Adam Kaufman (3:02)

I'm glad you said all of that because ev. I've been living in a state of. Of, you know, miniature regret for about a week since our last show with Brian Barrett, because I feel like while we're not quite. We're almost at the midpoint of the NBA season. Felt like the start of the new year. Right? Like, turn the calendar. 2025 to 2026 would be a good. Just kind of checking point along the lines of what Greenie is talking about. We sort of treated it like any old show and addressed, you know, just a state of things that were going on in the moment coming off of this game. And Jalen's, you know, bitching about not getting Eastern conference player of the month, and we just sort of went on our little tirades with that stuff. Whereas I'm glad that Green is here to offer us some of that almost mid season perspective, because to your point, Greeny, I mean, look, I love that you come on with us basically once a month because we do have these various checkpoints going back to literally the off season where you were outlining, you know, what tier is this team going to fall in? Is it the year one Brad Stevens 25 win? Is it the Isaiah Thomas? You know, like you. You go on kind of a surprising run and you're obviously a playoff team, but nobody really believes in you. You can't actually win anything, but you stack up some wins versus, wait a minute, this team could actually do something.

Evan Valenti (4:20)

And I don't think we're actually. We're actually the 2016, 2017 Isaiah Celtics that won 53 games and we're first in the conference. That's who we actually ended up being.

Adam Kaufman (4:30)

Well, but I don't know if people really believed in that team. It was fun. It was a great story, but it was like, are they a contender? Are they truly a contender? And right now, and this is something we've harped on more recently and throughout, I guess this Eastern conference is just so unbelievably wide open. It's a lot of what we keep saying about the AFC with the Patriots and everything, as those playoffs kick off, it's, anybody can beat anybody. There's no juggernaut, there's no thunder, there's no Nuggets. There's not even a Rockets, you know, like this conference could go any way to the point where. And you've tweeted this Jason Tatum, because I know we're all in the camp, we believe that he is going to come back at some point. Hell, I, I think if they're playing.

Evan Valenti (5:14)

Like this, they'll bring him back.

Adam Kaufman (5:15)

I, I've convinced myself that he's coming back in February, let alone, you know, March or April. And you know, you have said like, you know, boy, what that first time that we see Jason Tatum questionable, like how hard is that going to hit? And every. And I think that, I think that one's going to hit even harder, honestly than when it says available simply because you will know it's on the table. The anticipation. He's actually, this, this could happen. But long winded, ramble short. This team, winners of nine of 11, doing what it's supposed to do, beating up crappy teams on the other side, setting up as we sit here now for a date with Victor Wembanyama at the Garden. Luke Cornett in the crowd watching his old teammates last night. Guest of this team on back to backs. During the entire Joe Missoula era, let alone just the 5 and 1 record this year, this team, this, this is a really great opportunity against a team that I think most people would say, yeah, I mean, you're not on the spurs level, they should wipe the floor with you even in your house. Plus, they've been resting and waiting and this Celtics team could go in and sort of reannounce its presence a little bit.

Evan Valenti (6:25)

Especially because, you know, they had an opportunity to do that against Denver, right? Like, yeah, they didn't have Jokic, but everybody else on the Nuggets played. They're still a damn good team. You sort of fumbled that one away earlier this week. Now, if Wemby's playing, the spurs are, I think second in the West. I haven't looked at it this morning, but you know, second or third in the west, they've been just like you, one of the better stories of the entire season. When Wemby's on the floor, they're like a generational defense. So it's just another challenge, right? And it's another opportunity for them to say, hey, what you're seeing from us is not a fluke. It's not just because we play in the East. You know, people forget they're playing like a 50 win pace against the Western Conference this year. So this is what I mean, like when you really look into their season. It's. It breaks your brain how this is even possible. I mean, they have the highest point differential in the Eastern Conference and third highest point differential in the NBA. You know, it's like outside of a few close home losses, this team should be like 27 and 9 or something like that.

Adam Kaufman (7:31)

Yeah.

Evan Valenti (7:32)

To this stage of the season. And even if you were an optimistic Celtics fan that said, hey, the east is terrible. They're gonna. Because I think Kaufman, this was you. You were like, they're gonna win 45 games. They're gonna be comfortably in the top six. They've been even better. Yeah, they've been even better than you. Like, like, even the most optimistic Celtics fan has been selling them short, given what they've been doing. It's. It's honestly one of the most enjoyable seasons you could possibly have without your franchise player. It's. It's mind boggling.

Dan Greenberg (8:06)

The best part is it's like a different guy seems to emerge like every month to be awesome. Like, we've had. We had the Josh Minot awesome month. We had the Jordan Walsh awesome month. Now we're in the Anthony Simons. And. And like. And what. This is, what to me is really interesting about this team is like Joe was still kind of, kind of still in the lab, like pressing buttons. Like the Luca Garza, we're going to reinsert him. And now he's amazing. You know, the Jordan Walsh thing is kind of tapered off a little bit, waiting to see what happens next month when they figure out how to bring him back into the. The fold. You know, we haven't seen the Ugo Gonzalez go crazy month yet. You know, again, it's just.

Evan Valenti (8:48)

Well, he's just been awesome the whole time.

Adam Kaufman (8:49)

I was gonna say, based on Greeny's tweets, I think he's been going crazy every game.

Evan Valenti (8:53)

Yeah. Since preseason, he's just been, you know, constant.

Dan Greenberg (8:57)

It's just been like a lot of. I mean, every button that they seem to press seemingly works, and at some point you're like, this luck's gonna run out. And then they just keep doing it and keep doing and keep doing it. So, you know, you talk about best case scenario for what this season was going to look like. And Green, we had you on to outline all of them. This is the tippity, tippity top of what it could look like to the point where Jalen is now top three MVP candidate according to NBA key ladder, whatever the hell that is.

Evan Valenti (9:27)

Yep.

Dan Greenberg (9:28)

I don't know where we're at With Joe Missoula coach of the year. But I, I would assume that he.

Evan Valenti (9:32)

Probably, you want me to tell you, ESPN in their mid season, you know, award, didn't even have him listed as a coach of the year candidate. Wasn't even listed like you had. You had Eric Spoelstra as a long shot, Mark Dagnold as a long shot. It's like what is. That's how you know the Celtics are back in my opinion once, once ESPN starts being weird, you know, Jalen was.

