NFL Week 16 Reaction: Drake Maye Or Matthew Stafford For MVP? Are The Bears A Super Bowl Contender?

Summary

Bussin' With The Boys

NFL Week 16 Reaction: Drake Maye Or Matthew Stafford For MVP? Are The Bears A Super Bowl Contender?

Date: December 22, 2025
Hosts: Will Compton, Taylor Lewan
Guest: Greg Olsen (Fox Sports NFL Analyst)

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Episode Overview

This lively, football-centric episode brings together Will, Taylor, and Greg Olsen for a casual, in-depth discussion of NFL Week 16 highlights and hot topics. The trio debates MVP front-runners, examines pivotal playoff races, and explores ongoing narratives such as the concept of "momentum," coaching decisions, analytics versus "gut feel," and the rise of young quarterbacks. Packed with expert insights and playful banter, this conversation is essential listening for anyone looking to get an inside-edge on NFL strategy and the pulse of the league.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Momentum: Myth or Magic?

[03:50-06:16]

• Greg Olsen jokes about being "chirped" constantly online about his takes on momentum, referencing recent NFL and college games.
  • Greg: “My entire timeline during NFL football games is people talking shit about momentum… it makes me so happy to be chirped by the Internet and be like, 'Can’t wait till Olsen’s on with Bussin or we could talk about all the momentum that Seattle had.'”
• The group debates whether momentum is more real in college football due to the younger players' psyche.
• Olsen recounts his own “momentum” moment—banging the drum at a Panthers game and declaring, humorously:
  • Greg: "That is where momentum is real. When I banged the drum... the momentum was completely real. The sideline felt it. The locker room felt it. Yeah, that was real." [12:53]

2. College Football Coaching Carousel & Fandom

[06:16-12:39]

• The trio discusses Miami’s resurgence, the upcoming matchup against Ohio State, and the role of rooting for people over teams:
  • Greg: “I root for people more than I do schools or teams… that’s just my approach.”
• Michigan’s messy coaching situation gets airtime, with speculation on DeBoer, Dillingham, and Whittingham as potential hires.
• Tara Lawan (filling in for Taylor) expresses frustration with Michigan’s lack of a “backdoor” plan:
  • Tara: "Strategically you can’t, you can’t be, 'Hey, if this happens, then this.' If you’re a top five program…you need [another plan] in your back pocket."

3. NFC Playoff Picture and Contenders

[15:02-23:38]

• Dissection of NFC playoff scenarios, focusing on the Panthers, Eagles, Rams, Seahawks, and Bears.
• Olsen highlights the Eagles as a scary playoff team despite recent struggles; Tara counters with skepticism due to weak opponents.
  • Greg: “There’s something about Philly that I don’t want to play them. That defense has gotten really good… Jalen Carter on defense. I still think LA and Seattle are the two top, but I think Philly’s right there.” [15:26]
• The conversation explores which teams Philly could (or couldn’t) beat in early playoff rounds.
  • Greg: “Are any of those teams for Philly unbeatable?” [20:47]
• The Bears' hot streak gets spotlighted, with love for their postgame energy and Coach Ben Johnson’s locker room culture.

4. Officiating, Wild Endings & Rulebook Nuance

[29:43-39:10]

• The group unpacks wild late-game moments: Lions’ controversial touchdown nullified by flag; the debatable two-point conversion in Seahawks-Rams.
  • Greg: “By the letter of the law, that is a conversion. I would not be shocked to see that [changed] at the owners’ meeting…It’s just such a weird play because the whistle doesn’t matter.” [30:55]
• Greg dives into NFL rule nuances (backwards passes, offensive penalties in final seconds, who can advance a fumble).
• The difficulty of being a fan (or official) facing heartbreak due to complex officiating decisions is acknowledged:
  • Tara: “My heart goes out to the Lions fans… he starts off, ‘The result of the play is a touchdown,’ is the craziest way… it was true cinema. It really was.” [38:14]

5. Coaching Decisions, Analytics, and "Feel"

[42:43-55:33]

• The group nerds out about situational football—when to go for two, when to kick, and how analytics interact with gut instinct.
  • Will: "By the book, by analytics, you go for two and win in regulation. Greg, rule number one—win in regulation."
  • Greg: “Every decision…is about increasing your opportunity to win the game in regulation. The final output is about win probability, not tie probability.” [48:12]
• Debate: do analytics properly account for injuries or shifting vibes, or are “the nerds on the internet” out of touch with on-field nuance?
• Greg encourages wider awareness and discussion of these decisions among fans.

6. The Young QB Debate & Redraft: Maye, Williams, Daniels, Nix

[69:47-78:23]

• The core MVP debate: Matthew Stafford vs Drake Maye. The panel agrees Maye’s impact and poise as a second-year QB on an overachieving team are remarkable, but Stafford's steadiness is hard to top.
  • Greg: “If the season ended right now, God if you would asked me two weeks ago, I would have said Stafford. What Drake Maye is doing on a team that preseason had very little expectations…he’s special." [70:07, 71:09]
• Lively redraft of last year’s first-round QB class: Maye, Williams, Daniels, Bo Nix, J.J. McCarthy.
  • The consensus: Drake Maye goes #1, followed by debate on order of Caleb Williams, Jaden Daniels (injury risk), and Bo Nix.
  • Greg and Will analyze the balance between floor/ceiling, injury risk, and the “X-factor” of each QB.

7. Advanced Stats: Completion Percentage, Yards Per Attempt, and Risk

[78:53-82:10]

• Greg argues against over-focusing on completion percentage, advocating for a blend of efficiency and aggression:
  • Greg: “I don’t like chasing completion percentage... There’s a cross-section between average depth of target and completion percentage. Some guys throw it 80% at three yards—doesn’t do a whole lot for me.”
• Olsen highlights the hidden positives in Caleb Williams’ ability to avoid sacks—suggesting some "inaccurate" throws are better than drive-killing sacks.
  • Greg: “If he tipped more sacks and got less inaccurate throws off on the run... would that be better? Offensive success would go down because he’s taking sacks.”

8. Holiday Spirit & Movie Picks

[64:08-68:05]

• The hosts pivot to holiday levity, discussing favorite Christmas movies and calling out Home Alone for its unrealistic plot and questionable parenting.
  • Greg: “Home Alone though, that was my childhood. That was the Christmas movie we watched a thousand times… Every kid’s dream, maybe a little unrealistic.”

9. Final Hot Takes: Chiefs' Decline & MVP Picks

[68:15-69:47]

• Quick takes on the Chiefs' disappointing season and Travis Kelce’s possible last days with the team.
• MVP race closes with agreement: it’s razor-close between Stafford and Maye, with a nod for Stafford, but growing support for Maye’s case.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Greg Olsen on “momentum”:
  “That is where momentum is real. When I banged the drum and that place came alive… the momentum was completely real. The sideline felt it. The locker room felt it.” [12:53]
• Greg Olsen (on rooting in college football):
  “I follow people more than I do schools or teams.” [06:50]
• Will Compton (on the Bears’ energy):
  “Everything happening in Chicago right now is… so much fun to watch.” [24:15]
• Greg Olsen (on officiating):
  “By the letter of the law, that is a conversion… I would not be shocked to see them try to put some more specific rulings for that exact situation because that sucks.” [30:55]
• Greg Olsen (on analytics):
  “Every decision… is about increasing your opportunity to win the game in regulation. The final output is about win probability, not tie probability.” [48:12]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 03:50 – “Get to Know Greg”: Momentum discussion begins
• 12:53 – Olsen recounts the Panthers “drum” momentum moment
• 15:25 – Wild card and NFC playoff scenario analysis begins
• 29:43 – Officiating controversies and rulebook nuance
• 42:43 – Deep dive on analytics, situational coaching, and gut vs. numbers
• 69:47 – MVP and redrafting young QBs discussion
• 78:53 – Debate on QB metrics: completion percentage vs. depth

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Tone & Atmosphere

The conversation is friendly, fast-paced, and rich in both expert insight and playful trash talk. The hosts and Greg Olsen maintain a balance of analytical depth ("talking ball") and comedic energy, poking fun at fandom, coaching, and their own quirks—making this a fun yet insightful episode for listeners.

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Summary

This episode stands out for its blend of X’s and O’s football analysis, real locker room perspective, and entertaining sidebars—from Christmas movies to Miami’s backstory. The MVP debate includes nuanced takes on QB growth and what advanced stats actually mean. Listeners walk away armed with an insider’s understanding of NFL playoff races, why analytics matter (but don’t tell the whole story), and what’s at stake for a new generation of quarterbacks.

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For next episode: Special guest Ty Simpson (Alabama QB) and more college football talk!

Transcript

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[Greg Olsen]

Guaranteed Human.

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[Tara Lawan]

All.

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[Will]

Mmm.

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[Tara Lawan]

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[Greg Olsen]

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[Will]

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[Greg Olsen]

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[Tara Lawan]

Shop [e-mail] or or visit your closest Pandora store.

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[Tara Lawan]

Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to the NFL recap with Greg Olson. My name is Tara Lawan. This is Bust with the Boys and Bust with the boys, if you're wondering, is presented by the one, the only fanduel sportsbook. I ho ho, hope you guys are ready for to boost your holiday winnings because this year you're getting eight straight days of holiday rewards. Every day brings a new way to play. So keep checking in to see what drops next all and it all leads to Christmas Day and we're fanduels. Got something extra special for everybody on the nice list. Days of gifts, one big finale. Your holiday football just got a whole lot brighter. Head to FanDuel.com Bussin to get in the holiday spirit. Fanduel, let's play your game. Also. Hey, before we get into this little back and forth Grigos, it's not really an interview anymore. This is boys having a fun little football conversation. Do me a favor and just subscribe to this podcast, it helps us a lot. It hurts you none. It would be very beneficial for us, so please consider doing that. Also, BWTB.com is where you can find all your busting with the boys merch. Clearly, you've missed the boat and the Christmas stuff, but there's no better time to start shopping than just get that bad boy done early for next year. Big hugs, tiny kisses. Let's enjoy this episode. There he is. Senor.

[Greg Olsen]

What up?

[Tara Lawan]

Chilling. Killing what you have to do.

[Greg Olsen]

Sorry, I was trying to find my air, my headphones. What's up? How are you guys?

[Will]

We're doing great, man. My. Our first question as a bus that we're very curious in knowing with you is, what's your favorite color?

[Greg Olsen]

Blue.

[Tara Lawan]

All right, you want to say, go blue.

[Will]

Hey, you really shut the haters up with that one.

