not so little | kendall vertes

Summary

CHEERS! with Avery Woods

Episode: "Not So Little" | Guest: Kendall Vertes
Release Date: November 10, 2025
Podcast Host: Avery Woods

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Episode Overview

In this engaging and candid episode, host Avery Woods sits down with Kendall Vertes, former Dance Moms star and recent college graduate, to discuss her new podcast, transitioning from child stardom to adulthood, navigating life after college, social media scrutiny, and redefining herself beyond her public persona. With warmth and humor, Avery and Kendall reflect on the realities of growing up on reality TV, building thick skin, finding community, and the exciting unknowns of post-grad life. The episode is a refreshing blend of heartfelt reminiscence, practical advice, and relatable anecdotes.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Kendall’s Transition: Dance Moms to Adulthood

• Joining Unwell and Starting Her Podcast
  Kendall expresses gratitude for joining the Unwell podcast network and the surreal feeling of launching her own show.
  "Since I just graduated college, I'm like living Hannah Montana. I was just in the farmlands of Virginia and now I'm in California, like, shooting my first episode for my podcast…” (01:59–02:19)

• Academic Path & Pushing Herself
  Studied political science and pre-law at JMU, despite initial interest in skipping college and moving to LA to pursue influencing full-time.
  “My mom honestly was the whole reason why I went to college…And I to this day am so happy she made me realize that because she's right. I met my best friends, I figured out a lot about myself.” (02:39–03:16)

• Dancing in College & Facing Prejudice
  Faced bias from a college dance coach due to her Dance Moms background, ultimately quitting dance senior year to prioritize a “normal” student experience.
  (04:11–04:51)

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2. Growing Up in the Public Eye

• Origins in Dance & Dance Moms
  Danced since childhood, with two sisters in different activities. Joined Dance Moms at 8 after attending a breakfast with Abby Lee.
  “Literally came to my mom and I for—with a contract that said seven years…we signed our lives away for seven years straight.” (07:13–08:19)

• Reality of Reality TV Pay
  Exposes the myth of lucrative child reality TV, sharing that she and her mom earned as little as $500 per episode in the beginning.
  “I hate the stigma that people think reality TV pays…for us to not be going to school…to not be around my sisters or my dad…traveling every single weekend…” (08:56–09:22)

• Parental Protection & the Impact of Trauma
  Attributing her and her peers' resilience to their mothers’ constant presence on set, protecting them from worse outcomes.
  “The only reason we are the way we are today is because our parents were on set with us. They were protecting us 24/7 through and through.” (06:38-07:03)

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3. Adjusting After Dance Moms and Social Media Scrutiny

• Social Adjustments & High School Return
  After Dance Moms, moved back to Pittsburgh to finish high school, learning again to make friends while navigating her local notoriety.
  “The last time I saw my friends, I was nine and now I'm 15…That was a really eye-opening stage of my life.” (28:21–29:35)

• Maturity and Coping with Criticism
  Early exposure to intense public scrutiny pushed Kendall to mature quickly. She’s now adept at handling criticism and taps into a deeper sense of self-worth.
  “I matured very early on…It gave me really thick skin. I can take criticism like there's no other.” (18:50–19:50)

• Toxicity of Modern Social Media
  Discussion on TikTok amplifying hate and misconceptions, especially regarding old childhood footage. Kendall stresses that viewers only saw a curated fraction of her life.
  “Whatever they saw on the show, that is like 30 to 40% of who I actually am as a person. And I was 8, I am now 22.” (20:38–21:11) Avery: “...watching a TV show back from, like, over a decade ago when you're a child is not accurate to judge your character off of.” (22:11)

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4. Personal Growth, Boundaries & Mental Health

• Setting Social Media Boundaries
  Both discuss filtering comments, limiting exposure to negative feedback, and how setting boundaries is crucial for self-preservation.
  Avery: “I just have learned, like, the only thing I can do is protect my peace. And the only way I'm gonna be able to do that is by setting boundaries for myself.” (27:03–27:12)

• Newfound Relatability & Post-Grad Uncertainty
  Kendall is candid about post-grad uncertainty and wanting listeners to relate to her journey:
  “I want them to...relate to me as much as possible.” (09:59–10:39)

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5. Behind the Scenes: Dance Moms & Friendship

• On-set Shenanigans & Sisterhood
  Recalling sleeping in hotel rooms, getting lice, splitting room service, and pranks—memories of childlike fun and bonding. “We had lice maybe two to three times...When you saw us in slickbacks, like, you could smell us from a mile away…” (15:53–16:27) “All the girls would go to one hotel room…order, like, the $90 steak and fries...when it was time to pay, none of us had cash…” (16:33–17:24)

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6. Reframing Identity & Future Aspirations

• The “Not So Little” Podcast
  Title inspired by her childhood nickname, signaling her evolution into adulthood. Hopes to use podcasting to both share her own story and amplify diverse voices.
  “I am a golfer. I also studied political science and pre-law. Like, there's so many different avenues that I can take with this podcast.” (36:16–36:23) “I want...my guests...to be able to talk about, like, who they would want to be known for if they weren’t in the public eye.” (36:53–37:18)

• Excitement for Guest Conversations
  Eager to feature surprising and interesting guests, from family members and fellow Dance Moms alums to authors and athletes.
  “People that I don’t even know yet that I want to have on my podcast…just random but interesting people that I want to know.” (40:09–40:24)

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7. Real Life, Relationships & Aspirations

• Daily Routines & Family Life
  Describes a typical day at home: coffee, walks, Goodwill trips, family time, and early nights.
  “I literally wake up, scroll, go get some coffee. Like, maybe go through my clothes, take them to Goodwill…” (33:07–33:21)

• Dating, Active Roster & the “WAG” Dream
  Openly discusses dating adventures, long-distance breakup, and her playful ambition to become a WAG (Wives and Girlfriends of athletes).
  “I just, like, I want to go to your game, and I want to make you dinner when you come home. And, like, I'll do your laundry. And, like, I just love that.” (54:58–55:07)

• Adventures & Social Life
  Shares stories of work trips to Miami and Vegas, navigating the “Unwell” influencer community, and enjoying low-key nights in with friends.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Post-Graduation Uncertainty:
  "I am sitting here like, am I doing the right thing? Like, should I be moving to a new city? Should I have gotten a corporate job? Should I have went to law school? Like, there's so many question marks in my life right now…" – Kendall Vertes (09:59–10:39)

• On Resilience and Maturity:
  "It also gave me really thick skin…Getting yelled at every day for eight years and your dance teacher telling you that you're ugly and washed up at the age of eight..." – Kendall (19:23–19:50)

• On Internet Hate:
  "You cannot please everybody. You aren't going to be everybody's cup of tea. And I just want to be myself and not cater towards, like, a certain crowd of people because that's when you start to lose yourself." – Kendall (21:16–21:39)

• On Filtering Social Media:
  “Yes, I filtered my comments. Like, hey, it's my page.” – Kendall (27:12–27:24)

• On Room Service Mayhem:
  “All of the girls would go to one hotel room…we would start knocking on the production crew's doors and asking for literal pennies. We're like, we just need 10 more dollars. Like, is there any way you could give us this money?” – Kendall (16:33–17:23)

• On Wanting to Be a WAG:
  "I want to be a WAG so badly. I just, like, I want to go to your game, and I want to make you dinner when you come home." – Kendall (54:50–55:07)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Kendall Joins Unwell & Podcast Launch: 01:53–02:24
• College Years & Choosing Education: 02:30–03:19
• Life on Dance Moms (Getting Cast, Contracts): 07:13–08:28
• Reality TV Compensation: 08:44–09:22
• Impact of Public Scrutiny & Social Media: 18:50–22:39
• Behind-the-Scenes Hotel Antics: 15:53–17:24
• Returning to High School & Community Reception: 28:21–30:29
• New Podcast “Not So Little” - Inspiration & Future: 35:36–37:18
• Dating & “WAG” Aspirations: 51:22–55:14
• Rapid-Fire Fun: 57:22–59:49

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Episode Tone & Takeaways

• Relatable & Unfiltered: Both Avery and Kendall keep the tone warm, candid, and often self-deprecating, increasing their relatability.
• Empowering & Uplifting: They discuss the importance of boundary-setting, owning your narrative, and making peace with an unconventional life path.
• Supportive Community: Frequent mutual admiration, encouragement for following one's own journey, and public affirmation of each other and other women.

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Final Thoughts

This episode delivers honest reflection on what it means to grow up under scrutiny and find your footing as a young adult. Kendall’s transparency about her insecurities, ambitions, and quirks is both refreshing and reassuring for listeners navigating their own post-grad or post-trauma journeys. Her and Avery’s banter about influencer events, dating, and “girl math” add lightness, while their insights into fame and boundaries provide genuine value.

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Find Kendall Vertes:
Instagram: @kendallvertes
Podcast: “Not So Little” (new episodes every Thursday)

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Transcript

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[Avery Woods]

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[Kendall Vertes]

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[Kendall Vertes]

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[Unwell Team Member]

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[Avery Woods]

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[Unwell Team Member]

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[Unwell Event Announcer]

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It starts with a swipe. Download Tinder today. Hi, welcome to Cheers. I'm your host, Avery Woods.

