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Call Her Creator with Katelyn Rhoades
Ep 81: 6-Figure Brand Deals, Media Kits & Perpetuity —What Creators Need to Know with Sarah Boyd of The Digital Dept.
00:42:43
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- [00:00]
A
Hey friend. Welcome back to Call Her Creator. Powered by your all in One Creator Store, Stan Stan is the easiest way for you to make money online. All of your courses, digital products and bookings are hosted within your link in Bio. If you're ready to start your free trial, visit my show notes and click my affiliate link to get started today. Welcome back to Call Her Creator, the podcast that helps you turn your content into cash and build a business doing what you love. Today's guest is someone who lives and breathes the influencer industry, Sarah Boyd. Sarah is the co CEO and CRO of the Digital Department, a leading full service influencer marketing and talent management firm providing brand strategy and creator representation. In 2016 with the Rise of influencer marketing, Sarah started managing some of the most sought after celebrity influencers. Her current and past client roster includes Alessandra Ambrosio, Jamie Chung, Olivia Culpo, Julianne Hoff, Lauren Bushnell Lane, Jana Kramer. The list goes on. Guys, she is incredible. Sarah and her team have helped shape what brand partnerships should look like in 2025 and today she's here to pull back that curtain just a little bit and give us a peek into what goes on in the creator economy. Sarah, welcome to Call Her Creator.
- [01:26]
B
Thank you so much for having me excited to be here.
- [01:29]
A
Yay. Me too. Me too. Okay, so I was telling Sarah before we pressed record, I was already stalking all of her socials and finding out what all she does. So before we dive into everything, I always like to find out like your back end story like before you started this incredible business, where were you at to begin with?
- [01:48]
B
Yeah, I actually started before social media. I went to college in Philadelphia and graduated in 2004 and moved to Los Angeles. It was my dream forever to move to la. So I moved there right after I graduated and I worked in fashion pr. So my day to day was really just representing a lot of fashion brands that wanted to get in magazines on celebrities. So a lot of working with stylists. There were no influencers back then, there was no social media. So the influencers are really celebrities, the magazine editors and working with them on a day to day basis and really just building my network in LA for those first nine years. And then I started my own business called Simply which was a fashion and beauty conference and I call myself the DOT Connector. I love connecting people, kind of being the behind the scenes person to bring people together. So that was really the mission for Simply my conference and it was kind of the first of its kind. It was a great way to bring People together and connect people. Like, I had a sister that got me in the industry, and a lot of people I met didn't have that connection or handshake that they needed to get their start. So I started it very bootstraps with like a few thousand dollars to my name. And it, you know, the first one was really a success. And we had, you know, we ended up growing it to host it in Dubai, Louisiana. New York, Chicago, all over. We'd had tens of thousands of people attend this conference. Incredible brands, incredible speakers, and it was just my dream and actually made it come true. So I built that. And as I was building it, I started understanding that the digital landscape was really booming. And a lot of my connections were these celebrity creators. And, well, they weren't creators at the time, they were just celebrities. And they started seeing, you know, how lucrative this business could be. And I really started with some of the names you mentioned, helping them with a blog and helping them monetize their blog, which then led into, you know, Instagram campaigns and things like that. So I was really, you know, figuring it out along the way because it was also new. And as I was simultaneously growing simply, I was growing my roster of celebrity clients. And then about five years into building Simply, I had a baby and realized I don't think I can work 247 and literally not have a second off or take a vacation. I was kind of losing my mind. So I was on one of my many walks with my daughter, who was a few months old at the time, and decided I wanted to sell my business. And I, a few months later, after just sending some cold emails and again figuring it out along the way, ended up selling my business five years after I launched it and sold to a company called Socialite, which was one of the premier influencer marketing and talent management agencies. And, yeah, I stayed on, obviously, and ended up becoming the president of Socialite a few years later. Socialite then got acquired by a company called Dolphin Entertainment, which is a publicly traded company on nasdaq. And another company that was also under Dolphin was called B Social. And I've known the owner of B Social Alley for many years being in this industry. And we came together since we were doing essentially the same thing under one roof, and became the digital department two years ago.
