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Casefile Narrator (28:11)

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Gilberto Valli / FBI Agent Anthony Foto (28:29)

In.

Casefile Narrator (28:29)

Mid-2012, elementary school teacher turned stay at home mother Jackie Valli was growing increasingly concerned about her husband's unusual behaviour. 28 year old Gilberto Valli, known to friends and family as Gil, had recently been spending much more time on their computer in the living room. He had always been a night owl as he worked late and struggled to go straight to sleep. He typically stayed up for a couple of hours playing video games, watching television or browsing the Internet. But after Jackie became pregnant, his behaviour worsened. He started staying up until 3, 4 or even 5am Sometimes he wouldn't come to bed at all. Jackie had met Gilberto about three years earlier on a dating website. He sent the first message and when she viewed his profile, his occupation immediately caught her eye. He was an officer with the New York Police Department. Jackie's father had been a police officer and she thought the job sounded so cool. She replied to Gilberto and the two arranged to meet for dinner. Their first date went exceptionally well. They shared laughs, enjoyed dessert and cuddled together at the movies. The night ended with a passionate kiss and the shared sensation that something special had just begun. Things moved quickly after that. Within weeks, Jackie and Gilberto were officially a couple. A year later, they moved into a New York apartment together and got a puppy in. Then, in January 2011, Jackie discovered she was pregnant. Gilberto's initial reaction was one of shock and uncertainty. He didn't feel they were ready, but after long discussions, he seemingly embraced the idea of becoming a father. Their daughter was born that September. Five months later, Gilberto proposed. The couple celebrated with a small but lovely wedding soon after, life as new parents started off happily enough, but Jackie gradually felt that she and Gilberto were drifting apart. As their intimacy faded, Gilberto immersed himself deeper online. Whenever Jackie caught a glimpse of the computer screen, it appeared he was browsing innocuous sites like espn, Major League Baseball and a message board for New York cops. It wasn't until Gilberto started regularly deleting his Internet search history that Jackie began to suspect he was hiding something, possibly an affair. When the computer stopped working in mid-2012, Gilberto began using Jackie's laptop. He created his own account on the device, secured with a password. One night in August, as Gilberto slept, Jackie saw that he had forgotten to log out. At the bottom of the home screen were two small image files. She clicked on them, but the pictures wouldn't load. However, she could view the file information, which revealed their source a website called the Dark Fetish Network. Jackie typed the website's URL into a browser and discovered it was a pornographic forum for hardcore fetishists. Its homepage displayed a naked woman, hogtied and covered in blood. To Jackie, she appeared to be dead. The discovery left her stunned. Gilberto was a kind, baby faced man who some likened to a teddy bear. Sensitive, patient and respectful, he was the perfect gentleman, opening doors for Jackie and pulling out the chair for her at dinner. He supported the family on his single income while treating them to special joys such as meals out or trips to the zoo. Gilberto had never faced any misconduct complaints as a police officer, nor had he been involved in criminal activity or substance abuse. Though he and Jackie sometimes disagreed, he had never shown aggression, anger or any inclination to harm women. A virgin when they met. His intimacy with the Jackie had never involved anything resembling the content on the Dark Fetish Network. Gilberto was still asleep at 8am When Jackie tapped him on the shoulder. Nervous, she tried to meet his gaze but couldn't quite manage it. She told him he had left his account open on her computer. She hadn't meant to pry, but when she clicked on an image, it took her to a website showing a woman tied up. Jackie's tone wasn't angry or accusatory, yet Gilberto looked frightened. He quickly apologised, insisting he hadn't meant for her to see it and explaining that it was nothing. Sometimes after late shifts, he said he came home wound up and instead of waking Jackie, he watched pornography instead. Most of it was normal stuff, though occasionally he looked at bondage content. Jackie relaxed slightly. She told Gilberto she understood and even suggested they experiment together as a way to reconnect. She proposed that he stop by a sex shop the next day to pick up a few items for them to try. Gilberto seemed both relieved and enthusiastic. For Jackie, the exchange offered a flicker of hope, the first since before her pregnancy. She later recalled, I thought maybe we had a breakthrough, that we were communicating, that he was going to be honest and talk to me. Despite Jackie's optimism, the discovery changed both her and Gilberto irrevocably. Jackie couldn't stop thinking about what she'd seen, while Gilberto seemed increasingly suspicious of everything Jackie did. Overcome with a growing sense of dread and feeling she had no Choice, on Sunday, September 10, 2012, Jackie installed spyware on her laptop. The program recorded every