Episode 393 - Robert Stark - Army Veteran, Author, Alaskan

Summary

Podcast Summary: Cleared Hot – Episode 393 with Robert Stark

Introduction

In Episode 393 of Cleared Hot, host Andy Stumpf engages in a profound and heartfelt conversation with Greg Anderson, an Army veteran, author, and Alaskan resident. Throughout the episode, Greg delves into his personal journey of overcoming adversity, the therapeutic power of writing, the challenges of parenting, and the importance of mental health support for veterans. This summary captures the essence of their discussion, highlighting key insights and memorable moments.

Early Struggles and Personal Experiences

Greg Anderson opens up about his tumultuous early adulthood following his military service. Struggling with alcoholism and the aftermath of a failed marriage before turning 20, Greg candidly shares his path to sobriety and personal growth.

"I kicked her to the curb, man, you know, and didn't want to try nothing. And now I'm married again. I'm married. I've been married for five years. And I want this marriage to last for the rest of my life."
— Greg Anderson [00:55]

Greg discusses his initial attempts to find peace post-military through traveling to India in search of inner tranquility amidst the chaos of the country. However, it was only after reaching the Himalayas that he began to experience a semblance of inner peace.

"When I got up north into the Himishal Pradesh, Dharamsala, the mountains, the Himalayas. That's when I really started finding some kind of inner peace."
— Greg Anderson [12:35]

Counseling and Mental Health

The conversation shifts to the significance of counseling in Greg's life. He emphasizes the transformative impact of therapy, despite the challenges in finding the right counselor.

"Counseling has helped, for sure. I just try to be honest about my experiences. I have no illusions that I Am perfect. I probably have made more mistakes than the average person..."
— Greg Anderson [36:13]

Andy and Greg agree on the critical role of mental health support, especially for veterans dealing with PTSD and other psychological burdens. They discuss the stigma surrounding seeking help and the importance of finding a counselor who genuinely connects with one's experiences.

"The key is finding somebody you connect with... Don't give up on talking with somebody. Give up on the person you don't click with."
— Andy Stumpf & Greg Anderson [96:10-96:15]

Family Life and Parenting

Greg shares heartfelt anecdotes about his family life, highlighting the challenges and rewards of parenting. He reflects on the fears and anxieties that come with raising children, especially in a technologically saturated world.

"My counselor reminds me that baby are born as babies, not as teenagers."
— Greg Anderson [13:44]

They discuss strategies for fostering open and honest communication with children, emphasizing the importance of being present and supportive. Greg recounts a poignant moment when his young daughter expressed a desire to run away and get married, prompting deep reflection on the emotions driving such thoughts.

"She was taking deep breaths and all she could say is, I don't know."
— Greg Anderson [40:14]

Writing and Healing

A significant portion of the episode is dedicated to Greg's journey as an author. He speaks about his first book, Warflower, which chronicles his experiences as a soldier and his subsequent struggles with addiction and personal loss.

"Warflower has provided me so much more than monetary or notoriety or popularity."
— Greg Anderson [62:14]

Greg explains how writing served as a therapeutic outlet, helping him process trauma and rebuild his life. He shares touching stories of how his books have impacted readers, fostering connections and encouraging others to seek help.

"Dozens of people... shared the book with the veteran. And the veteran started opening up to their families about things."
— Greg Anderson [60:08]

Reflections on Aging and Health

The duo engages in a candid discussion about aging, health, and the societal shifts surrounding physical well-being. They critique the prevalence of obesity and the societal reluctance to confront health issues head-on.

"I have to take those off the scorecard. That might actually drag me down to like a D on other people's scorecards."
— Greg Anderson [26:08]

Andy and Greg advocate for a disciplined lifestyle, emphasizing the importance of physical activity and mental fortitude in combating degenerative diseases and maintaining overall health.

Conclusion

Episode 393 of Cleared Hot offers a raw and inspirational look into Greg Anderson's life as a veteran, author, and father. Through his storytelling, Greg illustrates the resilience of the human spirit, the healing power of writing, and the enduring importance of family and mental health support. Andy Stumpf and Greg's honest dialogue provides valuable insights for listeners navigating their own challenges, encouraging them to seek discomfort as a pathway to growth and to never shy away from seeking help.

Notable Quotes

• "Life is more about constantly suffering through and working through discomfort."
  — Greg Anderson [05:46]

• "They are an amazing expression of our species. They're tougher than men."
  — Greg Anderson [24:18]

• "Writing is my number one therapy."
  — Greg Anderson [59:42]

• "Communication, I mean, early and dealing with issues before they fester. It's like cancer, man. You gotta attack it at its first sign."
  — Greg Anderson [35:19]

Final Thoughts

This episode serves as a testament to the struggles and triumphs that veterans like Greg Anderson face. It underscores the importance of community, honesty, and proactive mental health care in fostering resilience and meaningful life transformations.

Transcript

[Andy Stumpf]

This episode is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Do you ever think about switching insurance companies to see if you could save some cash? Progressive makes it easy to see if you could save when you bundle your home and auto policies. Try [e-mail] Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates. Potential savings will vary. Not available in all states.

[Greg Anderson]

Okay, I got the red smoke. North and south. West of the smoke. West of the smoke. Okay, copy. West of the smoke.

[Andy Stumpf]

I'm looking at danger close me now.

[Greg Anderson]

Oh wait, baby, give it to me. I mean it.

[Andy Stumpf]

You're clear.

[Greg Anderson]

Hot campaign. Clear not.

[Andy Stumpf]

What questions do you have, sir? You said you had questions.

[Greg Anderson]

I do. The first question.

[Andy Stumpf]

Hold on. How many do we have?

[Greg Anderson]

Well, I know right off top of my head. Yes.

[Andy Stumpf]

Okay.

[Greg Anderson]

There's two. Okay. That I was thinking about and I told myself this morning I can't walk out of here without asking you. So.

[Andy Stumpf]

Okay.

[Greg Anderson]

The first one has to do with the other day. I was listening to one of your full auto Fridays.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yep.

[Greg Anderson]

And you were mentioning having a difficult day.

[Andy Stumpf]

Oh yeah. Calling a woman a dusty old cunt.

[Greg Anderson]

You did?

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah, I did. And still relatively proud of that work. Upon self reflection, I'm happy with it.

[Greg Anderson]

I can't imagine saying that to someone.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah, you can.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, that's true.

[Andy Stumpf]

If they get you to that point. I have to leave out some of the details because it involves family and there are. There was a lot that got me to that point and most of the time, and there's not many times I try not to talk to people like that because I almost always feel bad about it afterwards. Even if I feel like in the moment. Yeah, like that's. That's how you do it. Up one side of somebody and down the other. Most of the time I feel bad about that. Not this time though. Pretty happy with it, but we have to leave the details out. It was a rough day, but it was a combination of. It was one of those days I was talking to a buddy on the phone and he basically said, you met chaos today and seems like you made it to the other side. There were personal issues, professional issues. Another personal issue. A professional issue. And about 2/3 of the way through the day I just started laughing like what the fuck is going on today? Nothing was going. I'm like nothing was going. Right. And yeah. Like I said in the episode though, for whatever reason I kept going back to the headspace of. This is kind of awesome because it gives you this specifically with the. One of the issues was with my older son. Just some legal stuff. It gives you the chance to be the person that those people need, which is pretty cool. And I'm glad I was able to recognize it. There have definitely been times in my life where I was given the opportunity to be that person and I wasn't. You know, you fall short of it and. Or I probably didn't even recognize, hey, this is a really important opportunity because I just was too immature. But that day. Yeah, fuck that day. Today's episode of the podcast is brought to you by Black Rifle Coffee. Hey America, let's talk about coffee not watered down, drive thru blends or beans you can't pronounce. We're talking real American coffee. Black Rifle Coffee veteran, founded roasted. Right here in the usa. Built by those who've worn the uniform to those who've got backbone, grit and love this country. And right now, from June 23rd to July 4th, they're launching the Buy a bag, give a bag campaign. For every order of coffee, they're going to donate a bag to an active duty service member. The mission deliver 15,000 bags straight to the front lines around the globe. Whether you're into something smooth like loyal spirit or you want to get after it with Freedom Fuel or the legendary dark roast Tactisquatch, there's a roast for every kind of patriot ground whole bean or K cups. Every sip supports the ones who serve. And now it literally fuels them too. This summer, don't just drink your coffee. Join the mission and make it count. Head to blackrifflecoffee.com and help deliver 15,000 bags to America's warfighters. Black Rifle Coffee veteran, founded American Roasted. This is America's coffee. Back to the show. The person receiving that comment stopped him.

[Greg Anderson]

In their tracks for just a second, I would imagine.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah, yeah. I also, I didn't share this on that episode. There was another person there that day, also a woman. And I, I did call her a dusty old queef.

[Greg Anderson]

I haven't heard that word in like 15 years.

[Andy Stumpf]

You're welcome. She was also nearly 80. I'm not perfect. I did the best I can. Upon reflection of that comment to her as well. Pretty happy with it.

[Greg Anderson]

I'm glad you went there because what you just said had nothing to do with the question that I was gonna ask.

[Andy Stumpf]

Okay. Far away.

[Greg Anderson]

But it's nice to hear those things. The question was you'd mentioned how at no point during the day did you feel like you had to run away or disappear.

[Andy Stumpf]

You can't.

[Greg Anderson]

And I was wondering if that's something that you believe had came from the values you learned from your father and your mother something that was trained into you and how you've got to that point in your life. Because I feel like so many people want to run away at times.

[Andy Stumpf]

I was just having this conversation with somebody at the coffee shop and at 40. How old are you now?

[Greg Anderson]

40.

[Andy Stumpf]

Okay, so I'm 47. God. My perspective on life has shifted over the years and I don't feel like I'm closer to 50 than I am, you know, 45 or 40.

[Greg Anderson]

You look it.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah, yeah, for sure. I mean, whatever. It just ride it hard and put it away wet, you know what I mean? Skip the ironing, it doesn't matter. Just put everything in the. What was it? Nate Barghazzi COMEDIAN goes, I'll wash a suit and a rug. You know what I mean? Just like, I'm the same way with my life. Throw it all in there, I don't care. Put it on cold, put some detergent. I don't think, you know, everybody wants to, to search for a happy life and I want everybody to be happy, but I don't think that's the reality of life. I think it's more about constantly suffering through and working through discomfort. Some of it paper cut discomfort, some of it maybe hand caught in a paper shredder discomfort, maybe, hopefully not that bad. But I think if you can accept the fact that life is going to be hard at almost all times, you're going to be okay. And that gets back to where did I. Where did I arrive at that mentality or that day. I've had days where I felt like I want to run away. Don't get me wrong, that day, for whatever reason, I feel like I handled it okay. I'll give myself a C on that day. Not for the cunt and queef comment, but. Which would be a cq, but yeah, I have to take those off the scorecard. That might actually drag me down to like a D on other people's scorecards. But for the rest of it, you know what I mean? For me, A plus, of course, double plus, gold star. But stripping that aside, that day I did okay. Um, the broad answer to your question is yes. It's all of those things my parents absolutely set for me, my moral compass. I remember watching my dad and you're a father now.

[Greg Anderson]

I am.

[Andy Stumpf]

How old are your kids?

[Greg Anderson]

I have four now.

[Andy Stumpf]

What is. You are insane.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, well, we just had twins recently or my wife did, so I have a four year old, a two year old and two that are three months old. All in this little 680 square foot house.

[Andy Stumpf]

Fuck you. Which could be a nightmare or the.

[Greg Anderson]

Best blessing I've ever had.

[Andy Stumpf]

So my dad. It's amazing. Children are sponges. My dad was, of course, my first example of a man. Right? And again, this is actually a conversation I was having today as well. Not all men are awesome. And there are plenty of men who start off not being awesome and they find their way. Because I do believe that people can change and they can make choices. But the question I asked this person was, is the father of your child, Would they be proud if their son grew up in their example? That's a fucking tough question. What would he say? What would this person say if I asked him, do you want your son to grow up like you? If that doesn't put you back on your heels a little bit to think. And this. And this will tie into your kids. They're not at the age yet. They're. Because they're young by their processing ability. But I remember my dad and I've worked with him a lot on construction sites and I. And I saw him quite a few times in social interactions, but I never saw him step down from doing the right thing. I saw him get in the middle of confrontations. I saw him squarely telling people to just get fucked right into the sunset. Who deserved it. I saw him stepping up to do the right thing. And I'm sure my father would tell you that always hasn't been the case for him in his life. But those were examples that I saw super early on. And then, you know, my mom, my mother had great examples as well too. Like for her, open, honest communication was essential, right, that she had. Like, I learned a lot of things about, you know, there's IQ and then there's eq, the emotional quotient and how she was able to connect with people and how she talked and God, she possessed a level of empathy that I don't think I'm just possible of. So, like, great lessons to learn from both. Then went into the military and man, if there's one thing that the SEAL community rewards. And again, it's not a perfect community and not everybody lives up to this, but in my sense of like trying to make it, let's romanticize it and try to portray to people that it's a perfect world, which it's not, it's about standing up for what is right. And it's about standing up for people who can't stand up for themselves. And it's about finding bullies and fucking smashing Them. So it's kind of been.

