Call It Triggers, Past Boyfriends and that Coldplay Kiss Cam

Summary

Call It What It Is – Episode Summary: "Call It Triggers, Past Boyfriends and that Coldplay Kiss Cam"

Podcast Information:

• Title: Call It What It Is
• Host/Author: iHeartPodcasts
• Release Date: July 28, 2025

Overview: In this engaging episode of Call It What It Is, hosts Jessica Capshaw and Camilla Luddington delve deep into the nuanced topic of emotional triggers. Balancing heartfelt discussions with light-hearted banter, the duo explores personal experiences, coping mechanisms, and societal reactions to public emotional events, all while maintaining their trademark camaraderie.

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1. Introduction to Triggers (02:46 – 05:45)

Jessica and Camilla kick off the episode by defining what constitutes a trigger versus a mere annoyance. They emphasize the importance of recognizing genuine triggers that cause intense emotional distress, often rooted in past traumas or challenging experiences.

• Definition Discussion:
  • Camille Luddington (04:46): “Anything person, place, thing, or situation causing intense emotional distress, bringing up past trauma or a challenging experience.”

Jessica humorously admits her own misunderstandings about triggers before clarifying their true meaning.

2. Personal Experiences with Triggers (05:45 – 12:10)

The hosts share personal anecdotes to illustrate how triggers manifest in their lives.

• Jessica on Emotional Triggers:

  • Jessica Capshaw (06:10): “I was waiting on tables on Mother's Day, and that whole day was a trigger. Anything could trigger me that day.”

• Camille on Childhood Triggers:

  • Camille Luddington (07:10): “Most of my triggers are childhood triggers... I feel like I'm team avoid, but I've been getting better at diving in.”

They discuss their respective coping styles—Jessica tends to avoid diving into triggers, while Camille is gradually learning to face them.

3. Coping Mechanisms: Team Avoid vs. Team Dive In (07:35 – 11:01)

The conversation transitions into how each of them handles triggers, exploring the dichotomy between avoidance and engagement.

• Camille's Approach:

  • Camille Luddington (07:35): “I'm not wired to fight. I'd rather figure it out... Just keep swimming.”

• Jessica's Approach:

  • Jessica Capshaw (08:21): “I'm a team avoider. I compartmentalize... But sometimes, you need to sit with it.”

They acknowledge that while avoidance can offer temporary relief, facing triggers can lead to deeper emotional healing, despite being more challenging.

4. The Complexity of Grief as a Trigger (09:03 – 11:01)

Jessica opens up about her grief over her mother's passing, illustrating how deeply personal losses can serve as potent triggers.

• Jessica on Grief:
  • Jessica Capshaw (09:18): “Having children ended up being a trigger for grief for my mom. The box I had boxed up grief never goes away.”

This segment underscores the enduring nature of certain triggers and the importance of addressing them rather than suppressing.

5. Triggers in Daily Life and Relationships (12:10 – 19:00)

The hosts discuss how unresolved triggers can spill over into everyday interactions, leading to overreactions and strained relationships.

• Camille on Work-Life Balancing:

  • Camille Luddington (13:11): “When I'm on the hamster wheel, juggling emails and family demands, I sometimes overreact to my kids' minor mishaps.”

• Jessica on Compartmentalizing:

  • Jessica Capshaw (09:12): “I am an expert at compartmentalizing.”

They emphasize the importance of self-awareness in recognizing when past triggers are influencing current behaviors.

6. Public Events as Triggers: The Coldplay Kiss Cam Incident (30:21 – 39:35)

A significant portion of the episode is dedicated to discussing a high-profile cheating scandal involving Coldplay during a concert kiss cam event. Jessica and Camille dissect why this particular incident has become so triggering for many.

• Why It’s Triggering:

  • Jessica Capshaw (32:15): “The CEO and HR thing is what making it stick... public scrutiny is intense.”

• Public Perception and Empathy:

  • Camille Luddington (34:09): “This is completely not a new thing... but the public nature makes it so horrible.”

They explore the intersection of personal betrayals and public exposure, highlighting how societal magnification can exacerbate the emotional impact of such events.

• Humorous Banter:
  • Jessica Capshaw (37:48): “This is why we can't have an affair together, Jess, because we will get caught.”

Their playful exchange lightens the conversation, demonstrating their ability to tackle serious subjects with humor.

