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- [00:04]
A
Welcome to Charged up, the podcast, where the cutting edge meets cutting grass. We're diving deep into the electrification and automation revolution, transforming lawn care from the ground up. Whether you're a weekend warrior, a green tech enthusiast, or a landscaping pro, we're here to keep you powered up with the latest in robotic mowers, battery breakthroughs, and the smart tech reshaping your backyard and beyond. Your host, Tim Allard, has over over 15 years in the industry and has been charged up about the electric revolution for years. So plug in, power up, and let's get charged up.
- [00:45]
B
Hey there. This is your host, Tim Allard of the Charged up podcast. Thank you for joining us this week. And my guest today is Adam Goldwasser from Greener. Adam, it's a pleasure to meet you. We just kind of ran into each other here at the Equip Expo and had a good little conversation earlier. But I want to share some of what you do and what you guys are offering at Greener that may be of interest to my listeners. And so go ahead and tell me a little bit about Greener.
- [01:21]
C
Yeah, absolutely. First of all, thanks for having us on. And we're charged up to be here. I think. I came over because I saw your branding and I was like, oh, that has got to be aligned with what we're doing. And sure enough, it was pretty dead on. So Greener started a robotic mowing as a service business in the northeast of the US six years ago. Now, today we operate and manage one of the largest fleets of autonomous mowers in the country between two markets across 200 square miles. And we do so efficiently with three technicians. And we do so efficiently because we use software that we've built to do so. Now we're at a point where robotic mowing adoption is starting to proliferate a bit. Some of the landscapers are trying to get into robotic mowing for themselves, and they're looking for solutions and tools to aid their effort in doing so. So we are willing to provide those tools in the form of the software that we've built to manage our own business for others to do so, and also give them a bit of the playbook in how to be successful in structuring a robotic mowing program.
- [02:36]
B
Sure. Can you tell me a little bit more about that software and exactly what you know? How could it help me as a business owner that's looking to integrate robotics into my business?
- [02:48]
C
Absolutely. So what we have is a manufacturer agnostic, single point of control fleet management platform. So we have API integrations with all the Major robotic mowing brands that are on display and full production level here at the show and their equipment passes information directly into our system, allowing you to a single point of monitoring control. And then there's the task resolution component. So the key to operating a robotic mowing program successfully is maximizing uptime of the machines. Downtime is the enemy of robotic mowing. You're playing catch up. The results are never up to snuff. If the robotic mower is sitting in error because a branch from the storm fell and got caught in it and no one has reset it for three days, sure, not a good look. So our software empowers technicians to resolve those errors and track all the time and effort that goes into doing so. And empowers the organization to feed that information into their backend cost accounting software to understand the profitability of the robotic mowing operation, return on asset on any one piece of equipment they put out in the field, and ultimately be successful in running a program.
- [04:17]
B
Cool. What is your role at Greener?
- [04:22]
C
So I'm a co founder, coo, come from a background of startup operations, zero to one, going from concept to scalable business. So we started with the robotic mowing as a service business again back in 2019 and scaled that into a decent operation in two markets in the Northeast and really had a natural evolution because we just built this tool out of our own need and now we find that it has broader application. So we're really excited to be on this journey. But me personally, I have startup operations background and that's what drew me in on this exciting industry that's just getting off the ground.
- [05:10]
B
It is. And I think. How many years did you say you've been doing this?
- [05:13]
C
This is six.
- [05:14]
B
Six. Yeah. I mean, so you were definitely a real early adopter of this type of technology. You know, we're finding, you know, some of the robotic stuff I think has been more geared towards homeowner. I think from a commercial perspective, I don't see a lot of guys doing it with our business. Same thing for us. We've been battery powered for four seasons now. And this year is the first year we've started looking and testing the robotics out there in the field. And I think with some of the stuff we've seen here this week, it's a game changer. I mean, some of the stuff that's coming out, you know, Cress's new Voyager is going to change the commercial landscape. Like Horizon, I think, cover some ground. It's crazy. I think you're gonna, you know, we're talking about even implementing it next year in our business. We actually just put a deposit on one because I'm this, this will make commercial landscaping so much more easily to scale because you need one technician, one truck, one voyager and your hand tools. And you have a totally independent separate cost center right there. And so you can just replicate, replicate, replicate. And so I'm hoping that's what we're going to see because we're changing how we're doing things this next year. And I certainly offer. Want to talk more about what you guys are offering. Correct me if I'm wrong. I think a lot of technology innovation such as your software oftentimes is developed originally from more of an in house standpoint of how can you better your business. And then all of a sudden you realize, hey, well, if this works for us, it would probably work for others.