[Greg Anderson]

It's.

[Andy Stumpf]

You know what I mean? It's kind of been reinforced. And nowhere in that when was I ever shown an example of what you need to do when things get hard is turn around and run away because problems chase you. And I have experimented with this in every version of my life. I've gotten on bicycles and tried to run away from my problems. Skateboards, scooters, airplanes. Scooters, scooters. Let's go across the country. Fuck me. They're here waiting. You know what I mean? Like, they're just there waiting for you. So you can run away from your problems and you can be the best long distance runner on earth. They're gonna come find you. So why run? You know, I'd rather. I'd rather be destroyed as a person fighting as hard as I can and have all the bullet holes on the front of my body than all of the entry holes on my back, you know? But yeah, there's a lot of pain associated with that. There's frustration associated with it. There's uncomfortableness associated with that. And I just think that that's okay. I think that's the way it's supposed to be. And that's not fun. Put that shit in a fortune cookie. Life sucks. No, we'll shorten it up. The abridged person. Strap in, cocksucker. Like that. Yeah, so. But I mean. I mean, it's 47 years. I can't really say. 47 years of experience because, I mean, I was shitting in my pants for the first few years of my life. I don't.

[Greg Anderson]

Probably 10 years or 12. I was 15 when I stopped.

[Andy Stumpf]

I've had incidents in my adult life. Some of them are like food poisoning related. You just have a little bit more trust than you should.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, I had that happen in India.

[Andy Stumpf]

That's one place I haven't been. How'd you find your way to India?

[Greg Anderson]

I wanted to go to Sri Lanka.

[Andy Stumpf]

Okay.

[Greg Anderson]

This girlfriend I was with at the time wanted to go to Nepal.

[Andy Stumpf]

God damn. So we started right at the end of us all.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. We didn't work out, unfortunately or fortunately.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah, you never know.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. But so we ended up just flying into India and I spent maybe four and a half months traveling around.

[Andy Stumpf]

Wow.

[Greg Anderson]

Different parts of India. It was when I was 25 or so. I was really seeking that peace of some sort after the military. And I can't say I found a lot of peace there in the wild frantic country of India. But when I got up north into the Himishal Pradesh, Dharamsala, the mountains, the Himalayas.

[Andy Stumpf]

We started talking about, like, the postcard picture.

[Greg Anderson]

Totally, man. Yeah. Where the Dalai Lama lives and all the Tibetan refugees are up there. That's when I really started finding some kind of inner peace.

[Andy Stumpf]

And so have you been able to find it now, wherever you are? Because I. I'm not a spiritual person.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

But I tell you what. If you deal with your shit, Mm. You can find peace and chaos, man.

[Greg Anderson]

No doubt about it. I know that now. The most chaotic place that I'm at at any point is in my house with my kids and just wait, just wait. My counselor reminds me that. That babies are born as babies, not as teenagers.

[Andy Stumpf]

That is true.

[Greg Anderson]

So you can have time to develop those skills that are required for you to be a good parent when they are teenagers. But it seems like that's.

[Andy Stumpf]

Here's what your counselor's not telling you. Children are designed to sharpen their teeth on the bones of their parents. They're going to destroy you. They're going to do everything you don't want them to do. They're going to take all of your life experiences and say, hold my beer, dad. You're telling me that I shouldn't do this? I need to go see it for myself. You're gonna lose sleep. You think this fucking is the natural color of my hair? This gray? I didn't have a single gray hair until I had children. I don't know if that's true at all, but that's what I tell them.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

It is the single most rewarding and utterly terrifying thing that I have ever been a part of. People think combat's hard. Okay?

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

There are aspects of it that are hard. You want to talk about worry? Launch a 16 year old girl into the world. Start meeting her boyfriends. Start. And we also now live in a world, the world you and I grew up in, hypothetically. Sometimes I would tell my parents I was going places that I wasn't. I'm just gonna spend the night at my friend's house. We were not at my friend's house. We were in fucking San Francisco. In the electronic age. Now you can kind of see where your kids are. And Life 360 is an app that I have nothing to do with professionally. Don't get a dime from it. It's a great tool to just track where your loved ones are. You can create circles and there's like little pins. So I get an alert when they come home, which is nice. Not when you're trying to Sneak in the house. And then of course, there's ways around all of this, but I have really open, honest conversations with my kids. I've always told them, tell me the truth. I'm gonna be able to tolerate the truth a lot better than a lie to try to. That will lead us to the truth eventually. Now we got two things we have to deal with. So they're really honest, and sometimes I have to say to them, I need you to shut the fuck up, all right? Because I don't wanna know this.

[Greg Anderson]

It's like that.

[Andy Stumpf]

That honest. Every topic is on the table and it's fantastic. And obviously I'm a little bit tongue in cheek talking about it because I would not give up that level of communication for anything. But then you know what they're up to and God damn, you're worried. Dude, it is. It can be wild.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, I'm getting worried just thinking about it, man. You should live in anxiety.

[Andy Stumpf]

My goal is to really just keep your counselor on the tab for the next two decades. You should live in a state of crippling anxiety and fear. As a parent.

[Greg Anderson]

I feel like that, but I think it's gonna really exponentially grow here in the next 12 years. 15 years, 8 years. 1 year, my 4 year old the other day, she told me we were driving back from our friend's place, we go every Wednesday for dinner. When we were getting back home, she's on my lap driving the car. We pull in park, and she goes, Daddy, when I'm 16, I'm gonna steal the car, run away and get married. I was like, okay, you know, And I really believe her, man. She's just a firecracker, dude.

[Andy Stumpf]

Don't believe everything that somebody who believes in Santa Claus says.

[Greg Anderson]

I believe in Santa Claus.

[Andy Stumpf]

No, you don't. No, you don't. Or the Easter Bunny. Whatever floats your boat, you know, that lays the chocolate eggs. Here's a better question. Where does that come from?

[Greg Anderson]

Where.

[Andy Stumpf]

Where in the ether does a four year old have that level of. I mean, she. What I'll tell you is this. She will never remember saying that. Do you have any memories from being four?

[Greg Anderson]

No.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah, right. I struggle to remember. 40, if I'm being honest. Most days. Been hitting the head a lot. But where, where does that come from? How do. How does she have any understanding of that, that concept or construct? I don't have the answer to that.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, I don't think she really understands.

[Andy Stumpf]

No, not at all.

[Greg Anderson]

What she's saying there. I. I mean, she watches quite a few.

[Andy Stumpf]

She already Knows she's. I have Daddy, and this is how I almost shut his heart off.

[Greg Anderson]

Oh, yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

So, yeah. You stand by.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. She knows that. Yeah. Parenting is. It's the most powerful thing that I've been through. No doubt about it.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah. It's the coolest thing ever, man.

[Greg Anderson]

It is, man. And seeing these kids grow up, seeing my wife give birth. I mean, all four were natural. No pain medication, bad births. She did. Yeah. The twins at home.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

And three of them were at home. One of them came out with a broken arm, unfortunately.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

The other. The other.

[Andy Stumpf]

At that age. She'll be right.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. She healed up in no time.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

But seeing that, I mean, this last one with the twins, it was crazy, man. The whole deal was crazy.

[Andy Stumpf]

Do you have a doula there or some level of medical help?

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, there's a midwife. She's got another midwife with her.

[Andy Stumpf]

Okay.

[Greg Anderson]

And then there's a trained nurse that was there with us with the twins. There were actually three midwives and the trained nurse, so there were four practitioners there.

[Andy Stumpf]

If she had needed a higher level of care. I know you moved, and we can. I definitely want you to kind of bring me up to speed between what's happened since we last talked. You live in Alaska. Spoiler alert. Which I'll probably talk about in the info anyway. So not really a spoiler alert. What would the process have been to get her to a higher level of care should she needed it?

[Greg Anderson]

We live only about 25 miles from hospital.

[Andy Stumpf]

Okay. So closer than you were previously.

[Greg Anderson]

Actually, I didn't move since last time we talked.

[Andy Stumpf]

Oh, okay. I thought you had.

[Greg Anderson]

No.

[Andy Stumpf]

Okay.

[Greg Anderson]

No. I bought the property in 2012, and that's when I moved from Seward to the property where I live now.

[Andy Stumpf]

Okay. If you were in Seward, how far would it have been?

[Greg Anderson]

You can't give. Well, you'd have to fly to Anchorage or Soldotna.

[Andy Stumpf]

Okay.

[Greg Anderson]

And so they don't give birth in Seward anymore.

[Andy Stumpf]

Okay.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

I feel like there's probably some horrible stories associated with that.

[Greg Anderson]

Probably.

[Andy Stumpf]

That's not great.

[Greg Anderson]

People pride themselves on being like the last ones born in Seward, which, you know, teach their own. We all need to feel proud about something, but either way, man.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

My wife. I mean, from the time. I don't know if you ever saw the movie. There's an old Clint Eastwood movie. I think it was called Honky Tonk Man. And in the movie Clint Eastwood, he's just a drunk. He's probably 30, 40 at the time he made the movie. He's a drunk who plays guitar and sings songs as a country guy. Well, at one point, he ends up getting together with this young girl. It's kind of a weird scene. I think she must have been 13, 16, somewhere too young in the movie. And. And he gets with her, and he wakes up the next morning, he's drunk. You're hungover. And she. The first thing she says is, I have conceived. And she swears that she's pregnant. And he's like, oh, no. He starts scrambling, getting out of there. Well, I don't mean to be personal here, but after our second child, my wife and I's sex life kind of plummeted.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah, that's how it goes sometimes.

[Greg Anderson]

That's what I figured. And we didn't run away from each other. And so finally, at one point, we're sitting downstairs and we're talking, and my wife is like, so you. You don't even want to have any more kids, do you? You just. You don't want any more kids? And I was like, savannah, I told you, I want to have six kids. Yeah, of course I want to have kids.

[Andy Stumpf]

Which is psychotic, by the way, but it is moving on.

[Greg Anderson]

But she says. She said, well, how. How are we going to have kids?

[Andy Stumpf]

Well, called the birds and the bees.

[Greg Anderson]

You know, how. So we go upstairs about 15 seconds later.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yep.

[Greg Anderson]

My wife is like. She didn't say I've conceived, but she really felt it.

[Andy Stumpf]

And women's intuition is a thing.

[Greg Anderson]

Isn't that something, man?

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

And I swear to God, the next day, a few days later, she swore that she felt, she says, the squiggle of my powerful seed.

[Andy Stumpf]

Your seed was just tilling, you know, just fertilized dirt. Yeah. I don't know if I buy that last part, but I'll go with the intuition. I don't think you can feel that.

[Greg Anderson]

I don't know what to know either.

[Andy Stumpf]

I'm literally talking out of my ass at this point because I do not have the plumbing parts associated with that or that experience. But I do think there's some intuition associated with it.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

All right.

[Greg Anderson]

And either way, she swore that she was having twins. She just knew, really. And then she started obsessively watching all of these videos about twins.

[Andy Stumpf]

She willed it in.

[Greg Anderson]

I don't know exactly, but maybe we went to a midwife appointment. I don't remember how many weeks in eight weeks, six weeks, whatever.

[Andy Stumpf]

Sounds about right.

[Greg Anderson]

She told the midwife, I really think I'm having twins. She was showing bigger than normal. The midwife's like, you know, I don't. I highly doubt that. And besides, if you are, we might have to get another level of care, because this midwife had never given birth to twins before, and there was only one on the peninsula who had. And so she didn't think it was possible that she was having twins and that she knew she was having twins. My wife told other people, close friends. We don't talk to a lot of people. We live kind of in the middle of nowhere, but that she thought she was having twins again. Everybody's like, no, no, no. There's no way. She just kept meditating on it, thinking about it, watching these videos about it. I mean, just obsessing over the twins. We went to the. I forget what you call the person. Ultrasound technician appointment. And the man there, he's like, is there anything, you know, any concerns, anything you want to talk to us about? And Savannah says, well, the only thing is, I really think I'm having twins. And the guy laughs. He's like, well, I hope not for your sake, because everything will change. It'll be much more difficult, and I highly doubt you're having twins. Okay. We go into the technician's office. He gels up that little wand, puts it on her belly, and right then he says, you're having twins. And. And there were two babies in there. And from that point on, the carrying of those babies for her, what she went through, oh, my God. I mean, you and I can sit here and be like, oh, parenthood. It's so hard. Or combat and all this stuff. Oh, my God. If I had to deal with what my wife went through for nine months times three, I probably would have ran away. But you can't. She couldn't run away.