7. Differentiating Triggers from Pet Peeves (27:50 – 32:49)

Returning to the core topic, the hosts clarify the difference between genuine triggers and everyday annoyances.

• Jessica on Parking Triggers:

  • Jessica Capshaw (24:00): “I get closer and closer to absolutely exploding in the car... it's tty patent.”

• Camille on Self-Talk:

  • Camille Luddington (27:12): “I do a lot of self-talk... It's okay. You weren't here.”

They reiterate that while pet peeves are manageable frustrations, triggers require a more profound emotional response and understanding.

8. Concluding Thoughts and Final Insights (39:35 – End)

As the episode wraps up, Jessica and Camille reflect on the importance of recognizing and respecting both personal and others' emotional triggers. They advocate for greater empathy and awareness in social interactions to foster healthier relationships.

• Final Reflections:

  • Camille Luddington (39:35): “I hope that the news cycle stops and I wish them grace and healing. It's gotta be just horrible.”

• Jessica’s Closing Thoughts:

  • Jessica Capshaw (39:39): “We can't have an affair together, Jess, because we will get caught.”

They emphasize the necessity of understanding the gravity of triggers and the impact of public emotional events on individual well-being.

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Notable Quotes:

• Camille on the Definition of Triggers:

  • “[04:46] Camille Luddington: (…) anything person, place, thing, or situation causing intense emotional distress…”

• Jessica on Emotional Hot Mess:

  • “[06:00] Jessica Capshaw: (…) I was an emotional hot mess. And I was like, no, don't stop believing. But he stopped believing. And then I stopped.”

• Camille on Coping with Triggers:

  • “[07:35] Camille Luddington: (…) I think a lot of my adaptations and the way that I cope is… Just keep swimming.”

• Jessica on Public Scrutiny:

  • “[32:15] Jessica Capshaw: (…) The CEO and HR thing is what's making it stick.”

• Final Reflection on Empathy:

  • “[34:09] Camille Luddington: (…) you can't help but do that. And then you're so frustrated. I'm like, this is terrible… everyone loses.”

Conclusion: This episode of Call It What It Is provides a profound exploration of emotional triggers, interwoven with personal stories and societal observations. Jessica and Camille offer listeners relatable insights and practical reflections on navigating the complexities of emotional responses in both private and public spheres. Through their candid dialogue, they encourage a deeper understanding and compassionate approach to dealing with triggers, fostering a supportive community for those seeking to better manage their emotional well-being.

Transcript

[Jessica Capshaw]

This is an I Heart podcast.

[Camille Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camille Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camille Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camille Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camille Luddington]

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[Camille Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camille Luddington]

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[Camille Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

Call it what it is with Jessica Capshaw and Camille Luddington, an iHeartRadio podcast. Well, hello, hello, hello, hello, Call it crew. And welcome to another episode of Call it what It Is.

[Camille Luddington]

Oh, I love. Thank goodness for these. For these episodes, because it means I get to see you. Because, you know, we don't FaceTime all the time. Usually we just call each other. Also, you called me earlier today, and it made me laugh because most people would, like, wait for someone to say hello before they start talking.

[Jessica Capshaw]

We don't. You know what's so funny is we often don't even say goodbye.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah, I agree. Yeah, no, we don't usually say goodbye either. Hellos and goodbyes.

[Jessica Capshaw]

It's like, okay, someone's walking in and this is. The phone goes dead.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah, that's exactly right. That's exactly right. Yeah. Hey, so what are we talking about today?

[Jessica Capshaw]

We're talking about triggers. Our triggers. Your triggers. Not avoiding them, loving them, even engaging with them or avoiding them.

[Camille Luddington]

Yes. Because people have different adaptations or coping mechanisms for their triggers. Yeah.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I think we start by just saying the definition of the trigger, because I earlier today was like, this is my trigger. And this is my trigger. And this is my trigger. And then I read the definition. I'm like, those are not triggers. Those are just things that really irritate me.

[Camille Luddington]

You are not alone. You are not alone. And actually, part of the reason I felt that this was a good thing to talk about is I think it's no one's fault. I just think there's a lot of people walking around the world saying that, you know, there are triggers when it's just something annoying.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah, let's just.

[Camille Luddington]

Let's. Let's. Let's give. Let's give a trigger. It's fair. Day in court. And let's give something annoying. It's fair. Day in court.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Perfect.

[Camille Luddington]

Okay, so a definition of a trigger. Anything person, place, thing, or situation causing intense emotional distress, bringing up past trauma or a challenging experience. Triggers kind of deep.

