The France Pavilion: Julien Creuzet

Summary

CHANEL Connects: The France Pavilion with Julien Crouzet – Detailed Summary

Release Date: July 23, 2024

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Introduction

In the latest episode of CHANEL Connects, host Jana Peel delves into the vibrant world of contemporary art at the Venice Biennale. Set against the picturesque backdrop of Gabrielle Chanel’s La Pausa villa on the French Riviera, the podcast offers an intimate conversation with Julien Crouzet, the first French Caribbean artist to represent France at this prestigious event. This episode, titled "The France Pavilion: Julien Crouzet," explores themes of freedom, identity, and the immersive nature of Crouzet’s artistic endeavors.

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Julien Crouzet: Background and Representation

Julien Crouzet, a visual artist from Martinique, brings a unique perspective to the Biennale. As the first French Caribbean artist to represent France, Crouzet emphasizes the importance of freedom and authenticity in his work.

Quote:

Julien Crouzet [02:13]: "It is really important. It is in a certain way a responsibility. But I just would like to be free and to be what I would like to do to be a French Caribbean Afro descendant and what I can keep with me with my energy, with my identity, and what I would like to share for real with people."

Crouzet views his representation as a platform to share beauty and create immersive experiences, aiming to offer audiences a profound and interactive encounter with his art.

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Artistic Vision: Freedom and Immersive Experience

Central to Crouzet’s philosophy is the concept of freedom—both in the creation and perception of art. He strives to allow his work to evolve independently, free from traditional constraints, enabling history and narratives to be reinvented through his installations.

Quote:

Julien Crouzet [02:52]: "The object needs to be free, the history needs to be free to reinvent. You can rewrite again the history, for example."

Crouzet’s goal is to create experiences that are immersive and transformative, encouraging visitors to engage with art on multiple sensory levels.

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The Role of Water in His Work

Water serves as a central motif in Crouzet’s pavilion, symbolizing both connection and ambiguity. He uses water to blur the lines between different environments, creating a sense of being submerged in an otherworldly forest or a submarine landscape.

Quote:

Julien Crouzet [03:21]: "It's the spirit of the pavilion. But at the same time, it has like ambiguity. We don't know if we are in a forest or inside a submarine forest. And that is a strange ambiguity."

This element not only enhances the visual experience but also invites visitors to ponder the intimacies of continents and the fluidity of identities.

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Influences from French Caribbean Thinkers

Crouzet draws inspiration from notable French Caribbean intellectuals, particularly Ms. Esr and Edouard Glissant. Their work on identity, hybridity, and coexistence profoundly influences his approach to art.

Quote:

Julien Crouzet [04:06]: "Ms. Esr opened the idea of the identity a black person can exist in the beginning of the 20th century. Edouard Glissant gave beauty and perspective on how it's possible to live together, using the metaphor of archipelago to explain relationships."

These influences are evident in his exploration of creole languages and the complex cultural tapestry of the Caribbean.

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Exploring Creole and Hybridity in Art

Crouzet’s work embodies the hybridity of Creole language, blending various cultural elements into a cohesive artistic expression. His multidisciplinary approach combines sculpture, sound, and video, creating a synesthetic experience that engages multiple senses simultaneously.

Quote:

Julien Crouzet [07:58]: "For me, it's the relation we need to have with an object, it's turn around. It's not just look one point of views. Because which point of views can be like a possibility to transform your perception."

This blending of mediums allows him to transform perceptions and evoke deeper emotional responses from his audience.

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Studio Insights and Artistic Process

Crouzet describes his studio as a "secret kitchen," a space where ideas are stirred and creativity is cooked to perfection. He emphasizes the fluidity of his creative process, where visual art interacts dynamically with other forms like music and video.

Quote:

Julien Crouzet [09:29]: "For us, my studio looks like a secret kitchen. It is really important not to speak about how I organize myself with my team inside the studio because I think how it's for people to start to think and dream."

This environment fosters innovation and spontaneity, essential elements in his immersive installations.

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Temporality and Identity in Crouuzet’s Art

Temporal themes are pivotal in Crouzet’s work, where he intertwines past, present, and future to create a narrative that reflects his multifaceted identity as a French Caribbean Afro descendant.