[Greg Olsen]

Write it down.

[Will]

We just. We just. We just want. Hey. It's a segment called get to know Greg.

[Tara Lawan]

Get to know Greg. Well, I guess next week.

[Greg Olsen]

I feel like I'm walking into something.

[Will]

You're not walking into anything.

[Tara Lawan]

Nothing. We just know that. We know that your favorite color is blue now.

[Greg Olsen]

All right, well, I'm glad we settled that. Can you did your guys. My entire timeline during NFL football games is people talking shit about momentum, by the way. And I literally smart. Like, I. I'm now, like, searching the word momentum to see how many of them are related to, like, our conversations on here. It makes me so happy to be chirped by the Internet and be like, can't wait till Olson's on with busin. Or we could talk about all the momentum that Seattle had. Or like the Rams. It was. It is magical moments on the Internet.

[Tara Lawan]

It is. Did you watch any of the college football. I know you're NFL guy. Did you watch Oklahoma, Alabama?

[Greg Olsen]

I watched Oklahoma, Alabama.

[Tara Lawan]

Lot of momentum in that game got shifted, shifting. All Alabama needed was that one toss out to their sideline. All of a sudden, momentum shifted.

[Greg Olsen]

It's just, you know, there was so many. So much momentum playing out, so much momentuming. I guess the part. The part that I just have a hard time and you got. Again, I'm. I'm very open minded to being taught, and I'll change my ways. It's very hard for me to believe. Like, why, when I have all the momentum, do you guys take it back so easily and then give it back to me? It's a fickle thing because it's funny.

[Will]

People trying to acquire momentum, they're waiting for that opportunity to strike to garner the momentum. Yeah.

[Tara Lawan]

Yep. Fair.

[Greg Olsen]

That's true.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah.

[Greg Olsen]

No, it's a great point.

[Tara Lawan]

I. I think. I think college football, there's much more of an argument that we could stand on for momentum. The young psyche of a young man hardly even able to drink. Momentum goes a long way.

[Greg Olsen]

Who had the momentum in the Miami game, Ma?

[Tara Lawan]

Neither.

[Will]

Defense?

[Tara Lawan]

Neither.

[Will]

Neither.

[Tara Lawan]

Because I'm playing the game back in my head, dude. And it's like Miami could have won that game by multiple scores.

[Greg Olsen]

Oh, my God.

[Will]

All those field goals.

[Greg Olsen]

Four field goals. Tony got tripped by his toenail on that. He's. By the way, he's awesome. Unbelievable on that punt return. And then we didn't get any points. Yeah, I. I would say that's probably a fair assessment of that game. But Miami, man, we're back. We've been saying. We've been saying the U is back for, like, 10 years. College football Playoff win. Going to play Ohio State. I mean. Yeah, go play Ohio State in the Cotton Bowl. Feels back.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah.

[Will]

Do you feel like Miami has a chance against Ohio State?

[Greg Olsen]

Yeah, I think you always have a chance, right? I think at this stage, the teams that are. That are all left. I think the defense is really good. I think our defensive coordinator is a stud. You know, obviously, I'm a huge Mario guy, just because. I mean, for a lot of reasons. But we go way back. I mean, I've known Mario since I was a freshman in high school. He coached me, recruited me at multiple. I mean, he. We. We have a good friendship and go way back. So obviously, I always root for Miami. I root for Mario specifically. But, yeah, man, I think we got a shot. I'm also a big Ryan Day guy, and, you know, here's what I will say about my fandom, and then we can talk about whatever is your show. I just. I'm just getting all this off my chest. Obviously, I always pull from Miami. I'm a Miami guy. Met my wife there. Miami household. My kids love it. So, like, we're. We've always supported Miami. Good, bad, indifferent since I left. But I'm more. And I'm more at all levels. I root for people. Like when Mario Cristobal was the head coach at Oregon, I was an Oregon guy. Like, I root. I love Ryan Day, and right now he's the coach at Ohio State. I like Ryan as a guy. I've gotten to know him as a friend. Like, I want. Now I want Miami to win. Don't get me wrong, but I root for Ryan Day. If Ryan Day and woke up tomorrow and he was the head coach at Michigan. He was the head coach at Nebraska. I would still root for those schools. So I like follow people more than I do schools or teams. But that's just my approach.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, I like that.

[Greg Olsen]

Outside of Miami. Yeah, obviously.

[Will]

No, I share a lot of that too.

[Tara Lawan]

I'll say this. Ryan Day is not being considered for the Michigan job.

[Greg Olsen]

He's not up for it. Who is Michigan going to hire? That's not going great, buddy.

[Tara Lawan]

I know, I know. And I'll be honest, like, completely. It's a shit show. I think, like right now, if the strategy was wait for DeBoer or Dylan or if you can't get Deborah, get Dillingham. You can't base a top five programs head coach off of possible results going one way or the other. It's just a. Foundationally, it's a bad move. And I personally believe, like, if you are a top five school, you need to always have that get out of jail free card that. Hey, our chest move in the background in case something like what has happened at Michigan, like if you have a guy that loses his job, goes on a mental breakdown, the whole thing. Allegedly. Allegedly. You hear that?

[Greg Olsen]

Can you guys hear me?

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah. Can you hear me?

[Will]

Can you hear us?

[Greg Olsen]

I lost your sound.

[Tara Lawan]

G, baby, that he's blaming you.

[Will]

He might be faking it. Like, he's like, oh, here he goes talking about Michigan. Let me just.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, let me mute this.

[Will]

I can't.

[Greg Olsen]

No. What were you saying about Michigan?

[Tara Lawan]

It's a shit show. And I think that, like, strategically you can't, you can't be. Hey, if this happens, then this kind of result based. If you're a top five program. I'm a little disappointed in the fact that you didn't have like in your back pocket. Like, hey, if something ever happens, we got this guy, this guy and this guy that we know. Hey, they. They're aware. We're aware back channels. The whole thing we had at Ozgeron on. He's meeting guys at a gas station in the middle of Louisiana knowing that he's going to be the interim head coach three days before it happens. Like, that's the kind of. That's the kind of backdoor stuff I need going on at my school so that we can kind of figure everything out. Now, clearly there's a lot of bigger issues out there, but Deborah wins and Dillingham signs an extension.

[Will]

In my mind, the entire Michigan plan just got.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah. If that is.

[Greg Olsen]

You really think. Do you really think Caitlin DeBoer, if they would have lost that game to Oklahoma, you really think he'd leave Alabama for Michigan?

[Tara Lawan]

So I think in a vacuum, just that statement is no. I think if there's a lot of things going on behind the scenes that made me believe, oh, this is a real possibility. But I think if you just said, hey, do you think the head coach of Alabama would leave to go to Michigan? I think it's clear the answer is no. But then you put in a bunch of factors that people are saying, question marks behind the scenes. It's like, if these three things happen, then you see it. That's where I started to have some level of belief. But once they beat Oklahoma, it was like, all right, yeah, that. That's. Yeah, that's on life support, that whole thought process. If I'm Michigan and your Two guys are DeBoer and Dillingham and then the rest of the pack, because there's plenty of good coaches out there. I know Whittingham from Utah. He's like. His name is now, like, come in the fold. He's a fantastic coach with limited resources, but if you're missing. You're like, it's these two. Then everybody else, I'm. I'm of the mind frame of, you need to stick with the interim head coach foundationally, find yourself a president, start to heal from a PR standpoint, the mistakes that Michigan's clearly made in the last few years, and do it the right way, because if you just get a guy to get a guy, you're. You're putting a band aid on a bigger wound, and it's just going to be an issue in 28, 29, 30 and beyond.

[Greg Olsen]

The Dillingham thing, to me is interesting, right? So he signs the extension, and obviously I know his roots and ties to Arizona State, but he then had his press conference where, you know, everyone's excited. He signed an extension. He's not leaving for another job. And he's like, hey, I need somebody in Arizona that can cut a $20 million check. We don't cut a $20 million check. I can't win. I can't compete. So I'm thinking to myself, like, at Michigan, you could have five guys write $20 million checks. I mean, the money is completely not even the problem at all.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, no, it's. It's.

[Greg Olsen]

They gave Bryce Underwood 10 million. So if, you know, money is an issue and, you know that's what it takes to compete, why not take the Michigan job? Unless that Michigan job is just such a disaster and you're just walking into such a shitstorm that it's not the time to take it is all I could think of.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, that is everything you just said is the fear that goes in the frame of mind of a Michigan fan, a Michigan alum. Yeah. Is like, is it. If you were really a top five coach, are you looking at that situation going, let me be the guy that walks into that because it is, it is scary. And for me, it's like everyone's willing, like the AD of Michigan says, I'm willing to open up the checkbook for the next head coach at Michigan. And if you're Dillingham and your heart's truly in Arizona, sign a 10 year deal, spend a decade in Ann Arbor, get us a couple of natties. And then guess what, the ASU job's probably going to be open. That's not going to be like a. Oh, we hope so. Like that has more of a Rolodex of new coaches every few years anyway. You need a guy like Gilliam.

[Greg Olsen]

It's going to be interesting to see who they get. Man.

[Tara Lawan]

Last thing on the. On the momentum. Last thing on momentum. I mean, the Panthers take down Tampa Bay and it was kind of wishy washy until some guy walks out, starts beating the drum and completely changes the momentum for the Panthers. What's that about?

[Greg Olsen]

That is where momentum is real. When I banged the drum and that place came alive and I gave just a nice casual, it's not about me, but it is about me. Prom queen for me, but we are here for me. I'm not saying who's saying it. People have said this. That place hasn't been that packed in years. Whether it's a correlate, you know, causation correlation to the guy banging the drum, well, I guess we'll never know. But all I know is that place came to life and we win a huge division game at home to keep our playoff hopes alive. I'm not saying it. Some people are saying it was the drum, so thank you. The momentum there, in that case, the momentum was completely real. The sideline felt it. The locker room felt it. Yeah, that was real.

[Tara Lawan]

It's. It's Greg Olson In Carolina, it's 50 Cent in Oklahoma. Both. One, Greg Olson did more for the Panthers than 50 Cent did for Oklahoma. That's what we're getting at.

[Greg Olsen]

Exactly.

[Tara Lawan]

When you smack that drum the first time you put a dent in that mother like that thing, did you think, I'm about to rip this thing?