[Jessica Capshaw]

It is really deep. I have some, like, really deep triggers that I'm going to be so honest. It's. It's. It's the morning for me, and I just don't feel like being on the floor talking.

[Camille Luddington]

Should we shelve this topic? Do we need to trigger?

[Jessica Capshaw]

No, it's something I need to Shelby. So certain triggers I don't need. I like, I would be have an emergency therapy sort of situation after the podcast. Then.

[Camille Luddington]

I have a feeling that in the. In your trigger, dealing with style, you might be. Oh, I guess that's the question in what's your style for dealing with a trigger? Are you a little bit like team avoid or are you team like. I'm feeling a trigger. I'm diving in.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Oh, there's no dive in.

[Camille Luddington]

You. You're in a. Okay, great.

[Jessica Capshaw]

No, I. I dive out. I definitely dive out. I will tell you. I will tell you when I've dived in. Okay. My very first boyfriend, who I've talked about on the show, I'm still friends with him. He was like my high school sweetheart. We did this stupid thing of, like, pick making our song a song that gets played everywhere. So our song was Don't Stop Believing by Journey. There is no bar that you walk into or just like, anywhere where you're not going to hear that song. Like, I think if you were in a. If you guys are. If anybody listening right now is in a couple situation, you're like, what is our song gonna be? Please pick something that you're not going to hear regularly. So if it goes downhill, you. You're only maybe hearing it like, once or twice. After the breakup, I heard that song everywhere I went, and it literally. I did dive in. I was like an emotional hot mess. And I was like, no, don't stop believing. But he stopped believing. And then I stopped. You know, it's like, that was a dive in. That was a trigger dive in. And it did. Absolutely. And caused me intense emotional distress.

[Camille Luddington]

Yes. Yes. Yeah, yeah.

[Jessica Capshaw]

What about you?

[Camille Luddington]

Well, I feel like most of my triggers are childhood triggers.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Are you a team avoid or team dive in?

[Camille Luddington]

I would love to say I'm a team dive in, but no, I think I've gotten better at diving in. I've gotten. I've gotten better at trying to do the hard better, you know, like, not like, getting. What do we always say? Like, you get better at doing the hard.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Like you.

[Camille Luddington]

You know that it's something that doesn't come natural to you. Also, I'm not, like, I'm not ready. I don't. I wasn't wired to fight. I'm not. Like, I'd rather figure it out. And I think maybe that's a connection. That would be a natural one for someone who's like, team dive in. Because I think when you dive in, you gotta be ready to get a little. A little dirty. You gotta tussle. Yeah. You gotta be ready to rumble on some level. Right. Like, you gotta go at it. And I think that a lot of my adaptations and the way that I cope is. Is. Is like a little bit Finding Nemo. It's like just Keep swimming. Just keep swimming.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Just. Yeah, I think that's a lot of people, though. I think a lot of us are avoiders because, like, also, I'm a little bit. Who has the time to dive in? Like, if I dive in, I. I need to pick up my kids, my drown in in 30 minutes. Do you know what I mean? Like, I can't. There's not. I don't want to. I don't want to deal with it, which is not good. I don't think it's necessarily good to not just sometimes sit with it.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah, I know. And how many times have you been.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Have you.

[Camille Luddington]

Have you, like, push something aside because you didn't have time to fight, but you. But really a fight was necessary. Like, you needed to.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Camille Luddington]

You needed to get that done.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Mm. No, I've. I've talked about this in therapy because I am an expert at. Com. And compartmentalizing.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah. I thought that was a positive thing. Is that not.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Apparently not really.

[Camille Luddington]

I literally said it, like, two weeks ago. Like, it was a really great thing to do.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah. Yeah, so did I. I was like, boasting about it in therapy, and she was like, wait, hold on.

[Camille Luddington]

But seriously, you're not allowed to, like, have your feeling and just go, like, I see you. I'm just gonna put you over here for a second.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yes. But the problem with me, like, I'll tell you, one of the things that, like, I was dealing with in therapy that I did a good job of doing that with was grief over my mom. I had, like, boxed that up. I had, like, taped it, put it on a shelf, and it was dusty. And I was like, that's. I love that over there. Like, who needs to open that up? Like, n. Boring. I don't do that.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah.