- [07:04]
C
Yeah, I think all the best businesses start out of a need. Right. A gap in the market and a need for a tool or for a service or something that is going to improve the way that you do things. And so this is no different than that. And I just wanted to speak to another point you just made that it's taken off a little more with DIY and homeowner. And I think that's because, you know, the benefits are clear for a homeowner. Right. Noise free. Let's put a exclamation point on that. Environmentally friendly. Right Ahead of the regulatory coming down the pike with that.
- [07:41]
B
Sure.
- [07:41]
C
And cut every day. Who doesn't want their grass to look like a golf course? We've got, you know, families with young kids who tell me, oh my kids play soccer and now they can play all week instead of the two or three days after the mow and then the ball stops rolling and we have to wait for the guys to come.
- [07:56]
B
Yeah. And well, and with most of it, you don't have the rain issue. I mean, you have days of rain, your mower is still cutting. You know, you if for the homeowner that sometimes often finds it hard to find time to maintain their own lawn anyways, you know, now rain doesn't become a factor. So there's just so many problems that are solved. And I think, you know, one, even if it's not raining early spring, the ground so soft, not putting these big heavy machines getting stuck, tearing up your lawn. I mean we, we service a lot of properties that in the early spring or if we have a rainy season that there's areas we can't mow commercially because we can't put a Zero turn on it. And so you almost, you know, even from a robotic standpoint, we've sometimes looked at some of these and said, hey, we may have to create two separate maps like the dry season map and the wet season map. Because, you know, you know, obviously there's more technology, they're starting to come out. You know, we have more all wheel drive, four wheel drive models coming out, which will help with some of those issues. Because, you know, oftentimes if you have wet or wet and hilly areas, it's hard for those robotic mowers to really get some traction.
- [09:12]
C
Yeah, no, that could, that could absolutely be a challenge. But to your point, the tech is proliferating and it's getting to a point that a lot of those edge cases are being accounted for, which is really exciting to see. I think is going to be one of the next things that breaks down the barriers for people to by and large adopt these products. The, the other side of the equation. Right. Because the homeowner benefit piece is, is pretty cut and dry and clear.
- [09:39]
B
Sure.
- [09:40]
C
There is a clear cost benefit to the landscaper operating a robotic mower to augment their traditional maintenance operations. Clear cost benefit. And we've been, you know, the benefit beneficiary of case studies that we've been able to, you know, do an apples to apples comparison on a property and how much exact time goes into it on one week when it's fully traditional and then the next week when we've installed robotic mowers. How you're seeing an 80% reduction in time on property to maintain and you're getting that time back in your pocket in the form of labor that you can, you know, put onto higher margin work, you know, or other mowing work if you just want to grow that operation as well.
- [10:25]
B
Yeah, exactly. And that was the conversation I had just today of the fact that now that one crew now can become two crews. So if you have six crews now, you can be 12 crews doubling efficiency overnight. You're doubling your efficiency overnight and creating volume. And so then you can, can obviously one, make more money because you're doubling your crews, but two, you're cutting your costs at the same time, so you're bringing in more income. And the outgo is not, it's not equivalent.
- [11:06]
C
The revenue per employee goes up.
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B
Exactly.
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C
And the cost to do business comes down.
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B
Yeah. So it's not like the old model where like if one thing went up, the other went up. Now it's like one thing goes up and the other actually probably goes down,
- [11:20]
C
you know, There is nothing that makes sense in the equation of a loss leader like cutting grass requiring one of the largest labor inputs of any maintenance operation. So I think it's time we flip the script. And robotic mowers are the way they definitely are.
- [11:37]
B
I think the one thing with that is, and I think you've probably seen this in every market. I think we've seen it in the last five to six years of trying to find staff. It has just continued to be a problem and I don't know when it's going to correct itself.
- [11:52]
C
I don't think it's getting better.
- [11:54]
B
I don't know if it's going to correct itself. But the conversation I had yesterday with somebody is, I think it also, from a business owner's perspective, cutting grass has always had a little bit of a stigma of what do you do for a living? Oh, I cut grass like it's the bottom of the barrel job. And I feel like the robotics and this technology piece is almost gonna change that because now I'm not hiring a guy to cut grass, I'm hiring a landscape technician because he's dealing with technology. So he's gotta have some skills. Yeah, I mean there's the hard skills of being able to trim and blow, but there's also gotta be the technology piece to problem solve, you know, and do the maintenance on these more technical, you know, mowers versus what we're used to of just changing oil and putting gas in it and new spark plugs. And so.