[Andy Stumpf]

I think it's fair to say that if men were responsible for caring and bearing children, the human species would have been a long time ago, thousands of years ago. We would not be sitting here today, like, nope, we're not doing that.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah, it's. They are an amazing expression of our species. They're tougher than men.

[Greg Anderson]

So tough, dude.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah, they're tougher than men, for sure. Now. You think you're still gonna have two more?

[Greg Anderson]

I really don't know, man. I mean, the rate we're going, it might be a few years, but, man, but we could. You know, you never really know. But we're getting older, too. You know, I was. The other day, I was driving, I was thinking, man, I'm gonna be, like, 60 when my kids are 20, 18. I'm gonna be that old still gonna be okay?

[Andy Stumpf]

I, I believe you're 40 now.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

How old inside, in your head do you think you are? How do you feel?

[Greg Anderson]

Oh man, I, I feel better today than I did in any of my twenties.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

My teens. Healthier. Clear headed.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yes.

[Greg Anderson]

I mean, I don't feel 40. Yesterday I was talking with this dude.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah, my dad's 78. I asked him the same question. He goes 25. Yeah, it's a number, man. My dad's still active out there kicking around.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

You know, you'll be okay.

[Greg Anderson]

I think so too.

[Andy Stumpf]

There was a shift, there was a lexicon shift about activity and exercise and staying active that occurred somewhere after, right around my parents generation. It's just being active is now kind of just a part of life, you know, I mean, people are talking about longevity and you're gonna be okay.

[Greg Anderson]

I love that you say that because I don't know what it's like here, but where I live, I mean, I'll look around whether I'm at the fair or the store and dude, we might be active. Yeah, but people are big, bro.

[Andy Stumpf]

So they're going to die uncomfortable deaths due to type 2 diabetes and get their limbs sawed off. Yeah, I'm not talking about those people.

[Greg Anderson]

Right, right.

[Andy Stumpf]

That is. And there are Some people who 100% have endocrine system issues where it's a real struggle. Most of that is called hand to mouth disease though. An inability to control. I mean, we live in a society in our first world of absolute excess. We throw away more food than most people on planet Earth get access to every day. And then we complain about it on our thousand dollar cell phones, you know? I do, I know, me too. Sometimes then I look at myself in the mirror, I'm like, you're a real piece of you. You proud of yourself and like easy on yourself. On some days I'm like, yeah, today I am proud of myself. That cunt. Those people are gonna struggle. You're not one of those people though.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, I sure hope not. You know, you're not, you're sitting here right, right now. I'm not right now. I think about it.

[Andy Stumpf]

You'd have to go off to become that person.

[Greg Anderson]

I feel that. But I also know, and I'm not here to debate, but I saw a dude the other day when I was loading the plane, you know, he's sitting in the wheelchair and he was probably, I don't know, 60s, but he had, I think it was multiple sclerosis.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

You know, he had no muscles in his hands, his arms, he was so frail.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

I was thinking these types of things come up, man. I mean, sometimes, right. And I'm not going to will them on myself. Like my wife may have willed the twin pregnancy.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yes.

[Greg Anderson]

But I'm also aware that something might happen.

[Andy Stumpf]

Remember though, all degenerative diseases. And for full disclosure, I'm not a doctor, so everything I'm saying is my opinion, not medical fact, because I'm still working on my md. All the degenerative diseases, they start eating away from whenever they kick in. Right. So do you want to start that kicking in when you're already well down towards being a human sloth or as capable and as healthy as possible? Right. So we can't control whether or not we get those. Some of them are genetic, some of them are probably lifestyle based. But if you push yourself to that place of health and are thinking about longevity, yes, you might get that. But at least your Runway is starting from such a better place. Because imagine those people that you're talking about. I call them candle wax people because they look like they've melted. Pretty fucking accurate when you think about it. Imagine starting a degenerative disease from that position versus somebody like yourself. Plus, you want to talk about being a parent, your kids aren't going to end up looking like candle wax people. Or they. There is a chance they could. Of course, I hate absolutes. Much less likely if you don't set that example for them. One of the things that breaks my heart is seeing morbidly obese children.

[Greg Anderson]

I know it, man.

[Andy Stumpf]

They, they didn't, they don't have really a hand in it. And you can oftentimes. See, I can't think of an example, although I'm sure one exists, of two very health conscious people that have a morbidly obese child. I haven't really seen that, but you see the opposite quite often. And I'm not trying to be an asshole. And I know that the struggle is real for some people, but does that mean you should pass that on to your child? I mean, I think the stats show, I want to say 60% of Americans are considered obese. It would be more than that. The government keeps moving the scale as to what the number is to be considered obese, I guess in the hopes of not hurting people's feelings, you know, because that's important.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

Fucking dusty old queefs.

[Greg Anderson]

Do you think they're running away, you know, from.

[Andy Stumpf]

That's a perfect example of what running away looks like instead of facing this. And maybe you're Going to have to fight like your life depends on it. To not go past this threshold of what this number is. Let's just move the number. That's actually a perfect example of running away. I can't think of a single thing in my life that I have run away from that didn't meet me somewhere else. And more often than not, it met me when I didn't want it to. It was even less optimal than if I had turned and faced it.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. You know, so I got the other question for you.

[Andy Stumpf]

Fire away.

[Greg Anderson]

Because before we start going all over.

[Andy Stumpf]

The place, I'm an open book, sir.

[Greg Anderson]

I forget the second question. Perhaps you've answered it in one of your podcasts that I didn't hear, but I just want to hear it face to face. As a man who did get married and divorced before I was 20.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

Didn't take it seriously at all. Was a cold. Got back from my first tour and was just up, dude. And I.

[Andy Stumpf]

That's what 20 year old men are, though, by definition.

[Greg Anderson]

True. Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

You had the military combat experience into that. It's not a good. It wasn't good.

[Greg Anderson]

No. And then you had alcoholism. Active alcoholism is a real pretty picture.

[Andy Stumpf]

Strong work, sir.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, thanks. I did a good job. I don't regret it. I do. But either way, I kicked her to the curb, man, you know, and didn't want to try nothing. And now I'm married again. I'm married. I've been married for five years. And I want this marriage to last for the rest of my life. Now, as someone who also has been divorced with a long marriage behind you, 19 years by, remember correctly, one month.

[Andy Stumpf]

Shy of 20 years.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. What are the things other than the obvious, like you're more emotionally available, intelligent, present.

[Andy Stumpf]

Because I don't know if I can answer any of those questions. I leave those to other people. I appreciate where you're going, but I'm not gonna sit here and say I'm any of those things.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, but you're also present. Maybe not mentally, but you're not on deployments all the time. What are some things that you're doing differently to ensure to the best of your ability that this marriage will last and that you guys will thrive together.

[Andy Stumpf]

Biggest piece of advice is don't let things fester. Don't leave things unsaid. Nothing gets better with time. It really doesn't. Relationships can get better with time if you put the work in. But I am trying, as I get older, to see things more through other people's eyes. And I'M not perfect at this by any stretch. This is a daily practice for me, whether it is somebody who clearly isn't paying attention, is driving like an idiot and cuts you off, right? And your initial reaction is you just. You want to fill in the blank. Describe them colorfully, because you can see that they're on their phone. It's like, okay, they're probably not on their phone for a reason that's worthwhile, but maybe they're also having the worst day of their life, and they are rapidly trying to navigate to somebody that they're trying to help, Right? And I can talk myself off the ledge that way. When I was younger, I would just honk and scream at them and just be as much of an asshole as they are. So trying to see things through other people's eyes. And I can apply that to the lens of a relationship, too. Human beings have immense skills and attributes, but I am not aware of any human. Even though there are some people that will charge you money for this, that can actually read somebody else's mind, Right? I think we can all agree that the tarot card reading and the crystals. Sorry, Greg Anderson. Are total. It's like probably sitting on one right now in exactly the way that you're imagining it and holding two others, you know, just downhill skiing on a set of crystals. But that's just where my mind goes. I can't help it. I can't read anybody else's mind. And one of the biggest things that helps me is when people, more specifically my wife, since we're talking about a marriage, says, hey, this is how I'm feeling and this is why. And sometimes I'm directly associated with the how she's feeling and the why. I would never in a million years try to intentionally do something that made my wife's day, hour, minute, second of her life worse. If she asked me for feedback on something and I knew that she may not appreciate the feedback, but it would help her, I would give her that. You know what I mean? That's just me being honest as a partner. But I would never try to undermine my wife. I would never try to intentionally be mean to my wife. But I don't live inside of the brain of my wife, and she doesn't live inside of mine either. Right? And so by trying to think about that in those terms of I can't read somebody else's brain and how much I value when they can sit down and just actually have a direct conversation with me about, this is what's going on, this is how I feel you may have done this or said this, and this is how it made me feel. Instead of, like, the initial reaction when I had when I was younger is, I'm gonna jump, right? Like, gotta go to DEFCON 5. Gotta go on alert. It's take a breath, try to see that through somebody else's eyes, and then learn from that. And that has helped tremendously. And then just if I'm frustrated about something, whatever it is, this expectation that any other human being has this attuned radar, they might know you're frustrated. But how the are they gonna know what you're frustrated about unless you communicate with them? So communication, I mean, early and dealing with issues before they fester. It's like cancer, man. You gotta attack it at its first sign. Not ten years down the road when you're so symptomatic that you can barely function. That's probably the biggest thing.

[Greg Anderson]

Well, those are huge deals, man.

[Andy Stumpf]

They're not easy.

[Greg Anderson]

It's not. I mean, you say you'll never be mean.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

To your wife.

[Andy Stumpf]

I won't. I don't know if she knows this. She kind of won the lottery. Not a big deal. Thank God she's not in here. I'd be tackled over this table.

[Greg Anderson]

That's hard to do when you feel like you've been attacked or you're called out for something and you're feeling insecure or vulnerable. Choices though, no doubt. Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

Was I attacked or do I feel it?

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, exactly Right.

[Andy Stumpf]

Hard questions to answer objectively if you allow your emotions to override that thought process.

[Greg Anderson]

Y. Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

It's not easy.

[Greg Anderson]

And how have you gotten to this point, being an emotional doctorate? Counseling. I know you mentioned counseling.

[Andy Stumpf]

I've gone through an immense amount of counseling at different times in my life. I do, too. I'm not gonna say that I love it.

[Greg Anderson]

I really do.

[Andy Stumpf]

I love the end result. Because what I'm looking for still to this day is the counselor that does all the work. I just want to talk, and they really need to work on what I say. Give me the solutions, because that's not what it's like, as you know, you go and they fuck you up. And if you think a counselor's gonna do any of the work, well, they do a little bit. I mean, they're a part of it, but it's all on you. And you leave with homework, and that homework could take years, and you have to work through your shit. So counseling has helped, for sure. I just try to be honest about my experiences. I have no illusions that I Am perfect. I probably have made more mistakes than the average person and I probably have repeated mistakes that I shouldn't, more than not. And I just, instead of sweeping that under the rug, I guess it's more of a desire to try to figure out maybe the why and help people do something with it. I'm not qualified to answer the questions I do on Friday. I'm qualified to give my opinion, you know, and I try to preface that specifically on technical stuff. Like there's a few things that I. I may have at one point in my life gotten near an expert level at like sky. If people ask me a skydiving question, I can give you likely a very detailed and nuanced technical answer. However, I am no longer a skydiving professional, so things might have changed. But beyond that stuff, like a really narrow bandwidth of things that I actually spend a lot of time in, all I can give people is my opinion. And I just, I just try to be honest about where I've fallen short, I think in the hopes that it will give people the space to realize they can do the same thing. Because for a long time in my life, I don't think I was able to acknowledge the fact that I had fallen short as much as I had. That's not a good way to live, you know?

[Greg Anderson]

Oh, no doubt.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

Now, as someone who's been through some things combat wise, I'm imagining. I mean, I've never heard you watch them on tv, war stories or whatever.

[Andy Stumpf]

But mostly just watch it on tv.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. But I wonder, do you sometimes go to spaces emotionally that you don't even know why you can't understand?

[Andy Stumpf]

I love how you think I'm like completely in tune with my emotions and I'm like keeping a pulse on it.