Quote:

Julien Crouzet [15:15]: "I live my present and to understand my moment, I need to know more about my history. The history we can share together of this planet, for example, and different specific situations of the past."

By blending different temporalities and geolocalizations, he crafts a new geo-historical narrative that invites viewers to contemplate their own identities and histories.

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French Pavilion Proposal

Crouzet’s proposal for the French Pavilion aims to mix different temporalities and localizations, creating a space where monuments from Paris and Venice coexist. This fusion seeks to open his identity and offer a unique experiential moment for visitors.

Quote:

Julien Crouzet [16:09]: "I would like to mix different temporalities, different localizations and make a new geo localization or a new geo historical localization."

This innovative approach underscores his commitment to transforming traditional narratives and engaging audiences in a dialogue about culture and identity.

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Closing Remarks and Exclusive Poetry

The episode concludes with Crouzet sharing a piece of his poetry, highlighting the interplay of language and sensory experience in his art.

Quote:

Julien Crouzet [17:59]: "I can just share one lyrics of the show. The part of a Creole say when the night arrive the same idea continue to move like the movement of the wave."

This poetic interlude encapsulates the essence of his work—fluid, dynamic, and deeply connected to his cultural roots.

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Future Episodes Tease

Jana Peel wraps up the episode by hinting at upcoming discussions with other influential figures in the art world, including William Kentridge and Carolyn Kristof Bakargiev, promising explorations into the evolving relationship between artists and curators.

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Conclusion

This episode of CHANEL Connects offers a profound insight into Julien Crouzet’s artistic journey and his contributions to the Venice Biennale. Through an engaging dialogue, listeners gain a deeper understanding of how Crouzet’s work challenges traditional perceptions, celebrates cultural hybridity, and creates immersive experiences that resonate on both personal and universal levels.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps:

• Julien Crouzet [02:13]: "It is really important. It is in a certain way a responsibility. But I just would like to be free and to be what I would like to do..."
• Julien Crouzet [02:52]: "The object needs to be free, the history needs to be free to reinvent..."
• Julien Crouzet [03:21]: "It's the spirit of the pavilion. But at the same time, it has like ambiguity..."
• Julien Crouzet [04:06]: "Ms. Esr opened the idea of the identity a black person can exist in the beginning of the 20th century..."
• Julien Crouzet [07:58]: "For me, it's the relation we need to have with an object, it's turn around..."
• Julien Crouzet [09:29]: "For us, my studio looks like a secret kitchen..."
• Julien Crouzet [15:15]: "I live my present and to understand my moment, I need to know more about my history..."
• Julien Crouzet [16:09]: "I would like to mix different temporalities, different localizations..."
• Julien Crouzet [17:59]: "I can just share one lyrics of the show..."

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Listen to CHANEL Connects

For those eager to explore more conversations with remarkable artists and innovators, CHANEL Connects offers an extensive archive, featuring dialogues with luminaries like Jennifer Packer, Hans Ulrich Obrist, and Arthur Jafa. Stay tuned for upcoming episodes that continue to illuminate the dynamic intersections of art, culture, and creativity.

Transcript

[Jana Peel]

Welcome to Chanel Connects, the Venice Biennale edition.

[Julien Crouzet]

It's important to be free. So who was the fool who didn't recognize it all that time ago? Yeah, I think it is seduction.

[Alvin Lee]

Oh, absolutely. Just another woman trying to survive.

[Jana Peel]

So who of them is lying? I wish that were the case. Well, let's face the terror of the new work then. And this is what art is so good at.

[Alvin Lee]

I don't.

[Jana Peel]

Do you prepare?

[Alvin Lee]

No.

[Jana Peel]

In this season of Chanel Connects, we've taken up residence in Italy to go to the center of the art world. Listen in to the artists, curators, thinkers and makers behind the Venice Biennale, the world's most important exhibition of contemporary art. Now in its 60th edition. Each of our guests is focused on what matters most and what happens next. I'm Jana Peel, global head of arts and culture at Chenille. Thank you for connecting with us.

[Julien Crouzet]

Could you tell where my head was at when you found me? Me and you went to hell just to find peace.