keystroke, tracked every website visited, captured screenshots every five minutes, and monitored all emails sent and received. The spyware revealed that Gilberto was still secretly visiting fetish websites. Jackie later reflected, I know S and M is kind of popular, like 50 Shades of Grey, but this seemed different. When she came across images of feet detached from bodies, Jackie realised her husband's interests went far beyond just bondage content. The following morning, Jackie once again tapped the shoulder of the sleeping Gilberto, waking him. I logged into the computer just now, she immediately told him, and I saw everything. Gilberto tried to feign ignorance, but Jackie laughed sarcastically. Oh, so you're going to deny it? When he tried to speak, Jackie cut him off. Cook women, grill them. That's what we are to you. She said she intended to take their baby and get away for a while. Desperate, Gilberto pleaded, Jackie, what you saw is not who I am. He professed his love for Jackie, insisting she knew him while apologising and begging her not to leave. Tears streaming down her face, Jackie went to the bedroom and began packing. Once she had calmed down slightly, she told the anguish to Gilberto. I'm just a little freaked out. I need to get away. She gathered their daughter and left for the airport, heading to her parents home interstate. In shock and grappling with a whirlwind of emotions, Jackie sent a text to Gilberto shortly after leaving that said I do love you. Later, she messaged him again, saying that she wasn't giving up and that they would work through this together. Jackie suggested he schedule a couple's therapy appointment in a few weeks. Sounds great, Gilberto replied. I'm happy to hear that when you come back, we start over. That's it. I never want to see you like that again. And I won't let it happen again. Jackie had taken her laptop with her. Days later, she logged into the spyware program again to further inspect the data it had collected. Among the screenshots, she noticed an unfamiliar Yahoo email address. Curious, she went to Yahoo's website and entered the sign in details. Although she didn't know the password, she tried one that she and Gilberto used for everything else. It worked. Jackie was confronted with thousands of disturbing messages and images Gilberto had sent under the alias of Girl Meathunter and others. The lurid messages detailed his desires and plans to abduct, rape, kill and eat women. Even more horrifying, his targets included 10 women they both knew in real life, whose photos he had taken from their Facebook pages and shared online. Among them was an old friend from Jackie's workplace, Gilberto's supervisor at the precinct, his high school crush, an 18 year old graduate from his former high school and several of his college friends. Overcome with equal parts repulsion and terror, Jackie clicked on the inbox's search bar and typed in Jackie. There were countless hits in messages from early 2012, Gilberto had corresponded with someone using the name Ali Khan. Ali said he had been banned from the Dark Fetish Network for trying to turn his fantasies of buying and killing women into reality. This piqued Gilberto's interest, given his growing fascination with the idea of selling women. The two men quickly struck up an online friendship. Gilberto suggested taking his wife on a trip to India where they could meet with Ali Khan. The two men would then take turns raping Jackie before Gilberto planned to hang her by her feet and slit her throat, then cook and consume her remains. He shared a photo of Jackie in a bikini, noting that she had a lot of meat on various parts of her body. Aly Khan said he would enjoy watching her blood gush, adding that if she cried, they should show no mercy. Gilberto replied, it's ok, we will just gag her. For Gilberto, the live cooking of Jackie was solely for his own entertainment and her suffering. He said he wanted Jackie to experience as much pain as possible through her ordeal, insisting that the rape would be the easy part for her. Upon uncovering this horrifying information, Jackie messaged to Gilberto, I need to know who you really are. Right now I'm betrayed and terrified. I need the truth about everything. She asked whether he had ever shared pictures of her or their daughter on the websites he frequented or in the emails he sent. Gilberto replied, absolutely not. I promise. Jackie knew Gilberto was lying. While she hadn't found any pictures of their now one year old daughter in his correspondence, he had shared plenty of images of her and much more. In an email titled 4th of July Menu, gilberto listed the personal details, physical descriptions and photos of several women he knew. Woman number six was described as 26 years old, 5ft 7 inches tall, weighing 150 to 160 pounds, married and with a baby daughter. The name given was Jackie and the accompanying photo was of her. Gilberto asked Jackie when she would be coming back, but she refused to answer. Instead, she demanded that he be completely honest. Gradually, he began to confess everything. By Wednesday, October 24, 2012, Jackie had been gone for six weeks. Gilberto had the day off from work and was alone in their New York apartment watching a movie when, around 2pm Gilbert a knock sounded at the door. He didn't move. He wasn't expecting anyone and was not in the mood for visitors. The knocking eventually stopped, but minutes later his cell phone lit