- [12:46]
C
And you know what? That, that person, that employee is going to have a better career trajectory for that very reason. Right. They've learned a new skill that's valuable in the market. It may even attract a whole new crop of, you know, labor talent that may have been a little bit more tech focused and been like, well, cutting grass traditionally doesn't really interest me. But you know, managing a fleet of robotic mowers, complex environment, that's an interesting challenge.
- [13:13]
B
Well, and I think even, even as far as like your, your company uniforms, you can be a little cleaner and neater because you know, you're cutting, you're trimming some grass, but you know, most time you can just blow that off your pant leg and so you're not getting as dirty. And I remember back when we used gas powered equipment, like you come home smelling, you know, all of a, you got grease on your, your shirt because you bent over the mower and you know the thing's leaking oil somewhere. Because I think they all do.
- [13:41]
C
Right. Those things get put through the wringer.
- [13:45]
B
How, how do you see that changing for your team? I mean, how many guys do you have out in the field? How many, you know, how many robots is each person managing?
- [13:58]
C
So today we've got round about 400 robotic mowers in two different geographic regions, about 200 square miles. All in all, three technicians.
- [14:10]
B
That's crazy.
- [14:11]
C
And a very powerful management app in their pocket in the form of the Greener hub.
- [14:17]
B
Do you, in the, in those areas? Like, do you. So if you have three technicians, I guess they cover a pretty large area. Do they have like a maintenance route that they go on? Do you only go out to, you know, when there's an issue with a robot or are they checking them constantly?
- [14:42]
C
So there are many different models in which people empower third parties to do resets. In our core robotic mowing as a service business, we're covering all resets and our software is monitoring at all times those robotic mowers. And if one goes into distress and has an error that requires an in person visit to reset it, it's going to look at. Okay, where is this robotic mower right now? It's on 123 Main Street. 123 Main street is in service territory. Easthampton, East Hampton is assigned to technician Kevin. So put, oh, and this happened at 1:00am, put it on Kevin's schedule for today at 9:00am or. Oh, it happened at 2:00pm, 3:00pm after the cutoff for today. Okay. The logic says put it on his schedule for tomorrow. Right. Builds that technician's schedule. They come in, look, check into the app and they know exactly where they have to go, what they have to do to keep that fleet up and running that day. They're armed with the information to resolve any issue in the field. And if they can't resolve it for whatever reason, they're able to create a follow up task to do so at a later date. You know, different equipment as needed.
- [16:00]
B
Sure. Now are your techs, what are they doing? Are they trimming, they blowing? They're just strictly maintaining the robotics.
- [16:07]
C
Yeah. So we've got a pure robotic mowing as a service play in which we partner with full service landscapers in those markets and act as their outsourced mowing department, using robotic mowers as our core team. So and we started our business that way because we recognize the benefits of robotic mowers for the end user, the homeowner, and we recognize the community that is doing the work of keeping that grass maintained. And it's not the homeowner, it's this Professional group of landscapers. But the barrier to entry in the form of the learning curve was a little bit steep. Having to suss out exactly which mowers are the right ones for the right job, how to structure a program, the bit of upfront capital investment to actually go and start replacing traditional equipment with robotics. And so we want to break down those barriers and make it as simple as possible. So we partner with the landscapers in those markets. We say, you give me an address, we'll tell you exactly what it takes, how many and what type of robotic mower a price for, you know, annual service for the season. You give us a thumbs up, we'll go secure the mowers, install them, maintenance, maintain them and monitor them. Regular maintenance as needed, maintenance, storage. In the off season, your crew comes around, does the edge trimming and the fine turf care and the finer edge flower beds and all the other work that they were already planning to do, minus the ride ons and the time suck of actually mowing acres of grass and everybody wins.
- [17:51]
B
Now, I was thinking of this earlier and tell me if you have ever. So in my mind what I was thinking is you're gonna have some homeowners that are like, well, I could just buy my own robot. Right. Do you have those conversations with potential clients of why they should sign a service agreement with you versus they just go out and buy their own piece of equipment?
