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A
Hi, welcome to BCI Cattle Chat. I'm Brad White. Happy to have you with us. Happy to have our crew here in the studio. Morning, Todd.
B
Morning, Bob.
C
Good morning, everybody.
D
Dustin, good morning.
A
So we're glad you guys are here because we've got a couple topics that we're going to discuss today. On a previous episode, we talked about imports and the importance of that to the cattle industry. So we'll address that. We've also had some back and forth and discussion on brucellosis. So we'll outline some of the things that we know about brucellosis and the vaccination control process here in the US before we get into those topics. Guys, we've come through spring and spring is the time of temperature extremes, especially here in the Midwest when it goes from hot to cold, cold to hot. I want to hear your story of one time that you were maybe outside working or in a situation you were caught unprepared for the rapid weather change. And it could be spring or fall. But tell me an example of a time, because I can think of several times I was out and the weather changed dramatically and all of a sudden the clothing did not fit the scenario.
C
Yeah, in a way, I think this could still happen to me now, but I do have a phone that gives me weather updates. Back in the day, you were a little bit more at risk of things changing. And I can remember being, you know, miles from anywhere and just get drenched to the bone. And it's because I had no idea that.
A
That the rain was coming.
C
That the rain was coming. Yeah.
A
Yeah.
D
I mean, even though I do have my phone and apps, I still most of the time get surprised. Yeah. And so a recent one watching a high school basketball game, it was towards the end of the season. My wife and I both walk in in a. It was really nice in February. Right. We both walk in just wearing a long sleeve T shirt and you walk out. It was pouring, it was windy and it was cold. And like it wasn't just raining a little bit, it was pouring. And of course we had to park like half a mile away.
A
And so you went and picked up the car for it.
D
I did. I. I ran as fast as I possibly could and I kept thinking, please don't pull a muscle, please don't get hurt. I get to the car and then I drive up and yeah, pick my wife up. But yeah, I was sitting there thinking, man, I'm going to get hurt doing this. I didn't stretch.
A
Todd.
B
When I was a teenager, we had a little car called the River Rat. It was a 1984 Mercury Lynx front wheel drive hatchback. You could fold the back seat down and it made a fairly good sleeping area. So naturally my brother and I decided it was the perfect vehicle to go elk hunting with. So we go up to this unit on the Idaho Montana border, pretty close to Manida Pass, and it was a beautiful fall day and we go elk hunting. We both had cow tags and so we spend the whole afternoon traipsing around the hills of Idaho and glorious fall day. We come back to camp, we, you know, make Dinty Moore beef stew on the campfire. Everything's just perfect.
C
Life is good.
B
And we wake up in the morning and there are 6 inches of snow on the ground. And we're in a front wheel drive Mercury Lynx with no tread on the tires. We're back in the mountains and we were so stuck. So, so stuck. We ended up after some, many heartfelt prayers and some a little bit of innovation. We rigged up a willow pole that we found and we would tie it to the front of the car and we used the willow pole to ratchet our way up the hill out of the little draw we were in, and finally made it back to the highway so that we can drive home.
C
Stories from the Oregon Trail.
B
He almost got stuck in the mountains though, with that snowstorm. And we got back home, there wasn't a, wasn't a flake of snow on the ground. But you know, Manida passes 7,8000ft and weather changed just like that.
D
So what happens if you got an elk or two? Where were you in your little car?
B
We, if we'd have gotten an elk, we were, we would have probably quartered it out and hung it up in a tree and then gone home and gotten somebody to come back up with a pickup and haul it home for us. So I don't think my parents really expected us to shoot anything. So. Yeah, we just, we were just out. I mean, we were just kids. We were just out having a good time.
A
Yeah, it is the, it is that time of year and there are times we're caught unprepared, even when we have our, have our phones. One of the things I want to follow up on, and on a previous episode, we had a listener question relative to what are the prices of cattle going to be in the next few years? Which I thought was a good discussion, but a part of that discussion that came up was the importance and the changes in some of the imports. So we talked about the cattle cycle, our cattle inventory, but the cattle imports have Also been in the news for a variety of reasons lately. So Dustin wanted to give, have you kind of give us a background on what's our current status there and what are some of the things we should be thinking about relative to imports.
D
So I guess the first thing is maybe just taking a step back before we talk about kind of the current situation. You know, you know, we export beef anywhere from 10 to 15% and. But yet we import 10 to 15, maybe a little more. And so people are probably asking, well,
A
why, why do we have, why do
C
we have trucks leaving this way and trucks back that way?
D
And so I, I think, you know, when you say, oh, beef, well, it, yes, it is beef, but it's pro. There's different products, right. You got over 200 different products of an animal. And what we export is much different than what we import the products. Right. So when we export, we will export, you know, high value products to various countries. Maybe Asian countries like Japan, like tongues for example, or short ribs to maybe South Korea, but then in awful to maybe the Middle east liver stuff that we don't consume here. Otherwise if we didn't consume it, if we didn't export it, we probably would have to pay money to put it into a landfill.
