ChooseFI Ep 577: Health and Fitness Update Plus 'Are Organic Foods Worth It?' with Dr. Bobby Dubois (Dec 15, 2025)

Episode Overview

In this episode, Brad Barrett delivers a comprehensive health and fitness update, sharing his personal journey to optimize longevity and well-being—especially as he enters his late 40s. The episode then shifts to a meticulous, data-driven discussion with Dr. Bobby Dubois (Harvard/JHU-trained physician-scientist and host of "Live Long and Well"), who helps answer a perennial FI-community question: Are organic foods worth the extra cost? Together, they explore evidence for muscle-building regimes, actionable ways to lower health expenses, grocery savings, and how to prioritize your health spending—and finish with a cost-benefit analysis of organics.

Brad’s Personal Health & Fitness Journey

Timestamps: 01:40 – 34:40

Focus: Building Muscle and Staying Fit in Your 40s

Brad’s Mission (01:40):

• Brad, 46, is at his personal peak of health, despite being a lifelong athlete.
• "I want to live a healthy life into my 70s, 80s, and 90s, and I think it starts with what you do in your 20s, 30s, 40s, and 50s." (02:50)
• Caveat: Brad is not a doctor; this is not medical advice.

The Muscle-Building Protocol

Key Principle: Focus on effectiveness, not time or sweat.

Workout Structure (04:40):

• Machine-based, not free weights or barbells.
• 6 exercises, 2 sets each (upper or lower body), in the 5-10 rep range.
• Slow and controlled tempo—especially on the eccentric (lowering) phase (~2 seconds).
• Rest 3–5 minutes between sets: “I’m literally just walking around the gym, resting. I don’t ever walk out sweaty, but my strength and muscle progress have been astounding.” (08:30)
• Track everything meticulously: machine settings, weight, reps.

Quote:
“I’ve never walked out sweaty from this type of workout, but yet I’ve built more muscle than I could possibly imagine. This is for a guy in his 40s!” (07:25)

Beginners’ Advice:

• Start with “white belt mentality” — form over ego.
• Initial results can be profound, especially if you previously plateaued.

Sample Exercises (Upper Body, 15:40):

• Chest press machine
• Lat pull-down or assisted pull-ups
• Shoulder press machine
• Chest-supported row
• Triceps machine
• Dumbbell curls for biceps

(Lower body outlined at 23:10: leg extension, leg curl, leg press, hamstrings, calf, adductor/abductor machines)

Nutrition & Recovery

• Aim for 1 gram of protein per pound of bodyweight. Brad consumes ~180g daily (“which is a lot!”).
• “Oikos Triple Zero Greek yogurt, chicken thighs, Quest protein bars—these are staples for me.” (18:43)
• At least 2 full days rest between sessions of the same muscle group.

Cardio

• Walks: at least 10,000 steps a day, not for magic, but for avoiding sedentarism.
• Zone 2 training: slow, sustainable treadmill work (heart rate in 130s).
• "Zone 2 is about building that all-day pace—it takes years, but it’s really worth it." (28:00)
• Occasional high-intensity intervals (“Norwegian 4x4” intervals), swim sessions, and use of sauna/hot tub 3x/week for cardiovascular/risk-reduction benefits.

Monitoring Health Markers

• Bloodwork annually (Superpower, Function Health).
• For cardiovascular risk: LP(a), ApoB, elective CAC scan ($129 cash pay), carotid ultrasound, possible DEXA body composition scan.
• “You could probably spend four or five hundred dollars a year on [these] and get a remarkable overview for your health.” (32:10)

Cutting Grocery Expenses: Quick Recap

Timestamps: 31:30 – 34:40

• Plan meals in advance to avoid costly, unhealthy, last-minute food options.
• “Embrace leftovers. If you’re someone who says, ‘Oh, I don’t eat leftovers,’ who the heck are you, honestly?” (34:00)
• Build a recipe index for meal simplicity.
• Buy in bulk, freeze extras, and minimize eating out.
• Every $100 cut from your monthly food budget can lower your FI number by $30,000 over a lifetime.

The Truth About Organic Foods: Conversation with Dr. Bobby Dubois

Timestamps: 34:41 – 70:13

Core Question: Are organic foods worth the extra cost—for your health or your financial independence?

1. What Does “Organic” Actually Mean?

Timestamps: 36:12 – 42:32

• Organic ≠ Pesticide-free: “Organic means no synthetic fertilizers or pesticides. That doesn’t mean pesticide-free, just not synthetic ones.” (38:25, Dr. Bobby)
• Conventional ≠ Unsafe.
• USDA organic certification requires extra hoops; many local farmers offer high-quality food not labeled “organic.”