[Jessica Capshaw]

And she. Basically, the box never goes away. Right. So it's. It's sitting there and it's. And at some point, you're gonna listen. Having children actually ended up being a trigger for grief for my mom. That's. That's a deep one. Right. So the box just, like, sprung open and bust the seams. And then I was like, no, no, gonn you back up. And that's when she was like, no, you can't do that anymore. And then you did have to. And then I have. I've done a deep dive in with, like, grief, and it's been hard. And I had. I had a lot of conversation. I know this is a little bit off the subject of a trigger, but I had a lot of conversations about, like, why. Why Should I lean into something or face something that's so difficult and upsetting? And I realized that it really. You get a release from it, but I really did not. You do, but it's tight. You're waiting through the water, you know, like. And I didn't want to get in the. I didn't want to get in the ocean. I was like, no, no, thank you. I'm dry on the sand.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah. Yeah. And, and, and also that when you face it, which I guess would be something you could have a chance at if you were team dive in, you kind of prove to yourself that it's possible. Because I think I'm. I'm imagining this. I'm making this up. I'm. I'm thinking that I avoid it because I actually, on some level, think I can't handle it. Like, if I actually dove in, I die.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yes.

[Camille Luddington]

I've said these kinds of things in therapy before, by the way. Like, Like I have my. Convinced myself that I actually might expire if I were to meet this challenge for this emotional distress or the thing that triggered that memory of that thing. Like, I would just die, which I know is not a rational thought. Like, I'm not. My heart's not going to stop beating. I'm not going to start inhaling and exhaling, but the emotional pain of it might just take me down.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I think that's so real. I think that's something that so many people listening will relate to. I. Because that's the way you described is exactly how I felt. I felt like I'm just going to drown.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah.

[Jessica Capshaw]

What's the fucking point in getting in the ocean? Like, I'm not going to do it.

[Camille Luddington]

Because I think that the other thing that's. It's talked about, but maybe not in this way, is that in order to stay engaged with something, you have to be hopeful that it will get better. But when you feel hopeless or when you've told yourself the story that if I dive in, I'll die. Yeah, you're pretty hopeless. And you're not. You're not in that lack of. In the vacuum without hope, you. You don't see a path forward. So it's interesting. Okay, so do you have times where you will find yourself overreacting to something that someone said or did, and then you actually realize later that it actually had nothing to do with them, but it was about something that, that was that person, place, thing, or situation that recalls this, like, intense emotional distress?

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah, I think it probably happens all the time, daily. Is there something that like for you, you can think of right now because.

[Camille Luddington]

You have too many examples. You like room.

[Jessica Capshaw]

What happened this morning?

[Camille Luddington]

Oh, I think I find it. So tell me if this happens, do you anyone? I find when I'm trying to do it all, which of course we all know is like there's no virtue in it. That's just so ridiculous. You can't do it all. But when you're, When I'm on the hamster wheel, like when I'm just like going, going, going, going, going, and I'm trying to look at my phone, stay ahead of emails, all the things that are coming it to me for, family stuff, work stuff, whatever. Most of it's like you're just like lobbying these tennis balls, right? Like they pass one to you and you pass it back and you've got to just exchange of information. But every once in a while there'll be an email or something that'll come in that will actually be emotional someone or a text. Right. Like someone's upset about something or disappointed about something and I won't be able to deal with in that moment. And I have found myself a couple times being super short with the kids.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah.

[Camille Luddington]

Like trying to live my own life. Like trying to live my life while also tending to this, these ideas or questions or demands that I think that I have on my time that come through my phone. I have found myself being really upset about something I learn or under it, or not understanding how to answer it or whatever. And then instead of being like, hey kids, I need to take a 22nd time out and respond to this in the way that I want to respond to this, I will not respond to do that. And the next thing that someone does where, you know, something spills or someone does something naughty or whatever, I'm like, yeah, like what just happened? Like, I just spilled the yogurt or whatever. And it's such an oversized reaction. And I will find myself checking myself and being like, whoa. Like I was not that mad at what you did. I was carrying this like leftover, you know, this, this trigger of, of, you know, I don't. Whatever, right. Like, I mean I can, I can pull out my dirty laundry, right? Like abandonment or what? And be like, okay, now that's been brought up and I'm going to then just like sprinkle it all over you all. It's not fair.

[Jessica Capshaw]

This is actually like making me think about me. I used to have to wait tables on Mother's Day and if I waited on your table Mother's Day, just know that I really hated you because, like, you, I. That whole day was, of course, a trigger. And I was waiting on, like, you know, moms getting gifts from their daughters, and. And I was just angry the whole day. The whole. Anything could trigger me that day. Like, oh, you want an extra water? Oh, you do?

