Call Me Back - with Dan Senor

Episode: A NEW MIDDLE EAST – with Tal Becker and Nadav Eyal

Date: October 13, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode of "Call Me Back" is a powerful, real-time reflection on Israel’s most historic day in decades: the return of 20 living hostages after 738 days in Hamas captivity, marking—God willing—the end of the October 7, 2023 war. Host Dan Senor is joined by Israeli journalist Nadav Eyal and former diplomat-analytic thinker Tal Becker to interpret the profound emotive and political significance of this moment for Israel and the broader Middle East. Interwoven through moving testimonies, political speeches, and behind-the-scenes negotiation stories, this episode explores topics from trauma and catharsis to the future shape of regional politics, patterns of leadership, and the possibility of a new epoch for Israelis, Palestinians, and their neighbors.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Return of the Hostages: National Catharsis and Pain

• Joy and heartbreak intermingled: Both Nadav and Tal share viscerally personal responses, emphasizing feelings of relief and communal healing, alongside grief for those not returning and for the years lost.
  • Nadav Eyal recounts family reunions and the tireless struggles of those who brought the hostages home:

    “I see the image of Ariel Cunho hugging Arbel Yehud. Arbel Yehud was kept in captivity alone 482 days. Now they are together again.” (08:41)

  • Tal Becker reflects on Simchat Torah, symbolism, and collective agency:

    “Our enemies constantly say that our weakness is that we love life... And today, that felt like the greatest strength ever, that we love life. It's something we should be unbelievably proud of.” (00:15, echoing at 10:29)

2. A Nation’s Identity: Agency, Resilience, and the Raison d'Être of Zionism

• Reclaiming agency:
  • Tal Becker on the transition from trauma to self-determination as the core of Zionism:

    “Bring them home was almost this message inward to us. We need to reclaim that agency. So in a way, the hostage story this time was about the story of Israel itself." (13:43)

• A society-wide affirmation: The episode discusses how the ordeal and rescue of hostages became synonymous with Israeli national purpose and unity—‘kol yisrael arevim zeh bazeh’ (all Israel is responsible for one another).

3. Political Transition: “End of Something,” Dawn of a New Era

• Both guests and political leaders (Netanyahu, Lapid, Trump) speak in terms suggesting an epochal shift—from years defined by war, violence, and military logic, to a potential focus on diplomacy, reconstruction, and regional integration.
  • Nadav Eyal cautions against easy predictions:

    “It’s very clear that there’s going to be a lot of pressure internationally by the United States and others for Israel to try to solve issues from now on like the one that we are seeing through political means, diplomacy...” (16:34)

  • Tal Becker draws a vital distinction:

    “There’s a huge difference between saying you will live by the sword and saying you will live with the sword... One of the geniuses of Israel has been to live in the Middle east but not cross that line.” (18:08)

4. Speeches from the Knesset: Calls for Unity and Regional Vision

• Netanyahu: Looks forward to new peace treaties, highlighting the Abraham Accords and “the path we paved” (03:38).
• Yair Lapid: Calls for Israeli reinvention and forward-looking unity, directly expressing gratitude to the United States and Israel’s patriots (04:35).
• Donald Trump: Emphasizes the prospect of regional partnerships and unparalleled prosperity post-war (05:34).

5. The Trump Factor: Leadership, Negotiation, and Personality

• Singular diplomatic force: Both Eyal and Becker stress that President Trump’s unique style, willpower, and direct involvement were pivotal.
  • Nadav Eyal details behind-the-scenes pressure by Trump to force closure on the agreement, noting:

    “The president wanted the agreement… And then the president authorized, according to a Barack Ravid story, Steve Witkoff and Jared Kushner to go into a room for the first time and actually have a sit down with Hamas officials and make them the promise in the name of the President of the United States." (25:43)

  • Tal Becker on "the man vs. the moment":

    “It’s hard to imagine the diplomacy that led to this, the power of the president in the way that he operates, the moment, the man and the message… It seemed in a strange way that Hamas calculus about the hostages… flipped on its head as a result of a whole set of things that I think President Trump and his team set in motion…” (23:58)

• Leadership style matters: The podcast describes Trump’s notable generosity in giving credit to others—his team, Israelis, and regional partners (28:56).

