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Call Her Creator with Katelyn Rhoades
Ep. 72: Stuck on Instagram? Here’s How to Pivot and Grow Again with Meg Harriman
00:40:56
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- [00:00]
A
Hello, guys. Welcome to an episode of Call Her Creator powered by Stan your all in one creator store. So today's guest, guys, is someone who not only teaches Instagram strategy, but she lives it across to thriving Instagram accounts. I had kind of talked to her about it this week, and she's like, I don't know, do you want to talk about that? And I'm like, yes, Meg. Like, that's hard to even handle, too. I'm trying to handle two accounts right now. So we'll talk about that. We're going to talk about, you know, Instagram growth strategies, all the above. But Meg, her. Her Instagram handle is social media with Meg. Meg Herman. She's a creator, a coach. She's grown to combine following over 200,000 followers by blending lifestyle content with smart, strategic social media education. And today, we're going to go behind the grid to talk about what it really looks like to grow as a creator in 2025. From her early days on Instagram to what's working right now, Meg is here to share the real strategies, mindset shifts, the behind the scenes of her growth, all the things. So are you ready?
- [01:04]
B
I'm ready. I'm excited to be here.
- [01:06]
A
Yay. Okay, cool. Let's start from the beginning. I always like to know the origin story. Like, how, like, were you working a 9 to 5? Did you leave the 9 to 5? Did you just start with social media? Tell us about Meg and her story.
- [01:19]
B
Yeah, you know, I came out of the womb once just doing social media. Yeah, that's how it feels. Yeah, it's true, being in this world for so long. But no, I did actually start as a nutritionist because that's actually my degree. I was a holistic nutritionist for four years right after I moved to Florida from Maine. I'm originally from a very small town in Maine and just one day decided, you know what? I'm done. I'm not going to get a job here. I don't love it. It's cold. And I just moved to Florida, found a job, and I loved it. I love science, I love nutrition. I love to geek out on that stuff. But the more I was in my own world down in Florida, like, away from my family, the more I kind of, like, introspective, learned about myself, and got into the world of just really trying to find who I am, what I really love, and I fell in love with fitness as well. So I actually decided to become a personal trainer and work with nutrition outside on my own, while I was still doing my Full time nutrition job. I was building kind of on the side, a like, side hustle, fitness, nutrition, online coaching. And this was really taking off because I was naturally building my first Instagram page just by documenting, like, just randomly sharing what my struggles were. Like, I really focus on struggles because. Because it was a big part of my past with like mental health and my own body, my own transformation. And it was really organic for me to be able to share about it, get that engagement, that interest, that community, and started to take on clients and grow that platform un, really unintentionally in the beginning. And then once I started to, I was like, whoa, why am I growing? Like, this is pretty cool and it's kind of fun. And I started to get questions from people while I was growing and I decided maybe I should learn why I'm growing. Then I started to study the marketing and become obsessed with that and understanding content creation and consumer behavior.
- [03:32]
A
Wow, that's really amazing. I. I was just listening to a podcast yesterday and she was talking about how she started growing her account too, by sharing she was going through a divorce and she was having a baby. Sharing those struggles on Instagram. And you just said you kind of were focused on those struggles. You think that like focusing on pain points over, you know, everyone wants to show up on Instagram looking polished and perfect and like this extravagant lifestyle, but I'm one too. That's like, no, it's not actually like that. Here's what's actually going on.
- [04:06]
B
Yeah, for sure. I think that, like, niches like ours, it's sometimes very difficult to do that because it's more of that, like, I don't know, less emotional than like fitness or divorce. And like, it's something where I feel like, yeah, we got to show those receipts. But I think it's so important for us to show the downsides and be able to openly talk about all of the struggles too, because that's, you know, it makes us human and shows that we're still learning too. Like everybody, we're learning together. It's just how, how we're learning and how fast we're learning.
- [04:41]
A
We're all new here. Okay, let's talk about your first account first. So you said you were just documenting. How many times a week were you actually posting and what kind of post were you sharing? And also take us to what year you started all of this.
- [04:55]
B
Okay. Yeah, years, they really get me.
- [04:58]
A
So I feel like no, because the algorithm has changed so much. So I want people to know, like, all this goes back in blah, Blah, blah.