[Greg Olsen]

Yeah. You know, I didn't want to go too hard. You know, I feel like, there's. It's like we have, like, an epidemic right now in the league of guys, like, getting, like, oblique injuries. I feel like I've never seen guys hurt their obliques as much as they have this year. I was worried about that rotation, that I wasn't prepped. I saw the team. Cairo, who's a buddy of mine who had worked on me for years, and I was like, dude, I might need you to give me, like, some T spine, some lower lumbar, and just, like, get me moving at halftime just so I don't. I can go in and be real tight in the turn. But, yeah, I don't want to say it was the. It was the moment of the day, but it certainly was the moment of the day.

[Will]

Team needed a spark, and they got it. They needed. Became the spark.

[Greg Olsen]

I needed the guys to be on the sideline and be like, guys, I feel something right now. I feel like I'm so much more motivated to go play. That dude banging that drum. He did that for me. I was going to quit. I wasn't really into the game, but I'm alive now, and that was my role.

[Will]

Yeah, dude, how do you. Since we're in the nfc, how do you see the playoff picture shaking up for the Panthers? You got Panthers, bucks for the division. You got Packers, Lions. Packers have to lose out, and Lions have to win out to. To make it in there. But it's like the Chicago Bears over the weekend. Them and three NFC west teams are now cemented in the NFL playoffs.

[Tara Lawan]

Crazy.

[Greg Olsen]

It's unbelievable. I think the NFC is. Is really fascinating. I think they're loaded. I think there are some division winners that are not thrilled to see some of these wild card teams. We got to hope Jordan Love is okay. You know, obviously Green Bay's already, you know, kind of gotten a couple big injuries and obviously Micah and all that. So you gotta hope that he's ready to rock come playoff time if, you know, they make it as a. Presumably as a wild card. I still think Philly is a. I've been saying this for weeks. There's, like, something about Philly that I don't want to play them. That defense has gotten really good playing as well, if not, you know, better than they were last year even, which is saying a lot. That D lines coming to life. Jalen Phillips, what a great trade by Roseman in the front office, getting him from Miami a couple weeks ago. They've been really good up front, taking the ball away, playing really good defense, and then the offense just keeps it feels like they just get a little bit better, a little bit better. And we all know talent, talent can pop at any moment. And you look in that huddle, they got some real dudes. Sounds like that Lane Johnson's going to be back for this weekend's game. That's huge. Jalen Carter on defense. So I still think LA and Seattle are the two top, but I think Phillies right there. Chicago's a thrill a minute. Whether or not that, you know, we'll see how that race ends. I think that the seven NFC teams, it's going to be a fascinating to see how it all falls and then I think that's going to be one of the better NFC playoffs that we've had in years.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, I'm with everything you said except for that the Eagles the last two weeks they played the Commanders and the Raiders and I just can't put a whole lot of stock and them like they all, they clearly look better, but they also to come back from a deficit against the Commanders, the Raiders, it's like you hate it for those guys, especially a guy like Max Crosby who deserves to be on a winning team. But it's like they're both non competitive teams and the Eagles look great against the Raiders and the Commanders. It's like, well, you had to come back from that game and all that. I'm just, I'm hesitant to be supportive of the Eagles right now. Love Rosemanni, love some of those players. But it's just like something's not clicking.

[Will]

Something, something's not going to the Super Bowl. They might win their first game. Like they'll have a home game, but after that, like they won't get any farther than the second round.

[Tara Lawan]

It's gonna be tough to get through.

[Greg Olsen]

Who do you think, who do you think in the first two rounds they can't beat? Right. So let's assume, let's look at it. Let's assume la, Seattle will be one. Let's just say it's Seattle. Let's say Seattle doesn't stub their toe because Seattle has the Panthers. And then I think they play the 49ers. Drive that, right?

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah.

[Will]

Yeah.

[Greg Olsen]

Okay, so what's weird is San Francisco controls their own destiny, as does Seattle. So assuming they both, you know, so San Francisco plays tonight against Indy. Let's say they handle business. And then who does, who does San Francisco play in Week 17?

[Tara Lawan]

They play the Seahawks, I think, or the Rams.

[Will]

They play Seattle.

[Tara Lawan]

Okay.

[Greg Olsen]

They play. I thought they played Seattle the last week. I thought week 18 they played Seattle.

[Will]

Yeah. Last. Last week they played Seattle. Next week they play. They play the Bears.

[Greg Olsen]

It's a big game, too.

[Will]

So that is a big game.

[Greg Olsen]

That. Man, they. That's because. Because what would be really interesting is if Seattle win. If Seattle wins and San Francisco wins and they go into week 18, that's not only for the division. It's for the number one seed, which is wild to think about that San Francisco potentially could be the number one seed and not have to play a road game. They could go all the way to the super bowl and not play a road game. That's pretty remarkable.

[Tara Lawan]

But. So your question is.

[Greg Olsen]

My question is, who do you think in the divisional round Philly can't beat?

[Tara Lawan]

I don't think they can beat the.

[Greg Olsen]

Seahawks, but the Seahawks might be the one seats. Right.

[Will]

We're saying Seattle is the one 49.

[Tara Lawan]

They already beat the Rams. But there was a weird situation that took place. It was in. It was in Philly. Correct? When they played.

[Will]

Yes.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, it was in Philly. Multiple.

[Greg Olsen]

I called that game. I called that game.

[Tara Lawan]

I think the Rams. The Rams will beat them. I think the 49ers, the way they're going, would beat them.

[Will]

It's Rams, 49ers and Green Bay right now who are five through six, remember?

[Greg Olsen]

So, remember. So if they. I still think there's a decent shot. We'll see how the NFC north shakes out and all that. But there's a shot that Philly could become the 2 seed.

[Will]

Correct.

[Greg Olsen]

Right. So they would host the 7. Who could be Chicago. It could be right now.

[Will]

Right now it's Green Bay.

[Greg Olsen]

Green Bay. You don't think so? Philly at home against Green Bay.

[Will]

Yeah, they could beat him.

[Tara Lawan]

I think Philly wins that game. I think Philly wins the injuries. This is. Yeah. I mean, if Jordan loves not playing. Yes, Jordan.

[Greg Olsen]

So now let's say they win now they play in the divisional round. They don't have to play the NFC west champion because that obviously will be the 1 seed. So now you're looking at the Bears, the 49ers, the Rams, potentially. Like, again. Am I saying they're going to win the Super Bowl? No, it's just I think the nfc, you take out Seattle, who I do think is really good. If they're the one seed, you're not playing Seattle until the NFC Championship. Until the NFC Championship, yeah. Are any of those teams for Philly unbeatable?

[Will]

They're not unbeatable. But again, the Bears went into Philadelphia and beat them by two. Score. Game. Not too long ago.

[Greg Olsen]

That was the two point. That was the down 15. Two point play, right?

[Will]

Yeah. So they went in. It was November 28th, night game.

[Greg Olsen]

It was thanks. It was thanks. It was Black Friday game.

[Will]

Yeah. They beat him 24:15.

[Greg Olsen]

Yeah. Again, I might. My point is correct.

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[Tara Lawan]

All.

[Coca Cola Advertiser]

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[Will]

They're beatable. They. They are beatable.

[Greg Olsen]

I can make strong an argument for Philly. I could make as strong an argument that Philly could win, that I can any of the rest of the team. And that's my point. I think the NFC playoffs is fascinating because I genuinely do think. I do think Seattle's the best. Then the Rams are close. I think the rest of that group, two through seven, I could throw them in a hat and I could make an argument why either of them could beat them home away. I really do think all of those teams could potentially go as far as any of the rest.

[Will]

Yeah, it's going to be tough for that Eagles team to beat A Bears team with all that momentum the Bears got.

[Greg Olsen]

Right now, the momentum of the Bears is real.

[Will]

Dude, it is so much fun.

[Greg Olsen]

They have so much momentum.

[Will]

Yeah, they do. They have a lot of momentum. If you watch those post game locker room clips, I love them. I said a few weeks ago that the Bears were going to make the playoffs. Boy, was I wrong. But I've had so much fun watching Ben Johnson in the locker room with the squad, with the, with their little chant going on. Like, that's a chant to where in the beginning when they win, it's kind of like, oh, this is corny. And now the chant is just, hey, if you don't like the chant, like you might have a little sweetness to you.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah.

[Will]

You know what I mean? Like, you're so bought into these post locker room chance, these fourth quarter comebacks. Everything happening in Chicago right now is. It's, it's been fun to watch and it's, it's.

[Tara Lawan]

Clearly there's always been some sort of not at the defense. They're not very good. They're more opportunistic. They're. Ken Williams, he throws the ball under 60% completion percentage, but they just win.

[Will]

Yeah.

[Tara Lawan]

And then Caleb Williams in overtime throws an absolute bomb and doesn't get crazy, except he just does maybe the hardest celebration ever by just dusting the shoulders and putting his hands in his pockets. Like, hey, these boys are real.

[Will]

Yeah.

[Tara Lawan]

Hang on the nail polish all you want.

[Greg Olsen]

His hands were in his hand warmer before the ball was caught.

[Will]

That.

[Tara Lawan]

Hey, you can't. That got a juicy up walk off, man.

[Greg Olsen]

It's amazing.

[Tara Lawan]

It's amazing. Bears win the super bowl, you paint your fingernails.

[Greg Olsen]

What's that?

[Tara Lawan]

Bears win the Super Bowl. Are you painting your fingernails in solidarity?

[Will]

Yeah, sure, yeah, we'll all do it.

[Greg Olsen]

I'll have a matcha. I'll paint my fingernails. Whatever.

[Tara Lawan]

Hey, hey, I'll tell you what though. Matcha's kind of go hard, right?

[Greg Olsen]

I've tried it. My wife's got. My wife got into Matcha for a while and I would like. I'm not a coffee guy. I've never had a cup of coffee. But I'll crush an espresso martini. But I've never. But I've never had a cup of coffee. Like, I don't start my day with coffee. Yeah, it's a, it's a weird brag.

[Tara Lawan]

It's a weird brag. But also you've had coffee because you've been. Espresso martini.

[Greg Olsen]

I crush an espresso martini. At dinner. We Actually made him at the house last night just as, like, a little nightcap after the game. And. Yeah, it's just a weird thing. I do not crave coffee. I. My wife loves it. I've sipped it. I've been like, hey, is this a great cup? Like, she's like, this is a great cup of coffee. I'm like, all right, I'm gonna try it, and I'll take a sip. I'm like, I don't. I don't get it. I don't get it.

[Will]

Life is your caffeine, bro.

[Greg Olsen]

Yeah, man. I'm just. I'm ready to talk ball with the boys. Coffee to get up in the morning to talk ball.