Adam Kaufman (9:55)

I'll look up the latest while we're talking too.

Evan Valenti (9:58)

Jalen was the first team all NBA selection for them, but was the only first team selection not in the MVP part of that story. All other four members of the first team were in the mvp. And yet here he is. So it's like that's how you truly know the Celtics are back.

Adam Kaufman (10:13)

I'll tell you just some of the odds. You know, Jaylen Brown is sitting fourth in the MVP odds right now, 40 to 1. I mean he doesn't have a chance of sniffing it as far as I'm concerned. But just the fact that he is in that top five conversation to me more importantly says, all right, he's not going to be mvp. But you know, for first team, all NBA, that's very much on the table. Especially as you look at guys one like, you know, well, you look at guys like Jokic who is just not going to be eligible for maybe. Yeah, in all likelihood anyway, you know, he's not, you can't even invest in him for MVP right now because the books are aware of that. You know, LeBron is not going to be an all NBA player this year for the first time because he's not going to again play in that minimum games. But as far as coach of the year, we are looking at right now, he's gone up. I bet you Joe Missoula has moved and I'm proud of us as a show by the way, because I've been harping on this thing for two months at this point in time. Where's Joe in this conversation? He's sitting plus 353rd on the board behind JB Bickerstaff at plus 170. Mitch Johnson at plus 320.

Evan Valenti (11:28)

Okay, Mitch, I could understand being, you know, in that but like the JB Bickerstaff stuff like the Pistons were good last year. That's not, I don't know that that just to me, I would actually, I would almost say Joe and then the Phoenix Coach Ott have been the two most impressive coaching performances. But also, you know, I can see Mitch in San Antonio because they were without Wemby for two prolonged stretches.

Dan Greenberg (11:58)

Right.

Evan Valenti (11:58)

And they're still maintaining their level. But yeah, I don't, I don't really understand that. It's kind of like when Dwayne Casey won it for the Pistons that one year. It's like, what. It's just very odd. But yeah, ESPN didn't even have to have him listed as a candidate, which is just bizarre. So credit to Joe. I know he's with the.

Adam Kaufman (12:19)

Right cough.

Dan Greenberg (12:20)

You gotta understand, like, even at 40 to 1, you're at like a shade turned ankle away from being in a way, different parts.

Evan Valenti (12:28)

Right.

Dan Greenberg (12:28)

And I think that's a dart throw. I, I think that's well worth a dart throw because, you know, the NBA's. And you know, Shay's gonna play a ton and he's gonna have the ball in his hands a lot. And so, you know, I, I, again, I'm not like trying to wish us into existence. Picture of.

Adam Kaufman (12:46)

Yeah.

Dan Greenberg (12:46)

Again, if. Yeah.

Adam Kaufman (12:49)

Long odds bets. I, I get it. And sometimes these things just, it's worth.

Dan Greenberg (12:52)

It'S definitely worth it. I think Barrett got it at like plus 8,000. The thing that I think, like 80 to 1.

Evan Valenti (12:59)

Yeah. The biggest takeaway is if you remember Jason Tatum at his peak was in that third or fourth MVP slot behind SGA and Jokic. The fact that that is now where Jalen is living is just again, way beyond what I think even the most optimistic expectations of his season were like. We're seeing him take that leap to becoming no worse than like the seventh best player in the NBA this season. Like that in and of itself is, is such a testament to him and just a testament to the mentality of this entire roster and coaching staff. And Brad Stevens, like, that shouldn't be possible with people around. He's not playing with another All Star.

Adam Kaufman (13:49)

Maybe let's go with that for a second because we talked about this. Really. We've, we did this a bunch with Bobby Manning a couple weeks ago. We might have hit on it briefly with Barrett last week. I don't recall. But we've certainly sprinkled this in from time to time. Brown is having the best season of his career. He has leveled up yet again. He's been incredible. He's averaging 30 points a game just south of that. Six and a half rebounds, five assists, which I saw you talking about this on, on Twitter with people. Great number. Obviously, especially considering there was a point in time where, you know, for a Few years early in his career, like people would have balked at the idea of Jalen Brown ever averaging three assists in a game.

Evan Valenti (14:24)

Right. He's almost, he's almost quadrupled his average in three years.

Adam Kaufman (14:28)

Right. So what he is doing and, and I will say, and I'm not saying this to discount the performance at all, I did think that number would be just a little bit higher. I thought he'd be, you know, between five and a half, six. And that's only because I didn't think the scoring would be where it is right now. I thought he was going to be inherently a little bit more of a facilitator, a little bit more the player that he was last year. And we were going to see guys like White and Pritchard, you know, doing even more than they are currently doing. And oh, by the way, these guys are both 17, 18 points per game. I certainly thought we were going to get more out of Anferty simons who's averaging 13 and a half. So I just thought a lot of, you know, those helpers were going to come from Brown. I'm not dismissing the five. The five is incredible. He has had a great year. And, and that is all, by the way, without mentioning the fact that he is shooting 50% from the field, 37% from three, 55% from two. You know, the mid range, Jalen, mid range, my God, how many conversations about that. But if we believe that Jason Tatum is coming back as again the three of us do and a lot of people do, I am curious how it looks, you know, because I, I think we believe that Tatum, at least upon his return, probably whatever portion of this season he plays, he's not going to be the Jason Tatum of old. There's going to be a little bit of a build up to being that guy again. So even let, let's just say in a dream world you get 80, 85% of that guy. How does he so often over the years it's had a Brown bend to Tatum, right? How does Tatum bend to Brown? How does Tatum bend to, to what's working so well in this offense? How is Missoula putting him in to where he is alongside another all star, alongside another all NBA, NBA caliber player. But this thing continues to work at the high level that it is.