- [05:05]
B
Totally. Yes, I totally agree. And I mean, that's actually why I decided to start a second account. We'll get into that. But is I probably started this in 2015, 16, really like going all in on it and finally like hit that 100k mark. Probably like 2017, 2018. Yeah. And I was posting almost every day, I would say every day. And it really wasn't like, oh, my God, I have to post in order to grow more. So like, I felt this like, desire to share more. Yes. I got that, like, high from people, you know, liking it, commenting and all the engagement and the growth and it was definitely addicting. But I felt like I just had so much to share and so many different ways I could connect with people and it was fun.
- [05:54]
A
That's amazing. So back in those days, there were no reels, there were no carousels. So you were just posting static images?
- [06:01]
B
Yeah, I mean, I think there was some carousels near the end there where I was like doing multiple images. But it wasn't like, it really wasn't the informational graphics that we see these days too. Yeah.
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A
Okay, so it was like photo dumps.
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B
Yeah, photo ds. A lot of like the thing that I think really helped me take off in like my own voice, my own brand was showing like the reality versus Instagram. Um. Cause I actually did end up going on and competing in bodybuilding. So I, I had that, you know, body that people aspired to. But I really wanted to show people that, like, we all have our days and it's all about angles and it's all about reality of what's going on and the mental side of it as well.
- [06:42]
A
Yes. Okay, so was there a moment when you were doing that where you're like, I know you had said people started asking you questions, like, were you getting questions from strangers in the dms or was it friends and family that were like, how'd you grow your account? Like, how did that even happen?
- [06:56]
B
It was a lot of strangers. It was a lot of people, like my past clients for fitness, like, they wanted to go on and do fitness coaching or nutrition stuff or, you know, grow their brand for whatever it might be. I'd say my friends and family, like, my family really didn't understand it at all. They still don't understand it. So yeah, my friends, a lot of them were kind of trying to do the same thing or just here and there. Maybe they like talked about it, but never really talked about it to me.
- [07:30]
A
Yes, I get you. It's like holidays. My father in law, bless Him. He's still like, so what? So how do you make money doing this? Explain. Like, we need this, this, and this, which we'll get into monetizing in a little bit. But I really just. There's so many people out there that are like, I want to grow my account. How did she do that? So, like, how did you start growing? Like, I know you said with a fitness account that you just started documenting your time, but when it came time where you're like, okay, wait, I could teach people about this. So now you're thinking about starting your Instagram coaching strategy social media account. What? How did you start growing that account? So you had to start from zero. You had just backstory. She had grown 100,000 followers on her personal journey, but now she says, okay, I want to go full time with this and actually maybe make money doing this. So tell us how that went.
- [08:20]
B
Yeah, um, well, I. Like, I said, I was getting questions and everything, and I. It was kind of hard for me to confidently tell people, like, I know all the strategies when what I grew it from is really like a clickable niche, right? Like, people like to see fitness. And obviously, if I was in fitness and bodybuilding, I was in, you know, little clothing sometimes. So I didn't want that to be like, oh, easy, cop out. Yeah, she just got it because of that. So I studied the science behind it and that consumer behavior and the psychology, and really looked at my posts to see, okay, this one doesn't even show that much skin. Like, why would it do so well? And it was like, the conversations that were happening and the pain points I was hitting and the way I was talking, whatever, you know, all the research that goes into it. So I just really dove deep into that and said, you know what? I'm going to prove to myself and to everyone else that I actually know how to do this in today's world. Right? Because this was like, five years after I started that one. And I was like, I'm going to start a new account. It was so scary, you know, starting an account to teach people how to grow with zero followers.
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A
Oh, my God, yes.
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B
Yeah. I'm like, I can teach you how to grow. And they come to my account. They're like, you have 200 followers. I'm like, yeah, I know, but I promise I can. So I decided to just go all in. And I mean, to be honest, when I first started, I was posting at least six times a week and four to five days a week. That was like twice a day. And that was either a Carousel or an infographic. And I was all in for probably about six or seven months.
- [10:05]
A
Okay, so you were posting a lot. Do you are. When you work with students now and they're starting from zero, is that something that you teach them? Like, hey, start posting a lot, or are you one of those that's like, oh, be very intentional, only post a few times?