[Greg Anderson]

Oh, I don't think I'm like anyone.

[Andy Stumpf]

Hurling through space, dude. I don't know what the fuck's going on.

[Greg Anderson]

Okay.

[Andy Stumpf]

Man. The combat stuff, I don't know what larger impact that has had on my life. It's a unique experience. It has gravity and weight to the choices and actions that you may or may not have to make or do. Because everybody's experience is different. Everybody tolerates it different as well. Some people, it unwinds them and destroys them. Some people, it unwinds them and partially destroys them. But they can grow back to be like the best version of themselves. And everything in between those experiences, though, honestly, I kind of just not like put them in a box and lock them away. I just try to remember that they really only apply to a Super narrow set of criteria, you know what I mean? Like they don't have broad and complete applicability to really anything else. So I try. I mean, I'm thankful for the experiences I had and I don't talk about the combat stuff much, if ever, because I just don't care, you know, I don't think it's a good measuring stick for anybody really. And it was what it was. And I, and I hope that I did a good job. I leave that up to the people that I work with to have that answer. But I think you also have to just recognize it. It is what it is, you know, it's not the end all be all. Just because you were a soldier and might have done a good job overseas, does that mean you're going to be good at business or in relationships? Or does it mean you're qualified for political office? It's like I have hard questions for all of those.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. Yeah. The other day I was sitting with my daughter. She was falling asleep. I hold her hand.

[Andy Stumpf]

This is the one that's gonna steal the car and run off?

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, that's my four year old primrose. And she asked. No, she was crying that night. She was crying, big emotions. Crying and crying and crying. And finally she's winding down. I'm holding her hand, tucking her in. I'm asking her, primrose, why are you crying so much? What's wrong? And she was taking deep breaths and all she could say is, I don't know. And it really made me think about so many people who I know, men myself included, who will go on these roller coasters. Don't know why. Don't know where it comes from. Is it from military? Is it from childhood? Is it just because I didn't have breakfast? Yeah, it could be so many things.

[Andy Stumpf]

Is it a full moon? You never know.

[Greg Anderson]

Did I get a tarot reading? Maybe.

[Andy Stumpf]

Are your crystals running out of power? Do you need to plug them in?

[Greg Anderson]

I love that you're talking like that. My wife's sister owns a store out in Kansas City. That is all.

[Andy Stumpf]

You understand I'm joking, right?

[Greg Anderson]

Okay. All based around crystals and tarot. That's her whole thing.

[Andy Stumpf]

I need you to send me, email me the link to that. Cause I'm gonna send that to Greg Anderson.

[Greg Anderson]

All right. But yeah, going back to the emotional stuff, man. And then sometimes if I'm, I'm, I'm not gonna say I'm in it with my wife, but if I'm feeling distant or detached and I'm not really Wondering why, Because I'm not typically that guy who thinks about the why of everything, but sometimes I do wonder if. And where it comes from, if it's from military stuff. And also, as I was driving here, not to keep rambling, but I was listening. You know, I'm thinking before I came, I was listening to some. Some chants.

[Andy Stumpf]

You don't have to have, like, premeditated questions. It's gonna be okay.

[Greg Anderson]

Oh, yeah. No, I feel that. But I was Gregor. Some Gregorian chance. I was getting chilled out in the sun, doing some writing, and then I got in the car, and I'm like, okay, who do I need to listen to to get amped? And I'm running through Italica, running through it. And John Prine came up, and I was like, you know, not my typical get amped, but I put it in. And the first song that came on was Flashback Blues.

[Andy Stumpf]

I am not familiar.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. And he's singing about detaching from the current situation with his wife because he's going on a flashback. And I know he's a Vietnam veteran. Who knows? I don't know what he did there, but that made me wonder about flashbacks. What is the deal with flashbacks? Are they real? Are they not? What are they? Do you experience them? No.

[Andy Stumpf]

I think this is one where portrayal in movies and TV might have. Might have gotten a little bit out of control. Because for a long time, having never experienced one. And I'm not saying that they're not real. I have never experienced one. Do I often think about things in the past? Sure. But I'm not detached from the present, and I don't feel like I'm teleported or transported. And those are just words that I'm using. I've heard other people say it's a really common movie narrative, like the broken soldier narrative and the flashbacks. And oftentimes, what do they do? They literally will jump back to, like, a scene in the past. I don't know if that's helping anybody by portraying it that way. I do think, and this is, again, based off hearing people are talking with them who have experienced that. It's 100 real for them. I just can't speak to it with any level of personal experience. But I do think the portrayal that people are used to seeing is probably relatively inaccurate. It's not helping anything.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

How about yourself?

[Greg Anderson]

You know, I think I had one. I say, think, no, thank God. Right now, maybe that'd be deja vu from the episode a couple years ago.

[Andy Stumpf]

That would be.

[Greg Anderson]

But I want to first Apologize in case I repeat anything that I said last time because, well, I'm need you.

[Andy Stumpf]

To repeat some of it here because I was going to ask you to bring us up to speed. It helps make the episode stand alone.

[Greg Anderson]

Okay.

[Andy Stumpf]

And that way, because otherwise what people like shit. Pause. Go listen to the other one. Come listen to this one.

[Greg Anderson]

Okay.

[Andy Stumpf]

You can do a little wave top as to before and then. Honestly, I'm fascinated what you've been up to in the years since we talked last.

[Greg Anderson]

And the reason I said that is because I didn't listen to it. Why would I?

[Andy Stumpf]

You know, I have no idea what I'm on either.

[Greg Anderson]

I wouldn't either. But either way, it's the flashback thing I was thinking about on the drive in because of that song. It came on and, you know, I think about six or seven years ago, I was working maybe five years ago. I had just started working with this nonprofit out of Homer. It was called 907 Vets. It was just starting up. I was working as a peer support specialist for a tribe, the Nuneltik Traditional Council, trying to help people get off drugs and alcohol. Having a hard time being successful with that. I can't get them off either way. This organization formed because of it. I started trying to work with vets. A lot of people suffering, you know, holing away. Either way, the organization kind of plummeted. That's not the point of the story. One of the things we did was we went on a charter boat. And I love catching fish. I love being on the water. I can't say I love being around a bunch of other vets. It's kind of one of the things. I don't really hang out with other vets. I'm not really into the talking about it and the stories and whatever. I might be disassociating. I don't know.

[Andy Stumpf]

Well, you might just need a different circle of vets.

[Greg Anderson]

No doubt about it.

[Andy Stumpf]

You know what I mean? Because I know exactly what you're talking about. And sometimes those circles, that is what they like. But those people who like doing that find those circles and other ones connect through that shared experience and talk about everything. But it might just be that particular circle.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. I'm still open to meeting others, but either way, we went out on the water and it was out of Homer Kachemank Bay. It wasn't a rough day. I've never in my life puked because of seasickness. Just to say I have.

[Andy Stumpf]

It's not fun.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

Stays with you for a few days.

[Greg Anderson]

I did Puke. One time I was commercial fishing in Bristol Bay and I ate like a boiled salmon egg sandwich. And I got done eating it and.

[Andy Stumpf]

I puked, like right after you got done eating it? Right after that probably had something to do with the food preparation, sir. Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

But either way, we're there and we're fishing and we're having a good time. And the captain, he was this, you know, prob six foot three, chain smoking guy who smelled like booze. I think he was still drunk. He may have slept on the boat, I don't know exactly. But he keeps coming in back where we're at, fishing and just smoking and smoking. And that smoke was mixing with everything. And the people there. I don't know what. What it was, but we limited out. We caught all of our halibut, all of our rockfish. We didn't fish for salmon. And at one point, all the fish were on deck. They pulled them out to take pictures and there was blood, you know, going around these dead bodies, fish. And guys were celebrating, you know, and they were holding up the picture, holding up the big halibut, the grip and grin. I don't know what you call it, but holding that up and putting the smile on and the smoke was mixing. And all of a sudden I really did feel like I had transported back to my first tour.

[Andy Stumpf]

Man, what an interesting set of circumstances that triggered that. I get that.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. And it was, you know, I'm not trying to be Mr. Detail Oriented Guy, and I by no means want a pat on the back, but in my first book, Warflower, there was a scene that was in it that one of the agents who expressed. Expressed interest wanted me to cut it out because it made the American soldier look bad, look other than honorable. And that's where my mind went. Maybe it was just me thinking, but it felt like more than that. And it was like we had just gotten some. A firefight and there were some dead enemy combatants. And we piled the bodies up, dude. You know, and some of the guys there, they were pissing on them. Yeah, they were taking pictures with them, putting their boots on their heads. And then we got done with that and. And we ended up throwing one of the bodies in the back of the chow truck because it was gonna go back to base. And we were laughing, you know, about how they're gonna open the back of the truck and there's gonna be a dead Iraqi back there. And, you know, we thought it was so funny. I don't think it's funny now, you know, I don't See the humor in it. But something about that moment brought that back to me. And I leaned off the back and I started puking, and I just puked off the boat. And then I end up coming up from the puke. And that captain, he pats me on the shoulder and. And I swear he blows smoke in my face. And he's like, we got a greenhorn on deck. You know, there's one on every boat. And I just didn't have anything to say. I was just.

[Andy Stumpf]

There's nothing to say. Yeah, he's not. Good luck explaining what you just did to somebody who doesn't have that experience.

[Greg Anderson]

That's the only time I've ever experienced something that was so vivid like that.

[Andy Stumpf]

I think it's a good thing you threw up. I would say that is you reconnecting with the person that you are, the story you're telling. I totally get the. Hey, this is going to be fucking hilarious. Context matters.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

Context doesn't mean that what happened is okay. I totally understand everything that you describe, but the throwing up, thinking about that situation is more normal than thinking it's funny. Even though in the moment, I understand the gallows humor of that.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

I think it's a good thing.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

I am not a psychiatrist. A psychologist. Again, for full disclosure. So, dude, what have you been up to the last few years?

[Greg Anderson]

Last few years, man.

[Andy Stumpf]

So, because your book came out, you.

[Greg Anderson]

Were the first one came out forging years ago.

[Andy Stumpf]

Forging it, your path on your own.

[Greg Anderson]

Yep. No doubt about it.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

And then, you know, I'm a writer, dude. That's what I do. I love writing. And I was writing the next one. You know, I'd written the first draft years before, and then I decided after the first one came out to focus on finishing it. I put that one together. It was fun, but also difficult work. Put that one out there in December. We've been working the land. You know, we got 20 acres up there, only about an acre and a half. I just fenced in. I put a fence around 2.75 acres. And so we're just growing the garden larger, growing the family building on to the house, working, you know, doing some substitute teaching, make a little bit of money.

[Andy Stumpf]

What's your favorite subject?

[Greg Anderson]

Pe, Dude. Hands down, man. Come on.

[Andy Stumpf]

My dad taught pe. I was not alive at this time, but I feel like I need to apologize to the students because I can only imagine the shortness of the inseam of the shorts he was wearing with probably athletic tape jammed in the sides, you know, like we're talking acres of upper thigh that he looks like it's Yeti. Just. He got the hair gene for sure. He got your hair gene. My hair gene, and like several other people's. He was such a dumbass. He was gonna trim his beard with a clipper. Did not check to see that the guard was the correct length.

[Greg Anderson]

He was like.

[Andy Stumpf]

So I see him a full walrus mustache, which was the length of his beard. I think it's been two days. He has a better beard than most people would have in two months. That's. And he was probably wearing 4 square inches of fabric as a PE teacher. Knee high socks, for sure. Low tops. I apologize to anybody who saw that.

[Greg Anderson]

May have traumatized some people there.

[Andy Stumpf]

It's kept some therapists turning the lights on and off. But I also. I guess in that era that was kind of normal.

[Greg Anderson]

You know what's scarier?

[Andy Stumpf]

You know what's scarier than that? Short shorts for men are coming back. And I am not a fan.

[Greg Anderson]

I haven't really seen them. But I guess where I live, not many people wear shorts.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah, you live in the middle of fucking nowhere. That's the technical description of where you live. In suburbia, we're starting to see a little competition for who can go shorter.

[Greg Anderson]

You got a pair?

[Andy Stumpf]

No, I was forced to wear a pair. UDT shorts is what we went through training with. Maybe an inch and a half inseam, a lot of bubble gum hanging out. You know what I mean?

[Greg Anderson]

Disgusting.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah, it really was. And I actually think to this day, it was just a cruel joke. Somebody was forced to wear one at some point in time, and they said, you know, what's the best thing to do with generational trauma? Pass it on. That's right.

[Greg Anderson]

I think they did it successfully.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. I always wondered why it is. I mean, this is part of why I never wrestled in school.

