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- [00:04]
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- [01:24]
Adam Kaufman
Today is Friday, March 7th and this is Celtics Beat on the CLNS Media Network, the leading online provider of audio video coverage of the Boston Celtics. I'm Adam Kaufman. Episode 614 features the Athletics, Jared Weiss.
- [01:38]
Evan Valenti
And I'm Evan Valenti and today's show is powered by prizepix. Prizepix is the official daily Fantasy partner of CLNS Media. Download the Prize Picks app today, use the code CLNS and get $50 instantly when you play. $5.
- [02:03]
Adam Kaufman
What's up everyone? Welcome in this is Celtics Beat right smack in the middle of a Celtics home stand before a a real tour of the NBA on the road. They got a busy stretch coming up here, an interesting competition for sure to close out this home stand. Three straight wins here in this four game stand as it has been to date a date with the Lakers in primetime on the way this weekend. OKC where the NBA leading thunder will not be resting anybody in that contest unlike what we've got in front of us here as we sit record on a Friday we will have SGA and Jalen Williams probably Hartenstein, Holmgren, everybody available for what could be an NBA Finals preview. But you know what, we only said that a few days ago when the Celtics dispatched the Denver Nuggets. So welcome in lot to get into here of Course I am. Adam Kaufman, Evan Valenti, we are always here. And for the first time in a while, pleased to welcome back the Athletics Jared Weiss, who covers not only the Celtics, but the entire NBA. Jared, welcome back, buddy.
- [03:04]
Jared Weiss
It's good to be back here, my man.
- [03:07]
Adam Kaufman
Listen, there are a lot of things of interest over these last few wins for the Celtics and obviously with the Lakers upcoming here, but I don't know about you guys. Maybe Jared, just by nature of what you do, you're a little bit more dialed into sort of the, you know, all time this, all time that, you know, Celtics historical, whatever. I was floored, genuinely shocked when Peyton Pritchard and Derrick White became the first ever Celtics teammates to put up 40 plus in the same game. I thought for sure, you know, I wasn't even complete. Like, if you had told me, hey, did the Jays ever do that? I don't think so, but maybe, but I'm sure, like Larry bird or Kevin McHale, those two in the same game. Or we can, you know, hell, maybe Paul Pearson and Antoine Walker did it, or we can go back to, you know, Koozie and Russell. I don't know. But the fact that it has never, at least had never ever before happened in Celtics history, that a pair of teammates scored 40 plus in the same game and it's Derek White who's on his way to get a new set of teeth, and Peyton Pritchard off the bench. My God. What. I mean, what. What a tour de force.
- [04:28]
Jared Weiss
It's. It's so, it's. It was shocking that they got there, especially with Peyton Pritchard coming off the bench and dropping a 40 piece. But the most amazing part of that game was that Peyton Pritchard has 10 threes through three quarters. He needs one more to tie Marcus Smart's record. And I think part of you is like, you want to see history happen. Peyton deserves it. I think the other part of you is like the fact that Marcus Smart going 11 for it was at 22 from 3. He holds the record in this glorious franchise with all of its history. That's Marcus fricking Smart. That holds a three point record. That's such a funny piece of history that like, you don't want to see that go away because, like, I feel like 30 years from now I'm going to be telling my Android kids about or grandkids about this and you're going to be like, bleepboard, daddy, who was the greatest shooter you ever saw? And I'll be like, well, technically it was Marcus Smart. And they'd be like, you mean the guy from the coin? I'm like, yeah, the guy from the nickel. Yeah, that guy, Marcus. Smart. And so it would have been. It would have been a shame if he ever had to lose that record, but. And he will eventually, right? All records are meant to be broken. Pritchard is definitely a guy you want to see break it, though. Yeah, Peyton will probably break it before the season's over. And honestly, what I loved about when I asked him the question of why didn't you gun for that 11 3. Because he went over one from deep in the fourth quarter and he said, I'll get another shot at it, you know, I'm going to play the right way, you know. And I thought that was really impressive because, like, one, Peyton's become a great player because he really does commit to playing the right way and being, you know, really. I think. I actually think that as much of a score as he's become, he kind of looks at shooting as a secondary option to playmaking into the fact that Peyton Pritchard almost broke a franchise record. And he was like, whatever, I'll do it again at some point. Like, that's the kind of confidence that guy has. And I thought that really spoke volumes.
