fragrance first | jackie asamoah

Summary

CHEERS! with Avery Woods

Episode Title: "fragrance first | jackie asamoah"

Date: September 8, 2025
Host: Avery Woods
Guest: Jackie Asamoah

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Main Theme & Overview

In this heartfelt and candid episode, Avery Woods sits down with Jackie Asamoah (formerly Jackie Aina), the acclaimed beauty and lifestyle influencer and CEO of Forever Mood. The conversation weaves through Jackie's journey from a challenging upbringing and military service to her rise as a digital creator and fragrance entrepreneur. Together, they touch on gratitude, inclusivity in beauty, building a sustainable brand, work-life balance, marriage, and the reality of navigating social media as women. The episode is full of vulnerability, laughter, industry insight, and empowering advice—served, as always, with a side of sisterhood and good vibes.

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Key Discussion Points & Timestamps

1. Gratitude & Romanticizing Small Moments

[01:27 – 04:45]

• Avery admires how Jackie "romanticizes every aspect of your life," inspiring her to slow down and appreciate small joys like making her bed.
• Jackie discusses gratitude as a grounding practice, especially after growing up with very little and not wanting to fall into entitlement or greed:

  "It's like a love letter to myself...practicing gratitude...I don't ever want to be gluttonous."
  — Jackie [02:19]

2. Humble Beginnings & Military Experience

[04:45 – 12:50]

• Avery and Jackie bond over buying and renovating homes from modest means.
• Jackie shares her military background in the Army Reserves, explaining the challenges of being a woman in a male-dominated institution and the persistent misogyny experienced, regardless of appearance.

  “This is why I don’t believe how a woman dresses dictates how she’s treated...the military is the place that strips you of your individuality, and you still get disrespected.”
  — Jackie [08:00]

3. Gender Roles, Career, & Parenting

[10:21 – 13:00]

• Discussion on double standards faced by women who work or have stay-at-home husbands.
• Avery shares her husband’s experience as a stay-at-home dad, highlighting societal judgments:

  “If I was a man, you would never say this to me.”
  — Avery [11:56]

4. Why Jackie Joined the Army & Early Adulthood

[13:00 – 19:44]

• Jackie describes joining the Army at 21 after dropping out of college, familial pressures (especially as a Nigerian firstborn daughter), and longing for adventure and stability.

  “The stupidest decision ever...I did what I had to do.”
  — Jackie [13:00]

5. From YouTube Beginnings to Online Community

[20:12 – 27:11]

• Jackie started as “Lil Pumpkin Pie 05” on YouTube, inspired by isolation while stationed in Hawaii.
• YouTube began as an emotional outlet and community during her “lowest” adult moments:

  “I was just happy that people online were just being nice to me. That's how depressed I was at the time.”
  — Jackie [26:21]

6. Building a Business & Social Media as a Career

[29:15 – 35:41]

• Jackie explains her slow rise; the term "influencer" didn’t exist at the start.
• She balanced content creation with other jobs for years before going full-time.
• Both hosts stress the upfront costs, time, and “work ethic” required to make it as a creator, especially with no financial safety net.

  “There’s gonna be a long time—at least for me, that’s like four years—I cannot quit my day job.”
  — Jackie [33:33]

7. Work Ethic, Privilege, & the Creator Grind

[36:22 – 44:31]

• Candid discussion on the difference between creators who come from working-class backgrounds vs. those with family support.
• Jackie reflects on expectations on Black creators and the struggle for visibility in early beauty YouTube.

  “I'm a Black woman in America, honey. I have to give you three times better.”
  — Jackie [42:24]

8. Being a Voice for Inclusivity in Beauty

[45:08 – 54:35]

• Jackie shares how and why she advocates for deeper shade ranges and representation.
• She details the backlash and double standards faced for speaking up, including being targeted by major brands:

  “Sometimes it won't even be stuff that I've said...they treated me like the school principal of Black people.”
  — Jackie [51:22]

• Avery highlights Jackie's impact and the slow but real change in beauty standards:

  “Quite frankly, it took way too long for shade ranges to be expanded the way that they have.”
  — Avery [50:33]

9. Fitness, Lifestyle Transformation, & Boundaries

[55:06 – 59:19]

• Jackie discusses a slow, sustainable journey to fitness, focusing on consistency and lifestyle over aesthetics.
• Both stress the importance of hobbies and real-life fulfillment outside of social media.

10. Fragrance, Forever Mood & Entrepreneurship

[59:50 – 75:09]

• Jackie reveals her lifelong love for fragrance (rooted in early struggles with hyperhidrosis) and how it shapes her approach to Forever Mood.

  “Before I became a makeup girly...it was fragrance first, down. I was just like, a smell good girl.”
  — Jackie [60:13]

• The decision to focus on quality, intention, and filling a gap in fragrance offerings for underrepresented communities.
• Jackie credits her husband, Dennis, as a crucial business partner.
• She stresses the importance of truly caring about—and working for—the projects and brands you launch:

  “Don’t play with people’s money. That’s one thing I don’t.”
  — Jackie [74:34]

11. Privacy, Marriage, & Social Media Boundaries

[75:13 – 86:28]

• Jackie discusses her new marriage and why she refuses to share every intimate detail online:

  “I’m not big on...feeling like special moments are owed. Like, I have a problem with that.”
  — Jackie [83:32]

12. Five-Year Goals & Work–Life Balance

[86:36 – 88:46]

• Jackie hopes to establish Forever Mood as a global brand, transition more to founder over creator, and find better work–life balance.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “You have to be honest in saying, yes, there is a difference when you have help, support... Imagine having none of that at all.”
  — Jackie [40:54]

• “People support you, support you, support you, and then as soon as they see that, they're like, I don't know you...”
  — Avery [88:01]

• On fragrance as self-confidence:
  “Scent has always been...where I really got my confidence from, for real, for real.”
  — Jackie [62:03]

• On privacy:
  “As women, I have a problem with...feeling like special moments are owed. If I don’t want to do something, I don’t want to do something.”
  — Jackie [83:29]

• On building community:
  “Even in the darkest of times, for some people it just takes a mustard seed of hope, of faith, of goodness, of kindness, of camaraderie, of community. And that’s where I found it.”
  — Jackie [26:21]

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Rapid Fire Q&A & Unboxing [88:52 – End]

Avery and Jackie end with quick-fire questions and a live unboxing of Forever Mood products:

• Jackie's current favorite scent: She Was Here
• Favorite drink: Pistachio martini
• Cozy night in > glam night out
• Dream Sephora companion: Mariah Carey
• Scent compliments are the best: “You call me a lot of stuff, but you can’t call me ugly.” — Jackie [54:50]
• Discussion of fragrance layering, cosmetic preferences, and balancing at-home luxury.

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Practical Takeaways, Advice, and Vibes

• Gratitude and self-care: Slow down, appreciate small moments, and cultivate a gratitude practice.
• Career and entrepreneurship: Prepare for a grind; invest in yourself before profits come. Don’t enter a business unless you’d be passionate about it without money.
• Inclusivity matters: Use platforms to advocate, even when it's tough.
• Work–life balance: Prioritize real-life fulfillment outside of the algorithm.
• Protect your peace: Not everything needs to be shared; boundaries are empowering.

Jackie’s Socials:
@jackieaina (Instagram and TikTok)
@forevermood (brand account & website: forevermood.com)

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The Vibe

Supportive, candid, funny, and empowering—this episode unpacks real life, real work, and real scent, leaving listeners inspired to romanticize their own lives and do the work with gratitude and intention.

Transcript

[Jackie]

For years, everyone thought Verizon had the best network because they did. But now the best mobile network in.

[Avery Woods]

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[Jackie]

In the US based on analysis by Ookla of speed test intelligence data 1H2025CT.

[Avery Woods]

Mobile.Comnetwork this episode is brought to you by Huggies Snug and Dry. We all know I am a mama, but I was also a pediatric and neonatal ICU nurse. So I have changed a lot of diapers in my day. Experience unexpected softness and up to 100 leak proof protection, which is very important. So snug, so dry. More parents choose the new Huggies snug and dry softness versus the leading premium diaper Huggies. We got you, baby. Hi, welcome to Cheers. I'm your host, Avery Woods. Hi, Jackie.

[Jackie]

Hi.

[Avery Woods]

How are you?

[Jackie]

I'm good. I'm excited to be here.

[Avery Woods]

I'm so excited to have you. Do you know how highly requested you are to come?

[Jackie]

Because you've mentioned me.

[Avery Woods]

Yep.

[Jackie]

And it got like a lot of really good traction.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

So I was like, okay, let's get into it.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. Well, I have subscribed to your YouTube channel, I think, since high school. Like a long time. Like, really? Jacqueline, Manny, all of you. But I ogs the. Oh, geez. But your TikTok era is really everything to me. Like, you romanticize every aspect of your life and I really love that. And I look up to that a lot.

[Jackie]

Thank you.

[Avery Woods]

And I think it's kind of forced me to slow down a little bit in my everyday life and just take advantage of the small moments and not take for granted. Like, even making my bed. You know, I'm not a bed maker and I'm telling you, like, I. I know you are, but like every morning I'm like, damn, it feels so good to make my bed and like, come home to a beautifully made bed. Yeah. But that's because I watch you.

[Jackie]

I'm honored. Thank you.

[Avery Woods]

Truly.

[Jackie]

It's kind of. It's like a love letter to myself. Like a. An act of practicing gratitude. Because when you're so used to not having nothing, like nothing, nothing, nothing, and then you have everything damn near under the sun, you're like, wow. Like, to me, I mean, I don't want to get too, too deep or whatever, but when I look at really gluttonous people who do like really dark, disgusting, harmful things to other people, especially when they're successful. Look at the news, look at what's going on in social media. Look at one of the most famous trials that just happened recently. People who get to that point, I think their salaciousness never be like nothing's ever good enough for them. They just become greedier and greedier and greedier and the people around them just continue to tell them yes and yes and yes and yes and nothing is too big and nothing is big enough. And I don't ever want to be like that. So to me, like I get to wake up every day and I'm grateful for that. I get to set my bed every day, I'm grateful for that. And to me that's kind of like my way of internally not getting too big headed because like, yeah, even though I am, you know, I do got an ego, I'm not, I'm not going to shy away from it. Like I will pop my shit if I have to, but at the same time I feel like there's also levels to it and it's like, okay, sometimes there is beauty in being thankful for simplistic stuff too. You know what I mean? That's something that's really important to me. So. But on the flip side, sometimes people will see my content and they're like, why do you clean your own house? And I'm like, I get to clean my own house. Do you know what it feels like to not have a house? Yeah, you be cleaning that every single day. You get okay.

[Avery Woods]

Yep. Period. And when you, when you come from your background, which we'll get into, and you get to wake up in your beautiful home that you were able to style and decorate. Like when you come into that. And I'm experiencing that for my first time too, designing our dream home.

[Jackie]

Like, I'm starting so excited to see it.

[Avery Woods]

I just like so excited every day my husband and I go and it's like full of dust and people are like, are you so upset you're not moved in yet? I'm like, no, this is the house that I get to remodel and I get to design. Like even before we made it what we wanted, we were so grateful to buy this house that was 30 years outdated. Because even two years ago what we qualified for, for a house would not even get us a single family home here.

[Jackie]

Wow.

[Avery Woods]

You know, two years. Oh yeah. And that was working. Yeah. We had a pre qual 2 years ago Working as a cop and a nurse. And I think our pre qualification for a house was like $580,000. Which here gets.

[Jackie]

Which in LA, nothing is a garage, honey.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah, no, seriously, in LA though. And, and we were still so grateful for that at that time too because like we did not come from anything. So you understand how that feels. And I want to talk about your background because I think it's so cool you were in the military.

[Jackie]

I was, yeah.

[Avery Woods]

I was in the reserves, which is insane.

[Jackie]

I've lived like nine lives.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah, and you were. How long were you in?

[Jackie]

So all service members, regardless, Marine, Navy, all of them, you all basically commit to like eight minimum. That's like the government owns you for eight years. Whether you're active or inactive is different from person to person. So technically, totally, I was committed to eight years. But of those eight years, I only served like close to like five, six.

[Avery Woods]

Okay. What branch?

[Jackie]

Army Reserves. Okay. Yeah. And I did, funny enough, I did logistics.

[Avery Woods]

You did.

[Jackie]

So I was a person who was in charge of storing everything, weaponry, supplies. So like my job was literally like supplies. So I was storing, organizing.

[Avery Woods]

So from the get go.

[Jackie]

Yeah, pretty. I mean, yeah, like pretty much. It's just kind of crazy. But yeah, that's my job.

[Avery Woods]

So. My sister is a chief in the Navy.

[Jackie]

Oh, wow.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah, yeah, she's very high up and she's been in for. I think she can retire in four years.