- [05:40]
A
Wow, I love. Okay, there's so many things to unpack here. I love everything about one you talked about. You had your sister help you get into the industry, but you wanted to help those other people that didn't have a hand. I love that because like, me building my own business. Like, I started from the ground up, didn't have any. It's not a handout or anything, but the connections, so it's always nice to help someone with that. So you being the connect the dot girl, I love that for you. Did you guys with the digital department, how'd you come up with the name? How'd you decide? Like, oh, we need to. We need to be stronger together. Like, what even made you guys come together like that?
- [06:19]
B
You know what I mean? We hired a fantastic branding agency and it was many months of, how about this name? How about that name? Oh, I love this name. Shoot, it's taken. We don't have the rights to use this one. So it was a lot of trial and error to figure out a, what name was available, and B, you know, what looked good and all of those things. So finally we landed on the digital department. We call ourselves TDD and we love it. And fun fact, it was right before Taylor Swift came out with her logo for the. What is it? The poets.
- [06:57]
A
Yes. Poet department. Yes, yes.
- [07:02]
B
Very similar logo. I'm like, oh, my gosh. Did Taylor Swift copy us?
- [07:06]
A
Oh, my gosh. Did she get inspo from you guys? Very. I don't know. Love that. You need to ask her if she needs some help with her brand partnership.
- [07:15]
B
Yeah, I know. Yeah.
- [07:17]
A
That's awesome. That is so incredible. I love that. That's something too. For all of my listeners out there, you know, we have a mix of people that are just getting started in the creator economy, and then there's people that are, you know, like me, who've been doing it for a while and they've got a steady income. What you need to know is Sarah just said they went through a lot of trial and error to even come up with their name. So everyone thinks that you just all of a sudden snap your fingers and you have this business, but you don't. It takes years, which you start. You, You. You went after something that you are passionate about, and then you learned a way to make money from doing it. And I love that. And I think that's what. That's what most of us creators do. So. All right, let's kind of talk about the creator economy. What do you think is happening right now with influencers and creators? Like, what's the current landscape of influencer marketing right now in 2025?
- [08:14]
B
Yeah, I mean, the landscape is definitely extremely saturated. Right when I started, there was maybe a couple management companies, a handful. A handful of influencers in la, where I was and now honestly, everyone is an influencer in some way. I think also brand budgets have, you know, quadrupled or even more since, since the beginning and they've shifted in a lot of ways and you know, the industry has grown tremendously. But what we're seeing in, you know, this current moment of influencer marketing is, you know, I would say it's kind of the rise of the mid tier creator and the rise of the niche creator. So a lot of the creators that we're seeing consistently be booked are in that hundred to five hundred thousand follower range on Instagram, specifically the macro creators. You really have to prove conversion and you have to prove the worth behind, you know, the pay. It's the days are no longer of just throwing rates out with no support and data behind it. So that's why we're seeing a lot of the mid tier get booked really consistently and even more micro creators because, you know, if you think about it from a brand perspective, they could book 20 to 50 creators at the same rate. They could book either a big celebrity or someone with a macro level following and price tag. So that's what we're seeing currently. We're seeing a lot of new brands enter the space, emerging brands and obviously the big players are still very heavily invested in influencer marketing.
- [10:03]
A
When the creators come, the influencers and creators, are you guys looking for them to like, at that first time when you're speaking to them or just seeing their name on your email or whatever, are they coming to you with like, hey, I'd like to work with you, here's what I've done. Are they showing their worth there or are you starting a conversation first? Like how does that even get, how do you guys work with that?
- [10:27]
B
Yeah, we, we have a pretty robust vetting process. Before we sign someone, we want to make sure that we can be successful for them. You know, it's, it's a two way street. We're a team, we put a lot of time and energy into all of our talent. So we look for engagement rate, we look for how many brands are reaching out to them on a weekly and monthly basis. That's really telling. If no brands are reaching out, it's going to be hard if we're cold pitching and to get that feedback back as well. Having, you know, a good amount of warm leads really helps. And then we look at, yeah, their last year, you know, brand partnerships, the year to date partnerships, you know, what's their content look like? You know, we can help with strategy. We have that in house. We can Also do their affiliate and help with a lot of things. But if they're not someone that loves social media and wants to commit to this as a full time job, it's really hard for us. You know, when we're sending their content to a brand and they're like, well, they haven't posted consistently or they haven't posted in weeks in their feed. How are we going to, you know, work together if they, if they're not consistent? So we look for a lot of things. Consistency, engagement, rate, you know, what their brand partners are, what their content looks like, what platforms are they on? Are they diversified? Do they have a newsletter? Do they have a substack? Do they have, you know, a podcast? Do they have any, any other things happening in their life that could, you know, help us help them? Are they pregnant? Are they getting married? Are they, you know, any big life moments? Where do they live? We look for a high us following a lot of our clients are, you know, brands looking to activate in the US So those are just, I would say some of the major things that we look for when we're signing someone here.