- [06:16]
Evan Valenti
Yeah, well, I mean, I love that stuff, to be honest with you. The. The quotes that he's come out with lately. There's a quote at the beginning of the year, I think J. King, your colleague, wrote a piece on Pritchard and there's a great quote in there about how he doesn't care about half court heaves. And if you care about half court heaves affecting your shot percentage, you're a loser. And I was like, yes, I love this guy. This guy's on a heater right now. He's. I made the joke that tan Pritchard Top 5 basketball player in the league because he came back from the all star break from Turks and Caicos and just tore it up. He's been unbelievable. Jared, do you have a sixth man of the year vote?
- [06:50]
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- [07:21]
Jared Weiss
I don't. Although a team reached out to me about it the other day, so maybe I do have and I just didn't realize I'll have to dig through my emails, but I don't. I don't have a vote as far as I know.
- [07:31]
Evan Valenti
Well, let's say no way he loses.
- [07:33]
Adam Kaufman
There's no way.
- [07:34]
Evan Valenti
I, I disagree with that.
- [07:35]
Jared Weiss
I disagree with no way could have a chance. DeAndre Hunter maybe, but I think.
- [07:40]
Adam Kaufman
But Malik Easley is spending enough time, I think in the starting lineup that I don't know if it would even mathematically remove him from contention. But outside of that, Pritchard, I, I mean has he even started a game this year? Like even one? He is a pure reserve.
- [07:54]
Jared Weiss
Yeah, I guess it's an easy, it's an easy pick to make him six man of the year. I think just because of, you know, and Beasley's been great and I think most years he would be a very clear candidate for it. Hunter was really good, but also Atlanta fell off a little bit. Obviously now he's in Cleveland and he's doing a really good job with it. But like Pritchard, if you watch this team in the first half of the season, he was coming off the bench and basically saving their asses. Like he, he won them like five games on his own early on. He's been crucial for them getting through this holiday injury. He's kind of become the new identity of this team. Like I really do think that Pritchard is kind of the heart and soul of this team now in a way that's really rare for six men. And you look back over the years, the guys that won it or really should have won it, like all those years were. Was it like Lou Williams or Jordan Crawford were winning it were like great scores and everything. But like Andre Godala was like literally like running the warriors when it wasn't Seth Curry. Like, yeah, like this is. I think Peyton is capturing the spirit of the award which is does this person come off the bench and become the heart and soul for your team? Do you need them to close games because they're just so crucial to the flow of the game at that point and he checks off that box at a level that I just don't think anyone else in the league is quite doing.
- [09:03]
Adam Kaufman
And have I. Malik. Malik Beasley real quick has started. This is so far it's going to be more has started 14 of 63 games, Peyton Pritchard 0 for 62. But on top of that, I mean, look at, look at what we just saw in this most recent game where the Celtics, obviously, the Sixers are basically a G league team at this point, but the Sixers, the. The Celtics was, you know, it was no Jalen Brown, no Al Horford, no Christaps Porzingis, no Drew Holiday. Your starters in this game, obviously Tatum and White Cornet, I guess, by default. And then you had Drew Peterson and Keita. So, like, if ever there was an opportunity for Pritchard to start, and he did start a handful of games last year, three games the year. But, like, he has started at least a couple of games every year of his career to date. If ever there were an opportunity for him to start a game, it was this most recent one against Philadelphia. And I'm not saying, like, Missoula is. Is out for awards and doesn't want to confuse the two. And no, he is. He's the sixth man of the year, and that's what we're going to get him. And so he's not going to start and confuse the argument, blah, blah, blah. No, it's just he is the leader of the bench unit.
- [10:08]
Jared Weiss
He's.
- [10:08]
Adam Kaufman
He is that spark plug off the bench offensively, that it is a clear and defined role. Whether you want to say he's in there at the end of games with starters trying to save their ass and all that, like we're talking about. Sure, that's different. That's your closing unit. As far as the starting unit, Pritchard's just not part of it.
- [10:25]
Jared Weiss
Yeah, well, one, if there's any coach in the NBA that gives less of a shit about it, it's definitely Joe Masula. Like, there's no one else. He does not care at all.
- [10:34]
Evan Valenti
He.
- [10:34]
Jared Weiss
He. He cares about his guys feeling good and getting recognized, but he doesn't care about this award stuff. And so with Peyton, I think the key with Peyton coming off the bench is one, he, Joe, doesn't want to break the cadence of their game plan. And Peyton coming in and starting to become an offensive spark plug later in the. In the second half or first half is important. And then also it allows them to have the option of whether to close the game with Peyton and utilize his offense and his pressing on or have a more versatile switching defense. So I think they have to keep Peyton coming off the bench just so they can kind of stick to their lineup flexibility options throughout the game as well.