[Camille Luddington]

Do you think it'd be helpful if.

[Jessica Capshaw]

We maybe went to therapy more?

[Camille Luddington]

No. I mean, it seems silly to, like, you know, wear. Wear a badge that says, like, you know, I have intense mother trauma on Mother's Day when you're waiting tables. But, like, I wish there was some way we could let others know where we're coming from on a. Yes, on some level, like, and be like, I just got a very disturbing email. You know, whatever. You know, I, I. Because it's really not fair. It's not fair to other people.

[Jessica Capshaw]

That's why we say, like, you know, that's why people say, like, walking around in the world, like, you don't know what kind of day people are having. You know what? Actually, this was a trigger for me recently. And this is. Again, Ma, I'm sorry, everyone listening, like, listen, your mom passing is, like, pretty traumatic. Okay, you guys, so it's. I'm gonna talk about this. I don't have any pictures of my mom up anywhere. I don't have a single picture of her up in the house. And I found a photo of her, and then Matt took it, and he hung it on our pin board. And I walked by it, and I was like. And I, like, did not want it on there. And he said, oh, I'm so sorry. Like, should I take it off? And I just stood, and I was like, I definitely wanted to rip it off the board and, like, put it back in a box, but I was like, no, it's gonna stay there. And it's been a week now, and it's on my board, and I don't know how I feel about it. And there is. I am triggered by it. But I think that maybe in this mo, I'm. I'm taking it as a sign that I, I. There's a reason for it to be up right now.

[Camille Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camille Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

I have a question for you. It's a little personal. Sometimes when you leave a job, it's painful, right? Like, it's like you have a lot of feelings about it. And for you, you're in this really strange situation where you left Grey's Anatomy and then you have a hundred people every day talking about this character that you loved and approaching you. Was there a period of time when fans approaching you all the time about the show or Arizona, like, brought up feelings of, like, sadness or were you able to compartmentalize?

[Camille Luddington]

Well, I am good at that. No, I was always very. Yes, number one. Of course you have all the sad feelings.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah.

[Camille Luddington]

Oh, my God. I'm so. And I will get. I get so taken over by the nostalgia and the sad and the. I strongly dislike goodbyes. I'm like, that, see you later, queen. I'm like, well, I'm not saying goodbye. Just say it. See you later. And that's the little girl part of me. Right. I think that when you are a child of divorce and you go back and forth, you have these transitions that are like many goodbyes and you switch into a different mode. And so goodbyes are hard and you're sort of told by the world, you know, don't, don't. Don't make them goodbyes. Like, it's going to be okay. And the universe is conspiring to make it okay for you. So you're like, it's see you later. It's see you later. And that makes sense. And that is. That's right. But the ends of things can be so sad for me. And no, I was never sad about people coming up to me about Arizona because I just, I just loved her so much. The only time that I would ever have anything that felt remotely negative adjacement is I will. I get a little. I get defensive of her. Like, if people.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Oh, it's not often, but if people.

[Camille Luddington]

Say things, you know. Yeah. That are kind of flippant or like, say like, you know, or they. Or like make fun of her or say something and not even make fun of her, but just like something. I'm like, okay, yeah, that to me, not talking to you anymore.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Like, that's My friend.

[Camille Luddington]

Yes, my friend. You don't talk about her like that. You don't talk about her like that. Yeah, yeah, she was doing her best. She had a rough season nine.

[Jessica Capshaw]

She was in a plane crash. Watch the episode.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah, exactly.

[Jessica Capshaw]

One of the things we have here is what's the difference between a pet peeve and a trigger? One's annoying and one sends you.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah. I think what we're talking. I mean, I do think at the end of this is basically is. Is perhaps saying to ourselves, but also the. The world. This world is maybe also. Don't confuse annoyances with triggers.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yes. Because here's here. I was. Okay, so I was dropping one of my kids at camp this morning, and I knew we're gonna do this episode. And so before I'd read the. The official definition, I was like, oh, I got some triggers. And I. And I came home and I told Matt, and I was like, you know what? I'm gonna talk about today? Which has not happened because clearly it's a deeper thing. I was like, when you. When we go to a restaurant, you will pull in and you will pass, like, 15 parking spots, and every single time you pass a spot, I get closer and closer to absolutely exploding in the car. And the only reason I'm not is because there are kids in the back usually, and I don't under. And it drives me. And then he was like, oh, you know, I do it. You know why? Because I like a spot that's away from other people. And I don't need the answer. I'm just going to tell you. And the other thing that I cannot say stand that he does is he backs into a spot. Jessica Capshaw. When he starts, what I know is a reversal move. Oh, my God. I, like, I literally can't even watch. Like, I have to just, like, start looking at my phone because I.