- [12:21]
A
I love that. Are brands still prioritizing TikTok and Instagram? Are you seeing like a shift toward newer platforms?
- [12:28]
B
Yeah, I would say predominantly our, at the digital department. A lot of our campaigns are Instagram and TikTok. There's some agencies that focus more on YouTube and other platforms, but I would say our bread and butter is definitely Instagram. TikTok. We, we can do others, but that's kind of our, our like meat and potatoes.
- [12:48]
A
Yeah, I'm, I'm thinking that YouTube is climbing up there, you know, with the long form video and the YouTube shorts, but nothing, nothing like TikTok and Instagram. Okay, what about as far as getting paid as, as a creator? Let's talk about pay because that's what everyone wants to know is how much are they getting paid? What are the common mistakes? So let's kind of deep dive into that. What are some mistakes that creators make when they're pitching themselves for these brand deals?
- [13:18]
B
Oh, when they're pitching themselves or having, having someone like us?
- [13:22]
A
Either. Or like when they're pitching. Yeah, let's talk about you working with them. Like what are some common mistakes? You see, it's kind of different because you're more, you're at a different league than someone pitching themselves. Obviously. Yeah, we can, we can even look at it flip side from brands pitching you guys to use your influencers. Like what are just some mistakes you see in your Industry.
- [13:44]
B
Yeah, I would say a few key things to look out for if you're pitching yourself, and let's take it that way because I think most of your audience is probably pitching themselves and looking, you know, to get their own brand deals. I would say try to get them to throw out the number first, because what if you throw out here, I'll do it for 5,000 and meanwhile in their head they had 20,000 for a budget. You know, you always want to try to either get them on the phone or get them to at least give you some sort of number. If they push and they say, just send me your rates. You should have a rate card. You can, there's so much data out there now. You can kind of calculate what roundabout way your rate should be. Maybe it's not exact, but I think doing some diligence and figuring out what your rate should be based on your engagement and your following and all of that. So you have a media kit and your rate card, you know, and then obviously there's always a negotiation from there. And I think also making sure that you look at every piece of the campaign. It's not just an Instagram story. Is there a follow up slide? How many slides is there exclusivity and for how long is there usage rights? Are they going to take that piece of content and use it on paid, you know, their paid channels or boost it? Like all of these things are something to really think about and look at because that could increase your rate if they're using your content in perpetuity for their advertising. And then you all of a sudden see it and you're like, wait, I only charged them $1,000 for a story. I didn't see that part of it. So really reading every contract and every piece of deliverable and asking those questions ahead of time, so there's no surprises.
- [15:33]
A
Did you, I don't know if this was ever true. There was like some talk about it, but Travis Kelce, did you hear about that? Where like he did this ad and it was the perpetuity and they ended up. Once he got, I mean, he was already famous. We know that he's a great football player, but once he started dating Taylor Swift, they started replaying his ad again. Did you hear anything about that?
- [15:55]
B
Oh, but that is. Yeah, that's a great example.
- [15:59]
A
That's a great example, guys. Like, he had agreed to this ad and there was a clause in there that he did not pay attention to, which is probably, you know, something with the digital department too is I bet you guys Protect your creators, your influencers, where someone like who's doing it themselves, they don't know all the things to look for. So it's really great to pick your brain on that. But those are very important things to think about because if you blow up. I think about this all the time because, I mean, I haven't blown up. But if there's like this really good brand partnership and they're offering a really big rate and they're like, you know, the perpetuity. What is it called when they can use it whenever?
- [16:38]
B
Perpetuity?