[Jackie]

That's impressive. Joined really young because retirement is like 20 years.

[Avery Woods]

18 in the army, I think.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

Yep. She's 35 and can retire, I believe at 39. Cuz she joined at 19. Yeah, that's impressive. She's amazing. But she is very much like me. She likes her beauty, her fragrance, her hair products. Like she always is ordering stuff from Sephora and she'll take it on deployment with her. And she always tells me how much of an issue it is first of all, to be in charge of men and being a beautiful woman. And also when she was on one of her first deployments, she called us so upset because she was taking a shower and all these girls stole all of her products. Like all of her really nice affordable products.

[Jackie]

Excuse me.

[Avery Woods]

When she was deployed and.

[Jackie]

But like if you're wearing my gloss, you know I'm gonna knock you. I know what two face looks like. Boo. Take that shit off.

[Avery Woods]

I know.

[Jackie]

Oh my God, the audacity.

[Avery Woods]

I know that you've loved beauty from the beginning.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

So did you ever see any of that side of it?

[Jackie]

1,000%. Okay, 1,000%. I mean this, because this was the Era when I was in the military, this was the era when like beauty gurus were like kind of an underground thing. There were not that many people who would walk outside of the house willingly with a full. Because I live in la so I think it's a little different depending on what part of the US you're from. Like in the south that's very normal to be full, glam, down but like people on the west coast didn't really do that. So I 1000% from for as long as I can remember because even back then I was a glam girl, like down. Yeah. Being in uniform, being somewhat attractive is another whole nother thing. But wearing a full face of makeup, it would just be like, huh.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

It's interesting the way first of all there's a lot of misogyny in the military in general, especially, especially in the army. Like these men are just so filthy. And I'll even say, I'll even tell you, this is why I don't believe the military is single handedly why I don't believe how a woman dresses dictates how she's treated. Because when you're assaulted, harmed in any way, when I tell you when you're in the uniform, I cannot think of any other scenario that strips you of besides your face. Obviously the military is the place that strips you of your individuality in every single way. All the uniforms are shaped the same. I don't care how much body you're given, you're not going to be able to see in that boxy ass uniform, that big boxy, flowy uniform.

[Avery Woods]

You're seeing no curves.

[Jackie]

You're not going to see my curves. You're wearing, you're all. Well in basic training at least not when you get out of there. But like you're wearing the same draws. At one point you, you basically all virtually kind of look the same except for the face. So when people say stuff like what was she wearing? I know exactly what it feels like to still be catcalled disrespected, treated unfairly in the workplace, even in a big boxy, you know, clunky boots, like it, it does not matter. And yeah, there were so many times where like, and unfortunately because you know the military does have a ranking system so you got to keep it cute. So if somebody that's superior to you says a slick comment and you know that that person's superior to you, like you can't really talk back. It's a whole entire organization versus you.

[Avery Woods]

Totally.

[Jackie]

Yeah. So it would be really, it would Be really frustrating. And then when I got married, I got married really young, so. And mind you, we weren't even like, we didn't not even have that much money. And I guess to them I had a big ring. So then there would be times where like they would see me, see my ring and they'd be like, people just say all kind of sick stuff like, you don't even have to work, do you? And I just like, what are you talking about? Like, I'm here working. Like, why are you sizing me up based on what my ring looks like or based on the fact that I'm wearing mascara? Like, it would just be so stupid.

[Avery Woods]

It's also the way that a man would never receive a comment like that, which is me, every time.

[Jackie]

They never would. It's just so, it's so dumb.

[Avery Woods]

I say that all the time. I say, it's so funny. If I was a stay at home mom, which I think is one of the most difficult jobs out there.

[Jackie]

I agree.

[Avery Woods]

And I've never done that because I've just always, I've never had the opportunity to be quite honest with you because I always worked as a nurse and we couldn't afford for me to be a stay at home mom when I took over as being the breadwinner and being able to support my family. And now my husband's a stay at home dad. The comments that I get, and every time I'm like, you would never say that to a man. You would never say that to a man that supports his family, that's career driven, that has his wife home with the kids. It's so they say, oh, just that my husband's home with the kids, I'm never spending time with them. That he, he must have gotten fired because there's no way he would choose to be a stay at home dad.

[Jackie]

And I'm like, oh yeah, that he wouldn't shoot. Not choosing it is crazy.

[Avery Woods]

Well, what's funny is we always said our kids were so little out of school, we would never get this opportunity where they have both their parents at home. And like, yes, I work and I have to travel, but the majority of the time I am home, I'm working from home. I'm so privileged in that way. But, but both of our kids, we just talked about this off camera. Like both of my kids are going to school tomorrow and it's the first time they've ever been in full time school. Monday through Friday from 8 to 3 will never get them home again full time. You know, like that's a huge. It's almost like you're mourning. And I'm so grateful that we've had that opportunity. But it's so interesting, the comments I get. And I'm always like, if I was a man, you would never say this to me.

[Jackie]

Yeah, of course.

[Avery Woods]

It's wild.

[Jackie]

It's crazy. You. Yeah, there's definitely women that I follow that I know that are like successful and just them even being outside, they're like, where's your kids? It's crazy. Why would homegirl bring her kids to the bar? I'm confused.

[Avery Woods]

Oh yeah. Or when we go on a date.

[Jackie]

She can't go to the bar sometimes. But like, that's the thing, what kills me. When you're on a date with your husband, they're looking at you like, where's the kids? But you're with your husband. Like you're both allowed to have a social life outside of your kids.

[Avery Woods]

Well, also, I'm like, we've been together for 13 years. Like we came first. Like we go on our once a night date night because we're happily married and our kids get to see that we prioritize and focus on each other. And mind you, we usually don't even go on a date night until after our kids are in bed. So we did the whole day with them, we put them down, then I get dressed up cute for him and we go out and then we're up the more the next morning at 7am Getting ready for school.

[Jackie]

You have that right. How the hell do you think the kids got there?

[Avery Woods]

Exactly.

[Jackie]

What the hell do y'. All. We're grown, honey. We're grown.

[Avery Woods]

Thank you. You get it. Okay, so walk me through your decision. Joining as a reserves in the army.

[Jackie]

The stupidest decision ever. Okay. Okay. So it was, it was kind of giving midlife crisis vibes, girl. It was, it was, it was. I had a lot going on at the time. So I was in college and I was like 20. Yeah, I was about 20. But I was not willingly going to this college. Like when I was young, I thought I was going to go to school to become a fashion designer. I thought I was gonna go to fidm. That was like my dream.

[Avery Woods]

Don't even get me started on FIDM.

[Jackie]

I was like dream school. That was like FIDM's peak. Like all the cool girls. I just, I just thought I was gonna be Mary Kate Nash Gilson. I don't know what I thought, but. So from a very, very young age, I was just like a really creative girl. But My, I have one parent who's Nigerian. And if you know anything about Nigerian culture in general, very strict, very academic driven. I'm also the first born daughter, which is a whole different. A whole different set of trauma in itself. So growing up, like, growing up, my parents kind of gave me an ultimatum. They were like, you know, yeah, like you can do what you want to do or basically get cut off and we're not gonna support you at all. Or you can go to school and become a pharmacist. And it was just like that, straight up.

[Avery Woods]

Okay.

[Jackie]

And I was like, not even, like nothing else, just a pharmacist specifically. Okay. So needless to say, I, you know when you tell that, when you say something like that to a 17 year old girl, you're like, oh my God, I'm listening to my parents. You know what I mean? Like, I don't know what else to do. So I went to college, but I was not at this college willingly, like voluntarily. I was just there doing mom and.

[Avery Woods]

Dad said so exactly.

[Jackie]

Like it was just something to do, I guess. And I was like failing all my classes. But I went from A, like graduating with honors, like, never getting nothing lower than like a B minus. Like C was really, really like, what were you going through? Like, if I got a C in a class, it was kind of given. Like, we may need to like institutionalize this girl. Like, what's going on?

[Avery Woods]

Like boarding school?

[Jackie]

Very much. Very, very strict. Like, I was like smart, smart, smart. So then I get to college and then like, you're not forced to go to class and like, nobody told me, like, oh, you don't. Like, my parents are not forced to go. Like, I didn't know that.

[Avery Woods]

Freedom.

[Jackie]

I went from like being super sheltered and strict to then I get to college and I have all freedom. That's a big extreme. So then my parents get divorced my sophomore year of college and then I'm like, okay, well they're not paying attention to me and they're not paying attention to each other and they're fighting and this parent's over here and this. So I'm just gonna like drop out. So then. But then I was like, well then what else am I gonna do with my life? And then at the time I was dating this guy. I shouldn't have been dating this guy, but I was dating this guy and he had just joined. So then I'm like venting about my life, about how my life is in shambles. And he was like, oh, you should join the army. And I was Just like, boy, bye. What the hell would I do in the army? Like, what are you talking about? And honestly, I don't even think he was being serious. But again, I'm like, at this point, I'm like, I'm 20. And I'm like, well, he gets to travel. Like, he gets to meet new people. Like, all he talks about is how much his life has changed. And then when you come from like a background where you don't have access to any of that. And then at the time, you know, this was like the era of like, they would give you like a sign on bonus and they would just like wave this new beautiful life in front of your face. And so I'm not going to lie, like, I was eating it up. So I was just like, I want that for myself. So when he said it, I just like went to a recruiter like a month later. And then I just went to go ask questions and then I was just like, oh, I don't know, whatever. Didn't entertain it. And then I did end up dropping out. But then I was like, I can't be idle for too long. I need to. Maybe I should go talk to a recruiter again. So then like a year later, when I was 21, I officially went, signed up, joined. I went to go talk to somebody at an Air Force first and. And then. Or at an Air Force recruitment office first. But they kind of were like, not really answering my questions. Like, they just weren't like entertaining me. So then I went right next door to the Army. It was just gonna be like, I was just gonna go from Air Force, Army, Navy, whoever one was eating me up the most. I was just gonna go with that one. Like, I didn't even know the difference between all of them. I really didn't. But I wasn't gonna join the Navy. Cause I don't like the water. So I was like, hell no. Okay, I'm not getting in the water. I'm not swimming. Absolutely not. So that's how I joined. That is how I joined the Army. Wow. Yes. It was literally. And then they expl. You're. You said your sister's in the Navy, right? So I'm assuming she's active duty.

[Avery Woods]

Yep.

[Jackie]

So basically she's full time.

[Avery Woods]

Yep.

[Jackie]

So then when I'm talking to the recruiter, and then they were like, oh, you can just join the reserves, you know, like, you can still keep a job, you can still go to school. It's like being part time. So then I was like, okay, cool. And then they were like, telling me, like, you can still get deployed. And then I was just like, okay, okay. Like, it's just crazy. I was making these big adult decisions at 21, and it's like, I kind of really had no business, like, doing all that at 21, but, like, I felt like I did what I had to do. You know what I mean?

[Avery Woods]

I think when you get to a certain age, you look back and I. Because when I was 21, I thought I was grown.

[Jackie]

Oh, we think we know everything, girl. We don't know nothing.

[Avery Woods]

And then I think about how you can join at 18 if you wanted, which is.

[Jackie]

Which is. Which is crazy. And it's so weird because when I joined, I was 20, 21.

[Avery Woods]

Okay.

[Jackie]

Ripe old age of 21. I felt like the old head. Yeah, I felt like the old head because everybody was like, fresh out of high school, and I'm like, oh, duh. When you get to 21. I was. I felt so, like, haven't heard of high school in years. I'm like, 21. I really thought. I was, like, so astounded.

[Avery Woods]

You're like, do you guys need a drink? Cause I can legally order it. You're like, I'll go to the gas station, get you guys some beer since you don't have an id. Girl.

[Jackie]

I was. I was a baby amongst the babies, and I literally was just like, oh, my God. Like, I can't imagine joining fresh out of high school. Girl.

[Avery Woods]

Girl, you're a baby. Whoa, wait, that's crazy.

[Jackie]

It was intense. I mean, I wasn't the oldest there, but you do feel a little. There's a big difference between 18 and 21. Huge, big difference.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah, huge.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

I think all the time about, like, we just had someone on her. Her name's also Avery, who's a big tiktoker. She's so sweet, But I was sitting down with her, and I was like, wait, how old are you? She's like, 20. And I said we couldn't even go have a beverage.

[Jackie]

Damn.

[Avery Woods]

Like, I. It's just so. You live so much life in your 20s.

[Jackie]

You really do.

[Avery Woods]

You live so much life, especially as a woman. Like, so much changes over 10 years that you're like, wow, 20, 21, baby.

[Jackie]

I don't know who the hell that was.

[Avery Woods]

I got married at 21.

[Jackie]

You did?

[Avery Woods]

Yes.

