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Episode 402 - Michael Montoya - Don't Kick Land Mines in Ukraine
01:56:17
Michael Montoya is a veteran with over 15 years of experience in the military and security sectors, specializing in EOD/IEDD/CIED/HMA operations. Michael's extensive experience has seen him providing training and operational support across the globe,...
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- [00:00]
A
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B
Okay, got the red smoke. Sun runs north and south. West of the smoke. West of the smoke. Okay, copy.
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A
West of the smoke. I'm looking at danger close now.
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B
Come on with it, baby.
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A
Give it to me.
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B
I mean, it cleared hot.
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A
Can't be cleared hot.
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B
And she's just like, where are they all going? And I blame them on my kids. Tyler probably did it.
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A
Nice. Now, do you throw them away in the kitchen so she can find them, or do you throw them away at the garbage can? Or when you're out?
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B
It would have to be neighbor's garbage can because we did an episode where I came clean to her and let her know that I was throwing away some of her stuff when she wasn't paying attention. And then she admitted to me that she goes into the garbage can and takes it back into the house, which I wasn't aware of. Michael was here for this. It was a real journey of discovery.
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A
Yeah, it was fun.
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B
So now it's clearly I have to sprinkle her in the neighborhood garbage cans.
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A
It's like disposing of a body. You got to do it far and wide.
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B
I mean, Tupperware. How do you wash Tupperware? Because you can't. It's like, especially if you have spaghetti.
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A
Yeah. It depends what was in and how it was used.
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B
Spaghetti.
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A
I mean, vinegar. I mean, sometimes most Tupperware. Good Tupperware will use. I also get the glass Tupperware.
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B
Yep. I don't throw those away.
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A
Yeah. Because then they're versatile and they actually clean pretty easy.
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B
If you put spaghetti in a plastic Tupperware, you will know it for 20 years. The sheet, that's just the light red sheen to it. I feel like the best way to wash that is in a dumpster.
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A
Yeah. It's reasonable.
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B
Yeah. My wife.
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A
Reasonable.
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B
My wife doesn't agree. So I blame it on my kids. Today's episode is brought to you by Black Rifle Coffee. Now, I am more of a visual person than an audio person. So this is why I head over to their website and we can talk. Talk about what they have. Looks like they're doing a buy one, get one free. And that appears to apply to some brands of coffee or not brands. Some of the blends of coffee mugs, shirts. But let's scroll down, see what we got. The little slide bar, the slide bar of information. Far left is light. Which the lightest being silence or smooth. Far right is dark. Looks like the darkest is the murdered out roast. Right in the middle you got your AK Freedom Roast, Gunship and jb Just black. Those are also just great options. They have a summer merch drop, which here's some pictures of what they're offering. Some sun shirts, which I've been relying on heavily recently. Little bit warm, little high UV up here in Montana. And subscriptions. This is the cool part. Far left, coffee subscription. Get what bag of coffee delivered when you want at the velocity that you want and the quantity that you want.
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A
Shirts.
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B
Maybe you like new designs every month. Join the shirt club, the sticker club, same thing. And then the ecs, the exclusive coffee subscription. That's gonna be one bag per month. Here's an example of what last month's was. The Secret Water Society roast, which was incredibly delightful by the way. Actually, I've just working through my last of that bag. I think I have maybe one or two more cups of coffee left in that. A ton of options. Great coffee, founded by great people, still giving back to veterans. And what I'll say is this, the vast majority of people have no idea how much they give back to veterans. The best way to support me in the show is to support sponsors like Black Rifle Coffee. So head over toBlack Rifle Coffee.com, check out what they have to offer. Sign up, tell them I sent you, and enjoy your coffee, however you may like it, unless it's from a French press because then we can't be friends. Back to the show. You could use this.
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A
You try. You try to make her understand. She just doesn't want to. It's not on you at this point. I mean, there's pure logic behind it. She wants to throw emotion onto it. Yeah, it's on her.
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B
I agree.
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A
You can't control someone else's emotion. I know you can definitely rub it though.
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B
Yeah, bring me. Well, so we met in April of last year. Obviously people can go back and listen to that episode, but so we can reference it and make this standalone. Fill me in on what brought Us together for the first time last year, and then we can kind of fill in the blank on what you've been up to since then.
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A
No, absolutely. Well, you got a message from my friend.
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B
Yeah. They're like, hey, I got an international soccer star buddy.
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A
Yeah.
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B
Who likes to kick landmines.
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A
Yep, pretty much. And he sent you the. The text where I was basically like, hey, guess who stepped on a landmine? And Ukraine.
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B
You should let people know the region of the world we're talking about.
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A
Yeah. And took a picture of the nub all wrapped up in bandage, seeping with blood. And Psycho. You know, this guy, two thumbs.
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B
Well, we should also tell people how you got into the game of kicking landmines.
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A
Yeah. You know, went in the Marine Corps, became an EOD tech, and been enjoying it ever since. So, I mean, that's the short and dirty of it. But, you know, early childhood, wanted to be a Marine. Older brother when the Marine Corps awaited my time, went in the Marine Corps. You have to start as something else. I was a logistics or red patcher. And then Once I was 21 years of age and had all the other things necessary, got the lat, move into it, went overseas, did my on the job training. Wasn't supposed to be on a job training, but that's how it came down during Fallujah, Second Battle of Fallujah. So I got to meet a bunch of different techs from all the different branches and support them here, there, and every there and everywhere. But once we got done with that, floated back over because I was on the 31st Mew for that one. Went back over to Okinawa, took my leave, went to EOD school, became an EOD tech about two weeks before I even finished EOD school. You know, someone comes into the room we're. We're getting training in, and they say, hey, Sergeant Montoya, you got a phone call. Well, I mean, you know, any school environment, someone walks in, interrupts a class and hey, you got a phone call. It's not like, oh, you just won the lottery. Hey. So, yeah, I was like, crap, you know, family member died or something. What's going on? Get over their phones. Like, Sergeant Montoya, this is Chief Warrant Officer so and so. You're a combat casual replacement. You're going to. You're going to Iraq. I was like, can I finish EOD school first? He's like, yeah, once you're done with school, don't take leave. Go to your duty station. You're going over there, and that's it. So did that fun little Journey, didn't take leave, got there, was checking in and checking out. And everyone told me that you don't know what you're talking about. We haven't heard about this not happening. Was checking on a Tuesday after a three day holiday and I was still checking out on that Thursday. Got a call halfway through the day from the colonel who was in charge there. And it's like, there's a flight at 1800. Get your guns, you're going over to Iraq.
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B
And I was like, 6pm for the civilians?
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A
Yeah, 36pm And I was like, I was like, is this the one that you told me I wasn't going to go on? I don't need your. I was like, all right, fair, but I'm leaving, so it doesn't matter. Yeah, went and got my stuff, didn't even have issue deserts or anything like that. Straight green camis, all the other stuff. Got on the plane, got over to Kuwait and I was like, yeah, I need to go to tq. And they're like, no, you need to go to Alad. I was like, I need to go to tq. I was like, you know what, just get me in country, get to Al Asad. I show up at the EOD shop there and they're like, you're not supposed to be here, you're supposed to be over here. I was like, I can tell everyone where I'm supposed to be, but I'm just a sergeant.
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B
Yeah.
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A
So, yeah, got a little bit extra ammo, went to the amnesty box, got some demo, got some stuff. They drove me over to a log train that was going from al Asad to TQ. Hopped in the back of a 7 ton and green cammies and all the other marines and deserts are sitting there looking at me going, who's the spook? He's like, I was just a sergeant, guys. I'm sorry. Sure you are, sergeant. I was like, yeah, okay, here's my ID card.
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B
If you were a spook, I think they could get you an ID card.
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A
But do you do a silly face or do you keep it serious?
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B
Serious at all times. Espionage couldn't be more serious.
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A
This is true. This is true. Um, yeah, now, so, yeah, got over there and then did the left seat, right seat, two days into it. So from graduating EOD school to being in Iraq within like a nine day period and then two days later, you know, as officially, finally an EOD tech, we're going to a call and front vehicle gets blown up and it's like, okay, yay. You know, we're having fun and then just another tour, then another tour, then Afghanistan tour, and then got out and continued to do this stuff in the civilian world, first at, like, the Yuma proving Grounds, doing all the testing of all the different munitions and things, lot assessments, just all the general stuff that, you know, they got to make sure the military keeps functioning. And then went back over to Afghanistan in a training role for a training military and police and others for eod. And so got to do that for a year and shifted over to training all the people coming through in that first, like, week that you get in country. I forget the training, the RSY training or whatever. And was training that for the counter ID stuff. When that was done, did some human behavior pattern recognition analysis, that advanced situational awareness training. So I was doing that for about a year and then back over into training, but in Africa, so in 2014, and then from there just continued to do that, setting up EOD programs, going over to teach counter ID programs, engineering programs, just all the different fun stuff. And continued that until finally got rid of that company I was working with and decided to do something for free and volunteer. And no good deed goes unpunished, so.
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B
Indeed.
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A
But no, it was. It was good. It's what we wanted to do. So I was having, you know, good times even up to the second, even after, you know, like, things happen. So. But it hasn't stopped me, hasn't slowed me down. Yeah, you know, a little bit longer to get over the obstacle now, but, you know, hey, a little shoulder problems.
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B
You're walking better than the first time you were here.
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A
Yeah, I was in that one prosthetic that was, like, came down the back and kind of came around it, and it just wasn't moving, and it was causing, like, more rubbing and just the wound was still open and just causing other problems. And then we started getting this one done, and, like, they messed up. They didn't build it to the mold that was sent, so I couldn't even get my, you know, leg into it. And then they got that fixed. But at the same time, we did this other one, which was just like a boot. You know, those, like, old wrestler boots, like you think, like in the 1950s boxer shoes or whatever. It's like just leather, all lace.
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B
Oh, yeah.
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A
Yeah. So essentially that's what it looked like. So there was no roll to it or anything else. So it's kind of like when I would step, I just hit that point. That would be it. So it's. It was just a little awkward on the walking and everything, but I Was functional. The problem was it was rubbing a spot raw just every single day, just opening a wound, opening a wound, opening a wound. And I've got those two, like, nerves that were, like, surface, just subsurface. And so, like, the first 45 minutes to maybe two hours, I'm functional. And then after that, it's just rubs so irritated and raw and everything that at the end of the day, I'd have to lay down, have my foot up for three hours before it calms down and quit spasming and everything else.
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B
Jesus.