[Jana Peel]

The poet E. Temple Thurston urged everyone to visit Venice. He said, you've got to see a city of slender towers and white domes sleeping in the water like a mass of water lilies. In this episode, we meet another poet fascinated by water and and the connections it creates. Julien Crouzet is one of the most talked about artists exhibiting this year in Venice. Born in a suburb of Paris and raised in Martinique, he's the first French Caribbean artist to represent France at the Biennale. Julien meets with Tate curator Alvin Lee in the opulent surroundings of the Palazzo Pisani Moreta, overlooking the grand Can.

[Alvin Lee]

Hi, Julien.

[Julien Crouzet]

Hi.

[Alvin Lee]

I think we should perhaps start by introducing ourselves. So my name is Alvin Lee. I'm a curator of international at Tate Modern.

[Julien Crouzet]

My name is Julien Crozet and I'm a visual artist major.

[Alvin Lee]

Congratulations on the French Pavilion.

[Julien Crouzet]

Thank you.

[Alvin Lee]

What does representing France mean to you?

[Julien Crouzet]

It is really important. It is in a certain way a responsibility. But I just would like to be free and to be what I would like to do to be a French Caribbean Afro descendant and what I can keep with me with my energy, with my identity, and what I would like to share for real with people. And my goal is just share more beauty imaginary and people can have like a particular experience. Maybe this experience can be immersive.

[Alvin Lee]

I think he totally achieved that because freedom was definitely on my mind. Walking through the sculptural environments and in.

[Julien Crouzet]

The pavilion, it's important to be free. The object needs to be free, the history needs to be free to reinvent. You can wrote again the history, for example.

[Alvin Lee]

I think your work touches on very painful, haunting history of displacement and migration. But also intimacies of the continents through water. Can you speak a little bit about the kind of role of water in this pavilion and in your work in.

[Julien Crouzet]

General, the world of water. It's the spirit of the pavilion. But in the same time have like ambiguity. We don't know if we are in the like a forest or if we like inside submarine forest. And that it is a strange ambiguity. Because I work and I share like a certain density of object of sculpture in installation group. And that need to question the bodies. How the bodies of the public can move, can position it all the time. For see, for hair, for smell.

[Alvin Lee]

Your thinking around water is influenced by some French Caribbean thinkers. Can you speak a little bit about that?

[Julien Crouzet]

I have many important thinker and writer and poet. The first one important is Ms. Esr, of course, because he opened the idea of the identity a black person can exist in the beginning of the 20th century. The second one is Edouard Glissant. Give like some beauty and perspective. How it's possible to live together. How you can use the metaphor, for example, of archipelago. For explaining the relation we can have together on this type of situation.

[Alvin Lee]

I know for the French pavilion you had your press conference earlier. A few months ago, at the former House of Wiglut. Can you tell us a little bit about that?

[Julien Crouzet]

For me, it was important of many France, many identity. To be French person. And to be a French person can be from Caribbean Highland, from Martinique, from Guadeloupe, from French Guiana. And symbolically, I would like to move out of the center, the political center. And go to Martinique. In the place of when the thinking can be free. And I think the House of Glissant can represent this type of situation. A place where the thinking can emancipate. The thinking can speak about how it's possible to think about the future. Martinique is like a concentration of many identity. England, for example, and France make a war for a long time. For who is the owner. Who can use this land like propriety. And that it is interesting. He creates like a specific language. Creole mixed with English, French, Portuguese, Spanish, with African language. With the Caribbean Arawak, the Tainos population. And this place is where you can find like Afro diasporic person. And it is a very complex context. But in the same time it can be beautiful. And this place creates like a singular culture. In the music, in the art, in the movement of the bodies.

[Alvin Lee]

You were talking about Creole. The kind of hybridity of Creole language. And I think that's very much in your work too. You work across all these different mediums. You know, the skeletal sculptures. And there's also sound and then moving image. Where did it all begin? Was there a particular medium that you started your artistic practice with?

[Julien Crouzet]

I started when I was teenager with idea. Make music, wrote lyrics for, maybe make hip hop, rap music. But that opens the idea how it's possible. Maybe wrote more free text. And all of these texts can be like poetry. And that opens the idea of how hard a specific form, sculpture, installation, video can be in relation. For example, when I produce an object, I produce a sculpture. Sometimes this object is very silent or immobile physically. But when you make this object in relation with music or with video, it can start to give you some other type of information. I like the idea when, for example, you hear a sound and it can affect what you see. When you smell a perfume, it can affect the experience you can have inside the pavilion.