- [11:12]
Evan Valenti
Yeah, one of the big things that I'm I'm still worried about. You know, Peyton's been unbelievable this year. He might win six man of the year again, 43 the other night. I think, like, you talk about being the heart and soul, I think sometimes it's a little contagious. Like Baylor Shireman blowing a kiss to the Sixers bench on Thursday night. I think it was a little bit of Pritchard rubbing off on it, but I loved it. Love that. But my big concern, Jared, is it's just postseason play with him. And, you know, last year he was. He was good. Then relegated to basically like a special teams guy. Like, off the bench. We're gonna bring you on for heaves. He did a great job with it, but he wasn't. You know, when you get to the Eastern Conference finals, the NBA Finals, like, he's just not as big of a part of their team because he's smaller. He's easy to attack on the defensive side of the ball. I know offensively this year he's much better, much more consistent as a shooter. But as we've talked about, he's grown into a way better playmaker. Like, just way better. Do you think the playmaking can keep him on the floor in the playoffs, or is this going to be one of these issues where it's like, hey, Peyton, we love you, but you're getting killed out there. We can't have you out there on defense.
- [12:18]
Jared Weiss
So playmaking on offense and then, yeah, matchup. So, yeah, let's start with this. Playmaking on offense. I thought that's really, really has stood out over the past week or so, and it always depends on the defensive personnel that he's going up against. Some teams, they just. They have bigger defenders and he can't get where he wants. But against most teams in the NBA, his ability to hit the pocket over a screen or even beat people off the dribble, but just using kind of different jab steps and hesitations and reversals and stuff like that. He has enough speed that he's able to get downhill now, and that's pretty new. Like, he wasn't quite doing that last year. He's. He certainly wasn't doing that two years ago. And it's been amazing to see how much more downhill speed he has because he's always been pretty quick at, like, that first step, but he just, like, he's short. His legs aren't long. He's my height and, like, he's not. He just didn't have the downhill speed to turn the corner and to get into the paint. And then once he got there, he was too short and he couldn't really work his way out of it. So he had to do one of those like, you know, hop backwards, turn around, 15 foot rainbow shots. But now you're seeing him hitting the pocket, getting into the lane, and then he's able to kind of like throw his body out, like kind of around the corner of the defensive rotation so he can make that kick out pass. He like, he's able to do a lot of stuff. He's able to do what's called the Nash, named after Steve Nash. Where he. Sorry, my phone's ringing. Where he, where he'll dribble around the paint underneath it and then he circles back around in the loop and like he'll take that like little pull up there from 10ft, but he's turning that into more. Now maybe he'll loop around a second time. He just keeps going. So his motor and his speed has increased to the point that he can work offensively against most teams and be really effective. Then on defense, his pressing is always really impressive. His ball pressure is always really impressive. Teams that are going to force him into a switch where they can shoot over him or try to go through him, most players have trouble going through him because he's so good with his hands down low when they're trying to dribble. If teams are going to be shooting over him, I think the Celtics will just live with that until it becomes like too problematic and then they might have to, you know, pressure with the double and then get into rotation. They have Porzingis. That makes it easier because he can just kind of play his own in the paint. So I think, I think Payton will be fine. I think he will probably maintain his minutes.
- [14:41]
Adam Kaufman
Let's take a quick break, tell you about our good friends over at Prize Picks.
- [14:45]
Evan Valenti
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- [17:26]
Adam Kaufman
We're here with Jared Weiss and Jared there. All right, so there's a lot of Peyton Pritchard love right there. But before we do run out of time, we got you for another 15. 22 more guys in particular that I want to spend some time on. And it's not Jason Tatum. I feel like we're weekly celebrating all things Jason Tatum. This is this the no Jason Tatum show, even though he had a great game last time out. Jaylen Brown, who we'll get to, but it's not his scoring that I want to talk about. And first, Derrick White, if you're a longtime listener of this show. And I, I don't even mean like all time, just the last few years, you know, since Derrick White has been here, I do think, you know, I don't listen to every Celtics podcast, but I, I do think without patting myself on the back because it's really not even me. It's this show. We have been kind of at the, we're at the forefront of, of Derrick White appreciation, you know, and, and you I will put out there even before me as far as, you know, what White could do as a contributor to this program. Honestly, it wasn't that long ago that, that, you know, Gary Washburn's writing articles about how the Derrick White trade was a mistake and looks bad and all of that stuff. So, you know, it, it took some time, I think, for a lot of.