[Jackie]

So I got married at 21.

[Avery Woods]

I. I am. I feel so lucky because I really.

[Jackie]

You really love.

[Avery Woods]

I really. Yeah. I met him when I was 18. Like, knew he was a love of my life. We're still so happy. And I feel so grateful for that.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

But also I'm like, what? Who are you to make that decision at 21 years old? That's crazy. I didn't even graduate college yet. Like, that's so nuts.

[Jackie]

I know.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

But that's good that it worked out.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. Thank God.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

So seriously? Yeah, seriously. Okay, so when were you first posting to YouTube? Was that the first platform that you were posted to?

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

Was it pumpkin pie? Oh, five.

[Jackie]

Oh, my gosh. Lil Pumpkin pie. Oh, five.

[Avery Woods]

Little pumpkin pie.

[Jackie]

And girl, I hate pie.

[Avery Woods]

Really?

[Jackie]

I don't even like pie. I don't know where the.

[Avery Woods]

Where did you choose that?

[Jackie]

I don't know.

[Avery Woods]

Was it like a bath and body work scent? I know you like perfume.

[Jackie]

I don't even know. I don't even know. Like, I'm like, little pumpkin pie. I don't know. I just know 05 was zeros graduating high school.

[Avery Woods]

Okay.

[Jackie]

So that was like, you know, the username era. So it was like everything.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, yeah. Has like a theme ring to it. Yeah. Yeah. And so I was consistent. I feel like from the time I open my eyes to the time I go to bed, my day is so jam packed that sometimes it's hard just to fit in the smallest things. That is why Instacart always saves the day for me. Delivery through Instacart is so quick and easy and makes sure that I have the essentials I need for my family life to run smooth. When life's full and time's tight, Instacart helps you stay stay on track. Instacart is more than a grocery app. It's a care company that works around your schedule. Get groceries and household essentials delivered in as fast as 30 minutes. Whether you're hosting a barbecue, getting back from a trip, or juggling back to school chaos. Which is me right now because my kids are going back to school next week. And Instacart has really come through for me with reliable shoppers and a platform you can count on. Instacart delivers quality and convenience without cutting corners so you can focus on what matters most. Instacart has just helped me get so much time back where I can focus on my kids at home prepping for the school year. It' so easy for me to pick out groceries when I'm just able to look on my phone rather than walking around the grocery store. It also helps me keep it condensed so I'm not grabbing random things off the shelf. I love to meal prep for the week for dinners and also for my kids school lunches. So it just makes life so much easier when I'm writing down lists in my phone and I'm able to just order it all through Instacart and it's delivered right to my door. Instacart makes both quality and convenience possible. Download the Instacart app and use code Avery Woods 20 to get 20 off your first order of 80 or more. That's code Avery Woods 20 to get $20 off your first order of $80 or more. Offer valid for a limited time. Excludes restaurants. Additional terms apply. The show is sponsored by Better Help. I've talked about Better Help so many times to you guys and how much I love therapy. Better Help has truly been there for me when I need help the most. On top of a busy life and motherhood, Better Help keeps me in check to make sure I'm staying in routine when it comes to therapy. I don't even have to leave the comfort of my own home. But I am matched with so many incredible therapists that have helped me through so many challenging times. And even when I'm not struggling, I love to assistant in therapy because it helps my mental health so much like myself. I'm sure so many of you guys love to discuss your life problems with the people that are in your personal life. Your friend, group group chat, whatever the case may be. But there is a huge difference between that and actually talking with a therapist. That's where Better Help comes in. With clinically trained and licensed therapists, they've been around for over a decade, helped millions, and out of 1.7 million client reviews, they've got a 4.9 rating. Better help does the initial matching work for you so you can focus on your therapy goals? A short questionnaire helps identify your needs and preferences, and if you aren't happy with your match, switch to a different therapist at any time. It's fully online and you can pause your subscription whenever you need to. With over 30,000 therapists, better help is the world's largest online therapy platform, having served over 5 million people globally. As the largest online therapy provider in the world, Better Help can provide access to mental health professionals with a diverse variety of Expertise. Find the one with Better Help our listeners get 10% off their first month at betterhelp.com averywoods that's better h e l p.com AveryWoods Meeting new people just got way more fun because now you don't have to do it alone. With Tinder's new Double Date feature, you and your bestie can Match together. Tap the double date icon to see your profiles built for two. When two pairs match, the group chat kicks off. Scope the profile, send memes, keep the chat fun. Hype each other up. Flirt a little, maybe plan a hang. It's always better when you're in it together. Try the new Tinder double date. Explore all the possibilities. Tinder. It starts with a swipe. Download Tinder today. Yeah, exactly. So you were in the reserves and started posting.

[Jackie]

Yeah, because when I joined. So basically I joined this guy I was dating. Was. Had already been. Been in. We got married, and then he got stationed in Hawaii. So it was kind of like, you know, most times service members, if two people are dating and you're both in, especially if you're the same branch, you're kind of like. And this is why so many people get married young when they're in the military, because you just want to be together.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. You want to be on the same base.

[Jackie]

You want to be on the same base. You at least want to be in the same state sometimes in the same country. So, yeah, that's what ended up happening. And then because of what had went on in my marriage and being so young and, like, obviously not being happily married, it was a really, really emotionally rough point in my life. Probably one of the lowest I was going through my adult life at that time. YouTube was like an outlet. Like, it was just a distraction. It was a way out. And mind you, we lived in Hawaii. I didn't know nobody in Hawaii, so I didn't have family there. I didn't have friends.

[Avery Woods]

It's very isolating there.

[Jackie]

Extremely isolated community. I had no community whatsoever. So at the time, YouTube was my community. And it was like, it was. So every single time someone asked me, like, what the motive was When I joined YouTube, first of all, I had no interest being on YouTube. It was just more so like something at the time, my best friend was like, you should just get. Post your looks on YouTube. And I was just like, no, I'll.

[Avery Woods]

Never forget that blue eyeshadow. Are you kidding me?

[Jackie]

Oh, my God. She still. She still is a slave.

[Avery Woods]

You know what?

[Jackie]

She still is awesome.

[Avery Woods]

I. When people will post videos because they'll do it for me every once in a while, too. And I'm like, no, it's not the same effect. Or they're like, look where Avery Wood started. I'm like, girl, take those Amazon hauls away. Okay?

[Jackie]

Go.

[Avery Woods]

Get out of here with that. But your videos, they melt my heart. Like, when people are like, this is where Jackie started. I love to see it.

[Jackie]

Thank you.

[Avery Woods]

I love it. Like, it's really so inspiring. And you did. You. You knew how to blend out that eyeshadow.

[Jackie]

I was wearing color. I was really wearing color. I was showing the girls you were how to wear color. But, you know, the big motive for me at the time, which is so sad to say, but also kind of like a testament to, like, what I was really going through at the time, I was just happy that people online were just being nice to me. Like, that's how depressed I was at the time. It was just like, I would post something and the fact that people were nice to me, which, offline, I wasn't really getting a ton of that at that time, that was just what motivated me. And it's just. It's crazy how even in the darkest of times, like, some. For some people, it just takes, like, a mustard seed of hope, of faith, of goodness, of kindness, of camaraderie, of community. And that's. At the time, that's where I found it.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah, I. It's so interesting because I feel like when you first start in the beginning, like, I'll get messages a lot from people because I always try to talk about growing on social media because I think there's room for everyone, and I think it truly is a business, and if you have what it takes, you can change your life. And I feel like both of us have done that.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

But I feel like I get messages every once in a while from people that are like, I had one TikTok video go viral, and the comments were so mean that I'll never post again. So I feel like it can start one of two ways. Like, you can see that glimmer of hope where you're like, okay, this could be a great community for me. And I feel like I felt that as well and encouraged me to keep posting. And. And in my eyes, the love will always outweigh the hate. But there's also the side of people trying to start, and they can see the dark side of the Internet. But I also feel like over time, it's gotten worse.

[Jackie]

That's a fact. It has gotten deplorable. And I hate when my content ends up on the wrong side of TikTok. Do you ever feel. Cause you know how, like, when something. Like, when you're getting dragged for something, there's like, a normal. Normal. There's like a manageable level of getting dragged. And then I just like men. Like, if my content ends up on the straight men's side of TikTok, deactivate. Yep, deactivate.

[Avery Woods]

I literally will comment to men sometimes and I'm like, you're a grown ass married man with your wife in your profile picture.

[Jackie]

That's sad.

[Avery Woods]

This isn't for you. This content was not made for you. Never was. Why would it be? Why are you here? And does your wife know what comments you're leaving? You sick, nasty little.

[Jackie]

Go fix your plumbing somewhere. What are you doing in my comments section?

[Avery Woods]

Go fig.

[Jackie]

Don't you have artwork to hang up or something? Go do manual labor.

[Avery Woods]

They probably have to use a tax rabbit because they don't know how to use tools. Let's be so honest though, at least my husband can hang some on the wall. Okay.

[Jackie]

Oh, my God.

[Avery Woods]

Okay, so when. When were you like, okay, this could be something for me.

[Jackie]

Oh, my God. Okay, so social media was very different at this time. Like, it wasn't. Nowadays, I think you can get momentum in like six months and you're kind of like, all right, baby, I'm in there. But it took me a very long time because, you know, this is like 2009 when I first started. So the word influencer didn't really. Didn't exist. Like, that's kind of still like a relatively new term, even. Content creator. Like, people didn't call yourself a content creator. It was vlogger.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

You know, it was like youtuber, I.

[Avery Woods]

Guess you could say. Yeah, totally, totally.

[Jackie]

So it wasn't until like literally my fourth year where I had like a sit down talk with me. So basically the virality, the money, the opportunities did not come first. I gave myself an ultimatum and I was like, okay, it was fun doing this for Vibes. And I know you love the community, but at the same time, and there's. And there's nothing, there's nothing wrong with wanting more. There's nothing wrong with desiring money. Like, especially if you're putting time and effort into something. So I kind of had that inner dialogue. I'm like, okay, the community's amazing. But like, what else? Because makeup costs money. These reviews that you're creating cost money. Equipment costs money. And if you're not making it, then it might be time to either move on and, you know, try to go back to school, which I was still doing those things in addition to, like, creating my content. But I gave myself an ultimatum. And then I ended up spending a year in Kuwait. It was a civilian job. It wasn't a deployment. I got like a civilian government job by way of being a service member. So basically it Was tax free. So at that, at that time, that was the most money I had ever made and it was like $70,000 a year. So that was a lot of money.

[Avery Woods]

Tax free though.

[Jackie]

You're like, but tax free though.

[Avery Woods]

I'm dripping tax free.

[Jackie]

It was drip, drip.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

And mind you, I was basically working 12 hour days every single day, one day off a week. So I was working 6pm to 6am So I had no social life. I live in a different country. I don't really have a family to take care of. So tax free. So basically I was just putting money aside, putting money aside, putting money aside. And then I was like, all right. And still doing YouTube at the time. And then I think I actually started Instagram while I was in Kuwait. That was like 2013.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, that's like giving sepia. Filter. Yeah. Moment.

[Jackie]

Crunchy. Crunchy era. Very crunchy.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, I look back at those and I'm like, girl, what were you thinking? But that was, what was. That was the thing. No, we was just raw dog. Yeah, we were all talking. You know what though?

[Jackie]

Shout out to the day oners. Like we were, we were up in here with no 4K.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

Filters.

[Avery Woods]

I. It's funny because I started social media when I was doing prerequisites in college. So I was like 19, maybe going on 20. And I'm 30 now. It was a very slow growing for me. So slow. And people don't realize that. They're like, you blew up overnight. I'm like, yes, my TikTok gained a lot of traction quickly, but I was also doing it and making money from it for a long time. It was just on a much smaller scale. Yeah, it was totally different because it was like medical influencing. I modeled for scrub companies, I worked as a nurse. So I was trying to balance my career in social media and not knowing how much of a business social media really is. So then when the opportunity came for me to be able to make money in a real way to support my family, I was like, okay, I really actually have to choose between careers.

[Jackie]

You do have to choose.

[Avery Woods]

And I did. I was the same way. Where I was like, okay, I need to set a goal before I give up my years that I've worked as a nurse. Because that's obviously towards your retirement.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

So I felt the same way because it's, it's true, like, you do have to put money up for front.

[Jackie]

I feel like a lot of money.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. To be able to have high quality content, keep up with trends and also like, if you're into linking. You have to be able to purchase what's in stock, what's new, Are there shades available for people? Like, these are all strategic things that we think about being online.

[Jackie]

And also, the time that you commit to all of this costs you money because you're doing that while not doing other things, like making money. So you could be doing all of these things and kind of draining yourself at the same time, not actually making any money.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

Which is so crazy because it's like, it really does cost money to make money.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, yeah.