[Andy Stumpf]

The singlets.

[Greg Anderson]

Why these boys are forced to wear these little singlets.

[Andy Stumpf]

The singlets is actually functional. You could pro. And that's because, I mean, I started doing. I was doing jiu jitsu when you and I first met. The singlets. I understand from a functional perspective, from a fashion perspective, as a young man, I would have not have had the confidence to be able to wear that. It actually would have stopped me from doing that. It's because of the nature of grappling. They just. They don't want to have much for fingers to get ahold of. Not that you can use the singlet, but, dude, it's just violent. I mean, I guess they get out there full like Spartan style with like a Speedo and olive oil. But also. Who wants to see that?

[Greg Anderson]

Probably a lot of weird as that.

[Andy Stumpf]

Came out of my mouth. I was thinking a lot of people.

[Greg Anderson]

Oh, yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

I don't know, maybe the cheerleading squad would like to see it. They can go give some.

[Greg Anderson]

Dude, that's the thing for me when we're talking about anxiety. Holy cow, man. With the. The kids growing up and the screens and. I mean, I'm not trying to sound Mr. Old Fashioned Conservative, but you'll be okay. Yeah, there's a lot of people who want to see that type of stuff.

[Andy Stumpf]

Think about our parents. I mean, my dad was alive before electricity was created. At least that's what I tell him.

[Greg Anderson]

That's so. No. Okay. No way. Well, what year was that?

[Andy Stumpf]

I think he was born in 1842, but he's like the early 1900s, before anybody even kept track of time. I have had a lot of these conversations with him. He doesn't recognize the world that we're in now, but I bet his parents didn't either. And the legitimately three to four generations ago, there were no cars, man. You know, the Wright brothers was not that long ago.

[Greg Anderson]

It really wasn't.

[Andy Stumpf]

And now we're flying all over the place, let alone doing tourist flights into lower earth orbit. Sorry, Katy Perry, you're not a astronaut, but whatever. I'm also not an expert in aeronautics, but you're going to be okay. The world we came into. I remember the first time I got on the Internet. It was a senior in high school. I was taking a computer class. My kids don't remember a world without the Internet. They're going to be okay. And you are, too.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

I think this is the classic story of every generation, things are changing so rapidly where it's going to destroy everything. It might destroy everything the way that it used to be, but who's to say it's not going to grow into something better than what we could have even possibly imagined?

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, yeah. I try to have that mentality when let's say I'm on the airplane or I'm in the airport and I look around and everybody is on their device. I'm a reader, dude. I brought two books with me. I'm reading.

[Andy Stumpf]

They're not reading.

[Greg Anderson]

I don't. And that's. That's one of the things that I'm telling myself like, okay, they could be reading. And it might be good that these youngsters, they're not reading, have no ability to be bored or to sit in silence without doing something. They've always not. They. I hate to generalize, but many of them, and I tell myself, okay, well, they're gonna be inventing things that change the world and make it a better place and create awesome entertainment for people to enjoy their lives even more. But that judgy side of me is like, dude, why is that all you do?

[Andy Stumpf]

Because it's designed to be addictive. There is a. I think Rogan posted about this. It was. I want to say I'm almost over the top of my skis just by talking about this, but it was a series of photos because I believe it's a photographer. So what he does is he takes pictures of social scenes like that. But then he goes in and he photoshops the device out of their hands. And it's crazy. Everybody's head, you know, it just makes it look really awkward and that their heads are down. I do that sometimes. People watch and it's just interesting. It's like your head is a little bit lower. The devices are designed to be addictive, man. They're trying to monopolize and sell your attention.

[Greg Anderson]

Dude, we're gonna have a whole bunch of buffalo back folks. You know, just that big humpback.

[Andy Stumpf]

We're working for robots within several years anyway, so whatever.

[Greg Anderson]

Gosh, I don't know how the robots are gonna take my work in the dirt jobs. I mean, other than work for them.

[Andy Stumpf]

And you'll get your daily water ration that they're gonna pay you in so they don't rip you from limb to limb. Yeah, yeah. What was the second book about?

[Greg Anderson]

It was.

[Andy Stumpf]

Oh, hold on. How did War Flower do? How was your experience after the podcast? Because we stayed in contact a little bit over a year.

[Greg Anderson]

It was great, man. Yeah. I mean, I'm not going to say I'm like on the level with Jack Ryan or something, but I mean, Jack Carr. Yes.

[Andy Stumpf]

Jack Ryan is a tv. Funny you say that. I was just getting into the Amazon prime series. Jack Ryan, he's the Tom Clancy that's protagonist.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. So I mean the book did good. It's doing good, it's reaching people who are being touched by it.

[Andy Stumpf]

Self published, right?

[Greg Anderson]

Yes, both of them are. Yep. So the first one, I think it. I'm not going to say it like made me hit the scene running because as a self published author, I definitely don't feel a level of respect from the literary community, whether it's in Alaska or outside of it. Like these opportunities aren't presenting themselves to me about like, oh, come on, this. Come to this conference or teach this.

[Andy Stumpf]

Class or would you want to go to the conference?

[Greg Anderson]

No doubt, man. You know, I wouldn't be substitute teaching if I could make money doing other things that involve writing and talking about writing.

[Andy Stumpf]

Just be careful. Getting any sense of self worth from others.

[Greg Anderson]

No doubt about it. But, like, you know, I gotta make some money.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

To feed my kids, to maybe. I mean, I've got like, I. I just reached $5,000 in my retirement account.

[Andy Stumpf]

All right.

[Greg Anderson]

I'm stoked. I'm on my way.

[Andy Stumpf]

Have you considered selling pictures of your feet?

[Greg Anderson]

Not yet.

[Andy Stumpf]

Okay.

[Greg Anderson]

But I might go there.

[Andy Stumpf]

Let's think outside the box. Dirty Alaskan feet might trend somewhere on a website that we're not going to go navigate to because we don't want the FBI coming to where we are.

[Greg Anderson]

That's true. Yeah. Think outside the box. I'm not going to go there, man.

[Andy Stumpf]

You shouldn't.

[Greg Anderson]

I can't. It'll influence my kids to post weird things on the Internet.

[Andy Stumpf]

It might.

[Greg Anderson]

Either way, the book did good. And more than any of that, what it provided me, I believe was and is the family that I have. Man, the healing journey that I went through writing that first one. Taken the years. It took 15 years from start to finish to process the memories, how I remembered them, whether they're real or not. Exactly, I don't know. But. And man, the healing journey from that, you know, it got me to sobriety, which I thank God every day I'm sober and still have been. I was when I met you two years ago. I still am now. I just reached over 10 years. And as a vet and as a human, someone who doesn't use tobacco, doesn't use pharmaceuticals, doesn't use alcohol. I mean, it's pretty rare.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

So I feel really good not trying to boast myself up here about all that.

[Andy Stumpf]

That's. All of those things are very impressive.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. And I feel like I know that my number one therapy has been writing. And I've heard and read so many writers who say, like, don't turn your books into your therapy. Hey, man, I'm not trying to please you with what I'm doing. I know for me, that's what I did with my first book. Now after I did that therapy.

[Andy Stumpf]

Hold on, before you go to the second book, have you had people reach out who were impacted by your book?

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, yeah, I did.

[Andy Stumpf]

Would you trade that for any dollar figure on a check?

[Greg Anderson]

No, man. No way, dude. I mean, in my. My first book, I probably made to this day, no more than $7,000. And I know, exactly.

[Andy Stumpf]

But I've had that impact on people's life, dude.

[Greg Anderson]

I've had dozens of people, and I'm not talking hundreds, but dozens, write me, letters, approach me, whether it was on social media, which I don't have anymore, thank God. But thank myself for making that decision to delete them. But either way, man, those people, a lot of them were veterans or veterans families, family members who then shared the book with the veteran. And the veteran started opening up to their families about things. And, you know, that is way more powerful than any money, any. What do they call it? Literary event or president of the don't Organization number?

[Andy Stumpf]

Either, because let's say it's dozens. Those people are all force multipliers. They are part of somebody's family. They are a part of a social group. It is impossible for you to understand the downstream, potentially cascading effects that those people could have.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

So just because you saw that number. Dude, it's like a pebble in a pond, right?

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, exactly.

[Andy Stumpf]

It just goes on forever. Not that I don't know if a ripple goes on forever in a pond, but this metaphor, it does might stop.

[Greg Anderson]

It's hard to say.

[Andy Stumpf]

I mean, it depends on the size.

[Greg Anderson]

Of the pond, I think, but maybe a big lake or the ocean.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah, man, that's. I mean, that is everything you described are things you should be immensely proud of.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, I feel. I feel real good about it, man.

[Andy Stumpf]

You should.

[Greg Anderson]

And with that more than not going to say more than anything, but it's kind of like me coming here, you know, it's hard for me to justify in my mind flying down here, leaving my four kids and wife with the generator and the chicken chores, and we're just planting right now and all these things, and it costs money. I mean, we're not like plum. I feel very wealthy, no doubt about it.

[Andy Stumpf]

But health and money are not related exactly.

[Greg Anderson]

Just for clarity. But my wife had to remind me that the books I wrote, the ones that are currently out, I'm working on another one now, of course, but they are about me. They're my stories. They're my healing journeys and my experiences, and they're both written about me finding my path in life. Now I have to do things like this. Not for the reader, for the listener, for my wife and family, but I need to do them for me. Because I'm still healing and still growing and trying to be a better person every day. And so, you know, having that support and the justification to spend the money to come down. And now I've been here a couple days. Dude, this place is amazing. It's been like the best experience I could have right now. And it's gonna make me that much better of a dad when I get home because I was starting to get kind of crazy with the sounds all the time. And like, I'm just running away to work, you know, in. In the field I'm working, working, working, because in the house I can't control my babies. In I can't control my 4 year old. And I'm getting all, you know. So either way, that book Warflower, I pray and I swear it has provided me so much more than monetary or notoriety or popularity, although I am strikingly handsome. But I don't think that's from the book.

[Andy Stumpf]

Not connected for sure.

[Greg Anderson]

So, yeah, it's. It's an awesome journey, man. And there's one bookstore back home that this lady, I mean, I heard her on the radio and she said that there were two of her favorite books in the world she ever read. And it's a big reader. One was the Catcher or Catcher in.

[Andy Stumpf]

The Rye, a traditional classic.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. And the next one was my book, Warflower.

[Andy Stumpf]

That's amazing.

[Greg Anderson]

And I just like, I couldn't believe it. Now, the same lady who I really respect as a reader, she read my second book. And when I asked her, I could tell. I went to visit her at her bookstore and I could tell she was trying to kind of get me out the door a little bit. And I knew she had read the book. And finally I had the. Whether it's courage, naivety, whatever it is, to ask, how'd the second one hit you? How did it sit with you? And her face turned red. She was like, it didn't do what Warfire did for me. And, you know, that's good feedback, though.

[Andy Stumpf]

That's honest feedback.

[Greg Anderson]

Exactly. And that's what made me feel so good about it. Because I knew that the first one, when she had told me those things, it was honest. She wasn't just tooting my horn. She didn't have a crush on me, none of that stuff. It was that she really felt that about the first book and the second book. I mean, just like any book, it's not going to be for everybody, you.

[Andy Stumpf]

Know, what's it about?

[Greg Anderson]

So I have a theory. Okay, let me stop there. But it's about. It's broken. Four parts. The first part is about my mother dying and her getting cancer, me going to visit her in her apartment in Seward, and She's living with a boyfriend at the time, I think if you remember correctly, my mother was married to a guy who was in prison.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yes. One of the hotter stories I've ever heard. Worth going back to that episode just for that people.

[Greg Anderson]

And so they were married for 13 years. She divorced him, and then she went through, you know, a string of boyfriends. Not my business. You do your thing. You've been 13 years without intimacy on a physical level. Okay, so at this point, though, she was dating this dude. I hate to sound racist. I'm not in many ways, but, you know, big. Another big black dude, and he's living on her couch. He's not working. And my mom worked at a grocery store. She wasn't making bank, you know, but either way, she's just such a sweetheart. Maybe sometimes a little victim. But bless her heart, I come to visit her in her apartment there, and she got rails, dude. She's whistling, you know, out of her breathing and. And she's swollen. You know, she had been swollen for. It was this gradual swelling process that I didn't recognize until after her death. Swelling of the lymph nodes, swelling of, you know, basically the whole body. She had swollen up over a couple years.

[Andy Stumpf]

Cancer is the most fucked up thing. I lost my mom to cancer as well, and she never did swelling. But it was just honest, I swear to God. You could have put your. You couldn't have. But it seemed as if you could have put your two fingers around her leg. Just. Just a shell of the woman that raised me.