6. Caution and the Challenging Road Ahead (Gaza, Region, and Beyond)

• No self-delusion: Nadav Eyal urges realism about messy aftermaths—Hamas still controls Gaza, dangers of agreement violations, enduring divisions among regional leaders (40:58).
• Vision for transformation:
  • Tal Becker on the need to translate military gains into long-term diplomatic and societal progress, focusing on normalization, healing, and defeating extremism by establishing new “trend lines.” (38:08, 43:28)
  • On regional power and vision:

    “Israel is a regional power... and one of the big conversations we need to have today is what kind of regional power are we? …How do we craft a vision for security, prosperity, peace that benefits as many of the people across the region...” (44:34)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

Opening Emotional Resonance

• Tal Becker on Israel’s celebration amid tragedy:

  “There aren’t enough split screens on television to capture all the complexity of this moment. Not enough chambers in your heart to hold the joy, the relief, the hope, the uncertainty, the pain.” (10:29)

On Agency and Zionist Purpose

• Tal Becker on the meaning of 'bring them home':

  “The hostage story this time was about the story of Israel itself. It was about the raison d' etre of Zionism itself.” (13:43)

On National Catharsis

• Nadav Eyal on the uniqueness of the moment in Israeli history:

  “Israel had greater victories in wars, but it never had this sense of catharsis as it had in the last 24 hours… There was no other phase in Israeli history in which the notion of kol yisrael arevim zerazeh, of all for one and one for all, was more powerful than in the last 24 hours.” (12:34)

On “Living By” or “With” the Sword

• Tal Becker referencing Jewish sources to define Israel’s path forward:

  “There’s a huge difference between saying you will live by the sword and saying you will live with the sword… One of the geniuses of Israel has been to live in the Middle east but not cross that line from living with the sword, which is absolutely necessary in this part of the world… but not turning that into your identity.” (18:08)

On Trump’s Diplomatic Approach

• Nadav Eyal on the closing of the hostage agreement:

  “What was happening today, Dan, was what we call closing, what you guys in business call closing, right? It's not the signature of the agreement, but they actually transfer of money, or in this case, transfer of our hostages back home, and they got their prisoners.” (28:56)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Opening personal reflections (love of life in Israel): 00:09, 10:29
• Hostage homecoming and national catharsis: 08:15–13:00
• Knesset speeches & Trump’s address: 03:38–06:05
• Defining the new era—transition from war to diplomacy: 15:12–19:51
• Leadership debate (“the man or the moment”): 22:57–25:43
• Detailed account of Trump’s negotiation style and the agreement's “closing”: 25:43–31:58
• Future prospects for regional politics, obstacles, and opportunities: 33:26–38:08
• Looking toward the days ahead—stark realism and big questions: 40:58–45:00

Final Thoughts and Outlook

Nadav Eyal:

Cautions about the immediate future in Gaza, warning against illusions of stability without deeper change:

“Right now Hamas controls Gaza. Hamas is armed in Gaza... So, optimistic as I am, I always need to say that in the first few weeks after an agreement like that is signed, it's a dangerous time.” (40:58)

Tal Becker:

Emphasizes the opportunity and obligation for Israel to harness its regional strength for “security, prosperity, peace”—not only for itself and the US, but for all peoples in the region. He concludes with vision and sober optimism:

"...momentum has flipped back potentially to the forces of coexistence, prosperity, peace, stability in the Middle East. And now we need to capitalize on that... to dream a little.” (44:34)

Tone & Language

The episode mixes sober analysis with emotional resonance. Both guests speak in reflective, personal tones, blending lived experience with national and historical perspective. Key moments are marked by a sense of awe, relief, pain, humility, and resolve. The tenor is fundamentally forward-looking, cautious but hopeful, with moments of poetic emphasis on themes such as love of life, agency, and the possibility of a new order.

This summary encapsulates the episode’s main themes, insight-rich analysis, notable moments, and core emotional and political takeaways—serving as a resource for those who want to grasp this pivotal moment in Israel’s story, even if they missed the original conversation.