Call It with Chris Carmack

Summary

Call It What It Is: Episode with Chris Carmack

Release Date: March 24, 2025

Hosts: Jessica Capshaw & Camilla Luddington

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Introduction to Guest: Chris Carmack

In this episode of Call It What It Is, hosts Jessica Capshaw and Camilla Luddington welcome special guest Chris Carmack, best known for his role on Grey's Anatomy. The trio engage in a lively and candid conversation, blending professional insights with personal anecdotes, providing listeners with an intimate look behind the scenes of their beloved show.

---

Joining Grey's Anatomy

Jessica Capshaw initiates the discussion by addressing Chris's unique journey to Grey's Anatomy, noting, "When they offered you the role, did you have to audition?" (07:30)

Chris Carmack responds candidly, sharing that he didn't audition in the traditional sense but was directly approached based on his previous work:
"When I was asked to come on board, I didn't even have to audition. I had watched the first few seasons and knew the dynamics, so it felt like a natural fit." (07:32)

Camilla adds context about the show's tendency to build strong relationships among characters, emphasizing the importance of chemistry:
"Most of the time when someone gets hired, they're there for someone. Were you brought in as part of a love triangle?" (08:28)

---

Love Triangles and Character Dynamics

The conversation delves into Chris's character arc, particularly his involvement in love triangles within the show. Chris explains his role as the "triangle" with Meredith and Giacomo DeLuca:
"With Giacomo, there was this evolving friendship that eventually became a complex romantic storyline. It was intriguing to navigate." (08:40)

Camilla humorously references his role, teasing about foot cramps during passionate scenes:
"The love scenes look super passionate, but Chris is always in pain with a foot cramp." (06:45)

Chris laughs and shares behind-the-scenes struggles:
"Biting my lip and managing the cramps while maintaining the romance was a challenge, but it added depth to the character." (06:57)

---

Behind the Scenes: Friendships and On-Set Dynamics

The hosts transition to discussing their real-life friendships and how it translates to on-screen chemistry. Jessica reflects on their camaraderie:
"Our friendship really shines through in how we interact on the show. It's rare to see such genuine connections depicted." (25:07)

Chris echoes this sentiment, highlighting the benefit of long-term collaborations:
"Acting alongside friends makes scenes more authentic and enjoyable. It’s easier to build trust and deliver impactful performances." (25:01)

They also touch upon the challenges of integrating new actors into an established cast. Camilla shares her initial experiences feeling like the "new guy":
"It took years to feel fully integrated, but once I did, the dynamic became so much more natural." (36:06)

Chris adds insights into evolving within a long-running series:
"Your work becomes more mature as you grow with the characters. It’s rewarding to see how far we've come together." (36:27)

---

Teasing the Season Finale

As the episode progresses, the conversation shifts to upcoming storylines and season finales. Camilla teases the finale, mentioning,
"We have a really great guest star that you guys are gonna be so excited about." (54:35)

Chris builds anticipation by describing the finale as "super dramatic" and different from previous episodes:
"The finale is gripping and unrelenting. It's packed with twists that will leave everyone on the edge of their seats." (55:29)

They discuss the intense emotions and high stakes involved in the finale, reflecting on their collaborative efforts to deliver a memorable episode.

---

Rapid-Fire Questions and Personal Insights

Towards the end of the episode, the hosts engage in a rapid-fire segment, addressing questions from fans:

• Would you recollaborate with Adam Brody from The O.C.?
  Chris: "Of course I would. I'd love to work together again." (57:24)

• If Lincoln left Grace Lo, how would his story end?
  Chris: "He finally follows his passion as a baseball player, getting recruited into the major leagues." (57:49)

• Who from the cast would you trust to babysit your kids?
  Camilla: "I'd trust Bailey."
  Chris: "Definitely Bailey." (58:15)

• Which cast member would you pick as your best man if you were to get married today?
  Camilla: "Jim Pickens."
  Chris: "Jim always looks on point and would be great standing up there in a suit." (61:39)

• Do you think Joe and Link are end game?
  Both: "We do." (62:17)

• If you could be a live-action Disney character, who would it be?
  Chris: "Finn Rider."
  Camilla: "Rapunzel." (63:50)

This segment showcases their playful chemistry and the deep mutual respect they share, both on and off the screen.

---

Conclusion

The episode wraps up with heartfelt thanks and final thoughts. Jessica expresses gratitude for Chris's participation, while Camilla emphasizes the enduring bonds formed through their work. They leave listeners eagerly anticipating future episodes and the continuing adventures of their favorite characters on Grey's Anatomy.

---

Notable Quotes

• Jessica Capshaw: "You are so winning. I mean, I watch the O.C. and..." (10:41)
• Chris Carmack: "Knees... I get a lot of foot cramps." (08:40)
• Camilla Luddington: "We get to play comedy and drama. And I actually feel really fulfilled as an actor." (38:05)
• Chris Carmack: "When you've been on a show for years, your backstory and relationships become second nature." (36:27)

---

This episode of Call It What It Is offers fans an in-depth look at the dynamics of Grey's Anatomy, the challenges and joys of long-term acting partnerships, and the personal connections that drive compelling storytelling. Whether you're a die-hard fan or new to their work, Jessica, Camilla, and Chris provide an engaging and entertaining listen that celebrates friendship, passion, and the relentless pursuit of excellence.

Transcript

[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

Capshaw and Camille Ludington and iHeartRadio podcast.

[Camilla Luddington]

Hello, hello, hello, hello, Call it crew. And welcome to another episode of Call it what It Is.

[Jessica Capshaw]

We got a special guest today.

[Camilla Luddington]

We got a Gray's Anatomy guest. Come on. What? Come on. The family. What's funny is, is that he should be here right now and.

[Jessica Capshaw]

But he's not. Why are you alone sitting on that couch?

[Camilla Luddington]

Well, I feel like I've been stood up, which is, you know, embarrassing.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Well, and I was gonna start with the fact that it's embarrassing that I'm sort of the third in this situation.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah, it's okay. It's gonna be having.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Who would I be a third for?

[Camilla Luddington]

Mr. Chris Carmack.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Chris Car.

[Camilla Luddington]

Well, here. He was supposed to be here, and I'm gonna give him. Because traffic. He's not. Traffic is terrible in la. And he keeps texting me and I'm like, you're already this up, Chris. You're already. I'm already. And so he should be here. Right here. Yeah. Yeah.

[Jessica Capshaw]

But he's not. There's an empty space next to you.

[Camilla Luddington]

But I'm gon him. I want to ask him. Not just gray stuff. I mean, I'm going to tease some stuff for the season, but we got to get into the OC we got to get into all the things Nashville.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I watched that religiously. Like, I watched it appointment television. I watched it on the night I was into it.

[Camilla Luddington]

Did you ever audition for it? I feel like you could have.

[Jessica Capshaw]

No, no. Because I think at that point I probably would have been like an. Like a. You know, I don't. I don't think I could have played high school. I think I would have been, you know, a college girl.

[Camilla Luddington]

I don't know. I feel like they were all 45, other than like, you know, it's like still those. Let's see. Is he here? Oh, he's here. He's got to use the bathroom. I don't even. Tick tock Carmack. Oh, my God.

[Jessica Capshaw]

One of those has to use the restroom first.

[Camilla Luddington]

This is. I know. This is what I have to deal with on a daily basis.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Oh, I have a feeling he's going to come in and be really, really, like, great and kind and winning. And smiling.

[Camilla Luddington]

We'll see.

[Jessica Capshaw]

And then also, like, a cool drink of water. Is that what we say?