[Camille Luddington]

How do you do. Do you start, like, harm thing? Do you look at your phone? Do you say anything?

[Jessica Capshaw]

You know when people are like, take a deep breath and then. I like that. Honestly, I compartmentalize.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah.

[Jessica Capshaw]

My body knows it's being reversed because it's sat in the car, but my mind is trying to deny.

[Camille Luddington]

I imagine you sitting like a yogi with your. Your legs crossed and your hands onto your side, and you're like in a lotus.

[Jessica Capshaw]

But I'm being forced to move backwards in a reverse.

[Camille Luddington]

By the way, I completely identify with this. This happens in my own life as well sometimes. And what's really confusing to me as someone who is with me quite a lot is I. I couldn't like to walk more. I love walking. I walk. I'm happy to walk. Like when people are in. When I'm, you know, going anywhere, people are like, do you want to take a car? You want to walk? I'm like, oh, walk, walk. But when I'm in my car going somewhere, I want the spot that is the number one pole position spot in a parking lot.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I call that princess parking. You want the princess parking spot?

[Camille Luddington]

That's what I want. But it's not about walking. So what's it about?

[Jessica Capshaw]

Okay, so let me ask you a question. How do you feel when there's one person in front of you, can't tell whether leaving or parking, and the princess spot is open and then they pull in and you just know if you just been like 30 seconds sooner, that would real disappointing. That is disappointing.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah. And you know what? When I was younger, I dealt with that less. Well, I have said before, and I will say again, that self talk is real. Is is I do a lot. And I will truly say to myself, like, it's okay.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Over the spot.

[Camille Luddington]

Jessica Capshaw. It's okay. It's okay. You weren't here. You were here.

[Jessica Capshaw]

But that's honestly, that's what I'm doing. When Matt reverses and I'm like, it's okay, Camilla.

[Camille Luddington]

You'll be fine.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Okay.

[Camille Luddington]

He's almost done. By the time you get out of the car, you're mad at him for sure.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I mean, I think. I do think the word gets thrown around too much. We've sort of like, it's encompassed way, way more than it really should.

[Camille Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camille Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camille Luddington]

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[Camille Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Danielle Fishel]

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[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Camille Luddington]

Okay, I have a question. I mean this is like, I want to say it's old news, but honestly, it's the kind of news that keeps on giving. I don't know that it's going to be over. I think we, I think it's still got legs. I think it's to be on. Well, both you and I have said that we have been cheated on in our lives and this Coldplay concert.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Jessica, that, that is not going away. That has legs.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Because more information keeps coming out and then like statements are getting released and.

[Camille Luddington]

Like why, why are we so obsessed?

[Jessica Capshaw]

Because of the audacity.

[Camille Luddington]

Huh?

[Jessica Capshaw]

Like, you really think like if you're gonna cheat on me, be in like the corner of like a shady bar and like be trying to hide it if you're in, I don't know, clearly a good section of the Coldplay concert, right? Like, yeah. First off, I'm pissed off because you have good seats.

[Camille Luddington]

Right, right, right.

[Jessica Capshaw]

And you're like, like that. All huggy, huggy and smiling and listening to no, not on my watch.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I also think in the world climate of. Of. Of misbehavior, you know, there's so many people who seem to be getting away with stuff.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah, right.

[Camille Luddington]

Like, there's just so many things and so many different areas of life where it's like, people do things and like, okay, like, they just get away with it. Or like the court of public opinion doesn't even, like, up. They're not even upset or they move on or whatever. And everyone comes up with their ideas or reasons why that is. But, you know, who knows? But for some reason, this couple seems to have gotten the vast majority, or at least the very vocal majority to be like, no, you don't get away with this. You are going to be held accountable, and you did this, and this is not okay. And they're just rolling with it.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Do you know what? I have a theory on it, though, because I don't think it's just two people cheating. I think it's the fact. And maybe wrong because I just made this up in my head. I think it's the fact that she's HR for a company, that he's a CEO and people are like. And that's corporate America.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah.