Evan Valenti (16:17)

I would say you don't even have to worry about it because the only difference in Jalen season is he's getting I think seven more front court touches a year compared to last year. That's it a game. So it's a game. So it's like the way that he is, his role has expanded is not something that, you know, you have to change once Tatum is getting, because you have to remember there's no more Porzingis, there's no more Horford, there's no more Holiday. So those additional touches in, you know, in the front court, in the half court, when they're on offense is not coming at the expense of Jason Tatum. Right? So he's taking 22 shots a game. This year, when Tatum averaged 30 and Brown averaged 27, Tatum was taking 21.2 shots a game. I see no reason why they can't have, like, if Tatum wants to take 20 shots a game when he's back, those shots are available for him. Even at this current version of Jalen that we're seeing, you know, it's not something where he has the ball. He's like, how do I say this? When Tatum hat is on the floor, he has the ball and he initiates everything, right? He has almost 100 touches a game. That is not how Jalen is being used. So if you just think the only adjustment I think will be instead of White and Pritchard initiating things, it's going to be Tatum, just like it always is. So I know that this is like a huge talking point because we're inching closer and closer to his return. I would just tell you they played together for almost 10 years. We know that it works. And the version of Jalen that we're getting now is almost separate from how they will play and can play when Tatum is back, because his role is not touch dependent, if that makes any sense, because he's only getting seven more touches a game, or I think it's eight or nine, you know, nothing drastic.

Adam Kaufman (18:17)

Well, it's abundantly clear, by the way, because I can already visualize the people in the YouTube comment section saying, here goes Kaufman. He doesn't like Jaylen Brown. He's pitting these guys against each other. I think we're all intelligent enough to know that that is not what I'm doing. What I am doing is simply looking at. I'm. I'm thinking about this from an X's and O's perspective. I'm trying, which is impossible, to put myself in Joe Missoula's brain and, and saying, okay, we've got a guy who's having a career year, who's playing great, playing selflessly, goes and gets his when he needs to, or carries the offense, obviously, when he has to, he's. He's doing incredible things out there. And this is working in a way dissimilar from how it has ever worked before. Jason Tatum is not a detriment to that. He is an addition to that. But we don't know what he, what version of Tatum he is going to be. And so while that buildup is existing, how do we sprinkle him in to where it's comfortable and efficient for everybody and this works for everyone. Brown can continue being him and Tatum can get comfortable without sacrificing the rhythm and continuity of what you noted off the top has been an historic offensive performance.

Evan Valenti (19:35)

Yeah, I mean, I think 99% of it just comes down to what Tatum looks like and is able to do on the floor. Right. Like, if they decide that they don't want to put extra, like, creation stress on his body or something like that, that's going to change how they play. If, if they say he's fully ready to go and it's back to him being the primary offensive engine, it'll look just like it's looked for the last eight years. Only now Jalen's going to be shooting 50% from the mid range and he'll have even better spacing to operate from on the offensive end. So it's really just, just like the entire season of like, we don't know what's going to happen at the deadline. There's just so much unknown until we actually see him on the court, it's impossible to know how they play or how they should play to maximize both, because we need to see what his limitations are like. When you remember when Gordon Hayward came back, even though he was healthy and there was, you know, no physical limitations, the mental hurdle for Hayward to return to the player he needed to be took time and that impacted how the team looked. So aside from the physical part I want to see is Tatum mentally over his injury. Does he trust himself to play and move and be aggressive like he always has been? If so, then it's not going to be an issue. If he isn't, then they're going to have to recalibrate to say, okay, if we can't have Tatum the way we're used to playing, how do we then incorporate that into what we're doing and get the most out of everyone on the floor?

Dan Greenberg (21:15)

I always say that Tatum's like, queen of the chessboard, can kind of do whatever you need to do. He could be a center, he could be a point guard, he could be a wing player. He'll figure it out. I think it's going to take a little bit trying to figure out. Again, you talk about the gravity of things and how Tatum's, Our Jalen's life will be a lot easier when Tatum hits the floor because the space will be even better. And I totally agree with that. It's just going to take some time, I think. You know, even though, like, even though this season has been, like, the best possible output you could possibly ask for, and everything has gone basically as right as it possibly could, you know, at some point this, like, magic fairy dust might, might wear off, and it might take a while for Timber back into this. What's up?

Adam Kaufman (21:53)

I said, how dare you?

Dan Greenberg (21:55)

I know, I know, I know, I.

Adam Kaufman (21:56)

Know.

Dan Greenberg (21:59)

This out of the atmosphere. But, like, that being said, they're, they're like. What is the word? Like, what's the worst possible outcome that happens when you sprinkle Tana back into this thing? He becomes like a killer, you know, kill second unit guy. Like, is he just like, I, I, I understand people's, like, trepidation of, like, what this. Oh, it's gonna be a little, like, okay, it could be a little rocky when it comes back, and I'm definitely, definitely expecting some turbulence. No question about that. But, like, the worst possible outcome is like, okay, he comes off the bench and is like, the best sub you've ever seen. Like, I'm, you know, I'm just trying to think of the worst possible scenario outside of him getting, like, somehow hurt again, is like a super sub who comes in and just destroys worlds for 20 minutes. Like, again.

Evan Valenti (22:49)

Well, I think the worst, worst possible.

Dan Greenberg (22:51)

Outcome outside of an injury. What is that? Because that's like, you're talking about, you talk about reinforcing a top five player in the NBA back to a team that's killing everybody.

Evan Valenti (23:00)

I would say, I mean, the worst, I mean, if we really wanted to say the worst case scenario is that he, you know, comes back, assumes his normal role, assumes his normal offensive load, and he shoots like, 30% from the floor. You know, like, the production not being there despite the role being what it is would be worst case. But, like, I don't know, he's also your belief. So it's like, I just, I can't see if he's healthy. There's no, there's almost no downside to him being back in your rotation. Like, we're talking about a top five player, one of the best players over the last, you know, 10 years in the entire NBA. No team in the NBA is adding a top five. All NBA player at the trade deadline, you as the two seed are like, that's just, that's just something that doesn't happen in NBA history. I feel like. So, I don't know. I'm, I, people are. You can already sense the worry. I could not. I sleep so awesome and so well knowing that Jayson Tatum is going to be back in my life again that I feel like it's mostly just fear mongering and you're waiting for the other shoe to drop. If you're like, you know, this is actually going to be bad or hurt the Celtics, like, no, adding a top five player is basically the best thing you can do to any roster in the league.

Adam Kaufman (24:21)

I think the timing of this is fascinating because we've had a lot of conversations on the show really in, in been what, couple months, probably at least a month anyway, we've had conversations surrounding what do you do with Anthony Simons in particular? What do you do with that contract? You know, are you going out trying to acquire a big, you know, who's going to be available? Is it Zubots, is it Claxton? Is it, you know, player to be named a Kong Woo.

Dan Greenberg (24:53)

Right.