- [10:20]
B
It really depends on their niche, their availability, and their goals. But I do believe, like, yes, the most that you can show up without burning out and without compromising the value you're actually giving, the better. I mean, it's just actually a numbers game. If you have your ducks in a row when it comes to the quality and the value you're giving you, that's all good. Then. Yeah, the more you show up, the better. So I don't ever give people a schedule like that. Like, that was insane. But I will tell people to, you know, when you're really starting, you want to go all in to show up six times a week. And to create that content, I tell.
- [11:00]
A
People, when you're just getting started, like, you have to want it and maybe do like a 90 days, like, I'm going all in. And really give it all you got. Because if you're going to just try it for two weeks and then tell me that nothing worked, I'm gonna laugh in your face. Yeah, so much longer than that. I know for my own account, I was still working my 9 to 5, but I had just had my second baby, and it was kind of just like, do it on the side to build my credibility, because I always knew I wanted to work in the space and be like an industry leader. But of course, you know, I had my safe 9 to 5 job, so I wasn't ever like, okay, I'm gonna go all in on this. I kind of was doing it on the side, but had I got. Had I gone all in and really posted more, I think I would have grown a little bit faster. Took me a little while. Like, there's people now that are like zero to a hundred thousand followers in six months. And I'm like, holy crap. It took me two years, you know, to get there.
- [11:54]
B
Yeah, for sure.
- [11:55]
A
But I definitely. I definitely think strategizing and giving yourself a schedule is something that will be helpful to at least take you down that path.
- [12:05]
B
Oh, 100. And what you're saying about, you know, people growing at such a fast rate these days, I personally don't agree with people when they say that it's so much harder to grow these days. I think it depends. I think we have to kind of look at back then when we were growing. You know, we didn't have as many tools, resources. We didn't have as much market research that we could utilize to really study and. And give that real attention to. To be able to go all in with it. It was a little harder, but I guess it's harder now with the amount of people. It's how you look at it.
- [12:41]
A
But, yeah, I do think it's definitely getting saturated, so it's harder to stand out. But I also feel like these smaller accounts that are just getting started, I feel like the algorithm is trying to help them. And I'm like, where was my help when I was first getting started?
- [12:57]
B
I know. And I feel like they're not helping me. I'm like, okay, I've worked so hard. I' here every day. But okay, it's fine. Instagram, it's fine.
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A
Literally. If you think about how many times we've posted since we started, it's insane. When you started your social media account, were reels out by then?
- [13:15]
B
No, no, they. I think it was. I think I started it at, like, in 2020 or it was like, close to.
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A
Yeah, that was the prime time to honestly get on social media. I was pregnant with my second child in 2020, and I'm so. So I'm not mad, but I wish I. I wish I would have been more comfortable in my skin, not. Not pregnant because I left my baby, but I wish I would've been more comfortable and just said, screw it, I'm gonna show up anyways. Because I think 2020 was a time too, to start TikTok, and, oh, yeah, you know, the things that we do now on Instagram. I could have easily done that on TikTok, but I wasn't confident enough to show up. Do you have some advice for people that are just like, I want to do this, but I just. I'm so scared. Or they're scared of other people, what they're gonna think, like, how do you.
- [14:04]
B
I mean, it depends on why they're scared, right? Like, if they're scared about their people, then their family or friends, or if they're scared about, like, co workers, or if they're just fearful of themselves, like, being embarrassed internally or what maybe Billies would say. I don't know. It really does depend. But at the end of the day, it's easier said than done. But you have to understand that, like, you're the person who closes your eyes at night. You're the last person to like, talk to yourself. You're the last person, um, to really make yourself either feel proud or upset with how you perform that day, what you did that day. And that's the most important thing. It's not, like I said, it's easier said than done, but you have to, I guess, feel the pain of not going after that dream so deeply in order to overcome it. If, if you're still letting that fear hold you back, maybe you just haven't hit that breaking point. I don't know.
- [14:54]
A
Yes, I agree with you on that because I. I was at my breaking point with, with my second kid because I just wanted more time and freedom with them. So that's where I was kind of like, okay, you're starting attraction here. Let's go all in. And then that's when I went all in. But reels were also out, too, which I think really helped my account grow as well. I know the answer to this, but I'm going to ask it anyways. Have you ever hit a plateau and how did you start growing again?
