Chief Change Officer – Episode #424

Guest: Brian Sims
Host: Vince Chan
Airdate: July 8, 2025
Title: When Truth Gets Political — Part Two

Episode Overview

This episode continues the candid and unflinching conversation with Brian Sims—civil rights attorney, former Pennsylvania State Representative, and influential LGBTQ advocate. Host Vince Chan and Sims explore what it means to drive change from inside the system, especially when institutional silence, discrimination, and political inertia try to block progress. The dialogue dives into personal battles, the evolution from advocate to strategist, harnessing data against misinformation, and the responsibility of outgrowing oneself to reshape systems. This is a compelling inside look at the labor and loneliness of transformation—and the hope that persists.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Weight of Being First and Only Out

• Brian Sims’ early experience in the Pennsylvania House after his historic 2012 election ([00:13-06:45])
  • Emphasizes the enormous pressure and visibility as the sole openly LGBTQ member.
  • Notes the strain of working alongside closeted colleagues, many actively supporting anti-LGBTQ legislation.
  • Used his platform to model allyship by championing women's rights, reproductive rights, and racial/ethnic justice.
    • “I introduced a whole bunch of women's rights bills… ethnic intimidation act bills… to show people, yes, I am gay…but I can introduce these bills and show you why that matters… And it did have that effect, which I was grateful for.” — Brian Sims [04:46]
  • Recalls the pivotal, personal moment when his microphone was cut off for attempting to comment on Supreme Court progress for LGBTQ rights, leading to open discrimination on the House floor.
    • “I got a half a word out, and my microphone was cut…My colleagues…were furious… But over the next couple of days… I decided to go out and meet as many of my Republican colleagues as I could… I wanted them to meet me in the context of… we can still talk and meet each other.” — Brian Sims [05:45]

2. The Myth—and Limits—of Common Ground

• Reflects on bipartisan relationships and the reality of allyship in the legislature ([06:45-08:43])
  • Dinners and collaborations existed, but “100% of [my Republican colleagues] voted against every single LGBTQ equality bill that came up in 10 years.”
  • Stresses the difference between professional civility and true friendship or solidarity.
    • “Do I consider this person a friend despite these things? Absolutely not. My friends believe that women are equal… that I should be able to get married. Those are different.” — Brian Sims [07:57]

3. Building and Maintaining Progressive Relationships

• The importance of nurturing authentic, evolving professional and personal connections—even among ideological allies ([08:43-11:04])
  • “All relationships take work, and sometimes the longest relationships require work about finding new ways to refresh them.” — Brian Sims [10:13]
  • Notes the risk of losing ground if common interests aren't reinforced, and contrasts alliances with Republicans (purely transactional) versus Democrats (possibility for real friendship and recurring collaboration).

4. Perseverance Through Legislative Setbacks

• Recounts two major legislative disappointments and their deeper lessons ([11:04-14:09])
  • Attempted amendments to the Equal Pay Act and the Marriage Equality Act—neither passed, one overtaken by federal action, another stymied by institutional sexism and status quo.
  • Observed that powerful men feared giving up privilege for equality.
  • Expresses frustration—and learning—about the limits of individual agency within long civil rights arcs.
    • “It is hard to both be in the moment, present working on something, and be an active student of something…But it is important to understand the history upon which we find ourselves.” — Brian Sims [14:09]
    • “The fact that I wasn't able to pass a bill doesn't mean that I failed. It means that I'M a part of a tapestry of people…that worked on a thing because it was the right thing to do.” — Brian Sims [14:55]

5. Guarding Against Ego and Embracing Growth

• Discusses personal transformation from attention-seeking advocate to strategic, history-minded change architect ([14:09-16:30])
  • “For a lot of my time in office, I was the only person of my kind doing work that no one else was doing and garnering tons of attention for it…If I thought it and I did it, it was the right thing…That is not true, and it's not a good approach.” — Brian Sims [15:27]
  • The dangers of arrogance and the necessity of balancing passion with humility.