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A
Yeah, just like the. The constant, like the pain. But once I got this one fixed, I was over there doing some capacity stuff this. This last little trip. So we're doing IMAs, EOD training for the different organizations in the government. So National Police, Emergency Services, or State Emergency Services, Ukraine State Special Transport Service, and mod, their military administrative defense. So there's a mixed group, which is good because they're all kind of coming together, and every organization has different ways they do stuff. You know, just like, you know, EOD in the military, we all have different kind of roles, responsibilities, things that we can do or they can't do, or, you know, Navy diving, you know, Marine Corps, we can do this. Other people can't do this. There's all just going to be different SOPs, and. But it's good to come together and actually, like, start working together and seeing it from a different perspective. Granted, like, the training we're giving, it's like that, that foundation training, all of our students are already doing those jobs, but it's a good kind of reel back and go, okay, you write, yes, this is a way. And when you go to this organization, you might do it a different way. But if you ever go back to this organization over here, you're going to have to remember the fundamentals and go back to this. So, yeah, just some good stuff.
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B
What are the fundamentals for disarming a bomb?
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A
Don't get blown up.
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B
Okay, check. Apparently, knowing you, that's possible.
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A
Yeah.
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B
You know, like asterisks at least.
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A
Yeah. Don't get blown up.
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B
I mean, obviously. Yeah, so don't action the device. What is like. I mean, I'm not saying that even though one of my favorite scenes is in the abyss where he has to, I think, cut the green wire, but he's using green light, so of course you have to guess. Good thing he closes his eyes, too, so he wouldn't see the flash.
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A
Yeah, yeah.
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B
Like, what are they? What are the fundamentals for disarming a device?
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A
Oh, the fundamentals are more for the approach and the method, the methodical process that you go through as you work through it. Easiest way to do it is one you have a base knowledge of all the different stuff you'll be working with. Then you have a knowledge of all the safeties that you're going to apply, and not just the safeties, but what the safety's for and the application of the mitigation technique you're using. So a safety would be like high explosive safety or fragmentation safety. Well, on high explosive, don't apply heat shock or friction. Right. Have distance from blast, will help protect you. Have cover from blast, help protect you. Well, fragmentation, as you're approaching it, fragmentation could hurt or kill you. Make sure you have ppe, have your body armor, have your helmet, have your glasses, gloves, fireproof, you know, clothing. And so it's just applying that and then knowing how to scale that application. Because, yeah, a bomb suit would be great, but it's right up here. And you can't climb this wall or you can't do this. You can't do this activity in the bomb suit, but you can do it in a plate carrier, soft armor, or a helmet. So it's just learning to at least take it into consideration before you do all that stuff.
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B
So you're still going to lose your hands in a bomb suit, right?
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A
I mean, if. If it's right here like that, absolutely. But, you know, like, you're walking and it goes off 20 meters away, and it's a smaller bomb. You just fall over, you know, and hopefully no shrapnel hits it.
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B
Well, in my mind, all disarmament comes down to multicolored wires and appliers, or, you know, the little clippers.
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A
Yep.
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B
Because I get all of my information from the movies. And When I encountered IEDs overseas, I ran the opposite direction, screaming, EOD, because I don't fucking like them.
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A
Did we have ear pods in? Because maybe we didn't hear you.
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B
Okay. Yeah. Those bomb suits look horrendous.
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A
Yeah, they're. They're not light, and it's part of.
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B
Seem really well ventilated, though, at least.
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A
Yeah. I mean, they actually make a cooling suit.
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B
Do they really?
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A
Yeah. Where it's got all the lines through it and you have this water jug that you kind of freeze and it has a little bit of water that cycles through it.
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B
All right, that's really smart.
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A
Yeah. But then it says another thing that you have to put on, another thing you have to cool down, another thing you have to be ready for, um, and so it just. Sometimes it's not practical, especially in like a tactical environment, like.
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B
Yeah.
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A
And then if you're just doing foot patrols. No, you're not going to bring a suit anyways because, I mean, you could.
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B
Just do the patrol in the suit and then be prepared for everything.
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A
That's right. That's right. Can you imagine need those exoskeleton things and stuff.
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B
I don't even think that would be enough.
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A
Just. Well, I mean, I guess now you can just put on the back of one of those walking dogs or whatever and it just carries it for you and just call Fido over. Hey, you know, comes over and dresses you. Yeah.
- [17:24]
B
Dons you in your suit of armor.
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A
Is there a wipes?
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B
You know, cops, I think are a good analogy here. There's no way they can know all the laws. So they have their computers, obviously, and they can look stuff up. If you encounter. If an E and D guy encounters a device, do you guys have like a means of identifying what it is? Is there something that you guys can like here?
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A
Say that question again.
- [17:51]
B
So cops, right. They are there to enforce the law, but there's no way they can know every law.
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A
Right.
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B
They don't have to. They used to carry books, but now they have their computer. So if they bump on gets the limit of their knowledge or experience, you guys, right? The safety mechanisms, the fundamentals and all that stuff. What do you do if you encounter something you've never seen? Do you have something that you can search it or how. Where do you start?
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A
Yeah, I mean. Well, in the military there's always reach back. There's always a publication or something and you can share it within the community. You can ask, I mean, like on.
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B
Target, like real time. How do you deal with that?
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A
Yeah, you just use the knowledge that you have. Because normally you don't have something right there. You're going to put the stuff. That's what I was asking. Yeah.
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B
There's no ruggedized laptop with all known.
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A
Yeah, but it'll be back there. You're not going to walk down next to a device or next to the piece of ordinance. You're going to go down there.
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B
Just open your screen.
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A
Yeah. So. Yeah, just. Jeeves, can you help me disarm this?
- [18:48]
B
You know, surfing to YouTube. How do you.
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A
Yeah, how do you. Potato. No, not potato. Yeah, hold on. I'll be right back. Wi Fi, you know.
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B
Okay, so. So there is a resource.
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A
There are resources and a lot of things are open source too. You know, like if you see something, because there's a difference between the ID world and then the conventional munitions. You know, IDs, whatever we can grab together and that's what we do. But with conventional, I mean it's manufactured in a factory to specifications and QA qced.
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B
Yeah.
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A
The information about we know how it should work. Is it always going to be perfect? Is something going to be flawed on the inside? And it. Yeah, it's supposed to blow up after 400 pounds of pressure. But then, you know, someone puts 10 pounds of pressure on and explodes like it was a faulty, you know, one. It, it happens. You know, not everything's perfectly made, so not every bullet fires when you try to shoot it.
- [19:50]
B
True story. I didn't know that you couldn't come into the Marines and pipe straight into the EOD pipeline. I didn't realize you had to go do some time first before they would let you do that.
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A
Yep.
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B
What's the reasoning behind that?
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A
Well, there's a few. And back in like the 80s they did it where you can come straight in.
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B
Yeah.
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A
And then sometime I want to say in like 2004 ish, 5 ish, they did a period where they, I mean our numbers doubled and they needed people so they took people straight in. Some of the problems is one, it's a small team. In order to drive with demolition and stuff like that in a vehicle on highways in the states and all that stuff, you have to be 21 years of age. So if we have two 18 year old or 19 year old EOD techs in the Marine Corps that they're supposed to be able to drive and go do a thing and they can't do it. So it helps with that maturity of, you know, you get people in and when you go to a normal unit, a garrison unit and all that stuff and you're building as you're building up how you're supposed to work within the Marine Corps and everything else. Whereas if you go onto a small team, it's a different dynamic. So you haven't built up any of that discipline or any of the other things that, that they, that you should be displaying. So you just get in there and it's just small teams run amok, do stuff. I mean when I got to my unit in 2006, I was the only EOD tech at my unit. It was supposed to be a seven man team.
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B
Damn.
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A
Because every, it was one. Our numbers were low and everyone was everywhere else. So, you know, that's, that's it. So I showed up and I was like, hey, I'm the OIC now. And two days later I was gone. Iraq. So.
- [21:38]
B
So they need you to be. They need you to be a Marine first.
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A
I need you to be able to like be a competent adult. Well, a competent man child.
- [21:46]
B
I didn't realize there was a restriction on driving with devil.
- [21:49]
A
Yeah, yeah. I mean it's. Yeah, it's just all kinds of little, little things and of course laws and stuff. So who knows? Well beyond the age limit. So I don't even think about it anymore.
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B
So I think I might have violated that law early on.
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A
If you're on base, you're on base.
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B
But no, we would drive stuff all over the place to training facilities.
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A
And that's.
- [22:11]
B
I could be statue of.
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A
I could be remembering something that I'm just totally not remembering correctly too. So.
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B
Well, and then a lot of times the demo would show up in a semi truck, I think. So a lot of the times they would drive it. But yeah, I don't know. I don't think I was ever pulled over and asked if I had any C4 in the car, which more than likely I didn't anyway. In.
- [22:32]
A
Yeah, it was C2.
- [22:34]
B
Totally different, stacked together. Two plus two. What from all the people you know in your career during the G wat era, call it Iraq and Afghanistan. What was the most complicated IED that they ever came across or sophisticated or just something where anything that sticks out like, wow, that's actually pretty impressive.
- [23:02]
A
So without personal opinion and stuff like that, a lot of IDs and all that stuff that we were doing and around the world, they're simple, they're basic. There's not a lot of complexity to it.
- [23:16]
B
Is it basically charge an activation device?
- [23:19]
A
Yeah, it's just a basic, basic. The most basic ID switch. This, that, this done.
- [23:25]
B
Boom.
- [23:27]
A
When I train people and I teach people, especially counter ID or any of the stuff or awareness or E hat or whatever flavor of the month that something we're putting a term to, it always comes down to this. And it's the same thing with any artisan or any job or anything out there. Everything's going to be dictated by the person's knowledge and imagination and availability of resources tracks. You can know everything in the world.
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B
If you don't have shit though, who cares?
- [23:57]
A
But if you don't have anything, then you're making the most basic thing. You can know absolutely nothing and have everything available for you, but you only know one way to do it. You're only gonna be making one thing. That's it. And so you know the. The rule of Complexity and stuff also applies. Keep it simple. Stupid. Right. If it's working, why make it more complex now if we're being successful? And it's just always a game of chess in some way. Right. Checkers or, you know, Uno, who knows? Well, pick a game. Yeah, but you're going to, as you're winning more, they're going to change the way they do it. And if you become, what do you call it, like consistent in your behavior, predictable, then someone can always find a way to counter that.
- [24:50]
B
Yeah.
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A
So that's where the complexity may come in. That's where this may come in. Because they see you do this one action over and over and over and they go, oh, if I just kind of do this, he's gonna do this. But then I'm gonna add this to.
- [25:04]
B
Counter his doing that.
- [25:05]
A
Yep. And that's what it always. It's. I mean it's the game we're always playing. Right. So how do we do this business?
- [25:11]
B
Yeah, it was like the V hold vehicles in Afghanistan. Designed to absorb. Not absorb, but I guess it would be deflect a blast from underneath and then you find the same charge but it's put into the side to go straight in, hitting it at a 90 versus diffuse. And it's like, you know, is that complex? Not any more complex. Is it innovative? Sure. But it's the same thing they, you know. God, I remember the first times I was driving around in Afghanistan. It was either in a thin skin Toyota Hilux or a completely unarmored Humvee.
- [25:47]
A
Okay.
