BRD Around the World and the Economics of Creep Feeding

Summary

Podcast Summary: BCI Cattle Chat

Episode: BRD Around the World and the Economics of Creep Feeding
Date: August 7, 2026
Host: Brad White and BCI Cattle Chat Team
Guest: Dr. Selwyn Hedley, Professor of Veterinary Pathology, Londrina State University, Brazil

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Episode Overview

This episode of BCI Cattle Chat features an international perspective on bovine respiratory disease (BRD) with guest Dr. Selwyn Hedley from Brazil. The hosts and Dr. Hedley compare the epidemiology, pathogens, and management of BRD in Brazil and North America. The second major topic is an in-depth discussion on the practice and economics of creep feeding in beef cattle production—covering definitions, management strategies, risks, and cost-effectiveness.

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1. International Perspectives on BRD (00:58–13:43)

Similarities and Differences in BRD Between Brazil and North America

• Pathogens and Economic Impact:

  • Dr. Hedley: “I think we have the same pathogens. And I think the cost is more or less the same.” (04:30)
  • Both regions encounter similar economic and health problems due to BRD.

• Feedlot Demographics:

  • In Brazil, most feedlot cattle are steers (males), with a small percentage being females, unlike the mix in North America. (04:30)

• Multiple Pathogen Infections:

  • Dr. Bob Larson: “Respiratory disease is a syndrome, meaning there’s a number of viruses, there’s a number of bacteria involved, and... commonly more than one at a time.” (05:38)
  • Multiple pathogens (viruses and bacteria) are found in most BRD cases, making disease control more difficult.

Pathogen Profile Comparisons

• U.S. Pathogens: Manheimia haemolytica, Mycoplasma bovis, Pasteurella multocida, Histophilus somni, IBR, BVDV.

• Brazil Pathogens (per Dr. Hedley):

  • More Histophilus; some Manheimia; little Mycoplasma (perhaps underdiagnosed)
  • Viruses: “mostly BVD, some BRSV, herpesvirus 1, but hardly see bovine parainfluenza virus.” (07:45)
  • Malignant Catarrhal Fever (MCF) agent is emerging as a co-factor: “We always see it associated with other viral pathogens... should be considered as an emerging cause of pneumonia in cattle.” (08:22)

• Diagnosis Methods:

  • PCR is standard, but immunohistochemistry can better demonstrate active lesions and the presence of pathogens. (11:55–12:20)

Management and Risk Factors

• Shipping Fever & Commingling:

  • Both countries’ feedlots purchase cattle from far distances; shipping and commingling are major stressors and BRD risk factors. (10:42)
  • “Feedlots normally will buy cattle from municipalities within the state or without the state... these animals, they are transported. And then what we see is that these animals become sick.” (10:42 – Dr. Hedley)

• Production System and Disease Dynamics:

  • Similar management patterns in Brazil and North America, including cow-calf systems, weaning, and feedlot phases.
  • Interstitial pneumonia is also observed in both countries (11:55).

Notable Quotes & Moments

• Dr. Hedley on Emergent Pathogens: “MCF alone doesn’t cause pneumonia. We always see it associated with other viral pathogens—so probably there is some synergism between MCF and the other viral pathogens to induce pneumonia.” (08:42)
• Dr. Hedley on Brazil’s BRD Status: “Brazil is... one of the leading cattle producers actually. But we think we are behind everybody in terms of cut health. So we are running behind, but I think we’ll get there.” (13:16)

Key Takeaways

• BRD is a global problem with largely shared pathogens, complicated further by multiple infections.
• Control requires holistic management across the production system.
• There are diagnostic and management nuances by region, but the fundamentals remain the same.

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2. The Economics and Management of Creep Feeding (14:06–24:33)

Definition and Methods

• Dr. Philip Lancaster:
  • “Providing some source of feed that nursing calves have access to that the dams do not.” (14:06)
  • Can be via grain (creep feeders), special forage plots (creep grazing), etc.

Reasons for Creep Feeding

• Dr. Bob Larson:
  • “As the forage quantity and/or quality are going down... a young growing animal... would benefit from additional calories and show that with additional growth.” (15:10)
  • Especially considered near the end of grazing season when natural nutrition declines.

Alternatives: Early Weaning

• Calves can be weaned earlier and put on a complete diet, which may be more efficient in certain operations (16:56–17:08).
• Weaning reduces feed competition and reduces cow’s intake needs by 20–25% (16:56–17:08).