[Will]

No cup of coffee in his life. That's wild as. As Taylor just puts down some cold brew.

[Tara Lawan]

But matcha. You like matcha?

[Greg Olsen]

No, I. That was my point. I took a sip of her, like, when she was in her matcha fairies, and, yeah, it just had, like, a weird. I don't know. It didn't do it for me.

[Tara Lawan]

Man, that's a bummer. That's a bummer. Grabbing coffee.

[Greg Olsen]

Are you into it? Is it, like a daily.

[Tara Lawan]

You're like a. I'm a black coffee guy, and I. I only waver from that kind of, like, during the holiday season when I'm like, yo, I'm feeling a little festive. Let me get this pumpkin spice. Let me go and get this. Love it. Peppermint, whatever. But it's. It's pretty much just that my wife's had a couple of matchas, and it tastes like. What are those? Like, Japanese desserts that are like a little rice paper around it, but there's ice cream in the middle. What are those called, anyway? A match. Is tasting a green tea. One of those. Onward. Yeah. Not the show. Not the show we're looking at, dude. I mean, the NFC is exciting, but, like, you look at the Broncos, Patriots, and Jags right now, even the Chargers, it's like, it's going to be a hell of a look.

[Will]

Is there a hotter team in the NFL right now than the Jacksonville Jaguars?

[Tara Lawan]

Not since last week when it was the Broncos.

[Will]

Yeah, Then they just.

[Greg Olsen]

The Broncos had all the momentum until last week's game against Jacksonville. But to your point, I have Jacksonville this week against Indy in Indy. Could be a sneaky, fun game.

[Will]

Could be a sneaky, fun game. I don't. It's hard for me to buy that the culture going to put up a fight now that we have a little bit of film with Philip Rivers and we see What? You know how they might try and schematically attack Jacksonville? Jacksonville is hot right now, bro.

[Greg Olsen]

They're good.

[Tara Lawan]

But to put it for Greg's point, like, Jacksonville, the top dog right now, they just beat the top dog. What a perfect game for them to kind of like play a little below their level and make it a sneaky, fun game to watch.

[Will]

Yeah. Like if they start drinking their own.

[Greg Olsen]

Cool storylines, I think storylines. I think Indianapolis played their ass off on defense last week in Seattle, had the lead with 20 seconds left. You know, here we are talking about Seattle is one of the best teams in league and Indy, with a quarterback that hadn't played in four years, went to Seattle and took the lead with 30 seconds and, you know, obviously didn't win, but went toe to toe with them in their place. We'll see how they do tonight against San Francisco. They play well against San Francisco tonight. Philip Rivers gets a couple more weeks to get his feet under him, get back in shape a little bit, get the juices ripping. I don't know. I think when they assigned us that game, I was like, interesting. Like, not typically a Fox game, not a game that I would have anticipated, but as the last week or two have gone on, especially watching Jacksonville yesterday for the first time, like, really sitting down to watch them in that late window against Denver, I was like, these guys are good. Like, there's nothing fluky about this. I mean, they won against. They beat Denver decisively.

[Will]

Yeah, I'm more like going to the Seattle going, thinking about the Colts. Like, I know there's really no, like, look over games in the NFL, but part of me, I buy more that Seattle was looking toward more of their Thursday night game against the Rams than when they were, you know, having full focus, having full energy into the game against the Colts.

[Tara Lawan]

You can get lulled into that trap.

[Will]

You can get lulled. I'm not saying, like it's intentional on Seattle's part, but again, they had a massive game coming up Thursday night. Rematch against the Rams to where you're playing the Colts. Philip Rivers, like, you don't have. You don't know exactly how they're going to go about everything offensively with Phil. They kind of snuck up on him. Then Seattle had to realize in the final minute of the game, hey, hey, guys, we're the Seattle Seahawks. Let's go down here. Points. Yeah. And get on to our Thursday game.

[Tara Lawan]

Dude. I mean, just being on the Seattle, that game against the Rams was at the best. That had to be the best game of the entire year.

[Greg Olsen]

Totally.

[Tara Lawan]

It was unbelievable. Were you able to watch that game? No, because we were.

[Will]

I did.

[Tara Lawan]

Last Thursday was a shit show for us. But the two. Do you think, do you guys want.

[Greg Olsen]

To talk about it or are you guys okay?

[Will]

I didn't. I was in New York doing Christmas in New York with the family, so I didn't get to really watch much of the game.

[Tara Lawan]

Last, last stream of the year for busting with the boys.

[Greg Olsen]

I saw the lady took your family picture and put her finger in the lens. It was a good. That was good. You guys don't think I follow you guys. I know I, I am. I'm all in on bus. I'm all in with the boys. I like following your kids. I'm in.

[Will]

I love it.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, one thing, one thing too. We had a whole conversation about Greg Olsen leaving Fox, coming to bus with the boys last week. Like, I mean, buddy, we know you're about it. We're about it as well. We'll figure the whole thing out. But you're watching that game. I'm watching that game. The two, the first two point conversion happens and ball gets batted down, someone just picks it up in the end zone and it counts from your vantage point. If you are the referee and you're watching that back. Is that a backwards pass in your opinion?

[Greg Olsen]

It was.

[Tara Lawan]

I love it.

[Greg Olsen]

Because remember, because remember sideways is backwards. So the, the way the letter of the law and they harp this. Mike Pereira sends out videos to us at Fox like weekly, anywhere between 10 and 25 minutes of like all the controversial calls, real nuanced rules just to try to bake some of these situations in our head in the event you get that like random one off. So lateral is backwards, backwards is backwards. It has to be a forward pass. So from the time that ball left his hand and hit the guy in the helmet, it was clearly going backwards. And it's just such a weird play because the whistle doesn't matter. There's no such thing as an inadvertent whistle if it is picked up. A backward pass can be advanced by the non throwing player. A fumble cannot be advanced. So like there's some real nuance to all of this. But by the letter of the law, that is a conversion. I would not be shocked to see that placed on the table at like the owner's meeting and say, okay, no one ever imagined that moment was going to happen. Let's put some guardrails in place to make sure you don't get awarded a two point conversion when you failed the two point conversion. I would not be shocked to see them try to put some more like, specific rulings for that exact situation because that sucks. Like, you defend that play. Everyone had given up on the play and it eventually led to you losing. Kind of a weird one. But by the letter of the law, it was legit.

[Tara Lawan]

God. Yeah.

[Will]

Well, I mean, dude, the referees, man.

[Greg Olsen]

But Will, what do they teach you? Race? What do they teach you guys on defense, man?

[Will]

No, you're right. But I'm thinking of other situations.

[Greg Olsen]

Pick up everything.

[Will]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. Get on the ball.

[Greg Olsen]

Pick up everything.

[Tara Lawan]

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[Greg Olsen]

Pick up everything.

[Will]

Did you see the. The situations with the Lions?

[Tara Lawan]

Yes.

[Will]

Even when you're watching the Patriots game and the Drake May throws a deep ball, I forget the receipt.

[Tara Lawan]

And it should have been. It should have been a flag.

[Will]

Yeah.

[Tara Lawan]

Clear as day. Should have been a flag.

[Will]

Yeah. Humphreys is sitting there tackling him, like, right in front of like everybody. The announcers are even laughing about it. Like, yeah, that's a miss.

[Tara Lawan]

That's.

[Will]

That's a pass interference.

[Tara Lawan]

Right.

[Will]

Like moments that just matter and we're. See, we. We just. I feel like it, especially this time of year, like it sticks out like a sore thumb when, like when there's a bad call that happens. What'd you make of the lion situations down there? Like when they went for. It was when they went for two, right. Or the touchdown. The score, the little.

[Greg Olsen]

The touchdown, the little pick route.

[Will]

And then he was even a pick route.

[Tara Lawan]

It was a bot. Let me go body. Jalen Ramsey. Throw him into the. In the rafters for a second. Come back to the ball. Not score.

[Greg Olsen]

There was two. Yeah.

[Will]

So there's, there's another.

[Tara Lawan]

I'm talking about the last play of the game is that. We're not talking about that.

[Greg Olsen]

They scored. They scored on a pick route. They ran a little dart slant.

[Will]

Yeah.

[Tara Lawan]

Washington. Darnell Washington.

[Will]

Yeah, the guy.

[Tara Lawan]

Okay. Remember, I'm also thinking of the wrong play. Keep going.

[Greg Olsen]

No but. No, but that. No, but you're right. But the whole series of events was wild because they're up five, they kick a very short field goal to go up 8, saying, okay, at least we can force a tie at the very least. And the guy misses it, the Steelers kicker misses it. So they remain down five. So now it's touchdown or bust four down mode. Go to win the game, and they score. But it was real late. Like the. The tv, they didn't reference that there was a flag on the pick route to the. To the right corner. Like they. No one said there was a flag. They're showing the celebration. You know how usually like the yellow thing that says flag.

[Will]

Yeah.

[Greg Olsen]

Pops up, nothing came. And then like, I'd say a good 15 seconds later, the flag was referenced. Then they show the replay. You're like, okay, obviously, clearly pass interference. Then the Amun ra one that you're talking about. Taylor was insane. I mean, the amount of moving parts there. I would have liked to have seen a replay. I don't. Right. Like, we all assumed it was going to be some sort of pass interference, but we didn't actually get a replay of Amun Random punching the guy in the chest at the goal line, Jalen Ramsey, until clearly after the official's announcement.

[Tara Lawan]

Right.

[Greg Olsen]

But in those situations, putting all that together is. He is not easy. Right. For Romo and Nance to try to decipher all that in the real moment is not easy. The biggest part of all of that is offensive penalties don't extend the game. Right. So even if you don't know, even if. Which I don't blame them for not knowing. Then there was a lateral. If it was clearly a lateral, it can be advanced by golf because it's under two minutes. If it was a fumble, it cannot be advanced by anyone other than the fumbling party. In that case, fourth down correct inside two minutes.

[Tara Lawan]

I thought it was only fourth down. The only person that can advance the ball is the guy that fumbled. Am I incorrect?

[Greg Olsen]

Pretty sure. Now you have me second guessing myself. I. We have to. Now you have me second guessing. I'm fairly certain there's a time element, I think. Fourth down for sure.

[Tara Lawan]

Yes.

[Greg Olsen]

So in that case, it would have been fourth down. And in the last two minutes, I'm pretty sure there's a time element. But now you have me second guessing myself so we can fact check.

[Tara Lawan]

I hate doing that.