Adam Kaufman (24:53)

I mean, all these different guys who, who in theory could be available to you and what's the package look like and are you able to. Because again, Keda has been a stabilizing force there. Garza has been a revelation, you know, well, but inconsistently sprinkled in. Right. And when they do use it, certainly of late he's played very well, but you don't know if, you know, when the, the pixie dust on that runs out. You know, I think we all agree they need another big. It's, it was the, we were talking, I, I don't know how many times I said in the off season, you're entering the year with a G league frontcourt. They need a big. They clearly need a big. But to go to the timing again, the trade deadline is, is February 5th. That's less than a month away. As we sit here right now, I don't think anyone realistically expects Tatum to be back before that or even necessarily. And I know we don't have the intel that the team doctors and Brad Stevens and Joe Mazzulla and Mike Zarin and all those guys behind closed doors do. But by February 5, they may not even know with certainty. Yes, Jason Tatum is returning this year. They may have an inkling one way or the other. But to know is a different animal, obviously. And if you know that he is coming back, well, then you know all the different things that he is able to do in the middle, offensively, defensively, he can improve. Certainly a disastrous defensive rebounding situation that the Celtics have this year versus Stevens having to act with assets theoretically again in the next three weeks to address a need for a team that even without its best player, Sorry, Jalen, right now looks like a contender in the Eastern Conference at the very least. So what is the approach in your mind if you know, if, if you're in basketball ops? What's, you know, what, what are you making sure that you do? Because you have to separate Tatum from this. You have to at least try. Tatum not in the mix. We hope he's going to be back, but we just, we can't plan for it.

Dan Greenberg (26:51)

Yeah.

Adam Kaufman (26:51)

How are we improving this team and what are we using to do it?

Evan Valenti (26:55)

So I think there's a few factors that I think will drive there, even outside of Tatum, that will drive their deadline activity. And the first, obviously you mentioned is Simons. And to me it has little to do with getting under any apron or luxury tax and more to do with what do you see happening this summer? Do you see a world in which you want. Because I mean he's playing Joe Missoula is molding him into a serviceable winning player.

Adam Kaufman (27:25)

Right.

Evan Valenti (27:26)

So is your belief that he's willing to stay and commit and are you interested in offering him some sort of extension? Whether that's mid level money, you know, something affordable? Right. If that's a yes, I think you keep him and you look to add low salary big men because they do need to add depth to that spot. If there is no future with him on the roster, just maybe he wants to hit the market. Maybe you're, you know, you're not interested in extending dollars to him. If that's the case, you almost have to trade him at the deadline because you then cannot lose that asset for nothing this summer. It's sort of just like what the, the Hawks did with Trey Young. They didn't want to pay him his extension. They couldn't lose that asset for nothing, so they flipped him. So I think what the future of Anthony Simons is is basically going to dictate what they do. Because if now you're getting out of the Anthony Simons business, well, you can use that 27 million to bring in a little bit of a higher salary bid. If your plan is to extend him, well, now you're looking more towards 6, 7 million dollar centers, minimum centers that you could maybe fit into one of your tpes, something it Just changes the market of help that you're going to be able to explore. And seeing as how we're all on the outside looking in, it's impossible for us to know what they're planning to do with Simons. Like, it wouldn't shock me if they move him, but it also wouldn't shock me if they're like, you know what if Tatum's not going to be back until March, we kind of want to see what he looks like playing next to Tatum. We want additional offense for a playoff run that we weren't really maybe expecting to have. I think the way that he's playing and how Joe has like, has molded him into a serviceable rotation player on both ends of the floor changes the math of like, okay, because heading into the season we were like, all right, they'll flip Simons and his expiring for a starting caliber center and that'll be it. Well, now I think that's changed a little bit. Some big man name centers aren't available. Like, who's the best center that's a big salary guy that is going to hit the market. You know, the Clippers are playing well. They're now going to be buyers if you, you know, believe the reporting around the league. I don't know, it's just like impossible to know. But your overall point of they have to address the big man spot, I agree with. It's just we don't know what path they're going to take to do that yet.

Adam Kaufman (30:02)

Let's take a quick break. Tell you this show is brought to you by our good friends over at Prize Picks. Whether you're starting a new routine or making player picks for the very first time, trying something new can be kind of hard. But life and on Prize Picks always feels good to be right with high pressure. Playoff matchups every weekend, elite hoops action almost every night. The action, it just never stops. And Prize Picks have lets you take control.

Dan Greenberg (30:30)

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Adam Kaufman (31:28)

Yeah, he should do it.

Dan Greenberg (31:29)

Christian Watson staying in the same game, more than 56 and a half receiving yards. Now, if he gets hurt, obviously that's, that's a little dicey and he gets hurt quite a bit. But this Bears defense, not the best passing defense, I believe of all the wide receiver options that Jordan Love has to throw to, Christian Watson is his favorite. If they're gonna win that game, they have to score some points because that Bears offense is really humming right now under Ben Johnson and. And then we're going to use the Patriots for our last part of our lineup here. Kaufman, Stefan Diggs. More than 50, 54 and a half receiving yards. If you look at Diggs's numbers in prime time, he's been unbelievable. He's been sensational. This is a primetime game Sunday night in Foxborough. I love Steph Diggs in this game and as you know, folks, if you hit all three, that's three extra money. If I don't, unfortunately, hopefully Flexplay bails me out, I get my money back. And prize fix now has early payouts. Let's say everything went well. Hit all of them. Prize picks let you cash out early and getting your money cannot be any easier. Coffin, as little as 15 minutes. Watch the money roll in your account. They even use Venmo over at prize picks, which is the easiest way do.