[Jackie]

And there's gonna be a long time. At least for me, that's like four years. Like, I cannot quit my day job in those four years.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah, for sure.

[Jackie]

I. I had to do a lot of the community building, the reviews, you know, buying product, like you said, out of pocket. And then, so, yeah, so after some time, it was just like, okay, well, what are you gonna do with the money that you put aside? So I basically decided I'm gonna look good for my parents. I'm going to at least go back to school, but I'm gonna go to cosmetology school. So that was kind of like, I was like, okay, well, if I'm gonna be on camera, like, I'm gonna go back to school, but I'm gonna get something that's at least adjacent. Right. So that's what I did. I came back to California and I went to Vidal Sassoon in Santa Monica and I became a licensed cosmetologist. And then I kind of was like, all right, so I can either still do makeup and now hair, now that I have this license, I can do that, or, you know, if social media ticks off, takes off, then I'm going to run with that. So I was pursuing both. And then 2014 was when I got my first, like, real viral piece of content. And the great thing, this is why it's so funny that you say people call you an overnight success that you just blew up overnight. Because even though at that time, that was my first viral piece of, like, my first real viral piece of content, what happened was people saw that video and they started binge watching all the other content I had made up until that point. And it could not have happened at a better time because instead of me just being like a one hit wonder and then people just like, not caring anymore. They were like, oh, like, where has she been? It was almost just like, where has she been? Effect. I had years worth of content for people to catch up on. Yeah, that's exactly what people started Doing. And I never, I literally went full time around. So yeah, 2015, 2014 is when I went full time, stopped pursuing outside education, stopped pursuing other jobs, and I've been full time as a creator ever since.

[Avery Woods]

And what were, what were your parents reactions?

[Jackie]

Well, the thing is, is like once you're making money and you're not asking them for money, you can't really say nothing.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah, it's so true.

[Jackie]

You know, like, you can't really, like, it's kind of like, I mean, you're making more money than me. But it created like a really. It also creates like a really awkward dynamic with parents too. It can, because you're the child, but you're making more money than them. How did that work? You know what I mean? Like, it becomes a little. So I reach out to my parents, tell my parents, like, y' all not gonna debo me, like, I'm not asking you for money. And what I do with it, you know, that's that. And they also, I will never tell my parents how much money. I don't even tell my siblings how much money I make.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah, it's especially like us coming from being first responders. All of our friends, the majority of our friends are, have very normal jobs, like cops, nurses, teachers. They are the hardest workers, but the least paid. Like, it, it kills me. And my parents were both teachers. My mom was a second grade teacher for 42 years. My dad was my high school math teacher. So we, we don't like to have conversations like that because I have a hard time with the things that I saw as a nurse and how little I was paid. And that's why I always try to advocate for people in healthcare because I think it's so ridiculous how much CEOs of hospitals can make, you know, tens of millions of dollars a year. And I'm like, you're not putting people in body bags.

[Jackie]

Respectfully, it's a slap in the face.

[Avery Woods]

Totally. And so that's why I will never say my job is hard. And I always say, like, being a nurse was physically extremely hard. Long days, you know, I worked during the pandemic up until five days before my C section with my daughter full time in the icu.

[Jackie]

Wow.

[Avery Woods]

So then. But mentally it can be also really hard. Cause I worked in pediatrics, so you see a lot of really sad things. Social media is cake. Physically, I'm able to edit in bed after my kids go down. And there is a strategy to it. But I also think the mental toll is what has affected me more than what I felt physically as a nurse.

[Jackie]

I say the same thing all the time because I've worked retail. I used to work at Target, actually. Even though I'm boycotting the sergeant. Yeah. I was gonna say. Oh, sorry. Yeah. But I used to work at Target.

[Avery Woods]

Aren't we all?

[Jackie]

I used to work at Old Navy.

[Avery Woods]

Oh.

[Jackie]

So I've done everything. I've done customer service, I've done retail. And obviously I was in the military. So I physically have had. I've encountered every difficult. Every sort of difficult level of entry level job that you can think of. So the. The experience is absolutely there. And I'm also grateful that social media didn't take off as soon as it does, because you see the difference in, like, the longevity between people who have never really worked in the workforce.

[Avery Woods]

Okay. I've never really talked about this.

[Jackie]

It's. It's not the same.

[Avery Woods]

I know they'll come for me, but I.

[Jackie]

Wait, is that a hot take?

[Avery Woods]

Well, I just feel like there's people in the industry that maybe would take it the wrong way, and I don't want to be offensive, but I think that I have a different type of work ethic because I didn't come from money.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

I. I mean, I paid my own health insurance when I was 16. Like, that was expected of me. My phone bill, my car. Like, I had to get a scholarship to go to college. And then I've just worked since my 16th birthday. And then I came from a really hard career and balanced that on top of growing social media. So nothing was an option for me except to work my ass off.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

That. That was the life that I just knew.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

And so I feel like I will always make it my job to be the hardest worker in the room. And I feel like you're the same way.

[Jackie]

Well, I didn't have a choice.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

Like, I didn't actively choose to work. Like, it wasn't something I did because, you know, my parents wanted me to get. Like, I didn't have a choice.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

At all.

[Avery Woods]

Same.

[Jackie]

And not only was I expected to find my own living, but I was expected to give it back to them to an extent. You know, like, I was almost like a third provider, which is in itself really has, as an adult, has become really detrimental to me because looking back, I'm just like, I had no business doing all that as a child. That's crazy. But listen, if you won't say it, I will say it. Okay? Listen, there's nothing wrong with having parents that provided for you working because you can but to do a service to the average person that lives in this country that does not make a lot of money, that doesn't have a lot of money, that works a standard job, you have to be honest in saying, yes, there is a difference when you have help, support, and whether that support looks like your parents being able to step in, your grandparents having money aside, having a house in your name that you will inherit. Imagine having none of that at all.

[Avery Woods]

And nothing to fall back on. No.

[Jackie]

Fall back on.

[Avery Woods]

Yes.

[Jackie]

Nothing to fall back on. There will be a difference in how you navigate your career choices, especially in this industry as being a creator, because we've already talked about what you. It costs to film all of this stuff. Right. But, like, imagine having to worry about surviving in addition to all that, like, having to turn in your camera and, like, knowing that, like, oh, I bought that, but, like, I was actually supposed to pay my phone bill, but I chose to just buy this because then hopefully, the hopes. The hopes is that I'll make more money off of this, but I really shouldn't have bought that for this video.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. I remember when I finally took the leap, and my fallback was that my RN license was still active for another three years.

[Jackie]

That's why I got my cosmetology license.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. I was like, yeah. And it was different too, because I'm like, this isn't to keep myself afloat. Like, I have kids, which I got to make sure they're fed.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

So I was like, okay, worst case scenario if this fails. I talked to my nurse manager, and she was like, oh, you always have a place here with us. Oh, my God. And so that I was like, that made me feel at ease because I said, okay, worst case scenario, I can go back to work as a nurse and we'll be okay. We'll be fine.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

But, like, that was my fallback. It wasn't my parents or people that, you know, financially supported us. Like, it was just us.

[Jackie]

Like I said, there's nothing wrong with having support. Like, I think in an ideal world, you should have something to fall back on. You should. That's the way community should work.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

But a lot of people don't have that option. And I'm gonna tell you right now, I didn't. So when I get an opportunity, I make for damn sure whatever was required of me is buttoned up, is exactly what's exceeded what's asked for. And that's why people would. When my content finally took off, they're like, oh, my God, quality is amazing. You Know, technique is amazing education. I had to be amazing. Like, I'm a black woman in America, honey. Like, I have to give you three times better. Like, this was also a time, mind you, in makeup specifically, I'm not talking about, like, comedy or, like, gaming or other genres. On YouTube, I had a really hard time breaking, like, a glass ceiling, I guess you can call it that because when you are watching a makeup tutorial, people had a very, like, separationalist way of thinking when they would consume content. So if you post a Sephora haul or if you're doing a tutorial, you may not have the same skin tone as me, but if I like your technique, I'm going to be like, oh, I'm going to try that on my skin tone. But in, like, 2010, they wouldn't even want to click on the thumbnail because they just saw a black girl. They wouldn't even be interested in entertaining. And you can have, you know, like, black women love me, Black men love my tutorials. But you can only get so far being that niche down. So for a while, yeah, like, there were years where it was just the people. And that's why I'd be writing for my community so hard. Because people who look like me saw me first period, and we're not budging. Even when the money wasn't there, even when the wigs weren't there, girl. Like, when the hair was the experimental phase, like, even when the makeup was, you know, still. I was still kind of getting there. But that's why I take so much pride in talking about stuff that, like, if a brand would do something that I genuine, like in an advertise, like advertising or in a campaign, like, if they did something that I truly felt did a. A, a true disservice to people who look like me, I would say something.

[Avery Woods]

I was going to say. I want to talk about how much you advocate for inclusivity. And I. I love it so much. Like, you and Gloria are two of my favorite people that are so Gloria, she is a queen. I'm. And she's such a kind human being. But I. It's so refreshing. And I feel like in the last maybe one to two years, we see a lot more of this. Because I feel like no matter who you are, it's very intimidating to speak, not necessarily negatively, but trying to give education to a brand that is doing a disservice to people of color.

[Jackie]

It is.

[Avery Woods]

And I want to ask where that confidence came from? What made you motivated to do that? And have you ever gotten Backlash from.

[Jackie]

Brands before all the time. So I would say most of it was motivated by me just speaking to my immediate community. So in the beginning, and also there was levels to it, right? So like as my audience grew, I got a little bit more comfortable, a little bit more bold in how I would call attention to stuff. But in the beginning, I just felt like I was talking to people who look like me. And so for the most part, most of them knew exactly, like they knew what the experience was. Like going to a makeup counter and walking away looking orange because you wanted to try a new foundation.

[Avery Woods]

Can't get a.

[Jackie]

This was your shade and maybe that was not. That was that shade.

[Avery Woods]

Oh no.

[Jackie]

But so yeah, for a while it was just me talking to my immediate community. But then when I started getting viral content, when my channel started to become like mainstream, I guess you could say, for lack of better words, and like non black people, and not even just like non black people were following me. It was like people who were of lighter complexions, right? So like I had a big community of black people who followed me. But then also darker skinned Asians were also following me too. So they would just kind of sit and listen. They would sit and listen. But then when I started to notice that like people who were all throughout the spectrum were following me and to them, they sometimes people often think being pro yourself, whatever that may look like. And obviously in this case I'm pro black because I'm black. Like, I'm just gonna state the obvious, but they hear you're anti everything else, which is so annoying because why actually. And it's, it's crazy. This is 2025 and I literally had an interaction with someone in a video yesterday that recommended a. Okay, so in the video, it was a TikTok video and I verbatim said that I prefer. I said something like, oh, I prefer mineral sunscreens. And I don't know if you know the difference in like mineral sunscreens and chemical ones.

[Avery Woods]

Okay. Yes.

[Jackie]

So for those that don't know for context, chemical sunscreens are usually the ones that are completely sheer. But I was saying, ashiness aside, my preference in formula is mineral sunscreen because they tend to be better for like acne prone skin. They're usually more oil controlling. Anyway, lots of context, but.

[Avery Woods]

And it can give you a white cast almost most times.

[Jackie]

Yes. Which is really annoying. But in the video I was saying. So I say because they're basically a little ashy, I saved them for underneath makeup. So you don't see it. Right.

[Avery Woods]

Sure.

[Jackie]

So someone. There were several people who were like, your complexion even lighter that were like, try this mineral sunscreen. It leaves me no white cast. So there were several people. And it's like, I get you're trying to be nice, but it's like, that's clear on you. And I don't think it's wrong to, like, say, hey, just an FYI, that may be sheer for you, but, like, this ain't my first rodeo. And I'm here to tell you, if there is zinc oxide and that formula is not gonna look sheer on me. You know what I mean? I know you mean well, and I said that to several people who I was interacting with in this video. But there was, like, one person that said that I was being rude because I told them. Because I literally told this person, sheer for you does not mean sheer for me. I have dark skin. And there's been so many times where I'm, like, called mean. I'm called rude. But I'm just one. I'm stating the obvious. I'm stating the obvious.

[Avery Woods]

You're very factual because I've seen you respond to people.

[Jackie]

I'm very factual because I've been on the Internet for a long time. And when you add too much fluff, I feel like that's when people weaponize it. So I just kind of hit people with facts because when you're a little too nice, I feel like they take advantage of it. And when you're too raw, then, of course, you don't want to scare people. But I am educated. This has been my job. And I feel like because I'm a woman, you don't like being corrected. You can't. Like, I can't be smart. I can't be good at something. I can't be educated. Can I be the expert in my field? Because I am technically, like, if you want to be technical, I'm just letting you know that if there is zinc oxide in a product, it's going to look sheer on you because you're lighter than me, but it's not going to look like that on me. She said I was rude. She said I was being mean. She said I was. I was just like, huh.