up with a call from unknown. He ignored it only for the phone to ring again five minutes later. This time he answered. A male voice asked, hello, is this Officer Valli? Yes, gilberto replied. Who's this? The caller identified himself as a police officer from the 112th Precinct. He explained that Gilberto's parked car had just been hit and suffered pretty bad damage. He asked Gilberto to come outside so they could file a report. Gilberto got dressed, holstered his work issued handgun and headed for the door. Gilberto stepped into the hallway. As he rounded the corner toward the stairwell, he was met by six police officers with their guns trained on him. Put your hands up. One ordered. Gilberto raised his hands, protesting that it was all a misunderstanding. Within moments, his wrists were cuffed behind his back and his service weapon taken. Among the officers stood an FBI agent named Anthony Foto. Everything is going to be alright, agent Foto told him. Gilberto shook his head and said, I don't think so. Gilberto Valli was taken into custody and placed in an interview room with Agent Foto, who explained that this was Gilberto's one chance to get ahead in the game by sharing his side of the story. Gilberto declined the offer of a lawyer and began speaking. He started, quite literally from the very beginning, his childhood. Gilberto grew up in a quiet, uneventful neighbourhood in New York. He was well liked in school, had plenty of friends, earned good grades and stood out as a talented baseball player. The only shadow over his childhood was his parents troubled marriage. They argued often and when they weren't fighting they tended to ignore each other. By the time Gilberto was five, his parents had separated. Both remained devoted to him with his father pushing him to work hard and aim high while his mother nurtured his kindness, generosity and love for animals. In 2002 Gilberto left for college where he shared an apartment with three roommates. He threw himself into campus life, parties and social activities. Midway through his senior year he decided to pursue a career in law enforcement. He passed the admission test with ease and completed the 1600 question long multiple choice psychological evaluation, probing everything from racial attitudes to finances, relationships and even bedwetting. Gilberto claimed he answered truthfully and no red flags were raised. He then completed a 30 minute face to face examination with a psychologist covering his upbringing, relationships, education and lifestyle. The only issue he admitted to was trying cannabis three times. He was cleared to begin training and progressed smoothly through the academy. His first posting was to one of New York's most violent precincts. But he handled the pressure well and found it less intimidating than expected. Afterward, he was reassigned to the quieter 26th Precinct, where he still worked six years later. Gilberto loved his job, but the long, irregular hours made it difficult to maintain a social life. When a colleague suggested online dating, Gilberto decided to give it a try. He met Jackie, became a father, got married, and settled into family life. Telling all this to FBI agent Anthony Foto, Gilberto said he had nothing more to add. Agent Foto was incredulous. He knew of some very serious allegations against Gilberto that were deliberately omitted from his otherwise flawless backstory. Determined to uncover the truth, Foto spent the next two hours questioning Gilberto about the Dark Fetish Network girl, meat Hunter and the 10 women at the centre of it all. Gilberto admitted to everything, though he struggled to explain why he did it. He claimed he didn't particularly enjoy the experience and acknowledged that it was destroying his personal life. The long nights in front of the computer left him exhausted, created distance and suspicion in his marriage, and eroded any desire for intimacy with his wife. Recognising his online life was beginning to damage his real one, Gilberto said he'd started taking steps to change. In what he insisted was pure coincidence, the night before Jackie uncovered everything, he logged into the Dark Fetish Network for the last time and permanently deleted his account. Gilberto was resolute that while his online conversations about harming women might have sounded realistic, they were nothing more than make believe sexual roleplay. He was adamant that he had never hurt anyone and that no one was ever in any real danger. Despite the thousands of gruesome messages in which he discussed the abduction, rape and murder of several particular women, all of them were found safe and completely unaware of Gilberto's online activities. Many hadn't spoken to or thought about him in years. Others maintained only casual contact, exchanging birthday wishes or brief life updates. The 18 year old on Gilberto's list didn't even know him. It seemed Gilberto was telling the truth, that everything he did was confined to cyberspace. At least that's what he said. Casefile will be back shortly. Thank you for supporting us by listening to this episode's sponsors. Finding snacks that are organic, natural and enjoyable for your little ones is important. Little Bellies offers a range of snacks for babies and toddlers that help them explore tastes, shapes and textures while supporting their curiosity and development at every stage. 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Casefile Narrator (52:05)