Adam Kaufman (32:39)

Any of these things. So download the app today. Use the code CLNS. You get 50 bucks in lineups after playing your first for only $5. 1. Once again, download the prize picks app. Do it right now while you're listening to the show. The promo code CLNS. You get $50 in lineups after playing your first for only five bucks. Prize picks. It's good to be right. Let's get back to Greenie. So again, guys, this team is just, I mean, it's humming. Obviously, against inferior competition, there's a world that is not unrealistic where this team could be riding an 11 game winning streak given what we saw in the way the Blazers game ended, the way the Nuggets game ended. It's bad teams beat the bad teams. And that's generally speaking what the Celtics have been doing. You know, coming off that Denver game, by the way, I was doing a show yesterday and somebody said to me, well, I don't know, I think the Celtics might lose to the Raptors. You know, this, this feels like a, a trappy kind of game. I said, let me tell you exactly why it's not a trappy kind of game and why the Celtics are absolutely, maybe not cover the almost 10 points, but going to win this game against Toronto is because they just had the trap game against the Nuggets that just happened. This is the bounce back and show everybody that we're not frauds game. And so I was happy to see the response obviously by this Celtics team, which in the process, as we've all noted, 37 games in inching closer to the midpoint year, 24 and 13 have climbed to second again in the Eastern Conference. Four games back of the Pistons who are, you know, starting to catch fire a little bit again, winners of seven and ten, three in a row. The Knicks are up and down the Raptors. Honestly, it's borderline shocking to me that this team is even in fourth in the East. But I think it speaks in general to where the east is. The Celtics, by the way, three and oh, against Toronto this year. I know they were undermanned last night. Don't care. Win however you can win. The Sixers, the Heat, I mean this, this thing is a little upside down. Like we all believed the Cavaliers, the Magic, even the Hawks, like these teams are all going to be in your top four, top five seeds. And right now all those teams are sitting in the mix for the play in tournament. So things are going to shift. I do believe that. I think in the case of Atlanta, getting off of Trey Young is, is good. You know, they're, they're a better team without Trey Young. So I think Atlanta is going to climb a little bit from sub 500 where it is right now, but this Celtics team to circle back. And I want to spend a lot of time on the spurs game because by the time this show is published and people get around to listening to it, the game's going to have already happened. But to spend a couple of minutes on it.

Dan Greenberg (35:20)

Well, hold on, hold on. Before you get to that for a second because we have Greeny on here, we had to address something because Dan is the, I think primary guy in pushing this narrative cop. You know how close team is to 4020. Ah, listen, Greeny is the captain of this fan club, and if you hit 4020 guy, like, that's so.

Adam Kaufman (35:42)

Well, explain. Explain to anyone that does not know the 4020 principle.

Evan Valenti (35:46)

Okay? In the 70, what is this, like the 78th season of the NBA? So in NBA history, however long you.

Adam Kaufman (35:54)

Said, no, we're higher than that 80, we got to be up over 80 now.

Evan Valenti (35:58)

Okay? In the history of the NBA, in a normal 82 game season, there have only been two teams in history to win the title by and not win their 40th game before they lose their 20th game. It's just. It's the single most important thing you have to do if you have dreams of winning a championship.

Adam Kaufman (36:18)

This was 40 pointed out by Phil Jackson, if I remember right.

Evan Valenti (36:22)

Phil Jackson, you have to win your 40th before you lose your 20th. Basically, that's like, it's like a 56, 57 win pace or something like that. Not a math guy, but I'm pretty sure that's what it is. Right now, the Celtics just need to go 166 to hit 4020 without their best player, which is not easy, you know, like, they've gone. They basically just need to replicate what they've done over the last 25 games for the next 22 games. Like, they've already been playing at a 4020 pace. They've been playing about 700 basketball for almost 30 games of their season, if you can believe it or not. So the fact that that's even on the table without Jayson Tatum and with this roster is borderline, like, impossible. Like, that should not exist. And I think the reason that is.

Adam Kaufman (37:17)

You said 22 games, right? So that's by the end of February.

Evan Valenti (37:20)

Yeah, February 27th.

Adam Kaufman (37:22)

I'm gonna. I'm gonna throw the games at you. Ev, do me a favor. Count the wins along the way, okay? Home against the spurs, yes or no, win or loss.

Evan Valenti (37:34)

He might be frozen.

Adam Kaufman (37:36)

Is he frozen again?

Evan Valenti (37:38)

He's been frozen for like, five minutes.

Adam Kaufman (37:42)

I don't even usually. At least he's frozen, but we can still hear him. Yeah, I don't even think he's there anymore. I don't even know what to do about that.

Evan Valenti (37:50)

I'll do it for you.

Adam Kaufman (37:51)

All right, well, let's hope he returns at some point in time. Otherwise, this is all just going to be for you and me. All right? Spurs, win or lose, back to back.

Evan Valenti (38:02)

Wendy, I'm still gonna go win. I. I just think they're rolling right now.

Adam Kaufman (38:06)

I think you're getting greedy at Indiana when at Miami is It on a.

Evan Valenti (38:13)

Back to back or anything like that or.

Adam Kaufman (38:14)

No, no. You. In fact, you have three days off.

Evan Valenti (38:17)

When?

Adam Kaufman (38:17)

When at Atlanta.

Evan Valenti (38:21)

Ewing theory still going to go.

Adam Kaufman (38:23)

Win at Detroit, loss. Okay. Verse Indiana.

Evan Valenti (38:30)

When.

Adam Kaufman (38:33)

At Brooklyn? When at Chicago?

Evan Valenti (38:38)

When?

Adam Kaufman (38:40)

Home against Portland. When Home against Atlanta.

Evan Valenti (38:46)

I'm going to say they're going to split with Atlanta. So I'm going to say loss. They're going to have a bad loss in there somewhere.

Adam Kaufman (38:51)

That one's on my birthday. It makes me sad. Home against the Kings.

Evan Valenti (38:55)

Win.

Adam Kaufman (38:58)

Start of February. Home against the Bucks.

Evan Valenti (39:03)

Giannis plays. Is this the first time they're playing Milwaukee? No. Second time. They're gonna. They're gonna remember. I'm gonna say when because they're gonna remember that ass kicking in that they had in Milwaukee.

Adam Kaufman (39:14)

Okay. At Dallas, win at Houston. That's a back to back loss. Home against the Heat, couple days later.

Evan Valenti (39:25)

When he owns Sposhire. So they won like 11 of 13 against Miami. Some great home.

Adam Kaufman (39:31)

Home against the Knicks. Nationally televised.

Evan Valenti (39:35)

That's February 8th, right?

Adam Kaufman (39:36)

Yeah.

Evan Valenti (39:37)

That could be the Tatum return. So I'm going to say when there.

Adam Kaufman (39:40)

Are a lot of nationally televised games in here. I'm not pointing them all out. Home against the Bulls.

Evan Valenti (39:44)

When I haven't been keeping track. Have you been counting?

Adam Kaufman (39:48)

Yes. At Golden State. And that's about. That's over a week later. It's after the break.

Evan Valenti (39:55)

Is that the first game of a West coast trip?