[Camilla Luddington]

A very cool drink. Wow. I feel like that's like, I'll drink water. A tall drink of water. Yeah, sure.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Well, I'm going to explain to people what. What they're listening to is. They're listening to us talk about two beautiful people on a couch next to each other. And I think you're just picking apart things for no reason. I think you both look fantastic.

[Camilla Luddington]

Thanks.

[Chris Carmack]

Stop.

[Camilla Luddington]

Okay.

[Jessica Capshaw]

And again, I think you look really great together.

[Camilla Luddington]

We do. Thanks. I agree.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I think this works.

[Camilla Luddington]

Okay, so we have to introduce him because we did a mini introduction. So Chris is here now and he's taken about five minutes just to get situated.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah. You know, well, you know how uncomfortable I am in, like, all situations. I'm usually, like, cramping and.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah. The funny thing is we had. So I had Matt on the pod. Okay. I had him on the pod, like, two weeks ago. And his first question, which we joked about was like, I was like, listen, you're gonna come on the pod and we're gonna make it so sexy. And he was like, how are the chairs for my back? And I feel like Chris can relate because nobody knows that in most days on Grey's Anatomy you're in pain.

[Chris Carmack]

It's true. It's true. I don't know if this will still be rolling when I get up from this couch, but it would sound something like this.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I feel like I'm dating, like an 80 year old on the show.

[Jessica Capshaw]

What do you credit your pain to? Because Matt has a whole back thing. So what's yours?

[Chris Carmack]

Knees.

[Camilla Luddington]

Knees. The knees. Your feet. You get a lot of foot cramps.

[Chris Carmack]

I get a lot of foot cramps.

[Camilla Luddington]

If we do a love scene, nobody knows this. We should talk about when we do a love scene on Grey's Anatomy. It looks that we're really. It looks like we're super passionate. Right. It actually is because Chris is in so much pain. He always gets a foot cramp.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah, I. I bite my lip and I'm like, yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

And they're like, God, they're so romantic together. I'm like, no, Chris really needs to scene to end.

[Chris Carmack]

So much love.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

Because there's so much love.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Ecstasy and pain so close together.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah. Okay.

[Chris Carmack]

The agony and the ecstasy.

[Camilla Luddington]

The agony.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yes, absolutely. Chris, you get the phone call.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yes.

[Jessica Capshaw]

That they want you to come to Grey's Anatomy.

[Chris Carmack]

Yes, yes.

[Jessica Capshaw]

How much do you know and what do you know?

[Chris Carmack]

Well, when I Was asked to come on board.

[Camilla Luddington]

You didn't even have to audition.

[Chris Carmack]

I didn't know.

[Jessica Capshaw]

No, I had a feeling. I have the people like you. I'm so happy for you, Chris.

[Chris Carmack]

People like you. I'm so happy.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I'm just happy. I'm not, I'm not happy for you.

[Camilla Luddington]

I'm not, I'm happy.

[Jessica Capshaw]

You're an offer only actor. Go ahead. I was incoming calls for Chris Carmack.

[Chris Carmack]

I was, I hadn't seen the show in quite a long time. So I had a lot of catching up to do because I had watched, you know, the first few seasons back in the day and then, you know, and then I had to catch up. So I was watching season 14 with I think it was your wedding and was obviously not expecting to end up a love interest for Joe. But I knew we had this past, this past together and this friendship. And of course you suspect at some point that it's going to be a foil for Joe's relationship. Like maybe it's going to spoil Joe and Alex. Little trickery that developed in its own.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Way when new actors get hired because the show leans so heavily on creating great couples. Most of the times when someone gets hired, they're, they're there for someone. So did they did. Were you there for someone?

[Chris Carmack]

I was there as like the, as the triangle, the love triangle with Meredith.

[Camilla Luddington]

With the thruffle.

[Chris Carmack]

With Giacomo DeLuca. DeLuca and Meredith were kind of having a thing and then.

[Camilla Luddington]

Wait, I have a question. I have a question. Did you know who was going to win? Because you did. You lost that thruffle.

[Chris Carmack]

No, I didn't. I did.

[Jessica Capshaw]

The offer would have been totally not as valuable.

[Chris Carmack]

I lost terribly. I, I, I, I don't know what to attribute it to.

[Jessica Capshaw]

It might have been the, another one.

[Chris Carmack]

It was the agony.

[Jessica Capshaw]

You had bad knees.

[Chris Carmack]

The agony. Yeah, exactly. No, I wasn't groaning as much back then.

[Jessica Capshaw]

He was. And spry.

[Chris Carmack]

I was younger.

[Camilla Luddington]

And we just talked about this too.

[Chris Carmack]

We were just watching some of our old scenes side.

[Camilla Luddington]

We were, we were on set and we were watching our old scenes on Monday and we were talking about how.

[Chris Carmack]

I was like, I was like, look how we've aged. I was like, look how skinny I was.

[Camilla Luddington]

And I was like, you were really skinny. You did. Like a lot.

[Jessica Capshaw]

But just for the listeners out there, you're completing the fantasy people have about actors, which is that you're admitting that you sat there watching old scenes of yourselves.

[Camilla Luddington]

Well, actually, no, wait, no.

[Jessica Capshaw]

For research.

[Camilla Luddington]

No, we don't.

[Jessica Capshaw]

For fun.

[Chris Carmack]

Just to admire ourselves.

[Camilla Luddington]

We just Loved our work so much. No, we were. We're going into hiatus when we're potentially out there auditioning, and so we were talking about past scenes and past work, and sometimes you're like, I actually felt, like, really great about this scene. And then you watch it back and you're like, maybe not so much.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

Maybe rethink that.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

In your mind, you're like, I know what my reel's gonna be. I'm gonna cut this scene. This scene. This scene. And then you look back at it, you're like.

[Camilla Luddington]

Actually, I was gonna say, if it.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Wasn'T as good as you remembered it, I think I would blame the editor.

[Chris Carmack]

That's what I would say.

[Camilla Luddington]

It was great. Exactly.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

100.

[Camilla Luddington]

That makes sense. Exactly. Right? Okay. So you got brought in from Meredith.

[Jessica Capshaw]

You lost.

[Camilla Luddington]

I lost.

[Chris Carmack]

I was beaten.

[Jessica Capshaw]

But they liked you so much that they were like, we're gonna keep the guy even if. Even if he loses. We're just. He's so winning. Because, by the way, let me say this because I can say this from the outside.

[Camilla Luddington]

You.

[Jessica Capshaw]

You are so winning. I mean, I watch the O.C.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah, just a minute. She's a huge O.C. fan.

[Chris Carmack]

Awesome.

[Camilla Luddington]

Awesome.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I know. I also am just sort of wildly impressed by the breadth and scope of where you started. I mean, I could spend the whole hour talking about that. Like, how you started singing. I mean, I was listening. It's funny. You were giving me kind of. You were giving James Marsden y vibes for me.

[Chris Carmack]

Because I like that.

[Camilla Luddington]

I like that.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Right? How about that? Well, because he was on Dax Shepard's podcast talking about Paradise. He was talking about having been. Having grown up not in LA or New York, and having been a sporty young guy who also was really interested in theater. And so I was just sort of like, again, we don't need to go there. But I just think it's so. I think it's so interesting how we all start in this business and. And that we get to be all different sorts of things. And that you were an athlete, and then you kind of got into. Then you got to New York, and then you started modeling, and then you were in the theater, and then you were on tv, and now here you are. That's so. That's a lot of. That's a lot of stuff. And all very cool stuff.

[Chris Carmack]

And. And also fast. Because I'm so young, I've done it. Yeah. I've done it in such.

[Camilla Luddington]

Graduated from Tish.