- [16:38]
A
Yeah. Do they. Is it called like exclusive perpetuity or something like that? Or they just. What do they say? What's that? What is that? That we want to watch that, that word that they say, that phrase.
- [16:50]
B
Well, we don't want to sign on to anything in perpetuity because that's forever.
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A
Okay.
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B
You always want to limit it with like six months, a month, 10 days, whatever that rate, that amount of time is. You want to have an end date.
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A
Yeah.
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B
So.
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A
But apparently Travis Kelsey did not look at that. But I know I got to, I got to do research on that because I can't remember if it was true or not, but I read it and a couple of things and I think it was. But when we talk about a media kit, what makes a strong media kit or a rate card.
- [17:21]
B
Mm. For a media kit, I would say it's almost like when you're putting on makeup. Right. You play up your best features.
- [17:28]
A
Yes.
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B
So in a media kit, like say your engagement rate is not that good. Don't put your engagement rate. Put your. Maybe your follower count is higher. So put the things that you want the brand to see and don't put the things you don't want them to see. If they need to ask for it, great. We can always provide that. But take your best features and put them in your media kit. So a beautiful photo. Make sure in your media kit all of your content pillars are shown. So if you have six content pillars and it's family, relationships, travel, beauty, you know, fashion, whatever those are, make sure they're all shown in your media kit so the brand can see that they can easily sink into your content in a natural and organic way. And then again, any sort of numbers that you can add in there. So obviously your social following. But if you have a newsletter, add in those numbers, add in your open rate, add in click throughs, if you have any affiliate data, if you're selling a lot on Amazon or LTK or Shop my includes some of Those really exciting sales that, you know, hey, I posted this shirt and I got 200 sales from it. Link clicks are really important. So if you have great link clicks, include that in the media kit. Because if you think about it from a brand perspective, a lot of brands use influencer marketing to sell product, Right. Some do brand awareness, which we love them. But a lot are very focused on ROI and how they can get that return back by using the influencer to promote the content. So thinking kind of from a brand perspective and what to put in there, what a brand might be looking for.
- [19:08]
A
Yes. Okay, that's good. Good feedback. And then as far as like how long it should be, is it usually a 1 pager, 2 pager?
- [19:15]
B
It can be. I mean, if you have a lot of press, then you can include press in there and that could be a couple of pages. But I think short and sweet is always the best. People don't have an attention span nowadays, as we know, hence TikTok blowing up. So I would say, you know, jam as much into a page or two as possible. And Canva, you can do really beautiful designs in Canva and create it on your own.
- [19:41]
A
Yes. Side note, Canva, you can type in their media kit and there's a ton of templates for you to play around with. Now if you are trying to stand out, obviously you can get those for inspo, but try to like beef it up yourself and make it your own so you stand out. Um, okay, what about what's one thing creators can do today to immediately become more brand friendly?
- [20:02]
B
That's a great question. Um, I would say one thing would be looking at your page as a whole. Because again, thinking about everyone's attention span, when a brand or agency lands on your page, they need to immediately know what they're getting when they come there. Same to get new followers. Right. So if someone, you, someone tags you, you click on their page and you look at it and you're like, I don't know who they are or what they do or what they're about. You want to make sure that is like screaming off of your page. So taking those content pillars and making sure every six posts have one of those content pillars in it. So you know, just keeping that top of mind when you're doing in feed content to always be including that. I think organically tagging brands to become visible. There's lots of platforms right now that are, it's called social listening. So they're listening to see, you know, oh, did this creator ever organically tag me? And they can get notifications to see all of that, which is pretty wild. So some brands, they'll look and be like, oh, they never organically tagged us. They're not really a fan of the brand. It could be as simple as following the brands that you love and engaging with their content. It's so simple. But a lot of people don't do that and building those relationships in person. We actually host an event called Brand Edit and that's exactly what we do there. We do it in multiple cities and brands can set up at our event and then influencers come and it really builds that two way relationship as opposed to just an email or dm. And I think that goes such a long way to have a face to the name behind the brand. And same with the influencer. So trying to get out networking events, attend their events, support and also getting their pr, gifting and tagging them organically and unboxing it and really showing support both ways instead of just like, I'm not doing anything for free, I'm not tagging you. You know, like that attitude is not going to be fruitful. I don't think. You know, it's spreading the love. And obviously if it gets to a point where you feel taken advantage of and they just continue to not book you for a campaign, that's a different story. But I think the beauty of being an influencer is to share all of these cool things that are a part of your life and the gifting that you get and the events that you can attend and all of these really fun things about being a creator.