[Jessica Capshaw]

No, no, no. That's exactly what it is in a Coldplay concert hug. And I think that is what, for some people is really triggering. And you can use the word like it just. Like it's. It's more than just like, you're potentially having an affair.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I do feel, I have to say, though, I did see a picture of the lady and she has young kids.

[Camille Luddington]

And I felt just the woman and the head of hr.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I. And it just made me.

[Camille Luddington]

She married, too. I don't know the whole story.

[Jessica Capshaw]

She is married, too.

[Camille Luddington]

Oh, they're both married.

[Jessica Capshaw]

They're both married. And she has kids that are, like, young. And it just made me like, just the whole, like, public scrutiny of it is intense. But I think that CEO. CEO and hr. Part of it is of a.

[Camille Luddington]

Part of the story.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah. Is what's making it stick.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah. Yeah. And I wouldn't be me if I didn't bring up this part, which is like. And I think it's kind of fascinating is like, listen, people cheat. Right? Like, this is not. This is. This is completely not a new thing. And, and, and sometimes we're willing to just be like, yeah, oh, they cheated, and it was no big deal. But I think that's what I'm trying to say is, like, this, for some reason is Just like people really, really, really. And, and I'm not without. I know this one. Maybe this is provocative. I'm not without empathy. I mean, I agree it's audacious. The two things can be true. It's audacious and it's hurtful. And you and I have both said being cheated on is the worst. I think personally, like, triggering part, although this didn't trigger me, is how public.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I think that's what it is.

[Camille Luddington]

If you would, if you weren't just feeling your own personal pain, like someone just cheated on me. Like my personal pain of being cheated on was small and my own personal pain and I was the only one that was, you know, living with it. And if it was with the whole world, I think it would just be so horrible. But that's where I say, on the other side of the coin, I have this empathy for that, for the people who did it too. Because I'm like, ugh. Your audacity and your, this, this terrible thing that you've done is now going to hurt so many people that you love. And there's no doubt, there's no way that you're escaping that. You're gonna have to live so publicly with the fact that you made this terrible choice and now in perpetuity, you will have been the Coldplay cheaters.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah, that's terrible. Like, everyone loses.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I know, I know, I know. There's, there's no, nobody's winning in that situation. I think that, I think when something's up for public consumption like that people are 100 projecting. Right? Because I'm like the audacity. If anybody, everyone, you know, it's like you can't help but do that. And then you're so frustrated. You're so angry. And I, I honestly, I hope for everyone involved, it, it probably does go away and it doesn't have likes and it will. Right. Like it's a news cycle. I think that people were just so sure. Shocked at, Shocked at, like. Well, I. Shocked at the way they got caught, to be honest.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah. Well, it does seem like a complete one in a million. I also think I'm gonna throw in there. I think people are, I see on, on, on all the socials. I think people are also very taken aback by their interest in it. I am, I'm. I'm taken aback by why I care. I'm taken aback.

[Danielle Fishel]

Why.

[Camille Luddington]

I've asked one more follow up question.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I think it's because of the CEO, HR thing. I do. I think if they were just like in The. Here's the thing that I said to somebody. I said, you know, what is the. And I don't know why I care about this part, because it's like a mood point. But, like, if they had honestly just like, waved at the camera, I thought that joked. I don't even think it would have gotten any traction. But they full on. The guy hit the floor. He almost knocked himself out. It was so obvious in two seconds that they were having an affair.

[Camille Luddington]

Yes.

[Jessica Capshaw]

And then Chris Martin said, I mean.

[Camille Luddington]

Well, but that's what set it all up, right?

[Jessica Capshaw]

He's like, either they're camera shy or something like that, or I'm having an affair.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah. What kind of psychic powers did he have? Oh, I agree with you, though. If they just carried on, like every other kiss cam and like, whatever. I think that I. For sure. No doubt. No way. No how someone was going to see them and be like, was that so. And so that I saw on the. And I mean, listen, they were caught. They were caught no matter how.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yes, but if you just done like a wave. If you just On a wave, you could have played it off like, sorry, we were just like kind of dancing clothes. And I'm sorry about that. The fact that you literally.

[Camille Luddington]

What do you think you would have done? The wife or.

[Jessica Capshaw]

If I'd been in that situation?

[Camille Luddington]

No, like, I mean, in.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I'm at cold.