[Chris Carmack]

No, it's. It's. Yeah, it's all. It's you know, over many, many years and, and, you know, I kind of consider myself a bit of a journeyman actor. You know, I've done theater all over and I'm fortunate to have been, you know, series regular on three shows now. Which is, which is. Which is pretty good.

[Camilla Luddington]

That's amazing. I can't say that.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Which looks easy out there to people who are listening, but it actually is not.

[Camilla Luddington]

No, it's not.

[Jessica Capshaw]

It is not an easy thing.

[Chris Carmack]

Here's an interesting factor because you're asking about how on Degrees I have never, other than pilots that didn't make it, I have never actually booked a series regular role. I've come onto every show as a guest star and then been made a series regular.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Well, by the way, we share this in common.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

Is that right?

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah. No way.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Seriously, all the pilots that I ever did. Nope, Nope. I'd be number one on the call sheet. I'm like, this is my chair.

[Chris Carmack]

This is.

[Jessica Capshaw]

It didn't get picked up.

[Camilla Luddington]

There's something about us that screams we've got to like test drive them temporary.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Right?

[Camilla Luddington]

Like we're test drive doctors.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah, a little bit.

[Jessica Capshaw]

A little bit. Just a little bit.

[Camilla Luddington]

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[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

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[Camilla Luddington]

So let's pause the annoying everyday drama and play the drama you want. Hulu. The drama you want. Okay, so you got we have to talk about your big love interest on the show before Joe, right? Which was actually Amelia. Do you know this Jess? Do you know that him And Amelia have a kid together? No. Her eyes tell me.

[Chris Carmack]

No.

[Camilla Luddington]

She didn't know that. She thought you went straight to Josh.

[Chris Carmack]

Her eyes told me. Amelia.

[Jessica Capshaw]

No, I love Amelia. I love Amelia. Listen, I could have been Amelia's love interest. I love Amelia. Yeah, I know. I was. I was focusing on the journeyman part of Chris Carmack. I was talking. I was. That was. I was focusing on the early development. I was also wondering if maybe perhaps in some Abercrombie and Fitch store during my. My. My nascent years. I was. I was like, under a big, giant billboard of you at some point in my life. I was thinking, as I picked out my khakis, were you just right there behind me? Maybe.

[Chris Carmack]

You probably was. You might have carried me out of the store.

[Camilla Luddington]

You probably did.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I bet I did.

[Camilla Luddington]

I bet you were, like, on. No, I used to cut the bags, because that was back in the day. And put them on the wall. You're probably on my wall. I just realized in this moment.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah, I probably was.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Look at how so sure.

[Camilla Luddington]

He's like, yeah, that was me.

[Chris Carmack]

No, I remember back. I mean, years ago, I was. I was dating a girl, and we were looking at old pictures, and this was back when old pictures were actually photographs, right?

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

In, like, in college. And I was looking at her in her dorm room, and I was like, what's that on the wall behind?

[Jessica Capshaw]

And it was you.

[Chris Carmack]

It was the bag. Yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

But I was. I GUESS I was 18, 19 or 19, and I was in New York. I was. I was in New York. I was at the Tisch School of Studying acting.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I'm telling you. So impressive.

[Camilla Luddington]

I know. Very impressive.

[Chris Carmack]

And actually, somebody came up to me with a flyer for an open casting call for Abercrombie. It was another student at the school, and she gave it to me, and she said, you would be crazy if you didn't go to this. And. And I went, oh, okay, maybe I will. And me. And we. And one of my buddies went and stood in line, and. And they took some pictures. And then I got a call from an agency because I didn't have a modeling agency. They said they want to book you for this job. I think I took a little bit of time off a class, and we shot for a week in Manhattan so I didn't have to travel or go, oh, okay.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

And I just showed up for call times and put on, you know, tons of layers, clothes and ties that were gigantic. Or like a. Like, it was a very preppy kind.

[Camilla Luddington]

Of thing, I remember.

[Chris Carmack]

And then, like, Frolicking in the fountain. And again, these were.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Okay, so it worked.

[Chris Carmack]

I got so much crap from friends, which was hilarious. There's one. There's one picture of me, like, in ice skates and lacing. Ice skates and boxers.

[Camilla Luddington]

Oh, my God. Yeah. Because we all. And everyone.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah. And peanut butter and jelly.

[Jessica Capshaw]

They go together.

[Camilla Luddington]

Okay, so I'm looking at a picture of Chris right now. He's. He's topless, just holding a trumpet with.

[Chris Carmack]

With a group of shirtless men on a basketball court. I think we were going for, like a. Like a boys to men Motown Philly kind of thing with a big band.

[Camilla Luddington]

I'm not getting that, Chris. I'm not getting that at all. I don't know what I'm getting. I'm going through all your. Okay.

[Chris Carmack]

Oh, there's the hockey sticks.

[Camilla Luddington]

There's the hockey.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Oh, wait, hang on.

[Camilla Luddington]

I look like I just woke up. That is so ridiculous. Oh, you look like a baby. Baby Chris. I'm excited for, like, our history just to be like Chris Cormac topless.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I'm gonna show you something.

[Camilla Luddington]

Devices.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Is this agony or ecstasy?

[Chris Carmack]

Ooh. Oh, good question.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I feel like. I don't know.

[Camilla Luddington]

That's a foot cramp.

[Chris Carmack]

That's a foot cramp.

[Camilla Luddington]

That's what I often see, so I'm familiar with that face.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Okay. All right, Wait, hold on. I know we're all over the place.

[Chris Carmack]

But you think it's my O face, but it's my owl face.

[Camilla Luddington]

It's the outfit.

[Jessica Capshaw]

It's your. Ow. You just have to cut.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah, you have to cut before the screen. Yeah, yeah, yeah, before the screens.

[Jessica Capshaw]

But I'm. Now that I'm reacquainting myself with these images, I definitely, definitely walked out of a store holding.

[Camilla Luddington]

Holding you. Then you ended up on the wall. Yeah.

[Jessica Capshaw]

You were on a bag. You were on a bag.

[Camilla Luddington]

Okay, okay, so you.

[Jessica Capshaw]

So then you. So.

[Camilla Luddington]

Okay, all right.

[Jessica Capshaw]

You didn't get Ellen. You didn't get Meredith.

[Chris Carmack]

No.

[Jessica Capshaw]

And you went on to Amelia.

[Chris Carmack]

I mean. Yeah, that's the short and sweet. Well, so. So they brought me on for like a 10 episode arc. Like, that was the original thing. And I don't know why, but the. The Ellen thing did not work out much faster. Yeah, then they were expecting. They were expecting to play it out. So I think that it was kind of like, okay, well, that ended really fast. Like, what. What else could we do with them?

[Jessica Capshaw]

And didn't work.

[Chris Carmack]

And. Yeah. And then they were like, let's, let's, let's. Let's Try him and Amelia. And it was in it. It was great. It was really cute.

[Camilla Luddington]

Watch your mouth, Chris.

[Chris Carmack]

But it was the wrong. But it was the wrong.

[Jessica Capshaw]

She has a better memory than couple.

[Camilla Luddington]

Exactly. Say it again. No, I know. I. I think that that's. That happens on our show a lot. There's a little bit of chess that gets played. Right. So you're paired with somebody. Maybe it works out. Maybe you don't even get to that point yet. And then it's sort of like, well, who's free to play with? And then they watch that chemistry. And the truth is, is that you and Katarina had really good chemistry together.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

And you had some great storylines. And then Joe and Alex broke up. And then I think it freed Joe up. And then it was like, well, this is a really messy storyline potential. And I feel like sometimes we lean in on the show to Messi. What makes for like the better storyline. Right. To like, mess with it and have you guys break up. And her date of people. Er. And so that's sort of. That's my memory of sort of what happened.