[Avery Woods]

Also, it's like when you read a text from someone.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

You can take it. You can read it in whatever tone is in your head. Right.

[Jackie]

But most times that tone is you projecting. And that ain't got nothing to do with me. That ain't got nothing to do with me.

[Avery Woods]

But you're never people. It sounds to me like this person took it the way that they wanted to take it because they wanted to say something back to you.

[Jackie]

Yeah, they were, like, kind of giving, oh, this is coming off like, you people. And I was just like, you people.

[Avery Woods]

What the.

[Jackie]

Oh, no, it was just like. It was just like, a lot. And I just basically was like. I mean, like it or love it. The fact is, a product that shows up sheer on you is not gonna look the same on me. And I'm gonna keep saying that until I'm blue in the face. You don't have to like it, but it's a fact.

[Avery Woods]

No, I think a lot of people look to you when it comes to advocating for the beauty standards, because quite frankly, it took way too long for shade ranges to be expanded the way that they have. And still to this day, I see black creators come on TikTok and try the darkest shade of a foundation. And it's actually insane when I'm like, a medium dark. I'm sorry. Look at the color of my skin. Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, that shouldn't be happening. It just shouldn't be. And I think what you're doing is so amazing, and so many other creators also are doing the same thing. Have you had a brand ever reach out and ask you to take something down or maybe try to backtrack a little bit? Really?

[Jackie]

I think what's really frustrating is sometimes it won't even be stuff that I've said. It'll be. So they would. There was a time where, like, they kind of treated me like the school principal of black people, and it would be very. Like, I didn't even say anything. They're the ones who are dragging you. What do you want me to do about it? Like, why are you. Like, I've had CEOs of big, big companies reach out to me directly, like, kind of threatening me in a way. Yeah, yeah.

[Avery Woods]

Ask you to take content down.

[Jackie]

No, no. One. I'm not gonna say who it was. One. It's a big company. One. One company, like, try to get me up out of here. Like, they just basically try to get up out of here. They try to blackball me. Crazy. Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

So why. Why not blast them?

[Jackie]

In this instance, it was in response to me blasting them.

[Avery Woods]

Okay, got it.

[Jackie]

And I think, actually I was kind of surprised at how much people. Because sometimes I'll be saying something that everybody else is already saying. I'm like, this isn't groundbreaking information.

[Avery Woods]

It's because you are the blueprint to them. To a lot of people.

[Jackie]

Well, yes, you know, to a lot of people. And that's very, that's very flattering. But I, in a lot of ways I just see myself as someone who often lends a voice to people who are often being overlooked. So most times I'm not saying anything that everybody else isn't already saying. So it can be a little annoying when a brand targets you. Because my philosophy is when it comes to like messiness, like if we all have our moments. But I try to really stick to blasting brands and not people. Like, I try not to go after people directly. So when I see brands kind of wielding their power, it just, I don't know, it just kind of feels a little like it can be, it can be very concerning because I think that people think. Because I have a lot of followers and I'm where I am now, I'm like untouchable. I'm still, still not untouchable. Like the times where there have been brands that have single handedly tried to do things to blackball me. Like there have been times where it's like, maybe I should be a little concerned. But I, yeah, girl, like it was.

[Avery Woods]

You gotta tell me off camera so I can stop supporting these brands.

[Jackie]

They're not your vibe. I don't even think they're okay. Yeah, I don't even think they're your vibe.

[Avery Woods]

Okay.

[Jackie]

But yeah, just like really, I just don't like when they target me specifically. You know what I mean? Yeah, Especially when I'm saying something that like, isn't the first. Like, I'm not the only person who's saying this. Why are you mad at me?

[Avery Woods]

And also you're using your voice to educate, hopefully the brand, they can learn their lesson. But also like showing your viewers that there's other options for them when they don't feel like they can find something that's the right shade for their skin tone, you know, like you're helping so many people in that. And even though it's so interesting how you said, you know, people would skip over your video or not watch it just because the skin tone difference, but I feel like I have learned so much from you. Just the other day you did a self tanning video and I was like.

[Jackie]

Oh shit, I love tanning.

[Avery Woods]

I know. And that little, that little two piece set you wore, I ordered that. I said, oh, period. Yeah, no, okay. Also, body is so fucking teased. It's crazy.

[Jackie]

You call me a lot of stuff, but you can't call me ugly.

[Avery Woods]

And.

[Jackie]

You can't beat me on that mat, baby.

[Avery Woods]

No. Okay, I want to talk about this because fitness is so important to me. What's your now? Tell me, tell me, tell me everything.

[Jackie]

So I work out. Okay. I used to be like the laziest gym person. It's funny because, like, people see me now and they're like, oh. Whenever they see me, I love how they're like, oh, you were in the military, that's why you. And I'm like, girl, being in the military does not permanently alter your body. I still gotta go to the gym, like, and I left like 10 years ago. This is straight willpower. Okay?

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

Period.

[Avery Woods]

Also, how old are you again?

[Jackie]

30. I had to like think because I just had a birthday. 38.

[Avery Woods]

See, that's crazy. This woman is two years to 40. Also, I remember the first time I ever met you was at the rare beauty event. And I literally was like, my jaw was on the floor. Even more beautiful in person.

[Jackie]

Thank you.

[Avery Woods]

Even hotter in person. Body tea. Crazy.

[Jackie]

Thank you.

[Avery Woods]

So for anyone that says it's like cameras or whatever. Nah, she's no gorgeous and good looking.

[Jackie]

Every day I'm fighting Ozempic allegations. I'm offended because I'm like, what did you think I looked like before? I'm confused. Like, people, you, you see me at every stage.

[Avery Woods]

You're also toned and muscular.

[Jackie]

It never gave Ozempic, babe. Like, what the hell?

[Avery Woods]

I think like eats away all like, you're so toned and fit. Yeah.

[Jackie]

And also there's nothing wrong with those impacts. But like, I don't feel like I present the body of someone who died to do that. Even before and after. But anyway, I was always kind of naturally very like muscular. But then I just had like a coming to Jesus moment one day and I was just like, all right, one day you're not gonna be naturally snatched, so you're gonna need to like, one day at a time, kinda, you know, get back on it. And I would, I would engage with the gym, like on and off. So I would be like fit for six months and then I would stop and then I would be like, good for a year and then I would be like really diligent for a year and then I would stop. And then, yeah, it was like 20, 23 where I just decided I was just gonna make a change, but I was gonna start really, really small. So I already kind of like ate semi healthy because I live here in la, so we're very, we're very spoiled. Yes, that aspect.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

So it kind of started with like some of the things that I would eat and then when I started to see a little bit of momentum there, then I started working out a little bit, like little by little. It was, it was baby steps, like baby steps. It was like three times a week or something. Like not super, super crazy. But then, yeah, I think it was kind of like a one thing after the other. And it's crazy because you can start with not even having like a really. My goal was not to become super ripped. I was just like, I just want to improve my lifestyle. And I'm glad I focused on that instead of looking a certain way because I've completely transformed my lifestyle. And the byproduct was looking more snatched and looking more toned. But that wasn't really what I was targeting at first. I just was like, I just want to live better. I want to feel better. So that's what I did. But I did it slowly so that. And I knew I wasn't going to do anything temporary because I was like, I want to make permanent changes.

[Avery Woods]

Yes.

[Jackie]

And that's exactly what I was targeting was like permanent lifestyle changes.

[Avery Woods]

It's also about creating consistency. Like people always ask me, like, how are you so motivated Monday through Friday? I'm like, you just gotta get past that 27 days where it takes to create a habit.

[Jackie]

Exactly.

[Avery Woods]

And then I like crave like, you know, I literally showed up here in my sweats or my workout set because I came from a workout. But if I don't do it, I feel like my whole day is off. Like, I have to start my day and like have that one hour for myself. You do you do Pilates?

[Jackie]

I do.

[Avery Woods]

Is that your favorite workout?

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

Okay.

[Jackie]

Yeah, I do love Pilates. But I went. Yeah, I went from doing workouts begrudgingly to now, like, I have to force myself to take a rest day. Yes. I love working out so much. But yeah, it's, it's really. And you know what I think also motivated me? I needed hobbies.

[Avery Woods]

Okay.

[Jackie]

I needed non social media related stuff to do.

[Avery Woods]

You gotta put your phone down.

[Jackie]

Yeah, yeah. I was a little chronically online at one point and it's like, yeah, I have an excuse because this is my job. But it was like, girl, like, you.

[Avery Woods]

Put that phone down. Yeah. It's also the one job that like you literally can work 24 hours a.

[Jackie]

Day if you're, if you don't give.

[Avery Woods]

Yourself a time limit.

[Jackie]

And I needed, I needed something that was gonna break me away from that. And so, yeah, for me, working out became that thing. Yeah, yeah.

[Avery Woods]

And your quality of your content's insane, too.

[Jackie]

Thank you.

[Avery Woods]

Like, do you film your TikToks in your phone?

[Jackie]

It depends on what I'm doing, but a little bit of both. So most times when you see me doing, like, a green screen feature thing. Right. Like, obviously, that's my phone.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

But, yeah, most of mine is, like, on a camera.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. I was gonna say your quality is insane. Your morning vlogs, we get quality.

[Jackie]

Thank you.

[Avery Woods]

I'm like, my show's on. My show's on. Jackie's scrubbing her tongue.

[Jackie]

Somebody's got to do it.

[Avery Woods]

I want to talk about Forever Mood.

[Jackie]

Yes.

[Avery Woods]

Because all of your followers probably understand what I'm coming from of, like, I watch you, and I just know you smell so good. Was perfume always, like, your number one thing? You loved fragrance. You loved mixing fragrances. Like, you were always talking about stuff that smelled so good. Talk to me about the inspo behind Forever Mood and starting a business.

[Jackie]

Before I became a makeup girly, even before I was a fashion girly, it was fragrance first down. I was just like, a smell good girl. So I have hyperhidrosis, which means, like, I sweat a lot. And so when I hit puberty, that was the first part of my body that was out of control. Like, I would be sweaty even in the winter. And it was. It's. It's really jarring and weird because it's like, why am I always, like, sweating? And when I was young, like when I was 10, because I hit puberty really young. I got my first. I got my first period when I was nine.

[Avery Woods]

Damn.

[Jackie]

Yeah. I got my first period when I was nine.

[Avery Woods]

That's like fifth grade.

[Jackie]

Fourth.

[Avery Woods]

Fifth grade.

[Jackie]

Yeah. I remember being. It was the year before I started sixth grade. It was so weird. I got one. I was at Six Flags. Awkward. I was in Six Flags when I got my period.

[Avery Woods]

You said here an amusement park. Really? When I'm going upside down on these rocks.

[Jackie]

Yeah, upside down, of all things. And I was, like, on my first period, and then, like, it went away, and then it never came back until, like, a year later. So then when I was, like, 10, I was, like, getting a period. So, you know, you're hormonal, you're prepubescent, but I was, like, really sweaty, and I was wearing school uniforms. So it's so funny that this is the shirt that I'm wearing right now, because this would be a. A white linen shirt. A 10 and 11 year. Like, that would be, like, a nightmare piece of clothing to wear because they all had huge yellow pit stains and Nothing would get them out.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, that breaks my heart.

[Jackie]

And, you know, we wore school uniform, so in order for me to hide it, I would wear these, like, big. And I grew up in the Valley, girl.

[Avery Woods]

Like, it was hot.

[Jackie]

Hot.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

But it didn't matter because I was so embarrassed. I would wear these big puffer jackets. And literally one day my teacher begged me. He was like, please take off that jacket. And I was just like, I can't.

[Avery Woods]

You know, it's also like, when you're so much younger than everyone that's not experiencing the same thing, you're probably, like, embarrassing. What is going on?

[Jackie]

You don't know. You're like, you're confused. You're like, why am I so different? What the hell is going on? But it. It ran in my family. So, like, some of my siblings have it, my mom has it. So that was like how I kind of started to play around with perfume because I was looking for something to make me feel better, which is the name why Forever mood kind of comes from. Because it's forever a mood. And this is exactly why whenever I'm describing scent in general, I'm always talking about how it makes you feel. Because I feel like that's more important than like the literal list of notes. You know, top, middle, heart, base. Like, what does it make you feel like? What does it remind you of? For me, scent has always been the. From as long as I can remember, from the youngest age, like, where I really got my confidence from. For real, for real. Like, I didn't care. It doesn't matter how broke I was and how broke my parents were when I put on a perfume. Honey, when I wore a little bit of Dolce and Gabbana light blue.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, yeah, that's a good one. That's a classic.