[Kendall Vertes]

Hi, Kendall. Hi.

[Avery Woods]

I'm so happy you're here.

[Kendall Vertes]

I can't believe I'm sitting next to you right now.

[Avery Woods]

No, no, no. You're like my adopted child. I feel I'm obsessed with you. We likewise, we've gotten to know each other so well because I feel like we're always at these events together and your mother and you're my. Well, I can't even say that because you're, like, taking shots with me. I was just saying you're my daughter.

[Kendall Vertes]

But you're the cool aunt.

[Avery Woods]

It's. I just love your journey and, like, where you are and what's coming up. Welcome to Unwell, by the way.

[Kendall Vertes]

Thank you. So happy to be here. I unwell today.

[Avery Woods]

Of course. Yeah, I know, and I feel bad. Usually I'm like, repping myself. I dressed up in Mew Mew for you.

[Kendall Vertes]

Thank you. Put some extra effort. I love the effort.

[Avery Woods]

Okay, so we have a lot going on. You are officially with Unwell. Part of the Unwell fam. How are you feeling?

[Kendall Vertes]

I mean, I never thought in a million years I'd even have fun stories to tell on a podcast, let alone working with the most famous podcast network. This is definitely a pinch me moment for sure. And I feel like I. Since I just graduated college, I'm like living Hannah Montana. Like, I was just in the farmlands of Virginia and now I'm in California, like, shooting my first episode for my podcast. It's honestly so crazy, but here we are.

[Avery Woods]

Congratulations on. On everything. And also graduating college. That's a Huge deal. What did you study?

[Kendall Vertes]

I studied political science and pre law. See, why? But like, why, why did I.

[Avery Woods]

You said, I'm going to challenge myself.

[Kendall Vertes]

I really did. My mom honestly was the whole reason why I went to college. I wanted to move back out here and just like, I don't know, around, be an influencer. This is where you do it. Like LA is the place to do it. And she was like, no, you need to go to college. You need to get a degree. You'll thank me later. It's four years of your life that you'll never get back. And I to this day am so happy she made me realize that because she's right. I met my best friends, I figured out a lot about myself. And like, you go through a lot of transitions through college in those four years. You learn a lot about friendships and, I don't know, working hard and passing all your classes. And now I'm here.

[Avery Woods]

I feel like college is more than just a degree and an education. You learn how to be on your own, you learn how to make lifelong friends. Your frontal lobe is developing and you learn characteristics and traits that you'll carry with you for the rest of your life. Not procrastinating, getting work done on time.

[Unwell Team Member]

Exactly.

[Avery Woods]

It really does set you up forever. Yeah. And you danced in college, right?

[Kendall Vertes]

I did. I actually came in. So long story short, we never did school on dance moms. Like they were working us for like 12 hour days. We never had time to do school. And so when it was time for me to go to college, that's when Covid hit. And I didn't have to take the SATs. So I had no grades under my belt to show that like I'm competent enough to even go to school. And so I did my first semester at a community college in Pittsburgh.

[Avery Woods]

Okay.

[Kendall Vertes]

Just to submit to colleges to show them that I can keep up with education. And so I came into JMU my spring semester, my sophomore year. I then joined the dance team my sophomore year and junior year. And unfortunately I had a coach that wasn't always on my side and kind of disliked me for my background of dance moms and used that against me. And I'm like, you know what? I really just want to have one day where I don't have to worry about dance and. And a teacher that doesn't like me. So I quit for my senior year. I enjoyed being with my roommates, going to parties, traveling, like being a normal college student. And so that was definitely an interesting experience.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. And you've obviously Been in such a public eye for so long, especially regarding dance. How old were you when you first started dancing?

[Kendall Vertes]

I think I was, like, in diapers. Like, it really was since I came out of the womb. My. I have two older sisters, so my oldest sister, she was a dancer, 100%. My middle sister was the tomboy. She did soccer, softball, tennis, swimming, all of that. And my mom put me in dance. I would go to all of my sister's classes. I would just, like, run around in the back. My mom's like, obviously, you need to be a dancer. The rest is history.

[Unwell Team Member]

Stevie started at 23 months.

[Kendall Vertes]

Love it.

[Avery Woods]

And she's four and a half now.

[Unwell Team Member]

I know.

[Avery Woods]

Isn't that crazy?

[Kendall Vertes]

That's wild.

[Avery Woods]

She turns 5 in May.

[Unwell Team Member]

I know.

[Avery Woods]

It's such a big birthday.

[Unwell Team Member]

Wow.

[Avery Woods]

I know. I can't believe it. But, like, watching her, it's so amazing to see how much they learn.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

But also, like, I'll watch back dance moms. And I'm, like, the way I could never. Yeah. Like, have her in that environment. Like, if. If it ever turns into that. I can't.

[Kendall Vertes]

No. Nobody should put their kids through that.

[Avery Woods]

So I just commend all of you girls for, like, going through that. And all of you are doing so well on your own now, which is really telling because, although it's not Hollywood, because you see a lot of these, like, Hollywood stars that were child actors or singers, and you kind of see what they've turned into because of their trauma. You guys aren't that far off from that. Like, you were still on tv. Your life was exposed. There was a lot of drama, a lot of emotional abus. But all of you have done so well and, like, made such names for yourselves, which I think is very telling to who raised you.

[Kendall Vertes]

Oh, for sure. And I think I tell everybody this all the time. The only reason we are the way we are today is because our parents were on set with us. They were protecting us 247 through and through. Like, obviously, there were times where they weren't physically able to protect us from Abby, clearly. But, yeah, I mean, our moms, if they weren't there, it would have been a completely different show.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah, I could imagine that. What's your first memory of being a part of the show? Like, were you approached, or was it, like, an audition? What was that process like for you?

[Kendall Vertes]

So I was at a competing. I was at a dance studio like, an hour away from Abby's.

[Avery Woods]

Is that the candy apples one?

[Kendall Vertes]

Wait, you have, like, good dance moms.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, yeah. Kathy oh yeah, I watched that shit.

[Kendall Vertes]

So she was in Ohio, but no, I was at a dance studio like an hour away. And I was eight when I first joined Dance Moms. But they reached out to my mom and said, hey, like we have an open spot on this team. Like, we'd love to meet with you. Please send in a few tapes of your daughter dancing. Come meet Abby. So my mom and I went to breakfast with Abby, went to like the Donut Connection, of course. And she was basically just telling us like, yeah, I have a spot on this dance team we'd love for you to come on. And that was literally it. Cuz it wasn't that popular yet. Like they just wrapped up their first season. We weren't sure if it was going to even keep going to a second. And it was still very questionable if I was even going to be on. But I came. I knew I was going to be on the team, but for continuity purposes, I still had to obviously go to the audition. And after that episode, they literally came to my mom and I for. With a contract that said seven years. And like we literally signed our lives away for seven years straight. Like there was no, like, after this season we'll renew your contract. Like it was seven years that we signed our lives away.

[Avery Woods]

So seven years is insane to think about.

[Kendall Vertes]

Honestly, why did. How did they even know that it was gonna go on for that long either? Like, I still ask myself that question every day.

[Avery Woods]

So that's from 8 years old to 15 years old?

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah.

[Unwell Team Member]

Contracted.

[Avery Woods]

Was it the same amount of money for all seven years?

[Kendall Vertes]

So my mom and I split a paycheck for 500, I think for the, definitely the first season.

[Avery Woods]

Because we were obviously.500 for the entire season.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah. Isn't that crazy or. No, sorry, 500 per episode.

[Avery Woods]

But still that's crazy.

[Kendall Vertes]

I hate the stigma that people think reality TV pays.

[Avery Woods]

Well, it pays for reality TV pays trash. I know this cuz I have so many friends even currently on reality TV that make nothing, nothing.

[Kendall Vertes]

And so once the show really started to pick up, our moms were like, seriously, like we're filming 60 hours a week for a $500 paycheck? No way. And so eventually like every year would grow like $1,000. But still, like my ending paychecks were like $2,000 a week. Which, okay, granted, I'm eight years old, like that's a lot of money, obviously. But for the amount of work for us to not be going to school, I was never around my sisters or my dad. We were traveling every single Weekend. I had no social life other than the 50 year old male producers and the girls on the show. Like, those were my friends. It was so crazy. I need my mom to write a book.

[Avery Woods]

Honestly, she should because she would have some tea.

[Kendall Vertes]

She has some tea for sure back.

[Avery Woods]

No, I'm obsessed.

[Kendall Vertes]

No, I, um.

[Avery Woods]

Okay, so obviously so many people know you from dance moms and like watching you grow up, but how would you describe who you are today as an adult?