[Chris Carmack]

And also like, they really. We were leaning into. Link really wanted to be married and settled and that's what he wanted. And of course Katharine's character, Emilia did not want that for herself. And she never really has.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah. That character is tracked that she.

[Chris Carmack]

You know, so that was our. That was like our big conflict. And it had really. I mean, how many rings did I have to propose to her? You know, it really.

[Camilla Luddington]

I know this. But. But Link on the show proposed to Emilia with three different rings and was like any one of these. And she was still like, none. She was like, there's no ring.

[Chris Carmack]

Pulled out all the stuff.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yes.

[Chris Carmack]

He had the kids with him. It's like he pulled out all the stuff. But. But the answer was. It was a hard no.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Okay.

[Camilla Luddington]

I do remember Krista Vernoff. I heard Krista Vernoff calling me. I just pulled into the lot and like, hey, I have a pitch of a story for you. And I was like, okay. And she was like, what do you think of Lincoln, Joe? And at the time I was like, that's tough because I like the drama of that. But we had a stat truly established that they were friends at the time.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

And we'd been playing that and we'd had some really nice moments. Like, she really leaned on him when Alex left. And so to sort of hard right turn it. I was wondering if it was even going to work is the truth. But I was game. Of course.

[Jessica Capshaw]

To try whatever you were working on, a different kind of chemistry you were doing. You were going.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yes.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Premisery.

[Camilla Luddington]

And I didn't know if we could, like, how it relied on the storyline and the writing, too, but, like, if we had established that so well.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah, we really had. We, you know, we dug into the friendship of it all and, like, the. And the platonic friendship of it all, and. And it was playing well, and the fans loved it and we loved it. Yeah. So it was. It was a little bit like, oh, we have to say goodbye to this thing that we really love. But.

[Camilla Luddington]

But actually, I have to say, I feel like one really nice thing about the two of them together is that we have managed to keep some of that.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

Like, they still. So that thing that I thought you.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Were your best friend.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yes. Like, that thing that I thought that we were going to say goodbye to, we got to keep.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah. And. And what's interesting, too, is, you know, of course we had to struggle and have our.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

Have our fights along the way to get to where we are. And I remember just working with you on those, and sometimes it felt like, oh, this feels like, would I be this mad?

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

Do you know, because we really did have that friendship not only baked into the characters, but our time together as actors, too. And it felt like we had to reach a little bit to find the conflict because the characters really are so good and easy with one another.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah, it's nice.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Oh, man, that's so great.

[Camilla Luddington]

It's good. Like, I don't fight with you.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I don't. I was. I was like. While you were just talking, I was trying to think of, like, a time we fought. I don't think she's very easy to fight with.

[Camilla Luddington]

Are you kidding?

[Jessica Capshaw]

I don't find you easy to fight. I don't want to fight with you. No, no, no, no. I listened. I listened to your podcast. Matt came on and did an episode. I laughed so hard. I mean, I truly was laughing. I could not believe how hard I was laughing. But even if you're not, I. I don't know. You really fight.

[Camilla Luddington]

I think. Honestly, I don't see you as a fight. There's a cultural thing. I think you're spicy. As a Brit, we kind of roll with the punches. I have to say, I don't. I don't think that we're easily offended. Except for my dad. My dad's always really offended at everything. I do have to say one of my favorite scenes, though, that I did with Chris, that we laughed about a lot was there right around the time when he was like, still in love with Amelia, but Joe was realizing she had feelings with him. You had a scene that was like completely typical Grey's Anatomy where he. I'm like, sort of kind of suggesting like, hey, maybe just look at what's right in front of you and maybe fall in love with that. And me, right. And Chris had to go, you're right. I love. And then there was like this massive pause where you think he's gonna say, Joe. And he goes, amelia. And he's like too. He's like so close to my face. And we did pee our pants at that.

[Chris Carmack]

Oh, yeah, A lot.

[Camilla Luddington]

It was so awkward.

[Chris Carmack]

Do you remember our rehearsals?

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

I love Amelia. The right turn.

[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

They drop a new seasonal collection so there's always new styles to check out.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I personally get a little girly. I love a bow, I love a little lace, I love the way it fits and I always love knowing that I feel supported underneath my clothes.

[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

Offer ends April 1st. Go to CheapCaribbean.com to start saving this.

[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

So let's pause the annoying everyday drama and play the drama you want. Hulu, the drama you want.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Do you remember your first kiss on the show?

[Camilla Luddington]

I do remember our first kiss on the show, but it felt weird because it almost felt like I Jo was taking advantage of Link a little bit because he's upset over Emelia and he's like five whiskeys in and for some reason Joe's a little bit like, now's my chance, now's the time.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

So it didn't feel romantic.

[Chris Carmack]

Actually, you're gonna have to remind me.

[Camilla Luddington]

Where do you remember? Okay, I will.

[Chris Carmack]

Where was the scene?

[Camilla Luddington]

We're in Jackson's apartment and we're sat on the floor next to each other and you're really upset about Amelia. And then I think I go in for a kiss with you and we start making out and then they end up being on the floor together. It was so significant to.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Any bells for him. Looking at his face.

[Camilla Luddington]

Chris literally can't remember anything.

[Jessica Capshaw]

He might be more goldfish than me.

[Camilla Luddington]

He is more goldfish than. You do not remember.

[Chris Carmack]

I mean, I remember the day.

[Camilla Luddington]

It was a Wednesday. Great.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah.

[Jessica Capshaw]

This is great.

[Chris Carmack]

I'll. I have to dig.

[Camilla Luddington]

No, don't worry about it, Chris.

[Jessica Capshaw]

This is not good for her self esteem.

[Chris Carmack]

I don't, I don't remember.

[Jessica Capshaw]

God's sake.

[Camilla Luddington]

Okay, just hit him with another.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I remember. I was gonna say, I remember Noah. Like, I. This isn't about me, but I was. I, I. Yeah, I definitely could not forget my first kiss on that show.

[Camilla Luddington]

Cali.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

That was so iconic, though.

[Jessica Capshaw]

That was a thing. Yeah, it was like we were at Joe's. It was like in the bathroom.

[Camilla Luddington]

Was it the first lesbian kiss on the show?

[Jessica Capshaw]

No, because she'd been with.

[Camilla Luddington]

No.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Erica. Oh, yeah, she'd been with Erica. And then Erica wasn't there anymore. And then I was there, and then I. I was like you. I was the guest star. And I didn't. I actually didn't. I didn't come for anyone. I came for a medical case, which, you know, I knew probably wasn't going to both.

[Chris Carmack]

So medical stay for day for the sex.

[Camilla Luddington]

That's the theme of our show. That's right.

[Chris Carmack]

That should be the tagline. Come for the medical stay for the six.

[Jessica Capshaw]

So when. So when you came and you knew you were. Did you. Did you love it right away? And like, did you know, I really want to stay here, so I need to. Did you feel that pressure? Like, I got to figure out who I'm going to be with? Because you do. I felt that pressure when I was there. Like, I remember people talking about it. Like, if you. Whenever was the Cali and I broke up, I remember someone. It probably was you being like, we got to be with someone. And I was like, wait, what? I always be on my own. Nope, can't be on your own. Not on that show.

[Camilla Luddington]

That is a good question. When you realize that it wasn't that Meredith had chosen somebody else, did you worry that that was your end on the show?