Nutritional and Economic Considerations

• Creep feeding does not significantly reduce nursing; it mainly replaces forage consumption, not milk (17:08–17:52).

  • "He's a teenager, he's gonna eat everything you've present him. So he'll... eat everything." (17:14—Dr. Bob Larson)

• Costs versus benefits must be considered:

  • Additive gain is not solely from creep feed, as it replaces some grass intake (20:24–21:55).
  • Tools like economic spreadsheets are essential to compare cost of gain versus added value.

• Brad White: “Well there’s a cost associated with creep feeding…” (19:04)

• Dr. Bob Larson: “...my spreadsheet, it'd be better to go ahead and just wean the calf.” (19:12)

Efficiency and Limiting Intake

• Limiting creep feed intake increases efficiency.
  • “Don’t let it be ad libitum intake... limit the amount to a reasonable [level].” (21:55—Dr. Philip Lancaster)
  • Type and quality of creep feed vs. available forage makes a big difference.

Nuances for Breeding Stock

• Dr. Bob Larson: “Extra calories in a female [pre-puberty] can have some damage. You’ll put some fat deposition in the udder, particularly with a starch-based creep feed.” (21:55–22:30)
  • For replacements (heifers or bulls), manage feed accordingly—heifers should avoid high-starch, bulls may benefit from calories.

Feed Types and Substitution Effect

• Different feeds replace forage at different rates:
  • “Starch feeds... have a higher substitution effect on the forage than high fiber type feeds.” (23:37)
  • Using high-fiber feeds (e.g., soybean hulls) can “add more calories on top of forage and replace less.” (23:37–24:10)

Notable Quotes & Moments

• Dr. Bob Larson on Teenager Analogy: "Think teenager, they would benefit from some additional calories and show that with additional growth.” (15:10)
• Dr. Bob Larson on Predation: “Raccoons will get fat if the feed’s out there all the time.” (19:12)

Key Takeaways

• Creep feeding can improve calf growth under diminishing forage quality, but its appropriateness is highly operation-dependent and must be economically justified.
• Early weaning is often a more straightforward and sometimes more cost-effective growth strategy.
• For breeding stock, especially replacement heifers, excess energy (particularly from starch sources) can be detrimental.
• Precision in feed type, timing, and method is critical; a “one size fits all” approach does not work.

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Memorable Moments

• International Food Discussion (00:56–03:56):
  • Dr. Hedley misses “Pepper Pot,” a beef and pork stew with a unique sauce from his native Guyana—a lighthearted segment that highlights the diversity among cattle professionals and the importance of cultural exchange.

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Important Timestamps

• 00:58–04:30 – Introduction of Dr. Hedley and setup of BRD discussion
• 05:38–08:42 – Discussion of BRD as a syndrome and common pathogens
• 10:42–13:16 – Cattle movement, commingling, and BRD risks in Brazil
• 13:43–15:00 – Transition to topic of creep feeding
• 15:10–20:24 – Nutritional and economic considerations of creep feeding
• 21:55–24:33 – Feed substitution effects and management for replacement stock

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Conclusion

This episode provides a robust overview of BRD from a global perspective, emphasizing both shared challenges and region-specific nuances. The conversation on creep feeding balances practical management advice with economic realities and animal health considerations. Overall, listeners gain a multi-faceted understanding of both disease management and the feeding strategies guiding today’s beef industry.

Transcript

[A]

Hi, welcome to BCI Cattle Chat.

[B]

I'm Brad White.

[A]

Happy to have you with us and happy to have our crew here in the studio.

[C]

Morning, Bob. Good morning, Philip.

[B]

Hello, guys.

[A]

And we have a guest today all the way from Brazil, Dr. Selwyn Hedley. Good morning, Selwyn.

[D]

Good morning.

[A]

So we're glad to have you with us. Tell us just briefly, I know you've done some research on bovine respiratory disease and the epidemiology and path in Brazil. Tell us, what's your job title and where do you work?

[D]

Currently I'm working as a professor of veteran pathology at London State University and there I'm involved in the diagnosis and immunology of bovine respiratory disease. So I collaborate with colleagues from all over Brazil on all of the place. Including us.