C
Oh, my mother would still cook that stuff.
D
But in general. Right, but so there's that which we've talked about demand on previous podcasts and saying that relates back to that discussion. But what do we import? Well, we import a very specific product. Right. It's, it's mostly lean product that we can ground in with our hamburger or we can make hamburger. Yeah. And so we import and export two different things and generally it's from different countries. Right. When we import, we talk about Australia, New Zealand, in some South American countries like Brazil, Argentina, Paraguay, etc.
A
A pretty different industry and how they grow beef and beef in those areas.
D
Right. And so when we think about Australia, New Zealand, Brazil, I mean that's not necessarily grain fed. Right. We're talking grass fed. And so it's going to be a lot leaner. And so we're importing that lean beef to mix with our trimmings that have a lot more fat to get the perfect blend for.
C
Yeah, it's, it seems, you know, when you think about beef consumption in the United States, you're really the first thing that comes to my mind are steaks and hamburgers and then to some extent roasts and some other things too. But I don't think of liver, I don't think of tripe. I don't think of other cuts. And what you're saying is a lot of those things that I'm not thinking of, we export those because a lot of people aren't thinking of those in the United States. But when you think about hamburger, and particularly, you know, the last few years, we've really increased the weight and the percent fat on finished cattle. And that fat really only has value if I can mix it with lean and turn it into a 80, 20 or 70, 30 hamburger. And so it kind of makes sense to me that we've needed to bring in some lean because we are creating more fat than we did 10 years ago.
D
Yep. No, absolutely. And just thinking about the more recent situation, which is what one thing Brad asked about is we're actually down total beef production in 25. And actually since 2022, we've been down total beef production not by a lot, but by a little bit. And you know, yes, the numbers have been going down. We've been told, we've talked about that on previous podcasts, but you know, we've
C
offset some of that with carcass weights.
D
But what's where, where those numbers are really coming from, it's the non fits of coal cows. You know, we're down since 2022. We're down almost 25% in terms of beef production. So I think the coal cows is where that loss of production is, is
A
coming from because we may not have started growing, but we haven't. We're not continuing to call at the same rate because the herd is small.
D
Right. And now we're probably going to continue to keep those.
C
If we keep heifers back, then we're going to continue to be pressured there.
D
And so we have been importing a lot of beef in terms of. I'm just going to pull some quick numbers here. You know, our largest countries have been Australia. We're up 250%. Wow. Since 2022. From Australia, Canada's our second. Brazil's number three. Mexico is four. But it's actually down because of the.
C
Got the border closed.
D
Got the border closed since last May or July. New Zealand and then Uruguay and then more recently there's been a lot of political discussion surrounding this.
C
This.
D
Right. And so Argentina gets brought into the mix. We have import in January of 2026. I think we imported a bunch more from, from Argentina, but they're still not going to make their quota. And so we'll still probably import from other, other countries. But in general that there's a big difference between imports and exports. And the reason we do both is because it's two different products and we need the imported product to make our
C
hamburgers, which, I mean, hamburgers are a big, big part of the beef industry in the United States.
D
You think about all the fast food restaurants and of course, all the dishes you make at home when you have ground beef. And it's, I mean, in our household, I mean, my youngest son, I don't even know how many pounds of ground
C
beef he goes through, but I love my steaks. But we actually eat way more ground beef than we eat steaks.
A
So what are the implications of this import scenario that you've outlined where we are currently for, say, a cow calf producer? Does that impact my bottom line? Is this something I should be concerned about? Is this something that I should say, okay, we're exporting and importing, but it, it affects me or doesn't. So one of the reasons.
D
I guess I should have followed up with this. One of the reasons we are importing is because our beef prices are so high. Right. And so because our ground beef prices are so high, we, we're attracting more imports. That. That is. So I think it's. I think it's a good thing that we're importing for, you know, a couple reasons. One, there's probably some political, I'm sure, going on behind the scenes, but if our consumers demand ground beef and we can't give it to them, then they can switch. And we don't substitute. Right.
C
To keep buying ground beef and, and have that as their.
D
So we still have our calves that are going in and, and parts of that is going into our. But we need that lean beef that we're bringing in that allows us to blend it such that we can, our domestic consumers can continue consuming beef. So I think it's a good thing that we, we have products to complement ours that allows our domestic consumers to continue consuming.