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah, I had no idea what the future on the show was going to be. And I'll say this, too. You say, like, did I immediately feel like it was the right place for me? The answer is like, no way. Because this show has Been on for so long. Yeah, yeah, for so long. And the characters that I've been working with have been on the show for so long. After I'd been on the show for six years, I remember turning to Kevin McKidd and saying, I finally don't feel like the new guy.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

It takes so long on a show like this.

[Camilla Luddington]

I agree.

[Chris Carmack]

To not feel like the new guy.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I agree with that.

[Chris Carmack]

And it wasn't because anybody made you feel uncomfortable. It's because it's so established. So established.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah, it's so.

[Jessica Capshaw]

And you know what? I'm not saying anything that hasn't been said before, but I haven't said it. I came on season five and because the show was such a huge hit and because it was actually sort of famous for having had some rocky behind the scenes action, like there was so much stuff happening, which I think is kind of typical of something that's that successful. But I remember coming in and there was such a. I don't think it's there anymore. But there was such a feeling of. There was like a tier system. Yeah. There was a hierarchy to who had been there, how long they'd been there, how comfortable they were or weren't. I mean, these were people who, on some level, again, because of just how successful the show was and how much was being thrown at them, that kind of. I don't know why everyone makes the analogy to war, but like, they'd kind of been to war and like they. They navigated all these things. And then I was kind of. I came after that. So I was. I too was new to that. And I completely agree with you. I did not feel firmly in place until many years into it.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

Like, I.

[Jessica Capshaw]

It was always the people who were there from the beginning, and then it was the new people that came in.

[Camilla Luddington]

I felt the hierarchy too, but I don't think that that exists now.

[Chris Carmack]

And I wouldn't personally describe my experience as a hierarchy.

[Jessica Capshaw]

No, I think it had gone by then.

[Camilla Luddington]

No, back. I think by then, back in season nine, when I joined, I think it was. I still felt that. Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

And something happens to. As an actor on a show when you've been on it for years, you know, your backstory and your relationships with all the other characters and actors becomes so ingrained and second nature. It actually. Your work gets better. Your work gets more mature. You don't have to do a lot of the work because, you know, I don't have to build these characters in my mind. I don't have to do the acting work. I've known them for seven years, and I know their characters, and I know everything we've been through together. We've actually acted those scenes together.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah, that's so well said. And I completely agree.

[Chris Carmack]

And coming onto a show like that, I remember just being blown away by the actors that were around me. I was. I said, oh, my God, they're so good. Everybody is so talented. And it's true.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I think they're so good, too.

[Camilla Luddington]

I think they're so good.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I mean, and the writing is so good, but there's also, you know, there's such. The storylines are so dramatic that you. You know, I think in the. In the hands of lesser actors, which I don't mean that unkindly, but, like, it's more the compliment. The actors are so great that when something crazy happens, like, there's. She's not my mother, she's my sister, whatever, you actually completely believe it because the acting is so good. You know, you're like, yeah, okay.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah, of course they are.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Of course they are.

[Camilla Luddington]

I also feel really lucky because. And we talked about this the other day because we shot together all on Monday, and some of our scenes were just ridiculous. Like, really, they're funny. Right. And we get to do the fact that on our show, we get to play comedy and drama.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

So that's not every show. Like, we're so lucky that we get those really deep, dramatic scenes, and then we get scenes that are completely ridiculous, that are so fun. And so I actually feel really fulfilled as an actor. Like, I feel like we get to do. We get to play a lot.

[Jessica Capshaw]

There is something to be said, what you just said, Chris, about the fact that, like, when you been playing a character for so long, you know them better than anyone. I remember it must have been when I was not feeling so new anymore. But there was, you know, because we get a somewhat new. I mean, there's a couple directors that come a couple times, but when you're shooting 24 episodes, you have a lot of different directors. And I remember it was a new director, and I don't know that they were a favorite, that they were someone who was just maybe not everybody's favorite.

[Camilla Luddington]

There's been some. We've cycled through.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah. We've had ones that just came, and maybe it just wasn't a good fit. Right. And this particular person who was not a good fit was giving me a little bit of direction. And I remember being like, oh, I think I've gotten to the point where I know what I would do more Than this visiting person.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Jessica Capshaw]

And it wasn't an ego thing. It was just like, oh, yeah, I've been here. I've been here a minute.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah, well. And when you come onto a show and everyone's lived in their characters for so long, that's very intimidating. I finally feel like I'm one of those people on the show. But.

[Jessica Capshaw]

But, yeah, I was very intimidating to Camilla when we first met. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

Jessica and I, we have a backstory. I'll fill you in, Chris. Don't worry.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Without Jessica, you don't need to.

[Camilla Luddington]

Okay. Okay. So I am using our podcast as a little bit of exclusive shit for Grey's Nat. Last week, Joe and Link got engaged on the show, which was a really big episode. So I want to pick Chris's brain because he did the engagement speech. And you know that when you have to do an engagement speech on Grey's Anatomy, we've done a. You've done a couple really big love speeches, actually, for Joe, and there's something towards the finale that's going to blow everyone's minds. It's just crazy. Do you feel the pressure of that? Like, okay, it's a Grey's Anatomy engagement. This is like the moment, as an actor going into it.

[Chris Carmack]

No, and I'll tell you why.

[Camilla Luddington]

Really?

[Chris Carmack]

No. Yeah. And I'll tell you why. Because particularly with this Joe and Link love story, it feels so earned.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

And it feels so lived in and really slow burned, so that it felt like we've been holding it back.

[Camilla Luddington]

I agree.

[Chris Carmack]

You know, and it felt good and right and cathartic to do it.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

So it. I really actually felt more like finally than. Than. Than the pressure of. Of it.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah. I have to respond to something, because tvline.com they do this thing where they're like the quotes of the week or the episodes of the week, and they kind of analyze and ask questions about it. And one of the things that came out this week was about our engagement last week, and it said, would Joe Wilson really have said yes so quickly to Link? And I was, like, interested after two disastrous marriages. And I went to the comments because I know what I think, and I went to the comments to see what people were saying, and everyone was like, no, it. It doesn't not make sense that she would say yes so quickly because their friendship has gone on for so long. There's so much trust there. And that's exactly how I feel. I'm responding to TV line. I love TV line.

[Chris Carmack]

It doesn't not make.

[Camilla Luddington]

No, no, no. Yes. Yes, I did it. I did it. Yes. It makes sense that she said yes so quickly was what the comments were saying. They're saying it makes sense. They were asking whether it made sense. They're like, would it really have made sense that she's not like, wait a second, I got.

[Chris Carmack]

She's also pregnant with twins.

[Camilla Luddington]

She.

[Chris Carmack]

I mean, like, this is not like.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yes, but I think that there's something. Yes, but I wonder if, like, I would imagine if she did have any PTSD about it, it would be like, maybe if we seal the deal, it'll go wrong. Like, it's gonna torpedo something.

[Chris Carmack]

She has, like, a. That built in.

[Camilla Luddington]

Maybe. Possibly. But I didn't carry that because that's not what the scene was. And I. If we had had to play that, I would have played that. But we didn't. And it made sense to me to not have to play it because I felt like, again, it's. It has been such a long time. We played so many years of friend, just pure friendship, which you don't see a lot on the show. There's usually, like, right off the bat, some sort of, like, something like you kind of hate each other. You're kind of in. You know, we played pure friendship. So the yes made so much sense.

[Chris Carmack]

And the other thing, too, is I have this experience with friends in my life that I've known since childhood, that when you are with them, you. I don't want to say you revert to children, but you feel so safe, you feel so free. They've known you your whole life, and they really know the essence of who you are and the experiences that you've had in life beyond that friendship and since that friendship started almost don't matter to that friendship. And because Link and Joe were friends before, a lot of this trauma that Joe has experienced, I almost feel like there's that reverting to safety bubble, if that makes sense. Yeah, I don't think I said that very well.