[A]

Yes. And we're, we're glad you're here because we're collaborating with you on a project, trying to look at some of the similarities and differences between BRD or bovine respiratory disease between here and Brazil. That's one of the topics that we're going to talk about today. We're also going to talk about creep feeding and how does creep feeding impact cattle growth? Is it economically feasible? When should we or should we not do it? We'll dive into those topics. But I wanted to remind you, if you have a listener question or anything you'd like us to discuss, you can send an [e-mail]. before we get into those topics, guys, because someone's here from out of country, I wanted to find out when you leave the country, when you leave home, what's one of the things that you really miss about home that you can't always get when you go to a different country? Bob,

[C]

be able to plug in my electronic devices without having some sort of a converter because I've done it a few times when I plug something in and it fries it. So I like, I don't know if the way the United States does electricity is the best, but that's what, but it's what you're used to, what I've

[A]

got, that's what your stuff is designed for.

[C]

That's what I miss is US Based electricity. Voltage.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

Philip, I don't know. I mean, I like going to different countries and seeing different stuff, trying different food and, and lots of stuff like that. But I mean, I think probably the thing that you miss after being gone for a while is just the familiarity of your routine here at home. And because you're doing everything different, everything's not the same. And so you just feel out of place.

[A]

Sometimes I think you're thinking like I'm thinking, but not to put too fine a point on it. Cheeseburgers. Selwyn. What do you miss when you leave home?

[D]

Where's home? If you've been in Guyana. If you've been in Guyana. Where? You're in Guyana. I miss everything from Guyana because the culture in Guyana is quite different. I miss the food from Guyana. Yeah.

[C]

Food is.

[A]

Was there a specific food that you miss?

[D]

Yes, yes. It's called Pepper Pot. Pepper pot. Pepper pot.

[A]

And what's in it?

[D]

It's beef. Yeah, it's pork. And there is a special sauce that's only made in Guyana. So persons living in New York, they have access to the sauce. But me in Brazil, there's no sauce without my paper pot. And it's a favorite Christmas food. So Christmas, I'm done.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[C]

That actually sounds pretty good.

[A]

Just from the title. And two favorite ingredients.

[C]

Beef and pork.

[D]

Beef and pork.

[A]

Beef and pork and pepper. It's got to have pepper in it.

[D]

Yeah, pepper.

[A]

Excellent. We're glad you're here and able to visit with us. And you and I and Dr. Feitosa here and a couple other people in the North America have been collaborating on some BRD projects. So one of the things that we're looking at is some of the epidemiology and causation of BRD and how we could better try to control it. So from your viewpoint, or what are some similarities between BRD between Brazil and North America, and maybe what are some differences?

[D]

I think we have the same pathogens. I think we have the same pathogens. And I think the cost is more or less the same. The economic impacts is more or less the same. More or less the same that we have in person and you guys. And you guys have over here. But I think the only thing that is different, if you look at brd, if you look at. If you look at feedlots, the feeders. Feeders in Brazil, they are mostly stairs. Different of here, you might have males and females. So it's pedophile stage. You might have some females. But that's not normal. That's normal. It's a small percentage of the feeders for the females. It's basically. It's basically still. So that's kind of different

[A]

characteristics of the population, but some of the pathogens. And as we were talking before we get on, someone mentioned, Bob, that they're seeing a lot of multiple pathogen infections. Is that what you would expect?

[C]

Yeah, that's actually what we expect here there are some diseases where a specific germ causes a specific disease, and one we use in veterinary medicine all the time is rabies. So to have rabies, you have the rabies virus, and that's the only thing that causes that. But there are other things that are really syndromes. So respiratory disease is a syndrome, meaning there's a number of viruses, there's a number of bacteria involved, and in fact, commonly more than one at a time. You know, some of our digestive, some scours and things like that would be similar. And so in those situations, you can't just say, well, the disease and the germ are the same thing in rabies. The disease and the germ are basically the same thing in respiratory disease. That's not true. Now, that that means that sometimes control is more difficult because maybe we have extremely good control on a specific virus, but another virus or bacteria kind of fills that empty spot and we still have disease. And so, yeah, I'm not surprised at all that in other parts of the world, when they diagnose pneumonia in cattle, they're getting several viruses, several bacteria, and, you know, different outbreaks, different animals within the same outbreak might have really different loads of those germs.

[A]

And to put names on those. And I'd be curious, Selwyn, if this is what you see. But we see bacteria, Manhymia hemolytica, Mycoplasma bovis, Pasteurella, multacida, sometimes histophilus. So those bacteria, and then we'll see viruses, infectious bovine rhinotracheitis, bovine viral diarrhea would be some that we see. Does that have some overlap with what you see or do you see some differences?