[Greg Olsen]

Fourth down for sure. But. So, like, there was so many different factors on there, but the only thing that mattered was offensive penalty. As. As Time goes to zero, regardless of the outcome of the play. There is no untimed down, untimed downs, only for defensive penalties, which happens very rarely. That off the top of your head, I'm not sure if in the moment I would have known it either.

[Tara Lawan]

And the thing that's crazy too is like, while the referees are sitting there and talking, you have Steelers players and Lions players like, coming in, trying to give their two cents on the whole thing. And you could tell, like, in their minds, from an entertainment standpoint, it might not be just entertainment, but they're like, getting the players far enough away to where they can have a conversation without them hearing. To where you don't see, like, the Steelers guys cheering or any of that exactly true WWE shit. And then for the referee and I, my heart goes out to the Lions fans, man, because it's got to be such a heartbreaking, like getting your hopes up like that and heartbreaking. But for him to start over, all the things being like, the result of the play is a touchdown is the craziest way to start all of that. That and you're just like. And you hear the Lions fans lose their mind. Like, we just won and our playoff hopes are alive. We're ripping all the things. And he goes, the result of the play is a touchdown. But, but, but it's like, oh, my God, it was. It was true cinema. It really was fair.

[Greg Olsen]

And that's such a tough announcement, right? Because you have to acknowledge it was a touchdown. It was a legal lateral, but it was an offensive penalty. Yes, Time expired. Because if there was one second left, they would have enforced the offensive pass interference. Retried, fourth down. But because it went to zero, I mean, there was so many elements to that play in real time. And then to get up there and address the crowd, the country, and concisely package it all together for it to just make sense. I don't envy the position of the officials.

[Will]

You almost can't start off with the result of the play was a touchdown. You almost just have to say, all right, guys, bear with me for one for one for 60 seconds.

[Greg Olsen]

Everyone grab a beer and just hold, hold on your ass, right?

[Tara Lawan]

We're gonna take a quick five minute break. We'll get back to you in just a moment.

[Will]

Yeah, yeah. Everybody bear with me because I'm gonna say something, you're gonna get excited, but then it's gonna make you very mad. So just let me finish the 60 seconds, right?

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, exactly. And dude, like Rogers after that, just kind of like sitting there and you could see he's like reflecting in his post game press conference about 10 years ago. He did X, Y and Z. He game like this 13 years ago, except where we had bad refs. And you just kind of see like the joy on Roger's face for the first time in a long time. You're just like, good for you, man.

[Greg Olsen]

Ste been playing good shots of Rogers's bicep T. Yeah, that kept sticking out to me. I was like, God, I didn't realize he was all tatted up, but they kept showing. I don't know if he wore like a different sleeve or like he didn't wear a sleeve. I don't know what was going on, but like we got a hundred shot. We didn't get the replay sequence, but we got the shot of the Rogers's arm tat like 10 times, which was also mind blowing. I didn't even realize he was tatted up.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, it was, it was awesome, man.

[Greg Olsen]

It was a lot going on. That was a hell. I mean, you talk about the three, three national games Thursday, the Bears, packers on Fox and then that ending on CBS. Like both teams down 10 points plus in the fourth quarter comeback. It was. Oh no, that was last night's game. But like then you factor in Sunday's game where they're down 10. New England. Those four games. The drama that ended those four games is incredible.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, there was in that New England game when they were. I think it was 11.

[Will]

Yeah, they were down.

[Tara Lawan]

They were down 11.

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[Tara Lawan]

All.

[Coca Cola Advertiser]

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[Tara Lawan]

Four and so they're down by four. And I thought I saw variable put a one up and I'm thinking, ain't no way they're going for one right now to make it a four point game. Like, you got to make it a three point. So I got my phone out, ready to take a photo. Nine minutes left in the fourth, blah, blah. And then they end up going for two. I'm like, all right, we don't gotta talk about this with Greg tomorrow. Because that would have been a devastating, strategically bad move by them.

[Will]

Yeah, bad. I sit there now and all the games I watch, I almost question every time, do they need to be going for it right here?

[Tara Lawan]

100%.

[Will]

They should go for two damn near every time.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah.

[Greg Olsen]

Yeah, they should go for two point plays this weekend. Dude, we saw Sirianni late in the game. The game was over in our game. Go up 17. Tank Bigsby, I want to say it was Tank Bigsby scored to go up 17. Instead of kicking the extra point to go up 18, he went for two to go up 19. In the moment. Right. I'm factoring on this. I'm like, I guess being up 19 is better than being up 18. I'm like literally doing this in the commercial break in my brain. And I'm like, well, because it's two touchdowns, two 2 point conversions and a field goal tie versus two touchdowns, two 2 point conversions AND a field goal beats you. But there's four minutes to go in the game. Josh Johnson's at quarterback. Is there really a likelihood of them even getting three? And I'm like doing all these mental gymnastics in my head and I'm like, you know what? They've missed three field goals. They're kicking situations a disaster. Like, I don't blame them. Just go work on your two point plays. Like, that's literally how I ended up, like, summarizing it.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah.

[Greg Olsen]

Because to be up 19, 18, I don't know if it really mattered at that point in the game. It was over, you know?

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah.

[Greg Olsen]

What Is a fight broke out.

[Tara Lawan]

What's your preference on calling a Friday a game? Like, does it mess up your routine? Are you kind of about it that way? You can go watch ball Saturday, Sunday it was.

[Greg Olsen]

So my game was Saturday, so I called the Saturday that Saturday. Fox had a double header this year, which was super cool. So we got two national games. We did. So I think when they started, when they set the schedule and they told us about this, I think the assumption was our crew was going to do Bears, packers, and then the night game, Burkhart and Tom, Kevin and Tom were going to do the rematch of the NFC championship, right. Eagles, defending super bowl champs, against the Commanders and. And all that. So obviously with the year Washington had, they flipped the game. So we got Washington, Philly, but still really cool. I mean, two national games on a Saturday obviously went up head to head against some of the College Football playoff games, but I loved it. It allowed me to go to the Panther game yesterday, took my boys to the Panther game, got to watch them. Obviously the momentum that we built on banging the drum. But yeah, it was weird waking up on a Sunday and just like hanging, strolling up to the stadium, had a couple beers during the game. Watch it. It was, it was fun.

[Tara Lawan]

I love it, dude.

[Will]

On the, on the situational ball, the Bears ended up winning the game. But at the end when they decide to kick the extra point and go for two, are you thinking, Are you going for two?

[Greg Olsen]

You know what? In most instances, I'm going for two. To try to just end the game in the moment you got the momentum. Do you think you have all the momentum?

[Tara Lawan]

Win the game in regulation? That's an extreme.

[Greg Olsen]

And I've said that you want to win the game in regulation. I think the calculation that they made was the team we're playing down, their star quarterback offensively struggling, haven't really gotten a lot of things going. So this is where the analytics world fights back and says, these are not computers, these are not robots. All of these factors are baked into the final number that gets spit out. Right? You go into, there's a league wide. Do you go for it? Don't you? League wide trends. Then each individual team has to take that data in advance. Predetermined. Okay, how does this data affect my team based on what we know, and that's before the game in these little books that they produce. Because you're not allowed to have tablets, you're not allowed to have the technology. We can have it in the booth as broadcasters. They can't have it in the booth with the coaching staff. They can't have it on the sideline. They're not allowed access to computers, phones, tablets that have, like, any Internet access because they don't want them doing these real, real time calculations. So it's all preset in these scenario books that they do. But then you have to apply it to what's actually going on in the game. Right. So there is an element of real time information that's being calculated. And I think the knock on analytics is, well, you say go for a quarterback sneak, but what if your left guards are. Or what if you're. And we and the guys who do support it sit here and says, it is being baked in. All those decisions are being calculated by yes or no. So I actually do think it was smart to go to overtime because I think the, the conversation there was, we're playing against a backup quarterback. We're playing against, you know, Jordan loves out. I think if Jordan loves in and that game is a higher scoring, more offensive efficiency, I'm going for two. I'm ending the game.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, I mean, I can get on board with that.

[Will]

He said a lot. He said a lot to essentially say, I like our ball club better in OT because we have momentum going for us and we're playing against a backup quarterback.

[Greg Olsen]

Well, momentum, the momentum of the game and the fact that Jordan Love, one of the best five quarterbacks in the league, is out of the game in concussion protocol are two very different conversations.

[Will]

I, I don't disagree with you, but you're still. You're basing it off your, your gut instinct and your feeling on, hey, they don't have Jordan Love. We just drove down and scored like.

[Greg Olsen]

It could have been 30. We'll take score. Could have been 38.

[Will]

Because again, by the book, by analytics, you go for two and win in regulation. Greg, rule number one, win in regulation.

[Greg Olsen]

You. You want to win in regulation. That's. Every decision that you make is about increasing your opportunity to win the game in regulation. That is 100%. How all these. The point being you're not trying to play for a tie when there's five minutes to go in the game and you're deciding, how many possessions do I have, how many times am I going to get the ball back? Do I want to be down 9 or 7? All the things we've covered this year, especially in the last couple weeks, every decision, the final output is about win probability, not tie probability. Okay? So just understanding that's the framework of how all these models are built. But then in the nuance of the game. And this is where like, and again, like the analytics crowd gets kind of like put like into a locker. Like you guys are the nerds on the Internet, you know, we're football people, we know more than you. The knock on analytics is that you're not taking into account what's happening in a football game. Right. You're not taking into account injuries, you're not taking into account is the starting quarterback in or out, the center, the whatever it is, the score of the game, Is it a high scoring game? Yeah. I want to end this shit. I do not want Green Bay to possess the ball. We haven't stopped them all day. We talked about that last week in the Buffalo New England game, right? Where it's like, we haven't stopped Josh Allen in three quarters. Why do I want to give him the ball back?

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah.

[Greg Olsen]

So all those factors, the analytics crowd, if that's what I want to be thrown at, I don't. That's fine. Those things are being taken into account. But we're not taking into account how people feel on the sideline and how good the post game, the pregame huddle was. And we just scored two touchdowns. So I'm going to go for two now. I didn't score a touchdown, so I'm not going to go for two. Those are the arguments that have zero bearing on the actual outcome. It's not that guys don't feel it, it's just over long periods of time. The outcomes don't support that.

[Tara Lawan]

Right. A lot of the conversations we revolve around with situational two, not two, happens at the end of the game. In the Miami, Texas A and M game, it was clear that both defenses were being. Were killing each other. They were the biggest part of the game. The offenses were getting nothing going. Miami finds himself in a fourth and three to five situation down on like the six yard line going into their end zone. They elect to kick three. They miss the three in that situation. Are you going for the touchdown in that position?