[Jackie]

Kids know nothing about this. What you know about this?

[Avery Woods]

That's a classic.

[Jackie]

It is so good. I know.

[Avery Woods]

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[Jackie]

Yeah. Because nobody wants to hear you stank.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. Well, that's when I was a kid.

[Jackie]

It'S like nobody wanted to say. It was like. I know you're thinking it, but I.

[Avery Woods]

Also think as women, we're so used to being complimented by how we physically look.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

That it's so nice when you give someone a hug. Like, you smell so amazing. It's like, that's so much better to me than being like, your body looks tea. Your face, which I'm like, okay, tell me that.

[Jackie]

But, yeah, I'll take them all.

[Avery Woods]

But I love a good scent compliment.

[Jackie]

Yeah, same.

[Avery Woods]

It's. It is so huge. Jackie, like forever Mood is really going to like, I. I could imagine it being acquired in like five to 10 years and being like a big ass. I mean, it already is a big ass company. But like, you've done such a great job and you've like really gone in with celebrity status. People that have made perfumes, like, you're really that girl. Do you realize that?

[Jackie]

Thank you. It's.

[Avery Woods]

It's kind of crazy. Yeah, you do. You're like, hey, I know.

[Jackie]

No, you know why? Because I was actually so scared. I genuinely. When we started Forever Mood, you know, this is, you have to remember this is like the era where, like, everybody had a perfume.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

It was unserious. It was just like another perfume. Before there was like the celebrity makeup boom, there was a celebrity fragrance boom.

[Avery Woods]

Sure.

[Jackie]

So by way of being a creator, we're kind of like sort of celebrity adjacent. So I knew I was gonna be graded higher. You know, I was gonna be ex. There was gonna be more expected of me. So I had to really put a lot of thought and intention into what I wanted to do, how I wanted to do it, what our were, what our point of difference would be. Because I do think there's a strong point of difference, like the way we market and who we're speaking to. I like, that's why Forevermore exists. Because I was like, people are not really doing this, people are not really doing that, or people are not really, like, speaking to that community or filling that void. And I knew as. As a consumer, like, I knew what was missing and I wanted to create it.

[Avery Woods]

When you did that iconic video of your huge perfume wall and then it like all went down to the one bottle, I was like, holy shit.

[Jackie]

That was when we first. First launched. You know, we started with our candles.

[Avery Woods]

Yes.

[Jackie]

And then when we first started perfume, the candles were kind of like, let's just see if people like our point of view on scent. But really my. My real love is. Is fine fragrance. And you know, honestly, this brand, this brand would not exist without my husband. Without Dennis.

[Avery Woods]

I want to talk about Dennis because I met him at the rare beauty event.

[Jackie]

Oh, yeah, you did?

[Avery Woods]

Yeah, he. We all met our as couples, I guess, because we had our husbands there with us. But what a gentleman. What a stand up, kind man. I really, really like him. And I remember walking away and David was like, he's really cool. I really like him.

[Jackie]

You know how men, like all the bros love Dennis and the way they.

[Avery Woods]

Really do is dress so dapper. I mean, obviously I expect nothing less like British shoe, but like, so dapper. Such a handsome guy. So kind and welcoming and warm to really everyone. And I love that you guys are business partners because even though David's a stay at home dad, he does a lot of like, my business management behind.

[Jackie]

The scenes, there's a lot of overlap.

[Avery Woods]

When you're married so much. And also, like, I couldn't do it without him. I really couldn't. And I love that you guys did this together.

[Jackie]

I was, I couldn't do it, child. Like, I couldn't. He's basically the person who runs the brand and I'm more creative director. Like, I'm the one who has the final say so on every, like, marketing angle. And obviously like the master scent curator of the brand. But he's the one who hires. He's the one who unfortunately has to fire sometimes. Like, he.

[Avery Woods]

Business is business, business is business.

[Jackie]

And it's. It, it's particularly awkward sometimes when you're a influencer led business. Because I think sometimes people think they can get away with stuff because they like me. But then, you know, that's kind of where Dennis has to step in and make sure there's like a bit of separation so that it remains professional. But yeah, we, we, we offer two completely different things to the brand. But we are, we're, we're actually so good at this that when people ask me for advice, I almost kind of tell them, like, like, I don't really say it like this, but I don't want them to get their hopes too high. So I'm almost like. Just so you know, like, what we have is extremely rare. So don't expect that if you want to start a business or do something with your partner that it's going to be the same thing. It's just the real, like, we have something that's very rare. Most, most times I would tell people, don't do this with your spouse or your partner.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

Because most of them won't be as, as willing to compromise sometimes. But with us, it just works. It just works perfectly. Like, it's just so perfectly. We don't step on each other's toes. We hear each other. I would say the one thing Mr. Dennis needs to work on is work, life balance. Okay, so Dennis is the one. And it's some people with them standing desks. Okay. The people with standing desk.

[Avery Woods]

Does he have a standing desk?

[Jackie]

Yes.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, wait, you were talking shit about this?

[Jackie]

I was literally just talking about some of my stories. They're obsessed. They don't know when to put the phone down. They don't know when to walk away.

[Avery Woods]

I just imagine him like on a walking pad, like with his fucking stickers.

[Jackie]

No, I'm the walking pad girl. He's the standing. There's two types of people walking pad at the Desk.

[Avery Woods]

That office is busy. That home office is busy up there.

[Jackie]

And then I have my own office and he has his own office. And then we have the forevermood home office.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, damn.

[Jackie]

So the standing desk is, you know, Dennis Lair. Yeah. He has a hard time. Like, he wants to discuss stuff in bed. And I'm just like, go to bed. Like, I'm off. All right. You're still locked in. But I'm trying to listen. I'm over. I'm trying to let my skincare settle.

[Avery Woods]

You're like, my skincare's gotta settle. I gotta steam my sheets.

[Jackie]

I don't wanna read no emails. I don't want the blue light penetrating the peptides I just put on. I'm not talking about that right now.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, my God. Okay, what do you think is the most challenging part of starting a business or owning a business?

[Jackie]

Ooh. This is, I think, like, solid advice for creators in general. Make sure. And this is probably gonna be like, duh. So common sense. But I think, like, make sure it would be something that you would do even if you don't necessarily know if you're gonna make a lot of money. Like, I genuinely thought Fair Mood was gonna be like a passion project, which is so laughable because, like, there ain't no such thing as no damn passion project. Everything is work. But I genuinely thought it was gonna be like a fun little thing that I could do just to, like, fulfill my childhood dream of being able to create my own fragrances. But yeah, I think when we do this as a job, you're around your manager, your agent, public, like, everybody's telling you, you can do this, you can start this, you can start this, you can start this. And it's like, once you think you can do anything and everything, you already lost the plot.

[Avery Woods]

Yep.

[Jackie]

You already lost the plot, baby.

[Avery Woods]

Yep.

[Jackie]

Because you have some. There's some things you have no business even entertaining.

[Avery Woods]

And also it's the millions of little projects that are all half assed because you're spread too thin.

[Jackie]

Spread too big.

[Avery Woods]

Like you. If you're gonna start a business and expect people to give you money to support that business, I agree. You got to give 150.

[Jackie]

Don't play with people's money. That's one thing I don't. Yes. I do not play with people's money.

[Avery Woods]

Because we know how hard it is.

[Jackie]

To earn it and how hard it is to. How hard it is to earn it back when you lose it.

[Avery Woods]

Totally.

[Jackie]

So, yeah, we are extreme. Like, I'm not interested in just Launching stuff for the sake of it, or I'm not interested in attaching my name, my likeness, my work ethic to stuff just because I can. Or the opportunity presented itself. No. So I think, yeah, just make sure you're doing something that, like, even if you. Even if it didn't immediately take off, it's something that you would still be kind of passionate about. For me, that really is Frank.

[Avery Woods]

No, I love that. I know we already talked about him, but congratulations, you're married.

[Jackie]

Thanks.

[Avery Woods]

That ring. That ring's crazy.

[Jackie]

Girl, I know you ain't talking. You need to hand it over.

[Avery Woods]

This is my tenure. Your upgrade, though. She's cute.

[Jackie]

Is it rose gold?

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. So it's.

[Jackie]

We have the same wedding band.

[Avery Woods]

Do we?

[Jackie]

Yeah, we have the same.

[Avery Woods]

Wait. Cute. We also have the same bracelet.

[Jackie]

Oh, we do.

[Avery Woods]

Shout out. Okay.

[Jackie]

Period. They was getting dragged a couple months ago. I was here for it, though. What?

[Avery Woods]

My watch.

[Jackie]

Van Cleef.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, Van.

[Jackie]

No, I. Oh, you got to go down the rabbit hole. I'll send you a video.

[Avery Woods]

I got.

[Jackie]

It was funny, though. I got really trying to play this, girl.

[Avery Woods]

I got canceled because my husband bought me a Cartier watch. And I said, what's wrong with Cartier? Because he's a stay at home dad. And they said, so you bought him present?

[Jackie]

And I said, I'm so confused.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, don't even get me started. Anyways, this is a whole. It's a different day of discussion.

[Jackie]

Do you ever see somebody getting dragged and then you try to get to the root of the problem, and it's like, that's what y' all are.

[Avery Woods]

Well, also, I'm like, go outside, touch your lawn. Just rub a little grass.

[Jackie]

So he's not supposed to take care of his wife?

[Avery Woods]

Apparently not.

[Jackie]

What kills me is when people be like, they just. There was some girl who just got married, and she has like two cars, apparently. And people were like, she just got. She just had a baby. Then they just got married. Why is she already getting a new ring? And it's like, damn, y' all are strict. People call me strict? No, y' all are strict. She trying to get a new ring.

[Avery Woods]

She set a baby.

[Jackie]

I was talking about that. I don't know if you saw the other video.

[Avery Woods]

Which one?

[Jackie]

Because somebody was getting dragged because they had. Did a what's in my hospital bag? Video.

[Avery Woods]

Okay, I didn't see this. You know what I love, though? Do you know what I love about you so much is I will see a video. And if they're getting a lot of Hate. The fucking top comment is Jackie and she's like, these people need to calm the fuck down. You do whatever you want, makes you happy. These people are jealous. I love it because you will always.

[Jackie]

Especially if it's somebody that's that. I follow you too though. I feel like you'd be doing well for the girls.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, I don't give a fuck.

[Jackie]

We're alike in a lot of ways.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

Because cheers to not giving a fuck.

[Avery Woods]

Here's my thing. Like the baddies that have been with me, they know my personality. And the thing with TikTok is when you scroll for you page, you see someone you've never seen before. You don't know them, you don't know their background, you don't know their brand. It's so easy to judge. But I'm like, some of these people and you've talked about cancel culture before because there's a difference between teaching someone a lesson and them truly learning and, and then canceling them to the point where you're like threatening to kill their kids. Like there's a difference.

[Jackie]

Sinister.

[Avery Woods]

It really is.

[Jackie]

Yeah, it's like, it's, it's really sinister. I think we, I think we've gotten to a point where it's like, okay, people are digging for stuff always. You know what I mean? Like, this isn't even going to help anybody or anything.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

And it's like really. Oh, it's just really awkward to see. So. Yeah, if some, if, if I'm interacting with a peer in this space and I see them going through it, I try to like give them encouragement.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah, you're always.

[Jackie]

People would give me at the, you know, when I was going through it.

[Avery Woods]

Totally. What was the hospital bag video?

[Jackie]

Oh, okay. So listen, you know, I try to stay out of parenting business because I don't have kids.

[Avery Woods]

Okay.

[Jackie]

But you know, it's very, it's very jarring being on the outside looking in because I just feel like. And this is just my, this is just what I observe. It could be. It is a generalization, I will say. But a lot of times it just seems like there are certain communities and I'm not going to specify which one, but obviously by way of what I'm talking about, you know what I'm talking about the judgment sector. They're so mean. So this girl had her first child and when most people have their first, they do the absolute most, which I think is normal.

[Avery Woods]

I didn't touch like 95% of the shit in my hospital bag, but I wanted to pack it so, so excited to have a baby. Let me live.

[Jackie]

Well, apparently she. She was like filmed a what's in my hospital bag?

[Avery Woods]

Video.

[Jackie]

And I guess she like packed a picture of her dog in a frame. Like, okay, at most. At most it's laughable. But I was just basically in the video. So I didn't see the original video first. I saw the way people were responding first and I felt like they were being really mean. So I was just asking a question to the audience. I was personally just asking a question. Okay. I just said if you could die during childbirth, I feel like if you wanted to bring the kitchen sink, like, I feel like that's fair. I don't know. I don't have a kid. I've never done it, but I just. Don't fight me. Shouldn't you be allowed to, like, you're given life.