[D]

More or less the same. But if you look at the bacteria pathogens, we see more histophysis, some, and then we are seeing some mahemia, but we don't see much mycoplasma associated with brd. Maybe it's not been diagnosed. Yeah, yeah.

[A]

It's harder to culture if you're using culture, but you can find it on some other techniques.

[D]

Yeah, normally we use pe. Pcr. We use pcr. Then if you look at the viral pathogens, we see mostly bvd. Okay, bvd. And then there is some brsv. And there's also herpesvirus one. And we hardly see bovine PI influenza virus. We don't see that much. And then we are seeing the agent of MCF as a cause of respiratory disease.

[C]

Malignant catarrhal fever.

[D]

Exactly.

[C]

Which we don't see that very often. In the United States. And when we do, a lot of times we think of it as either sheep or possibly zoo animals or some of the extraneous exposure. Yeah, kind of. So we see it in the United States, but not commonly.

[D]

Okay, okay. So what we believe is that MCF alone doesn't cause pneumonia. We always see it associated with other viral pathogens. So probably there is some synth synergism between MCF and the other viral pathogens to induce pneumonia, pneumonia in cancer. But then we believe that it should be considered as an emerging cause of pneumonia in cats. And I think the more you investigate, chances are you're going to figure you're going to find it in mixed infections.

[C]

Some of our diagnostic labs do have the testing capability. I think as veterinarians, we'd probably have to ask for it for it to be run.

[A]

Well, the tricky part is presence of a pathogen. And we've just named a bunch of pathogens that a lot of times the. The actual host of the pathogen is cattle. They don't always cause disease. Just finding that pathogen doesn't mean it's disease causing. There are some other risk factors. And I guess we're interested in learning a little bit about cattle production in Brazil. So in the US it would be pretty typical. We'd have cow calf herds, they would wean the calves. They may go to a growing phase and then go to a feed yard. And I know Bob, you had some questions on marketing.

[C]

You know, in fact, in the United States we used to and still do sometimes call bovine respiratory disease. We'll call it shipping fever because a lot of times it's associated with the movement of cattle. And with that, a lot of times commingling cattle, so bringing cattle from different sources. So a couple of risk factors that, that are fairly important are transportation and co mingling like through an auction market or at. At a facility. Do you have in Brazil, Is it. Is it similar to North America in that you have auction markets and a fair amount of distance that cattle move to the feedlots, or is it different?

[D]

It's more. It's more or less the same. For example, feedlots normally will buy cattle from municipalities within the state or without the state. And these animals, they are transported. So mostly when they arrive at the feedlot, they will be processed. And then what we see is that these animals become sick. So it's more or less. More or less the same thing?

[A]

Well, we call it shipping fever, but shipping is a. Is a stress. But a lot of times the commingling is a Part of that process. So we get animals that were grown on one operation. They may have been for lack of a better term used to some of those pathogens. They expose other cattle and that's where we get some of those infections. So interesting that you see a lot of the same issues with respiratory disease. We've also done some work on a little variation of respiratory disease called interstitial pneumonia and interstitial pneumonia. I'd be curious if you also see that in the feed yards because we'll see it some here.

[D]

Yes, yes. We do see a lot of interstitial pneumonia. And then we use immune acid chemistry as a better diagnosis rather than pci because I showed the lesion and I confirmed the presence of the agent by immuno is the chemistry and it's better than pci. I can show you there's a. There's a lesion there and there is the bug.

[A]

Yeah.

[D]

So I prefer using histopathology with PCR and do molecular biology just for confirmation or for publication.

[A]

Yeah. And I think one of the take homes from this discussion is respiratory disease. Not unique to North America. A lot of the same pathogens, maybe a little different prevalence of some pathogens in different regions of the world. But finding just the presence of those pathogens doesn't tell me exactly what's going on. And you guys alluded to it. There's several risk factors that lead to respiratory disease and sound like some similarities us and Brazil. And that's if we want to manage to decrease it, we have to manage holistically. So from the start as much as possible to try to decrease those. Appreciate you sharing some of that information with us, Selwyn and sharing some of the work that you're doing. Anything else that you want to share relative to your work on respiratory disease?