[Greg Olsen]

Yeah. So college. I don't pretend to know the college landscape.

[Tara Lawan]

Use the conversation we're having as these are two football teams. The both defenses are.

[Greg Olsen]

I'll take. Yeah. So I'll. Again, it has happened in the NFL game because I do think the kickoff situation in the NFL is a significant difference. There's some nuance about field position. Right. Like I, you know, I fail going forward on fourth and three. At the three. If I get it, I get seven. If I go for it and fail, you got the ball in the minus three. But if I kick a field goal, let's just call the average starting field position in the NFL is the 32. So I got three points, but I gave you 29 yards. So there is some, there is some context about the NFL that makes some of these goal to go situations very different. I'll take my game. I called on Saturday and I said this in real time. Would it have mattered? I don't know. Opening kickoff of the game. Philadelphia gets the ball. They fumble the opening kickoff. Washington gets the ball on the, I don't know, inside to 30. They go down. They go down. They go down. They have like fourth and goal to two. Two and a half. Ish. And on third and two, third and three from. They threw an incomplete pass. On fourth down, they kicked the field goal. So they got an opening kickoff return fumble. Got the ball in Philly's field, in Philly side of the field. Got the ball inside the five and kicked the field goal to go up three. Nothing. If you're Philly running off the field defensively. Let's talk vibes for a minute. How you feeling, Will? You just got a sudden change. You didn't think you were starting the game. Next thing you know, you're on defense. Sudden change backed up, all the emotions are high. All the vibes we talk about and all this, and you force a field goal. Is that a win or a loss?

[Will]

It's a massive dub, massive win.

[Tara Lawan]

Right? You go for it. You go, you go for the touchdown.

[Greg Olsen]

So that's, that's an example. So instead they kick off. And now instead of the first time, you know, the first time Jalen Hurts gets, you know, behind center in that game, instead of, if he's in the gun, he's in the end zone, if not, he's under center at the 1. Instead, he's got the ball at the, you know, we'll call it the 33.

[Will]

Yeah. No.

[Tara Lawan]

Fair points, got to go for it.

[Greg Olsen]

Fair points, got to go for it. One of the bad field goals get you beat, man. I mean, look at, look at the Rams on Thursday night. Now they scored 30 points. How many now that one got taken away on a pass interference or on a legal man downfield. Right. One of the early touchdowns. How many field goals did LA kick inside the 10 yard line?

[Tara Lawan]

I don't know the number, but a lot.

[Greg Olsen]

At least two.

[Will]

Yeah.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah. If you get inside the 10, you got to start having the conversation with yourself as like, we're using four downs to get these 10 yards. It seems like that is now the new world we are living in. But if you're going through the game and both offenses are absolutely crushing it and you. Are you then thinking maybe we don't go forward here? I don't know. I'm so. I'm losing my train of thought a little bit because it's so nuanced and it does have so much to do with what's taking place during the game.

[Will]

Take the points, man.

[Greg Olsen]

I think first two field goals, first two field goals, that LA kick, they were down seven, nothing. They kicked the field goal from the six in the first quarter to go down 73. Then their first possession of the second quarter, they had the ball and they got down fourth and two at the five. Got a delay a game. Fourth and then they went to fourth and seven at the 10. They kicked the field goal.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, well, you.

[Greg Olsen]

They had the ball at the six and they had the ball at the two and they got six points.

[Tara Lawan]

You get the delay game, you got to keep the field goal, but you should be going for it in the.

[Greg Olsen]

Situation again, I didn't see that part of the game. So did they try to make them jump? I don't know exactly what they did, but yeah, no. And listen, the cool thing that I think about all of this is, and we joke about momentum and we joke about what's the best and all this at the end of the day, I think the cool thing that comes from a lot of these conversations we've had all year is more people are thinking about it, talking about it, discussing it. They might not agree, they might not all be on the same side of the argument, and that's fine. But I think it's pretty cool that people now are watching the game with those scenarios in their head and watching the game that they think it's time to chirp. All of us on Twitter, they're thinking about it. It's in their mind. And maybe a year or two ago, it never even dawned on people that these are the decisions that the coaches are wrestling with in real time. We're thinking about it sitting on the couch, just watching as fans. But this is very much what's going on all week long, during the game, after the game, in post game recaps, pregame meetings. And I think it's cool that now fans and viewers are going through the same mental exercises of game management and strategy that the players and the coaches are going through. I think that's the win of all of this.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah. If anything's come from this conversation that we've been having on busting with the boys. It's that we are building strong character in these coaches to understand it's okay to go to the podium and stand 10 toes down on some of these decisions you're making. Don't take the scared way out anymore. We are now giving you a vessel to where you can sit on a podium and go, I learned this on busing with the boys. This is the correct.

[Greg Olsen]

Exactly. Yeah, exactly.

[Will]

I'd love to. I'd love to watch a game with Greg.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah.

[Will]

Just look over and be like, you got to take the points here because.

[Tara Lawan]

It was truly great.

[Will]

Like, like, no, you got to take the points here. And then when Chicago kicks the extra points instead of going for two, I like, look at Ben Johnson. He's just taking the easier press conference.

[Tara Lawan]

Yep.

[IBM Advertiser]

Yeah.

[Tara Lawan]

I'm thinking when I want to watch a football game, since we've been doing this on these recaps, it's the first 15 plays on both teams in the first quarter. It's the last two minutes of the half. It's the first 15 plays in the second half and the last four minutes of the game that are the most exciting for me to watch. Yeah, like, there could be multiple touchdowns going back and forth, but, like, when it comes down to your players have give. This is the proc. Your players have given you. Now, as a coach, it's your job to put them in the most advantageous spot to be successful at the end of the game. And watching how different coaches make different decisions, that if this team had that coach, they would be more successful than the other way around. Because I've said this before in the bus, like, as a player, I didn't always look at the coaching staff and be like, oh, we have great coaches. That puts us in good position. I just thought we have good players or we don't have good players. We're going to figure out the game, and it's all on us.

[Will]

Yeah.

[Tara Lawan]

Truly, it's like these very little. These pockets in the game that great coaching elevates your team to a whole new level because then it breeds momentum.

[Will]

And Greg's right, too. Like, fans are in it. They're involved. They're. They're kind of watching and going through. What do you. What are you laughing at?

[Greg Olsen]

It brings momentum.

[Tara Lawan]

It brings momentum. Yeah, that was my.

[Greg Olsen]

I was laughing at that.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, good. Good.

[Will]

With the fan part being involved and everything else, it's like, I didn't know Greg was coming on today, but I saw. Whenever I jumped on Twitter, I saw Somebody at me and be. I can't wait to hear you guys talk about the fourth quarter of the Patriots game and hear Greg's takes on everything else. So since my brain was thinking that Greg wasn't gonna come home, like sad. Like sad. We don't get to talk about the situation. Well, because.

[Greg Olsen]

Why did you not think I was coming on, by the way?

[Will]

I don't know why I thought that Christmas. I think Clump might have said that you were possibly not going to be on today. So I have no clue. I just. Again, I heard we're here now.

[Greg Olsen]

So what are they. What do you want to talk? What. What situation did they want to talk about?

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, because the fourth quarter of the Patriots game, Patriots, Ravens, is like, I think they handled it exactly the way you would say you should handle it. Other down by 11.

[Greg Olsen]

Was there any. Was there, like a significant situation that I missed?

[Will]

I don't think so. Like, maybe it went the way it should have went. And that fan is just excited to, you know, excited that they're seeing the same things we are. To your point, Greg, everybody. So they're just, you know, they're getting like. All the boys are probably going to talk about the way everything was handled situationally in the fourth quarter.

[Greg Olsen]

Fourth quarter went touchdown, Ravens touchdown. Patriots punt. Six play punt by the Ravens. What was the down and distance when they punted?

[Will]

Oh, Greg might have found something. What was the D and D?

[Greg Olsen]

No, it was. All right, so it was fourth and four at midfield.

[Tara Lawan]

What? Oh, they're on the 50 yard line now.

[Greg Olsen]

They took a. You guys probably know. But they took a penalty. Mark Andrews, false start. Were they in. Were they lined up to try to snap it? I might have been in and out of.

[Tara Lawan]

No, they seem like they were in an ice situation. And then the, The. The nickel came down and kind of did one of those, but didn't cross the line. And Mark Andrews, along with like the right guard, like, jumped out of there. We got him. We got there.

[Greg Olsen]

Oh. So it looked like we were gonna try to. And if they didn't, they were gonna take a delay a game anyway.

[Tara Lawan]

Probably. Yeah, it seemed like they were gonna take delay again.

[Greg Olsen]

So I think fourth and four at the time. They were up 24, 21. Fourth and four at midfield. So let's see. So they punted.

[Tara Lawan]

Backup quarterback.

[Greg Olsen]

Backup quarterback.

[Will]

Yeah, Huntley.

[Greg Olsen]

They punted and they pinned New England at the 11 and New England went 89 yards for a touchdown.

[Tara Lawan]

You gotta go for it in that situation. You go for it. Let him shoot you first or sooner so you have a better opportunity.

[Will]

Yeah. So you get the ball back.

[Tara Lawan]

Because now the Patriots are thinking, all we got to do is get three here variables to probably not think in that. But like the old thought process of football is like, we're only down by three.

[Greg Olsen]

Let's at least come in field goal range. At least I can always tie. Don't put the ball in harm's way. Don't be a little more concerned.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, because I was thinking that when they were on the. I believe it was the, like the 50 yard line and they lined up and it was fourth and four, I'm like, I wonder if they're actually gonna go for it. And then they started to do the hard counts. I was like, okay, they're gonna ice, take the delay game, give their punter room to kick it. But I was kind of hoping they would go for it in that situation. Just so this conversation would have been like, was it the right move?

[Will]

Well, it sounds like it was not the right move to kick to punt the ball.

[Greg Olsen]

Backup quarterback. It's hard. Listen, I'm not saying any of these decisions are easy and they're hard to stand up there and defend.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah.

