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- [00:00]
Sharan Srivatha
This is Sharan Trivata. Welcome back to the Business School podcast. In this episode, I want to break down for you the big debate of whether is selling evil is selling evil. And a lot of us hold back on how much we sell. A lot of us sell aggressively. A lot of us have somewhere in between. But we don't realize that selling is not about manipulation in any way. At its best, it's about empowerment. It's about helping people achieve what's truly good for them. What's truly good for them. And I'm going to break down how exactly you do that all starting right now.
- [00:33]
Tron
One thing is for certain, just because it's tried and true doesn't mean it's working right now. So the big question is this. Where can you learn what is working right now? The strategies, the tactics, the psychology, and.
- [00:47]
Sharan Srivatha
The exact how to.
- [00:49]
Tron
How to grow your business, how to blow up your personal brand and supercharge your personal growth. That is the question, and this podcast will give you the answer. My name is Sharon Srivatha, and welcome to Business School.
- [01:08]
Sharan Srivatha
Many years ago, I was in a mastermind group called Genius Network with Joe Polish, and I heard this definition of selling from Dan Sullivan, and it was selling is getting someone intellectually engaged in a future result that is good for them and then getting them to emotionally commit to take action to achieve that result. I'll say that again. I think it's super important for us to know this definition of selling, because if you don't have what selling means to you, you're not going to understand what selling means to you and the energy that you can transfer to the other person when you're doing all of this. So selling is getting someone intellectually engaged in a future result that's good for them and then getting them to commit emotionally to take action to achieve that result. Which is, if you know this, at its best, it's. Selling is not about manipulation, it's about empowerment. It's about helping people achieve what is truly good for them. And many entrepreneurs and business owners fear sales because it's often associated with pushy and unethical tactics. The scripts that we listen to on the Internet are not just mediocre, are terrible at best, from sales gurus who've never actually sold something or they randomly sold something and realized it was actually easier to sell the education than it is to sell the thing. And this negative perception totally affects their ability to connect with their customers and grow their businesses. And that's what I want to talk about. And a lot of this is broken down from this. This talk that Joe Polish did about is selling evil. It's actually available for free on the Internet. I'll find it. It's like a two minute thing. I'll find it and I'll send it to you and I put it down in the notes. But the main reason for this is understanding the definition of selling so that we can do the right thing associated with this. So this is a super important must listen to episode. If you sell anything, maybe a product, a service, an idea or a cause. Right. So here's kind of like the big section, the section number one around it or the the idea number one around it which is intellectually engaging the client or the customer. Right. We talked about the definition of selling. Selling is getting someone intellectually engaged in a future result that's good for them and then getting them to emotionally commit to take action to achieve that result. It's got a couple of parts. Is getting someone intellectually engaged in a future result that's good for them, intellectually engaging the consumer. That's the big idea, number one. And if you focus on that part one of the quote, getting someone intellectually engaged in a future result. 92 plus percent of customers prefer sales interactions that focus on problem solving and education over persuasion. Right. Our persuasion has to be built into the urgency and the desire of the client. If our persuasion is based on our own paycheck, which we call commission breath, right. Then they can see it and feel it and hear it a mile away. Because people love to be sold, they just hate to be pressured. That's the quote that I got from your Polish's video just people love to be sold, they hate to be pressured. We all want to be led. We all want the inspiration. We all want an amazing sale. We all want to buy, we all want to be sold. That transformation, we all want that end result, but none of us wants to be pressured. People love to be sold, they hate to be pressured. And this is what's super, super important if you're a real estate agent. Guiding a client into visualizing a long term value of the home and the neighborhood and the school and the commute and the building of character and memories is way more important than pushing the sale. And you know that because the client feels that they realize they see themselves in the future, that is good for them. You're intellectually getting them to engage in a future result that's good for them. Sales is about clearing the picture and helping the client intellectually engage in the future result that's good for them, the reason a client does not intellectually engage in a future result that's good for them is that they have blocks. They're blocks on money, blocks on time, blocks on insecurity. You know, if you're selling somebody a way to lose weight, they have to intellectually engage in a future result that's good for them. And the reason they can't see that future result is because maybe of the fear, maybe of the embarrassment of their current body, maybe that they've tried a