- [15:19]
B
Yes, it's actually funny. I think I'm like, just now starting to get out of this plateau that's been like a year and a half long. It's been. Been rough. And like I said, it's hard in our industry. I feel for us to really come out here and say the struggles because, right, we're the experts, we teach people how to grow, whatever. But I think I actually lost almost 4,000 followers over the last two years and, like, net growth. Right. So it's been really hard. And going and seeing, like, all my screenshots of my old analytics, and then now looking at it, I'm like, oh, my gosh, this is just. It's frustrating. It really is. And you can understand. Sometimes it's really frustrating because I can understand how I can help someone else create the content that's going to help them take off, because it's like that outside perspective, and I can really dig deep into their market research. But sometimes we're just so far into our own head and we just get in that rut. It's difficult. So I'm on the up and up here, and I would say that the biggest thing that's helping me get out of this is, well, two things. One, testing out different styles of content that I enjoy creating. So, like, I've been doing some of the simple reels still, but when I'm doing, like, collaborations or I'm doing a really impactful message behind a reel, I'm trying to do more Storytelling more cinematic stuff. More, more stuff that makes creating fun and allowing me to learn and not just be like I just threw it together and obviously it didn't do that great. And then the second point would be trial reels really has been helping me a lot.
- [17:03]
A
Okay. Which I want to talk about too before I talk, before we talk about trial reels though. I personally have noticed your change in your content. I feel like you've really leveled up. Like how did you learn how to do all those editing? Is it self taught? Are you using tools?
- [17:19]
B
I. Yeah, I just, I spend way too much time testing it out and playing around. There's been like, thank you. There's been weeks where like I'll be working on, you know, especially for collaborations because I just really want to it really show them that I care about it. And you know, I only work with those brands that I do care for so I want to give them my best. And I see a lot of other people they work with that have such great quality content. I'm like, well I want to, you know, have that level too obviously my own way. So it's been self taught. I've been in there playing around sometimes like YouTube, Google things really helps out. But I guess I kind of have an intuitive feel for how to use certain editing apps. It's just fun for me. I'll play around with it until I figure it out.
- [18:07]
A
What editing apps are you using?
- [18:10]
B
Home. So I use Cap Cut. I'd say probably like 90% mostly on desktop but sometimes on my mobile too.
- [18:18]
A
I still isn't that wild.
- [18:21]
B
Oh well, hey, I mean if you don't need it because you're crushing it.
- [18:24]
A
Like I feel like I could elevate my content if I just downloaded it and I just don't want another app on my phone so I just need to do it. But I. If you guys go to her Instagram, what is it at social media with Meg, if you scroll down you will see like I've noticed a lot more talking head videos too that you're doing versus just the trending audio.
- [18:45]
B
Mm. Yeah. And I mean it's. I really do love trending audio. It's fun. And actually today when I was, you know, shower thoughts that always come to you when you're in the shower, I was like I miss doing transition reels. Like those I think really took my account. So I was like I'm going to start doing them again. I don't care like whether or not they're the thing to do anymore. Like they're fun so I'm going to start doing more transition reels and just trying to bring more fun into creation again versus getting stuck in that comparison trap.
- [19:17]
A
Yeah. And just doing what everyone else is doing. Your reels are definitely standing out from everybody else because you're being different. They're longer than they used to be. You're talking head, you've got the mic in your hand, which I think kind of draws my eyes too. And then the text overlay that you're using is different. That's from Cap Cut, you said.
- [19:38]
B
Yeah, most of it is. I mean there are times like I'm trying to use edits, I really am. But I, it's. It is natural for me to go to Kafka and usually I'll start with edits thinking, oh, I should be able to do this. And then I'm like, literally there's no tool that would do this. So I kind of go back and forth shoot.
- [19:55]
A
Then I really need to do it because I'm using edits and I feel like edits is the most simple and if I really want to be the expert in video, I need to just do it.
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B
Do it.
- [20:06]
A
Talk to us about trial reels because I agree with you. I'm going to put my little two cents in here. I'm using. I don't have trial reels on my main account, which really ticks me off. Oh, I know, I'm so mad. But I do have it on. Call her creator and I feel like it's definitely helping me grow over there. I've had a lot of trial reels going off and I'm reposting the same video every time and just changing the audio. So talk to us about trial reels.