[Avery Woods]

I'm sorry.

[Jackie]

Have we really shrunk ourselves that much? Where we have to be like. Cause people were like, oh, my. People in the comments. And you're actually. You're a nurse, so you can weigh in on this. People in the comments were like, I know her. Nurses are so sick of her.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, please. Then you're in the wrong field. Working in labor and delivery. Here's my thing. If I can go on a brand trip to some fancy ass 5 star resort in Bora Bora and they have a photo of my family on my nightstand for my three night stay, I think it's okay that during childbirth you want to look at your dog that can't come to the hospital.

[Jackie]

I agree.

[Avery Woods]

That's crazy.

[Jackie]

I don't. I didn't. I didn't really think that was that crazy. Funny, sure, but I didn't really think that was that crazy. But anyway. Okay, so I'm here for a good hot take.

[Avery Woods]

The only thing I've ever seen with you where you were like, hold the up, let me talk about this. Was when you got married, which I thought was actually insane.

[Jackie]

Dumb.

[Avery Woods]

I'm sorry. So I don't understand.

[Jackie]

And I didn't even really talk about it. There was nothing.

[Avery Woods]

Is it because you did it so privately that people had a problem? Is that what their problem was? Because I'm sorry. Avery, every single aspect of our life is talked about. Like I literally told David, David, I said, if we ever, ever had another baby, I would Kylie Jenner it. I would literally come.

[Jackie]

Really?

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

But I don't feel like you put that much of your tea online.

[Avery Woods]

Not anymore. The last, I don't think. No. Maybe.

[Jackie]

Maybe when I Started following you. Yeah, you may have. Because I don't. Like, that's not my experience interacting with your con. Okay, that makes sense.

[Avery Woods]

I pulled it back a lot just because, like, the safety of my kids is being compromised. And that's. That's your thing, too, is like, you're damned if you do, damn if you don't. Right. Because now people are mad that I don't show my husband kids. So it's like, girl, whatever. But anyways, I. I respected it so much because literally no one knew.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

And I'm like, that is, first of all, so hard to do because people are always whispering and, you know, spit, spat and shit and trying to leak stuff.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

But I think it's just the expectation that they thought that that was a moment you would give everyone. But that's a very personal journey.

[Jackie]

And I think social media has normalized, expecting the most sacred, special, intimate parts. But, like, when you look at my history on social media, I've never been an open. Like, you could describe me as a lot of things, but an open book was never one of them. And then we got engaged in 2019.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, wow.

[Jackie]

Okay. So I was saying, even then, we. You're gonna see the ring anyway, so you're gonna know I'm engaged for sure. But I wasn't going to document my wedding. Sorry. And I didn't want to.

[Avery Woods]

It's no one's business.

[Jackie]

And I don't think it needs to be explained.

[Avery Woods]

No.

[Jackie]

I don't think it needs to have caveats or just, like, disclaimers. It's just, if I don't want to do something, I want to do something. But people are so used to women being like, guys, I'm so sorry. I'm not sorry. Like, I. It's mine, and it's sacred. And I think also because when you have a unique point of view on this, because you said you were an open book at one point. So sometimes when, as creators, when we get criticized, when you kind of give them something to criticize, it's like, all right, I can kind of see why I entertained it. I gave them something to work with. But I think for me, it's always been really difficult to work with this idea that I see what people say about me and my relationship from literally nothing. And that is what scares me.

[Avery Woods]

Yes.

[Jackie]

The stuff that they would say about my husband, the stuff that they would say about our dynamics, stuff that they would say about me, stuff they would say about him, how we got together. Like, it's like, I don't Even post or share anything and you still think you know us. That's concerning to me.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

So if you're talking about me based on what you don't see, well, I'm not gonna incur, I'm not gonna give you more than like, if you want to, if, if you wanna do that based on nothing, go for it. But yeah, I'm not big on, I'm just not, I'm not big on like feeling like special moments are owed. Like I have a, I kind of have a problem with that. And I think as a woman, I have a problem with that.

[Avery Woods]

Yes.

[Jackie]

Because I'm supposed to feel apologetic for wanting a little bit of privacy. I think it's normal and I think, I think the world is moving that way anyway. Like, I love seeing how more people are like not even into having big extravagant weddings as much anymore. Like more people are eloping, more people are doing things more intimately in general. Like even on the, in the creator world and the non creator world. And I love that because like, yeah, hell yeah. Like, let's normalize a little bit of having something to yourself. And also like I got married and divorced really young. So I knew like, if I do this again, not that I was an open book then, I wasn't, but like I've always known that I would do things differently both for myself and also now that this is my job. But yeah, girl, I have been saying for years. And it was also really frustrating because we got engaged and then because there was no announcement, after a couple years it turned into he refuses to marry her. She still. The long. The. I got turned into the image of the long suffering woman whose fiance refuses to marry her. And I said nothing in the entire time. I said nothing in the entire time we were engaged. So I was like, wow, that's so crazy. He refuses to marry me. Who told you that? Who told you that?

[Avery Woods]

The thing I've learned about social media is if someone has their opinion made up about you or they're jealous no matter what they say or will make up about you, people that feel the same way will jump on it so quick. Like it's factual information. It's actually insane. It's kind of insane behavior.

[Jackie]

It is, it's like crazy behavior. Yeah, probably.

[Avery Woods]

Oh yeah.

[Jackie]

And I'm not even trying to be rude. Like, no, it's actually probably. No, it really is because it's not logical. It's like, no, I can sort of understand if I gave you something, but I don't give enough for people to have that Many opinions and the stuff that I've seen has been like, from one extreme to the next. So it's like, yeah, I don't, I don't, I don't give enough. Like, this isn't normal behavior. So I just don't really give anything now because it's like I don't want like a crumb to even be misconstrued, misunderstood. And like, I think people just forgot marriages are sacred.

[Avery Woods]

Yes.

[Jackie]

They. Absolutely, yes, are sacred.

[Avery Woods]

Yep.

[Jackie]

So if that's my way of protecting that little bit of sanity I get in my personal life.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah, Good for you.

[Jackie]

That's important to me.

[Avery Woods]

It is. It's what is like your five year goal, business wise, personalized.

[Jackie]

Where.

[Avery Woods]

Where do you see yourself? What do you have your eyes on the prize for?

[Jackie]

I'm really trying desperately, I'm doing okay at it. But like, better work, life balance.

[Avery Woods]

Okay.

[Jackie]

And by that I mean now that we have Forevermood and Forever Mood is growing at the rate that it is and it's consuming more of my life. Like now I have to navigate being like brand founder and like almost creator second. Whereas before I was like creator first, brand founder second. Now it's becoming the opposite, which is amazing. And I hope to be able to lean more into that and get a better hold of that, if that makes sense.

[Avery Woods]

It's probably weird because you've been a creator for so long that it's.

[Jackie]

I think I'll always be a creator girl to some extent for sure.

[Avery Woods]

Just kind of drawing it back a little bit to focus more on Forevermood.

[Jackie]

There will be signs.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

Put it this way, that maybe there will be sides because I miss posting for Forever Fun. Like when it was Vibes.

[Avery Woods]

I know.

[Jackie]

I miss those days.

[Avery Woods]

I know it doesn't happen anymore, unfortunately. Or like you can't even have fun with it because then people are so mean.

[Jackie]

Yeah. You know what? I think it's a bit like when people know it's your job. I think sometimes they can. How can I put this? Like, especially like newer creators when they know, like this is all you have.

[Avery Woods]

Or when you have the ability to leave your relatability in your job. People support you, support you, support you. And then as soon as they see that, they're like, I don't know, you.

[Jackie]

Got to be really careful with how you kind of navigate that because.

[Avery Woods]

Totally. Yeah.

[Jackie]

Yeah. That's like the first thing they'll come for if they don't like something about you. So, yeah. Always have a backup plan.

[Avery Woods]

Yep.

[Jackie]

So, yeah, I think being More established as a brand founder. Hopefully being a global brand. More of a global brand.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, I already see that. I see that in the next, like, year.

[Jackie]

I'm so ready. I'm so ready.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

Work. We work so hard. Like, I've never. I'm. It's a different type of working hard, but, like, this is the hardest I've worked as an adult. For sure.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. You guys are crushing it.

[Jackie]

We're trying.

[Avery Woods]

Okay. We like to end our episodes with rapid fire. So we have six for each Rapid fire.

[Jackie]

Yes.

[Avery Woods]

Okay.

[Jackie]

Oh, and then we have an unboxing.

[Avery Woods]

Okay. Should we do at the end?

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, period. We've never done an unboxing on camera.

[Jackie]

Oh, you don't gotta unbox everything. I don't mean, like.

[Avery Woods]

No, I'm obsessed. Okay. What scent are you obsessed with right now?

[Jackie]

Definitely Forevermood. She was here.

[Avery Woods]

She was here.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

Okay. I've seen you post about your espresso martinis. Is that your go to cocktail for a night out?

[Jackie]

It was until I tried pistachio martinis.

[Avery Woods]

Wait, what? That's a thing?

[Jackie]

Naughty, nasty. I love dirty, filthy.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, I love pistachio. Pistachio desserts. Have you ever been to the Malibu farmer's market and gotten the pistachio filled croissant?

[Jackie]

No. What?

[Avery Woods]

Oh, girl, I'm gonna get it. What the.

[Jackie]

Time out. Hold on.

[Avery Woods]

Okay, so Malibu farmers market is more like a grab and go. Farmers market.

[Jackie]

Yes.

[Avery Woods]

There's a pastry guy. He's a big net around his tent, so no bugs get in. These are.

[Jackie]

He takes his job serious. That's the kind of person I want to shop at.

[Avery Woods]

I'm telling you, they are authentic. Like, tastes like they're from Paris. And there is a pistachio one. There's also a Nutella banana one my kids love.

[Jackie]

But. Okay. I don't normally like filled pastries, but I would try that because I like pistachio.

[Avery Woods]

It's light and fresh. It's not really heavy. Or like dessert. Oh, we'll go on our, like, walk around Malibu. The kids will ride their scooters.

[Jackie]

Absolutely. Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

Say less. I'm there. That sounds amazing.

[Avery Woods]

Where are you get a pistachio martini.

[Jackie]

I make it, but the first one I tried was in Paris, actually.

[Avery Woods]

Okay.

[Jackie]

It was so good.

[Avery Woods]

All right, I gotta get one, so.

[Jackie]

Come over and I'll make you one.

[Avery Woods]

Okay. I'll be there. I'm like, so right now, literally. Okay. Would you rather have a cozy night in or a glam night out?

[Jackie]

I was gonna say glam night in. Cozy night in.

[Avery Woods]

Okay, yeah, same. What song instantly puts you in a.

[Jackie]

Good mood in the city? Oh, when I used to jump in, you come.

[Avery Woods]

You like Justin?

[Jackie]

Yeah. Like what he put in that song? Every time I get that, every time that song comes on, I just start like belly rolling.

[Avery Woods]

Like, did you see me on the surfboard of that song? Use my road lip liner? No, I was surfing.

[Jackie]

See that guy that was impersonating him.

[Avery Woods]

In Vegas, I just found out this.

[Jackie]

And ran up a ten thousand dollar tab at the bar.

[Avery Woods]

Okay.

[Jackie]

Yo, let him have it. Please let him. He pulled that off and y' all didn't clock it. Yeah, let him have it.

[Avery Woods]

I was at my workout this morning and I like work out with all these moms that I'm obsessed with. We're all just like. It's like our one hour escape. They're like, did you see this Justin Bieber guy going, I had no idea. They said he had the same tattoos and stuff.

[Jackie]

It's actually scary.

[Avery Woods]

That's fully committed.

[Jackie]

That's committing to the bit. No, really, I'm saying they should just let. Let him have it.

[Avery Woods]

Deserves to get away with like, he ate that. The fact that the DJ didn't even know and he's in music, that's a y' all problem.

[Jackie]

I'm sorry.

[Avery Woods]

See, and I was too drunk. The club lights.

[Jackie]

See why I shouldn't gamble?

[Avery Woods]

Listen. Yeah, okay. Who's someone you'd love to get stuck in a Sephora with for an hour?

[Jackie]

For an hour?

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

Mariah.

[Avery Woods]

Mariah who?

[Jackie]

Carrie. Oh, yeah. Okay, there's only one.

[Avery Woods]

I'm like, I thought I was. I thought you were talking about like a makeup guru or something.

[Jackie]

No, no, no. Mariah or Sierra. Yeah, Mariah.

[Avery Woods]

Sierra, Ciara. Okay. Why Mariah?

[Jackie]

She just seems like a glam. Like, first of all, she'd buy everything. I already know that. Yeah, but she just seems like super, super filthy glamorous. And I live for it. And cece too. Like, I love Ciara. She's always so fun.