- [25:48]
B
Which I think has an overmatch of about a quarter of a pound. Maybe a blasting cap might overmatch the flat bottom. I was terrified of Nothing more than IEDs by the last time I went over there. I mean there I wasn't physically there, but saw the aftermath of about a 1500 pound HME. And what that did to an RG, just flipping it through the air.
- [26:12]
A
Yep. Probably ripped it in half too.
- [26:14]
B
It inverted the V of the hole and just took it up into the air like they were, they were torching pieces of bodies out of that to recover the bodies. And I mean, I guess. Is that more complex? No, they just did. They're like, well, 50 didn't do it, 500 didn't do it. 1500. Not that they were probably even weighing it anyway, but yeah, they just kept going big.
- [26:38]
A
They probably went 15 out of 0, 150 out of 0, 1500.
- [26:44]
B
Yeah. But again, that's not necessarily more complex. They just were paying attention to the result of what they were getting, you know, so there's not like some legendary Jason Bourne story where there was multiple kill switches and somehow there was, like, a radio beacon attached to a rabbit's asshole that would run across the field or. Yeah, I don't necessarily know why. My brain just went to that, but that's what I'm thinking.
- [27:05]
A
I mean, rabbits. I guess I learned this morning there was a rabbit living in our shed in our backyard. And our hunting, majestic wiener dog.
- [27:16]
B
You have one, too?
- [27:17]
A
I got two wiener dogs.
- [27:18]
B
What are their names?
- [27:21]
A
Leia and Lulu.
- [27:22]
B
Short hair or long?
- [27:24]
A
Short.
- [27:24]
B
Same double dabble. Ours is a reverse chocolate dabble. One blue eye, one speckles of blue. His name is Javelin. I want to get another one.
- [27:36]
A
Seeking meat Missile.
- [27:37]
B
Yes. I want to get another one. All black. Carl. Gustav.
- [27:41]
A
Oh, no. But have it. Wear a little yellow banded color for yes.
- [27:47]
B
My wife won't let me do it. She says she wants to get a girl. Carolina is also a name.
- [27:51]
A
Yep.
- [27:52]
B
So, yeah, I think Javelin and Carl would be great. Nobody would really know what it is, but we would.
- [27:57]
A
We would, and that's all that matters.
- [27:59]
B
Aren't they the best?
- [28:00]
A
They are. I mean, they're bred to take down badgers and, you know, honey badgers don't care.
- [28:05]
B
Traditionally, they're bred to take down lions.
- [28:08]
A
In their eyes, everything's a lion that they're ready to eat.
- [28:11]
B
I actually don't know if that's true, but that's what I tell people, and people will tell me it's impossible. I say, yeah, but obviously they hunt in packs.
- [28:17]
A
This is true.
- [28:18]
B
And I think 12 miniature dachshunds could take down a line.
- [28:23]
A
Yep. I could see it. Yeah. Put enough, you know, thorns in someone's foot, they're not walking.
- [28:29]
B
Yeah. I don't know how they would kill the lion, but I think they could.
- [28:32]
A
Take them down, go right through their mouth. Over.
- [28:37]
B
They the first dachshunds you ever had?
- [28:38]
A
No, no. I had two other dachshunds before. I mean, they lived till they're 16, 17 years old.
- [28:44]
B
Do people don't get it? So I had one. I lost it in the divorce is the way I like to describe it. I had never had a dog like that before. He was. His name was Chachi. He was the coolest dog, the Most loving personality, 15 times the size of his body. So I finally talked my wife into getting a dog, and she was, I think, uncertain about the desire. Like, why that breed? You don't want to get a Malinois or an Akita or something like that I'm like no miniature dachshund.
- [29:15]
A
That's it.
- [29:16]
B
And he's got her. He's got her wrapped around his little fingers. She loves that dog. They do spa days on Sunday. They clean out their ears and get their nails trimmed. And he's just.
- [29:29]
A
Ah.
- [29:31]
B
He barks at everything that is there and also everything that's not. A leaf falls across town. He lets us know. Yeah.
- [29:38]
A
Somewhere in the South Pacific, a butterfly flaps its wings and the dachshund barks.
- [29:43]
B
I have heard, because I have been trying to talk her into getting Carl, that they're happier if there's two. Would you agree with this?
- [29:51]
A
Yeah. I never have one. It's always in pairs.
- [29:55]
B
Do they seem to just fuck about and do their own thing, or do they just enjoy the company?
- [30:00]
A
Like.
- [30:01]
B
Or both, probably.
- [30:02]
A
Of the dog or of you?
- [30:04]
B
Well, when it's just, I mean, you know, he's so cool. He gets so excited. He loves Michael. Michael is his. It's his grandson, basically. He does the watching of the. The mini when we're out of town.
- [30:15]
A
Yeah.
- [30:16]
B
And it's so interesting. You're either one of their people or they're very wary of you. But if you're one of their people, they lose their shit when they see you. But it's just us and him right now. I just wonder if he would like it more if there was another. He'd have more to do in his alone time.
- [30:31]
A
Take him to a dog park and see what he does. When you've seen another wiener dog around.
- [30:35]
B
There'S not many up here.
- [30:39]
A
You know, Open a new business.
- [30:41]
B
I don't know what that says about Montana.
- [30:43]
A
It just means that they just don't know yet.
- [30:45]
B
He loves snow. He will run and just dive into it.
- [30:48]
A
Yeah. Then they're gone.
- [30:49]
B
Basically.
- [30:50]
A
If there's six inches of grass, they're gone. They look like you're watching their tail. Yeah. You're watching Jurassic park and the raptors moving around.
- [30:57]
B
I actually described it as exactly that last weekend. Yeah. It's cool.
- [31:00]
A
Just the grass.
- [31:02]
B
Yeah, they're the best.
- [31:02]
A
Anyone know where he's at?
- [31:05]
B
Yeah. Anybody out there who has never experienced a miniature dachshund? They are. God, they're cool. Favorite, favorite pet that I've ever had is that. Is that breed. And they're just so loving, too.
- [31:16]
A
They are. They.
- [31:18]
B
Oh, yeah.
- [31:19]
A
Lay right there.
- [31:20]
B
Personal space is non existent.
- [31:22]
A
No, no, no. If there's more than a hair between y', all, there's too much. So they close the gap.
- [31:28]
B
But there's no, like, legendary story of some, like, rogue IED maker that nobody knows who he is. But his signature is so complex. Come on, man.
- [31:37]
A
No, not that I can think of. I mean, it probably would be like.
- [31:41]
B
An EOD tech anyway. Yeah, be like the pyromaniac firefighter.
- [31:45]
A
Yeah. It's like, you know, if I ever got captured, I'd be like, oh, yeah, no, I'll make all your IDs, the microchips into like, you know, I'm like, I got to make this really complex. And I'm like basically spelling out our grid coordinates of where we're at. So when someone takes an X ray of it and they go 38. What's this grid doing on this thing? This thing doesn't even work.
- [32:06]
B
Yeah, let's check it out. It would look dope. Oh, yeah. You'd be like, iron man making lights.
- [32:13]
A
Would come on and all that stuff, but it'd never be enough to set it off. And then when they come back, didn't work. Like, I told you to use a better detonator.
- [32:22]
B
Yeah. All right. Damn it. Well, that ruins that dream for me because in the movies it makes it look pretty damn cool.
- [32:28]
A
Yep. Yeah, there's. There's some good movie scenes. I forget which one it is. I think they're on an airplane or whatever, and the guy's got the. The straw where like he puts it in between.
- [32:39]
B
Oh, yeah.
- [32:40]
A
Cause the connection. I mean, technically, if that was a connection point and you had a plastic straw and you put it in between and they don't touch, it's insulated. That in theory would work if that whole thing was actually real. It's set up that way.
- [32:58]
B
Okay. You know, and I think we talked about last time. I mean, basically, Hurt Locker, you said, is mostly a documentary. Pretty much everyone. Ttps. Yeah. Tactics, techniques and procedures.
- [33:08]
A
How everyone lives their life. And I mean, they had to downplay it, so that was good.
- [33:12]
B
Yeah. Definitely grab the daisy chain of debt cord and pull all the 155 rounds up.
- [33:17]
A
Yeah.
- [33:17]
B
And if you can't buy the blasting cap, essentially.
- [33:19]
A
Yeah. And if you can't shift seven one five fives or one handed seven hundred and something pounds plus, then. Then obviously you're not a tech.
- [33:30]
B
Michael, have you seen that scene in the movie? I haven't even seen the movie. Okay, first off, that's a good thing that. That latter part is good, but can you find us? I have to see it. I need to see this.
- [33:41]
A
Give me a specific.
- [33:42]
B
How would you find this on YouTube? Hurt locker 155 round scene.
- [33:47]
A
Yeah. Pulling that cord.
- [33:49]
B
Yeah. Because it's pretty amazing. Of course, he's standing directly in the middle of the concentric circle of all the rounds too.
- [33:56]
A
Oh, okay.
- [33:56]
B
Yeah.
- [33:57]
A
I actually have seen this scene.
- [33:59]
B
He's pretty good. Some things are just worth seeing again. Oh, okay.
- [34:05]
A
And that's why we can't have nice things.
- [34:07]
B
This computer neither Michael or I can figure out. There it is. There it is. Teasing us. Just the tip. Michael. Grab it. Use your teeth.
- [34:17]
A
I'm trying.
- [34:18]
B
Use your teeth.
- [34:24]
A
There you go. I was gonna say. Yeah.
- [34:25]
B
Oh, my God.
- [34:29]
A
Let's bring it back over here. Okay, now bring it back. There you go.
- [34:35]
B
There we go. Yeah.
- [34:37]
A
Okay, let's see if this. Let me turn this up here.
- [34:40]
B
Yeah, you might have to skip a little bit. Oh, yeah, it's. Yep. Anybody can do this. Just. Oh, no. Here we go.
- [34:52]
A
Hang on.
- [34:54]
B
What are your thoughts on this? Just pull on the deck cord. Is this good?
- [34:58]
A
Yeah. No one's ever died by doing that.
- [35:03]
B
Knife in one hand. Observer, elevated position.
- [35:13]
A
Here we go.
- [35:14]
B
Yes. Secondary, take cover.
- [35:18]
A
Get in the wall.
- [35:19]
B
Get in the wall.
- [35:32]
A
Is that all Cat 5 cables? Did you see that?
- [35:34]
B
Look at this. Yes. That's probably enough, Michael. I think people get the point. It's basically a how to.
- [35:42]
A
Yep.
- [35:45]
B
1, 2, 3, 4, 5.
- [35:46]
A
I think I just realized that was all Cat 5 cabling. Did you see that?
- [35:50]
B
For like Internet modems and stuff?
- [35:52]
A
Yeah, like the Red Cat 5 cabling used for whatever. That's what it looked like when he had it all in his hand. And like some of it was broken and it's like the blue and whatever wires. Oh, yeah.
- [36:01]
B
They wanted to be a high speed connection to the blasting cap.
- [36:03]
A
True. It makes sense if you don't think about it.