- [20:29]
B
That's awesome. I, I'm doing that a lot too. In fact, I'm not posting any brand new content ideas. I know that's like the intention behind the creation of it was really to allow us to test things out. But yeah, I really, I'm not. I'm doing things that are proven. Even if like you said, I'm in kind of a plateau right now and I'm, you know, trying to crawl myself out of there. But even the ones that aren't reaching 10, 000 views, 30, 000 views, a million views, whatever. Even if they're just 5,000 views compared to my like 1,000, I'm still posting those.
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A
Yes.
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B
Things that have proved to work. I'm doing it. I'm just reach like changing out the audio or maybe I'm even changing the video. But it's the same text on screen and, like, cadence of it popping up.
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A
Okay, that's what I'm doing too. How many trial reels a week are you doing?
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B
You know, actually talking about this, I haven't done it this week. I guess I just, like, had a blank. But before that, I was doing probably three days a week, two to three. Okay.
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A
That's kind of what I'm doing too. I know you shared a trick for trial reels on your page today. Talk us. Talk us through that.
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B
Well, now the edits is out. And if you are using edits, it's even easier to do this. But if you are just creating an Instagram before you go in to actually post your reel, like your normal reel, not a trial reel, just go in and hit those little three dots in the library section of where all your reels are, like your drafts, it will duplicate your reel, and then you can post one normally and post one as a trial. And it just helps save time because I'm not going to lie, even though I'm using content I've really already created, it does take some time to post the trial reel. If you have to rewrite the text and the timing.
- [22:17]
A
It does to. To be honest, I'm doing it lazy way. I literally downloaded the original reel to my library and my phone, my camera roll, and I just keep uploading the same one.
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B
See, that's good to know because I've been thinking about it, but I'm like, I don't. Does it not know? Like, does it know if I've actually written the text or not?
- [22:32]
A
I. I feel that way too, but I've been doing it the most lazy way ever, Megan. And I've also done it the way that you're saying too, where I'll do a new video with the same text and those perform okay. But the one that keeps going off for me, it's at like 400,000 views right now. And then the. The ones after them, I've got like a 12,000, 30,000. Like, they're all up there. They have the same exact video. Did you see that girl share something? I think it was Eve. She shared something about if you don't have the trials feature, you can go on instagram.com or something. Have you seen that?
- [23:09]
B
I actually did see somebody say, if you don't. And then I was like, I already do. So I scrolled by it. So maybe it's that.
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A
Okay, listen to this, guys. Actually, I want to share this because it's super duper helpful. Let Me. Okay. It's Eve Longfield. Okay. She said it's a trial reels workaround. So you get this link that takes you, I guess, to instagram.com probably/trial reels or something, and you click it from there. You click it from the website. And then for some reason, I was trying to find. There. I was trying to find her post, but I can't find it for some reason. It's a workaround, and it lets you try trial reels even if you don't have it on your account. So I was gonna test it today on my main account.
- [23:54]
B
Yeah.
- [23:54]
A
Because so many people are growing from trial reels.
- [23:58]
B
They are. I am starting to see people kind of abuse it. And it's like, you know, they're doing what I'm doing, what you said you're doing, which is great. Like, I was telling people to do that. But now I'm seeing, like, so many of the same creator. I'm like, if I see you one more time, and my Explore page, like, I'm not. I'm trying to not click on your stuff.
- [24:17]
A
Yes. Wow. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I've seen that too. And I've seen where they'll use the same exact audio, too. They'll be on the audio several times.
- [24:25]
B
You know what is kind of tricky about trial reels, though? This happened to me, actually, with this creator. I saw it pop up on my Explore page. It was first time I was ever, like, introduced to this person. And it was my exact words, my exact everything, my audio almost the same, like, shot. And so I messaged this person, was like, hey, I appreciate it, blah, blah, blah. You know, however I handle people who steal your work and say, if you could just add, you know, the what's credit or please remove it. And it's hard with trial reels, though, because you then go to their page and you, like, want to prove it and you're like, I can't. It's not there. Anyways, she was very kind. She added credit, but you never know if people are doing that if it doesn't get shown up on your feed.