[Avery Woods]

She's like my mom goals. Like, she pops those kids out. And I love how much she talks about how much weight she gains pregnant. Cause I was the same. I gained so much weight pregnant.

[Jackie]

What's so much weight when you're pregnant?

[Avery Woods]

I mean, I gave birth to Ziggy, like £210. I think I started at like 130.

[Jackie]

Wow. I know. Was it difficult for you? Like, was that like. Oh.

[Avery Woods]

I mean, I worked full time as a nurse when I, when I would chart, I would Just like roll around on my chair and my scrubs. I was so happy. And then when I was working during the pandemic with Stevie, I think I was only like 182 when I gave birth.

[Jackie]

Okay.

[Avery Woods]

So I only gained like 50.

[Jackie]

Like just like a light average, right?

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. I mean, which is only eight and a half pounds, though.

[Jackie]

Wait, so I have a question.

[Avery Woods]

Okay.

[Jackie]

When you. When you. Okay, when you gain a significant amount of weight like that through pregnancy, are you progressively gained, like from the moment you get pregnant, or is it like at like five months where it just pops off?

[Avery Woods]

With Stevie, I was really sick in the beginning. So my first trimester, I just had like a teeny, tiny little bump. It wasn't until I started getting like the ability to eat back because I was throwing up so much that I was like.

[Jackie]

So it was like a psychological thing.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. But also like, okay, I kind of did to myself. Like, I would go work my 12 and a half hour shift. So I was walking like, sometimes. I was a swattner. So for the entire pediatric tower, I would be responsible. So, like, if a kid was coding, like, I had to go to the code if someone could get an iv. So I was going from the ER to the PICU to the NICU to the oncology floor to the med surge floor. So I was walking up all these floors. So I was walking like sometimes up to 20,000 steps in a shift. Like, pregnant as buck. But so when I was time to like talk to my doctors or do rounds in the morning, I would sit in my chair with like a double chocolate Costco muffin on top of my stomach and just eat that because I was hungry.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

You know, I'll show you pictures later. But then, you know, but that's what my love for working out came from because I breastfed my kids for so long, but I held on to the weight until I was done breastfeeding. So Until Stevie was 14 months old, I was like the same postpartum weight from pretty much birth until I weaned her. So that was really hard for me mentally.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

So I loved when people like Sierra talked about how much weight they gained and then like getting their ass back to the gym and work. Life balance. She is. She's tea.

[Jackie]

So beautiful. She's so, so beautiful and just minds her business. I love for her.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah, I love her. Okay. Best compliment that you've recently received.

[Jackie]

That I've recently received. I mean, always something smell good related.

[Avery Woods]

Like, do you say when someone compliments you the way you smell, do you Say, like, it's my brand forever mood.

[Jackie]

If they. If they ask, like, if. If I know that they know it's my brand, like, yeah, I'll tell them, like, oh, it's because, you know, they may want to get it.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah, totally.

[Jackie]

Yeah. Most times.

[Avery Woods]

I love that.

[Jackie]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

Thank you so much for coming on. This was such a joy.

[Jackie]

Thank you. I love this.

[Avery Woods]

I told Jazzy, one of my producers here at Unwell, I was like, this is probably my top within my top three interviews of the whole year. Because I just. I've always wanted you on. And when I got to meet you, when I. First of all, when you followed me back, like last year or something, I was like, holy. I was telling everyone, everyone. And then when I met you at rare, I was like, she is such a light. Like, you really are such a good human being. And like, watching you interact with people, whether they're fans or they're serving you food, you always are so kind and classy to everyone. I really appreciate that because I've as I've gotten more and more in this industry. It's not always like that.

[Jackie]

It's true.

[Avery Woods]

Sometimes you don't want to meet your idols.

[Jackie]

Actually. Yeah. Because I've had some very uncomfortable experiences. Not very frequently, but, yeah, like, damn, I never would have thought that person was like that.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

But even still, you know what? I'm like, you know what? It could be a bad day.

[Avery Woods]

Could be a bad day.

[Jackie]

Yeah. But you still go to hell. But, like, it could be buzz off, but, you know, give them a little. Not too much. Like, I try to give people the benefit of the doubt.

[Avery Woods]

And you come from humble beginnings and it shows because you're so grateful for everything, but also, like, you enjoy your in home services. You've taught me that. You literally said, girl, why are you leaving your house to get your nail emails? Then I said, you're valid.

[Jackie]

Everything at home, honey. IVs at home, hair at home, girl.

[Avery Woods]

I get my own. I get my own self. An IV in Vegas.

[Jackie]

That's impressive. I wish. I can't do that.

[Avery Woods]

So listen, you need an iv, let me know. I still have an active license.

[Jackie]

Really? Yeah. I was gonna ask, like, so you did IVs and stuff?

[Avery Woods]

Oh, I worked in the ICU. Yeah, girl.

[Jackie]

Impressive.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, yeah.

[Jackie]

Shout out to nurses.

[Avery Woods]

Like, honestly, shout out to nurses. They need to make double what they make.

[Jackie]

Absolutely.

[Avery Woods]

Yep. Yeah, we love the nurses. Well, I adore you. Thank you for being here. Where can everyone find you?

[Jackie]

At Jackieina and. Or at Forevermood F O, R, V, R. No. E. Wait.

[Avery Woods]

We needed to do our thing.

[Jackie]

Oh, yeah. Oh, my God.

[Avery Woods]

Wait. We can't leave without this.

[Jackie]

Well, I gave you everything.

[Avery Woods]

No, you did not.

[Jackie]

Practically everything. I didn't know. I. I didn't know how you felt about candles because you got kids.

[Avery Woods]

I. Oh, we're obsessed with candles. They know.

[Jackie]

Okay. Because, you know, they know I'm so.

[Avery Woods]

Obsessed with candles that they are, like, trained. They know.

[Jackie]

Yeah. My niece and nephew, they know, too.

[Avery Woods]

For the new house.

[Jackie]

Yes. We are so excited for the new house. They're in between.

[Avery Woods]

Girl, are you kidding? Yes. You guys, look at this bag. I'll have Scott zoom in on it. This is amazing. Okay, I'm gonna open a couple things.

[Jackie]

Absolutely. Wait, wait. Open what's in the brown pouch first. Brown pouch, because you're gonna gag the girls. It's our newest. Yes. Look at this. She was here.

[Avery Woods]

Can I open her?

[Jackie]

Oh, my God. Of course.

[Avery Woods]

Okay. I love the mauve packaging. That's gorgeous.

[Jackie]

Yes. Thank you.

[Avery Woods]

And this is your current fave right now. This is. Yeah.

[Jackie]

Yes. And this is the latest one that we just dropped that's sold out everywhere, but it's coming back.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, the packaging.

[Jackie]

Thank you.

[Avery Woods]

I designed all of my bathrooms so different to, like, display all my favorite things.

[Jackie]

I love that. I love when everybody. When people do that with their bathrooms, specifically.

[Avery Woods]

Yes.

[Jackie]

So every bathroom is. I love that.

[Avery Woods]

So Stevie's and, like, we arched her bathtub, and it's all stone from the ground up. Pink stone. Wow. So it matches this so beautifully.

[Jackie]

I love pink stone. So pretty. That's, like rose quartz, right?

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

Yeah. Oh, that's a flex. I need to see that.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, girl, put your wrists out. Everyone, come here. The girls want to try. Wow.

[Jackie]

I hope you guys like pistachio.

[Avery Woods]

It is so good.

[Jackie]

Thank you.

[Avery Woods]

What I love about it is it's fresh, but it's also sexy.

[Jackie]

It's very. It's very sexual. I like it's a little too Go home game. The reaction to that one. That one. And funny enough, put that one on your husband, too. Okay. Yeah, that one's really good on men. Really good on men.

[Avery Woods]

I want to. At least. I. I saw a candle, and I really wanted.

[Jackie]

Smell a candle. Yeah. For sure.

[Avery Woods]

This Matcha Matcha Besties.

[Jackie]

I figured you'd like the matcha.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, girl, smell that. Jazzy loves candles, too.

[Jackie]

Do you? Oh, my God. I love that.

[Avery Woods]

I literally. I'm gonna style these for every room in the house.

[Jackie]

Oh, my God.

[Avery Woods]

I'm so happy because we have so many, like, display shelves. So I have some decorating.

[Jackie]

They're pretty as decor too. That's why I wanted everything to be so pretty.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, thank you so much.

[Jackie]

Of course.

[Avery Woods]

A lot. I'm so excited. Wait, hold on. I want to go through these. Hard to get. And it's hard to get.

[Jackie]

Yes.

[Avery Woods]

Self care isn't selfish. And that's literally your brand.

[Jackie]

What kind of fragrance do you normally wear?

[Avery Woods]

Like, what do you know my go to? I like Orabella, Salted Muse.

[Jackie]

Oh, okay. That's Bella Hadid's brand.

[Avery Woods]

Right.

[Jackie]

Okay.

[Avery Woods]

I like Leilabo number 13. Okay. Joe Malone. Yes. I do a lot of. What am I trying to say?

[Jackie]

Androgynous.

[Avery Woods]

No. What? When a male and female can use.

[Jackie]

Yeah, like unisex androgynous.

[Avery Woods]

Okay. Yeah. Yeah.

[Jackie]

I don't know why I knew that about you.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. So I love like a more. I don't like a super overpowering, florally girly scent. It makes me feel too young.

[Jackie]

Yeah. I think. Yeah. I think that's the vibe you give.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

You like a little bit of both.

[Avery Woods]

But like, this she was here is exactly like that. It's mature. It's giving. Milfy. It's giving. I'll get pregnant later.

[Jackie]

Yes. Maybe. Maybe not. Wearing around your man.

[Avery Woods]

No, maybe not. Yeah.

[Jackie]

I'm like. And you should also try NDA.

[Avery Woods]

NDA? Is that in here?

[Jackie]

Yeah. Do you like. Do you like by the fireplace?

[Avery Woods]

Yes.

[Jackie]

By Margiela. Yes, Very. That coated is NDA. Oh, I'm so excited. It doesn't smell the same, but it's the same aura vibe.

[Avery Woods]

I'm designing my primary bathroom right now, and I just know where I'm gonna put these on my little.

[Jackie]

They're gonna look marble shelf. Oh, and you would also like. You remind me because it's like a second skin. If you like clean.

[Avery Woods]

I like that clean scent too.

[Jackie]

Yes.

[Avery Woods]

That's like one that I'll put in my purse, like after a workout.

[Jackie]

I actually work out in that scent all the time.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, really?

[Jackie]

Because it's like a musk. So I like to. I like to sweat in it a little bit. Oh, yeah. I like to sweat in a little bit. I feel like it smells a little better.

[Avery Woods]

You got your sweat under control?

[Jackie]

Way under control. Shout out to. Shout out to Botox. Okay.

[Avery Woods]

You inject your armpits.

[Jackie]

Get up in there.

[Avery Woods]

Is that painful?

[Jackie]

Don't waste them. Units.

[Avery Woods]

Is that painful?

[Jackie]

Not in my opinion. No. They'll give you like a little ice pack. Like it's not unbearable, but it's not like, pleasant.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

Have you ever tried it?

[Avery Woods]

Not in my armpits. I mean, I love Botox, but I.

[Jackie]

Love it under my arms.

[Avery Woods]

Okay. Okay, maybe I'll try that.

[Jackie]

I heard it's like painful in the hands, though.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. I used to inject men in their hands when I did aesthetics, like really sweaty guys.

[Jackie]

It was painful.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. Because it's so sensitive. Yeah.

[Jackie]

Ouch.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Jackie]

No, it's not that bad under the arms.

[Avery Woods]

Well, thank you so much. I'm so excited. This is literally. I just went shopping, guys.

[Jackie]

Yes, you did. Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

And I'm like, I love you guys, but I'm not sharing.

[Jackie]

You can get it at Sephora, though.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. Period. Get Forever Mood at Sephora, everyone.

[Jackie]

And forevermood.com yes.

[Avery Woods]

And Doug Limu and I always tell you to customize your car insurance and.

[Jackie]

Save hundreds with Liberty Mutual.

[Avery Woods]

But now we want you to feel it. Cue the emu music, Limu.

[Jackie]

Save yourself money today.

[Avery Woods]

Increase your wealth. Customize and save. We say that may have been too much feeling.

[Jackie]

Only pay for what you [e-mail] Liberty Liberty, Liberty Savings. Very unwritten by Liberty Mutual Insurance Company affiliates excludes Massachusetts.

[Avery Woods]

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[Jackie]

Oh, right this way.

[Avery Woods]

Who, me?

[Jackie]

I can stream shows at 30,000ft and.

[Avery Woods]

I was able to buy reserve tickets for my favorite band.

[Jackie]

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