- [22:37]
A
100% agree with that. I actually, I just got a partnership with Instagram's Creators account. 20 million. So excited. But I was talking to my husband, I was like, I want to know how they found me, blah, blah, blah. And then I thought about it and I was like, oh my gosh, I've been tagging them naturally in stuff that I create and I truly do think that's what helped bridge the gap there and what's, what helped them reach out to me was because I am not constantly, but whenever it seems fit and authentic and raw, I will tag some of my content. So definitely agree with you there about tagging things and don't have that attitude that oh, they're not paying me, I'm not going to share about it because that's, that's why, that's why sometimes influencer marketing gets that bad rap is because you know, there's some people out there that will only post if they're getting paid and you see hashtag ad and it's like, I, I don't want to see that all the time. I want you to be your true self. If that comes with a paid partnership, amazing. But don't, don't make it inauthentic. Agree with that.
- [23:40]
B
Yeah, it's, it's very noisy. And how do you stand out amongst tens of thousands of influencers? Get in their dms, tag them and build a relationship. Like, we're getting away from the days of I love a relationship. Hence, you know, my, the business I started, and I think that is 90% of it, is really having strong relationships and all, you know, all of that, I can preach it all day long, so.
- [24:05]
A
Agreed. All right, let's talk about getting seen standing out as a creator. What makes a creator for you, as an agency, what makes them stand out to you? What would make you want to be like, oh, my gosh, I do want to work with her or him.
- [24:19]
B
I think being different, like, it's really hard to be different nowadays. So for us, we've actually, I mentioned it earlier, we're really interested in people that have a niche. So we actually brought on a business about a year and a half ago called GLOW Lab and they represented all dermatologists. And so we have them now under the digital department and we represent maybe like 20 plus dermatologists and skincare experts. And it's just cool because it's different. And I love following them because they give you skincare advice. They're creators, but also have this expertise and niche. And we also partnered with an agency that represents all of the biggest hairstylists, makeup artists to celebrities. So it's been fun working with them because they're, yes, they're creators, but also they have an expertise and a niche and brands really like that. You know, there's so many just traditional creators out there, which are great, but a lot of brands want that kind of like style stamp of approval from an expert. So, like, we just signed a gut health doctor. We have all different types of niches and specialties. We have a lot of reality stars, but one is a nurse. So we're like, let's play into you being a nurse, but also have the reality star life. So that's one of our content pillars. So I think having something different than, you know, every kind of run of the mill creator is something that stands out for us because I think it's something we can build on. It's something brands are really interested in working with as well.
- [25:58]
A
That's funny because one of the questions I had for you was how important is it for creators to niche down versus just being a lifestyle focused creator? So I did notice like I'm. I, well, I used to watch the Bachelor, like religiously. I don't anymore, but I still keep up with it. And I know that you guys represent a lot of them. So when you pull them on, like is being a reality star their niche or do you do things like what you just said, you pulled out that she was a nurse, like how do you work with those type of people?
- [26:29]
B
Yeah, exactly, exactly that, like great that you are on a show. And that's why everyone follows them, right? Is to follow their love story and that's always going to be number one for them and their, you know, their followers interests. But we always want to find something different. So whether it's, you know, following their love story with a new person or you know, marriage or kids or if they love gardening or if they love, you know, home Reno or there can be so many different things, but we need another angle. So that's why we always talk about our pillars with our talent when we onboard them or every year we do a new strategy on like how we want to show up on social media. So yeah, I think it's having a story outside of reality and a lot of the more successful ones I think have kind of leaned away from being this reality star and really transformed into more of a lifestyle content creator.
- [27:27]
A
Yeah. What about, do you guys, when you're working with brands, do you guys balance between like trending content or is it more like authentic storytelling content? Like I know for me, I, I share a lot of trending audio for people because trending audio works on Instagram and TikTok. Are you guys worried about trends when it comes to content creation?