- [25:14]
A
Oh, I hate that. I really know there's so many people out there that will just swipe your content and it's happening more and more. If that does happen, you guys, you can report that content. What's it called when you report it?
- [25:27]
B
There is a support. I don't remember.
- [25:31]
A
It's called copyright infringement.
- [25:34]
B
Oh, okay. Yes, Word.
- [25:35]
A
Yeah. But you can report it to Instagram sometimes they'll take it down. But, I mean, Sometimes it's hard, but yeah. Yeah. Okay. So, I mean, talking about trial reels, what do you feel like is working best for growth right now on Instagram? Like, if you had to give us real style or content themes or hooks or posting frequency, what's working?
- [25:54]
B
Like, do you think that it's kind of that next level? Whereas, like, what was working last year, year before was that short, kind of faceless style. You didn't really. It was more B roll. It was just text on screen, long captions, very short. I think now people are really enjoying more storytelling, more like, behind the scenes, more raw. More like it's. It's more edited, but it looks less edited, if that makes sense.
- [26:23]
A
Yes, yes, yes. No.
- [26:25]
B
For our.
- [26:26]
A
For our social media agency. I told the girls we had a meeting this morning, and I was like, we gotta stop looking over edited. Like, Instagram is moving to more authentic. Like, we even used to do a lot of reels covers for clients. And I'm like, stop doing them because I think that unpolished look.
- [26:43]
B
Yeah, I know. I'm always, like, back and forth about reels covers, because I know, like, it's a struggle when I think about how what I like, I love to go to a person's page and see. See, like a real cover that has the title. I know what I'm going to be clicking on.
- [26:57]
A
Yes.
- [26:58]
B
And it's aesthetic. I like to see that. And there are those accounts. I see that do that and do great. And then there's accounts that I see, like Shannon McKinstry, like, she slays and she never does anything specific with her aesthetics. And I'm like, it's wonderful. I want that freedom to do that. But then I look at my account, I'm like, I want to cover.
- [27:17]
A
No, I'm the same. Shannon does really good at talking heads, too. I think that kind of catapulted her growth.
- [27:23]
B
Yeah, yeah. Talking heads are doing great. The thing that's hard for myself included is being able to condense that talking head so that you can really hit the point with a clear message while keeping it brief enough. Yep, yep.
- [27:37]
A
No, my talking heads that do perform the best are really short. And then I'm actually not even giving as much value. I'm more. So like, comment this word and I'll send it to you, which I hate doing that. They're performing better. So it's. It's just the wild west out there.
- [27:52]
B
It is. It is. Which is, you know, fun and frustrating.
- [27:56]
A
That's it. Fun and FNF content or organize it like each week or do you.
- [28:03]
B
How do I plan and organize? That was.
- [28:05]
A
Yeah. Your content strategy. Weekly, monthly, daily.
- [28:09]
B
I go through phases of like, okay. Especially when I was doing more of my own products and coaching, I did plan more strategically, really hitting the pain points and showing people, you know, the why they're struggling and connecting to then be able to show them how they can overcome it. But right now I'm really playing on playing the field. Just whatever I want to post today, I have like a content bank of ideas and I'll go to that when I need it. But really I just love to create on spot and that's kind of how I started too. I didn't really plan in the beginning. I was just like, this is fun, I want to do it. And I, I'd like to spend time creating. I know a lot of people don't.
- [28:51]
A
But I do, I do too. I was, I had my assistant helping me. I was, I post twice a day and I was doing the off cuff once a week and then she was doing the second post for me. So it was nice to have some of it scheduled. But I was like, I want to get this back over again. I love creating content, but I will say taking it back over has been a lot more work on me. So I would say, I would suggest, you know, having help in, in strategizing it and planning it ahead. But if you're like me and Meg, you might just want to post day of and that's okay too. And I really feel like those perform good too.
- [29:28]
B
I know. Yeah, I do too. It's hit or miss as always, but it is always that one that you're like, I don't know, just post it and it does well. But like you were saying, it depends on who you are, like what you enjoy, how you thrive. And if I was going all in on a new page and especially if I'm telling other people who are so busy and you know, this isn't their full time thing like planning and scheduling and really going all in and batching certain things is so important. I, even though I don't batch now, all of my content, I do still batch like tasks. So I do still like do all of my market research. I do film batch some if it's more like B roll, not really talking reels. But I mean, yeah, batching is so.