Thank you for listening to this episode's ads. By supporting our sponsors, you support Casefile to continue to deliver quality content during his interview with Gilberto Valli, Agent Anthony Foto revealed that the FBI had made a major discovery in their investigation of Girl Meat Hunter. One of the women on his list was a New York resident named Marissa. She was an old friend and former colleague of Jackie Valli from when she worked as an elementary school teacher online. Gilberto had schemed to abduct and sell Marissa to a user he interacted with, known as Mike Van his 81 on Thursday, March 1, 2012, the day after a round of these discussions, the GPS in Gilberto's cell phone traced him to the block where Marisa lived. The implication was chilling. Gilberto hadn't merely fantasised about stalking women, but had seemingly carried out the behaviour in the real world. He insisted it was a coincidence or misunderstanding, but struggled to offer a fully credible explanation as to why he had been in the area. This discovery led to Gilberto's first chargeable offence, conspiracy to commit kidnapping. Yet that wasn't the only piece of evidence authorities found that suggested Gilberto had taken steps to turn his fantasies into reality. While on duty, Gilberto had access to a restricted law enforcement database containing sensitive information such as individuals, addresses, dates of birth, license plate numbers and other personal details. Officers were permitted to use it strictly for official police work. Records showed Gilberto had conducted unauthorised searches on multiple women from his list during his time as girl meat hunter. This discovery led to Gilberto's second and final charge. Unauthorised access to a law enforcement database. On the conspiracy charge alone. He was facing a potential life sentence. Gilberto was denied bail and remained in prison until his trial began nearly four months later in February 2013. By then, the case had become a headline staple, with the horrific and grotesque nature of Gilberto's online messages filling tabloid pages. The idea that an apparently normal, functioning member of society spent his nights talking about slitting women's throats and roasting them alive was made even more frightening by the fact that he was an active police officer sworn to protect the community. Dubbed by the media as the Cannibal Cop, Gilberto was likened to the fictional cannibalistic serial killer Dr. Hannibal Lecter from the horror thriller novel the Silence of the Lambs. Even more damning were comparisons to real life serial killers, including the infamous Milwaukee cannibal Jeffrey Dahmer, who murdered 17 men and boys and like Gilberto, harboured disturbing fascinations with human flesh. For that reason, Gilberto was widely perceived as a deviant monster and a danger to society. That was right up until his trial began. As Gilberto's trial date loomed, the evidence supporting his charge of conspiracy to commit kidnapping weakened. The police had initially claimed that GPS data placed Gilberto on the same block as the home of one of his intended victims. But this was then reduced to in the vicinity and later to being within 500 yards. Finally, the morning that Gilberto's trial was set to begin, the prosecution conceded that they would not be using the GPS evidence at all While the charge remained. The evidence now relied solely on the content of Gilberto's online activity. Make no mistake, the prosecution asserted Gilberto Valli was very serious about these plans. They contended that Google searches he had carried out demonstrated intent. Gilberto had searched for such things as how to make homemade chloroform, the best rope to tie someone up with the world's largest baking dish, and even how to prepare human meat. He had even searched how to kidnap someone. The prosecution stated that while Gilberto might not have purchased or prepared anything by the time of his arrest, the fact that he had researched these things indicated he was taking steps toward carrying out an abduction. In their view, it was fortunate that law enforcement intervened before anything could be carried out. Yet it was the absence of any physical evidence that formed the crux of the defence's case. They posited that Gilberto was Being accused of a crime he didn't commit. Searches of his apartment, car and work locker uncovered nothing of importance. According to his own so called blueprints for abductions, he lacked the tools and materials necessary to execute his plans. He had no rope, duct tape or tarps, no chloroform ingredients, and no payments from wannabe slave owners. Contrary to Gilberto's claims, he didn't have a van to transport victims, a remote house in the mountains to hold captives, or a large enough oven to fit a person. The basement of his apartment complex contained a communal laundry room, not the pulley system he said he was constructing to restrain women. The defence pointed out that Gilberto might have thought about it, he might have talked about it, but he hadn't done anything offline that demonstrated actionable intent to kidnap anybody. While acknowledging that Gilberto's online writings were scary and the stuff of horror movies, the defence maintained that it was pure fiction pretend. They argued that if having disturbing thoughts or writing violent content were a crime, then horror movie directors and author Stephen King would be in prison. In the lead up to his trial, Gilberto Valli was interviewed by Dr. Park Dietz, a world renowned forensic psychologist and criminologist who had provided expert opinions in numerous high profile cases, including that of real life cannibal Jeffrey Dahmer. Gilberto told Dr. Dietz that once he reached puberty, he immediately sensed he was different from the other boys. He discovered that he was turned on by bondage and sadomasochism, a sexual practice in which pleasure is derived from inflicting or receiving pain and humiliation. There was nothing in particular that led to these feelings with Gilberto explaining it was just there. He didn't worry about it as it was just something in his head that no one else knew about. In every other respect, he considered himself a normal, successful and good person. In the late 1990s, Gilberto went online for the first time describing it as love at first sight. Over time he discovered instant messaging and realised he could chat with strangers, pretending to be anyone he wanted. He also came across pornography, including images of women in bondage. While these images weren't particularly violent or graphic, his desires grew. He explored more websites and increasingly diverse and taboo fetishes. He first encountered cannibal related pornography in college. One site led to another until he found the dark fetish network. Gilberto