[Kendall Vertes]

Oh, God. Well, I mean, the whole reason of why I wanted to do this podcast is to let people know that I'm just like them. Yeah, I just graduated college. I moved back home with my parents. My roommates are 60 year old people. Like, I love that I'm living with my mom and my dad and a lot of my roommates went to grad school. Some of my friends moved to New York City and got corporate jobs. And I am sitting here like, am I doing the right thing? Like, should I be moving to a new city? Should I have gotten a corporate job? Should I have went to law school? Like, there's so many question marks in my life right now and I know that there's so many people out there who are also going through the same thing. And so I want them to like, come to me and like, relate to me as much as possible. Obviously.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. So you're starting a podcast.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yes.

[Avery Woods]

How do you feel about it?

[Kendall Vertes]

Like crazy. I don't even know how to feel about it yet because it doesn't even feel real. And there's so many like, possibilities for this podcast because like I just said, I graduated college, I could go to law school. I could also move to LA and like do influencing full time. Like, there's so much that I'm still figuring out and I just want them to be able to come along with me because everybody my age is going through this transition right now and it's okay. Like, it's a weird part of our lives, but it's honestly probably one of the most telling parts of our lives of who we are as people and what we do under stress and in certain circumstances.

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[Unwell Team Member]

This show is sponsored by Better Help. I've told you guys so many times how therapy has truly changed my life. And as a busy mom on the go that's constantly working and busy, it can be very hard for me to be able to leave the house and make my therapy appointments. Therapy should be able to be prioritized, and having it in the convenience of my own home has made it so much easier for me. As the seasons change, shorter days don't have to weigh you down this season. Better Help encourages you to reach out, check in on friends, reconnect with loved ones and remind them that you're there. Just like it takes a little courage to send that text or grab a coffee with someone you haven't seen in a while. Reaching out for therapy can feel difficult.

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[Avery Woods]

That you were casted with in dance moms that you're still very close to and hang out with all the time. When you came in and joined them, did you feel welcomed or was it hard to kind of adjust?

[Kendall Vertes]

I think the girls knew that adding another castmate, it was just another sister of theirs. Like, they solely just were there to dance. The moms on the other hand, like, there was obviously some tiffs between the moms, but I mean, we just wanted to dance. Like, that's all we cared about. And we were just making new friends and traveling every weekend. And it honestly was a sisterhood the day we laid eyes on each other. Like, we knew that we were in this together.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah, it is really sweet, like, seeing you guys as little girls so bonded, so crazy. Especially when there was so much chaos.

[Kendall Vertes]

I know.

[Avery Woods]

And you guys were like, can we just braid each other's hair?

[Kendall Vertes]

No, literally. And then we would get lice. I was just telling somebody we got lice so much because we would use each other's hair brushes and, like sleep in the beds and like, literally did everything together. We had lice maybe two to three times. Like on the show. No, it was disgusting. Because the crew would get it. And, like, we still had to film the tv. Like, you can't cancel the show because of lice. But, like, when you saw us in slickbacks, like, you could smell us from a mile away. The mint that they would put in our hair to, like, get the treatment. It was disgusting. It was so bad.

[Avery Woods]

I was going to ask you a behind the scenes moment that happened that still makes you laugh, but I feel like, honestly, a good one.

[Kendall Vertes]

That's a really good one. I would say, like, every weekend when we would travel to a new state, we would obviously be in a hotel, and all of the girls would go to one hotel room. All the moms would go out to dinner, and we would order, like, the $90 steak and fries. Like, there's seven of us. We would all order steaks, ice cream, french fries, everything you could think of. And then when it was time to pay, none of us had cash. And so we would start knocking on the production crew's doors and asking for literal pennies. We're like, we just need 10 more dollars. Like, is there any way you could give us this money? We just ordered room service. Our moms are out at dinner. Like, that occurred a lot. And our moms would give us money, but we would spend it on ice cream downstairs. We would get, like, the drumsticks from the hotel concierge. Like, we spent so much money on room service every weekend.

[Avery Woods]

I feel like anytime I'm in a hotel, I'm like, what can I rack up?

[Kendall Vertes]

No, literally.

[Avery Woods]

Because if I say just put it on the room, like, I'm not looking.

[Kendall Vertes]

No, right?

[Avery Woods]

You know, like, it's literally free.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah, it is. Girl math.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, my God. That actually rem me when I we took our kids to Cabo. I was shooting a billboard for Kosis in Cabo, and I, like, brought my family on this brand trip.

[Kendall Vertes]

As you should.

[Avery Woods]

So, like, everyone's taking shots. I'm like, swim with my kids in the pool with goggles on. And there was a swim up bar, and we got our room service bill, and I was like, we've only been here for, like, three days. Like, what's going on?

[Kendall Vertes]

I don't even want to know. It.

[Avery Woods]

It was. It definitely had a comma in it.

[Unwell Event Announcer]

I.

[Avery Woods]

It was. It was a fat bill. Come to find out, Ziggy and Stevie were swimming up to the swim up bar and ordering, like, five smoothies.

[Kendall Vertes]

Oh, my God, they figured it out.

[Avery Woods]

French fries. And of course, the people are like, yep, let me rock that up. What's your Room over in Ziggy's, like, whatever it was.

[Kendall Vertes]

304, you know, that is so funny. But what a smart girl.

[Avery Woods]

Honestly, both of them.

[Kendall Vertes]

I'm like, yeah, that is so funny.

[Avery Woods]

I get concerned because we still have to teach them, like, oh, for sure. And money doesn't grow on trees and that kind of thing, but, like, when you're that age, you don't have concept of.

[Kendall Vertes]

No.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, I'm ordering.

[Kendall Vertes]

Money grows on trees. Yeah, I still do.

[Avery Woods]

I'm ordering five. 25 smoothies. No, it's fine. Put it on mom's room. Okay. You balanced being a kid. School, friendships, filming and performing. How do you think that pressure has affected you and shaped who you are today as an adult?

[Kendall Vertes]

Let me say, I barely survived all of that. That was. It was a lot. Especially, like, going through puberty on national television with your mother. Like, I feel bad for her because obviously, I'm a. I'm a kid. I'm gonna snap at my mom when she's brushing my hair or I'm obviously under a lot of stress. But I will say it taught me. I matured very early on. Being surrounded by producers and production companies and traveling on my own and going to different countries with my dance teacher, I learned to mature, and I learned how to carry myself at a very young age. And I think that's something that I'm very proud of now, because a lot of people, I think it's a compliment. They're like, oh, my God, I thought you were so much older. Just, like, your maturity level. But it also gave me really thick skin. I can take criticism like there's no other. And I obviously take it with a grain of salt, because I know they're just trying to help me, but, I mean, getting yelled out every day for eight years and your dance teacher telling you that you're ugly and washed up at the age of eight, it's like, okay, I have to take it. So I take criticism very, very easily.

[Avery Woods]

Now, I was gonna ask you about that, because obviously, when Dance Moms was first starting, social media wasn't really a thing. It was, like, there was Facebook and then Instagram, but it wasn't really until, like, Tick Tock started coming out. Yeah, that, at least for me, I think TikTok is the most toxic social media platform by far. And I. I. It. What came out, like, 2019.

[Kendall Vertes]

2020, like, right when Covet hit.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. So when that happened, because obviously, that's where, like, a dance mom edits come. And, yeah, a lot of the comments when you first started seeing that stuff about people's opinions regarding you on the show. What. What was your thoughts? How did you deal with that? Because I have such a hard time with. Hey. Comments.

[Kendall Vertes]

I mean, yeah, I feel like we can both relate to this. It's when you're posting yourself on social media, obviously you're opening yourself up for commentary and people can say whatever they want. It's so easy to hide behind a screen and, you know, hate on somebody or talk about someone's body or whatever it is. I honestly also have and have tried to get better with hate comments, but I just know that whatever they saw on the show, that is like 30 to 40% of who I actually am as a person. And I was 8, I am now 22.

[Avery Woods]

I think 40 is a lot. I think it's.

[Kendall Vertes]

Let's give them 20.

[Avery Woods]

I was going to say less than that.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah. I think a lot of people, when they meet me, they're like, oh, my God, I love you. And they think that they know me, but I'm like, you know, saw nothing. You saw what they portrayed me on the show, which was a crybaby and, like, the brat. I was 8 years old under so much stress. And like, kids handle stress in all shapes and sizes. Like, nobody is the same when it comes to being under that much pressure. And I, like, the biggest thing that I always have to tell myself is like, you cannot please everybody. You aren't going to be everybody's cup of tea. And I just want to be myself and not cater towards, like, a certain crowd of people because that's when you start to lose yourself. Like, I genuinely just want to be the best friend that you can search up on. Tick tock and, like, relate to me as much as possible. But, yeah, it's definitely tough when people can say whatever they want and then the other ones just, like, latch onto it and add more to it. And it's like we're losing the plot here. Like, we really are.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. I also think, you know, watching a TV show back from, like, over a decade ago when you're a child is not accurate to judge your character off of. You know, it's like a. You're seeing a reality TV show where they're gonna clip the most dramatic moments that they know are gonna get attention and views.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

And then second to that again, you're 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13 years. Like, so, so young.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

That I just think it's crazy that they still will hold you to that and expect that from you as an adult.