[Camilla Luddington]

No, no, no, no. I think that makes sense. Did you get what.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yes, that makes perfect sense.

[Chris Carmack]

So, you know, your history.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Your history helps.

[Camilla Luddington]

You know, I also do think that our natural chemistry in real life helps with the chemistry we have on the show, which is. Which is always right. But I think that we have also just our own thing. Yeah, that helps.

[Jessica Capshaw]

And do you guys. Because, you know, I mean, I just am not as current, but do you push play on a lot of passion in this. In this situation? Are you guys doing.

[Camilla Luddington]

Just had a whole day of passion.

[Chris Carmack]

A lot of passion.

[Camilla Luddington]

We had a Lot of passion.

[Chris Carmack]

Passion.

[Camilla Luddington]

She's out here and there's a lot of. There's a lot of. Yeah, we just had to play. A lot of passion. I think that they keep it sexy still. Even though she's, you know, got two babies.

[Chris Carmack]

I mean, there might be more in there by now. Who knows?

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

I don't know how anatomy works.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah, we're going to town, baby.

[Chris Carmack]

There's eight or nine of them in there now.

[Camilla Luddington]

Watch out, Grace.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I may play a doctor on tv, but I'm not real sure how.

[Chris Carmack]

Baby, you know what? I'm just the bone guy.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Bonetown with the bone guy.

[Camilla Luddington]

I know that a lot of fans want to. Want this question, and you can be honest. I'm not going to be offended, truly.

[Jessica Capshaw]

She's already. She's giving you a path.

[Camilla Luddington]

No, there are people that still love Lincoln Emelia, together. So do you think, honestly, because, you know, we do this. We do the game of chess on Grey's Anatomy. Is there any part of you that thinks that really Link should have ended up with Amelia? Maybe the better storyline was to mix it up?

[Chris Carmack]

No, I don't. I think Lincoln Amelia were incompatible on a lot of levels. And I think they could have. I think they could have made it work. But I think Link and Amelia are old enough and responsible enough and loved each other enough that they could have made it work. But I think it was contentious in a lot of ways.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

And a lot of my best scenes with Katarina were Link and Amelia, like. Like fighting.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

And. And it just. I. You know, it's more fun to come to work and laugh, you know, than. Than to work on these conflicts. And it's more sustainable, too.

[Camilla Luddington]

It's more sustainable. Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

And Lincoln Joe just get to laugh a lot, which is really nice.

[Camilla Luddington]

We do. Yeah.

[Jessica Capshaw]

And do you like the medical stuff?

[Chris Carmack]

I do like the medical stuff. I will say that I feel like orthopedic is. Is one of, like, the more boring.

[Camilla Luddington]

I disagree.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I totally was thinking that was what Cali was.

[Camilla Luddington]

No, I think the opposite.

[Chris Carmack]

Okay.

[Camilla Luddington]

Because I feel like. No, no, because I feel like if you're. If you're brain doctoring, you're right. You're just like this all the time, people.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah. Teeny tiny little.

[Camilla Luddington]

You're teeny tiny. With you, you get to.

[Chris Carmack]

I know I get to.

[Camilla Luddington]

You're like, smashing. Yeah. I think it's so cool.

[Chris Carmack]

No, that's. That is cool. That is cool. But very rarely am I involved in, like, the trauma. The trauma or the life saving aspect.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

You know, it's like, most of it is, like, planned procedures and. Or I'm kind of like the guy who's fixing the bones while the heart is being worked on, and. And I don't get a lot of those, like, hero doctor moments.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yes.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

Do you know who used to get a lot of that that I used to be jealous of? Sarah Drew had. She was a trauma surgeon on the show. She just had, like, patient beds being wheeled in from an ambulance, and she was on top of the person.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah, yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

Like, doing chest compressions.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

And I was like, you look. Aw. Like, you look like the hero all the time. And the camera shoots.

[Jessica Capshaw]

That was well suited for her, too, though, because she had that kind of energy.

[Chris Carmack]

And cardiothoracic is great. You know, it's like, you know, Winston gets to walk off. Yeah, yeah. Just. Just saved her life with a new surgery that didn't exist 10 minutes ago.

[Camilla Luddington]

Exactly.

[Chris Carmack]

You know, and I'm like, you will probably regain full mobility, and you'll be able to play the piano again in six to eight months.

[Camilla Luddington]

Boring.

[Chris Carmack]

I mean, look, I've had orthopedic surgeons work on my knees and help me out in life, and it's very important. It's just not as exciting.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah, yeah. No, I got.

[Camilla Luddington]

Now that you say that, I realize it's so boring.

[Chris Carmack]

She's gonna leave me. Joe's gonna leave me.

[Camilla Luddington]

Oh, my God. You're just not doing it for me anymore.

[Chris Carmack]

I'm not pitching.

[Jessica Capshaw]

You can always change. I changed. I changed.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah. I changed a million times. Me and Ben Warren.

[Chris Carmack]

Maybe I'll try to, like, intern with. With Winston on cardiothoracic.

[Camilla Luddington]

Oh, yeah, that's.

[Chris Carmack]

And I'm. And I'm working on the heart.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah. You're just like, yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

And he's like, no, no, calm down. Calm down.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Maybe it's a storyline for when you guys feel a little. A little LOL in the passion, and you're like, I need to up my game. I need to get sexier. What can I do? And then you're like, it's cardio.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah. It's never been bones for me.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

I. Yeah, that's a line that could be in there.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah. For sure.

[Camilla Luddington]

Let's tease a little bit of our season finale.

[Chris Carmack]

Okay.

[Camilla Luddington]

We are shooting it right now.

[Jessica Capshaw]

You are?

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Jessica Capshaw]

This is the part of the show where I'm sick of being your third.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Jessica Capshaw]

And I'm getting out of here. I'm gonna let you guys talk about the season finale and all the secrets that it holds and have all of your chemistry and all your passion.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah, yeah. All right. We love you, we miss you. But she's it's.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Thank you so much for coming on.

[Chris Carmack]

Oh, thank you.

[Camilla Luddington]

It was great to see you.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Foreign.

[Camilla Luddington]

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[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

I personally get a little girly, I love a bow, I love a little lace, I love the way it fits and I always love knowing that I feel supported underneath my clothes.

[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

Offer ends April 1st. Go to CheapCaribbean.com to start saving this.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Episode is brought to you by Hulu. Life's full of little dramas. The kind you don't want. The annoying everyday kind. And Hulu has the drama you want.

[Camilla Luddington]

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[Jessica Capshaw]

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[Camilla Luddington]

So let's pause the annoying everyday drama and play the drama you want. Hulu, the drama you want. Okay, so we are. And then I do have to ask you some OC questions because you're not going to be happy. We have a rapid fire at the end. Okay, let's tease a little bit. Our finale because we're shooting it right now.

[Chris Carmack]

Yep.

[Camilla Luddington]

And what is one word to just. Well, first off, we have to say that we did the table read and it was incredible.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah, no, the table read was. Was coming in hot.

[Camilla Luddington]

And I, you know, sometimes we have finales. I'm like, that's a great finale. And then sometimes it feels like, oh, like this is a finale that is going to like be one of those ones that people won't forget. And I feel like after reading it, that was this finale.

[Chris Carmack]

100%.

[Camilla Luddington]

What is a word? I'm trying to be so cryptic. There's a great episode 17. So we have 18 episodes a season. Episode 17 is a really huge episode for Joe and Link. I don't know how to tease that.

[Chris Carmack]

Oh, right. Seventeen. Right, right, right.