explained that the, quote, weird stuff took over when he was at the computer. But he never brought his sinister thoughts into his daily life, nor did he ever experiment with his fetishes or speak about them to others. Although he enjoyed fantasising about brutal scenarios involving women, Gilberto insisted he had no desire to harm them in real life. He didn't fear any real world consequences, saying, why would I? I wasn't doing anything illegal. Gilberto claimed that his time as Girl Meat Hunter on the Dark Fetish Network was a safe and contained way to explore his fetishes with like minded people, not to plan crimes, adding, they are called fantasies for a reason. In his report on Gilberto, Valley, Dr. Park Diet stated that in his opinion, Girlmate Hunter was a role only, an exercise in sexual imagination and collaborative creative writing, and that there was no reliable evidence to suggest that his erotic conversations could reasonably be construed as conspiratorial plans rather than conversations that were an end in themselves. Dr. Dietz ultimately concluded, I found no evidence whatsoever that Mr. Valli ever harmed or actually intended to harm any woman. In Gilberto's words, the whole thing was like this big fantasy group, like a group of guys getting together to play Dungeons and Dragons or World of Warcraft. Except in our case, we weren't talking about rogues and mages and the spells they could cast. We were talking about kidnapping women and sometimes killing them too. Examination of Gilberto's extensive online correspondence showed that he frequently reminded those he engaged with that his messages were fiction. His profile on the Dark Fetish Network even included the disclaimer, I like to press the envelope, but no matter what I say, it is all fantasy. When he shared photos of women he knew in real life, he told recipients they were for fantasy only. When plotting the supposed abduction of Charlotte, Gilberto reminded Moody Blues, if you're wondering, it's all fantasy. Likewise, when Mike Vanhuyes, 81, asked if he would actually kidnap Marissa, Gilberto admitted he didn't think so. I'm just talking fantasy, he wrote. No matter what I say, it's make believe. Gilberto had exchanged thousands of emails and instant messages with around two dozen people in which he discussed kidnapping, rape, murder and cannibalism. The FBI divided the chat into two groups, ones they felt were fake and ones that they thought were real. In 21 out of 24 of these cases, the FBI had no choice but to conclude the exchanges were copied, clearly fictional roleplay. For instance, Gilberto told others that he had a woman from his top 10 list named Amanda bound and gagged in his basement, and that he planned to sell her for $3,500. This wasn't true at all. In fact, the only real world event mentioned in Gilberto's fictional chats was his brunch with Charlotte. Everything else he discussed had no direct links to reality. Still, the FBI concluded that Gilberto engaged in three real exchanges aimed at conducting criminal behaviour with Moody blues, Mike Van his 81 and Ali Khan targeting Charlotte, Marissa and Jackie respectively. The defence emphasised that the chats Gilberto had with these men contained the same language as the fictitious conversations, sometimes word for word. Additionally, the so called real chats were filled with plenty of fictitious content as well, such as Gilberto's claims that he had a human sized oven and a remote house up in the mountains. During the year long communication, none of the men involved ever took any serious steps to meet up. They never tried to uncover each other's real identities either. Gilberto routinely lied to the others about his age, marital status, job, work hours and where he lived. Their communication was sporadic, often with months passing between chats causing them to forget what had previously been discussed. Although they sometimes set dates for kidnappings, Gilberto never took any action on those days. One time he made separate plans with each of the men to abduct three different women on the same day. One was from Manhattan, one from Ohio and the third from Pakistan. Not only did he not follow through on any of these plans, the dates passed without comment, explanation or follow up from the others. Gilberto even fabricated details about the women on his list. While he did give out their first names, every other detail, such as their last names, addresses, occupations and dates of birth were false. Despite repeated requests, he never provided identifying information that would allow anyone to actually find the women. The trial's first witness was Gilberto's wife, Jackie. Her appearance on the stand marked the first time the two had seen each other since Jackie left their apartment in tears after discovering Gilberto's secret life. Jackie avoided making eye contact with Gilberto as she explained how she accidentally uncovered a girl meat hunter. She also described strange behaviours Gilberto exhibited in the months leading up up to the discovery. She said he became angry when she threw away an old suitcase of his, raising questions about whether it was the one he intended to use to abduct Marissa. For Mike Vanhei's 81, Gilberto claimed he never got angry or really cared about the discarded suitcase. He merely found it odd that Jackie got rid of it. She said that Gilberto encouraged her to start jogging at night and began asking questions about her ro, including where exactly she went, whether it was well lit and if there were people around. Although there was nothing in his online communications to support it, it was speculated that Gilberto had been gathering information about his wife's movements for a co conspirator. Gilberto said he was only ever curious to know about Jackie's jogging route to see if she was challenging herself by running up steep inclines in their neighbourhood or or sticking to flat ground. Jackie painted Gilberto as a disengaged father who rarely helped with their baby and often appeared despondent, sighing in a way that made her feel as though she was wasting his time. Overall, she described their marriage poorly. Gilberto felt the opposite to him. The year that they had a child and tied the knot was a good one, full of love and celebration. He said he loved his daughter and described Jackie as his best friend. Text messages Jackie sent Gilberto throughout 2012 showed affection and care. She wrote about how much she loved him, how he made her smile excitedly, planned family activities, called him good to her and referred to him as the best when he agreed to bring home ice cream and cookies. While Gilberto acknowledged that his computer use and hidden sexual proclivities had created some distance and a lull in intimacy, things were overall good at home