[Unwell Team Member]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

I've seen a lot of, like, Kendall was the mean girl. Oh, what do you have to say about that? Because I have never, and I will say this, I would say straight up if I ever got a vibe like that. But since the second I met you, you are the most girls, girl, compliment everyone. You always are going up to everyone. And you're so kind. I've never, never got an inkling of mean girl bad bone in your body.

[Kendall Vertes]

That's so kind of you. Thank you. My mom would love to hear that.

[Avery Woods]

No, it's so true. Like, and that's off camera. That's. That's not social media. That's just like sitting down, having a normal conversation.

[Kendall Vertes]

That's a great compliment.

[Avery Woods]

And also watching you interact with fans and people and other talent at Unwell. Like, you always are so respectful and so kind.

[Kendall Vertes]

Thank you. That means a lot to me. Yeah. Because, I mean, Abby, we did like a magazine cover when we were younger, and each girl played a different stereotype of school. And I was the mean girl. Maddie was like the teacher's pet. Kenzie was the nerd. And so I think that mean, that cover shoot, that was like, oh, like we are going to portray her as the mean girl. And then when I would snap at my mom because I was under a lot of stress, they were like, oh, she really is the mean girl. And when I would, like, I was. I saw a clip one time and Abby was talking to us and Maddie went to go give me a high five. And I, like, went like this. Because if I looked at Maddie, I would have gotten berated by Abby. Like, you. You had to be so locked in with her. You couldn't laugh, you couldn't cry, you couldn't breathe, you couldn't clap around her or else she would scream at you. So, like, I. I was just paying attention. But I think also with me being the crybaby and like, I don't know, me having these moments with my mom, it was so easy for them to pinpoint me as the mean girl. And then they would, like, nitpick and find these certain clips and be like, oh, yeah, like, there she is being mean to. Blah, blah, blah. Like, she didn't look at her when they high fives. Like, I don't know. It's so stupid. It's so stupid. But I mean, people can think whatever they want about me, but I know who I am and I know I'm not a mean girl. And like, I love everybody that comes up to me and I love meeting people. Cause we would not be here if it weren't for our fans. Like, we. I'm obviously gonna acknowledge that.

[Avery Woods]

And so, yeah, I've gone through that too, where people think that they know my character. And it's so interesting because I say, like, you maybe see less than 5% of my life. They think they see so much, but everyone is a different person than they are online. And I've come to realize as I've gotten older and just tougher and gone to therapy that people that already have their opinions made up about you, there's.

[Unwell Team Member]

No point of trying to prove them.

[Avery Woods]

Wrong, because no matter what you do, they already have their opinion. And they're gonna look for anything to convince them that their opinion is correct.

[Kendall Vertes]

Exactly.

[Avery Woods]

But at the end of the day, someone judging you without knowing you says so much more about their character.

[Kendall Vertes]

Exactly.

[Avery Woods]

Because all that matters is the people around you that are in your immediate, close life. Their opinions are the only ones that matter for sure. Everyone else is just.

[Kendall Vertes]

You have really tough skin as well. Like, you are a badass, and you handle. You carry yourself, like, so gracefully through all of it. Like, I need to be you when I grow up.

[Avery Woods]

You're so.

[Kendall Vertes]

Especially because you have a family. Like, you want to protect them.

[Unwell Team Member]

Yeah, of course.

[Kendall Vertes]

You're genuinely just doing what is best for your family. And you have grown, like, your social media and your presence tremendously over the past few years. And, like, you just. It doesn't fit. Like, at least from what I see, like, it does not phase you one bit. And if it does, like, it's for a day.

[Avery Woods]

Well, that and also, like, I just had to stop looking. Like, I stop checking comments. I don't check mentions. I don't look at dms. I don't look at hardly anything. I'll scroll on Instagram because that's, like, who you follow.

[Kendall Vertes]

It's a safe space for me as well.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. But I won't scroll on, like, the Explore page. I literally just know my feed and then I'll scroll my tick tock following, not my for you page.

[Kendall Vertes]

Interesting.

[Avery Woods]

Because my following is people that are my friends that I want to see.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

Don't hate me. Right. And then on my. You know when you scroll on your for you page and it, like, curates to whatever the I hate it love to say about you.

[Unwell Event Announcer]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

I just. I just have learned, like, the only thing I can do is protect my piece. And the only way I'm gonna be able to do that is by setting boundaries for myself. For sure.

[Kendall Vertes]

Wait, setting boundaries? Do you filter Words. Oh, yeah, I was gonna say. Because I do that too. And I hate when people are like, oh, she filtered her com. Yes, I filtered my comments.

[Avery Woods]

Like, hey, it's my page.

[Kendall Vertes]

Exactly.

[Avery Woods]

Control what's being said.

[Unwell Team Member]

Exactly.

[Avery Woods]

If I don't filter comments, then people can literally say whatever they want. That's. That's completely untrue and has no factual. Yeah, like, what am I trying to say? There's no validity to it, but people will take it and run with it.

[Kendall Vertes]

No, I know.

[Avery Woods]

And they'll be like, I knew that was true.

[Kendall Vertes]

And it's like, that just shows, like, we're really not in for, for the money. Because obviously, like, the more comments, the more money you make. Like, I don't care.

[Unwell Event Announcer]

I know.

[Kendall Vertes]

I literally could care less. I don't want you making up rumors and then people feeding off of that. And then, and then we start this whole new cycle of, like, me getting canceled and all of that.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, my God. I know. I'm like, not canceled. God. Triggers me. Okay, so filming dance moms growing up, when the cameras turned off, was that a hard adjustment for you? Like, what was life like outside of filming? Because you guys were so busy filming?

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah. So towards the end of Dance Moms, we actually moved out to la. Abby opened up a studio here. So we, my mom and I had to move from Pittsburgh to LA for about three and a half, four years.

[Unwell Event Announcer]

Whoa.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah. And so we were full time out here. We would go back for the holidays and that's about it. But my mom missed both of my older sister's homecomings, proms, graduations. My dad was basically at home raising my two sisters. So once the camera stopped, like, we packed up our shit and went back home. And my mom was like, you need to have a social life. There's no more dance moms. Like, you need to go be a normal kid. I was 15. I went back to high school. I had no idea what the reaction was going to be. The last time I saw my friends, I was nine and now I'm 15. Like, everybody went through puberty. Everybody had their groups. You have your clique when you go into high school. So I was trying to navigate, like, who genuinely wants to be my friend or who's in this for the wrong reasons. That was a really eye opening stage of my life because obviously I was just there to meet friends, go to high school football games, go to homecoming, like, be a normal person. And I mean, honestly, high school also shaped me a lot as a person and I learned a lot about myself and Friends and friendships.

[Avery Woods]

How was that going into high school? Like, obviously, you came back and everyone knows who you are. Yeah. And high school's already hard enough in itself with cliques and, like, again, going through puberty being a teenage girl. So were you welcomed? Were people nice to you?

[Kendall Vertes]

I will say, my school district was so welcoming to me because of my two older sisters. All of the teachers that I had had my older sisters, so I felt comfortable being there. And, like, the town knew who I was and they knew what I did. So, like, it wasn't awkward. Like, people wouldn't ask for photos, but they were just like, oh, my God. Like, I never thought I would see you again. Like, you were just out in LA filming a TV show. Like, what are you doing here? I'm like, I'm doing what you're doing. Like, let's go take our math quiz. Like, I'm just trying to get an education.

[Avery Woods]

Trying to get a high school diploma.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah, exactly. So it was. It was nice. And I'm honestly really glad my parents told me to go back to school.

[Avery Woods]

Did you dance in high school?

[Kendall Vertes]

I didn't. My dad was a tennis pro, and he said, when you come back to high school, you need to join a sports team to make friends. And I was like, okay. Like, I'll do tennis. My middle sister did tennis. Okay, you teach it.

[Avery Woods]

Okay.

[Kendall Vertes]

He's like, all right. No, we're gonna put you in golf. And so he took me to the driving range. He made me try out for my high school golf team. I somehow ended up making it. And I played golf for three years in high school, like, on my high.

[Avery Woods]

School team, you know, women's golf scholarship is, like, the number one sports scholarship to get.

[Kendall Vertes]

Wait, are you kidding?

[Avery Woods]

Yes, because they have to give the same. I love that. My dad was a golf coach for almost 40 years.

[Podcast Advertiser]

Holy.

[Kendall Vertes]

That's sick.

[Avery Woods]

Ziggy plays golf, David. Oh, I love that family. So when I married woods, my dad.

[Kendall Vertes]

Was like, yeah, as you should.

[Avery Woods]

If only my husband golfed like Tiger woods, because, God bless his heart, you.

[Kendall Vertes]

Can just put the cute golf outfit on and call it a day.

[Avery Woods]

I just go to drive the golf cart and, like, get a Bloody Mary.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yep.

[Avery Woods]

Drink. But, yeah, my dad told me this because he wanted me to play golf so badly, but I played volleyball because. Okay, they'll give the same amount of. They have to give the same amount of female scholarships as male scholarships, but obviously it's not super popular for females to play.

[Unwell Team Member]

Yeah.

[Kendall Vertes]

So they give them more money. Yeah, that's so Interesting. Wow, that's really good to know. Go women's golf.