- [30:15]
A
Important for the newbies that are listening. When you say market research, what are you, what are you doing for that?
- [30:22]
B
So personally, I do a lot of my market research which is just really, you know, Looking into what's working well for social media specifically here we're talking about Instagram. I scroll, I look at the explore page on my page. Like my business page, my personal page, even my husband's page. Like, I'll like look at his explore page because he sees different content. So I like to see, you know, okay, he's seen things about said topic versus what I'm seeing. But it's really the same psychology behind it that still performed well because of the same reasoning. So I like to just look at the explore page, see what's taking off search on Instagram. Like Instagram search has become so great. I love it lately. So I do lots of searches around keywords and then see the top performing posts I have. Again, I'm not very like, I don't love organization. I really don't. I always love the idea of it. Like my ADHD is like, this is gonna be so great. And then I get don't follow through. But I have plenty of files and different apps and stuff where I have started. Lists of common hooks to use, you know, ones that are doing really well or visual hooks that are doing really well, styles of reels that are doing really well, topics that are doing really well. And I have all of the them categorized on like why it captures attention. To be able to then go in and recreate my own based off of that. So just really studying what is popping off right now and also studying what captures your own attention, even if it's not doing incredible. And if you stop for something, why did you stop? And kind of just being more observant of your behavior.
- [32:08]
A
Love that you mentioned visual hooks. What are you talking about when you say that?
- [32:12]
B
So when you first start the reel, that first one, I wouldn't even say it would just be like one to three seconds. I'd say it's like one to two seconds max now. But it's that first thing that grabs attention. So walking into the frame, doing something on camera, maybe like picking the phone up and putting it towards you, like jumping in and excited. It's just that visual what you see in the first second.
- [32:36]
A
Yeah, I love that. I love. I've been trying to work on my visual hooks. Sometimes they're, sometimes they're crazy and I like, I tend to use my fingers in my hand. I don't know why, but you're a girl. There's so many easy visual hooks like put on your lipstick or mascara or like drink your Stanley. Like there's nobody easy and those are going to visually hook Someone into your reel in those first one to two seconds is like Megan said. I know they say one to three, but I agree with her. It's more like one to two these days.
- [33:07]
B
Yeah, it's getting shorter and shorter.
- [33:10]
A
All right, as we're kind of, you know, coming to a close, I got a couple more questions for you. What's one overlooked Instagram tip that you feel more creators need to hear?
- [33:23]
B
Oh, boy. I. I should know this off the cusp because I'm kind of doing a little series right now of underrated Instagram tips. But I guess it will go back to. And I say all the time is to create more than you consume. And so even if you're not going to post something, just get on your phone or your computer and start to get familiar with different creation styles and looks and feels and edits and just get comfortable creating. Creating. Allow yourself free time away from, you know, required creation. Right. Don't just create because you have to post. And even if you're not a creative person, I know that sounds like, okay, this is. I don't like to create. Right. Why would I do that? It's so important because it's going to spark more ideas and it's going to allow you to start to love the process and also help you so you can create your own voice, your own style, and not be copying other people.
- [34:24]
A
I love that there's people that I follow, like, all of us in the industry. I've kind of muted a few people just because I don't want to do what they're doing anymore. So that's a suggestion, too. You don't have to unfollow these people, but you could always mute them. But then I'm like, oh, crap. I haven't engaged with their content in a while. They probably think I hate them, which, you know, people don't. I don't think people really care about that, but I need to go back and do that. But that's a tip, too. If you're. If you see things and you tend to, like, copy everything you see, mute those out and focus on yourself. Create more than you consume. I love that. If someone's listening right now, Meg, and they're just starting, what would you tell them to focus on first? Which kind of. I mean, what you just said would probably be the first thing is to just start doing it. But maybe. Maybe they've started creating, then what?