- [36:08]
B
Yeah. Yeah. I'm not even an EOD guy, but I feel like just following by pulling up on debt cord through dirt is not a good idea.
- [36:16]
A
Yeah, it's. It's. It's a method. It's not the method.
- [36:22]
B
So you guys don't cover this as one of the classes in EOD school. So how'd you find yourself in Ukraine the first time?
- [36:32]
A
Well, I wanted to go in 2022 when it all started off. I was in Erbil teaching a humanitarian iedd, or improvised Explosive device disposal course to another organization and with another company. And I'm, of course, 2022 kicked off. I'm sitting there trying to decide to go over there or go back, work on our family relationship. And so I chose that I'm gonna go back and work on that. And so that's what I did. I decided, we went back there, we started working on it. And later on through the year, as we're doing different things, I take sporadic work over in Africa doing things, and then final buddy Stu, he's like, hey, do you want to go over and do this? And I was like, yeah. So signed up with the organization, went over there and. And like, what was that? Like January 1st or 2nd of 2023. Made the first trip and yeah, just started building the empire from that point on. So working through it's. It's not easy. There's still bureaucracy everywhere, even in war zones at times. There's still laws and rules and everything else you got to follow and work within. So. And then the biggest thing that you always run into is there's so many people going over and doing things with zero follow through.
- [38:12]
B
So you mean like individuals promising things, or are you talking about organizations?
- [38:16]
A
All of the above. Okay, yeah. So whether it's a non government organization, a government organization, individual, whatever it may be, like, oh yeah, you know, we want to do this, this and, and all this stuff. And then they never see them again. And first time, second time, third time, it just gets repetitive. So they're very wary if anyone is coming over. And it's like, hey, like, I would like to help with this. But we do it a bit of a different approach. We don't come in there going, you know, that was the old method. I'm from the government, I'm here to help. You know, it's like, oh, no. And we know how this is going to turn out. And we also don't go in there and say, hey, you're doing this wrong and let me show you how to do it right. They're still doing it. It's not that it's wrong, there's just different ways. Maybe they don't have the tools, they don't have the method, or they just need some more training or they need some more information and we can enhance what they're already doing. So we like to come in there and just be like, hey, can we come out and watch? Can we, you know, hand you the coffee? You know, what are we allowed to do? You know, we have some med kits. If someone does get hurt, we'll help you do the med stuff. You know, we got detectors. If one of your detectors go down, we'll help you with a detector. If you want us to sweep a lane, we'll sweep lane. If you want us to do this or this or this or you want training? You got 14 different detectors that came into the country. And you don't. You're like, we got training on this one. We don't know how all these other ones work. Okay, if you give us, you know, 48 hours of your time, we'll show you another detector. The next week, we'll come in, we'll show you another detector. Oh, this GPR one, it's going to take at least 40 hours of consistent training in a week to get familiar with it, and then probably about 100 hours worth of using it to get proficient with it. And so it's like, but this one we can have you trained in, show you how to use it all within a day and have you on some confident lanes. So you can be like, oh, yeah, no, I'm finding everything. Yep, that's mine. Oh, that's a piece of metal. Yep. And then safe excavation drills, all this stuff. So any capacity, train, advise, assist, mentor. But the biggest thing is when you go in, how can I support not. Let me show you how to do it. Right. They're already doing it. That's. That's the biggest thing.
- [40:53]
B
Have you seen an influx of people there just chasing war?
- [40:56]
A
Oh, yeah, no, there's. There's people that. That's their. That's, that's how they make their money.
- [41:04]
B
How do they. So how does that. Not that you do this, but what does it just show up like, hey, I'm a gun for hire? Like, what's the mechanism of that?
- [41:13]
A
Well, no, I mean, because you're talking about the military side, like, going fight, right?
- [41:18]
B
Well, even people who retired or people have gotten out of the US Military, they just want to go fight in Ukraine.
- [41:23]
A
Yeah.
- [41:23]
B
Are they just showing up saying, hey, I want to fight, and the Ukrainian government goes, okay?
- [41:27]
A
No. I mean, there's always a process. Just like if you were to go join the French Foreign Legion or join some other military, there is a process. You just can't show up and be like, yeah, give me a gun, I'll go to the front and I'm going to do stuff. No, they still go through background checks, interviews and everything else. And, and look at your history. And, and they're trying to. When they do take foreigners and stuff, from my understanding and from talking to different people and watching this stuff go on, they're trying to get people that are going to be beneficial as opposed to, like, I'm so and so. I've never done anything in my life. I'm here like, I want to go fight. I played paintball. Like maybe we don't have the time and effort and stuff to invest in you. Yeah, maybe you should go work with a charitable organization that's doing, what do you call it, evacuations or delivering water. Like get some life experience, you know, get some living in the country that, you know, there's drone strikes every day, there's ballistic missiles, there's combat going on, there's shift in lines forward and backwards. There's all kinds of stuff going on and see if you can mentally handle it for three months, you know, because things are difficult. Things are always changing.
- [42:52]
B
Probably depends on how dire their situation is too.
- [42:56]
A
Yep. But I mean, you know, resources available too. Like, I bet you if they had a gun for every hand and they could put them all out there and support them all, then they would. But if you don't have the resources to support people, you are going to try to pick and choose out of the 20 people you can take on four.
- [43:13]
B
Yeah.
- [43:13]
A
What four are you going to take?
- [43:14]
B
The most highly qualified.
- [43:15]
A
That's it.
- [43:16]
B
Yeah.
- [43:17]
A
You know, and just because you have experience doesn't mean that you are going to be a good fit for it. Just because you were in Iraq or Afghanistan or you were in the military, but you never deployed this, that there, you know, you're just going to have to figure out and find your way and figure out, find someone who's going to take you. But now that's all the military side. And we do get to see those people. We do get to talk to them, we get to work with them through training or anything. Because ultimately, even after the conflict is over someday the military is not going to be doing military stuff. They're going to be doing, okay, well, we need to go clear minefields. So they're going to be shifting over to that humanitarian side. So we still do training on equipment, on stuff, because they still have to do that stuff. And eventually they will be doing that stuff. So it's not, you know, all like, we're just teaching, just humanitarian. We're just teaching the government agencies, we're teaching everyone as a whole on whichever thing. And plus, you know, we give out the certificates after receiving this training to this standard. You've done this. And then it's a recognized certificate. Like when you go to look for a job in five years and. And you want to do demining. Oh, we went through this. I've got this much experience, I'm going to go on with this organization. And then so there's that life beyond the service. Right. So just like when we all Got out. Whether you're a cook, whether you're a driver, whether you're infantry, whether you're. Doesn't matter. There wasn't a lot of certs that transitioned over. So try to get people those search. Try to get them that training that whenever they do leave that they've got something else they can fall into.
- [45:06]
B
My forklift qual is pretty dope.
- [45:08]
A
I do. I like that.
- [45:11]
B
I pencil whip that one though.
- [45:12]
A
Like a T60 tank and a. What was the old, like Sardin York tank. Yeah, I actually had a. A license for driving the Sardin York.
- [45:22]
B
Hell yeah.
- [45:23]
A
Yeah. Because we at ypg, we had one. So I had to get all these licenses. Yep. And it was just like, all right, cool.
- [45:31]
B
How many times you been over there now?
- [45:33]
A
Let's see. 1, 2, 3, 4.
- [45:37]
B
How have you seen a change?
- [45:39]
A
In what way?
- [45:41]
B
Just even in the kinetic nature. Is there more or less bureaucracy interfacing with the soldiers and people? Has there been a mentality shift?
- [45:51]
A
Yeah, and it's. It's always in flux. So it's all. Think of it like a. A pond, you know, or an ocean. There's times where it's high tide, low tide, you know, a boat drives by and there's an extra wave. It's. It's always in flux. And you know, drastic things do change and they do appear like most recent one, you know, Ukraine striking deep within Russia and knocking out 40 plus of their strategic aircraft.
- [46:20]
B
I mean, I know it's a simplified explanation, but they basically use DJI drones.
- [46:25]
A
That's it. Just some dude.
- [46:27]
B
Did you ever. I've talked with everybody I know who I've served with. I asked him this. Did you ever once think about drone warfare like that when you were in. We were watching the dragon displays and stuff that Chinese do. I can't fathom the mental geometry of hearing that shit. And I also think the move is this. If you were to weaponize them, light them up so it does look like a dragon coming after you.
- [46:54]
A
I mean, you saw that one that like literally has like a thermite thing that just pours it on the position. It just burns. Burns the trees, burns the positions, burns whatever.
- [47:04]
B
Thankful that that was not even the most remote afterthought. It's just wild.
- [47:12]
A
Oh. And it's just. And it's moving at that exponential rate. Right.
- [47:16]
B
Oh, God. What'd you find, Michael? He said, tell me more thermite.
- [47:20]
A
Yep.
- [47:20]
B
Do you even know what thermite is, Michael? It's like a.
- [47:23]
A
Something that burns.
- [47:24]
B
Yeah, that's about All I know of it. Hot metal dragons. Drones. Rains molten metal on Russian positions.
- [47:35]
A
Yeah. Just set shit on fire.
- [47:41]
B
Fire spewing dragon drone.
- [47:46]
A
Man.
- [47:50]
B
Where does that align with the Geneva Convention? Because all wars are fought with laws and rules is. And they're always adhered to, I was about to say. I mean, holy, look at that.
- [48:05]
A
When they wrote it, they didn't have, you know, drones then, so technically they're not breaking it. Right.
- [48:10]
B
Well, they outlawed flamethrowers, which, by the way, I really tried hard. Just one op. That's all I wanted. I ran into a dude in Normandy. We went for the 80th anniversary.
- [48:22]
A
Yeah.
- [48:23]
B
I believe it was Iwo Jima. He was a flamethrower. He's like, you got. You got six good squirts. You got nine.
- [48:33]
A
Well, why is it six?
- [48:35]
B
I guess depending on the length of the trigger pull, you could maybe squeeze seven.
- [48:40]
A
No, I thought, like, didn't it. Didn't they have in the. The handle. They only had 6 caps or whatever to reignite it.
- [48:46]
B
I don't know.
- [48:48]
A
So. I don't know. That'd be interesting.
- [48:49]
B
My knowledge of a flamethrower is very light. My desire to ever use one was very high.
- [48:55]
A
I. I know a company that makes a flamethrower.
- [48:57]
B
Yeah, but it says not a flamethrower on it.
- [49:00]
A
I know, because it's a propane torch. Sure. Yeah. I mean, you know, like, talking about you. What's it. What's it say? Like, whenever someone's like, oh, I'm not a thief. It's exactly what a thief would say. I'm not a flamethrower. That's exactly what a flamethrower.
- [49:14]
B
Exactly. It's basically a butane torch is what the thing is. You can look at it, but. Yeah, it's pretty cool, man. Yeah. I don't. That's a different level because, you know, you're hearing those things. Some of those videos of them just chasing people down, man, that is a whole. That's a whole different ballgame.