- [18:33]
Scott Hanson
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- [19:05]
Adam Kaufman
On to all that Derrick White does. But now, and this isn't so much new this year, this was true of him last year as well, and especially during the playoff run. But you're really seeing it right now when there are opportunities that other guys are out of the lineup and even if they're at full health, it exists there to a lesser degree, just the consistency and that White brings. He is a, you know, he averages 16, 17 points, but he is not more often than not going to have an, an off game, a bad game, a poor shooting game. Like he's going to take his 10 plus shots. You know, nowadays he's taken 10 plus threes, but he'll take, you know, six, seven plus from long range. He's not really going to get to the free throw line, but he's going to score you double digits in points. He's going to get a few rebounds, he's going to get a couple of this, the stat log, the game log for Derrick White, game to game is consistent and you could look at it and call it stat humping and like, are you even watching the game? All that stuff, like, that's fine. I don't care. I. I do like that stuff. Just as. As a better and fantasy player and someone who pays attention to a lot of the metrics, I do appreciate consistency. I think a lot of people out there would agree. But to the eye test and when we're watching these games as well, I just think if it's possible and I'm curious if you agree. Derrick White is still underappreciated around here.
- [20:24]
Jared Weiss
Is he? I mean, I don't know. I think he's properly appreciated. He's looked at as a fringe all star. He's the team's third best player. I think it's pretty solidified now. And I think what's maybe helped that is that Jrue Holiday has been hurt this entire year and last year is pretty hard to pick in the pecking order where you would rank those guys between Derek and Holiday and Pozingis a lot of the time. But D. White's consistency, his health, the fact that like every three games he like sprains his ankle and he's down for two minutes and you think his career is over and he just like pops back up and just starts like wiggling like a wacky waving inflatable tube guy and you're like, all right, he's fine like that. That resilience.
- [21:01]
Adam Kaufman
Let me curb my statement then for a second. Maybe I shouldn't have said around here. I think around here you're right. We all know he's a fringe all star. Do you think nationally he's viewed as a fringe all star?
- [21:13]
Jared Weiss
I think so. I mean, he last year and probably a little bit this year was right there in the hunt for all star. I mean, he fell just short last year. So I think people recognize early last season that he was that caliber of player. And then he was in the finals run and everybody saw how great he is and saw how important he was to this team. So yeah, I do think that he's recognized at that level. I mean, I don't. I'm one of those people. I just don't pay attention to how people feel about these guys. I don't watch the Stephen A. Smith debating is this guy appreciated or not. Every team in the NBA knows Derrick White's a great player. Every player in the NBA knows it. They all talked, especially coaches will talk about him with great reverence. So I would imagine that fans know at this point, especially because he's become such a prolific three point shooter, which is like, insane when you consider where he was at when he got to this team and the blocks and steals that he gets as well. So he has enough, like, plays that I think he's pretty known. And also now he's got like 10 commercials. Like, every time I turn on YouTube, I see his face. It's insane.
- [22:13]
Evan Valenti
Yeah, a buddy of mine worked on the Berkshire bank campaign with him and just had nothing but glowing things to say about how awesomely cool and nice Derek White is. Kaufman, I've been bragging about how clutch Derrick White is. Do you know how clutch Derrick White's been this season? I'm going to give it to me. Give me the numbers in the clutch, which is defined with less than five minutes to go in a game where a team leads or trails by points fewer. Okay, we all have that definition. In clutch time, Derek White is 11, 17 from the field, 1016 from 3 point range, which is good for a 94.25 true shooting percentage in clutch time. Basically, Derrick White's been absolute nails this year, especially when the game gets close. And I feel like Weiss, his. His real secret superpower is the end of the shot clock. Heave that he barely has time to touch it and just nothing but the bottom of the net every single time. I. I love the fact that Derek White feels appreciated, but, like, the stats this year are unbelievable. So I talked about this with Barrett on his podcast a couple of days ago. It feels like to me that the pecking order of, like last year, I thought Drew Holiday finished off as like, the team's third most important player with stuff done. Defense. Am I crazy to think that Derek and Drew can just swap spots this year and everything will just function the same way? Essentially?
