Business of Home Podcast – The Thursday Show: What happened at High Point? Plus: Why designers are experimenting with AI video

Date: October 30, 2025
Host: Dennis Scully
Guests: Fred Nicolaus (Executive Editor), Caitlin Petersen (Editor in Chief)

Episode Overview

In this dynamic episode, Dennis Scully is joined by Business of Home Executive Editor Fred Nicolaus and later, Editor in Chief Caitlin Petersen, to dive into the latest news and major takeaways from the Fall 2025 High Point Market. The episode covers:

• Wayfair’s surprising financial performance and AI initiatives
• Developments in AI-generated video for designers
• John Edelman’s new “Modern Outlet” venture
• Celebrity home drama with Lily Allen and design’s place in popular culture
• A comprehensive High Point Market recap—trends, attendance, and the ever-present tariff issue
• Fun, gossip, and optimism about the design industry’s direction

Key Discussion Points & Insights

Celebrating a Milestone

• The episode marks Business of Home's 500th podcast. Fred playfully credits Dennis for the achievement:

  "Congratulations to us, but mostly you. This is Business of Home's 500ths podcast." (01:35, Fred)

Major Industry News

Wayfair’s Breakout Quarter & AI Initiatives

[05:54 – 13:52]

• Wayfair's Financial Performance:
  Despite another quarter of net losses ($100 million), Wayfair’s revenues grew 8% year-over-year, sending its stock up 20%. The hosts note that, contextually, this is seen as positive amidst a flat housing market and economic uncertainty.

  "All of their indicators were just upwards. They're making money at a time when housing is flat... but all of their numbers are going up, except of course, for profit." (07:04, Fred)

• AI On Display:
  CTO Fiona Tan gave a detailed breakdown of Wayfair’s AI strategy on their earnings call, outlining plans for integration with big chatbots (e.g., ChatGPT), generative design tools for consumers, and product listing enhancements.

  "Fiona Tan... gave essentially a masterclass in everything that AI could do for your company." (09:43, Dennis)

  However, Fred points out that the business impact is still speculative:

  "...Niraj in the call said that AI actually hasn't really made a big difference on our bottom line so far... there's a lot of hand waving around..." (10:14, Fred)

• Skepticism Amidst Hype:

  "This was a masterclass in how to talk about how you could use AI." (11:34, Dennis)

John Edelman’s Modern Outlet

[14:05 – 17:33]

• The Venture:
  Modern Outlet focuses on selling imperfect (scratched, returned, or showroom) pieces from designer brands at a discount. The aim is to solve a key pain point in the high-end furniture market: disposition of non-pristine inventory without brand dilution.

  "This very cleverly solves their problem by saying, hey, give it to us, we'll deal with it, we'll photograph it well and we'll sell it online." (14:42, Fred)

• Challenges & Opportunity:
  Competing against established resale platforms and the logistical complexity of e-commerce are flagged as hurdles, but the idea is praised as innovative and well-suited to Edelman's energetic approach.

AI Video for Designers

[17:33 – 22:05]

• What’s New:
  Generative AI video tools like OpenAI’s Sora and Google’s VO3 now create compelling video from prompts or images. Some designers are beginning to experiment, using these tools for client presentations, social content, and “concept road testing.”

  "You could upload a picture of a rendering that you've done and tell one of these engines, hey, animate this like you're doing a walkthrough." (19:18, Fred)

• Copyright Issues & Ethics:
  The hosts highlight concerns about AI-generated likenesses and IP, referencing Sora’s relaxed attitude and its notorious “Cameos” feature.

  "It sounds a little dystopian and weird, but I don't think that's crazy far off from where we are right now." (21:11, Fred)

Celebrity Drama: Lily Allen, David Harbour & Celebrity Home Tours

[22:45 – 30:03]

• Pop Culture Meets Design:
  British singer Lily Allen’s new album, fueled by her split with actor David Harbour, features lyrics about their designer Brooklyn brownstone—giving designer Billy Cotton a shout-out:

  "Billy Cotton got sorted all the furniture ordered. What a time to be alive." (23:28)

• Role of Homes in Celebrity Narratives:
  The episode reflects on how homes have become central to personal branding and pop culture, especially with media like AD Open Door.

  "I feel like now, especially post-Covid, when homes are just part of someone's identity... design is just kind of out there." (26:27, Fred)

• Privacy Concerns for Clients:
  Stories like Allen and Harbour’s make some high-profile clients more wary of publicizing their interiors.

  "...the client just doesn't want their home to be photographed... people want to hold on to more of their privacy." (28:03, Fred)

Main Interview: High Point Market Fall 2025 Recap

[31:50 – 72:10]
(Dennis Scully, Fred Nicolaus, Caitlin Petersen)

Vibe Check & Attendance

• Surprisingly Positive Mood:

  "Market was surprisingly optimistic... joyful, fun, hopeful, a great time." (32:27, Caitlin)

  • Attendance was flat (down less than 1% from spring), but key orders were up; buyers were serious and prepared.