[Alvin Lee]

For example, almost like a synesthesia, one sensory perception triggers another. Like a sound triggers your feeling of a smell or a vision.

[Julien Crouzet]

Immersive place. It is important very long we think how need to be silent. And we go in the museum, we see various silent sculpture. And I would like change this type of perspective. Just open the possibility how it can be like physically an experience. You need to move, for example. And for me, the relation we need to have with an object, it's turn around. It's not just look one point of views. Because which point of views can be like a possibility to transform your perception?

[Alvin Lee]

Is there a particular story to your ring?

[Julien Crouzet]

Ah, you speak about that one. Yes, it's like a long seashell have some in Caribbean ocean. And it like the first brief instrument. And the idea or the mythology of Visichelli can put out the bad energy, put out the bad spirit. And I like this idea we can have with some natural objects.

[Alvin Lee]

I mean, there's so many different kinds of materials in your work too. I'm curious about the setup of your studio. Can you describe your studio settings?

[Julien Crouzet]

For us, my studio look like a secret kitchen. And for me it's not important speak about how I organize myself with my team inside the studio. Because I think how it's for people start to think and dream. I like playing with the idea. What you see is not the reality. For example, I like the image. Have you been inside the Liberty Statue in New York?

[Alvin Lee]

You know what? All these years I lived in the US I've never seen the Statue of Liberty myself.

[Julien Crouzet]

What you see outside and what the statute look like it's really different inside. Inside it's a very like precarity constriction. And that it is really interesting sometime the perspective people can have about art. It's like magical tool or magical representation. What you see is not obligated. True. It's the idea of the cinema and the fiction. For example, when you see this type of image of this landscape, the relation between the sound not exactly need to be similar and don't need to be the same way. You can make like a confrontation between two universes. What you see, what you hear can create like a chaotic relation. And that can be interesting. For me, I can experience the theme.

[Alvin Lee]

Of the main exhibition of the Venice Biennale is Foreigners Everywhere by the curator Adriano Pedros. Can you talk a little about your. How has the theme informed your pavilion?

[Julien Crouzet]

The title of the Biennale is interesting and I think it's how it's possible to inverse or reverse the polarity of the world. The earth, for example, the north and the South. That it is maybe in a certain point of views interesting when we are in Europe in the same time, we just meet this week. And that it is interesting in a certain way. I'm the other. I'm foreigner for you and you are foreigner for me. What is your reality and how you negotiate with your identity? How you negotiate with the emotion of your identity.

[Alvin Lee]

Wow, that's a tough question. So I kind of grew up in China, Singapore and the US I moved to the US around when I was around 15. I'm queer and I think I spent many years trying to assimilate and let go of my Chinese identity. And I mean, identity is a fiction, which is something I've learned so much from thinking about. Queer theory, performativity. And I think these different forms of otherness have always kind of informed my effective approach to being in the world. It's a fiction and I feel like it's constantly being rewritten from these different experiences.

[Julien Crouzet]

And when you visit exhibition, do you question your identity?

[Alvin Lee]

I feel like I don't have a fixed identity that I hold onto in any kind of experiences. I think being in between that, in between space, of all these othernesses, that's where I feel the most comfortable. I do feel like every time I come to Venice, I'm in this fiction where this art world just goes island hopping and palazzo hopping. Water. Did you have time to kind of see some of the other pavilions?

[Julien Crouzet]

Not from the moment, but during the time I was in Venice, I visit many museums. We go to Correl Museum with my friends see some hold object old reality about Venice and Italian history. We go to Palazzo Ducali, maybe see Neptune statute in the stair and you can see this statute inside the pavilion in reverse in the last room inside the ocean.

[Alvin Lee]

It's beautiful. Yeah. So we're sitting inside Palazzo Pisani Moretta. Could you describe this environment for us?

[Julien Crouzet]

We have too much place for to be two persons in this room and that it is really particular. And I think we are very lucky to have this type of experience. I think this place, this architecture speak about another type of temporality. And I like to mention when we are and I like to mention we are in 2024 all the time. I think that it is important to fix a certain type temporality for understand I don't have a particular relation with this type of place. But it can be like a situation for discuss specifically in Venice in. Because Venice have a long history with art, with beauty. Since 100 years, maybe a bit more. It start in 1884, I think the first ball.