- [23:37]
Jared Weiss
Probably. I mean, Drew is Drew such a mystery right now because, you know, he has this finger injury. He's had the shoulder injury all year, and so his shooting has been way off. And the thing that's hurt the Celtics and has really hurt Drew is that last year he shot like 3, 50% from the corners. So their offense could just kind of plant him in that corner, make his life easy, make everyone's life pretty easy. And three seconds left in the shot clock, they would just eventually find it to him and he would bury it. And the Celtics kind of became infallible when he was shooting well because just no matter what, they were getting 14 points from him and he wasn't going to miss. And you just knew you could count on him. So we just always bailed them out and they don't have that right now. And so Missoula is going to find he's going to hit a tricky part of their playoff run where he's going to have to decide or maybe is going to have to decide. Do I roll with Drew even though his shooting is off and he's shooting 32%, or do I go with Pritchard, who is going to. We're going to sacrifice on defense and we're going to put more onus on White and Jalen to handle a lot of these, you know, more powerful defensive duties. But Pritchard's going to give me more reliable shooting. And last year they were great because they had no holes. Shooting wise, everybody was a good shooter. They're only the only two guys that weren't knockdown shooters were their two best players who obviously their percentages were low because of the degree, the degree of difficulty and also because for some reason they shoot terribly wide open and then are like incredible shooters when they're tightly contested. But so the Celtics do have some shooting holes in the rotation now, and that's why they're not a prohibitive favorite the way they were last year, because Cleveland's playing great and they don't have really any shooting holes besides Mobley and Allen. So, you know, I don't know what's going to happen with this Holiday Pritchard decision, but White has been good enough this year that at least you're comfortable knowing they do have one combo guard who can do almost everything from them except for, like, the super powerful stuff that Drew can do. And looking at the East, I'm not sure how much they're going to need it because they're going to get the Knicks in the second round the way things are shaking out. And I don't know how much they're going to need Drew on Cat since Jalen can handle that really well. But obviously the more. The more they can get, the better. But I still think they match up really well against the Knicks. We've seen that happen time and time again. So, you know, Drew might not be quite as vital this time around as he was last time, but he's still Drew Holiday. They still need him playing great if they're going to. They're not going to win a championship without him playing at a high level.
- [26:06]
Adam Kaufman
Before we get to Jalen Brown, since you guys, you know, brought up Holiday and Porzingis, obviously, and these issues that they're dealing with. What's your level of concern long term? Because the Celtics here with the final, whatever it is, 17 games, I don't know, left in the regular season, they're, you know, their place is solidified. They're not going to catch the Cavs and nor do they care to anyway and be the number one seed. They're not going to fall the third. Knicks aren't going to get there, especially with Jalen Brunson probably going to miss a couple of weeks with this ankle injury that he suffered. So, you know, they're going to be the two. So there's going to be health management. I mean, we're already seeing it really, but you're certainly going to see it down the stretch run of the regular season. Holiday with the finger. Porzingis is dealing with the bubonic plague or whatever the hell he's got going on. What are you thinking when we get to mid April for these guys?
- [26:55]
Jared Weiss
You know, Prezigas seemed pretty okay on Thursday when he was standing on the bench in the first half. I think he must have gone to the back for the second half. Whatever bubonic plague thing he's got going on. I guess it's taken a while to recover, you know, conditioning wise because he seemed like he was feeling okay. Are you asking like long term future, like beyond this year? Is that, is that what we're talking about?
- [27:15]
Adam Kaufman
No, no, no, no. Long, long term, specifically this year because, you know, as, as high as I am on this team as the defending champs and what they're capable of and just looking at them against all of their perceived threats, I still think they're the team to beat if healthy. If obviously you're down one or two of those guys in May in the second round and you're, you know, whatever. Like I, you know, you do start to obviously give other teams a chance, especially if and when you get to the NBA Finals and you have OKC or Denver or heaven forbid, LA on the other side.