[Avery Woods]

I'm like, the more you know.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah, right, right.

[Avery Woods]

So how are you at golf?

[Kendall Vertes]

I mean, I would say I can carry myself pretty well. I'm a very competitive person, though.

[Avery Woods]

Wait, we should go. We should.

[Kendall Vertes]

Let's do it. That would be so fun.

[Avery Woods]

We're members that. Let's go.

[Kendall Vertes]

I literally want to live your life. I literally want to be when I grow up.

[Avery Woods]

You are. You're already thriving.

[Kendall Vertes]

Thank you. You're so much younger than trying.

[Avery Woods]

You're already with unwell. Like, you're gonna be way more successful than me, and I can't wait. Okay, so how is it like, living at home with your parents?

[Kendall Vertes]

You know, my last year of college, I was so eager to just go back home. Like, I missed being with my parents, being with my animals, being in my little bubble. Like, I always feel so safe when I go home. Especially, like, with traveling so much. It's so nice to just like, have a meal cooked for you.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, my God.

[Kendall Vertes]

Your mom does your laundry. You can show her all your funny tick tocks that you saved. And so I moved back home. I was really excited. I was like, okay, clean slate. Like, I can kind of relax, figure out what I want to do, where I want to go. And now every morning I wake up and I'm like, holy. I have nothing to do today. Like, I am so bored because with social media, like, it's not consistent. Yeah, like you. It's consistent when you make it consistent. But I don't want to be filming a day in the life. Every day, I do the same fucking goddamn thing.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, yeah, speaking of, I was going to ask you, like, what's your everyday life right now? Like, I, like, wake up to bed. I want to hear your sketch.

[Kendall Vertes]

I literally wake up, scroll, go get some coffee. Like, maybe go through my clothes, take them to Goodwill.

[Avery Woods]

Okay.

[Kendall Vertes]

Watch a movie, take my dog for a walk, make dinner, and then literally go to bed by, like, 8:30.

[Avery Woods]

Are you.

[Kendall Vertes]

It's not okay, but I want to live that and my grandma. Like, I love.

[Avery Woods]

I know. You and I in Vegas. Yeah, grandmas.

[Kendall Vertes]

I love to be home.

[Avery Woods]

I said, you're like my child. Go out to the club. And you're like, no, I'm going to bed.

[Kendall Vertes]

You're so right. Same thing happened in Miami. Like, they all went out to the club after the afters, and I'm like, wait, I'm going back to my hotel.

[Avery Woods]

I know. I kind of love that vibe, though. We were, oh, My bad face mask on.

[Kendall Vertes]

Hell, yeah. Hell, yeah.

[Avery Woods]

How was Vegas for you? Did you have fun?

[Kendall Vertes]

So fun. I feel like when I did Unwell Miami, I was obviously meeting everybody for the first time. Like, that was almost my audition with Unwell. Like.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Kendall Vertes]

I was meeting the people who work for them. I was meeting the influencers. I was meeting you guys, the content creators. And so that was a little stressful, for sure. It's also, like, I've never been to an event like that where there's so many people like me there. And so I obviously had to keep my cool and just, like, tread lightly, meet everybody, get the vibe. Vegas was a whole nother story. I feel like I already had a family. Like, I felt comfortable being around everybody. I could talk to you guys about, like, normal.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Kendall Vertes]

And so Vegas was awesome, but it's also Vegas. Like, you're getting caught up in, like, the going out, the drinking, the getting ready, trying to sleep. Very overwhelming.

[Avery Woods]

Also, first of all, you carried yourself like a pro in Miami.

[Kendall Vertes]

I would never know that you were.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. But you. It was so nice to get to know you then.

[Kendall Vertes]

And then I love meeting people.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. No, you're a natural. You're so good with people. But I feel like people don't understand the chaos that goes on behind the scenes at our unwell events. Like, how busy we all are. And again, I'll never complain about this being my job. Like, so lucky. Yeah. But we are literally go, go, go for, like, 14 hours a day. Yeah. And then. And that's just what they have scheduled. And then, like, when we're recording podcasts and. Right. Editing our content.

[Kendall Vertes]

I was gonna say you guys have, like, behind the scenes campaigns that you have to film and.

[Avery Woods]

Yep.

[Kendall Vertes]

Videos you have to edit. All while, like, enjoying the events that we have to go to and, like, branding out and meeting new people and making connections.

[Unwell Team Member]

Yeah.

[Kendall Vertes]

It's a lot of.

[Avery Woods]

It's like, let's take shots. And I'm like, hold on. I have to work. I'm like. Because I. I can't take too many shots. Right, Right. We're not gonna be getting.

[Kendall Vertes]

We're not gonna make it out. Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. I'm like, oh, I'm concerned. Okay, let's talk about not so little.

[Podcast Advertiser]

Yay.

[Avery Woods]

What inspired the title?

[Kendall Vertes]

So one of my nicknames from a very, very early on stage of dance moms was my little Kendall. My mom would always say, my little Kendall deserves a solo. My little Kendall will be perfect for this part. And so now that I'm 22, I'm in this transition phase of going into adulthood, I'm like, how can I turn this into something a little more mature? Not so little. And I feel like everybody at least who's like, a dance moms fan or like, knows of dance moms, will definitely get the title. But it's also like, I can do so much with it. Like, I am a golfer. I also studied political science and pre law. Like, there's so many different avenues that I can take with this podcast.

[Avery Woods]

Where do you see it going? Like, do you want to focus more on you and what you're doing and what you've learned, or do you want to talk to people?

[Kendall Vertes]

Both. I honestly want to take them through, like, every brand trip that I go on. And I just went to Italy for my best friend's wedding. Like, I took them along with me for that. And just like, all of my life experiences of being, like, in the showgirl era of it, and then being, like, at home, living with my parents, not knowing what I'm going to do tomorrow, and then obviously meeting new people and sharing our experiences and learning from, I don't know, the other creators out there.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. What are you most excited for for the podcast?

[Kendall Vertes]

Oh, God. I honestly think, like, figuring out who I want to have on as guests because I love to just chit chat with people and, like, learn who they are as a person. And what I really want to do is I don't want to focus on what they're already known for. I want them to be able to talk about, like, who they would want to be known for if they weren't in the public eye and, like.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Kendall Vertes]

Who they are as people.

[Avery Woods]

I always try to humanize people.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yes.

[Avery Woods]

I never want to be controversial.

[Unwell Team Member]

Right.

[Avery Woods]

You know, haven't always avoided that.

[Kendall Vertes]

Try not to be controversial.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. I just feel like sometimes we need to be humanized for sure. Because obviously the Internet has so many opinions about who we are, who they think that we are. And so I love sitting down with people and just getting to know them.

[Kendall Vertes]

As a human being, their thought process of life.

[Avery Woods]

Yes. And I will say, like, one of my favorite things about having the podcast is I have made so many friends for sure. Like, already knowing you and like, I have my friends on, but, like, people that I've never met and, like, being able to sit down and really get to know.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

And. And then continuing that relationship after is so nice.

[Kendall Vertes]

So awesome.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. It's really, really fun. Okay, so you said you're figuring out post grad life in real time.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

Do you think, has it been easier than you expected? Harder. Like, what's your experience after college?

[Kendall Vertes]

I mean, I think it's. The hard aspect of it is seeing all of your other friends going to grad school and getting jobs. And it's like, should I have done that? Like, I could have gone to law school, but do I really want to give up? I'd have to give up one or the other. I could not do influencing in grad school at the same time or law school. And I don't know. I think the easy part of it is also not having that structure yet. Like, I'm still in my 20s, I'm 22, turning 23 this year. Like, I want to travel. I want to experience new things and make new friendships and, like, travel the world before I know I'm going to be tied down somewhere.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. I also think, obviously, no one's path is ever the same.

[Kendall Vertes]

Oh, no.

[Avery Woods]

Like lineal. Like I. When I went to school for nursing. Right.

[Kendall Vertes]

And now look at you.

[Avery Woods]

It's so different. But I also think a lot of those people that you graduated college with, they don't come from your childhood. Like, you have an immense amount of incredible opportunities that so many people would love to have because of what you.

[Unwell Team Member]

Sacrificed in your childhood.

[Avery Woods]

And I think that's an amazing thing that you can embrace that and, like, make that your career and make money from it. Right. Because you did have to give up so much growing up.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah. Like, I have to just keep reminding myself I've basically been working since I was 8 years old. Like, it's okay to not have structure in your life for a tiny period of it.

[Avery Woods]

Absolutely.

[Kendall Vertes]

Like, it's okay to wake up and, like, sleep in and not do anything in bedrot.

[Avery Woods]

Absolutely. I agree. So who can we look forward to in your pod? Like, are you gonna have your family on Dance Mom Girl? For sure.

[Kendall Vertes]

I mean, I.

[Avery Woods]

Episode.

[Kendall Vertes]

I know for sure. That is the most anticipated episode. I will tell you.

[Avery Woods]

Like, you guys need to do like a truth or shot or something.