A
Absolutely. And I, and I think that's a good thing for the long term. And as our herd continues to grow, of course those imports and exports will shift a little bit as it goes forward. So thanks for sharing that, Dustin. Appreciate that conversation. Also, I want to shift gears and talk a little bit about brucellosis because we had some discussion here within the group and there's been some emails back and forth talking about brucellosis vaccination. And one of the things about that vaccination is it's one of the more regulated vaccinations. We have a good record. It's a once in a lifetime. It comes with a tattoo And a tag. We, we're only vaccinating heifers. But before we dive into the vaccination part, I want a little background on what is brucellosis. And Bob, I'm going to turn to you first. What, what causes it, what diseases do we see and why have we tried so hard to eradicate it?
C
Yeah, so brucellosis is a bacteria and it has a worldwide distribution. So there's brucellosis and there's several different species. There's, there's a species that is primarily in sheep and goats. There's a species that dogs can get, but the cattle, brucellosis. And so there's really kind of two disease categories in the United States that are federally regulated. With a lot of paperwork, veterinarians are actively involved in the suppression and eventual eradication of these diseases. And those two diseases are brucellosis and tuberculosis. And the reason both of those diseases raised to this level is because they can be transferred to humans. And, and so there's kind of, for brucellosis, it's when it enters a herd, you can have a real abortion storm a lot of abortions really fast. So it's economically damaging to the cattle producer. But probably why it really became a federally controlled disease is that it can be passed to consumers. And particularly brucellosis, pass through milk was a pretty prominent disease in the past in the United States and in other parts of the world. And so the government came in and said we can and we will control this disease. And so starting about in the 1940s and 1950s, they used a multi prong approach. One was using vaccinations and using testing at sale barns and at slaughter. And then if you identify a positive animal, then that herd was quarantined and herds in contact with that herd were tested. And there was aggressive test and cull strategy to reduce how common this disease was. So you go back to the 1940s and 50s and you know, people had disease caused by drinking contaminated, infected milk. The other place, the other group that's susceptible is veterinarians and cattle producers. Because the other way that humans can get this disease is actually some of the birth fluids. So think of, you know, when you give birth, when you help a cow give birth, there's a lot of fluids and those can be a contamination source for humans. So we wanted to address the human health risk. And so they came out with this pretty aggressive. And it involves. So if an animal is vaccinated, they are tattooed so they're permanently identified. They have a specific ID number in their Ear so that they can be tracked. And that effort was really successful over a relatively short period of time. This went from a fairly common disease to one that was quite rare. When I first started in practice, there were still occasional brucellosis outbreaks. And I can remember a few situations where we had quarantine situations and you went in and you did some aggressive testing and things like that. But even in just my career, that's gone down to pretty darn rare. In fact, it's A good thing Dr. Gunderson is here, because really, the only place where we really see brucellosis is in the United States anymore, is mostly in the wildlife population around the Yellowstone part. And so this aggressive, and it's kind of a cooperation between the federal government, the state animal health groups, private veterinarians and producers. I think we should remember that this was a real success where we took a disease that was harmful to cattle and harmful to humans. And, and we've got it pretty much under control now.
A
A very successful eradication program. Down to just that one area that you mentioned. And you talked a little bit about the vaccine, the control mechanisms, Everybody working together. Dr. Gunderson, what are your thoughts relative
B
to brucellosis, as Dr. Larson alluded to? I actually have a slightly different perspective because where I grew up and even where I practice, it's not eradicated. I never considered brucellosis to be a disease that was eradicated because I grew up just outside of Yellowstone national park and even practiced in that area for a little while. And there's a section of that area that's not in the park, but it's called the designated surveillance area. And it's an area where there's a high risk of spillover from wildlife populations into cattle populations. And there are a lot of cattle in the designated surveillance area. In fact, we just had a herd in the DSA this last fall. That bull tested positive for brucellosis. So, I mean, it does cause outbreaks even now in that area. And so growing up, you know, we had a small dairy. When I was a kid growing up in Idaho, neighbors had beef cattle. Veterinarians that I worked for, that I spent time with, they all did brucellosis vaccination as just a regular part of their herd health services. And bangs, we called it Bangs vaccination, still do. And that, that's a cornerstone of beef cow calf practice and dairy practice in the mountain west. Because. Because that reservoir of this disease is there in the bison herd, it's in the elk herd, and those, those herds are hopefully never Going away.
C
We want them, and they're wildlife. So we are not as successful eradicate.
B
Well, and those Brucella abortis bacteria does not cause quite as much pathology in bison and in elk as it does in cattle. So they can maintain that bacteria in their population and it does relatively little damage to them. But those herds, the bison and the elk, they migrate their migratory animals, even though they stay relatively confined in that Yellowstone area, the they do go out of the park. And so we do see outbreaks of this. And it's an ongoing issue and probably always will be. And we have the two main vaccine strains that have been used in the past. This is a vaccine that's an avarilent live. Well, I say a virulent. It's a live bacteria, but it isn't innocuous.