bunch of things and they felt like they've been taken for a ride. All of those things are prohibiting them from seeing the future result that's good for them. Intellectually engaging in a future result that's good for them. And that's why this is a really important process where we have to focus on generating and helping a client to create this intellectually engagement and the future result that's good for them. So it's not about, like, quote, problem solving. You know, a client is not looking, you know, they're not looking to buy two tickets to go to Hawaii. They're looking to go to. They're looking to be on the beach in Hawaii. So you see, not your job to sell, like to really focus on how comfortable their journey is going to be and how comfortable their flights are going to be and how they can get this extra upgrade. That's not what it is. You're selling Hawaii. That's what they're in. That's what they're. You're getting them intellectually engaged in a future result that's good for them. So the question is, you want to create a process. When you have. When you show a process for somebody to know that if they follow that process, they will get the future result that's good for them. That's when you open up their eyes. That's when you can be a guide. Being a guide is not about showing the client how to get there. Being the guide is showing the client that you have a path and a process to getting. There's a big difference. A Sherpa helping somebody climb Mount Everest is not just showing the person what to do. A Sherpa show helping somebody climb Mount Everest is creating the safety for the climber to know that the Sherpa has a path and a process to get the client there. The client's not worried about getting the result. They can't even see it. They need the safety and the capability to know that you have a process to get that result. So being a guide is not just, quote, coaching the client being. Being a guide is coaching the process because you know that they're coming to you from an A to B. You know that they're coming to you to get from, you know, a point A to point B. And you have to be able to show the process. Now, yes, that process is different for each and every client because you're bespoke customizing. I get it. But for most of the things that we do, there's a core set of similarities in this linear process. I know it has, you know, nuances and what ifs and it depends and all of that, but there is a core process. And even if there is no core process, we have to show the clients that there is a core process. If not, they don't believe us, that they can get to the future result that's good for them. All right? Intellectually engaging in a future result that is good for them. The second big idea is to really understand these words, what's good for them. We want the focus on the ethics of the selling. When you focus on the ethics of the selling, everything becomes a lot easier. And selling is not evil anymore. For example, intellectually engaging in a future result that's good for them. Those are the words. Intellectually engaging in a future result that's good for them. Now, if you can get them to intellectually engage in a future result that is not good for them, then that's manipulation. If you were to sell somebody some solar panels and you know that for some reason the. That. That. That is not good for them, well, you can intellectually engage in a future result that is getting the solar panels and having sustainability, et cetera. But if that result for some reason is not good for them, maybe because they're leaving the house in two years, maybe because they can pay off the infrastructure costs, maybe because they already have, you know, they're. They're completely off the grid and they are living in the Arctic tundra and they have no, you know, no solar anyway. Like, if not good for them, then it doesn't matter. Right? So that is the ethics of the sale. So the question we want to ask is, can I get somebody intellectually engaged in a future result that is good for them? Businesses with higher customer Trust scores or NPS scores achieve 50% more loyalty and 38% more revenue by just getting to people to intellectually engage in a future result that's good for them. Right. Why do we say that? We're not in the sales business. We're in the people business. Why do we say that? We say that because we're getting people to intellectually engage in a future result that is good for them. I'm saying this over and over so that these words start to mean something to you. Because if it doesn't, this is when you get a lot of pushback, right? And we have to keep asking the question, what is good for them. So when you're in a consultative state, when you're trying to sell something, that what you're thinking about is what is good for them. Once you realize what is good for them, whether they're going to buy that house or get this insurance policy or buy the, get this mortgage or buy the product or get the fake weight loss or what have you, you want to then use that, that selling Hawaii, selling the six pack, selling the energy, selling time with their children, selling more money to achieve their dreams and retire comfortably, whatever. What is the future result that's good for them? If you cannot define the future result that is good for them right now, for one of your clients, you're not gonna be able to get them to intellectually commit to engaging in that future result. Right? That's what's super, super important. So being transparent about that and thinking long term about that is really important. So that was the big idea. Number two, getting somebody not only to intellectually engage, but intellectually engage in a future result that's good