[Kendall Vertes]

My mom doesn't drink, which is so annoying because when I drink. No, she's very old school.

[Avery Woods]

Very. I love that for her. I do too.

[Kendall Vertes]

It raised me really well. Like, I don't do drugs. I hate. I stay away from them. That is the one thing that I will always carry on with me from my childhood up until now is like, yeah, that. Friends, family, I mean, a lot of the cast members from the show, obviously we're not living in the same state, so we don't get to talk or see each other as much.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Kendall Vertes]

And people that you wouldn't expect. Like, I want to meet new people, People that I don't even know yet that I want to have on my podcast. Like authors of books that I read, gymnasts from neighboring colleges in Pittsburgh. Like, just random but interesting people that I want to know.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. I've come to learn. Like, it just doesn't matter who the person is or how popular famous they are. Can you have a good conversation with them? Can you and your audience learn from them? Like, are they intriguing to you? Interesting, because I love sitting down with people that I'm like, I'm obsessed with whatever you've done.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

If anyone knows who you are, I selfish.

[Kendall Vertes]

That's where I'm at for sure.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. What do you hope that people take away from listening to your podcast?

[Kendall Vertes]

I want them to just see who I am as a person. Outside of dance moms and outside of all the clips that you see on TikTok and the clickbait that people post, I'm just a normal 22 year old girl trying to figure out her life and navigate relationships and rosters and guys leaving you on open and living with your parents. All of it at the same time.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah, it's. And you have so much going on at such a young age too. It's gonna be.

[Unwell Team Member]

I'm gonna be sad.

[Avery Woods]

I can't wait.

[Kendall Vertes]

Oh, thank you.

[Avery Woods]

How are you celebrating the launch?

[Kendall Vertes]

You know, that's a. That's a good question. I'm a big sports girly. I love football. And so I was maybe wanting to do like a little tailgate in Pittsburgh, maybe something in New York as well. A lot of my friends are in New York and I don't know, around Christmas time.

[Avery Woods]

Wait, who are your teams?

[Kendall Vertes]

The Steelers.

[Avery Woods]

Okay. Period. Yeah, that makes sense.

[Kendall Vertes]

We like them, but they're not that good, so it's okay. They're just fun to watch.

[Avery Woods]

I just like have football in the background all the time with my husband.

[Kendall Vertes]

I feel like you have to at that point.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. Okay. So like, are you dating? Like, what's going on?

[Kendall Vertes]

We have an active roster.

[Avery Woods]

We do. How many are we talking?

[Kendall Vertes]

Well, it's. It changes every week.

[Avery Woods]

You know that one boy that used to be on your TikTok, he's pretty cute.

[Kendall Vertes]

Wait, who?

[Avery Woods]

I don't know. I think.

[Kendall Vertes]

Is that my ex boyfriend?

[Avery Woods]

I think he was. He's pretty cute.

[Kendall Vertes]

He was great. And my mom would love to hear you say that because she loves him and she asks me about him every day and we get into arguments because I'm like, mom, we are not together.

[Avery Woods]

Did that end amicably?

[Kendall Vertes]

It was kind of a mutual decision. He was at a neighboring college, but eight hours away, so I guess not even neighboring. He was at a college eight hours away. Like, yeah, that didn't make sense. And he just. I couldn't give up my weekends to drive 8 hours to go watch him play baseball. He couldn't come to me. So it was always me going to him. And, like, I had my own life, I had my own work that I needed to worry about. And so it was just right person, maybe wrong timing.

[Avery Woods]

Was that your last boyfriend?

[Unwell Team Member]

Yeah.

[Kendall Vertes]

So I've been single. We broke up literally in October. So it's been a year.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, okay. I love that that's a healthy journey for you.

[Kendall Vertes]

And, like, I love being single, but I also love men.

[Avery Woods]

I know you do. You and Scotty. You and Scotty. We are going to take care over.

[Kendall Vertes]

California if I ever move here.

[Avery Woods]

No, you guys need to be each other's wing people.

[Kendall Vertes]

Oh, absolutely.

[Avery Woods]

Like, when Thunder Down Under. He's in. He's coming in here. Like, yes. When Thunder down under boys came in Vegas.

[Kendall Vertes]

I think I was wet.

[Avery Woods]

I have to tell this story because it's Jazzy's dying laughing. Okay, this was so funny.

[Unwell Team Member]

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[Avery Woods]

Let's be real, your bathroom routine could.

[Unwell Event Announcer]

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[Avery Woods]

There are a lot of things that I'm good at. I feel very proud to be a businesswoman and financially support my family. But there is one thing I'm not going to lie to you guys, I'm not that good at, and that's keeping track of my finances. That is where my husband comes in. Okay? I just make the money and then he handles what's going on behind the scenes. But if I didn't have him, honestly, I'd be kind of scared. I can't tell you how many times.

[Unwell Team Member]

I have checked out in public and.

[Avery Woods]

My card gets declined. And I'm like, I know I have money in my bank account, but what happened was basically when I get paid, I put everything in my business account. Because that's just how it Works when you own a business, right? So I never put anything into my personal checking account, but a lot of bills, auto draft out of there and I can't tell you how many times.

[Unwell Team Member]

I've just never replenished it and it's just in the red and I'm getting all these overdraft fees, missed payments.

[Avery Woods]

But however, Chime understands that every dollar counts. That's why when you set up direct.

[Unwell Team Member]

Deposit through Chime, you get access to fee free features like free overdraft coverage, getting paid up to two days early. With direct deposit and more, you can open a checking account with no monthly fees and no maintenance fees and not to mention access to over 47,000 free atmosphere chime is banking done right? Work on your finance goals through Chime today. Open an account in 2 [e-mail] Avery that's chime.com Avery Chime feels like progress. Chime is a financial technology company, not a bank. Banking services and debit cards provided by the Bank Corp. Bank N A or Stride Bank N A members FDIC Spot.

[Avery Woods]

Me eligibility requirements and overdraft limits apply.

[Unwell Team Member]

Time depending on submission of payment file.

[Avery Woods]

Fees apply at out of network ATM.

[Unwell Team Member]

Bank ranking and number of ATMs according to the US News and World Report.

[Avery Woods]

2023 Chime checking account required. I we're walking to the pool party, okay? Day two pool party. And I'm with Jazzy, who is my producer, unwell, and Scotty, who also helps produce the podcast. And we're walking to. We have to like, be escorted everywhere, right? Because people, people are just crazy, right? And so we go to the elevator and all of a sudden, I am not exaggerating. These six foot seven, maybe six foot.

[Kendall Vertes]

Eight, you have like 12 packs.

[Avery Woods]

Two Australian men with their shirts off. They're like in Speedos, go to the elevator. And Scott's like, oh, my God. Oh my God. I'm like, why? She goes, those are Thunder down under guys. I'm like, okay.

[Kendall Vertes]

Like, that is such an appropriate reaction.

[Avery Woods]

Jazzy goes, can we please take a picture with you? And I look at her. I said, I am not taking a photo with them. I would get annihilated on the Internet if I'm saying there were thunder down our guys.

[Kendall Vertes]

Like, hey, the moms that would go after you if they ever saw that photo.

[Avery Woods]

The story gets worse, Kendall.

[Kendall Vertes]

So why am I, like, on the verge of tears?

[Avery Woods]

He goes, I. I go, I'm not taking a photo with them. And he goes, why won't you take a photo with us? And I said, I'll get canceled.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah, you said, like, just lately I'm gonna get canceled.

[Avery Woods]

I said, I just don't even want to risk it. Like, and I also just, like, I just have no interest. Like, yeah, it's just whatever.

[Unwell Team Member]

Right?

[Avery Woods]

You know, I'm just, like, too old. You're better than me, so. No, girl, live it up. Like, please live it up. So anyways, I go give you your phone. So I take a photo. We'll put an overlay here. Yes. Jazzy and Scotty with these two men. And it is the most in the elevator too, right outside the elevator, like, in the elevator bay. And they're just, like, beaming. Scott is, like, wrapped his hands, like.

[Kendall Vertes]

Wrapped around the grip.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. He's like, so then Scott's dying. So then we. We go to the pool party, and I tell Jazzy. I was like, dude, it's so weird because they followed me. Thunder down under followed me on Tick Tock and Instagram like, the day before.

[Kendall Vertes]

Stop.

[Avery Woods]

So then we go to the pool party. We're, like, up hiding in the cabanas.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

Because I have major social anxiety, but I had to film an ad with Bose, so I was like, I need to go down to the pool area.

[Kendall Vertes]

Okay.

[Avery Woods]

To film in the Bose, like, station.

[Kendall Vertes]

Oh, they had a pop up.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah, they had a pop up. So I get escorted down there, and luckily, there's, like, not a ton of people in that area. So I, like, sneak in, take my videos, and I'm walking out, and there's thousands of people at this pool, right? Yeah. Both those same dudes come up to me. They go, hey, Avery. And I was like, oh, no. And they go, the Thunder down under social team asked us to take a photo with you to post it online. Can we please take a photo? So down pool, in front of, like, everybody, people, they're all staring and taking photos, and I literally glued my hands to my sides, and I said, don't even touch me.