- [49:33]
A
Yep.
- [49:34]
B
I mean, who's flying those? Are they soldiers? So. And you see those pictures of the fiber optic cables?
- [49:41]
A
Yep.
- [49:42]
B
We're talking to soldiers with FPV goggles on. Just getting.
- [49:45]
A
That's it.
- [49:45]
B
Like, a bunch of them together. Did they spread these guys out?
- [49:49]
A
It all depends, you know? I mean, if you're gonna fiber, you can probably have three people, but you wouldn't have them that close because. Yeah, of course, if there's a counter thing or whatever, then you lose your whole.
- [49:58]
B
Yeah.
- [49:58]
A
So people get Spread out. They get used most effectively. I mean, I think there's even a thing like war. War of drones or war on drones or something like that. And there's an actual program that you get points for destroying stuff.
- [50:16]
B
We're talking real world points. Real world points, like redeemable for a.
- [50:20]
A
Car wash. What are we talking redeemable for? Where equipment gets assigned so the units that are being more effective and have higher points, they can request more equipment because they're. They're being effective. So why not? You know, like, now you have like a. We're actually being more effective.
- [50:38]
B
Give us the good.
- [50:39]
A
Give us more stuff. And they're like, no, yeah, we got all your videos. We got all this. I think. I swear I saw something.
- [50:45]
B
He's already over there frantically googling. Yeah. What'd you find, Michael?
- [50:48]
A
Just a few articles. Let me just click this one. Clickety click, click. Clickety clack. I mean, business inside, you know? It's good then.
- [50:56]
B
Yeah. I mean, the point system. Not a bad idea, to be honest. We will one day, Michael. By that I mean figure it out. We'll figure it out. Okay. Ukraine's drone pilots are overhauling which Russian targets they think matter most. And tanks have fallen far from the top. Scroll up a little bit. I want to see that picture. Hit that X on that little ad.
- [51:16]
A
Yeah.
- [51:16]
B
Fucking ads. All right, so what do we got here? We got iPads. Scroll down. I'm just looking at the gear. God, that guy's rocking an ATAC system. Modern cut body armor, multicam. All right, how you can. Ukraine drone units updated their point system earlier this month to prioritize personnel hits. A tank kill could earn 40 points in the past, but now it earns only 8 per vehicle. Russian drone pilots are now the highest priority target for the bonus program. I'm a few. I bet you that goes in both directions. If the Russians had a point system. Yeah. Keep going down, Seer. Keep going down.
- [51:56]
A
Now earn 15 points for wounding a drone pilot. 25. Wow. Tank kills. Previously 40. Now only bring eight. Destroying multiple launch rocket systems could have earned you 50. Now they net pilots only 10 points.
- [52:13]
B
Yeah. Scroll down some more, Michael, man. I mean, it is what it is. I get why they're doing it. It's an interesting way to dehumanize the act of what's going on. But I get it.
- [52:24]
A
I mean, it also lets intel flow better for you to know, like, okay, what's being effective? You know what I mean? So it's not like you just have that intel cell. That's going out there and have to like talk to the units and do this and find stuff. Everyone's feeding it right up into there. Probably got some AI system going. Yep, that's confirmed. Oh, look at this. There's probably some freaking point system where it's like a team overkill.
- [52:54]
B
So some moving map chart. I know exactly what you're talking about.
- [52:57]
A
Yeah, like in rankings. Oh you know, we just got passed by such and such big balls.
- [53:02]
B
Is in the number one spot.
- [53:03]
A
Yep. With their three tank kills today.
- [53:06]
B
So it's just in flux. You haven't noticed any drastic shifts that have from your first time there to your last time spending time there. What the mentality of the people fighting?
- [53:17]
A
I mean it's, it's broad because I mean you got people that, I mean obviously there's a draft type system over there and you got people that have been fighting for a long time and you could see just tired. But then there's also ones that have been fighting for a long time and they're driven. You know, it's like if you had to fight for your own home and it's gonna be case by case. Right. So like if you had a certain mentality, if you had to fight for your own home, you wouldn't care how many people came through that door. You're gonna be just in it to win it and yeah. Smiling through it or what maybe. You know. And then there's the ones that just got tired of getting hit with artillery. Tired of this. I mean shell shocks are real thing and certain areas it's, it's violent, it's long lasting in certain areas it's not as violent today, but tomorrow maybe and then yeah, when the shift really with the FPV drones and all, the drone, the dropping the grenades and now there's just a flying the kamikaze drone right into somebod. That's it. And when a drone goes out, it's not going out like FPV drone. When they go out, they are not going out to come back. You're not bringing it back. So they are going out, they will find a target. Especially when they get to that last little battery usage like oh, you got 10 minutes or let's say it's an hour long battery or whatever and you go out and you don't find a worthwhile target in the first 40 and now you got 20 minutes left. Okay, well time to go back to. You know that one target I saw, that's just an empty truck. Let's go smash it. Yeah, it's those drones are not coming back. So when a FPV drone goes out, it's going to go blow itself up or malfunction, you know.
- [55:14]
B
Yeah. Yeah. The fact that it could do strategic damage to Russia's infrastructure like that. The aircraft with just that disproportionate portionate nature of the technology. Like and cost obviously too. Damn. Did they send those on? Because those weren't fly by wire. Do they send those on GPS coordinates? Do you know? Because that would be a hell.
- [55:39]
A
There was an AI tracking. There was an AI system that. You got it there.
- [55:42]
B
Yeah. And then the AI refine the final.
- [55:44]
A
The final position it needed to fly into.
- [55:46]
B
Does it be a real long spool of fiber optic cable?
- [55:49]
A
No. I mean they. So like electronic warfare, right. The resources you have to fight all that. They're finite. You only have 10 systems but you have 100 places you need to protect. Where the 10 places going to go? They're going to go here. Would you ever think in a million years that in the middle of Russia or wherever it was that you would need an electronic warfare system all the way around these facilities all the way that far away from Ukraine?
- [56:22]
B
Yeah. Deep in Russia. No.
- [56:23]
A
Nope. So it wasn't fly by wires. I understood it.
- [56:27]
B
I just don't think it would have the length to.
- [56:30]
A
Yeah, no. It was never going to be.
- [56:32]
B
Holy.
- [56:33]
A
Basically trucks parked outside the target location. The top of the truck 18 wheeler popped open and drones just activated. Flew off. Activated. Flew off and found their targets.
- [56:45]
B
Yeah. I mean we're obviously looking in for people watching. They look into. Those are some pretty far distance flights. Scroll down, Michael. But they're all delivered by truck to the launching point.
- [56:58]
A
Yeah. So like all. Look at that.
- [57:00]
B
Yeah.
- [57:01]
A
They're coming out of the back of the 18 wheeler. That the 18 wheeler or whatever or the. The transport truck.
- [57:06]
B
Yep, there it is.
- [57:07]
A
They didn't know that these drones were in there. They were told to go park at this location for whatever and already got paid. You know they didn't unknowing people.
- [57:16]
B
Yeah.
- [57:17]
A
And they went there and then this thing popped open. And then these drones just lifted off. Did their thing. Flew into strategic bomber stuff that's been. Hasn't been remade since the 90s.
- [57:33]
B
Yeah. So what else you got, Michael? Keep them.
- [57:37]
A
Some of these things is. Once they're done, they're done. They only have.
- [57:40]
B
Dude, that's a big plane.
- [57:42]
A
Six of those, right?
- [57:43]
B
Yeah. That's clearly a radar. That's like an eye in the sky. Yep.
- [57:45]
A
I forget how many they have. But they essentially knocked out, you know, a third of their entire eye in the sky technology.
- [57:51]
B
Look at that shit. Just smoke and destruction everywhere. Keep going, Michael. Damn. Yeah, that was the first picture.
- [58:02]
A
Yep.
- [58:03]
B
Today's episode is brought to you by BetterHelp. I listen to podcasts just like everybody else does. I don't have a whole lot of time to do it, but I do. And I listen to the ad reads because I'm curious how other hosts do their reads. I'm not here to judge better or worse. It's just interesting to me, it's Data points. And BetterHelp is an. An advertiser that sells ads across a variety of platforms. And what I'll say is this, a lot of those platforms, they're reading an ad read similar to the one that I have in front of you, or in front of me, I should say. But I'm not going to do that because although I think it's informative, I think it could get people interested. I'd rather just talk about my own personal experience because to me, that's the most impactful thing. People say, you know, you were a seal almost two decades ago and that must be the hardest thing you've ever done in your life. And it's not. It was challenging physically, emotionally, mentally. But I've dealt with things in my life that far exceeded the difficulty of that six months evolution. Hardest thing I've ever had to deal with was a divorce that lasted for almost two years. I relied heavily upon speaking to a counselor every week. And this doesn't have to be something that's woo woo. You don't have to sit down every day and talk about your deepest, darkest feelings or trauma or whatever it is that may be ailing you. Sometimes it's just great to unpack to somebody who is neutral, a third party, and get a different lens on what it is that you are going through in life. A different optic, if you will. And I haven't had a great fit with every therapist or counselor that I've connected with. So I have not given up on therapy or counseling. I found the right person that works for me. I've had situations in my life where, you know, I. I have a relatively baseline level of emotion, but sometimes the pendulum swings a little bit lower and I need to talk to somebody to help develop systems for me or help me understand what is going on in my head that can help swing that pendulum back into the up or shiny or happier place for me in my life. Would it have happened naturally over time? Probably. But why suffer like that. When there are people out there who literally have devoted their lives to helping you get through times that may be difficult for you. How does this tie into BetterHelp? Well, BetterHelp has over 30,000 therapists and we live in the Internet world. You can connect with these people wherever you're at. Laptop, tablet, phone, you call it whatever you need that has an Internet connection. It is the world's largest online therapy platform. They have served over 5 million people globally. It's very convenient. You can join a session with a therapist with a click of a button, which is going to help you fit therapy into your busy life. Plus you can switch therapists at any time. As the largest online therapy provider in the world, BetterHelp can provide access to mental health professionals with a diverse variety of expertise. Talk it out with Better Help. Listeners are going to get 10% off their first first month at betterhelp.com cleared hot. That is BetterHelp Hotel, Echo Lima, papa.com cleared hot. Final closing thoughts on this. You don't have to wait for the check engine light to come on to look under the hood. Food for thought. Back to the show. How do you spend that one as Russia, like it wasn't that big of a deal.
- [61:28]
A
Yeah, we just lost what was. I think it was like a third of.
- [61:32]
B
I think a third of their strategic bomber.
- [61:34]
A
A third of your strategic.
- [61:36]
B
Yeah. Pull that mic a little bit closer to you.
- [61:39]
A
Oh, sorry about that. 40 aircraft.
- [61:43]
B
40 aircraft who? T 160s. I don't know what any of those mean. 50 airborne early warning. That looks like the Concorde. That was cool. That's very Russian looking. So is that. Yep. Damn. I wonder what the is there. Michael, see if you can find a cost difference versus what it costs for the attack versus what it cost Russia. Yeah. And the value of that?