2. The Real Cost of Organic

Timestamps: 39:36 – 42:17

• Americans spend about $3,100/person per year on at-home food. Organic is typically 50% more expensive.
• Dr. Bobby’s market check:
  • Apples: $0.42/lb (conventional) vs. $2.70/lb (organic)
  • Chicken: $5/lb (conventional) vs. $9/lb (free range/organic)
  • Salmon: $8/lb (farm) vs. $17/lb (wild)
• “For a family of 4, it’s about $3,000–$6,000 more per year.” (41:29)
• Farmers markets may be even pricier. “I was spending several dollars for one zucchini at a farmer’s market!” (42:08)

3. Health Benefits: What’s the Evidence?

Timestamps: 42:32 – 46:42

• Most Americans believe conventional food is drenched in pesticides, but “most fruits and vegetables don’t have significant pesticide residue—certainly not at levels that matter.” (43:50)
• Health concerns stem largely from rat studies (bombarded with extreme pesticide doses) or from farm workers using pesticides directly. These situations do not match regular consumer experience.
• “I think what we gotta do is look at non-farm workers, just average people like you and me and your audience.” (44:38)

4. Is There a Disease Risk from Non-Organic?

Timestamps: 44:54 – 49:53

• Observational studies claim organic eaters have lower BMI or cancer, but—crucially—“organic people care more about health, smoke/drink less, exercise more…” (46:18)
• Cancer data: Only 0.6% absolute difference in cancer rates (1.9% vs 1.3%) between high- and low-organic consumers in one large study.
• “You’d have to feed 1,000 people an extra $3-6k/yr in more expensive food to prevent one additional case of cancer… That’s about $300,000 to avoid a single case, not a death.” (49:47)

5. What’s Far More Important than Eating Organic?

Timestamps: 50:26 – 55:13

• Organic costs may force people to buy fewer fruits and vegetables.
• Huge benefit from simply eating more F&V:
  • Going from 2 to 5 servings/day drops cancer risk by 35% and mortality by 13%.
  • “80% of Americans don’t get enough fruits and veggies… that is low-hanging fruit!” (51:50)
• If you must prioritize, the “Dirty Dozen” (berries/blends without peels) are the only organic choices arguably worth paying for. The “Clean 15” (bananas, avocados, etc.) don’t need to be organic.

Quote:
“The benefit is… forget about whether they’re organic or not. Just eat more fruits and veggies.” (51:50)

6. What Else Should You Spend On Instead?

Timestamps: 55:13 – 62:46

• Use your ‘organic premium’ to:
  • Buy more produce.
  • Pay for a gym membership or personal trainer.
  • Invest in better sleep (mattress, Oura/WHOOP ring).
  • Do basic health monitoring (blood panels like Superpower/Function Health).
  • Get a CAC scan (for $129!).
  • Or, simply invest/save it: “$6,000/year invested at 8% over 30 years = $718,000.” (57:01)

7. Testing and Personalization

Timestamps: 60:23 – 64:47

• Experiment on yourself (“n of 1”) for factors like sleep, blood sugar, and response to foods.
• Brad: “With a CGM, I learned that a simple 5-minute walk after a meal can dramatically blunt a glucose spike.” (63:21)

Dr. Bobby:
“The mindset is so powerful… test it in yourself. Does eating gelato spike my sugar? Can I have salt without affecting my blood pressure?” (64:47)

8. Dr. Bobby’s Approach: How He Shops and Eats

Timestamps: 66:45 – 69:04

• At his Madrone Springs Ranch, home-cooked, garden-grown/fresh eggs matter more than organics per se.
• “The healthy, homemade [food]... way outweighs any tiny, tiny organic risk.” (68:18)
• For others: Accommodate guest preferences, allergies, and needs, but doesn’t sweat organic labels himself.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the real ROI of organic:
  “That is $300,000 to avoid one [cancer] case. Not a death—just a case. And that’s your money.” — Dr. Bobby (49:47)
• On what matters:
  “The low-hanging fruit isn’t to buy organic. The low-hanging fruit is to just use some of that $6,000 to buy more fruits and veggies.” — Dr. Bobby (51:50)
• On food planning:
  “If you’re someone who says ‘I don’t eat leftovers’—who the heck are you, honestly?” — Brad (34:00)
• On investment opportunity:
  “$6,000/year at 8% over 30 years—$718,000! That is not insignificant.” — Brad (57:01)
• On making health decisions:
  “There are finite resources, and we have to make decisions based on those finite resources and looking in totality... does it actually produce results based on the real money you’re spending?” — Brad (59:30)
• On home-cooking and health:
  “I think that the healthy homemade way outweighs any tiny, tiny organic risk.” — Dr. Bobby (68:18)

Key Takeaways

• Maximize “effectiveness” in health—reduce wasted effort at the gym, invest in the basics (protein, quality sleep, walks, bloodwork).
• Skip the organic hype—focus on eating more whole foods and veggies, regardless of label.
• Spending thousands on organic for marginal/uncertain benefit? Think instead about all the valuable uses and compounding savings for FI—and how it might let you truly retire (and live) earlier.
• Test, track, and personalize! Your optimal habits may not match the averages.
• Prioritize agency and mindset in health decisions; data beats dogma.

Further Resources

• Dean Turner (trainer): [deanturnertraining.com] — suggested for those wanting detailed programming.
• Dr. Bobby’s podcast: Live Long and Well with Dr. Bobby
• Newsletter: ChooseFI Weekly — Brad’s pulse on all things FI and health.

For questions, feedback, or to suggest follow-ups:

• Email: feedback@choosefi.com
• Or reply to Brad’s newsletter

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