- [27:50]
B
Not as much. I mean it's great to hop on some of the TikTok trends just to, you know, stay relevant and. But you know, some creators are like, I don't want to do the dances on TikTok. Is that okay? And we're like, yes, absolutely. You have to lean into what's organically you and who you are online and who you are as a person. We don't, we never will tell you. No, you have to do this like TikTok dance to be relevant. I think there's so many other ways you can do that. Not just following the trend, but yeah, the sounds and the songs and those sort of things I think do help. But I don't think it's what's going.
- [28:29]
A
To make you Successful, Yeah, that's the same. Like when people come to me for Influence Marketing Studio, we manage social media for businesses or busy entrepreneurs. And that is one of the first things sometimes is I'm not gonna dance on Reels or TikTok. Sounds like, no, that's totally okay. Like, you don't have to. Sometimes we can still jump on trends if, if it ties into your story somehow, but that it's not required to grow on social media. You know what I mean? I like doing it because I'm fun and out there cheerleader, you know, love dancing, but if that's not you, you don't have to do it.
- [29:04]
B
Yeah, exactly.
- [29:05]
A
Love that. All right, let's get into growth strategies. As far as growing and monetizing in 2025, what strategies are helping creators do that this year?
- [29:17]
B
Yeah, actually we've seen it a lot. We acquired another business this year to launch our affiliate division. And we've seen those creators just grow so much, not only on their affiliate platforms, but on their social as well. And what a lot of them are implementing are broadcast channels, obviously, the consistent sales posts and things like that, and becoming a resource for shopping. So those are the creators that I'm seeing growing in terms of following really rapidly as well as those that are doing, like, I've seen some more growth when people are doing collaboration posts with, you know, other creators that are in kind of have a different sort of niche than they do, but similar. Like, there's similarities, but there's a lot of crossover in terms of followers. So they help gain new followers by doing some of those collaboration posts. But the affiliate creators are just, it's crazy how much they grow through, you know, posting all of these affiliate links. Because a lot of times when we work with creators that aren't in the affiliate space at all, they're like, I don't want to sell to my audience. I'm going to be annoying. Like. But these affiliate creators, they're just gaining so many new followers because they're finding them from LTK or Shop My or Amazon or all of these other platforms. And they're just consistently talking about what sales are happening, talking about what clothes they're wearing, their beauty routine, all of these different things that people want, an influencer or, you know, someone they look up to's opinion on what to buy.
- [30:56]
A
When I'm on Amazon, I'll go to Amazon storefronts from people I follow just because, like, I don't always know what to even search for.
- [31:03]
B
Yeah, we're busy and it's like, all right, I love her style. Let me just click on all of her affiliate platforms and just buy it all. Add to cart.
- [31:10]
A
Done. Yeah, I love that. That's so funny. That kind of answers my next question, which was, are creators undervaluing affiliate marketing? Which I can say myself. I'll get affiliate marketing emails all the time. And it's like, I don't have the time for that. But you're kind of changing my opinion. Like, actually, maybe you do, because that is a way to be extremely helpful and add value to someone's life by offering something that I already like.
- [31:37]
B
Yeah. And I mean, yes, there's a lot of spam that comes out with like, oh, sign up for this brand and you get a 30% commission. You have to set up a whole portal. And like, I would say no to those.
- [31:49]
A
Okay.
- [31:49]
B
But do it through ltk. Shop my Amazon. They have every brand that you could ever imagine. Obviously, everything's on Amazon. And make money while you're at it. It's talking about things that you use on a daily basis.
- [32:04]
A
Anyway, I need to get back to that. I did. I did a test for, like, LTK and Mavely just to see how hard it would be to make a hundred bucks. And really, I made a hundred bucks, like, in a week from just sharing what I was wearing each day. So. And would you say, like, would you say for someone under 10,000 followers? I know we're all like, oh, you got to get to your first 10,000 followers before you start selling. Which isn't true, by the way. But do you feel like affiliates a good way to get into influencer marketing, like, before you've got that huge following or what's your thoughts on that?