with plenty of great moments. And it wasn't until Jackie discovered girlmate Hunter that she began to view their time together differently. It was Jackie who turned Gilberto into the FBI. She handed over her laptop and authorised agents to copy its hard drive. She also gave them keys to the couple's apartment and consented to the seizure of another computer Gilberto had used before it malfunctioned. When the defence asked to meet Jackie before the trial, she snapped. You're representing the man who wants to kill me. No, I don't want to talk to you. Jackie was the only woman on Gilberto's top 10 list who had anything bad to say about him at his trial. While all the other women who Gilberto fantasised about were disturbed to learn about what he'd done, none of them reported ever feeling threatened or uneasy around him in real life. During his time as Girl Meat Hunter Gilbert, he'd stopped by one of the woman's workplaces to say hello, had seen others in passing at social events and visited another in the hospital after she had a baby. At those times, he was typically accompanied by his wife or a colleague, and nothing sinister had ever occurred. The prosecution placed significant emphasis on the brunch meeting Gilberto had with Charlotte in July. Charlotte was a former college classmate of Gilberto's who lived in Maryland. The two had kept in touch over the years and it was Charlotte who had asked to meet up According to Charlotte, the brunch had been pleasant and entirely normal. Gilberto had even brought his wife and daughter. In her opinion, he was a doting father who appeared to have a good relationship with the Jackie. She didn't get any sense that he was plotting anything nefarious. When Gilberto returned home, he immediately rushed to his computer to message his friend Moody Blues that Charlotte looked mouth watering. Gilberto explained this as much as a fantasy like this may not be normal and might be shocking to many, it is no different than if I were to see a woman I knew for lunch and told a buddy of mine, man, she looked hot. He didn't speak with Moody Blues for a month after this exchange, at which point the pair never mentioned Charlotte again. The defence claimed that Gilberto used his wife and their friends as the objects of his fantasies because sexual fantasies often include those we know or find attractive, not because he actually intended to harm these specific women. As Gilberto's trial neared its conclusion, public perception of him had shifted. The prosecution's lack of concrete evidence led many to label the case a sham. Newspaper reports criticised the FBI for cherry picking statements to construct a narrative that ultimately amounted to nothing in the eyes of many. The defence had successfully underscored the absurdity of the charges. For example, why would an experienced police officer need to Google how to kidnap someone if he were truly intent on doing so? At times, the courtroom even broke into laughter at the sheer implausibility of the evidence being presented. The second charge, unauthorised access to a law enforcement database, had also lost traction. Gilberto admitted to making unauthorised searches, calling them stupid, reckless and wrong. He said he had run many names over the years, including members of his own family. He explained that he sometimes entered a random name into the database when turning on the mobile data computer in his patrol car just to test if the device was working. He had developed this habit after an NYPD officer was shot when approaching a suspect vehicle. The officer hadn't been able to run the license plate beforehand because his mobile data computer wasn't working. Aside from Jackie, the only other person from Gilberto's list that he had actually looked up on the database was his high school crush, Chloe. It was found that he had only searched her name once during his time as Girlmate Hunter, but he didn't do it to gather intelligence. Chloe testified that she had reached out to Gilberto after getting into a car accident because she needed the report number. Although Gilberto wasn't technically supposed to do this, it wasn't uncommon for officers to misuse the system and he had run Chloe's name through the database to get the number for her. The defence moved to have the case dismissed, arguing that the government had fallen far short of meeting its burden of proof. However, the judge allowed the trial to proceed in full while underscoring one critical point to the jury. There is almost no evidence of action by Gilberto Valley beyond computer based activities. In their closing arguments, the prosecution contended that Gilberto's fantasies were unacceptable and that the pornography he indulged in was, quote, not normal pornography for any human being. They argued that the defence was attempting to convince the jury of ideas that defied common sense, including that it was acceptable for an armed police officer to go about his day making detailed plans about killing real women. In their closing statements, the defence compared the case to the 1938 CBS Radio broadcast of the War of the Worlds, which was presented as a series of realistic news bulletins about a Martian invasion of Earth. Many listeners who turned in late missed the opening disclaimer that it was a dramatisation resulting in widespread panic. They also drew parallels to George Orwell's dystopian novel 1984, specifically the thought Police, whose role was not just to punish crimes, but to detect and eliminate thought crime. Any thinking that contradicted the state's ideology. The defence argued, you can't convict people for their thoughts, even if they're sick. The jury deliberated for more than two full days before returning a verdict. They found Gilberto Valli guilty of conspiracy to commit kidnapping as well as guilty of the unauthorised use of a federal database. The decision sent shockwaves through the courtroom and beyond. Despite personal opinions of Gilberto's disturbing fantasies, the prevailing belief among the press, the public and trial observers was that the defence would win. Instead, Gilberto received the maximum penalty, life in prison on the kidnapping conspiracy charge, along with a concurrent 12 month sentence for database misuse. Speaking to the press after the verdict, lead defence attorney Julia Gatto remarked, obviously the case involved thoughts that were unusual and bizarre and frankly, very ugly. We think that the jury just couldn't get past that. Defence attorney Robert Baum added, we were always worried that that thought would prevail over an objective, rational, non emotional view of the evidence. People can be prosecuted for their thoughts and convicted, which is even sadder to think about. One juror later spoke anonymously for the HBO documentary Thought