[Greg Olsen]

I just always think in those situations, I would rather be in control of the outcome in the game than deferring it to you and my reliance on stopping. I don't know, I just. You think you have an opportunity there to really change the outcome of the game under your terms. You get to call the play, you get to decide the formation. You get to decide. It's something you've worked on all week, all year, for multiple years. It's a big moment. Play at top of your play sheet as opposed to now I punt it to you and now I'm reacting to Drake May. I'm on the defensive, literally trying to just react to a 2 minute mode, hyper aggressive 4 down mode against one of the best quarterbacks in football. My defense isn't particularly great all season. Right. You're not the Texans, you're not Seattle, other than Thursday when they weren't that good. But like, I wouldn't say Baltimore's defense has been this killer.

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[Tara Lawan]

All.

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[Will]

Yeah.

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[Will]

Ah.

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[Greg Olsen]

All year. So you're like, oh, we're going to let our defense win the game. Really? Why?

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, yeah. If it was the Houston or Seattle or Denver, sure. You're like okay, yeah, we. You feel pretty good about putting your boys in that position. But yeah, I like going for it. I'm fully starting to buy into this.

[Will]

I'm fired up. We found the situation. Yeah. That this fan was excited for us to talk about.

[Greg Olsen]

I hope so because this fan met. Chirped us on or not chirped us but was. It seemed pos about it.

[Tara Lawan]

That's what you want. Greg? This is a probably. I don't know if you really want to answer this question like for bus with the boys. I don't know. I hate putting you in these positions. What's your favorite Christmas movie?

[Greg Olsen]

Oh wow. Home Alone.

[Tara Lawan]

The original fantastic movie. My kids are all about it.

[Will]

We just watched two over the weekend. Oh, Home Alone.

[Greg Olsen]

I love Elf. Yeah, I know that doesn't have like the nostalgia of like some of those like classics, you know, Christmas vacation. That. That's an all timer.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah.

[Greg Olsen]

Yeah. Home Alone though, like that was my childhood. That was the Christmas movie we watched a thousand times. The old man neighbor who's so scary and then he turns out to be like this loving man. Like that was a. That Was that was just like my childhood. Like, you can't get enough of that.

[Tara Lawan]

What's interesting to me, watching that movie now, having kids that are old enough to, like, watch, consume. They're not just involved with, like, cartoons. Like, they're kind of going through that transformation. Right now. We're watching Home Alone a couple of days ago, and I'm always having the conversation with my kids. Like, hey, if you're in a situation, you're in public and someone's like, come with me. And you say, no. You scream as loud as you can. And my oldest is kind of like, dad, this kid handled business.

[Greg Olsen]

Yeah.

[Tara Lawan]

And I had to basically sit them down, be like, that's a movie. You know what happens to that kid if he tries to pull half of those things? He's. He's unalived at the end of that movie. That's what takes place. Because my kids are legit. They can't thinking. If we just put some marbles down and tie some paint cans with some string, we're gonna. Some bandits up, and it's like, guys, no shot. They're gonna go like this.

[Greg Olsen]

Boo.

[Tara Lawan]

And you're done, brother. And you're done.

[Greg Olsen]

So the plot of that movie, magical. Every kid's dream, maybe a little unrealistic. Maybe. Call home. It was not 1850. We were not, like, using the pony express. Like, simple call to the landline. How you doing? Call a neighbor. Can you walk down the street? Like, apparently that entire block was just abandoned by people. Everyone on that street goes out of town. Everyone left.

[Tara Lawan]

And the kid just doesn't call 911 till, like, the very end, when he's finally got his devious plan all set up. It's hilarious.

[Will]

Did you see the SNL skit on Home Alone?

[Tara Lawan]

I think so. I think it was kind of what I was just doing, right?

[Will]

Yeah.

[Tara Lawan]

Where they're walking the room like, hey, watch out. There's some marbles on the ground right there. And they're like, oh, yeah.

[Will]

No, no, no, no, no. They did it to where everybody's basically dying from, you know, the. The. Oh, yeah, yeah. The family comes home, and they're like, oh, my gosh, you're here. And he's like, I'm gonna go. I'm gonna go in the room and get something. Some just fire sprays the top of his head. It likes his entire head on fire. And he's screaming and then sets up this domino effect to everything that happens. Everybody's essentially dying from all the booby traps that were la. But it's it's hilarious. You should check it out, dude.

[Tara Lawan]

Okay, first, if I could put you on a little bit of game for you and your wife. Two movies that I would suggest is Family Stone, Tear Jerker, and then another one is Spirited with Ryan Reynolds and Will Ferrell.

[Will]

That's a good newer one.

[Tara Lawan]

It's a good newer one. I'm telling you.

[Will]

Christmas Chronicles.

[Tara Lawan]

It's more like. More. It's definitely an adult holiday movie like Christmas Chronicles.

[Greg Olsen]

Love it.

[Tara Lawan]

What the hell is Christmas Chronicles?

[Will]

Check it out. It's on Netflix.

[Tara Lawan]

All right, all right, all right.

[Greg Olsen]

My kids used to watch Christmas Chronicles when they were kids.

[Tara Lawan]

Last thing I'll say.

[Greg Olsen]

And they're still kids. They were younger kids.

[Tara Lawan]

Last thing I'll say about Home Alone, when Kevin's mom finally comes home and she looks for him and she walks in, she goes, merry Christmas, Kevin. And they have a hug. And then the rest of the family walks in and like, pretty cool. You made it. And they all just go in the other room and Kevin walks to the window and looks out at the old man who's hugging. It's like. Like this kid's been home alone for three days and you've been. You've been raking yourself over the coals of being a terrible mother. And all you could say to him is, merry Christmas, Kevin. And then walk in the other room to do whatever. Terrible parenting.

[Greg Olsen]

And the dad didn't give a. Didn't give a.

[Tara Lawan]

The dad the whole time's like, he'll be all right. It's just wild to me the way the dad handled it.

[IBM Advertiser]

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[Tara Lawan]

It's so good. Hey, have the Chiefs just completely packed it in like, you don't make the playoffs?

[Will]

And it's just. I think Patrick Mahomes needs to be in the MVP conversation.

[Tara Lawan]

Still.

[Will]

Still. Because you. They are such a dog shit team without Patrick Mahomes.

[Tara Lawan]

Did you see all the players that didn't play?

[Will]

No, it was just 15. I was hoping. I was hoping this score would end two to nothing.

[Tara Lawan]

Same. I was hoping the same thing, but sad again.

[Greg Olsen]

It's the reality of this thing, man. It comes for everyone. It's just. Just some people get to last a little bit longer.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah.

[Greg Olsen]

Team. You know, team wise, obviously Mahomes will be back. He'll be fine. But like, that thing's going to look a little bit different going forward, and maybe that's a good thing. Maybe this is what they needed to say. You know what? We've stretched this probably longer than any of us imagined. We've Been thrown into the garbage a hundred times. People thought we were dead. We rebranded with this young defense, kick started it a couple years ago, won the super bowl, got back to another super bowl and maybe we just need to reset and start all over again. And there's nothing wrong with that.

[Tara Lawan]

It's just sad that we're probably watching the last of Travis Kelsey lose to the Titans, which is like, hey, shout out the Titan. That's great. But it was just watching a team that was miserable last year, like, he's.

[Greg Olsen]

Got big things ahead.

[Will]

Huge things. Greg probably knows.

[Greg Olsen]

No, I know he's got big tight end.

[Will]

You brotherhood. That's tight in you family.

[Greg Olsen]

Tight end, new brotherhood. Man, we're thick.

[Will]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Tara Lawan]

Thick. We only have five minutes left. Is there anything, Greg, that you want to talk about?

[Will]

Who do you got in the MVP race right now?

[Greg Olsen]

Oh, love that. Right now. I think it's two. I think it's Stafford and Drake May.

[Will]

Agreed. Who do you have as the front runner currently? Drake. Drake.

[Greg Olsen]

If the season ended right now, God, if you would ask me two weeks ago, I would have said Stafford right down. I mean, it's Stafford. The reason they lost that I don't like punishing guys for like, oh, they lost to Seattle and you become like a creature. You become like a creature of the moment. I still think I'm going to give it to Stafford. I'm probably not as strong in that opinion as I was two, three weeks ago. I think what Drake May is doing on a team that preseason had very little expectations. One, how many games last year?

[Tara Lawan]

Four. Yep.

[Greg Olsen]

New coach, bottom of the barrel. For them to not only be better, for not only them to be good, but them to be like potential top seed, one or two seed good and be and do that as a young quarterback in this league where we see young guys struggle, man, he's. I can make an argument for both. If I had a vote, I'd vote for Stafford.

[Will]

Yeah, I do think it's. It's razor thin close because again with Drake May, it's not like he's got Puka Nukua, Devonte Adams.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, he's got a bunch of guys.

[Greg Olsen]

I mean, I can make a great case of why I would vote for Drake. And he's a Charlotte kid and I've known him for a long time. I mean he's. He's special in all categories.

[Will]

And just to be that, see being year two and just observing and watching, he seems completely unfazed in the moments that he gets in. Whether it's hey, they're down. You know, down 11. Like just his ability, his poise and everything else. Only being second year in the league, I feel like it's just super impressive.

[Greg Olsen]

Yeah. Here's a fun exercise redraft last year's first round quarterbacks.

[Will]

Okay, give me, give me. Because you got what? You got Drake May, you got.

[Greg Olsen]

So you got Drake, you got Caleb Williams, you got Jane Daniels, you got bo nix, J.J. mcCarthy.

[Tara Lawan]

I mean, yeah, Drake sitting there at one. Right. Totally, completely.

[Greg Olsen]

Drake, two. I think two is the most fascinating part.

[Will]

If I'm sitting there and I'm drafting, they're all, they're all, they're all on a bench. I think this is tough.

[Tara Lawan]

It's tough because it's really between Bo Nix, Caleb Williams. Those are the two.

[Will]

One.

[Greg Olsen]

Daniels was the player.

[Tara Lawan]

Injuries, injuries. I know, you're right.

[Greg Olsen]

He was right.

[Tara Lawan]

But you're hoping.

[Greg Olsen]

But you're drafting for the next 10 years.

[Will]

Right, right, right.

[Tara Lawan]

Exactly. And so are you going to take the guy with the higher ceiling, which I think we can agree is Caleb Williams, or take the ultimate pro and maybe a higher floor and Bo Nicks? That's kind of how I'm looking at this.

[Greg Olsen]

So you would take both Bo Nicks and Caleb over Jaden Daniels?

[Tara Lawan]

You're talking about the next 10 years?

[Greg Olsen]

Yeah. He's your franchise quarterback. Yeah, I think. What her. Because if I would. If we would have done this at the end of last season, Jay Daniels I think would have been the unanimous number one.