for them. Here's number three, which is getting emotional commitment. Let's take the next part of the sentence. Getting them to emotionally commit to take action. Getting them to emotionally commit to take action. I'm going to read the quote again for you, which is selling is getting someone intellectually engaged in a future result that was part one. That is good for them. That's part two. And getting them to emotionally commit. Getting them to emotionally commit. Most of us can't emotionally commit. That's the problem. How do you get them to emotionally commit to take action? Emotionally engaged consumers we know are three to four times more likely to recommend a brand and make repeat purchases. Here's the problem that most people don't think about. Most people think that you deserve a referral because you did a good job. I have a real estate agent that tells me, hey, I did a good job for my client, but they did not refer me. They did not work with me again, but they said that they would. Why? Because we assume that just because we did a good job, we deserve a referral. No, we don't. We don't. Getting them to emotionally commit to take action is what is important. Just like I've heard these phrases that say, oh, yeah, the best time to ask for a referral is when someone says thank you. Well, no, just think about this, right? Whoever said that is wrong, right? Because it's very, very difficult. Because then you're making the interaction and the gratitude, you're making that transactional. If I say to you, hey, Jimmy, thank you so much for helping my son play much better soccer, right? Or which great private lesson. And you taught him how to do a perfect corner kick, great. I say thank you to the coach, Jimmy. What does Jimmy say? Oh, you're welcome, Sharon. Neal will do great. Or, oh, that's great. Who else do you know that needs to develop that kick? Is that what you say? That's terrible. Why would you ever say that? Because you take their compliment, a thank you, and you instantly turn into something transactional. This is why people who have never actually talked to a client in their lives write books and have scripts to teach you stuff. And then you become sleazy. And when you actually listen to people that have not actually done this and you see sleazy things, you get a really bad name. And then you wonder why your profession gets a bad name. It's because you listen to people who have not really done this and are saying sleazy things that make it difficult for you. If there's any time when someone says thank you, you know what you do? You receive the compliment and you accept the gratitude. And that is the bond that makes the relationship go deeper. Because here's why. Emotionally engaged customers and clients are three times likely to recommend a brand and purchase and to make repeat purchases. That thank you is what they're going to because they said that to you, they verbalized that to you. They've already told you they're consistent and congruent with their actions. When someone says thank you to you, they can't turn around. If someone told you, dude, you are amazing, they can't turn around behind your back and say, dude, you suck. They can't, because they now they're emotionally incongruent with what they said. And people don't buy the product, they buy the feelings. And you want to stack the feelings of you being great, you being thoughtful, you being helpful. But if you ask them and make the emotion transactional, then you're done. Because that whole emotional boom goes, dissipates into zero. So please, whoever told you that you have the best time to ask for a referral is when someone thanks you is wrong. Because you're intentionally taking the gratitude and making it transactional. And when you do that, doesn't matter what script you use, right? When you do that, you have no ability to influence a deeper, more meaningful lifetime value of a client associated with it. So they are wrong. And think about it. Imagine you said thank you to somebody and they instantly hit you back with an ask for the future. Now you're like, man, I'm not thanking anybody anymore. And you become just a mean person and the world will stop saying thank you to others. The salespeople actually make other people mean people. Because now I, as a grateful thank you person, I'm going to stop telling people thank you because they're going to turn around and make it transactional to me and I don't want to hear it. That's what's happening to the world. That's what's crazy, right? That's why the storytelling is so important. Sharing the journey, saying thank you, overcoming the challenge is really, really important. And the main part about this is getting them to emotionally commit to taking action. And when someone emotionally commits to taking action when they see the end result, that's good for them. That's when something cool happens, right? It's not about making sure they can have they can lose weight. It's about the energy that comes from losing the weight. Cool. Well, what can they do with the energy that comes from losing the weight that they can't do right now? Can they take their grandchildren on a walk then when they can do now that is emotionally committing to a future result, can they wear their clothes and be more confident than they are right now? They want to live into that feeling because then they can emotionally commit to that future result that's good for them. If something happens, can they not be a burden to their family and they not feel guilty? Have them live in their guilt and realize that there's a better way. Because then you're getting them to emotionally commit to taking action on the future result that's good for them. That's number three.