6. Combatting Loneliness By Building Community

• Finding sustaining fellowship among similarly motivated, intersectional leaders ([16:30-17:47])
  • Sims now surrounds himself with “four or five closest friends” from diverse backgrounds but united in LGBTQ advocacy.
    • “I didn't have them when I started…I've made them and they've made me friends. And that has had such a profound impact on my ability to keep doing this work. Grateful doesn't fully encapsulate how I feel about them.” — Brian Sims [16:59]

7. Data, Democracy, and Fighting Back Without Getting Burned

• Transition from public office to private sector strategies fighting anti-LGBTQ agendas ([17:47-22:22])
  • Now emphasizes collaborative work, using data to expose discrepancies between politicians’ public stances and their actual voting records.
  • On the power of exposing simple, clear metrics: “Americans are not as anti-LGBTQ as our political leaders…And finding those political leaders that are behaving more anti-equality than their own voters is that the sec this sort of intersection that we look for at where I work.” — Brian Sims [20:09]
  • Warns against confusing “fighting back” with fighting dirty, and instead insists on principled, strategic engagement.
    • “You either run from a burning building or you run into it. And in this case, I think the smartest thing that I can do is run into it with the knowledge that I don't have to light myself on fire while I'm there.” — Brian Sims [22:07]

8. Fighting Polluted Data with Clarity and Simplicity

• Navigating the dangers of media manipulation, data pollution, and voter misinformation ([22:22-27:51])
  • Sims advocates for simplicity and accessibility—using data points that are easy to trust, verify, and repeat.
    • “I can use data to tell any kind of a story…But the more simpler the data, the more simple the equation, the easier it is to understand the story that it is telling.” — Brian Sims [24:09]
  • Changing hearts and minds requires repeated, understandable, and credible information—not overwhelming complexity.
  • Summarizes: “Long term approaches to change are often not huge, big cataclysmic understandings…It is often the culmination of a lot of little opportunities to think about something differently.” — Brian Sims [26:34]

9. Proudest Accomplishment: Changing the Decision Makers

• On what real legacy looks like in transformative politics ([28:44-31:02])
  • Sims feels most gratified by increasing representation of women, people of color, and LGBTQ Americans in government.
    • “More women, more people of color, and more LGBTQ people running for office in the United States right now and winning than ever before, despite everything that's going on…And the more that happens, the more our politics get better.” — Brian Sims [29:20]
  • Emphasizes: systems are improved when decision-makers better reflect the communities they serve, not just when policies change superficially.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “I served with over a dozen closeted elected officials…almost all of whom…were supportive of anti-LGBTQ bills.” — Brian Sims [03:12]
• “When it came down to the moments where it mattered most…100% of them voted against every single LGBTQ equality bill that came up in 10 years.” — Brian Sims [07:30]
• “It seems trite, but it is simple, that…all relationships take work, and sometimes the longest relationships require work about finding new ways to refresh them.” — Brian Sims [10:13]
• “I'm not a failure because a bill didn't pass—I'm part of a tapestry of people working for the right thing.” — Brian Sims [14:55]
• “We’ve confused fighting back with fighting dirty.” — Brian Sims [21:32]
• “The mistake we made is trying to be all things to all people and using data to tell all stories. I’m using data to identify very particular places where a simple, singular message is going to change someone’s ideas…” — Brian Sims [25:27]
• “It’s good to change the minds of decision makers, it's better to change the decision maker.” — Brian Sims [29:06]
• “I'm very proud of that. Very deeply proud of that.” — Brian Sims [31:54]

Important Timestamps

• 00:13–06:45: Early days in office, being silenced, and modeling what an ally looks like.
• 06:45–08:43: On bipartisan relationships and the real limits of common ground.
• 08:43–11:04: Lessons about nurturing relationships within one’s own party.
• 11:04–14:09: Legislative failures, persevering through disappointment, and learning humility.
• 14:09–16:30: Evolution from advocate to strategic change agent.
• 16:30–17:47: Building sustaining community as an antidote to loneliness.
• 17:47–22:22: Strategic advocacy: collaboration, data, and responsible activism.
• 22:22–27:51: Fighting misinformation and building trust with clear, incremental data.
• 28:44–31:02: Increasing representative leadership—Sims’ proudest accomplishment.
• 31:44–32:05: Closing reflections and gratitude.

Tone & Final Takeaways

Brian Sims’ voice is earnest, candid, and unsparing—even about his own missteps. Vince Chan steers with empathy and forward-facing challenge. Listeners are left with a nuanced, pragmatic roadmap for change: genuine allyship, strategic humility, radical transparency, and relationship-building. The journey is lonely, slow, and rarely finished. But as Brian Sims reminds us—in a world hooked on outrage, strategy, clarity, and community win the day.