- [32:39]
B
100%. Yes, you can use Facebook and your friends and family might buy the egg cooker that you use every day on Amazon. Like, there's so many ways that you can monetize. There's so many different platforms, too, for micro creators, where you can make 50 bucks or you get a free bottle of wine if you post about it. Or, you know, there's so many different platforms out there. Just use chat, GPT and search, you know, micro creators. And then you can log in and you get all of the different opportunities. And $50 might turn into 100 and 250. And then that's how you continue growing. You can also do ugc, where you can make extra money just creating content and not actually posting it on your channels. And then, yeah, again, affiliate. I think you would fall out of your seat right now if I told you what some of these people make on a monthly basis, just no brand deals, just affiliate.
- [33:36]
A
Can you give us an average? Can you give us anything?
- [33:38]
B
I mean the highest I've seen was over 500,000amonth.
- [33:42]
A
Shut your freaking mouth. Oh my gosh. Yeah.
- [33:47]
B
Shopping post every day and no brand deals. That's it.
- [33:52]
A
And you know there's some, there's almost like, like taboo, like if you're an affiliate over influencer, you know, like there's some kind of like you're better than. But you speaking that number out loud, it's like actually you can make really good money here. Okay, this should inspire you guys. If you're listening, go at least sign up for one affiliate marketing platform and just, just share what you like. Any predictions for influencer marketing by the end of 2025? So the end of this year, you think anything crazy is going to happen? Should we lean into something?
- [34:28]
B
I think the new thing to lean into a substack.
- [34:31]
A
You've said that. What is substack?
- [34:33]
B
Substack. It's a kind of like the old school blog. You can charge though, like you can have it for free and then certain posts you can put under a paywall and you can charge either a monthly fee, you know, so you can monetize it but you can also put affiliate links in there. It's kind of like going back to the old school blogging days and I think it's a really great way to just have longer form content than just a TikTok or your in feed. And you also get to own your audience, right? So you get everyone's email addresses which is gold. Any way you can get your fans email addresses like look what happened with TikTok. It almost went away and people could have lost their entire livelihood. So I think taking back what your is yours because a lot of these platforms you don't own and they could go away tomorrow.
- [35:27]
A
And what, what's your favorite creator success story from a campaign that you've worked on like recently or anytime really?
- [35:34]
B
Oh my gosh, so many. And I haven't really been in the day to day of management for a while so I mean we see. I guess one that comes to mind first would be Alan Bernstein. He's from Dancing with the Stars. We just signed him maybe in the last year and he was getting like a decent amount of brand deals but his manager TDD has just, they created this incredible relationship. They've become really good friends and he's I think like triple, quadrupled the amount of brand deals that he's gotten and he's worked with, like, all of his dream brands. He's, like, booked and busy and so happy and just so thankful for everything that we've done. So it's been exciting to see because typically male creators, it's a little bit harder to book deals for than female. But we've just, I mean, it's been really exciting to see his growth. And I'm sure Dancing with the Stars has helped last season and, you know, continue to build, but I think his.
- [36:38]
A
Personality, like, he's like a warm, fuzzy teddy bear. Like, and I think that through his content as well.
- [36:44]
B
Yeah. And I think it's also, it's, you know, the relationship with a manager and the talent. You know, you have to have that really close relationship to work together and texting all day and, you know, how to monetize and how to strategy, strategize, you know, what's going to work, what's not work, what brands we want to reach out to. Let's collaborate. Like, okay, organically tag them. I'm going to get gifting and then I'm going to reach out. So it's really a partnership and a team. And I think that's a really good example of how we've worked with the talent to really grow them as a team together.
- [37:17]
A
I love that. That's awesome. You guys are really doing something good. Okay, as we close out, I got a few rapid fire questions and then we will end this thing. Creator, red flag. What? What would be a red flag for.
- [37:30]
B
You not posting consistently?
- [37:32]
A
Yep. What about a green flag? Like, you would want to work with.
- [37:36]
B
Them if they respond as quickly as I do.
- [37:39]
A
Oh, yes, girl. Love that.
- [37:40]
B
And a business mind. Fast on it. Hungry Hustle.
- [37:45]
A
Yes.
- [37:46]
B
Yeah.
- [37:46]
A
Yes. What's one thing every creator should stop doing in 2025?
- [37:51]
B
I don't know. I don't want to offend anyone if I say this. Okay.
- [37:58]
A
A nice one is stop ignoring your comments. Like, it's just.