- [18:19]
C
Yeah, there are definitely DIY users and homeowners that will buy and implement robotic mowers for themselves. And we absolutely support those use cases. And you know, we've sold equipment in certain cases. But we have found, and many of our friends in the industry that have been around for a few years have found that some level of service is necessary to optimize the results of robotic mowers. And whether that is a light maintenance package in which you're just doing ad hoc as needed maintenance or, or all the way up to a turnkey, like, I'm not going to lift a finger if that thing gets stuck. You're going to free it up and everywhere in between. Right. There is a need for that. For those in the do it for me market, those that are hiring professional services to maintain their property. So while the DIY market exists, and I think it's an amazing thing for the industry, I mean, seeing is believing with robotic mowing. So the more reference you can get out there with more robotic mowers, the better and ultimately, you know, it's going to be good for the industry.
- [19:35]
B
Yeah, no, I want to be respectful of your time. But I guess one of the thoughts that I'm having right now is so as the fact that you contract out the. The manual labor piece of it, the trimming, the blowing, the weekly fine tuning of things. Do you have, how does that relationship work? So you get a phone call, somebody wants you guys to go out and place a robotic mower on their property. And so where do you go from there? Do you contact the third party, the subcontractor that does the other work? Do you have a preset pricing agreement? How does that work? Can you tell me A little bit?
- [20:16]
C
Yeah. So actually it's a little bit flipped on its head. The landscapers have the accounts, the full service. Landscapers have the accounts. They're doing a multitude of services in the markets that we're operating within. And so we approach the landscaper with, you know, our proposal to work with them to manage their robotic mowing program on their behalf. And, you know, they can focus on their core competencies. And so really we're more of a subcontractor to their effort than anything which provides certain benefits. Right. Such as insulation from the end user. They still get to manage that relationship, which they want to do. Right. They can sell through additional services and, you know, we get to focus on what we do best. And, you know, it's a happy marriage, let's say. Homeowners definitely reach out on occasion for service direct and we can absolutely service those clients. We've got a network of landscapers that are happy to pick up, you know, trimming work. And hey, we work with all these different landscapers. You know, bridge any connection if you need, you know, the supplementary care for your property. Here's what we do for the robotic mowing portion. And, you know, happy to work with you.
- [21:35]
B
Cool. Very, very good information. If you can just tell my listeners how to find out more about you, how to get in touch with you if it's something they want to learn more about.
- [21:46]
C
Absolutely, yeah. So you can find us at gogreener Us. That's gogreener us. Or you can email me direct at Adam Goldwasser, G O L D W A S S e r@greenertech.net maybe you can link it because my name is very long. Sure.
- [22:08]
B
We can have Mr. Producer put that in the field notes for us.
- [22:11]
C
And we're. We're launching the Greener Hub platform. Anybody, any and all interested in operating a robotic mower program within their landscaping business or robotic mowing as a service business, to service the community.
- [22:26]
B
One last question. I want to ask that just kind of popped into my head. Are you looking to grow that network outside of the current area that you're serving?
- [22:35]
C
The robotic mowing as a service business? It's organically growing within those markets and serving as an amazing R and D center for our software. Ultimately, we are making the short term decision to truly focus on the growth of the software platform because we think we can serve a broader audience of users that way while the RAAS operations just continue to grow and snowball on their own without us really driving it. Because again, market awareness is growing and with it demand. And I'm not knocking on as many landscaper doors trying to knock down, but we're still getting the inbound inquiries. So that's, that's always good to see.
- [23:19]
B
That's awesome. Well, it was a pleasure to meet you. I'm glad you kind of came over and pushed your butt in earlier.
- [23:24]
C
Yeah, absolutely.
- [23:25]
B
I definitely, I'm sure we'll stay connected and have more conversations as this industry and all this technology changes. I want to kind of keep touch and see how things evolve for you guys. So we'll definitely catch up again. And I really appreciate you coming on and letting our listeners know what you guys are about and hopefully they'll reach out to you with any questions they have. But enjoy the rest of your time here at Aqua.
- [23:48]
C
Thank you so much. Yeah, no, really appreciate, you know, the opportunity to talk about what we're doing and super enthused and excited about what we're seeing down here and the motivation of the industry and the direction it's going. So happy to be a part of it.
- [24:00]
B
Yeah, great. Thanks a lot. Adam, to my listeners. Thank you for joining us on the Charged up podcast this week. We'll see you on the next one.
- [24:26]
A
That's it for this episode of Charged up, where tech meets turf. If you enjoy the ride through the world of electric and automated lawn care, forget to follow the podcast, Leave a well worded five star review and share with your fellow green thumbs and gearheads. To connect with Tim, check out the show description. Thanks again for listening. And until the next time, stay sharp, stay smart, and stay charged up.