- [62:14]
A
I want to say it cost them like $8 billion. Yeah.
- [62:19]
B
What do you think? What would your guess be for Ukraine?
- [62:22]
A
Well, the time it took, for them it was like a year plus.
- [62:25]
B
I just mean the hardware, though.
- [62:27]
A
Oh, the hardware.
- [62:28]
B
Eight grand. I bet you.
- [62:32]
A
I'd say that they put. They put in million bucks. A million to $2 million total for.
- [62:37]
B
A net of 8 billion strong for one A50.
- [62:42]
A
Those big radar planes.
- [62:44]
B
Yep. There are 350 million. Yes.
- [62:47]
A
Ukraine claims the operation inflicts an estimated.
- [62:49]
B
7 billion in damage.
- [62:51]
A
Oh, 7 billion. That was off, you know, just a bill. All the drones used customly. Well, yeah, let's see. Only a fraction. I don't know how much exactly.
- [62:58]
B
I'm going to say Each drone was.
- [63:00]
A
About $400, it says.
- [63:06]
B
Yeah, yeah. So million might actually be high.
- [63:09]
A
Yeah.
- [63:11]
B
Dude, that is the future of warfare, man.
- [63:15]
A
Yeah. Because even if they use 400 drones or you said they're 400 bucks. A 400 bucks. I'm not sure. Even if they used a thousand drones before, it's only $400,000.
- [63:25]
B
Yeah.
- [63:25]
A
They use that many. Yeah.
- [63:30]
B
Damn.
- [63:30]
A
With precision strikes.
- [63:32]
B
Yes.
- [63:33]
A
This just. I'm gonna throw something out there. I'll probably get killed. But why are we still paying Northrop Grumman and stuff like that? Dude, I'm just, I'm just saying, like guided missiles right there. Done.
- [63:46]
B
So that's actually an interesting point that you bring up. The news of this comes out. What are the conversations like at places like Northrop Grumman the day after that?
- [64:01]
A
Is that how do we justify a $40,000 drone when 400 ones are working?
- [64:07]
B
Yeah. Or do they hard lateral and say that's the way of the future and we better reinvent who we are and what we're doing.
- [64:13]
A
Right. But they still need to justify a $40,000 drone that.
- [64:17]
B
Yeah.
- [64:17]
A
We all know $400 drones work. Exactly.
- [64:19]
B
$1,000 ones are great. It's.
- [64:21]
A
Ooh. Yep.
- [64:23]
B
Yeah. You know.
- [64:23]
A
Yep, yep. And they have the sticker on them.
- [64:25]
B
They do slightly larger, longer battery life. Yeah, that would be. I mean, if they are not having those conversations, I'd be surprised. That would be a way to call for them like, okay, a nation just got a third of their nuclear not capability, but strategic assets wiped off the face of planet by FPV drones. We should talk. I've seen it in special operations where they have the helmet flip down FPV goggles. I mean, it's definitely. It's going the way of the future for sure.
- [65:02]
A
That's it.
- [65:02]
B
Yeah. What's a day in the life look for you on this last trip you were over there.
- [65:07]
A
Well, we did that capacity building. So we're out there getting up in the morning, going in, teaching throughout the day, making sure classes and everything was done up to standard. And that went on for nine weeks. So the training was over a nine week period. But before that we did an Odessa trip to do some fundraising. About 2,500 bucks from Ukrainian business organizations. Yeah. So we're just going to constantly just keep looking for the. To feed the beast, to keep the teams going, to keep the effort going.
- [65:46]
B
Well, tell me about the company you have put together and structured what you got.
- [65:49]
A
Absolutely, yeah. So Invictus Global Response, of course, we, we put it Together after the incident where we're finally like, you know, we need to quit doing this for other people. We need to do it ourselves. We need to drive it. We need to be. We need to be it.
- [66:03]
B
The incident as when you blew your foot off?
- [66:05]
A
Yeah.
- [66:06]
B
Okay. Is that how we refer to it, as the incident?
- [66:08]
A
Oh, yeah.
- [66:09]
B
How do you. What do you call it?
- [66:10]
A
I don't know. Stumpy? I don't know.
- [66:14]
B
The incident.
- [66:17]
A
There's many things I'm sure my wife, my friends, and everyone else calls it.
- [66:21]
B
I would be very curious as to what they call it, actually.
- [66:24]
A
Well, she did say she's sorry that she didn't make the trip or whatever. She's nursing a little injury or whatever.
- [66:32]
B
Bring her out next time.
- [66:33]
A
Absolutely.
- [66:33]
B
Sit down. Anytime.
- [66:34]
A
Yeah, my problem is I got to keep her away from your shop because we'll leave with all of your tumblers and stuff.
- [66:39]
B
No, I completely can't afford that. I'll hook you up with a great discount of zero percent off.
- [66:44]
A
Hey, perfect. I like zeros. Right now, everyone likes zero.
- [66:48]
B
Or I could charge you double and give you half off. It's your choice.
- [66:51]
A
Interesting.
- [66:52]
B
Yeah.
- [66:53]
A
Sold.
- [66:53]
B
Hashtag savings.
- [66:56]
A
Hey, wiener dogs don't pay for themselves.
- [66:58]
B
They really don't. They're very bougie.
- [67:00]
A
That's it.
- [67:01]
B
Yeah.
- [67:02]
A
Yeah. So, yeah. So after I blew my foot off or sitting in the hospital and. Yeah. Went ahead and just locked it down, went with it, made the organization. And as we grow and develop, we've brought more people on. We've grown the advisory board, and, yeah, we just keep reaching out. We're doing all kinds of different stuff to raise funds. So we got our 401C. Three.
- [67:31]
B
501.
- [67:31]
A
501. Yeah, you're. You're right. Yeah. I'm thinking of the investment. 401. Yeah. 401K. Yeah. The. The 592.14. Nailed it. But, yeah, so we got all that stuff done. We've got. Yeah. We're just slowly building it as we get funds. And sometimes, you know, do, like, buy me a coffee. We got, like, a monthly thing where people can get a patch. You know what I mean? So we just get random patches, and when units donate them, then we just buy a few more extra patches from that unit.
- [68:04]
B
Yeah.
- [68:05]
A
You know, and then it almost pays forward. So sometimes, you know, like, if they have patches, all right, we buy them for five bucks each. They bought them for two.
- [68:11]
B
And then I've seen this buy me a coffee thing. I've seen people doing this. Are they Actually buying you coffee or is it just a small donation?
- [68:17]
A
No, it's just. So a coffee is typically five bucks, right?
- [68:20]
B
Yeah.
- [68:20]
A
So buy someone 10 coffees, that's 50 bucks. So it's just a way.
- [68:24]
B
What are they phrases around the coffee? Why don't they just say small donation?
- [68:28]
A
It's just a new age way thing of doing it. I think I gave you that, that one thing to the buy me a coffee thing. But yeah, it's just another method, just another way. Just like how you have like a donation pages or anything. It's just another way of getting it.
- [68:45]
B
My only optic I've seen it are content creators.
- [68:49]
A
Okay.
- [68:49]
B
And yeah, I was just curious, does this actually go into a coffee fund or is this just a way for people to.
- [68:57]
A
It's just a small donation.
- [68:58]
B
Okay. Yeah, that's my thought. Interesting. All right. What has been the. What's been the hardest part about building the company?
- [69:10]
A
I mean, nothing grows without money in today's thing. But what we have been able to do is through our efforts and passion and our dedication to it, we've also been able to meet and work with and have support from many different organizations, people, communities to allow us to keep doing what we're doing. You know, if we don't have a place to stay or whatever, someone's like, hey, we got a couch and a floor. There you go. So then that's a hotel room. We don't got to do food. All right, well, let's keep it cheap. Go out. All right. Ramen noodles for the day or this. So being frugal, being responsible with what we do have a thing I tell people a lot of times is Whether I had $5 or 5 million, the effort's still going to keep going. The difference between $5 and 5 millions is the magnitude of impact that you'll be able to see. So, you know, five bucks gets us another gallon in the tank so we can go down to the field, we can help support. We can do this. 5 million. It gets us the legal team for us to expedite the humanitarian demining thing. Hire locals, train them, equip them, build their capacity, let them lead the way in the demining for our organization. And eventually, just like everything, as they're sustainable, as they're accredited, as they have the ability to get grants and other contracts to do the demining work and bring stability in the area. And for the Ukrainians, or no matter where we're at in the world, the community that's working there, then we slowly move back and Manage, assist and everything else. But the funds are staying in there. They're self sufficient. And that's the goal from everything is to build their capacity to let them, you know, work on their home. Just like if anyone worked on their own home around here. You're going to take a little bit more care. You're going to care that you get all the weeds out of that for sure. Whereas if you just hire someone to. Yes, I can see what's coming up and no one's going to notice that for a week. So I'll just leave it.
- [71:36]
B
I'll be long gone before that sprouts its head up.
- [71:39]
A
Yep. So. And that's what it is.
- [71:42]
B
What's the hardest part about finding the right people?
- [71:48]
A
Well, it was like I said earlier, there are a lot of people that want to do good or want to do things. It's also managing what if they're coming in to help or support of what it actually looks like. Because if they just take things at like the face value or the scrape of, you know, peeling up back a sticker, it's going to be oh man. D mining this is. There's a lot of efforts to get to the point of demining. So it's the managing expectation. A lot of people think, you know, I'm going to be able to jump right in, I'm going to be able to do stuff. Nope, we got to get this done. There's a demining season because the ground gets too hot if there's. If it's too wet. If we're using a demining machine, the machine gets bogged down. So there's days that we can do things, days that we're gonna have to shift effort. We do more than just the demining. When a strike happens on a building we support the emergency services, go in there and help them in the way that they want help, the way that they need help. And not just coming in, pushing people out of the way. Like I got this. You know, it would work a lot better if we spoke Ukrainian. But you know, there's things what we can do show up the ones that do. Or we have an interpreter that's a volunteer. So no one's getting paid obviously. And I would love to have enough money to where like we can take care of more things for specific people or make sure that specific people are hired because then they'll always be there, you know. And as westerners, we need some of that stuff. But we've been very fortunate. Wrap back around to that. It's. It's Managing the person's expectations, coming in, and figuring out what their true purpose is for them coming over. Because you can be like, oh, I just want to help. And then they come and they're like, well, I want to help, but I want to be on the front lines and this. Okay, so you didn't want to help with just this stuff. You want. Your intent for coming over here is you want to get into the action. You want to do frontline evacuations. You wanted to, you know, drive into a town in a vehicle, collect people up in under two minutes, and drive out before FPV drone hits you. Okay, well, we're currently not doing that, so we're helping from this point back. Or if we are going to help with that, we're going to make sure that mitigation techniques and procedures are in place, because operations and support and all that stops when someone gets injured or killed. So if we can take an extra day to make it safer and no one gets hurt or killed, then the effort continues. But if we have one moment where someone gets hurt or killed, our effort stops for months, if not forever, depending upon how many people or this or that, you know, so there's a lot of risk mitigation that we are putting into it, and we are taking the time. Like, one of the things that we've implemented is if even one person on the team that's going out to go do something that day just has that gut feeling, just something's not right. All right, we don't need to do this. You know, that's it.