[Camille Luddington]

I'm not a cheater. It's not my thing.

[Jessica Capshaw]

But, like, me and you were having an affair and where your arms wrapped around.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah, I have my arms wrapped around you.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I don't think I would have thought to wave with you. I think I would have hit the floor.

[Camille Luddington]

No, you would have been turning.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Oh, I would have been the one. Why am I turning?

[Camille Luddington]

I would have hit the floor.

[Jessica Capshaw]

No, I think we both would have hit the floor. You just not have seen us anymore. We have disappeared.

[Camille Luddington]

See, this is why people are talking about it. It's. It just doesn't stop. It doesn't.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Well, this is why we can't have an affair together, Jess, because we will get caught.

[Camille Luddington]

By the way, I'm just gonna say. I know we're on the topic of triggers, but I just. Affairs sound terrible that I can't.

[Jessica Capshaw]

The worst. Why would you.

[Camille Luddington]

How are you supposed to keep that up?

[Jessica Capshaw]

Also, I can't. Like, I'm not a good liar. Like, I. I can't even do a surprise. Like, the guilt I would feel over anything. Like, I buy Matt a birthday gift and I tell him as I'm walking through the door, what it is like, I cannot keep anything secret. I'm like, this is a shoe. You know what I mean?

[Camille Luddington]

He's like, just one, Just one. I got you a shoe.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Talk about compartmentalizing.

[Camille Luddington]

Yeah.

[Jessica Capshaw]

How you can come home and like be with your family and know that you're doing that. I just don't, I don't understand it.

[Camille Luddington]

No, but you know what? You just, just going back to what we said before. You never know what people are coming from or going to. And it definitely, as I understand it, it takes two to tango. And you know, there's of course there's always more than you know and think. So I, I, I do have to say not to, to gloss over it. I, I wish everyone in this scenario, I, I hope, I hope that the news cycle stops and I wish them grace and healing. Yeah, it's gotta be just horrible. The duck and roll. I think that was what gave people permission to laugh at it. Yes, it was the duck and roll. The duck and roll was funny. It was never not gonna be casual.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Wave would have, they would have moved on. The duck and roll was terrible.

[Camille Luddington]

There's the duck and roll. The army crawl out and like it.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Was just not that we're giving tips to people now.

[Camille Luddington]

I feel like we're like giving like.

[Jessica Capshaw]

This is how you do it better. Next time you're cheating on the kiss cam, tune in to call it what it is for the tips. Don't do it.

[Camille Luddington]

We got. Okay, then we're ending there. We're ending there. We're end ending there.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Oh my God. All right, well let's call heard it here first.

[Camille Luddington]

Let's call it the end of the the episode foreign. Hey, can we talk about plan B for a second? What exactly is it?

[Jessica Capshaw]

Okay, Plan B is emergency contraception you take after unprotected sex. Think of it as backup birth control. It works by temporarily delaying ovulation to help prevent pregnancy before it starts.

[Camille Luddington]

And it's available right off the shelf.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yep. It's at all major retailers in all 50 US states. No prescription ID or age requirement.

[Camille Luddington]

Ah, together we've got this.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Follow plan B on insta at Plan B. One step. Use as directed.

[Danielle Fishel]

Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and safeway. Now through August 12th. Get great savings on your favorite self care Items and earn 4 times points when you shop in store or online. Shop for items like Neutrogena cleansing and makeup removing towelettes. Dove Men 2 in 1 shampoo and conditioner. Dove Shampoo, Tresemme shampoo method body wash and Suave Body wash and earn 4 times points. Use these points for discounts on groceries or gas. Offer ends August 12th. Restrictions apply. Offers may vary. Visit albertsons or safeway.com for more details.

[Ryder Strong]

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[Camille Luddington]

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[Ryder Strong]

Ah, but do you know what our most important ingredient is?

[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camille Luddington]

Way better than that. Yes, Almond Joy is made with almonds and Joy.

[Ryan Seacrest]

Lenovo is built for creators who don't wait for inspiration. They chase it with inventive tech, built in AI tools and seamless performance. Lenovo devices powered by Intel Core Ultra processors are designed to bring your wildest ideas to life faster. That's the power of Lenovo with Intel inside, enjoy flexible financing, rewards on every purchase and free shipping. And students get special offers when you create an [e-mail] lenovo.

[Ryder Strong]

Lenovo.

[Jessica Capshaw]

This is an iHeart podcast.