[Greg Anderson]

That had to be tough to watch, bro.

[Andy Stumpf]

This episode is sponsored by Incogni. Let me ask you a question. This is going to be rhetorical, I think, for most people. Have you ever been notified that your information has been part of a data breach by a company that you didn't realize you had ever done anything with, or you're pretty certain that you hadn't, or. How about you subscribe for a free newsletter, and shortly after that, you start receiving spam from a lot of unknown senders. Or maybe you register for a store's loyalty card, and before you know it, you start getting spam in your mailbox, in phone numbers or phone calls, I should say, from numbers that you don't recognize. How does this happen? Well, people are constantly. People, organizations, entities, are constantly trying to gather your personal information and then sell it to anybody who will buy it. Here's what these data companies look for and hold most often. Full name, email, home address, gender, phone number, education, relatives, Social Security number, employment history, and Your shopping habits that is out there in the marketplace being sold. This is where Incogni comes in. It is a personal data removal service. It automatically removes personal information related to you from public websites such as search engines and private databases. Like I mentioned, thousands of companies are collecting, aggregating and trading your personal data without you knowing anything about it. You have the right to request data brokers to delete what information that they have about you and protect your privacy. The bad news is it would take you years to do this manually. Incogni can do the messy work for you automatically. Incogni helps you protect your privacy and take your personal data off the market by reaching out to data brokers on your behalf, requesting your personal data removal and dealing with their objections. They have a new unlimited and family unlimited plan. It's going to give you an extra level of protection. They have a custom removal feature in the unlimited plan and family unlimited plan. And you can point to any people search site or other website where your personal information is visible and one of their privacy agents will take care of the rest for you. Go to incogni.com ClearedHot and use the code ClearedHot to get an exclusive offer of 60% off. That's incogni.com Clearedhot and use the code clearedhot or just click the link below in the show notes to take your personal data off the market back to the show. It's hard.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. So hard, dude. Yeah. So I got there and just a visit and then very quickly I realized we need to get you into the doctor. She had some back pain that was making her not go to work. And she was one of those folks who never miss a day. Yeah. And she had done went to the acupuncturist, the chiropractor, but nobody could tell her what was going on. Give her a little solution that would last for a week or so. And so finally when I heard her breathing. I'm not. I was an EMT trained. I'm not like a medical professional by any means, but I know when you're whistling out of your lungs. Yeah, there's something wrong. You're not getting the oxygen.

[Andy Stumpf]

I know exactly what you're talking about. I'm struggling to describe that. I'm trying to think, is it like air and a radiator coming off? That's not it. I know exactly what you're talking about. I just can't think of a great way to describe it.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, I wish I could too. It's not like a balloon.

[Andy Stumpf]

It's like a wheezing it is exactly right.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, that high pitched on exhale. Yeah, she was hiding it. Make a long story short, I get her into the clinic and within four weeks, she's dead. You know, it was that fast. They found the cancer in her lungs, softball size throughout her whole body. And then the family comes up, you know, her family reunion, the support from the community of Seward. I mean, before that point, I had literally believed my whole life. I was probably 33 when that happened. I thought that you had to be a Navy SEAL or a doctor or a lawyer, a prosecuting attorney, a judge. You had to be someone of great notoriety to make a big difference in this world. But when my mother started dying from cancer, this simple grocery store clerk had waves of people come and visit her, give her support, make photo albums for her, give us thousands of donations to help with the family and food and the people telling the stories during the sickness and afterwards of the impact that her kindness every day in the store, her time and attention, looking at people in the face and asking them how they're doing and then listening. It changed so many people's lives, man. And I don't know if it's going to last forever. I mean, maybe they've already forgotten, I don't know. But the first part of the story was going through that with my mother and being there with her, thankfully, as a sober man at that time, and then dealing with my brother, you know, who wasn't sober at the time, and he's in and out of the picture and he's going through stuff at home and leads to divorce and these things, you know, Family, dude. For some reason, maybe it's because family is very important to me or I always wanted that full house, family. A lot of my writing goes back to family, man. And sometimes it hurts feelings, no doubt about it. But the second part is I. It was before that. I think it kind of goes back and forth. I can't remember. But in 2013, maybe it was 14 thing it was 13 after I'd bought the property. I bought the property in Happy Valley, Alaska with my brother. It was $80,000. 20 acres, unfinished cabin off grid, no electricity. Well, in septic. We're rich. Wealthy, should I say. And we plan on moving out there May 1st. Me, my brother, my brother's girlfriend, slash child mother at the time. We're all going to do this together. They're going to live in the house. I'm going to build a cabin or learn how to build. I probably would have built like a shitty dog house at that time I didn't know anything about building then and I'm still very much a beginner, but either way my technical and mechanical construction skills were basically non dude at that time I just went out there. I had gone to college for sustainable agriculture. I did a one year course working on a farm. And then I worked on another farm in Olympia, Washington. And I wanted to go home and buy land to farm. I thought it would really provide me the purpose and peace that I needed space to write in the summer, to have a connection with my God and have my spiritual practice, which is very important to me for my mental health. And like all great plans, it didn't quite work out like that, you know, I mean, within one week of arriving there, my brother's girlfriend said that she wasn't going to come out, that she was going to stay in Seward with her parents and my nephew was going to stay there with her. So my brother was started going back and forth to Seward and you know, it's 150 miles. And so that's where he was working. Make a long story short, it was a trek for him. Ended up trickling out. Coming back, they end up saying they want to bail out, they don't want the house anymore and then they don't want to pay on the acreage. And you know, we had split. Yeah, we bought this place with the money I'd saved from the military. That was dwindling. That was the down payment. It was for sale by owner. And then at that time I had, man, I can't remember, Maybe it was $750 a month disability.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yep.

[Greg Anderson]

So I wanted to be in a place where my disability would pay the mortgage. The mortgage was $540 and 17 cents. And so if I split that 260, I knew that I could still feed my addictions because at the time I was smoking pot all day and drinking, occasionally smoking tobacco and food, you know, I had to buy. And at that time, I quit smoking pot before it was legal. You know, quickly afterwards it became legal and I'm like, what the hell? Now I could. So either way, it didn't work out. The property didn't work out. A rift formed between my brother and I. He ended up basically accusing me of trying to steal his girlfriend and then bailed out on the property altogether. And I took over the property, this dream of the family farm where he could have his kids and family and I could build a little house for my family, which I wanted, I didn't have at the time. I was Pretty shattered, dude, I ain't gonna lie. And I kind of holed away out there just grinding. I didn't have much money and I quickly spent all that on pot or cigarettes or whatever. And I know tools other than hand tools. I mean, when I got there, I didn't even know what caulking was. You know, you say the word caulk, I think you're pervert. Yeah, no, it actually meant, you know.

[Andy Stumpf]

A U L, K, not ock, but exactly.

[Greg Anderson]

And so I didn't know what the hell I was doing, you know, all across the board. Now I'm running generators.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

Having to be a small time mechanic, small engine. I've got a vehicle that's having problems. I'm not a mechanic. I've got a house that needs finished. I need heat, you know, and then I'm trying to work a farm, which, yeah, I've worked for people who work on a farm, but not the same thing. No, man. So I grinded. I just worked and worked outside. The only thing I knew how to do at that time was labor and labor hard. And so that's what I did. Trying to escape the thoughts, escape the anger towards my brother, the shame towards my mother, who's now in this dating phase. From one week a cop to the next week this huge black dude that nobody wants around because he's doing bad stuff. And it's like. So I just hold a way out there working and working. And you know, I believe that isolation, man. There's a difference between seclusion, introspection, time for meditation and then just isolating. And a guy like me, isolation isn't good. And so I went down that suicide route, man, you know, and there was at one point I had adopted a dog. There's my brother's dog. He adopted her, a Saint Bernard, great dog. But she was about to be put down because she was kept on a short runner at a friend's house and she had tried to bite a couple people. Supposedly her mom was put down because she was hyper aggressive. And they were kind of of the belief system that it's passed down. And I'm not a dog expert, but they were about to put her down. My brother adopted the dog. He's walking the dog on the beach. He's like, this is the dog we're gonna bring out there. He's got this tight chain on her. And I learned a lesson that day not to lean down when I'm petting a new dog. They'll bite at you, dude. Try to bite my face, man. This Big jaws on the St. Bernard. And, you know, I back up. I'm like, this is the dog we're adopting? What the hell? Well, about a week and a half later, two weeks later, that dog was mine because my brother wasn't taking it. And so we had that riff. She trying to dominate me. I'm not a dog expert and I know things that I did with that dog probably aren't what Cesar Millan would say. I wasn't the soft handed guy with that dog.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

I thought that dogs and try to kill me, try to corner me, you know, I punched that dog in the face as hard as I could, dude. And it's not very hard. I'm not a very strong guy, you know, but. Whoo. We ended up finding out who was boss. And I only had to do it one time. Another time, I swung a shovel at her head, dude. And I stopped like inches away. I was so mad. She's trying to bite my neighbor, dude. It's like. And from that point on, we started having just a great relationship of me being in charge, you know, she lessened the aggression towards me and, you know, she kind of lived a great life away from a lot of people. She started warming up. Mega. Long story short, I spiraled. The alcohol, the pot, which works as a depressant for me, for many people. Yeah. Getting deeper in debt. You know, I thought I could make it with my disability and not a job. I thought by that point I was going to be like a New York Times best selling author. But I hadn't even shared my writing with anyone. I thought this newspaper job I was doing a column for out of Seward was going to pay me enough to keep doing what I was doing. And I was all wrong. You know, I didn't have good planning. I'm not going to lie. And. And it all spiraled down, you know, Too deep in debt for my credit to even get any more money, you know, I was like $12,000 in debt with that thing. And the only thought that I had of escaping was killing myself, dude. And So I took my.30 06 bolt action, locked one in, went and sat down at the base of a spruce tree, where now I have a Hannek hunger. And I just sat there feeling sorry for myself, dude. You know, nobody cares. Doing the whole pity cycle, man. Many of us.

[Andy Stumpf]

What were you gonna go with? You gonna use the toe, pull the trigger?

[Greg Anderson]

I was, you know, I was thinking just the thumb.

[Andy Stumpf]

Could you reach it?

[Greg Anderson]

I could.

[Andy Stumpf]

All right.

[Greg Anderson]

I could. Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

And it's a complicated Issue when you talk long rifles.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

Not to make light of suicide, but my head immediately went to logistics on that.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. And, you know, I'm sitting there and I'm going down this route of just negative thinking, man. Not seeing any light, no gratitude, no options, feeling trapped. I don't know about you, man, but when I start feeling trapped, it's not a good place.

[Andy Stumpf]

It's not a good place for anybody.

[Greg Anderson]

Exactly, dude. And so I'm sitting there and, you know, who knows if I was actually going to do anything? I'm probably. I'm not going to say brave enough. I don't know what the words are, but I probably couldn't do it. But I was telling myself I was going to. And right when I was thinking I was going to pull the trigger, my thumb was on there and off to safety. That dog started whining, dude. And she was right around the tree. She started crying for me. And I stopped and I looked at her. I'm like, you know, I'm mean. At that point, I was mean. I'm like, what? What the fuck do you want? Like, I can't provide anything for you, you know, you don't need me. You'll be better off with someone else taking care of you. Go to the neighbors. I mean, anything I could do to push the dog away. Like, I've pushed so many people away my whole life. And that dog crept around that tree and kept crying, man, and just staring at me, dude, with them brown doe eyes.

[Andy Stumpf]

And.