- [75:10]
B
How risky is it for you guys over there? Obviously, probably depends on what you're doing.
- [75:13]
A
But, yeah, I mean, like, when I was over there out east, literally drones flying directly over the house, really? And so all they have to do is what do they. Engine malfunction falls down, and then house goes bippity boppity, boop, boop, boop.
- [75:28]
B
Are they. Are they targeting whatever they can, or are they trying to go after military targets first and then it's like, fucking get some if they can't find one.
- [75:43]
A
I would love to say that they're targeting military targets, but that is not what I'm seeing when I show up to the apartment complex, to the school, to the hospital, to the. To the community of houses with no military vehicles in sight? Yeah, so some of it's targeted, you know, like, oh, that is a military facility. That is a, you know, Runway, or that is a, you know, training camp or whatever that they. They were used and 100 vehicles were parked There. That does happen. But then some things. There is not a rhyme or reason or a logical statement you can make to support that they did not target that. Especially when one drone hits, and then 10 minutes later, another one hits the exact same house. That's a civilian house.
- [76:45]
B
How are people, how are the civilians reacting to when they hear those drones? Are they numb to it yet?
- [76:54]
A
No, no. I mean, because when you can hear it, you know it's in the vicinity. So it depends. Like, day, night, whatever. Sometimes you can just look out and it's like a very loud lawnmower.
- [77:03]
B
Yeah.
- [77:04]
A
And so you can hear them. And, you know, at that point, at least with the drones, like the sheets and stuff, you can look and be like, oh, it's 500 meters that way, and it's going that way. Okay, what am I gonna do? Like, me running around is gonna do absolutely nothing. It's gone. And. But then, of course, when you're hearing it, it's getting louder, and you're like, you can't see it. And it's like, okay, people are taking cover. I know. People who still, you know, were, what, how many years and days into it now? They still go to the corridor. They're living in an apartment building. They hear the alarms and they go from their room that has a window into another room, the bathroom, the corridor that, you know, walk into the house where there's no. Or into the apartment on the 25th floor of Skyrise. It's not like it's a penthouse type thing. It's just old style apartment buildings. But they're still going and taking the precautions of doing this. And then you got people that don't do it and people that are ridden with anxiety of just the thought of the air raid alarms going off. There's everyone, and I've met people on all sides of the thing. People are just like, yeah, drone hits like 100 meters away. And they're like, all right, what were we talking about? You know what I mean? Because it's a constant thing for them. And then there's the ones that the alarm goes off and they're just testing it. They're like running for shelter. It's like, okay. And then there's the ones, you know, like myself, I try to figure out what's going on before just running amok. I also try not to go to places on certain days or certain things. It's. I don't try to put myself where it's a really good target of opportunity or a really good way of being somewhere that's Historically this is when it hits like on Sundays. I don't like going out to these big supermarkets or anything else or these big, you know, stores because historically they like to hit large shopping centers on Sundays when people are not doing stuff. And now they have a day off to go get stuff and do things. Hit it on a Tuesday when no one's there. Nope, nope. They'll wait for Sunday.
- [79:34]
B
How much longer do you think your wife's gonna let you do this?
- [79:38]
A
So the answer is never. But that is one thing. Like I got to do some soul search and stuff this last time because I did finally get to go back, get some stuff done, do things. And we are growing as an organization. Part of growing as an organization means when you got more than four or five people, I'm not going to be the one putting my hands in the ground every single day. I have to transition to that CEO, that director role and get the things in position and get the team what they need to be successful. Find the funding, use, utilize the funding in a responsible way to continue to show people we are doing what we tell you we're going to do. And then plus look at the massive impact that we're having with minimal support. So knuckle down everyone. Keep sending it, keep doing it because all we're going to do is just keep winning, winning, winning or something. Yeah. And so I'm transitioning. I know I need to be home, whatever home is and I need to wake up and go to sleep more times in a year next to her in the house with the family than more times away.
- [81:09]
B
Are you tired of going to war zones yet?
- [81:12]
A
No, I'll never be tired of that. But I do have more focus on what's more important and the family is more important.
- [81:21]
B
What do you think IGR will look like post Ukraine? What would your goals for it be?
- [81:25]
A
Well, we are in Southeast Asia as well. We're trying to get over into the Middle east. And this is all projects that people are bringing to us that potentially they will fund to allow us to do that. We always have a place in Africa. Spent many, many, many years throughout Africa. So if we can get stuff going, it all comes down to funding. We are global, we will go anywhere and everywhere and we can do anything. We can find the people that will be best for those spots. We are also US based. And part of that what I'm trying to do right now is to get some funding to get a vehicle that I can use to deliver water, food, pull a trailer, do all that stuff. So when I'm in the States and there's a disaster, and we're in Ohio and there's a tornado, and I can work with the emergency services and go, all right, we're available if you need something moves, something delivered. If you want just hot water brought to a team that's working in this area. We'll set up a tent. We'll do this. We'll do this. We are us, but we are global as well. So if you can't. If you can't do what you're doing at home, then. And you're not set up to do it at home. You're not. Your foundation's not set up, then what are you doing around the world, too? So we try to. Try to show like, this is us. This is what we do. It doesn't matter. We're in the world. We are us based. And we do have efforts over there. But yeah, it's going to continue to grow. It is growing day by day. Hopefully here in the next month or two, we should be having a fundraising event here at. In town.
- [83:21]
B
Or here in town in Kalispell.
- [83:23]
A
Yeah. Or at Whitefish. Trying to figure it out. Literally. It was a lunch conversation with some people yesterday, and over the next week, we're going to figure it out.
- [83:34]
B
Well, do let me know so I can help you promote it.
- [83:36]
A
Absolutely. Yeah. We're going to have a knife made from that piece of very slice.
- [83:42]
B
You could donate the entire thing to me.
- [83:45]
A
Oh, the entire. What about just a piece of it? Just. Just a tip.
- [83:49]
B
I almost had a fin off a Russian missile. It was in my hands, Michael, and he took it back. Selfishly, he wants to raffle it off for money to apparently. Apparently do some kind of good throughout the world.
- [83:58]
A
How. How ungrateful.
- [84:01]
B
What a piece of. Right.
- [84:02]
A
I know. I'm gonna hurt myself later.
- [84:05]
B
It was pretty. Would you say it was a shrike missile?
- [84:07]
A
No, Iskander, listen, I feel like you.
- [84:11]
B
Said shrike, because that sounds cool, but that might be from Call of Duty. Look up in a Scander missile. I'm gonna guess yes. ES Cander, obviously.
- [84:18]
A
Yeah.
- [84:18]
B
With the ice, it's probably esk.
- [84:22]
A
Isk.
- [84:23]
B
Isk. Oh, man. This is where I really need the power of Google. I can phonetically throw shit into there, and it generally corrects for my lack of intelligence. Oh, yeah, there's. Look at that thing. So that's one of the fins on the back.
- [84:41]
A
Yep.
- [84:42]
B
That was what was going to be behind you at your desk, Michael. I swear that's how it fit back here. Not the entire missile, obviously. First off, how would he have gotten that to Montana if it was the entire. This is what I have to deal with, Dr.
- [84:58]
A
Strange. I'm just gonna write it in.
- [84:59]
B
Yeah, this is what I have to deal with. I tell him we were just talking about. It was the fin, right?
- [85:04]
A
Yeah.
- [85:04]
B
He pulls up a picture of a missile which is clearly five times the size of a human being and now jumps to. That's not gonna fit behind my desk.
- [85:13]
A
Well, it wouldn't. Well, I mean, you're right, but we.
- [85:16]
B
I said the thin.
- [85:20]
A
You're not wrong. It depends on how you cut it up and piece it back. Yeah.
- [85:24]
B
Intact, you are correct. That would be two thirds through the ceiling, but. Damn it. Dude, he just put it in his chest on Delta.
- [85:32]
A
Yeah. What was that old show where, like, they got the missile coming out of the house? I don't know, from the 80s or something like that. I can't remember.
- [85:40]
B
You know, it's wild. That's a really big missile. And the fins are really small, comparative to the overall size, not very big. So that's what they're hucking down at the Ukrainians.
- [85:51]
A
That's some of it. I think. If you look up XM101, there's another one. XM101, is it. Just put it in missile, not middle. There you go.
- [86:09]
B
Oh, boy. That looks a little bit more cruise missile. Ish.
- [86:14]
A
Yep. Right there.
- [86:16]
B
What is that, a turbine engine underneath there in the back? Huh?
- [86:23]
A
That's a Hawk over there. Yeah, yeah. Then they send glide bombs. So basically take a bomb, attach a wing package to it, and then it increases its, you know, distance by whatever.
- [86:39]
B
Yep, yep.
- [86:39]
A
Just a glide bomb. So they can drop them and just let them glide for however far they want to glide.
- [86:46]
B
What do most EOD guys do when they exit the military? I mean, obviously you could go direct and keep doing that for a government or federal agency. Do they kind of go to the wind or do a lot of people take those skills and apply them directly?
- [87:00]
A
It really is all over the place. Like, I have a friend who, when he got out, Marine eodtech. Well, now he's flying airplanes, transport airplanes. So got his pilot's license and flies all over the world. So from playing with bombs to flying buttons.
- [87:20]
B
Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's. It's one of those skill sets where, you know, any of those tiny communities in the military really good at your job, Limited job, direct job options. Inside of that, I would imagine police and federal agencies probably pull heavily from that community, but there's only so many of those.
- [87:44]
A
Yep. Yeah. And then like especially police and stuff, depending upon what year, whatever it's going on. A lot of police organizations have restrictions on when you can become a bomb tech. Like I think at New York Police you have to be do 10 years in the force before you become a bomb tech.
- [88:05]
B
I feel like there should probably be a carve out there for guys coming in from there.
- [88:09]
A
Should probably be a thing where like.
- [88:11]
B
I get it, because they want you to be disarmed.
- [88:13]
A
A thousand bombs.
- [88:14]
B
Yeah.
- [88:15]
A
Our guys with 20 something years have done seven. You know, it's like. Yeah, should probably want to take this guy on now. He should do additional duties and learn.
- [88:26]
B
He needs to be a cop too.
- [88:28]
A
Yeah, he needs to be a cop, but maybe bring him on there. So. Yeah, yeah. There's all kinds of fun missiles. What else is there?
- [88:38]
B
What are your thoughts?
- [88:39]
A
The POM2, if you want to see what that. Yeah, POM2. Mine, mine, mine, mine. Yep.
- [88:51]
B
Yeah, here we are.
- [88:53]
A
Yep.