[Kendall Vertes]

And I was like, like, don't blink. Don't breathe.

[Avery Woods]

I said, don't breathe or I'll get canceled.

[Kendall Vertes]

Oh, my God.

[Avery Woods]

I know. So there's a photo of me, and.

[Kendall Vertes]

I'm like, wait, are they, like, praying on your downfall? Like, that was.

[Avery Woods]

No, I think. I think that they just. And then they, like, they want the cloud.

[Kendall Vertes]

They want your clout, and they wanted.

[Avery Woods]

Us to come to the show. And I said, no, I'm not.

[Kendall Vertes]

Wait, that is.

[Avery Woods]

So I said, I fully respect what you do and the way that you.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah, right.

[Avery Woods]

Work hard to keep your bod. But, like, like, Thunder down under is not.

[Kendall Vertes]

I'm okay for now. I'm actually really full.

[Avery Woods]

Thank you. So, yeah, I got a photo with them, and then I look on my Instagram and they, like, tagged me, and I said, oh, God, I'll put that here somewhere.

[Kendall Vertes]

So that's so good.

[Avery Woods]

So how many people are on your roster? Where are we at?

[Kendall Vertes]

We have three active.

[Avery Woods]

Okay.

[Kendall Vertes]

We have a few inactive.

[Avery Woods]

Okay. Are they local here or.

[Kendall Vertes]

They're everywhere. That's the thing. My problem is, like, I travel so much, I don't care where you're from at this point. I love. This is so bad. But I love flying and, like, staying with men.

[Avery Woods]

That's so hot.

[Kendall Vertes]

Like, but. And my mom's like. Like, I've been doing this for so long. Like, she trusts me and, like, I can handle myself in a. In any situation. I love, like, seeing their apartment and them, like, showing me their city and showing me, like, their favorite coffee shops.

[Avery Woods]

Okay, so my question is, am I okay? No, I love it. You're just living your best life.

[Kendall Vertes]

It's so dangerous, though. Like, what if they're all Ted Bundy?

[Avery Woods]

I know. Well, okay, so here's my thing. How can you be so comfortable with, like, someone you don't know?

[Kendall Vertes]

Like, I'm such a people person, like.

[Avery Woods]

Just sleeping in bed with them, you're just, like, fine with it.

[Kendall Vertes]

I literally love it. It's so. It's so exhilarating. The feeling is so exhilarating of, like, meet, like, them picking you up at the airport and, like, you're literally meeting face to face for the first time.

[Avery Woods]

That is so Scott coded because, like, last week he was like, I met a 54 year old. He wants to take me on vacation. I said, literally, yeah, you know, you didn't meet him. I said, you've been talking on Grindr and, like, what? So I'm, like, genuinely concerned. Like, his mother. I'm like, I'm gonna air tag you.

[Kendall Vertes]

I think the most exciting part about it is, like, the unknown. Like, I love the unknown of, like, what if they're like, do they have a toothbrush?

[Avery Woods]

Do you.

[Kendall Vertes]

Three in one.

[Avery Woods]

Like, what's a three in one?

[Kendall Vertes]

Like, the three in one shampoo, conditioner, body wash. Like, three in one. I'm glad you don't know that. I'm really glad you don't know that. I shouldn't know that, but I do, unfortunately.

[Avery Woods]

Okay, so what if, like, their package isn't what we're needing?

[Kendall Vertes]

If it's not packing? It's like, okay, we're already here. Like, let's just get this over with and I'll. I'll see you never. But I have a pretty good radar for packages, so.

[Avery Woods]

Do you.

[Kendall Vertes]

We've actually hit the jackpot almost every single time.

[Avery Woods]

Do you book a returning flight or, like, do you just leave it open?

[Kendall Vertes]

I book a returning flight. But they're so easy to change nowadays. Like, I actually have one of my trips coming up next weekend. Like, I'm actually, like, I'm planning to go to Chicago soon, so you have.

[Avery Woods]

To show me a picture of this guy.

[Kendall Vertes]

He's so hot.

[Avery Woods]

Is he.

[Kendall Vertes]

He's a hockey player. I also have a problem with athletes.

[Avery Woods]

I'm going to a hockey game on Saturday.

[Kendall Vertes]

Who's. Oh, the Kings. Oh, the la. Yeah, they're actually pretty good.

[Avery Woods]

I don't know much about hockey. All I know is that I can dress cute because it's cold in there.

[Kendall Vertes]

And it's like a very fast paced game. Like, they go by fast.

[Avery Woods]

So I have so many questions about this sly era. How do you meet these people? Are you, like, doing Raya?

[Kendall Vertes]

No, I actually got declined from Raya. I.

[Avery Woods]

Do you know how many people I know that are on Raya? That I'm like, how are you?

[Kendall Vertes]

My friends from hometown who, like, not to be, but, like, they don't.

[Avery Woods]

Like, they're not.

[Kendall Vertes]

They're not on social media who are on Raya. And I didn't do referrals. And I think that's why they declined me because I didn't have any, but I submitted my Instagram.

[Avery Woods]

You, like, put Abby as a referral, literally.

[Kendall Vertes]

But the amount of people that say they're like, oh, I'll give you a referral. I'm like, at this point, I don't even care. I just travel so much. Like, I want to see who's on it. Yeah, but it's all the freaks, I'm sure.

[Avery Woods]

So how do you meet people?

[Kendall Vertes]

It's always like, you pop up on my feed. I like your photo, they like your photo, and then they DM you like. It's such, like, romance is so dead. But I love it. Again, like, I love seeing that notification in my DMs.

[Avery Woods]

Okay.

[Kendall Vertes]

I hope none of them are watching this right now.

[Avery Woods]

I respect that. Now. Are you kidding me? They. They're. They're, like, gonna get off to it later. They're gonna be, like, so honored.

[Kendall Vertes]

No, they're gonna be like, this bitch is feening to be a wag, Which I am. I want to be a wag. So badly.

[Avery Woods]

You would be such a hot wag.

[Kendall Vertes]

I just, like, I want to go to your game, and I want to make you dinner when you come home. And, like, I'll do your laundry. And, like, I just love that.

[Avery Woods]

We're gonna clip this for social. Who would you like us to tag? That's a possibility. To be married. To make you a Wagner.

[Kendall Vertes]

We have one on my active roster, but I can't. I can't. Name drop.

[Avery Woods]

No, I got you.

[Kendall Vertes]

But, like, it. He's a football player from.

[Avery Woods]

That's hot.

[Kendall Vertes]

It's really hot. But he's 30 and uses Snapchat.

[Avery Woods]

Okay. I don't mind the age gap, because I.

[Kendall Vertes]

No, I love. I love an older man.

[Avery Woods]

My husband's six years older than me, and, like, people think it's. Oh, my God. You met him when you were 18. He was 24. And I said, yeah. I was also paying for my own health insurance.

[Kendall Vertes]

Literally, kiss my ass.

[Avery Woods]

Like, I was. I was so ahead of my years that anyone that was 18 years old was a little boy.

[Unwell Team Member]

Right.

[Avery Woods]

I didn't want to be with them. No.

[Kendall Vertes]

I think age is, like. It's weird when you're in high school and maybe in college, but, like. Yeah, when we're in our mid-20s, like, it's literally nothing.

[Avery Woods]

I was going to say, like, Also, now I'm 30 and my husband's 36 or 37 now, so it's like, it's nothing. Yeah. Okay, so the thing about Snapchat, I'm going to throw Scott right now.

[Kendall Vertes]

I hate it.

[Avery Woods]

It. Dude, that's the only way he communicates with anyone.

[Kendall Vertes]

Wait, are we serious?

[Unwell Team Member]

Yes.

[Kendall Vertes]

So grow up.

[Avery Woods]

I tell him, thank you.

[Kendall Vertes]

Grow up.

[Avery Woods]

I tell him how toxic that is. I said, why are grown men talking on Snapchat? You don't.

[Kendall Vertes]

He'll literally be like, do you add filters?

[Avery Woods]

No, hold on.

[Kendall Vertes]

Okay, no, not as scrolling.

[Avery Woods]

Listen to this. He'll literally be like, I could see myself marrying him. Like, this is what I would wear at our wedding. Do you have his phone number?

[Unwell Event Announcer]

No.

[Avery Woods]

We talk on Saturday. You don't even have his phone number and you're planning your wedding.

[Kendall Vertes]

Wait, that's also the thing when they DM me and they're like, how. Like, can I. Like, how can I contact you outside of DMs? Like, I always send my number first. Yeah, because I don't want you on Snapchat. But also, like, also, sus.

[Avery Woods]

Why are you talking on Snapchat? Do you have something to hide?

[Kendall Vertes]

It's cheating. I Think Snapchat is the easiest way for guys to cheat. And they still do. And I still fall for it.

[Unwell Event Announcer]

It.

[Kendall Vertes]

But just really trying to be a wag, so anything for the WAG era.

[Avery Woods]

And you will. I could see you, like, out on the field and, like, a hot wag outfit.