[Alvin Lee]

Since you're talking about temporality, I love the temporal aspect of your work. My question is, do you spend more time thinking about the past or the future? Or is that there's not really a distinction for you?

[Julien Crouzet]

I live my present and for understand my moment, I need to know more about my history. The history we can share together of this planet, for example, and different specific situation of the past. The past is like give some perspective for the present and try to make some proposal. But when I give one installation and I make one exhibition and I produce like a soundtrack, a sculpture or performance, I do it in my presence and in the same time. Maybe it can be like a suggestion for the future.

[Alvin Lee]

Speaking of proposal, could you describe the proposal that is your French pavilion to us in perhaps one sentence?

[Julien Crouzet]

I would like mix different temporality, different localization and make like a new geo localization or a new geo historical localization. In this reason I use for example monument from Paris, monument from Venice. I use different language and I try to open my identity and say, okay, I have all this information inside me and if I try to describe and take this line or this line, maybe I can create a specific place, a specific moment for unique experience.

[Alvin Lee]

Well, it's been amazing to meet you finally in person. I would love to visit your studio one day. Is that possible?

[Julien Crouzet]

Yes, Alvin, yes, we can do like a sharing moment soon in Paris. If you are in town, just let me know and we can organize this type of visit. Thank you so much for these interviews. And it's really important for me to have this possibility, share the emotion of my work. And the French pavilion for the 60 edition of the Venice Barino.

[Alvin Lee]

Thank you.

[Jana Peel]

Thank you to Julian and Alvin for hosting. And we have a bit more. Alvin asked Julian if he'd share some of his poetry after we wrapped and we were lucky enough to capture this.

[Julien Crouzet]

I can just share one lyrics of the show. The part of a Creole say when the night arrive the same idea continue to move like the movement of the wave.

[Jana Peel]

What a wonderful behind the scenes exclusive. Thank you again to Julien for being so generous with his time and his words. Julien talked about rewriting our histories, but what about our futures? We asked some influential visitors to the Biennale if an AI could continue the work of a dead artist. Who would you choose and why? My choices would probably be Helen Flankenthaler and Hieronymus Bosch. Let's see what our guests have to say. If I have to choose an artist whose work would continue with AI, I would choose Felix Gonzalez Torres because I think his interest in time and in light fits very well what we can see in Venice and experience again and again.

[Alvin Lee]

It would be an artist I would be intrigued by, and that probably died early was an artist like Ana Mendieta. Cuban artists that did a lot of works related to performance with the body and the feminine body. So it was avant garde, kind of feminist artist.

[Julien Crouzet]

Oh.

[Unknown Contributor]

Oh, that's a good question. I mean, first of all, do I want that to happen? But anyway, I don't have a choice. I suppose it would be really interesting to choose an artist whose career was cut short. And then you could kind of take your pick. You could think about Basquiat or even Raphael or Francesca Woodman. If you could have AI doing something interesting with photography. So, you know, artists that had far too short a career. I would love to see what they would have done as their career developed.

[Jana Peel]

Thank you so much to all of our contributors who joined us in Venice for the 60th edition of the Biennale. Thank you for listening to Chanel Connects, the Venice Biennale edition. Now, the number five is very important in the house of Chanel, so please consider giving us five stars on whatever platform. You're listening to us. Please follow the show so you don't miss an episode. To hear more from remarkable artists, listen back to the Chanel Connects archive where you'll find conversations between Jennifer Packer, Hans Ulrich Obrist and Arthur Jafa, who won the Venice Golden lion in 2019. They talk about what makes an artwork successful and the social, political and historical ways their work can be viewed. Next time on Chanel Connects, we hear from two old friends and veterans of the Biennale. Renowned South African artist William Kentridge and Free Thinking curator Carolyn Kristof Bakargiev. Together they explore the terror of unveiling a new work, why the art world is in for big changes, and the complex and occasionally tense relationship between an artist and a curator.

[Julien Crouzet]

Oh, I say, here's a perfect piece for you.

[Alvin Lee]

And I say, yes, it's perfect, but it's wrong.

[Jana Peel]

Do I do that?

[Alvin Lee]

Yes, you do. You do, you do, you do.

[Jana Peel]

Next week, find out why a bit of conflict can actually be a good thing.