Tariffs: Elephant in the Room

• Widespread Fatigue:

  • Most attendees wanted to move on, but behind the scenes, executives are still laser-focused, disclosing huge amounts spent on tariffs.

  "Everyone tried to put a good spin on market, but some people needed market to be better than it was..." (68:28, Dennis)

• Impact on Pricing & Business Growth:

  • Tariffs forced ongoing repricing, impacting resources and creativity.

  "...all of this energy and effort has been focused on trying to figure out how to price for all of these tariffs. In an alternate universe... all of those people would have been really focused on moving your company forward." (42:23, Caitlin)

• Domestic Manufacturers:

  • Some see opportunity but aren’t seeing a dramatic influx of business—yet.

  "They are having more conversations... but nobody told me of a giant customer that wasn't doing business with them before that suddenly showed up." (47:21, Dennis)

Hot Market Spaces & Trade Shows

• 313space is ‘High Point’s Hottest Nightclub’

  • Now a diverse, energetic mix of big brands and artisans—a huge draw.

  "It's where all the cool kids are... I definitely got pulled aside by a lot of vendors... who said, 'should I be there?'" (49:47, Caitlin)

• NKBA Moves In, Shop Object Moves Out

  • Kitchen & Bath now has an impactful presence; Shop Object experiment ends amid foot-traffic challenges.

  "Honestly, I do think that 313 space opened up with this neat vendor mix and kind of did it better." (55:01, Caitlin)

The Retail-Designer Shift

• Retailers Hollow Out, Designers Dominate:
  • The decline in independent retail stores is a growing concern, despite excitement about more designers attending.

  "The death of retailers is not good for anyone in the furniture business. Let's just get that up front." (56:35, Dennis)

Product Trends

• Tradition and Comfort Dominate:

  • Heritage brands leaning into archival pieces, rich traditional styles, and comforting details.

  "...the number of skirted seats that I saw at High Point skyrocketed." (60:46, Dennis)

  • Popular styles: menswear-inspired collections, walnut wood, tapestry, bullion fringe, scallops, ruffles, and game tables.

• Big Launches & Collaborations:

  • Notable: Hooker’s “Margaritaville” line and Amanda Lindroth for Chelsea House.

  "They divided it into four different zones... it was a really lovely surprise." (65:56, Caitlin)

Memorable Market Moments & Gossip

• Proximity Hotel Power Outage:
  • The industry elite’s hotel lost electricity, creating a rare High Point legend. (67:17)
• Hints of M&A Activity:
  • Some companies are rumored to be reevaluating their futures after two “soft” markets.

Closing Outlook

• Lingering Concerns:
  • Designers’ project pipelines are reportedly going quiet, which could impact the next market’s vitality. (70:10)
• Optimism Persists:

  "...It is always a pleasure to spend time at High Point... a sense of abundance and genuine joy that maybe has been missing from the general atmosphere for the last couple markets." (71:09, Dennis & 71:32, Caitlin)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "Congratulations to us, but mostly you. This is Business of Home's 500ths podcast."
  (01:35, Fred)

• "This was a masterclass in how to talk about how you could use AI."
  (11:34, Dennis)

• "Billy Cotton got sorted all the furniture ordered. What a time to be alive."
  (23:28, Lily Allen, lyric quoted)

• "Market was surprisingly optimistic... joyful, fun, hopeful, a great time."
  (32:27, Caitlin)

• "Everyone tried to put a good spin on market, but some people needed market to be better than it was..."
  (68:28, Dennis)

Timestamps for Major Segments

• 00:35 – 03:49: Celebrating the 500th episode & Nate Berkus interview reflections
• 05:54 – 13:52: Wayfair's financial results, AI talk, overall economic context
• 14:05 – 17:33: John Edelman’s Modern Outlet launch
• 17:33 – 22:05: AI video tools for designers—trends, opportunities, and memes
• 22:45 – 30:03: Lily Allen, design in pop culture, and privacy for clients
• 31:50 – 72:10: High Point Market Fall 2025 recap (optimism, tariffs, new vendor spaces, designer vs. retailer shift, product trends, gossip, and outlook)
• 72:10 – 77:23: What caught your eye this week? (First Dibs speculation, Supreme Court & tariffs, PRB vintage highlight, industry moves)

Conclusion

This episode encapsulates a moment of cautious optimism and creative adaptation in the interior design industry. Tariff stress and retail contraction weigh on market players, but High Point’s energy, a surge of strategic partnerships, AI experimentation, and the blending of design and celebrity culture keep the sector lively and forward-looking. The hosts balance critical realism with genuine enthusiasm—a must-listen for anyone invested in the business of home.

For more analysis, news, and designer resources, visit businessofhome.com.