Adam Kaufman (39:58)

First game of west coast trip. After the All Star break, I'm gonna say loss. Okay. At the Lakers win.

Evan Valenti (40:04)

What loss? Because they've, they've never swept. They haven't swept the lakers in like 10 years.

Adam Kaufman (40:10)

So I'm gonna say lost at the Suns. When at the Nuggets. That's a back to back loss.

Evan Valenti (40:20)

I bet you Jokic is back by then.

Adam Kaufman (40:22)

Home against the nets. Friday, February 27th, when you know how many counted out.

Evan Valenti (40:29)

I don't know If I had 16, I'll tell you that much.

Adam Kaufman (40:31)

That was 16.

Evan Valenti (40:32)

Yeah, it's going to be. It's going to be tight. Like they don't have a margin for Eric because you got to think there will be a handful that they maybe lose that they should have win and there will maybe some that they win that they should have lost. So they're right on the bubble. Which. What's interesting is like Normally for the 4020 rule, you have your best player. So the fact that they don't have Tatum is like, how much do you put into this rule? The only thing that I could think of is One of the two teams to win the title and not hit 4020 was the 9394 Rocket. One of the Rockets teams, I think it was 93 94. What did they do that year? Midway through the season, they traded for Clyde Drexler, and then they won the title. So that's like the closest equivalent you could get to, like, adding Jayson Tatum at the deadline and then winning the title. So it's like. It's not a perfect formula, but the point is, they. They're currently checking off every other major box that you need to be considered a legitimate title contender. Only I think it's like. Like one team. One or two teams in NBA history ever won the title not being a top three seed. They've checked that off. Their srs, which is your strength of schedule, combined with net rating. No team in NBA history has won with an SRS under three. They have the highest SRS in the. In the Eastern Conference. It's like plus six, something crazy. The only box that they have not checked is 4020. So if you're telling me that we could live in a world where without Jason Tatum, they can hit that box as well, well, then once he's back, I have no choice but to think that this team, as constructed, can win the NBA championship.

Adam Kaufman (42:24)

This is going to be a ridiculous question that I'm asking you, and I feel like I know how you're going to answer it even before I ask, but there are probably enough people out there that are wondering the same things to themselves. Have you seen enough 37 games in to believe this is real?

Evan Valenti (42:40)

Have to. You have to. You're. And. And I guess. What do you mean by real? Like. Well, by real.

Adam Kaufman (42:47)

By real, I mean you have a legitimate chance to win the Eastern Conference, and at that point, you're in the NBA Finals against the Thunder, the Spurs, the Rockets, whoever it is. And at that point, you know, it's the best of seven. Anything can happen.

Evan Valenti (43:04)

Yeah, I mean, I don't see how you couldn't. Because we want to always talk about. It's early. Let's let the sample grow. Let's let that. You know, you could have injuries. Well, we're almost at the midway point, so it's like your sample is no longer. Oh, you just got hot for a week. Like, that's why you're at the top.

Adam Kaufman (43:22)

Of the East, Right?

Evan Valenti (43:24)

You lead the east. And point differential, you. You're third in the NBA in net rating. Like, at some point, if it looks like a duck and it sounds Like a duck. It's a duck. Like, you just have to accept that they've been able to find success. And it's all, you know, credit to Joe Missoula for finding a way to make this sustainable. You know, the things that they're great at feel sustainable, the things that they're bad at aren't going away anytime soon. Like, they're always going to struggle rebounding. They're always going to, you know, have, you know, deficiencies guarding the three based on how they, you know, their defensive approach. But, like, at some point, when you're 40 games into a season, what you're seeing is not a fluke. You know, do I think they'll have the highest offense in NBA history? Probably not. But do I think that the fact that they're, you know, 11 and 8 against teams over.500, which is the, you know, the most in the Eastern Conference, I don't think that's a fluke. You know what I mean? Like, the fact that they're able to win on the road, they've been doing that since Joe Missoula first got to, you know, the. The reigns of this team. So it's like, I don't know, I think maybe you'll see some regression in some efficiency for certain guys, but they were winning games with Peyton Pritchard and Derrick White not able to hit a jumper for six weeks to open the season. So I think they just have to. You have to believe that it's real. But also know even with the level that they're playing at, they still have such a small margin for error every single night without Jason Tatum, that we could have losses like the Nets loss or the Utah loss. Like, those are just as real as beating the best teams in the league.

Adam Kaufman (45:08)

So, first of all, sadly, we have lost Evan for the remainder of the show, a tech issue, which is he's lurking in the shadows, still producing the program. But we. We don't have him on the air, so. Evie, I know he can still hear us. So if you do have any write in questions, I'm happy to. To lob those greenies way and. And put them out. But where I want to go next, Greenie, we have, over the course of what has been such a fun, spectacular season, we've had the Jaylen Brown shows, the Josh Minot shows, the Jordan Walsh shows, the, you know, to some degree, Ugo shows, the, you know, appreciation of a lot of what has happened, Derrick White, all of it. I'm not sure we've given the proper, deserved attention to Peyton Pritchard, who as Noah here at the network wrote a piece for Celtics blog. Peyton Pritchard's the NBA's assist to turnover leader. The most lethal paint mid range shooter. Even more efficient than Nicola Jokic, who would be the MVP favorite right now if again not for the injury.

Evan Valenti (46:10)

I think he's over like 65 in the paint this season. And they're all jumpers, they're not floaters or layups. It's like Steve Nast jumpers. He's shooting like 65%.

Adam Kaufman (46:20)

So Pritchard this year is averaging 17.2 points. He's played in every game all 37. Obviously started them all. Four and a half rebounds, 5.3 assists, but roughly a steal obviously doesn't block anybody. The turnovers are 1.2. That 4.5 is the assist to turnover ratio. He's shooting 45%. Still a little low on the three, about 34% there. So I, I think that's going to continue to climb. And 87 for the three point mark or free throw mark. Pardon me. And two point range again is just sub 60. And you talked about what he's doing in the pain. This guy is, you know, you just sort of go through the arc of him coming out of four years at, @ Oregon and sorry for what happened to you in the face last night. You know, role player, early sort of budding fan favorite, right? Look at the dribbling in his garage and the handle and all this stuff. And playing time isn't there. Wants to be traded. Then he evolves into obviously a contributor and kind of a, you know, I, I would joke on this show like a special team player. Basketball had that look at him coming in late in quarters and you know, launching half court heaves and he's hitting them and you know, shot percentage be damned. And all of that stuff matures obviously into sixth man of the year to now where he is for the first time in his career a consistent starting point guard. And it was only a couple years back that it's like, man, who's getting in late in games, Is it smart? Is it white, Is it Brogdon? You know, who's the guy? Like never are we talking about Peyton Pritchard. Peyton Pritchard now is very clearly, not only is he on a good contract, but just in terms of performance, very clearly a piece of, of what we hope is the next iteration of Celtics champions. What is he doing this year that stands out the most to you in terms of like holy crap. This level of growth, this part of his game I did not see.