- [14:39]
Unknown
A quick heads up. If you're an entrepreneur, business owner or executive, listen up. If you don't have a virtual assistant team or Offshore team yet, you're doing it the hard way. Look, I've hired 11 plus virtual assistants just in the last two years just on Tron brand. And since then my brand has over five times 500%. No exaggeration, I used to do everything myself or pay bloated US salaries. But hiring Offshore has been a total game changer. So here's the deal. Finding a great VA honestly is not that easy. Vetting, interviewing, onboarding. It's a lot. That's why I work with assistantly.
- [15:14]
Sharan Srivatha
They handle all of it.
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Unknown
Job descriptions, head hunting, interviews, onboarding, even setting you up for success.
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Sharan Srivatha
The whole shebang.
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Unknown
You get three to four top tier candidates to choose from super quick. And they don't stop until you're set up for success. I work with assistantly. My network works with assistantly. And if you're serious about growing and scaling your business, you should work with assistantly too. Check them out@hireyourunicorn.com hireyourunicorn.com let's get back to the show.
- [15:43]
Sharan Srivatha
Here's number four is like this idea of this inspiring action, right? To take action to achieve that result. That's the phrasing, to take action to achieving that result. Did you know that over 60 to 70%. This is a Harvard study, by the way. Harvard. Harvard Business Review. You can actually Google it. There's. I think it was 61% of sales are lost because of indecision, not objections. So think about it. We spend so much time in objection handling. We don't think about getting somebody intellectually engaged in a future result that is good for them and getting them to emotionally commit to taking action to achieve that result. Think about that, right? They're not saying that there's an objection to handle. They're just doing it because of indecision. They're doing it because they can't make a choice. They're doing it because they can't make a decision. That is the problem. 60 plus percent of sales are lost because of indecision, not objections. When you're looking through this process, you're saying, how can I get Sharon to intellectually engage in a future result that is good for him and then emotionally commit to taking action to achieving that result. Because when I do that right, Sharon is now committed and there's no more indecision. And then if you 60 to 70% of the way there on the decision, then I just have to solve a few basic objections. And the few basic objections can be solved by good process. Because good process and good process alone drives good results. There's a great quote that comes to mind when I say this. A decision delayed is a decision denied. Think about that a lot. Like a decision delayed is a decision denied. A decision delayed is a decision denied. And that's just. Why do you want. And what is. What is a decision denied? It's taking away your free will. It's taking away choice. That's crazy, right? It's a super, super important to think about that now. Last but not least is like thinking about the ethics and this power of selling. This is my last kind of big piece of the puzzle is selling is like a tool, right? It's like a hammer. It can build or destroy. Depending on how it's used. Companies and individuals and salespeople that focus on, like, ethical practices are going to see a significantly better result. I think there was a Gallup study that said 75 or 76% greater customer satisfaction when companies focus on ethical business practices. You're actually better off helping somebody intellectually engage in a future result that is good for them. And I will tell you this. Think about this for a second. I really believe the salespeople are the saviors of the universe, right? They're carriers of the messages that change the world. You didn't hear about something that changed the world without a salesperson. Salespeople change the world. Salespeople are the carriers of the message. Salespeople build a narrative. Salespeople get you to take action. Salespeople change the very future of you and your families change. Salespeople help you achieve something that you've never achieved before. Salespeople get you out of your comfort zone and make you want to do things that make you better. Yes, salespeople sometimes are unethical and manipulate and you sometimes get into a bad situation. Because the vast majority of the time, ethical selling, selling is not evil. Like, think about this for a second. The world