- [35:13]
B
Okay, so I think the unsexy thing that no one actually enjoys doing is the clarity work. I still, to this day, I Hate doing it so much. I always like lie to myself. I'm like, no, I know my target audience perfectly or no, I know what's working and like, I just don't want to do that work. But taking the time to actually sit down and you know, journal out or use ChatGPT to get prompts and questions starting to really shape the message that you are giving to people in your content on your page so that it really lands with them. So getting so clear on their specific pain points today, right? Because what their pain points were even in the same niche, you know, 10 years ago would be different. You know, it's now views on reels before it was likes on your post. Right. It's, it's very different because we evolve and society evolves. So the clarity work is always going to be important. So I would always suggest to whether you know, matters how established you are, but quarterly or monthly to really sit down and make sure that you are still really clear on your target audience and the pain points, the desires of them.
- [36:27]
A
Love that. That is so true. And that's something I need to work on too. Now, what about someone who is growing but they feel kind of stuck? Would you tell them to kind of do what? I mean, you can kind of give what you did. You felt like you were stuck. So you what, you started trying new formats, new ideas, right?
- [36:44]
B
Yeah, definitely. So trying out new ideas. And I think a lot of people say that and they're like, okay, cool. But like I liked doing X or whatever. You gotta try new ideas and also start to reframe. So something that's really helped me is, you know, back two years ago, I was getting 500,000 views, a million views, like at least once a week. I was going viral a lot. And so now when I get a post that hits like 8,000. Yeah, it's, it's like, what the heck? My ego is so bruised. So what's really helped me is to instead of compare today to two years ago is compare today to yesterday's. Yesterday's the day before. You know, it's a different scale that we have to look at. So if you're feeling stuck or you're kind of going backwards or you're in a rut, just look at that one piece of content today. What can you do better tomorrow? What's one thing and what was better than the one you did before?
- [37:40]
A
Oh my God, I love that. I'm going to, I need, I need to use that advice. I love that, I love that last question. If you could go back and give your early creator self one piece of advice. What would that be?
- [37:53]
B
Oh my goodness, what a good one.
- [37:57]
A
Think about little Meg.
- [38:01]
B
That I would say that the real connections you make, like in the DMS and through comments even are going to be so much more important than that number you see next to your name. The following. And I get it, everyone says that. But being someone who has grown two accounts over a hundred thousand and losing followers too, right? Like my personal account since I stopped showing up there, I was at like 120,000. Now I'm at 75 or something. 72,000. Like it's, it's, it sucks. It hurts, right? My ego still is like oh my gosh, another thousand gone. What? But really understanding it's about that one on one connection in the dm. It's about the connection you have in the comment section and knowing that your message is helping somebody regardless of if they are in there telling you you are actually connecting with people.
- [39:00]
A
You're helping people. Love that. How can people connect with you, Meg?
- [39:06]
B
Yeah, come on over. Hang out social media with Meg on Instagram threads. I'm trying to get on my threads game. You slay your threads game. Like how are you there so much?
- [39:16]
A
I have help, Darby. She basically takes my Instagram and turns them into threads. So little your Instagram stuff and say hey, go to chat GPT. Hey, turn these into threads. She kills it. I don't even know what's this is bad. I don't know half the time what's being posted there. Until one they go off and they're really good or sometimes they'll go off and they're bad and I'm like, oh my God. So I've got to get better. But it's hard to be in all these places.
- [39:42]
B
It really is. I've been, yeah, loving your threads lately and just thinking you're crush, crushing it. So yeah, Darby, good job. But I mean it all comes from you and your great work that you originally made. So give yourself that credit. But it definitely, yeah, connect with me there threads. I am getting back to YouTube. I've been doing my live show there with my co host Hesson called the Social Roundtable. We do that every Monday, so YouTube lives. But I am actually going to be coming back with other content and a little sneak peek. I haven't told anyone this, but why not now? I will be coming out with my podcast in the next month called Happy Creating and that will also be anywhere that you can hear any podcast and YouTube.
- [40:28]
A
Oh, I love the name thanks. That was the hardest part for me was coming up with my podcast name, and it's so fun. It's so much work, but it's so rewarding, and we get to have conversations like this. So I'm excited for you.
- [40:42]
B
Thank you. I'm going to have to have you on mine.
- [40:44]
A
Yes. I would love that. I would love that. That'd be fun. Awesome.
- [40:47]
B
Yay.
- [40:48]
A
Thank you so much for coming on today, guys.
- [40:51]
B
Thank you.
- [40:51]
A
Social media with Meg. She's the best. Thank you for listening, and we will see you next time.