[D]

I think Brazil is a major. One of the leading cattle producers actually. But we think we are behind everybody in terms of cut health. So we are running behind. We are running behind, but I think we'll get there.

[A]

Yep. So there's some opportunities to improve and improve the health which. Which by nature improves the efficiency of production.

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

Which is a good lead in for our next topic that we wanted to talk about. Philip, I'm going to turn to you and I'm going to have you start with the definition. So we had some questions relative to creep feeding. Maybe tell us what is when somebody says creep feeding, what does that mean to you? And then we'll dive into the intricacies of it.

[B]

So we generally I think maybe a kind of a Pure definition would be providing some source of feed that calves that are nursing calves have access to that the dams do not have access to. And that can be several different things. We generally think about a creep feeder where we're feeding a grain supplement and then the, and the calves, we have a creep gate where the calves can get to the feeder and the cows can't. But you could also do things like creep grazing where you have a plot of high quality forage and with a creep gate that the calves can get into there and graze on that and the cows cannot. So there's, there's different ways of doing it, providing different feedstuffs and things like that. But in overall we're providing something to the calves with limiting the access by the dams.

[A]

So Bob, what's the, what's the reason that you would do creep feeding? And is there a time frame that this makes sense?

[C]

Yeah, we often get questions about creep feeding as we get kind of towards the, the end of the grazing season, so starting about now and going into the early fall. And it's because, you know, the forage quantity and or quality are going down. And you know, for an adult cow that doesn't have a growth component, the, the nutrients that are available in the forage may be perfectly fine to maintain her body condition. But a young growing animal, think teenager, they would benefit from some additional calories and show that with additional growth.

[A]

I like your teenager now. Yeah, they're raiding the fridge.

[C]

They're raiding the fridge. And so then one of the questions is, well, so as the forage decreases in the total caloric potential for that calf to consume, maybe we could add some additional grain or byproduct feeds that would kind of meet some additional calories. The real question starts to come to, is that the best way to do it and is it cost effective? So the other way to get extra calories into the calves is actually to wean them and then put them on a total diet that meets their caloric needs. And sometimes that meets some of our goals. If we're, if we're kind of worried about the carrying capacity of the ground or something like that, taking those calves off by, by the time they're a pretty big calf, they're consuming, I don't know, 2% of their body weight, maybe, maybe one and a half.

[B]

It's probably. Yeah, yeah.

[C]

And so. Yeah.

[B]

Oh yeah. Because they're probably consuming close to 10 pounds of dry matter when they're, you know, 4 to 500 pounds.

[C]

Yeah. And so I take all those calves away and that's basically removing quite a bit of grazing pressure. And then that leaves more for the cows.

[B]

Well, and you take the, you take the lactation drive off the cow, her intake will drop by 20, 25%. And so that weaning the calf is

[C]

a good way to stretch.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

But if you creep feed them, is he gonna nurse less?

[C]

I wouldn't say so in that basically he's gonna, he's a teenager, he's gonna get, he's gonna eat everything you've present him. So he'll.

[A]

But you're going to have milkshakes before you have your vegetables.

[B]

Probably their preference is for milk then. And then probably the creep feed. So what you're going to replace is the forage in their diet is what you're going to replace.

[A]

So.

[B]

Which has some, some implications to it.

[A]

Yeah, but. But not as if my goal of creep feeding is to put condition back on my cows. Yeah, that may not help.

[B]

No, not, not don't. We don't generally think that that's going to make a big difference.

[A]

Is it, is there a too early time to start creep feeding? So if I'm exposed. Because I know and we've had discussions, beef dairy calves, they're exposed to feed relatively early in life. Should I expose some of these beef calves when they're two weeks old, a month old, six weeks old?

[B]

You know, that's a really interesting question, and I've had that thought before, is because we would. Those calves in a dairy system, we're going to wean them pretty early off milk, two months, you know, something like that. And the reason we give them grain instead of forage is because the grain increases the speed of rumen development. We get more, it's easily more easily digested by bacteria. It produces a higher volume of all the fatty acids. And so you get rumen development of the microbiome in there and the rumen epithelial tissue itself faster so that you can transition off of milk sooner. And so what? I don't know that there's any research that I'm aware of that would that be beneficial to a beef calf? And you know, we don't really have a good answer to that, but it's an interesting question.

[A]

Well, there's a cost associated with creep feeding. And Bob, I wonder, I'm going to go out on a limb. Do you have a spreadsheet that's associated with creep feeding?