[Greg Anderson]

And I realized, well, maybe I convinced myself or she convinced me that she needed me to feed her, that she needed me to take care of her, that she wanted to love me and she needed me to love her. And so, man, I put the rifle down and I just cried. And she came over, she put her head on my lap, and I sat there for I don't know how long, man. I'd like to say like, four hours. Maybe it's five seconds, I don't know, you know? But I just cried, dude. And I. I'm not gonna say I'm not a big cry. I basically cry in any movie. But real life shit, I don't cry very often, man. You know, my mom died. Like, I didn't cry. Just gotta move forward. Gotta move forward, you know? But at that point, it was like all this stuff came out of me and I just cried and cried. And so after that, I thought the best thing I could do was go back to Seward and not be around people. This was like the only option I thought I didn't have much money. I had no money. But I knew I could get work in Seward, whether for a newspaper, restaurant, Boys and Girls Club. I'm the guy to work at the Boys and Girls Club. Doesn't sound like a very healthy fit, but I could put on a mask, man. And so that's what I did. I left the homestead, locked the door, and went back to Seward, where I was able to rent a cabin for like 450 bucks and start working in a restaurant. Making enough money for that and to pay off my debt. After I wintered there that year, probably 2014, 2013 actually, still, I was gonna go back to my property because I was gonna work again. I was motivated again, got rebuilt. I hauled away playing guitar. You know, I love playing music and singing songs and writing songs. I got a lot out of me. Thought I had a good handful of songs, if not a CD worth. And my book, I'd done a lot of work on it, man. Not to mention a lot of other writings. I'm just a writer, you know. And so I was like, okay, I'm gonna go back. Well, I still wasn't completely out of debt. And I knew. Well, I didn't know. I knew. I thought if I went back to Happy Valley, I would have to get a job. And the jobs are further away than in Seward, and I didn't know anyone there. And so I know that in Seward at least, people know me as someone who works hard and I could find work. And the industry in Seward is so fast paced in the tour season that at that point I was working as a busser. You know, I'm a 32 year old war vet and I'm busing tables, having an 18 year old kid train me, which was great for me. You know, I needed that humility and I didn't want to talk to all the people. And I was able to make like 300 bucks a night, you know, just cash, not to mention the hourly rate. Very quickly I paid off the debt, stayed there for the summer. And then I decided I was gonna take all of my money that I had saved out of the bank and I was gonna ride a motorcycle into Mexico. That was like my plan. I had been through a couple girlfriends during that summer, trying to get back out there and open myself up again. And, man, the hurt that can come from that boy.

[Andy Stumpf]

So makes the long distance motorcycle ride seem appealing.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, it did. So that's what I did, man. I took out 10,000 bucks from the bank. I didn't realize it was so hard to take out all your money at one time, put it in an envelope, flew down to Washington, bought a KLR 650 outside of Eugene, Oregon, and then rode down through California into Mexico. Quickly had to turn around. I'm not a good planner. I ain't going to lie. I didn't have the permits or even a license for the motorcycle insurance, anything. I was just riding.

[Andy Stumpf]

Perfect.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. And no, I had no phone, no compass, no map. I just. I was going, man. And, you know, over the years, it's funny because I thought of you when I was finishing my book. I thought to myself, what would Andy. I mean, it's not like I wear the fucking bracelet. Excuse my language, wwjd, but wwad. I'm not like that. But I was thinking, what would Andy and his SEAL buddies do or think, these special ops guys, regarding this character in this book who just goes with no plan. No idea.

[Andy Stumpf]

I respect it.

[Greg Anderson]

No. No idea how much money was in this wall in this envelope he's just spending. And I almost changed a couple of the little parts of it to at least be like, he's got a compass or he bought a map at this gas station.

[Andy Stumpf]

Most people would be envious of that level of just go of. Let's pick a direction. And honestly, anybody listening to this, if you can't be envious of that a little bit because you're describing in many ways, freedom.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

Straight up, boundaried freedom. Because eventually the envelope will run thinnest. But, yeah, most of the guys I work with would probably say, that's awesome.

[Greg Anderson]

That's neat, man. Because I was really feeling insecure about that part of it.

[Andy Stumpf]

It's not a precise military operation. You're literally. To me, it sounds like, you know, here's the thing. You don't need a compass to find yourself because the compass points to magnetic north.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

That may not be where you yourself is. So they would respect the journey.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. And I brought that up to my counselor, you know, and he had said to me. He had me reframe the whole thing in the sense where he said he works with. I mean, he couldn't give me numbers, but many men, most veterans who don't take that leap.

[Andy Stumpf]

Oh, for sure.

[Greg Anderson]

Who hide and hole away and don't risk the unknown or take those leaps in the unknown out of discomfort, out of fear, out of all these things. But for me to do that, it showed great courage, and it actually makes the main character seem more courageous than idiotic, I'd say. And so I would think so, yeah. Either way, that's what I did. And I ended up holing away. I found this little trailer park in Pinos Altos, New Mexico. And I had ridden and ridden and ridden, gotten to Mexico, turned around. I was only there for literally, like four hours, but I made it to Mexico and I got turned around and I was like, at the border. I'm thinking, where am I gonna go? Okay, well, I heard some really great things about this Silver City, New Mexico. So I'll just ride up to there. And I'm riding there. And of course, it was one of two times my headlight went out and it was dark, and I was riding like, as close to the vehicle in front of me, of course, as I could get.

[Andy Stumpf]

Call that drafting.

[Greg Anderson]

And I found myself at a hotel there in Silver City, just doing the same thing I'd done in Happy Valley. Just fucking drinking, feeling sorry for myself, smoking cigarettes, just chain smoking outside, watching westerns and Steven Skoll movies, which is what was on tv. I'm not a huge fan of the guy myself, but either way, it was there. And I told myself, I'm gonna ride to this hot springs and this cliff dwellings out in past Pinos Altos. The Gila Forest. Gila National Forest. And I ride out there and it's just this awesome, slow, winding, just beautiful road. I rode through this little town of Pinos Altos that was like one western bar and an old fort and a really neat church that wasn't in operation. And then I kept riding, and when I got to that cliff dwellings, I'm an imaginary guy. And I'm sitting there and I'm looking around the space and I'm just visualizing these native people hundreds of years before. I'm not a factual guy when it comes to history and stuff. So I don't know when they were there conceptually. Maybe it was thousands of years, I don't know. But either way, I decided I'm gonna stay here. Dude, this feels right for me right now. I need to find a place to rent so I can write and process some of this shit and be sober for a little bit. Because I'm on a train again and it's not bound to someplace nice. So I drive back towards or I ride back towards Pinos Altos. There's a couple cabins along the way. I stop and I asked them about it, and, you know, they're 90 bucks a night, 100 something. And I'm like, there's no way that I can afford that. I'm gonna Spend all my money. Well, I find this little trailer park and the lady told, tells me I can get this little trailer for. I mean, I had everything that I needed more than I had at my house at that time, like a nice proper kitchen and heat and all these things. And it was like 75 bucks for the week. So I was like, all right, I'm just gonna hole away here and get sober. And right. Well, very quickly, like within hours, I started meeting this group of three older men in their 60s, 70s, one was in his 80s who were sitting around a campfire just shooting the man. So basically, like more than half of the book is about us sitting around a campfire, shooting, learning life's lessons, gaining courage and resilience through learning what they had been through, coupled with some isolation, still drinking myself into fucking oblivion, dealing with war that's coming up with me, and still feeling kind of pissed off about my brother fucking over the deal. Excuse my language.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah, no, it is what it is, man.

[Greg Anderson]

And so. And then not to keep going. The third part is about my dad, my father dying. And as you know, I didn't know my father. I met him twice and they weren't really the greatest experiences. And when he died, my brother and I went out to his place. He lived in a car, you know, he was living in a car out in the middle of the woods in Oregon for years and years. And so we went to my uncle's place in Idaho and went through his. His vehicle with all of his belongings. And then that part of the book is basically me processing grown ups out of dad, dude. Always wondering what it would be like to have a dad. Always wanting to be more like these other guys, but using no dad as an excuse or up dads, you know, and so going through that process in the book. So there's a lot of grief, I think, in the book. And then the fourth part is on the property with my family. And so it ends, I believe, with hope, with peace, with. I've got kids out there now, two of them at the time of the writing. A beautiful wife. We've done so much work to the land. I've gained the skills and I always wanted. It was part of why I bought the place. Both mechanical, carpenterial, if that's a word, a lot of janitorial.

[Andy Stumpf]

I don't know if it is, but I like that word.

[Greg Anderson]

Thanks.

[Andy Stumpf]

Carpeterial. Hey, I'll use that later today, out of context.

[Greg Anderson]

And so, yeah, that's where it ends. Is back on the property doing what I sought out to Do. And. And you know this book. My theory to go back to the theory is, and I hate to keep bringing up my counselor, but, man, I think it's such a hot issue that needs to be talked about is counseling.

[Andy Stumpf]

Dude, I don't ever shut up about it either. And I actually, at this point, if you listen to the show, I'll say, I know people are tired of hearing about this, but I'm not stopping. Yeah, I refuse to. It has too much impact.

[Greg Anderson]

Me, too. I've had the same one now for six years.

[Andy Stumpf]

That's the key is finding somebody you connect with.

[Greg Anderson]

No doubt about it.

[Andy Stumpf]

And I'm so tired of this bullshit. I can't talk to somebody who doesn't have the same experience as me because then really, a combat vet would only be able to talk to a dude who was a combat vet who decided to become a counselor, probably because of his own good experiences with counseling. That is, although an enticing excuse, it is an excuse. You can 100% connect with people that don't share the same experiences. Don't put objections in front of yourself. The world will put up enough objections for you. You don't need to place them in front of you.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, I mean, I had one great counselor that really broke some of the boundaries and rules. I mean, when I was living by myself in Happy Valley, we talked hand jobs or. No, no, not that far, but turkey dinners, you know, delivering turkey meals to.

[Andy Stumpf]

My house, one may lead to the other, sir.

[Greg Anderson]

Thank God it didn't. There's an age difference there, but. And then I went through. Yeah, I went through a couple after that. I think three that it just didn't jive with.

[Andy Stumpf]

And that's the move. You go find somebody else.

[Greg Anderson]

Exactly. Right.

[Andy Stumpf]

Don't give up on talking with somebody. Give up on the person you don't click with.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, and the reason I brought that up is because I talked with him after the book came out and I told my theory because I, you know, I'm selling some of the books, whatever. I mean, the sales on the second one are way lower than the first one.

[Andy Stumpf]

Well, what's the second one called?

[Greg Anderson]

It's called Just Like a Soldier.

[Andy Stumpf]

Okay. But this helps with marketing. Just so you know, your description of it was amazing. At no point in time did you say what it was called.

[Greg Anderson]

I'm really not good at that, but yeah. So my theory is that the first one was such a hit for those who read it because many Americans and others, they really are patriotic. They love their country, they want to support Their veterans, they're very thankful for the service that we've done and they don't really know how well, they want to read about the stories that we went through while we're there. And then Warflower, about a quarter of it, if not half, is the first two weeks after getting out. And that struggle, like, I just came back from Iraq and now I'm out and I'm like 22, divorced, drunk, cool. What the hell do I do?

[Andy Stumpf]

And just like a rocket being shot into space.

[Greg Anderson]

Totally, dude. Yeah. Now the second one we're talking about fast forward 10 years.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

You know, there's not. I don't know, there might be one war story. I wasn't in a place anymore of writing the war stories. I dumped them in Warflower and. And I don't really think about them that much anymore, you know, and. But still the traditional American. I'm not going to say all of them, but path would have been get out, get my GI Bill, find that career to go down, maybe be like, you know, some big name CEO guy of some company using my leadership skills or whatever. Which I didn't really have any, but. But instead mine was just like I was still a fucking shit show.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

You know, and still an addiction. Still feeling sorry for myself, still just jumping at opportunities, whether they're girls, whether they're a motorcycle adventure, just running, dude, running and running, man. And. And I think that that can sometimes be hard for the public to support the veteran when they're in that space because it's like, dude, it's time to buck up.

[Andy Stumpf]

Well, it's the same as supporting a family member that's in that space.

[Greg Anderson]

Exactly.

[Andy Stumpf]

You don't know you. There's nothing you wouldn't do. You'd give them your last breath and your last drop of blood, but you don't know how because you can't figure out what the going on.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

You know, I agree with you. I think that that desire is there for sure.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, it's.

[Andy Stumpf]

You know, nothing in life is black and white.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

I'm sure people have perfect transitions from impeccable military career, crystal clear transition, and they're off to the next. For most people, it's a little bit more gray like you're describing. And you could argue about degree and kind and all that stuff, but. Yeah, it's rough, man.

[Greg Anderson]

It really is. And should it go back to what you're asking regarding, like, what have you been doing? Mm. You know, it's. It's a strange, slow life that I live, which is How Just Like a Soldier ends. And I think that's another part for readers. I mean, I. I'm not going to say I studied the market intensively, but I do know that people typically want action. They want to turn the pages fast, and they want a hero, and they don't really want to read or watch movies that are just slow, man, boring.

[Andy Stumpf]

Be careful of audience capture. It's. It's one thing that I have refused to do with this show. If people ask me for my opinion, I will. I will give it to them. They can agree with the opinion, they can disagree with the opinion, but I don't make content based off of what people are demanding. Yeah, because if people recognize that that's happening, then you are no longer in control.

[Greg Anderson]

Exactly. Right. Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

So write whatever you want, man.

[Greg Anderson]

I am.