Evan Valenti (48:22)

Coming to me, I think it's, it's how he's able to get into the paint and just throw bigger defenders off of him with his body. He is able to use his strength because you would think at his size once he gets into the paint, like how does he not just get dominated by bigger players but it's his ability to use his shoulder and his low center of gravity to move guys off their spots to open up these little windows for his little paint jumper. It's like we always knew he was a low turnover guy. We always knew he was a good shooter. All that stuff like that's not a surprise, but it's the way that he now no longer picks up his dribble when he gets into the paint. Like he used to do that so often as a younger player of like he would drive into the paint, pick up his dribble, he would spin, he would turn, he would kick it out. But now we're seeing he's keeping his dribble, he's doing the little Steve Nash dribble around the rim. Getting into the paint and just finding ways to become a three level scorer as opposed to just a three point specialist off the bench is such a testament to his growth as a player. And I just think he's backing up every, just like how Jalen is backing up everything he said about who he was as a player. Peyton Pritchard is like the small point guard version of that level of confidence, right? He always knew he deserved to be on the floor. He knew he could be a starter level player in the league. Now he's doing it for the second best team in the east and it's an every night thing. You know he'll have off nights just like everybody else. But you don't average 17 and 5, you know, for a season by not being consistent. And I just think it's his ability to find other ways to score. Efficiency outside of catch and shoot threes is for me the biggest surprise of his.

Adam Kaufman (50:13)

Season. We're not maybe this to me problem but I think this is society. We're not a, a satisfied people, right? Every off season it's what's Jalen going to work on to level up his game. Derrick White, he's got another level, right? It's never, it never feels like enough. Even when guys are, are honestly from the outset seeming like they, they have not only hit but exceeded pre existing ceilings. So that said, what is Peyton unlocked next? You know what, what to you is the next evolution in his game, whether it's future seasons or even maybe.

Evan Valenti (50:44)

Glimpses this year, I think he can always continue to develop in the pick and roll. We're really starting to see a little mini leap in terms of how he's able to read defenses. And especially with Keda in the lobs, like that's become something that I feel like they always missed early in the year of when he would roll. That's starting to improve. I think, you know, there are instances where his outside shot can be a little inconsistent against length. Like, if you look at that Nuggets game, they really struggled in beating guys off the dribble. So I do think there are still ways where he can improve when he has to be defended by bigger guys with length on the perimeter, they sort of have been able to neutralize him a little bit better. And I just think it's continued growth of, you know, learning how to run an offense. He talked about it after the game where he's still figuring out the balance of when do I score, when do I get guys involved, when do I get a certain player or certain the ball at a certain moment. Like things that a starting point guard, like that's on your plate as opposed to previously it was all right, Pritchard's coming in the game. We're just going to let him spam his shot. Be that offensive, you know, injection. When you're the starting point guard, you're like the therapist for the entire roster, Right. It's on you to make sure, hey, you know, Simons hasn't touched the ball in five possessions. I need to make sure, you know, he gets it on this trip or, you know, we need to keep the bigs involved offensively so they can remain engaged in the game on the defensive end. Like those little things that are all a point guard's job, I think is where he takes his. His next.

Adam Kaufman (52:26)

Lead. All right, before we call this a show, before we came on, we spent probably 10, 15 minutes talking about Celtics related.

Evan Valenti (52:37)

Memorabilia.

Adam Kaufman (52:37)

Yes. And Ev, if anyone didn't notice, you know, scroll back on on your YouTube feed to the beginning of this show. Ev, over the last couple of shows has had this unbelievable gift from his parents that he got around the holidays of this. It's a, a two in one. It's. Well, it's a one of one. But this two in one Larry Bird, it's a picture frame that has a frame Bird game worn jersey within it. But then Bird would, you know, he signed the jersey, but he also in big gold Sharpie or whatever signed the actual, you know, picture on top of the jersey, it's very. It's awesome. I've never, you know, really quite seen anything like it, but so we started talking about other, you know, memorabilia that. That we have in our collections. And you brought out this little autograph.

Evan Valenti (53:23)

Book. I do. I have it right.

Adam Kaufman (53:24)

Here. You know, really like, peak a who Too, of. Of 2003-2006 era. Celtics of guys that like you. I mean, there were. We were trying to identify these guys, unfortunately, a lot.

Evan Valenti (53:41)

Of. Like this one. Who do we.

Adam Kaufman (53:42)

Think? Well, so that's. So that's why I wanted to bring this up. I, you know, is that Tony Allen? Is there a chance that's Tony.

Evan Valenti (53:48)

Allen? Let me see. Maybe. Right, because that could be a T or that could be a T and then double.

Adam Kaufman (53:54)

Ls. Yeah, well, so I, So I bring this up because. And I've done this before with. With signatures that I have on baseballs from literally 30 years ago that I just. There's no part of me that can read them. And it's a fun exercise because there are a lot of people out there in the Twitterverse or social media or whatever that are, you know, autograph hunters, seekers, collectors, whatever, that. That they. They know the answers to these questions. So any. You should take a screenshot of that with your phone and put them out and, and just anyone that you're not sure of. Okay. Put them on Twitter and say, any idea whose autograph this is? Because I think you would be shocked at how quickly and decisively you're going to have answers to these questions. I. A buddy of mine, he texted me one day, hey, I found this ball in my collection. You know, I can't figure out who the life of me signed it. Any idea? And I couldn't really figure it out, and I put it out on Twitter and it was old, old, old, like, early in his career. Because again, these athletes, a lot of the time, their signatures change over time, so it's hard to decipher. And we ultimately, with help from, again, social media, we figure out, wow, it's Dave.