the Case of the Cannibal Cop. They said the entire jury had immediately agreed that Gilberto was guilty of the unauthorised database usage, it was the kidnapping conspiracy that required longer deliberation. While all the jurors acknowledged that Gilberto had problems, some felt more strongly than others that he was guilty of that charge. For the juror being interviewed, the fact that Gilberto had shared photos of real women he knew was what made his actions more than just fantasy. However, it was Gilberto's discussions with Moody Blues about Charlotte that truly shifted the jury's perception. According to the juror, his trip to Maryland to visit Charlotte along with the document titled Abducting and Cooking a Blueprint, made it very real to the jury that any one of the women could have wound up a murder victim. Gilberto Valli appealed his conviction with the case heard in July 2014. In delivering his findings, the presiding judge described Gilberto's online communications as deviant, depraved and misogynistic, but noted that they contained a veritable avalanche of false, fictitious and fantastical information concerning himself and the steps he had allegedly taken to facilitate a kidnapping. The judge ruled that based on the evidence, it was more likely than not that all of Gilberto's online communications about kidnapping were just fantasy roleplay. His chats and emails about these topics by themselves were not enough to prove the legal elements of a conspiracy to commit kidnapping. The conspiracy charge was overturned while the charge for unauthorised use of a federal database was upheld. By that point, Gilberto had already spent 21 months in solitary confinement due to his protective status as a former police officer. He was sentenced to time served and promptly released under the conditions of one year of probation, ongoing mental health treatment, and various restrictions, including no contact with the women involved in the case and no Internet use. He remained in home confinement at his mother's house while the prosecution pursued their own appeal. The matter was fully resolved in the 2nd U.S. circuit Court of Appeals in December 2015. In a 2 to 1 ruling, the court rejected the prosecutor's arguments and upheld Gilberto's appeal. While the decision acknowledged that fantasies of violence against women contribute to a culture of exploitation and are a massive social harm that demeans women, the court emphasised that not every harm is meant to be addressed with the federal criminal law. The Second Circuit also reversed Gilberto's unauthorised database usage conviction. Outside the courtroom, Gilberto Valli offered a formal apology to everyone who had been hurt, shocked or offended by what he described as his infantile actions. Speaking to the women involved, he said, I just hope they know they were never in danger. I would never do the things I talked about on the Internet. Never. He reiterated that he was incapable of violence while acknowledging that his words alone wouldn't mean anything unless he rebuilt his life. Taking full responsibility, he it was my fault for doing all this. That's not who I really am. People who know me never believed the allegations. Gilberto's co conspirator, Moody Blues, was later identified as 57 year old Dale Bollinger, a nurse from Canterbury, England. He also faced conspiracy charges related to the Girl Meat Hunter case, as well as additional charges for separate offences including grooming an underage girl and possession of child abuse images. Bollinger was convicted on 11 charges and sentenced to to nine years in prison, though he was released after roughly three years for good behaviour. He relocated to the American state of Nebraska, but when local residents raised concerns about him living near a playground, he was taken into custody and transferred to a treatment facility for sex offenders. Gilberto's second co conspirator, Mike Van Hise, 81, had used his real name as his online username. Van his was a 23 year old mechanic from New Jersey. He was also charged and found guilty of conspiracy to commit kidnapping and sentenced to seven years in prison. His reduced sentence reflected his cooperation with authorities, a troubled childhood and the court's determination that he was less culpable than Gilberto. The third co accused, Ali Khan, was identified as a man from Pakistan, though his full identity remains unknown. Gilberto Valli has spoken publicly about his experience through various media interviews and engagements. He was featured in the HBO documentary on his case and authored a memoir titled Raw the Untold story of the NYPD's cannibal cop. He appeared in person at CrimeCon in 2019 and his case inspired an episode of Law and Special Victims Unit titled Thought Criminal. Reactions to Gilberto's outcome remained mixed. While some people accept his claims of fantasy, others believe he genuinely intended to harm women and that he remains a danger to society. He has received letters from supporters, including individuals with unconventional and morbid fetishes of their own. He has also received messages from people expressing their desire to put a bullet in his head. Gilberto claims he is unbothered by such remarks, explaining they can't overlook the fact that they can say that and have nothing happen to them, in part because of how my case played out. You can dislike me as much as you want, you can say he's a scumbag, he's a piece of garbage. But if you look at the case merely from a legal perspective, there's one conclusion you can reach. This is the country of second chances. I'm holding out hope that people who make mistakes don't have to be forever defined by those mistakes. To this day, the case continues to spark dialogue on several contentious issues, including the distinction between thought and action, the role of online platforms, media and public sensationalism, and free speech and legal precedent. It is often cited as an example of thought policing where someone is punished for their ideas rather than their actions. Speaking about the case, the policy director for the American Civil Liberties Union, Lee Rowland, said, there is always reasonable doubt about whether or not someone is going to take a particular action. Police officers don't have some magical psychic wand that allows them to know either. We don't want to give the government the ability to decide what fantasies meet the thought police's bar for acceptability. That bar is rightly high. If the First Amendment protects someone fantasising about violently raping and killing and eating a woman, it's going to protect pretty much anything you're thinking about. And that's what principles mean. They make us uncomfortable and we apply them regardless. This call is from a correctional facility.