will come to a grinding halt if all the salespeople took a day off. Imagine this right now. Imagine wherever you're sitting right now, as of today, right now, every single salesperson in the world right now, including, I not only mean live, but also on video, video sales, letters, emails. Every single salesperson, sales tactic, sales engine, sales activity, every single salesperson, every single sales thing stopped for one day. Not, not one year, not one week, not one month, one day. Let's say every single sales activity in the world got paused for one day. You know, the world would come to a grinding halt. We would lose not just one day's worth of gdp. We would use the degrading momentum of GDP for months to come. And if you think about that, why do people buy things? Why do people invest in things? Why do people do things? They do it so that they can be intellectually engaged in a future result that is good for them. And that is the super interesting part about all of this. So is selling evil? No, Absolutely not. Are they? Some are. Is there some manipulation out There? Yes. Why? Because a lot of it is not because the person has malicious intent is because they've been taught wrong. Most of the time, we've all been taught sales wrong. And the reason we've been taught sales wrong is because we have not been able to agree on a definition of sales that aligns our moral compass. That's the answer. I'll say it again. We have been taught things wrong, and we have not been able to discern whether something is right or something is wrong. We don't have a code of ethics on selling because we have not defined sales for ourself. And selling, when we define it for ourselves, we know exactly what it can do because it is not evil. This is what it is. Selling is getting someone intellectually engaged in a future result that is good for them and then getting them to take action to emotionally commit to taking that action to achieve that result. Selling is getting someone to intellectually engage in a future result that is good for them and then getting them to emotionally commit to take action to achieve that result. That was a great Dan Sullivan quote. Probably one of the best definitions of selling I heard. But I've realized that if I can define selling for myself and be in alignment with that definition, then I'm not manipulating. I'm serving. Because how you sell is just a function of how you serve. How you sell is just a function of how you serve. And the only way to get that right is to have the right definition of selling. Selling is getting someone intellectually engaged in a future result that's good for them and then getting them to emotionally commit to take action to achieve that result. Hey, by the way, hopefully this gave you a filter for understanding the big pieces about all of this. And I don't know if this helped shift you or maybe you send it to somebody who next time someone says, you know, Sharon, I feel sleazy selling. I feel sleazy putting, doing this activity. I feel like I'm overselling. I feel like I'm being aggressive. Send them this episode. Send them like, listen. Listen to Sharon's episode on Is selling evil? Right? And so the issue comes from not defining the ethical sales construct for yourself. Selling is getting somebody intellectually engaged in a future result that's good for them and then getting them to emotionally commit to take action to achieve that result. That is the North Star for us and how we do everything around that. Overall, if this was helpful or number one, send it to your team. Send to someone that would ever tell you, hey, is selling evil the second most important thing is, if you like this, can you do me a favor? Can you take a screenshot and post it and tag me? Because if you like this, then I can make more like this for you. I appreciate you hanging out with us and I'll catch you on the next one.
- [22:05]
Tron
Hey, Tron, I have a cool gift for you since you like this podcast. I actually have an ultra super secret private podcast that I make just for my partner companies and the CEOs and influencers that I advise. It's called 10K Wisdom. Because I try to wrap $10,000 worth of value in every single episode in.
- [22:28]
Sharan Srivatha
Just under 10 minutes.
- [22:29]
Tron
That's why it's called 10K Wisdom. It's raw, it's real, it's got no interest or outro or anything like that. It's just straight to the point and to the insights. Since you like this podcast, I think.
- [22:41]
Sharan Srivatha
You will like that.
- [22:42]
Tron
So for the first time, I'm making it available to you. Just go to 10kwisdom.com the number 10kwisdom.com and my team will activate it for you as my gift. Go to 10kwisdom.com I'll see you there.