- [27:47]
Jared Weiss
Yeah, if the Celtics, if you get have, if you have all these guys at 100%, which you're not quite going to. But let's say you have all these guys playing great, let's say it that way, including Drew, including Porzingis, I probably would give the Celtics the ever so slightest edge as being the best team in the league, just ahead of OKC in Cleveland. And we'll see where the Lakers and Nuggets fall in this, in this order as well. But that's not the reality and we have to operate based on reality. And I know I was on another show last week and I was asked, like, who would I pick between Celtics and Cavs? And I said, I guess I would put Cavs in seven. Even though I think the Celtics at their. At their very best or the best team. Because we just don't have reason to believe right now that Drew and KP will be 100% and that we can trust them for the entire playoff run. And I got completely dragged for it. So I'll just repeat that full context there. If you're looking at the long term future of the season, which is the short term future, I don't know why we're using that phrasing. Things are confusing me. This Celtics team, they have two behemoths in the NBA that they have to take down. And. And I don't care that they're the defending champions. I don't care that they're starting to kind of turn things on right now. And so you're feeling good about it. Like, OKC and Cleveland could enter the postseason pretty healthy. And OKC's depth is absolutely insane. Their depth is performing at a level that's reminiscent of what Boston's depth was last year. Their net rating is, I think, the best net rating of all time. Which now that we're seeing that happening kind of repeatedly lately, I think maybe that's just going to be how it is, you know, like the Celtics were like, what, fourth best net rating of all time last year. Maybe it's just going to be that way that we're going to have like a top 10 net rating team every single year. But, like, OKC is pretty flawless and they can do. If you can take. If you can shut down Shay, they still have other things they can do. But you need Drew Holiday to shut down Shay, like. And when I say shut down, I mean just have him not score 40 a game in the finals, which he.
- [29:46]
Adam Kaufman
Holding to very 425 instead of 38, 39.
- [29:50]
Jared Weiss
Like, he. Shea might legitimately average 40 points a game in the finals like that. I think that's in his realm. He's playing at that level right now. He's been incredible. You can't win a series against the Thunder without Holiday playing, like, incredibly on defense. Like, you absolutely need it. And he's the guy for Shea. He's the guy that has the balance and he has the power and he's actually able to stay in front of Shai. Because I do wonder, and I'm trying to think back on when they've matched up in the past and we'll see next week. But like D White style, I don't think will work as well against Shea, because if Shea gets you behind him on his back hip, you're not going to be able to block his shot because Shea will just like fall to the side and just like, he'll just like go completely horizontal and just like flick the ball the rim and he'll hit it anyway. Or he'll double pump and hang in the air and hit a floater. Like, you can't really take anything away from him unless you're just in front of him. And so that's what they need Drew for. So I think Cleveland is more beatable than OKC is, and that's by like, you know, one fraction of an inch, basically. And we've seen how the Celtics can match up against Cleveland when they're at their very best. And I think you could probably, if you're a Boston fan, you can feel pretty comfortable about that. But so OKC is the most difficult one. And just like, if you're not getting Drew at his best, I just don't see how you're going to beat them.
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- [32:12]
Adam Kaufman
Yeah.
- [32:12]
Evan Valenti
I mean, it's, for me, it's, it's, I don't know. I, I, I just, every game I'm, I'm waiting for Porzingis to come back just because the sickness feels weird. But I agree with the Drew Holiday stuff. You look at his defense last year, you know, highlighted in the Eastern Conference finals in Nemhard, I think it's pretty unbelievable. I know cop want to switch to Jalen Brown in the playmaking stuff because I, again, I had this conversation with Barrett the other day about the eight assists and the eight and nine from the free throw line he had the other day against Denver and.
- [32:39]
Adam Kaufman
Well, go ahead. So the, the where I, I mean, I'll let you build on, on sort of the, the core of, of my question, but it, you're involved in this. I remember when, you know, very early in, in his career, and obviously he's been around for almost a decade at this point, which is crazy, but the first couple three years of his career and the minutes aren't what they are now either. But assist per game, okay. As a Rookie, he played 17 minutes. We'll throw it out, but then, you know, 31 minutes per game. As a sophomore, 1.6, 26 minutes per game. In his third year, it was 1.4, 2 point, you know, fourth year in the league, it was 2.1. I just remember on our text threads there being conversations about, you know, like, this is, this is just who Jalen is. Jalen is never going to be a guy that averages, you know, even four assists a game, that type of thing. That was the belief among some anyway, that we are friendly with and some who have been on this show now you go back over the last handful of years, 3.4, 3.5, 3.5, 3.6. This year, 4.8. Jalen Brown is essentially averaging five assists per game. I'm just curious what you've seen in, in his playmaking that, you know, has silenced any of those doubters but also consistently turned him into this guy?