Gilberto Valli / FBI Agent Anthony Foto (87:34)

And is subject to monitoring and recording.

Jack Lawrence / Suing Diddy Narrator (87:39)

Nearly three years ago, I started speaking with men and women incarcerated across the United States. From drugs to arson, assaults and murders, even wrongful convictions. I thought I'd heard it all. That was until I met a man who was on the brink of becoming one of the richest prisoners in the world.

Gilberto Valli / FBI Agent Anthony Foto (88:03)

This is in the matter of Derek.

Casefile Narrator (88:05)

Lee Cardello Smith versus Sean Combs. Sean Puff Daddy Combs, also known as Sean P. Diddy.

Jack Lawrence / Suing Diddy Narrator (88:14)

This man was in the midst of a legal battle to sue Sean P. Diddy combs for $100 million for what he claimed was a sexual assault committed against him by Combs in the early 90s.

Upwork Advertiser (88:27)

There's a guy named Darren Lee Cardelo Smith, a Michigan man who's incarcerated. He has now been awarded a $100 million judgment against Sean Diddy Combs for sexual assault.

Jack Lawrence / Suing Diddy Narrator (88:44)

The claims being made by Derek Lee Cardello Smith were nothing short of mind blowing tales of corruption, murder.

Casefile Narrator (88:52)

They tried to hire me to kill a Detroit police officer's wife. Her name was Rose Cox.

Jack Lawrence / Suing Diddy Narrator (88:58)

A sexual assault and ultimately what he says was his own wrongful imprisonment.

Casefile Narrator (89:04)

This is literally the woman who destroyed my life after her life was destroyed.

Jack Lawrence / Suing Diddy Narrator (89:10)

It would be a story like nothing I had documented before. And whenever I started to doubt what I was hearing, Derek would point to legal documents, paperwork and news articles that seemed to support what he was telling me. Do you even believe this guy and what he's saying, dude, I don't know what to believe anymore. Like, honestly, one minute he's telling me this thing that cannot be true, and then I Google it and there it is in black and white. He's telling the truth.

Casefile Narrator (89:36)

Holy.

Jack Lawrence / Suing Diddy Narrator (89:38)

What is going on? This is not simply just another prison story. It's one that made headlines around the world and one that would leave me questioning everything I was doing.

Casefile Narrator (89:51)

Hi Jack.

Jack Lawrence / Suing Diddy Narrator (89:51)

I feel like I'm part of some sort of Twilight Zone right now. I'll be honest. So if you think you've heard it all before, when it comes to crime stories, trust me, you haven't heard anything like this.

Casefile Narrator (90:03)

You're on the cusp. You're on the cost of something extremely huge.

Jack Lawrence / Suing Diddy Narrator (90:07)

Suing Diddy, the brand new podcast from Casebot Presents is out now. Wherever you get your podcasts.

Gilberto Valli / FBI Agent Anthony Foto (90:19)

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Casefile Narrator (91:20)

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