[Camilla Luddington]

Gotcha. Oh my God, Chris, we just shot it. Huge episode for Joe and Lank.

[Chris Carmack]

You start throwing around big numbers like 17, you're gonna lose me.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Me.

[Chris Carmack]

I'm not a math guy. I'm a bone guy.

[Camilla Luddington]

So the episode we just shot is the episode before the finale. Episode 17. It's a huge Joan Link episode. We can't say what it is probably, but it's a really big episode, and we had a lot of fun.

[Chris Carmack]

We did have a lot of fun.

[Camilla Luddington]

And we have a really great guest star that you guys are gonna be so excited about.

[Chris Carmack]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. You guys are gonna be stoked.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah, no, for real. You guys are gonna be so excited. And the finale is super dramatic. Completely different to episode 17.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah, no, it's a quick turnaround.

[Camilla Luddington]

It's a very quick turnaround. And what is one word that you would use to describe it? Don't say what I think you're gonna say, because it's so. If you say that word, which could work. It's so obvious.

[Chris Carmack]

One word to describe.

[Camilla Luddington]

Okay, go. You can have more words if you need more.

[Chris Carmack]

All I can think of is the one word.

[Camilla Luddington]

I know, I know. You can't say that, though. It's.

[Chris Carmack]

It's gripping.

[Camilla Luddington]

All right. I don't know if anyone's gonna let you down. Okay, okay, okay. Hang on. Let me think. Let me think how I would describe it with one word. I think that it is unrelenting. Yes, actually.

[Chris Carmack]

But it does relent a little. We have. We have the only relenting scenes, which turns out to be a pretty comedic beat.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yes, we're the only comedic beats in that episode. Yeah. Unrelenting is a great word. I think that it's gonna feel like it's super fast paced. There's so much happening, so much strong. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You won't be able to, like. I wouldn't even. I really couldn't breathe during the table read. I was, like, holding my breath the whole time. And I am one of those actors that, like. I like to read our scenes and then I don't read anything else. Not like a selfish way, but. Because during the. During the table read, I like to hear the episode for the first time. And so I was hearing the ending for the first time, and I was, like, so shocked, really. I mean, those last few pages, I was like, oh, my God. So you guys have a lot to look forward to. Okay, let's talk about the OC Real quick. People want to know if you keep in touch with anyone from the OC.

[Chris Carmack]

Not, like, regularly. I've heard from, you know, Rachel and Melinda. They've got a podcast.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah. You went on their podcast?

[Chris Carmack]

I did their podcast, and I've run into Peter Gallagher. He's been on our show.

[Camilla Luddington]

He has been on our show.

[Chris Carmack]

He's been on our show.

[Camilla Luddington]

I forgot.

[Chris Carmack]

I forgot. And I worked with his daughter in Nashville, and so we've kind of been in touch over the years. But not like. I mean, we don't hang out and have dinner.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, to be honest, we shoot almost nine months of the year.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah. And I've got two little kids.

[Camilla Luddington]

We have kids. And so there's not a lot of free time.

[Chris Carmack]

There's not a lot of free time.

[Camilla Luddington]

There isn't. Okay, Rapid fire questions. Okay, so one question that we got a lot. It's the call at Cruise Dream. Adam Brody is having a big moment right now with. Nobody wants this. They are wanting to know if you would love to recollaborate with him and do something with him in the future.

[Chris Carmack]

Of course I would. I would love to recollorate with all of us. Of the.

[Camilla Luddington]

All of them. I feel like you would be great on that show to, like, guest star.

[Chris Carmack]

Sure. Let's put that out of that, please.

[Camilla Luddington]

Let's get Carmack on that show. Okay. Rapid fire. If Link ever left Grace Loan. How would you want his story to.

[Chris Carmack]

End if he left Grace Loan?

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah. Would you?

[Chris Carmack]

He gets. He. He finally gets recruited into the major leagues.

[Camilla Luddington]

Oh, God. And leaves Joe behind in the dust looking after the kids.

[Chris Carmack]

He finally follow is his passion as a baseball player. And the Mariners realize how good of a pitcher he was.

[Camilla Luddington]

With your knees.

[Chris Carmack]

Pitcher.

[Camilla Luddington]

Do you need knees for a pitcher?

[Chris Carmack]

Probably, yeah. Okay.

[Camilla Luddington]

Who on the cast would you trust to babysit your kids?

[Chris Carmack]

Not Joe Wilson.

[Camilla Luddington]

No way. I would trust Link, but I would trust Bailey.

[Chris Carmack]

Oh, yeah. Bailey. For sure.

[Camilla Luddington]

Bailey I would trust, too. Okay. Who would you want to come back to the show, dead or alive?

[Chris Carmack]

Well, I mean, we. We brought a whole bunch of dead characters back.

[Camilla Luddington]

We did in.

[Chris Carmack]

During the COVID season.

[Camilla Luddington]

I always say Capshaw. I'm gonna add in Jake Borelli.

[Chris Carmack]

He's not dead. Oh, but he's alive.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

Oh, I see. Dead or alive. Yeah. No, Jake Borelli. We had a lot of fun.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

And he's such a good foil for Joe. And. And.

[Camilla Luddington]

But you've had great scenes with him, too, also. Jake is just a gem. Yeah. And he's an incredible actor. He's someone that can seamlessly go back and forth between comedy and. And drama. So I feel my answer would be Jake and Jessica. But is Jake yours?

[Chris Carmack]

Well, I mean, now you feel the.

[Camilla Luddington]

Pressure to say Jake, you're like, no, not no.

[Chris Carmack]

No. I mean, my first thought was if we're talking dead or alive. I mean, if you could resurrect Derek.

[Camilla Luddington]

Oh, yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

I mean.

[Camilla Luddington]

I mean, if there was a way. I know. To be honest. I mean, listen, I was a McDreamy Meredith fan, so I don't. I don't hate that answer at all. Okay. If Luke from the. Oh, this is a great one. If Luke from the OC Walked into.

[Chris Carmack]

Graceland Hospital, young Luke is coming in with, like, gigantically alarming swollen test ankles.

[Camilla Luddington]

From what?

[Chris Carmack]

From a surfing accident.

[Camilla Luddington]

I was like, is this. You got a huge case of blue balls.

[Chris Carmack]

His. His. The fin on his surfboard.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

Caught him.

[Camilla Luddington]

Caught the balls.

[Chris Carmack]

It caught. Yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah, I can imagine that. I was gonna say that you'd. Your notice.

[Chris Carmack]

Shark bite.

[Camilla Luddington]

A shark bite? No, I was gonna say that you got into a fight. Broken nose.

[Chris Carmack]

Oh, well, yeah, but that's.

[Camilla Luddington]

That's boring.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah. No, I like the balls. The balls are a better answer. Who from the cast would be your emergency contact?

[Chris Carmack]

Who from. We're not on. We're not on the OC Anymore.

[Camilla Luddington]

We're not on the OC who from the cast would be your emergency contact? Oh, I'm right here.

[Chris Carmack]

Not Jill Wilson.

[Camilla Luddington]

Wait, from the cast? From the cast. Should we do the cast and then we do the characters?

[Chris Carmack]

Oh, we're doing the cast or the characters. Okay.

[Camilla Luddington]

If you were in jail, like, who would you call? I'd call Jim Pickens. I feel like Jim could get us out.

[Chris Carmack]

Maybe Kevin McKit.

[Camilla Luddington]

Oh, Kevin. Kevin could get us out of jail.

[Chris Carmack]

Kevin's. I think Kevin could bail me out, could break me out if he had to.

[Camilla Luddington]

Kevin could break you out? I think Jim could sweet talk us out.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

One call from Jim and it's like, hey.