- [34:01]
Jared Weiss
Yeah, Jalen, let's not say silence those doubters because Jalen was a bad playmaker for a long time. It's not, it's like, it wasn't doubt. It was a very accurate assessment of reality. And Jalen had to grow. And I think probably one him seeing the way JT's profile as a player in this league has exploded once he became an elite playmaker, probably had to motivate him a little bit more to do that better. Joe kind of Gave him the right opportunities, like the white, the right type of driving lanes and they had the right spacing that I think enabled Jalen to be a better playmaker. And also he just got to the point of his career where he finally was kind of growing in that direction. But you look at this year and his assist to turnover ratio is almost at a 2 now, which is like a pretty huge higher 2.7 because.
- [34:50]
Adam Kaufman
Or no, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, you're right. No, no, no, no. I was the turn. The turnovers are 2.7. These, the assists, it's. Yeah, it's 4.8 versus 2.7. So you're right, close to 2.
- [35:02]
Jared Weiss
Here's the key, I think with Jalen this year. So he's averaged 2.7, that particular number turnovers per game like almost every year of like the second half of his career. It's been like almost 2.7 every single year. He's done it like four times now, including this year. So that's the number of turnovers you're getting out of him and you got to just get used to that. And frankly it's not even that high of a number. It just seemed higher in the past because he didn't get any assists. Like he was getting basically the same number of assists. And so what you're seeing now is I think he's more of. His turnovers are probably, I'm guessing, anecdotally bad pass turnovers, which is great because that means he's trying to make plays. It used to be dribbling. It used to be losing his handle, trying to do all sorts of stuff that was just too like too sloppy, too tight, too ambitious, dribbling wise. And now I think more of his turnovers are more of the open floor playmaking type of turnover, which is great because that's, that's a sign of playmaking. So I think he's done a great job of overhauling his types of attacks. The way that he looks at scoring, he's not trying to race to the rim nearly as much as he used to. I feel like a lot of his rim attempts are kind of coming off of open cuts and open closeout attacks and stuff like that. He's more hitting the pocket on those pick and rolls with a playmaking mindset and then he gets into his mid range bag when he really needs to. And so he's had a pretty good perspective on how to run his offense, especially in the second half of the year. It seems like every year he comes out of the all star break with just like a much more reinvigorated renewed focus. But obviously he's dealing with this knee thing right now, which is hobbling him a little bit. Yeah.
- [36:41]
Adam Kaufman
Just to clear up my math quick, I can look at the exacts. 1.8 assists to turnover ratio this year, 1.5 last year. And those two are by far his best. You know, most years it's like you noted, it's if not negative, if not like, you know, less than one marginally above one. So one and a half, 1.8 on the verge of two noteworthy. And I have to check and see what. I'm curious what it is in the playoffs. I can look that up at some point too. But boys, we. We got a few challenging game. Well, a couple challenging games ahead of us here. For the Celtics, obviously they. The Lakers Saturday night with LeBron and Luca coming to town and. And that should be fun. And then you have Utah. Nobody's gonna play in that game. For the Jazz, you know, throwaway game probably for the Celtics too. And then of course, OKC midweek, a Wednesday night game that is also nationally televised as they've. They got a whole bunch of those on the horizon here. So litmus tests, I guess for the opponents maybe a little bit. For Celtics come okc?
- [37:45]
Evan Valenti
Yeah, I think so.
- [37:47]
Jared Weiss
Yeah.
- [37:48]
Evan Valenti
Litmus test game. I mean, I don't know. Cough the defending champions. We're talking about it, of course.
- [37:53]
Jared Weiss
Yeah. I mean, is the finals preview a litmus test? Two finals previews limit tests. Yeah, I would say so.
- [37:59]
Adam Kaufman
Yeah. There we go. See? So I got a. Yeah, I would say so. And. Oh, come on. This is why we ask these questions. Jared Weiss, who again covers the entire NBA for the athletic, always enjoy checking out his work. Enjoy when he hops on the show with us. We'll definitely do it again soon, man.
- [38:14]
Jared Weiss
Yeah, yeah, whatever.
- [38:16]
Adam Kaufman
For Jared. For Evan, I am Adam. Check us out Rate Review subscribe to Celtics beat whether you are downloading the pod or. Or watching the video. Hi. On the CLNS YouTube page, we will catch you again real soon. Again, Celtics, Lakers. The rivalry is coming up.
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- [38:45]
Adam Kaufman
Yep.
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- [39:07]
Jared Weiss
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Jared Weiss
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