[Andy Stumpf]

And if you wanted to go down the audience capture route, just write a fiction book right then. Because then you can unleash your creative side and you can kind of target that. Because maybe they. Who fucking knows, right? Maybe they do want that. Maybe some, maybe don't. But then without losing your authenticity, you could pursue that path a little bit.

[Greg Anderson]

Exactly.

[Andy Stumpf]

But if it's going to be true to you, be wary of audience capture. It's a real thing. No doubt about it, people. And all of a sudden you're like, whoa, who's that guy? Where'd he go?

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. And I mean, that's exactly where I went with the second book. And thinking about that of like, okay, I finished this thing, and then I have to start thinking, what's the audience? Who's going to read it? Why are they going to read it? And I kept thinking, I talked to my counselor about it, talk to my wife about it. I don't have many friends where I live, and I don't have many as it is. You know, I like to keep my circle small, but I bounce the idea off of them. Do I need to add more war stories? And the truth of the matter is, the reason I thought about adding more war stories was just to please an audience. Even if that character at that time in the writing or me today isn't living in that space anymore. If my day, if the biggest conflict that I'm finding is my tractor isn't able to turn my compost because it's frozen. I'm like, God damn it, it's frozen. I can write about that. I don't need to go back to the war space all the time, flashing.

[Andy Stumpf]

Back to the streets of Iraq in the summer where the compost was not Frozen. I have a book coming out April 14th of 2026. Zero war stories. Not a single fucking one.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

Refused to do it, I think. I told this story about the night I got shot, and I wrote it like this. I went over a wall. I got shot. I fell down. The end. That was it. And I think a few more words, but. Zero.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

Zero. Are they entertaining? Depends on what the story is and where you're viewing the story from. Some stories may seem entertaining to the other side, the reader. And I had to live through that. And it's far less entertaining to me. But what impact does it have? So. And the publisher was. Was happy with it.

[Greg Anderson]

Dude, I've been dying to hear about your book and your writing journey. Like, what does it look like? What's your writing life like?

[Andy Stumpf]

Sporadic.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

It begins with sitting down in front of a laptop.

[Greg Anderson]

You write on a laptop?

[Andy Stumpf]

I do. What are you going with? A quill and handmade fucking paper.

[Greg Anderson]

Ink on my pen or on walls.

[Andy Stumpf]

I would write when I felt like I was able to, and I would not when I didn't. And I finished it early. I did probably a thousand words to 1500 when I felt like it. Sometimes I would crank out 10,000 in a day. I would go back. The way I write is I kind of vomited out. And then I'll go back and I carve it away.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

It's funny, you know. You write a page at a time, and the next thing, I think the book's 280 pages.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. What's it called?

[Andy Stumpf]

Drown Proof.

[Greg Anderson]

Drown Proof. All right.

[Andy Stumpf]

I'll show you the COVID art. You'll be the first person to see this. You're not allowed to show this to anybody.

[Greg Anderson]

And who are you publishing through?

[Andy Stumpf]

St. Martin's Press.

[Greg Anderson]

Good for you, man. You made it, bro. This guy made it.

[Andy Stumpf]

I don't know about that.

[Greg Anderson]

I won't let them see this.

[Andy Stumpf]

They did all the, like, colorful stuff. Like, they made it look good.

[Greg Anderson]

This is going to be a hit.

[Andy Stumpf]

We'll see. Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

How exciting, man.

[Andy Stumpf]

I don't know, because I've been. Wow. So I just actually handed back my edits were due the seventh. So two days ago. Because it went through a legal review. A grammatical review. Thank God.

[Greg Anderson]

Because.

[Andy Stumpf]

Colon, semicolon. I got an idea. Let's flip a coin. Don't know. Grammatical. And then some content. Very light content recommendations. Thank God somebody learned in the English language went through for the. The writing portion.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

So that is back in. I needed to upscale some of the pictures that I put in they're all going to be black and white just through the book without. I guess there's two choices. You can do like, the color section in the middle. You see it very commonly. And I went with just black and white pictures kind of throughout. And. Yeah, I think I'm done.

[Greg Anderson]

Wow.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah, I don't. I think there will be an audiobook and I think I have the first writer refusal to read it, but I'll cross that bridge when I go. We're like 11 months away.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

So we'll see. Maybe it'll be good. Maybe it'll suck. The most massive dong anybody's ever seen.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. But how do you feel? I think, you know, if two. I forgot feels good.

[Andy Stumpf]

I looked at it so many times and edited it that I feel like if I kept going, I would have changed it back to what it was originally was and not even recognized it. So there was a point where I had to say, this is yours now. And I kind of struggle to remember what's in there.

[Greg Anderson]

I feel the same way with my writing, man. Yeah. Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

But literally, I looked at it so many times. Is it the. Is it the. Is it then, like.

[Greg Anderson]

Are you using these?

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah. I'm not an English major. I've. Yeah, barely graduated high school and that's the limit, but it's cool.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

I don't know if I have another one in me. I think it'll probably depend. Actually, it wouldn't depend on the success of that book because I don't know what makes a book successful. It's the same question that I asked you. Is. Is true of me if I wouldn't trade a dollar figure of any amount on a check for having an impact in somebody's life? So commercial success for me would look like that.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

We'll see how it goes. It's in their hands at this point. They're doing all the, you know, the COVID art. Like. Yeah, that's them. That shit ain't me. I'd be like, I don't know, take a picture of a chicken laying an egg. That would be a good. You know, so we'll see.

[Greg Anderson]

Nice.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah, man.

[Greg Anderson]

And so are you planning on doing, like, readings and book tours?

[Andy Stumpf]

What? I don't know.

[Greg Anderson]

Are you going to do things like that?

[Andy Stumpf]

God, I might be contractual.

[Greg Anderson]

I hope you come to Alaska, man.

[Andy Stumpf]

No.

[Greg Anderson]

What? Why? Nobody comes to Alaska.

[Andy Stumpf]

Precisely. That's why I'm not coming to.

[Greg Anderson]

There's no population, I guess I. I.

[Andy Stumpf]

Feel like I'm contractually obligated to potentially do those things.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah. No.

[Andy Stumpf]

Weasel out of it though.

[Greg Anderson]

Maybe you'll come to Happy Valley.

[Andy Stumpf]

Probably not.

[Greg Anderson]

Highly doubtful.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah. Two more questions for you.

[Greg Anderson]

Let's hear it, man.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah, then I got to bounce out and go pick up Richard, the guy that you met first. 1. Where's the best place that people can find your book to support you?

[Greg Anderson]

The best place would be from our family's secretgardenalaska.org they can also find it. Basically any other online store.

[Andy Stumpf]

Is there one of those outlets that benefits you guys more though? Is there any difference on what makes it back to you?

[Greg Anderson]

You know, it's kind of tough. If they buy it directly from the store, I make more money. Yeah, if they buy it from, let's say Amazon or Barnes and Noble or.

[Andy Stumpf]

Whatever, they make more money.

[Greg Anderson]

They make more money. But then they can leave like a verified purchase review.

[Andy Stumpf]

That probably helps too, doesn't it?

[Greg Anderson]

It does help. And so I think really more than. I'm not gonna say more than anything. The money's nice, but leaving reviews for a no name guy like me is super helpful, man.

[Andy Stumpf]

Here's the move. People need to go buy one from your website and then one from Amazon and leave a review.

[Greg Anderson]

Hey, there you go.

[Andy Stumpf]

You know what I mean?

[Greg Anderson]

God, you're a businessman, aren't you?

[Andy Stumpf]

No, no, not at all. That is not a chapter in the book. Last question for you. What is your current VA rating?

[Greg Anderson]

100.

[Andy Stumpf]

Okay. I was gonna say if it wasn't, go have it re looked at because I know that you're probably factoring that in. In your family's economic ecosystem.

[Greg Anderson]

No doubt about it.

[Andy Stumpf]

Good. Okay. I was just going to make sure that you, you know, the military gets their pound of flesh up front. I just want to make sure you were getting everything you were deserving of that as well.

[Greg Anderson]

Thanks, man. I'm glad you brought that up because that was something I really wanted to just mention was how many men and women I've met in the past three years when I started working with that organization who were getting zero. I mean guys.

[Andy Stumpf]

Some of that is their own doing.

[Greg Anderson]

Oh, no doubt it was their own doing.

[Andy Stumpf]

I hosted a podcast yesterday with a guy, he is starting a company or has started a company called Vetiver. It is an AI powered software slash tool to help people navigate through the process. And he was going through some of the stats. 19 million veterans. If you do active duty and guard, there's 2.4 million people currently serving. Combining those two, which is 0.83 or 8.4percent of the US population fraction, 19 million vets. Only 6 million of those vets are actively interfaced with the VA. Wow. That is 13 million people who have. They're off in the wind.

[Greg Anderson]

Those are big numbers, man.

[Andy Stumpf]

They are big numbers.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

People would say they're small in comparison to the overall population side, which I would agree with. But that's. That's. That's a lot of people out there in the wind. And yes, it can be harder if you've been detached from it and not interfaced for a long time. But I was asking these questions to him. There's solvable problems. There's ways that you can get your pound of flesh back. Is my point in saying that because the gov gets it. They say, sign on this dotted line and your ass be mine. And you're like, okay. So many people I know to include myself didn't pursue vocational programs, educational programs, mental health counseling, which wasn't as big of a thing when I started, but it was. It was. It was on ramping as I left. Just get your pound, too.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

Or for your family, there's educational benefits.

[Greg Anderson]

For you feeling freaking bad and guilty like you're a government handout. You know, that's what I'm finding with these. These people that I talk with.

[Andy Stumpf]

They don't want me. I served in peacetime. I don't want to take something from somebody who served in war. That is an objection, again, that you are putting in front of yourself. Life's hard enough. Don't do that shit.

[Greg Anderson]

Andy, thank you so much, man.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah.

[Greg Anderson]

Coming back on here. Well, you know, like I said, I was driving around looking at real estate and realized that it's probably never going to happen.

[Andy Stumpf]

What are you talking about? Pay $300,000 for an acre. It's the same price as in Alaska.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah, but I'd sure like to come back some point, man, to kids. They need to get back here, and I want to hit the mountain again and.

[Andy Stumpf]

Well, let's do this. The next time you come out, let me fly you guys out. You save your money for your homestead and let me fly you up.

[Greg Anderson]

That's very nice of you. Yeah, thanks, man.

[Andy Stumpf]

And actually let me rent you a Ford Taurus in Alaska. You just drive it, dude. Right. About that.

[Greg Anderson]

My whole family, dude.

[Andy Stumpf]

Well, that's. That's a book in itself.

[Greg Anderson]

I had to go three rows now, man.

[Andy Stumpf]

We'll get you back out here.

[Greg Anderson]

Thanks, man.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah. That was awesome. Thanks for making the trip.

[Greg Anderson]

What you're doing is really inspiring, and it's helping folks like me and so many others. You know, I know not to keep going on and tooting the horn, but a lot of guys, I don't know the numbers, man, but a lot of guys are raised without healthy father figures. And you're by no means like a father figure to me. We're like the same age, man. I mean, you.

[Andy Stumpf]

I'm like seven years older than you, but I get what you're saying.

[Greg Anderson]

But just hearing what you're sharing, hearing the letters that people are writing in, they're wild, man. I mean, one of the recent ones was a guy talking about, I mean, you read the whole letter. You know, his wife was leaving him, he was dealing with stuff. He never opened up. He was on Instagram looking at booty pics, all these things. And it was like, there are so many men and women I know, but who need to hear what you're sharing, man. It really makes me feel, as a remote guy in the middle of nowhere, like I'm connected to this larger community.

[Andy Stumpf]

So it's awesome.

[Greg Anderson]

Thank you so much, man.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah, my pleasure.

[Greg Anderson]

Yeah.

[Andy Stumpf]

Until next time.

[Greg Anderson]

Until now.

[Andy Stumpf]

Yeah. Marketing is hard, but I'll tell you a little secret. It doesn't have to be. Let me point something out.

[Greg Anderson]

You're listening to a podcast right now, and it's great. You love the host. You seek it out and download it.

[Andy Stumpf]

You listen to it while driving, working out, cooking, even going to the bathroom. Podcasts are a pretty close companion. And this is a podcast ad. Did I get your attention? You can reach great listeners like yourself with podcast advertising from Libsyn Ads.

[Greg Anderson]

Choose from hundreds of top podcasts offering.

[Andy Stumpf]

Host endorsements, or run a pre produced.

[Greg Anderson]

Ad like this one across thousands of shows.

[Andy Stumpf]

To reach your target audience in their.

[Greg Anderson]

Favorite podcasts with Libsyn Ads, go to Libsyn ads.com that's L I B S.

[Andy Stumpf]

Y N ads.com today.