Podcast Summary: Catholic Saints – Episode on St. Anselm of Canterbury
Introduction
In the April 21, 2025 episode of Catholic Saints, hosted by Taylor Kemp from the Augustine Institute, listeners are introduced to the life and legacy of St. Anselm of Canterbury. Joined by Dr. Elizabeth Klein, a professor from the Graduate School of Theology, the episode delves deep into Anselm's contributions to theology, his role in the Investiture Controversy, and his enduring influence on the Catholic Church.
Early Life and Path to Monasticism
Taylor Kemp opens the discussion by welcoming Dr. Klein, emphasizing her expertise in Catholic saints. Dr. Klein provides an overview of St. Anselm's early life, highlighting his birth in northern Italy in 1033 and his eventual entry into monastic life at the age of 27, after a period of wandering across France and Italy.
Dr. Elizabeth Klein [04:32]: "Anselm made the Abbey of Bec a center of learning and wrote many of his treatises during his time there."
Anselm's rapid rise within the monastery is noted, becoming prior just three years after joining and subsequently the abbot, setting the stage for his influential role in the Church.
The Investiture Controversy
A significant portion of the episode focuses on the Investiture Controversy, a power struggle between secular authorities and the papacy over the appointment of church officials.
Dr. Elizabeth Klein [00:48]: "Anselm of Canterbury is a monk, abbot, bishop, theologian, doctor of the church... his masterpiece, Cur Deus Homo, kind of one of the earliest theological reflections on the nature of the incarnation and Christ's atonement, still very appealing today."
Taylor Kemp succinctly explains the Investiture Controversy for listeners unfamiliar with the term, describing it as the conflict over whether kings had the authority to appoint bishops.
Taylor Kemp [02:19]: "Do we need to know much about it? Let's take a quick look."
Dr. Klein elaborates on how Anselm navigated this controversy, initially avoiding involvement with English kings who sought to control ecclesiastical appointments. Anselm's eventual acceptance of the Archbishopric of Canterbury brings him into direct conflict with King William II, who attempts to assert his authority over the Church by withholding necessary ecclesiastical symbols.
Dr. Elizabeth Klein [06:02]: "Anselm being forced to become Bishop, he refuses. His monks are refusing to relinquish him as Abbot."
The negotiation between Anselm and the king highlights the delicate balance between spiritual authority and secular power.
Exile and Political Struggles
Anselm's commitment to the Church's autonomy leads to his exile when King William II reneges on his agreement to support Urban II over the anti-Pope Clement III.
Dr. Elizabeth Klein [06:57]: "The King refuses these terms, so he's like, ah, I didn't really want you to be bishop that badly."
During his exile, Anselm engages in theological debates with Greek bishops, striving to maintain communion between Eastern and Western Christianity. His return to England under Henry I is marked by further conflicts over the rightful investiture of church leaders, ultimately leading to significant clergy reforms influenced by the Gregorian Reforms.
Dr. Elizabeth Klein [09:58]: "He enacts clergy reforms that include banning clerics from marriage, having mistresses, and drunkenness."
These reforms cement Anselm's legacy as a pivotal figure in establishing the Church's moral and spiritual integrity.
Theological Contributions
The episode transitions to Anselm's enduring theological work, particularly his seminal work, Cur Deus Homo ("Why God Became Man"), and the ontological argument for God's existence.
Dr. Elizabeth Klein [13:05]: "Cur Deus Homo is a deep reflection on the causes of the Incarnation and why this makes sense as a plan of God."
Anselm's ontological argument, though complex, is explained in an accessible manner. He posits that defining God as "that than which nothing greater can exist" necessitates God's existence, as existence is a predicate that adds to the greatness of a being.
Dr. Elizabeth Klein [14:22]: "His essential argument for the existence of God is if you can imagine God, he has to exist... if you can define God as that which, then nothing greater can exist. He must exist, because that would be the greatest thing."
Taylor Kemp reflects on the challenging nature of this argument, acknowledging its abstractness while recognizing its intuitive appeal.
Taylor Kemp [15:38]: "It's a little weird. It's jarring the first time you hear it because you're like, I have never even tried to think of something if I can imagine something, therefore it is is a very odd thing to think about."
Dr. Klein concurs, noting that while the ontological argument isn't universally accepted as conclusive, its intuitive strength resonates deeply.
Dr. Elizabeth Klein [16:50]: "There's an extremely strong intuitive attractiveness of this argument... it kind of echoes the image of God in our souls."
Relevance and Lessons from Anselm's Life
As the discussion draws to a close, Dr. Klein emphasizes the enduring relevance of Anselm's life and work. She draws parallels between Anselm and later saints like Thomas Becket and Thomas More, who similarly balanced spiritual authority against secular power.
Dr. Elizabeth Klein [18:31]: "When you look into the last of these saints, you're like, sorry, what was happening... and people remained faithful."
She highlights the comforting and inspiring aspects of Anselm's steadfast faith and dedication to the Church, despite the tumultuous political landscape.
Dr. Elizabeth Klein [19:12]: "You can have it all. He is wonderful."
Conclusion
Taylor Kemp wraps up the episode by expressing gratitude to Dr. Klein and the listeners, reinforcing the significance of understanding saints like St. Anselm of Canterbury in appreciating the Church's history and resilience.
Taylor Kemp [19:26]: "Thank you all, dear listeners, for joining us for another episode of Catholic Saints. We will see you next time."
Final Thoughts
This episode of Catholic Saints offers a comprehensive exploration of St. Anselm of Canterbury's life, his theological contributions, and his pivotal role in the Investiture Controversy. Through engaging dialogue and expert insights, listeners gain a deeper appreciation for Anselm's enduring legacy within the Catholic tradition.