C
Right.
B
The old strain was called strain 19 or S19. And that strain was plum awful. Like, if you injected yourself with strain 19 as a veterinarian or an animal health worker or a rancher, whoever handled that vaccine, you could count on a lifelong infection with strain 19.
C
A friend of mine that I went to vet school with accidentally injected himself with strain 19 vaccine. And it's called undulant fever because basically once a month he comes down with a pretty good fever, and he has for 40 years just because of that one mistake. Which is also why this is the one vaccine that an accredited veterinarian must give. Producers are not allowed to handle or give this vaccine. And there's a couple of reasons for that. One is the paperwork involved, and one is there are some handling dangers with this vaccine, and they want to kind of limit the number of people that actually use this vaccine.
A
And we've progressed from strain 19 to the RB51.
B
Correct. And now you use better, but still the same RB51, which is better, but it's not innocuous either. If you inject yourself accidentally with RB51, it is a serious deal. You need to go on antibiotic therapy, and you need to make sure that you get help immediately. And even if you do, there is a small chance that you will still have a chronic issue of undulant fever. And it's not pleasant. And so it's kind of an important deal. And, you know, some things that the problem is, though, especially where I worked, practiced, and where I grew up, it's such a common procedure. Bangs. Vaccination is such a common, everyday thing we do all the time, that sometimes it becomes routine and we forget about, number one, how serious brucellosis can be, number two, how dangerous the vaccine can be. And we don't always treat it with the level of care that we should.
C
And sometimes familiarity just kind of breeds some complexity.
B
Well, that's right. Well, let's say we give RB51 vaccine to a group of heifers, and some of those heifers happen to be pregnant when we give it. And maybe we don't want them to be pregnant, so we're giving them a prostaglandin at the same time to abort those pregnancies. Well, those pregnancies very likely will be contaminated because it's a. Because it's a live bacteria vaccine. They may very well be contaminated with that bacteria when that heifer aborts and if she needs any help.
C
Back to the old story that I told about veterinarians and producers that help that were infected through the fluids associated with giving birth.
B
That's right.
A
Birth fluids is what you call them.
C
Birth fluids.
B
That's right. Another scenario, and this is one that came up in one of our listservs for our professional organization we all belong to giving an antibiotic to these heifers at the same time we give the binges vaccine. Maybe we're processing these heifers for feeding and we want to give them an antibiotic for metaphylaxis. Well, if you give an antibiotic at the same time that you give that live bacterial vaccine, you might have a dead bacterial. You might have a dead bacterial vaccine, and the vaccine might not work. And then those heifers might not actually be protected against brucellosis if they ever encounter it, which again, it's a limited geographical region of the United States. But it's not impossible that they may come into contact with it.
C
So there's a lot of considerations. This is a disease that a lot of producers are aware of that probably 30 years ago, more producers were really aware of this disease. But as veterinarians, it's still kind of our prime. One of our primary responsibilities is to continue with the eradication efforts to control this disease, but recognize that the vaccine itself is an important part of that discussion of using it correctly.
A
Well, and have the conversation with your veterinarian, because import export requirements on heifers adults vary by state, and there are sometimes some brucellosis implications of whether I vaccinated them. And it's also a vaccine. And you guys mentioned many of the caveats, but there's a specific time frame when you can and cannot give this vaccine. And so you want to be sure that you target those heifers in that time frame. And of course we want them to be non pregnant heifers at the time we vaccinate them. So great discussion there guys on on brucellosis and good overview. Also Dustin, appreciate your thoughts on imports. If you have a question or topic you'd like us to discuss on a future episode, you can send us an email@bcisu.edu.
Main Theme:
This episode of BCI Cattle Chat (April 3, 2026) focuses on two primary topics:
The hosts, veterinary professionals from the Beef Cattle Institute at Kansas State University, offer a blend of economic, regulatory, and on-the-ground perspectives—drawing on both policy and practical herd health experience.
Background & Current Trends
Key Quotes & Memorable Moments
Countries of Origin and Market Dynamics
Supply, Demand, and Cattle Prices
Implications for Producers
Timestamps
What is Brucellosis?
Impact and Eradication Efforts
Persistence in Wildlife and Regional Risk
Vaccination Protocols and Safety Considerations
Risks and Handling
Practical Advice for Producers
Timestamps
In this episode, BCI Cattle Chat offers a thorough exploration of U.S. beef trade mechanics—demystifying the simultaneous import/export trends and revealing the behind-the-scenes economic forces. The panel also delves into brucellosis, spotlighting the impressive near-eradication achieved and the persistent, region-specific challenges, alongside vital guidance on vaccination safety and regulatory compliance. Through candid storytelling and candid technical discussion, the hosts deliver practical, actionable insights for veterinarians, producers, and beef industry stakeholders alike.