[Kendall Vertes]

Oh, like the custom outfits with, like, the name and number on the shirt? Yes, absolutely.

[Avery Woods]

Okay. Yeah, we're manifesting this.

[Kendall Vertes]

We're almost there. We're almost there.

[Avery Woods]

Okay. We're gonna end with some rapid fire. You ready?

[Unwell Event Announcer]

Go.

[Kendall Vertes]

Great.

[Avery Woods]

Okay. What's your favorite city in the world?

[Kendall Vertes]

I loved Milan. Oh, loved Milan. Never been so fun.

[Avery Woods]

Okay. Period. Okay, what's something or someone that makes you happy right now?

[Kendall Vertes]

My family and my roster.

[Unwell Team Member]

Oh.

[Kendall Vertes]

All three of them.

[Avery Woods]

I respect that. Ultimate comfort show Friends.

[Unwell Team Member]

I've never seen it.

[Avery Woods]

I know.

[Kendall Vertes]

I can't fall asleep without it on.

[Avery Woods]

Really?

[Kendall Vertes]

I literally bring my iPad with me just so I can, like, set it up.

[Avery Woods]

Okay.

[Kendall Vertes]

Fall asleep to it.

[Avery Woods]

That's how I'm with Gilmore Girls.

[Unwell Team Member]

Okay.

[Avery Woods]

But same thing.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

I really want to start Friends because I'm obsessed with Jennifer aniston in the 90s. She is.

[Kendall Vertes]

Is so hot. Her outfits, her stylist, her hairstyle, like, every episode. Stunning. And, like, I feel like that era is kind of coming back like that retro, like.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, absolutely.

[Kendall Vertes]

90S.

[Unwell Team Member]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah, I'm obsessed with her. Okay. Beauty product. That's always in your bag.

[Kendall Vertes]

I feel like just a good lip liner.

[Avery Woods]

What's your favorite?

[Kendall Vertes]

I just got the tarte one that they gave us in Vegas.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, we talked about this.

[Kendall Vertes]

Love it. And I also love the Kylie Jenner. Oh, wait. I also just got the road. I like the road one.

[Avery Woods]

The fat one.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah, I like that one a lot.

[Avery Woods]

I think I.

[Kendall Vertes]

Is it, like the kind of brownish? Yeah, I like that.

[Avery Woods]

Lunch is really good. I also love make it forever. Wherever Walnut.

[Kendall Vertes]

Really?

[Unwell Team Member]

Every day.

[Kendall Vertes]

Wait, makeup forever. That's like a.

[Avery Woods]

Wherever Walnuts. Haley's, like, everyday lit before she made.

[Unwell Team Member]

The road, so I literally just have.

[Avery Woods]

Like, a bunch of nubs. It's always sold out.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

Try anywhere. Caffeine or wherever Walnut. You would love them.

[Kendall Vertes]

I do, like, makeup forever. I feel like they're very slept on and they're.

[Unwell Team Member]

They're eye pencils.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[Kendall Vertes]

Oh, I like that.

[Avery Woods]

So you can put it in your mouth instead.

[Kendall Vertes]

Love it. Thank you. Coming from a nurse. So sanitary. I'm dead.

[Avery Woods]

Okay. Would you rather have a chill girls night in or a big night out?

[Kendall Vertes]

I feel like chill girls night in.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, really?

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. I was going to. Well, no. Okay. Yeah. You are a night.

[Kendall Vertes]

I mean, ask me, like, it depends on the day, but for the most part, like, if you mention going home, I'll go home. Like, I'm not the one to like, stay out till 4am and like, wake up and.

[Avery Woods]

But also love, you are like, you're like the reason why I stay out and, like, would have fun. Like, you're like fun energy and like, you make it fun.

[Kendall Vertes]

But the second someone mentions going home, I'm already 10 minutes out.

[Avery Woods]

Because I know if I'm like, I'm tired, you're like, we're out of here.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah, but I love, like, me on a glass of wine with my girls. Love it.

[Avery Woods]

I'm gonna have you over to the new house because I just filled my wine fridge because I came home from Napa. I'm gonna get you some good ass wine.

[Unwell Team Member]

Okay.

[Kendall Vertes]

I'm just moving here.

[Avery Woods]

No. Yeah. I'm like, kind of annoyed that you don't already live here. I kind of keep forgetting that.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yo, I can't. I can't afford to live in Calabasas just yet.

[Avery Woods]

That's not true.

[Kendall Vertes]

No, but I'm so proud of you.

[Avery Woods]

Thank you.

[Kendall Vertes]

That's like a huge. That's huge.

[Avery Woods]

Thank you so much. I appreciate it.

[Kendall Vertes]

Are you so excited to move in? Wait, I didn't mean to say Calabasas. I don't want them knowing where.

[Avery Woods]

No, it's fine. People already know because they're freaks.

[Unwell Team Member]

But.

[Kendall Vertes]

But like, I always see your farmers market.

[Avery Woods]

Dude, my farmers.

[Kendall Vertes]

I'm sure your kitties love that.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah, we drive our golf cart everywhere. It's iconic.

[Kendall Vertes]

Stop. That's so fun. It's like a little bubble.

[Avery Woods]

It really is. And like, I didn't want to come to LA because the city. But we don't live in the city.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah, no, you're far from it.

[Avery Woods]

I only come in to record.

[Unwell Team Member]

Right.

[Avery Woods]

Or, like, if I'm going to an event. But other than that, like, the kids school is five minutes away. The grocery store is five minutes away.

[Kendall Vertes]

That's so nice.

[Avery Woods]

My Pilates studio is five minutes. Everything's within a golf cart.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

Which feels like a little, like, small town.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

You know.

[Kendall Vertes]

Wait, so how did Ziggy and Stevie adjust to a new school?

[Avery Woods]

They love it.

[Kendall Vertes]

Good. Like, Ziggy had kind of a tough age.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. And Ziggy had such a hard time in kindergarten. Like, he was bullied all the time.

[Kendall Vertes]

Well, you don't have to get into.

[Avery Woods]

Him on the playground about like, his duck crocs. And, like, clothes that he was wearing. And then they said he had a funny name and didn't like that he was growing his hair out long and.

[Kendall Vertes]

What?

[Avery Woods]

Just like, really mean kids.

[Unwell Event Announcer]

Kids.

[Unwell Team Member]

Yeah.

[Kendall Vertes]

Did he do it? Does he do a sport?

[Avery Woods]

He does swim and dive, and then he plays golf.

[Kendall Vertes]

Stop, stop. I love that.

[Avery Woods]

Such a good swimmer, both of them.

[Kendall Vertes]

He probably has such good friends, too, through those sports.

[Avery Woods]

Totally. And I love that they're, like, low impact. Not a lot of injuries.

[Unwell Event Announcer]

No, for sure.

[Avery Woods]

Because I get so concerned about football and stuff. So Stevie does dance and soccer, but we left Arizona in March, and so they had a gap of time in between school.

[Kendall Vertes]

Yeah.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. But they did summer camp at their current school, so they met all of their friends in the summer.

[Kendall Vertes]

So when they went to school, that was so smart.

[Avery Woods]

They had so many friends. Like, all their classes were in summer camp.

[Kendall Vertes]

That's good.

[Avery Woods]

And so they already knew so many people and they knew all the teachers on campus, so. Yeah.

[Kendall Vertes]

So it was an easy transition then.

[Avery Woods]

They're thriving. Yeah. You need to come over and meet them. They would love you.

[Kendall Vertes]

I would love to. You can teach, go on golf cart rides.

[Avery Woods]

You know, Scott's gonna be Abby Lee for Halloween.

[Kendall Vertes]

Wait, he was telling me that I need to see all the sounds that he has saved.

[Avery Woods]

Oh, my God. He bought his costume. And I'm gonna make. Make Stevie get in, like, her little tutu and, like, pretend to follow his directions. Yes. He's doing, like, the 1, 2, 3.

[Unwell Team Member]

What?

[Avery Woods]

What's that sound? And he got, like, these balls to put as his tits. Like, like, it's just gonna be.

[Kendall Vertes]

Wait. Moral of the story is, I need Scott on Snapchat. I know we were just on it, but, like, at least Snapchat me, Scott. I mean, come on.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah. You're not gonna catch me dead downloading that app. Scott's like, okay. Yeah. Okay. Well, thank you so much for coming on.

[Kendall Vertes]

Thank you for having me.

[Avery Woods]

I love and adore you so much. Much. Literally. Call me anytime.

[Kendall Vertes]

I will.

[Avery Woods]

And I'm so excited for your unwell journey.

[Kendall Vertes]

Thank you.

[Avery Woods]

Where can everyone find you to follow you on social media?

[Kendall Vertes]

My Instagram is just Kendall Vertez.

[Avery Woods]

You looked at me like, what the.

[Kendall Vertes]

I'm like, wait, I don't even know. Where do people find me? Just Instagram Kendall Vertez. And then my podcast comes out every Thursday, period.

[Unwell Event Announcer]

Yay.

[Kendall Vertes]

Thanks for having me.

[Avery Woods]

Thanks for being here. Cheers. Love you.

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