[Chris Carmack]

Well, that's. The other thing is, like, Jim probably knows the sheriff.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

You know what I mean?

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Chris Carmack]

He's got deep connection.

[Camilla Luddington]

Character wise, who would you call? Emergency. Well, I hope you call me.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah. Character wise, it would be Joe.

[Camilla Luddington]

I love that. Real life. It wouldn't be me.

[Chris Carmack]

I'm thinking. I'm thinking you live all the way across town. Like, there's just no way. It would take too long.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah, yeah. You're thinking of the traffic. No, that's a good point.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

It took me hours to get to you. Who from the cast would you pick as your best man in real life if you were to get married today? Who from the cast? From the cast, again, I would pick Jim Pickens.

[Chris Carmack]

He'd look good standing up there in a suit.

[Camilla Luddington]

Let's be Honest. Jim Pickens is the best dressed out of all the guys.

[Chris Carmack]

He always looks. He looks on point.

[Camilla Luddington]

Just. Yeah, he looks amazing. Always.

[Chris Carmack]

What about me?

[Camilla Luddington]

Would I pick you?

[Chris Carmack]

I was gonna say how. How do I dress?

[Camilla Luddington]

How do you look? How did. Well, you know, when co. Costumes dresses you. You look great when you.

[Chris Carmack]

I often can't even find matching shoes in my house.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah, you look fine. Okay. People want to know, well, this is hard because you're with me. So I don't know if you can answer this truthfully, but do you think Joe and Link are end game?

[Chris Carmack]

I do. Yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

I do too.

[Chris Carmack]

Which means.

[Camilla Luddington]

Which means they won't be.

[Chris Carmack]

Which means they.

[Camilla Luddington]

They'll listen to this interview and they're like, yeah, exactly. We're gonna destroy these two. I mean, I hope so. It's hard to be endgame on our show.

[Chris Carmack]

It is. I mean, how can you be endgame if you. If you're endgame? That's like, story feels kind of over.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah. Don't you think that Link, like, has to be sort of endgame with Joe? Otherwise, it's like, hey, this is my baby mama, Emelia, and my other baby mama, Joe. But, like, let me. Let's date. You have quite the voice.

[Chris Carmack]

Mm.

[Camilla Luddington]

Do you wish you were on the show for when the musical episode happened?

[Chris Carmack]

The musical episode is. Is. Is yes. The answer is yes.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah. Yeah. It would have been great.

[Chris Carmack]

It's. It's. It. It's so either loved or hated by. Its very divisive.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah, I was gonna say because it's been so divisive. It's iconic, for sure.

[Chris Carmack]

So I 100 would have loved to have been on it. Also, I love asking Kevin about it. I don't know if he's come on the show. He's.

[Camilla Luddington]

Oh, no, we're gonna have Kevin on the show. Kevin has some great stories.

[Chris Carmack]

He's got some great stories.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah. No, we have to know. He has some great musical episode stories too, for sure. Okay. I personally want to know because I have heard you sing. If you could be, like, a live action Disney character in a movie, who would it be?

[Chris Carmack]

Oh, well, it'd have to be a prince.

[Camilla Luddington]

Which one, though? There's so many. Do you know who I think you could have been or could be? Finn Rider.

[Chris Carmack]

That was actually the one I was thinking.

[Camilla Luddington]

Really?

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Camilla Luddington]

I'll be Rapunzel. We could do Tangled together. They just gotta age it up. So we're like, you know, it's gonna take us a long time to get down the tower.

[Chris Carmack]

Detangled.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah. I'm like, God, it's taking forever. Okay, Chris, climbing. I love you. Everyone has wanted you on the pod, literally, since I started. And the truth is, is you were supposed to come on.

[Chris Carmack]

I was.

[Camilla Luddington]

And then we hit pause because we were filming. But also, I was like, let's recap our engagement episode, which was so. By the way, I have to say this, Jesse Williams directed that episode. And sometimes when we do these scenes together, I'm, like, completely enthralled, where I even forget, like, my next line. And it happened. And also in the episode. Not last season, the finale before, when we were in the rain and we were talking about. And I was so romanticized. I don't even know if that's the word. Sure. Romanticized by your engagement. And so I was very happy to say yes to it.

[Chris Carmack]

Oh, well.

[Camilla Luddington]

And not reject all the rings like Emilia did. Please come back on the show because hopefully these two are together forever, and we'll have lots more to discuss. Everyone, let's call it the end of the episode.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Hey there, folks.

[Camilla Luddington]

It's T.J. holmes and Amy Robach.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Don't miss Morning Run every weekday morning, Monday through Friday.

[Chris Carmack]

Yeah, we'll be covering the biggest stories, everything you need to know. Breaking news, politics, pop culture, on our daily podcast, Morning Run. And, of course, it has a little bit of our own personal flair to it.

[Camilla Luddington]

Yeah, that's right.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Make sure to subscribe now, so every.

[Chris Carmack]

Day when you wake up, you've got.

[Camilla Luddington]

The Morning Run waiting for you.

[Chris Carmack]

Listen to Morning Run wherever you get your podcasts.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Welcome to Casual Chaos, where I'm telling.

[Camilla Luddington]

My story unfiltered, unedited, and unapologetic.

[Jessica Capshaw]

From moments you didn't see on camera.

[Camilla Luddington]

To secrets nobody's dared to spill, I'm bringing you behind the scenes like never before.

[Jessica Capshaw]

I'm talking love life, because let's be real here. It's been a journey, wellness and the truth behind the headlines. And, of course, I've got the receipts.

[Camilla Luddington]

Plus, I'll be sitting down with some of the biggest names in pop culture for casually chaotic conversations you won't hear anywhere else. So pour yourself an espresso martini and get ready, because once you start listening, you'll be waking up in the morning thinking about so many things.

[Jessica Capshaw]

Listen to Casual chaos starting on March 24 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Camilla Luddington]

You met Michelle Lally in the hit Bravo show the Valley. You met me, literally, during the most difficult chapter in my life. Now it's time for you to meet the real me. Michelle Saniyi Yes, I changed my name and I want you to follow me on my journey to the Pursuit of Sassiness. So much has happened to me before, during and after the show. Before you can really understand the eight weeks that you saw on tv, I think you have to know what was going on from the very beginning. From being raised by two immigrant parents, paying my own way through college and working at Hooters, to starting my own real estate empire, getting married, having a baby during COVID to that very same marriage falling apart on national tv, to losing my mom, to eventually finding love again. There is so much to unpack and share. I'm on the pursuit of happiness and most importantly, I'm on the pursuit of sassiness. Listen to Pursuit of sassiness starting on March 17th on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or or wherever you get your podcasts. Future Health gives millions access to affordable weight loss meds like Ozempic and Semaglutide for less than three bucks a day. Weight loss medications can cost over thousands of dollars a month, but with Future Health they make it four times cheaper. You just take a quick three minute survey and if approved, boom. Your meds are delivered right to your door within 24 hours for free. You may know a handful of people who are struggling to lose weight weight. Weight loss medication like Ozempic really does work. You can lose 20% of your weight if you hate needles. They also give you access to oral Semaglutide, same active ingredient as Ozempic. No insurance needed. Everything is online and meds are shipped to Your door within 24 hours with free shipping. Future Health really does take care of their members. Find out if weight loss meds are right for you in just three minutes at try fh.com that's trifh.com try fh.com results vary based on start weight and adherence to diet, exercise and program goals. Data based on independent study sponsored by Future Health. Future Health is not a healthcare services provider. Meds are prescribed at providers discretion.

[Jessica Capshaw]

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