[Tara Lawan]

Agreed, agreed. The thing is his injuries and you're talking about the next 10 years and it's like, it's, it's too eerily similar to me from an RG3 standpoint or a great first year, then the second year kind of all, it all fell apart. And if we're talking about 10 years longevity, well, I see in my. The sample size of 50, like it's been. 50% of your career has been injured. Basically it's not your fault. And everything can change. Change. But because of those reasons, I have to go with the safer route and go to Bo Nix or Caleb Williams who have stayed healthy.

[Will]

I was listening to Matt Ryan kind of talk about quarterback development and he was talking like, you know, for. In the first year, like if you're like, you strike lightning in the bottle, like as a quarterback going into your second year, you're kind of just trying to keep your head above water in the first year. And then the second year, like if you have some success, you could get trapped into, hey, I think I Know what's going on more out there so you could play a little over your ski. Which I feel like Jaden Daniels, that could be the case in year two outside of the, the injury stuff he's like not until like you know, the third even really the fourth year is when you feel like you're seeing the field, you're seeing the game from all angles that the coaches want, want you to see it at. And if I'm looking at all these quarterbacks right now, I feel like I see that go against Jayne Daniels for how he kind of developed in the second year when he was on the field. And I feel like the light starting to click for Caleb Williams to where if you're looking at a 10 year quarterback like dude he, I feel like he's so close so you could talk about his inaccuracies.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah.

[Will]

But the way he continues to sling the rock even when he has a couple bad moments, the way he moves around and haven't being paired with Ben Johnson, I feel like he's so close to like breaking through and being like that elite quarterback were on why he was drafted first overall. Yeah, Drake May I feel like has that again the game's kind of slowing down for him. Him and even Bo Nix again higher floor, everything else. But if I'm chasing that higher ceiling of the quarterbacks we're kind of picking from to me go one Drake May, two Caleb Williams, then three Bo Nicks.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, I, I could, I could, I could flip 2 and 3 at any point.

[Will]

But Matt Ryan had a great breakdown. Not like talking about if you're redrafting but just a great breakdown of like quarterback progression and development over the years and when he felt most confident being on the field that he alluded to it being year five for him.

[Greg Olsen]

Yeah, I can make an argument but everything you just said Will I can make the same argument. Happens to teams that have a quick turnaround. Right. You look at Washington, low expectations, you hadn't been good in years. New ownership, you get dq. Dan Quinn, you draft Jaden, he's the offensive player that you're, you're a game away from the Super Bowl. Oh my God, we are ready to compete. Do you always get a good, real honest perspective? Did you win some games you shouldn't have? Was your record better than what you really are? Right. That goes, goes both directions. Some years your record, you're actually better than your record. Some years you're not as good as your record. Right. So there's a lot of. I think it's thrown Off. A lot of teams rebuild when they have early success and then all of a sudden in year two they get exposed. So I think everything you just said about quarterbacks, you can make the same argument of just overall team success. You think of the Giants first year day ball, they go to the playoffs, they beat, they beat Minnesota in Minnesota, a huge upset. Coach of the year. Now Daniel Jones is getting paid. Saquon wants to get paid. These. And all of a sudden did you push back your rebuild? And if you would have went 7 and 9 and didn't make now I guess 7 and 10 and you didn't make the playoffs, would you have handled drafts different? Would you have handled free agency different? Would you have handled extensions different? But all of a sudden you feel like, oh my God, we're in win now mode. You double down on some guys and it doesn't work. You just push that rebuild off. So it's a pretty fascinating exercise about early success in a turnaround.

[Will]

Yeah. When it's like did we actually realize that we were just fortunately keeping our head above water throughout the year? Now we think we're, we're getting a little too confident in what the reality of the situation is.

[Tara Lawan]

Right.

[Greg Olsen]

Yeah, it's interesting. I think I would go Drake May for sure. I think I'd go Caleb too. Jaden3 Bonix.

[Will]

Fascinating.

[Tara Lawan]

I don't hate that. The only thing that takes me away from Jaden at this point is the injuries.

[Greg Olsen]

And the injuries are real. I do think a change in offensive plan. I'm not saying Kingsbury goes. I think I like Kingsbury a lot. I do think there can be a little bit of an evolution into what they're asking Jaden to do. They started doing it with Mariota, granted different stages of careers and whatnot, but they were starting to do it a little bit better. I actually think that would have served Jaden a little bit better. Play action, boot game under center, run game, not being in the gun on every snap, more early throw reads. The thing about Jaden that's so impressive last year and then in his small sample size this year, he is incredibly accurate down the field. His downfield passing game, he is exceptional in those moments and exceptional. End of game, fourth quarter he last year, best passer rating in the fourth quarter, best completion percentage. I mean everything about end of game last year, he was unreal. Hence why they won so many close games. I still think I would take Jaden as of right now, but you could probably make an argument for me to at least consider flipping him and Bo Nicks. But I love Caleb. In Ben Johnson's system, it's not always going to be perfect. It's not always going to be in rhythm and timing, but that dude is uniquely talented.

[Tara Lawan]

Could you imagine when Caleb Williams actually has, like all his, you know, techniques and everything figured out and he's throwing above 60% completion percentage? Like, yeah, they're going to be incredible on offense. They'll be dangerous elusivity, able to move around, get out of danger. Like, I have. I have not seen a quarterback that able to get out of elusiveness, that elusive to get out of the pocket downfield. It's just. It's so Michael. So impressive. What's that?

[Greg Olsen]

I don't like chasing completion percentage. Huh? Personally, I don't like chasing.

[Tara Lawan]

I don't disagree with that. I don't disagree with that. I think it's. Completion percentage is one thing, but it's another thing when it's multiple games. Like, he's done it. He's done it nine times this season and they're 8 and 1. He was over 60% in this past game. And it's like, okay, if you're 8 and 1 when your quarterback's not that productive from getting the ball downfield and you just bump that. That number up a little bit, like, dude, it's going to be impressive. And it's just, to me, it's habits.

[Greg Olsen]

Yeah. I think there's like a, at some point, like a, Like a cross section between like average depth of targets.

[Will]

Yeah.

[Greg Olsen]

And completion percentage. Right. Because I can make an argument like there's guys that have been 75, 80% completion percentage, average depth of targets, like three yards.

[Will]

Correct. Yeah.

[Greg Olsen]

That doesn't do a whole lot for me. I just think in today's modern NFL, your margin for error is so small, you have to be incredible on third downs. Don't turn the ball over. Incredible in the red zone. Like, you just can't. You don't have anything. You can't make any mistakes because you just can't get any yards and chunks. But then I think there's also on the other side where your completion percentage is just so bad that regardless of how far short you're throwing it, it. Your efficiency is just so low you also can't overcome that. So I do think there's like this XY axis where they eventually like cross each other and you say, okay, that's the dream. Like, you are throwing it downfield. So we are getting that explosiveness, but there is some element of efficiency that we can count on. Playing and play out. We're not just like, hoping and prayer and, well, maybe it's going to work, but in between that, it's a disaster. You don't want that either.

[Will]

No, I. I agree. Not. I'm not as much in, like, the completion percentage over overall. Like, on pff, you can go into and see, like, inaccurate throws, like, outside of the frame, this, that, the other, which is always, like, fascinating to see all these little new details and wrinkles that they have in the whole database and analytics part of the game on pff. But I'm with you. I think completion rate is hard now if it's really good. And again, it's like Drake May. He'll have a completion rate. He's been throwing it around 70%. And his like, yards per attempt is like, what, over eight?

[Greg Olsen]

Yeah, yeah. He's unique. He's unique because he's doing both.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah.

[Greg Olsen]

Here's the last thing I'll say about Caleb. Not to beat a dead horse here, but his inaccuracies, sometimes throwing on the run, right. Those are high level, highly difficult throws. How many pass attempts. This would be a fun study. How many pass attempts has he gotten off that were deemed inaccurate, but they came after he avoided a sack. So he avoids a sack, runs around and. All right, he misses the guy. He misses DJ more in the back of the side, you know, the corner of the end zone, sideline that goes down as a pass attempt, incomplete pass off target onto the next down. Yeah, but what if he, instead of being over one with it with an inaccurate pass, he was zero for. Oh, because he got sacked, his completion percentage would be better. And he's doing that at such a high volume of snaps, his ability to escape pressure is incredible.

[Will]

Yeah, fair point.

[Greg Olsen]

So if he tipped more sacks and got less inaccurate throws off on the run, hypothetically, his completion percentage would go up. The offensive success would go down because he's taking sacks. And would that be better?

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, no, you're absolutely right. It's a good point. That's why you're on the show, Greg.

[Greg Olsen]

So there's. There's always a balance to all of this stuff, right? Like, yeah, I always say about turnovers, like, like the ideal turnover number is not zero. Right. I could take a knee and go for 65 knees in a row, and we didn't turn the ball over, we didn't take any sacks. So, like, there's a little bit of nuance. Again, I don't want a team whose goal is to get to commit zero turnovers. I don't want to fumble, but I don't want my quarterback to fear throwing interceptions.

[Will]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Tara Lawan]

You love yourself.

[Greg Olsen]

You're probably not going to be that very good. Now, I don't want to throw four, but I certainly don't want to throw. If the goal is to throw zero, that would scare me a little bit.

[Tara Lawan]

Yeah, yeah. Being too risk adverse. I know that. We got a. We got a boogie, correct.

[Will]

Yeah, we got a boogie.

[Greg Olsen]

Go, Greg.

[Tara Lawan]

I appreciate you, brother. We'll see you next week. We'll see you next week.

[Will]

Merry Christmas, my friend.

[Greg Olsen]

Merry Christmas, boys.

[Tara Lawan]

Merry Christmas. Merry Christmas. He didn't say. Well, they was coming back next week. He ain't come back next week. That's okay. That's okay. We'll need everybody next week. I'm gonna grab some nicotine.

[Will]

Yeah. And I need a pp. Okay, guys, thank you for tuning in.

[Tara Lawan]

Quick five minute. Oh, sorry.

[Will]

This one. Yeah, we can wear up this. The. Yeah, the NFL recap stuff. We can, we can, we can sign off on busting with the boys. Comes out tomorrow. Ty Simpson, the quarterback of Alabama, he joins the show. We also have the locker room with Josh Pate where we're talking all things college football. Thank you for tuning in. Big cucks, tiny kisses. Do not forget to make sure that you are subscribed to all channels and leave comments. Love you. Appreciate you.

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[Tara Lawan]

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[Greg Olsen]

Guaranteed Human.