[C]

I actually do. And it really often is an economic question is the cost of gain so the. Because they'll gain more, they Will gain more. But there's a couple of inefficiencies. One is, a lot of times I can get better feed efficiency by weaning the calf and just putting them on this diet rather than keeping him on forage and milk and a creep feed. The other thing is we have some wildlife predation of the feed. Raccoons will get fat if the feed's out there all the time. And that, of course, doesn't go into an economic viable outcome. And so it really comes down to, in your system, is this the most economical way to put some cat, some gain on calves? And then sometimes yes. But a lot of times, in my opinion, in my spreadsheet, it'd be better to go ahead and just wean the calf. And again, we're talking about weaning them maybe not at the, you know, if I'm typically going to wean them at six to seven months of age, maybe four to five or five to six a little bit earlier, they'll do, they'll do fine on my operation on a. On a growing type of ration. So it's really an option, But I think you need to put a pencil to it. The cost of gain versus the value of that gain.

[B]

Yeah, I would agree with that. I'll disagree with Bob in that I don't think the calf is really any less efficient with the creep feed than he is with put him in a dry lot and giving him feed. I mean, he's the same physiological calf. The difference is how we measure the gain and the conversion on creep feed. Because the way we measure it, we don't know how much grass they're consuming. We measure it based on added gain to calves that are not getting creep feed. And what you're doing though, is you're replacing forage in their diet. So you're not gain adding calories. You're replacing pounds with a higher calorie density. And so that's not exactly the same thing. And so from an economic standpoint, the. I think there's a big factor or two. I'll say two big factors when it comes to the economics of creep feeding. One, limit the amount of creep feed. Don't let it be ad libitum intake. You know, limit the amount to a reasonable. You know, we usually say probably 50% of what you think they're eating in forage. But then the, the bigger the difference in the quality of the creep feed, the nutrient value of the creep feed versus the forage. So if you got some really low quality stem stuff that you got Cows on that. The bigger that difference is, the more value creep feeding has because you're increasing the calorie intake that much more by replacing forage in their diet.

[C]

Yeah, a couple of things. This is an interesting topic and one that it obviously it depends because I'm going to bring in another factor and that's on future reproduction. So if we're talking about calves going to stocker feedlot, you know, I think it's an economic decision. Calorie, you know, what's the best way to deliver the calories to get the growth? If we're talking about replacement heifers or bulls, a little different question in that. And this is where it gets tricky. Pretty weaning. So pre puberty, puberty, extra calories in a female can have some damage. You'll put some fat deposition in the other, particularly a starch based creep feed or supplemental feed. So I really don't want too much extra calories in the form of starch, particularly in prepuberoal heifers. You know what's interesting and frustrating, There might be a benefit in prepuberables. There is some, some benefits to a little more calories, a little more readily available calories in that bull during that same growth phase. And so if you're talking about replacements, and I'm a purebred producer, I may want to separate cows with bull calves and manage them a little bit differently than cows with heifer calves. Just to throw a little complexity into the question.

[A]

Well, and some of the issues that you guys talked about are time dependent, right?

[C]

So that's absolutely.

[A]

If I creep feed for a short period of time, for a few weeks

[C]

pre weaning, there's, there's some real positives there from a weaning transition standpoint. And I'm not putting a lot of time and money and calories into them. So a short term creep feeding may be very different than the last couple of months of grazing.

[B]

Yeah, I would agree that one thing I was going to mention, the type of feed that you use impacts the substitution of the forage. So starch feeds, grains have a higher substitution effect on the forage than high fiber type feeds. So like soybean hulls, wheat mids, those types of things will have a lower substitution effect. So then you, if you can get them to eat the amount, you know, you're adding more calories on top of forage and replacing less. So think about the types of feeds that are in that creep feed. Don't just throw a bunch of corn

[A]

out there because you, you don't want to substitute. You want to supplement if you can.

[B]

If you can, because you're adding more calories on top of the forage. That way. If you're substituting pound for, if you're substituting pound for pound, then you're, you're not gaining as much. If I'm substituting half a pound for a pound, then I'm gaining more calories into that calf.

[A]

Absolutely. Great, great discussion there, guys, and appreciate you answering that question. Appreciate Dr. Headley joining us and talking about BRD in Brazil. If you have questions, comments you'd like us to talk about, you can send us an email at bci@ksu edu.