Evan Valenti (55:05)

Ortiz. Because I could be sitting on a gold mine and I have no.

Adam Kaufman (55:08)

Idea. Yeah, well, that's what. I mean. Who knows who's in there? I. I think Perk.

Evan Valenti (55:12)

We. We.

Adam Kaufman (55:13)

Yeah. In there, obviously, in that era. Makes.

Evan Valenti (55:17)

Sense. I'm. I'm convinced this is Marcus Banks just because I want it to be Marcus.

Adam Kaufman (55:22)

Banks. Yeah. Like, Ev is behind the scenes. He said, I looked up what TA's autograph looks like, and I would almost 100. 100 confirmed that that one was Tony.

Evan Valenti (55:30)

Allen. All right, well, listen, I'm a big. I was actually sitting second row when he tore his acl. Was one of the most traumatic experiences of my life. Happened right in front of.

Adam Kaufman (55:39)

Me. Not great. Good seats.

Evan Valenti (55:40)

Though. Oh, fantastic. But I mean, like, you could, like, hear the tendon.

Adam Kaufman (55:44)

Snap. It was.

Evan Valenti (55:45)

Gross. And it was after. The worst part, if you remember, it was after the whistle, after, like a foul. He went up to dunk it and then landed on a dead plane. Tore his acl. So that was great. But, yeah, this was. This had to have been at least 20 years ago. So my brain obviously isn't what it used to be 20 years ago. So I'm not really sure who I, like, handed these books to all the. All those years ago. But that might be a good idea. I might put it out because I am curious, you know, if there's. How many are in there? There's only like five. So, like, I don't know what I was doing. There's like, there's only four or five of them in this book.

Adam Kaufman (56:22)

So. So we've already identified at least a couple. Yeah, maybe even. Maybe even four of them because there were a couple that we talked about pre show. I don't. I've already forgot who was the junior. I've already forgotten who this guy. And it wasn't Not Giddens. For people that are shouting that.

Evan Valenti (56:37)

Out. Yeah, let me. Hold on. Let me pull back up.

Adam Kaufman (56:39)

The. I've already forgotten this guy's name because we had to look him up. He played for the team briefly and I.

Evan Valenti (56:44)

Think. Yeah, for those at home, like, who the hell is.

Adam Kaufman (56:48)

That? Yeah, let me see. Celtics number nine jersey. Quick little Google search. This is a great thing about basketball reference for the. When guys give you a gift like that, lifting their jersey number, you know, you can at least. All right, so 15 players in Celtics history have worn the.

Evan Valenti (57:07)

Number. I want to say JR.

Adam Kaufman (57:09)

Bremer. So J R Bremer played in 03. So he's in that window. I think it's Justin Reed. That's. That's who I. And I don't remember Justin.

Evan Valenti (57:22)

Reed. Do you how.

Adam Kaufman (57:23)

Much? I don't remember right now. I don't remember a thing about Justin.

Evan Valenti (57:27)

Reed. Well, he played 23. He played 23 games in 04055 minutes per game. He scored a total of 41 points in 23 games. So I'm starting to think that these are not going to be worth.

Adam Kaufman (57:41)

It. Before he went to Minnesota, he Was only in the league for three total years. Played 136 games, started nine good for him. All with Minnesota. Average 3 1/2.

Evan Valenti (57:55)

Points. So part of me thinks they sent all the, you know, lower level roster players to whatever this event was and that's, that's who it was. But hey, what are you gonna.

Adam Kaufman (58:05)

Do? Ole Miss, man, We're just, we're just shouting out teams that get got pounded in the College Football Playoff. First. First it was Peyton's Oregon Ducks and. And now it's Justin Reed's Ole Miss running.

Evan Valenti (58:20)

Rebels. Well, listen, this time last year I was heartbroken over my beloved Sun Devils losing, you know, in overtime at the buzzer or whatever. So, yeah, you know, I'll take, I'll take Oregon getting killed over that any.

Adam Kaufman (58:31)

Day. Yeah, I, I just can't believe we, we truly live in a world where Indiana is a powerhouse football program. Gonna.

Evan Valenti (58:41)

Shred. Listen, you live in a world where Indiana. Where you live in a world where Indiana is a powerhouse and the Jason Tatumless Boston Celtics have the best NBA offense in.

Adam Kaufman (58:51)

History. In.

Evan Valenti (58:53)

History. Literally. Like, look at.

Adam Kaufman (58:56)

Great. And the Drake may lead. Patriots might go to the Super.

Evan Valenti (58:58)

Bowl. Yeah, right. Like we are living in the weirdest of times, but also the best of.

Adam Kaufman (59:04)

Times. So it's the best of times. I like all of these things that we're talking about. All right, well, Greenie, we look forward to seeing your scribbles out there on barstool, obviously, and the, you know, constant tweets and in going back and forth with passionate Celtics fans, which always fun for us and, and certainly we appreciate when you hop on with us every month or so. Of course. Of course. All right. For Evan Valendi Lurk lurking in the shadows, of course for Dan Greenberg, check him out on Twitter and, and read all of his stuff. Adam Kaufman, we appreciate you hanging here with us. And the Celtics, let's see if they can take care of business here. Make it six and one on back to backs this year under Joe Missoula and take down Wemby at the Garden. Should be unbelievable coming up after that. By the way, just to give you the upcoming schedule before we join you again. Monday at Indiana, the start of a four game road trip and then off for a few days at Miami on Thursday. And I imagine we will come at you again before the Saturday night game in Atlanta. So three will be played and we will have much to talk about as the Celtics, hopefully, as Greeny predicted, go 30 during that stretch and inch their way closer to that. Listen, 20.

Evan Valenti (60:16)

Benchmark. It's on the table. But I am nervous now about that game at Miami because they'll probably have like a full day in Miami the night before. And that that is a trap game, you know, in.

Adam Kaufman (60:27)

Miami. There you go. All right, guys, we'll see you later. Remember, check out Celtics beat rate review. Subscribe to the audio version of the podcast wherever you get your podcasts, or go to the CLNS All Access page on the YouTube page. You can find us there. Leave comments. We do enjoy reading them on the YouTube page, if anyone noticed, last week's show was not posted due to some video technical glitches. But we'll be up there this week as you're watching, learning as you listen right now and comment along with us. And maybe we'll do a little mailbag here on the show coming up soon. Until then, see you.