- [38:02]
B
That's. That's one. Yes. Stop hiding your likes. Yeah, stop. Because it's such a red. Well, that's another red flag. But like, every time if I look on someone's page and their likes and their comments are hidden. Goodbye.
- [38:15]
A
What are you hiding? Okay, we both just said that. She's influencer marketing. I have a social media agency. Stop hiding your likes. Underrated income stream for creators, which I think we kind of talked about.
- [38:29]
B
Yeah. Affiliate.
- [38:30]
A
Affiliate Y.
- [38:31]
B
Call us if you need help.
- [38:33]
A
Yes.
- [38:34]
B
All your. All your content for you. And take all of that off your plate.
- [38:38]
A
I'm calling you as soon as this podcast is over. Biggest myth about influencer marketing to close us out for rapid fire.
- [38:45]
B
Oh, it's so easy. All you're doing is traveling and having fun.
- [38:49]
A
Yes, my grandpa.
- [38:51]
B
What am I supposed to do? Post on Zoom. Yeah, you know, stressed out. No, it's, it's a full time job for the our industry as well as the creators. It doesn't stop. These creators look like they're just enjoying life, but there is so much work that goes behind it. It's the, the editing. You're the model, you're the photographer, you're the analytics, the keeping the organic post. I mean it is 50 jobs in one.
- [39:17]
A
So it's 50 in one. Yes, you are right. My husband finally gets it because I took him to a creator event last year and he's like, oh my gosh, I see why you want to record everything. I'm like, yeah, we need B roll behind the scenes. And then my mother in law, she's having to watch the kids for us this summer because my, my, my youngest is finally out of pre K and I think she's finally understanding too. Like I'm not just dancing on Instagram. Like I've got meetings, podcast recording, you know, mastermind, so. That is so true. People underestimate what all goes into all of this. Sarah, you are a joy to talk to. How can people connect with you? Where would you want them to go visit after this, this conversation? Tell us all the things.
- [39:59]
B
Oh well, thank you. The digital department.com. it's the digital Dept.com so you can find all of our links there for our events, our brand strategy division, our talent management, our roster, all of it. Affiliate and follow us on LinkedIn. I mean you can follow me on LinkedIn. Digital department, you can follow on Instagram and TikTok. It's the digital DPT and then my Instagram is Sarah P. Boyd. So follow along. I'm not posting a ton. You'll see a lot of my family and my travel when I'm not sitting behind Zoom.
- [40:39]
A
So before I talk to you, I looked up your Instagram and started following you. I do see you travel a lot. Is that something you like to do?
- [40:46]
B
I do, it's just honestly the only time I post is when I'm traveling. The rest I'm just. It's not that exciting.
- [40:51]
A
It's just down working.
- [40:54]
B
Yeah. Um, but yes, I love to travel. I just got back from Santorini, Greece and it was the most amazing trip I'VE ever been on in my life.
- [41:00]
A
Bless you. And how many kids do you have?
- [41:02]
B
I have three. So my, I have a daughter that's nine and then two stepsons. One is 20 and one is 24.
- [41:09]
A
Wow. You are an amazing woman to do what you do and have children. I just know how much that takes out of us decision fatigue and you know, like making decisions for them and the business and being a go getter. So much kudos to you and what you've built. It's incredible. And I can't tell you how my heart pitter pattered when I heard from Lindsay that you guys were interested in talking with me because I, I just. The digital department, I've always looked up to you guys and what you guys do. It's. It's really amazing. So I hope you guys will go visit the digital department, learn about what they do. Sign up for their email list too because you guys send out very good newsletters and I always learn something from them and then the events too. I want to get to one as soon as I can, but thank you so much for being on. I appreciate you.
- [41:56]
B
Oh, thank you. And you actually reminded me when you said that we if you're a creator listening our brand strategy team, there is a link on our website. You can link it, go to the link through our Instagram as well to sign up for paid and unpaid brand deals through the digital department. So go sign up. They'll send newsletters out for all of the campaigns. We work with crocs, we work with all different types of brands in many different capacities. So even if you're a micro creator, sign up. And that's a great way to kind of be considered for different campaigns as well.
- [42:33]
A
Amazing. I love it. All right, thank you so much, Sarah.
- [42:37]
B
Thank you. This is fun.