- [88:53]
B
So this is a live one. Michael, are you ready to disarm this?
- [88:56]
A
Yes.
- [88:58]
B
I'll let you talk through it.
- [88:59]
A
Yeah, no, this is just as long.
- [89:01]
B
As you keep it above the bottom arm of your microphone right there, people be able to see it. Yep, yep.
- [89:07]
A
Yeah.
- [89:08]
B
So can you see that in this frame? Good.
- [89:09]
A
Yeah, we just got a few sirens, huh?
- [89:13]
B
Yeah.
- [89:13]
A
Air alert. Not easy.
- [89:16]
B
Probably just an old lady needs a sandwich, right?
- [89:18]
A
Yeah, I need a sandwich. Double turkey. I went to a dark place. No. Yeah, we just had some. Just random things. Just things that you can see. But this is a palm too, obviously. Much smaller and showing the different parts on top and how it lays out.
- [89:38]
B
So that thing spits out wires.
- [89:40]
A
Yep. You can see them up top. The springs.
- [89:42]
B
Yep. Hit that second image, Michael. Yep, Right there. It looks like it's a good one. Of course it's tiny.
- [89:52]
A
Yeah. And they just spring out and throw those things and it's about over.
- [89:56]
B
Would that be on the surface?
- [89:57]
A
Yep, just sitting on the surface.
- [89:59]
B
And you're saying real size? Like this is a 12. What is this? A 12 ounce can of water? It would be maybe a little bit bigger.
- [90:07]
A
People just bounce that size.
- [90:09]
B
Okay.
- [90:10]
A
But about that wide. So more like the rim of your cup.
- [90:13]
B
And are people just placing them on the ground?
- [90:15]
A
No, these are the ones that are scatterable. So they get launched out of the system and they just hit the ground and then they pop out of their canister and then they pop up like that.
- [90:23]
B
How do they write themselves? Is it just.
- [90:25]
A
It's just a spring. So Whenever this hits the ground, it'll land on its side.
- [90:28]
B
Yeah.
- [90:29]
A
And then whenever these spring out.
- [90:31]
B
Yep.
- [90:32]
A
It'll push it up.
- [90:33]
B
And then. Is it a delay in this? And then.
- [90:35]
A
Yeah, and then the wires go out.
- [90:38]
B
What are we saying? Half pound pole?
- [90:39]
A
Yeah. I want to say it should be on there. I think it's like 0.25 kgs, which about half.
- [90:45]
B
Michael. Jesus, man.
- [90:47]
A
Yeah.
- [90:47]
B
I was looking up a video of it. Oh, that would be also amazing.
- [90:50]
A
Yeah. Hold on.
- [90:51]
B
We'll scroll down on this though.
- [90:52]
A
Yeah. Let's see what it says. Does it say.
- [90:54]
B
What do we got here? Anti personnel fragmentation.
- [90:56]
A
Mind.
- [90:56]
B
High explosive fragmentation tripwire. Anti personnel. Keep going down another thing. Upright position. Keep going. Four spring loaded spools.
- [91:07]
A
It just won't tell you on here. It tells you on different websites. It's just this one. You can.
- [91:12]
B
Did you find a video of it, Michael? Yeah. Yeah. Oh, damn. There you go.
- [91:19]
A
Yep.
- [91:21]
B
I don't like anything that smokes like that on the ground. So that would be it deploying.
- [91:28]
A
Yep. See now look at that thing. And then, now the springs went everywhere.
- [91:35]
B
What was that little thing that hopped around? Was that just the cat?
- [91:37]
A
That was the cap that springs in it. Why.
- [91:41]
B
Why are you walking up to this?
- [91:42]
A
Why wouldn't you?
- [91:48]
B
Yeah. I'm very untrusting of anything on the ground shaped like that. Smoking. I'm gonna be real honest with you.
- [91:53]
A
Yeah. So maybe like a monster energy.
- [91:54]
B
Yeah.
- [91:55]
A
Drink.
- [91:55]
B
Yeah.
- [91:55]
A
Size. And then it folds itself up. Man. And then that top. That's the top.
- [92:00]
B
Gotcha.
- [92:01]
A
You see the wires going out? That's it. And then it's ready to go. Hello.
- [92:08]
B
Human beings are pretty gnarly. What's the kill radius on that thing?
- [92:14]
A
Just a few meters. But casually causing.
- [92:19]
B
Don't you dare click on the rugby, Michael. He's like, I'm playing rugby on Saturday next. You know, we're watching the All Blacks just annihilate people.
- [92:27]
A
Yeah.
- [92:30]
B
I have. There's a lot of talk from certain people in the intel world about this world, about this insider attack.
- [92:38]
A
Right. Okay.
- [92:39]
B
There's a threat. Sometimes it's tied to the influx of immigration in the previous administration. Whole conversation to have about that. What level of concern do you have about IEDs fighting their way back to the US.
- [92:57]
A
IEDs are in the US.
- [92:59]
B
Are they really in. I mean, the capability to make them for sure. The people with the knowledge. Are you aware of anybody that's actually finding those on the regular?
- [93:07]
A
Well, it's the biggest thing that you got to realize first is America is Massive. So there is an actual tracker where you can determine, like, how many explosive incidents have happened in a year. And it'll tell you, like, if it was a find, if it was an id, if it was a pipe bomb, all this stuff. And there's something about, like, our last time I looked, I was years ago, but it was like two incidents a day in the US Really. And it could just be something as simple as they found materials. So it wasn't a built up thing. Someone put a bag out and said, you know, this is a bomb. And it was just a backpack that was empty. So not every single one of them is a device.
- [93:51]
B
You hear pipe bombs and stuff from time to time. I'm talking more like the pressure plate, buried type stuff.
- [93:59]
A
If it was happening, it would probably be on the border.
- [94:02]
B
Think so? Yeah. Yeah. That would be a level of complexity and carnage that I don't. I don't think people are quite prepared for, mentally.
- [94:14]
A
Nope.
- [94:15]
B
Yeah. That would change, I think, the calculus of a lot of decisions.
- [94:20]
A
I mean, it would definitely shut the border down.
- [94:25]
B
Yeah. But then, you know, there's just the Canadian border. Did you know that there's the same size fence between Canada and the U.S. as there is between Mexico and the U.S. go on. No, I'm just joking. There's no fence at all.
- [94:36]
A
Yeah, as I said.
- [94:41]
B
Border ever. There's like some trees and stuff.
- [94:43]
A
It's the fence of. Sorry.
- [94:45]
B
Yeah, sorry.
- [94:45]
A
He crossed the line. Sorry, bud.
- [94:47]
B
Yeah, it's. I don't know. The more that the southern border gets cracked down on, you know, the northern border doesn't get talked about as much.
- [94:57]
A
Yep.
- [94:58]
B
It's. I don't know. I think a motivated person is going to find a way either way.
- [95:01]
A
No, absolutely. Absolutely. Like, will it make it more difficult if we can control our point of entry, point of exit and all this stuff? Absolutely. It'll make it more difficult. Does a lock on a door stop a criminal from breaking in your house? No. If someone wants to do it, they're gonna do it. I mean, and it all depends on how secret and how. Whatever they really want to be.
- [95:31]
B
Yeah.
- [95:32]
A
Because, I mean, how secret was the. The FPV drones or the. The drone attack on the Russian planes?
- [95:42]
B
Yeah.
- [95:42]
A
To the point where the US Was like, why didn't y' all tell us you were doing this? You know, like, if you want to do something and you're motivated and you're disciplined, things are gonna happen.
- [95:57]
B
What do you want to do outside of stopping things from blowing up? Can you keep that Igr Page up Michael. Just because I want to be able to point people towards where they can support.
- [96:09]
A
Yeah, like in what? What capacity? I want to be more in the community, like when I am home.
- [96:15]
B
You mean like the hoa? You want to be president of the hoa? First off, fuck you, Karen. Present hoa. I'll put my goddamn garbage cans where I want. I don't want to hear your fucking feedback about mowing the lawn. 39.5% chance that the head of the HOA is named Karen or Kathy. Probably tumbler full of iced chardonnay. Bad attitude, golf cart.
- [96:46]
A
Oh, no, I. I want to get more involved in the community. It's the same thing whenever we're over there. It's like I just enjoy.
- [96:54]
B
Yeah.
- [96:54]
A
Doing stuff. I mean, I wish.
- [96:56]
B
What is your main hobby? Outside of stopping bombs from blowing up?
- [96:59]
A
Oh, I mean, do you get changes? I do like making jewelry. I haven't done it for a few years now.
- [97:05]
B
Yeah, jewelry. Like coverings.
- [97:07]
A
Yeah. Or finger rings. Or both.
- [97:10]
B
Some people those are interchangeable.
- [97:12]
A
Yes, absolutely. I know. I mean, I've heard.
- [97:18]
B
How'd you get into jewelry making?
- [97:20]
A
I was. During the whole covet thing. Just had extra time and had the. I've been collecting gemstones and rocks all around the world forever. So it's like I got all these things that we got to do something with it. And do you do sports?
- [97:35]
B
Mountain biking, skiing, snowmobiling, like anything else?
- [97:39]
A
No, no. I mean, I like to hang out with people or go do stuff or go fishing like the kids had. The day after I got back, they had a fishing derby. So I went down there and all three. The. My. My son and his cousins, they all won a fishing rod, so it was pretty cool. But they caught a catfish. They caught some other stuff.
- [98:02]
B
If you were.
- [98:03]
A
Yeah.
- [98:03]
B
If somebody were to say to you, okay, you never get to work in the field you're working in now again, you can't even touch it. Don't get to research it. What do you think you'd do with your life?
- [98:16]
A
Depends where I live.
- [98:17]
B
Wherever you want to.
- [98:18]
A
Okay. Well, if I was living down there on the coast, fishing boat, deep sea fishing. Done.
- [98:23]
B
Okay.
- [98:24]
A
Just be a. Be a pirate. You're already. Already part way there, so.
- [98:31]
B
Yeah, I think you need to lose more of your leg and get a wooden. You could get a parrot, though.
- [98:36]
A
Yes.
- [98:36]
B
Which would be dope.
- [98:38]
A
And I can, you know, I always just use that. That laminate, you know, wood looking stuff. So it looks like it's a big wood thing.
- [98:45]
B
Yeah.
- [98:46]
A
But you know, like I do like fishing. Landlocked. Yeah. I don't know. Probably like a. Just a little shop. Something that I can just like chill at. Especially if it was just all paid off and it didn't matter about bringing in and having to grow something big. I know it was just a point of where the community comes together. So have a little bit of space, set up barbecues, let, you know, bring fundraising events together, bring people together and just literally have my own little place I go. Like, all right, this weekend Steve O's bringing the 15 Foot Grill trailer. So. And so, you know, just organize.
- [99:31]
B
Yeah.
- [99:32]
A
Community events. Organize just people being together and you know, when someone needs help, like. Oh yeah, no, get like 10 guys over there help you move all the stuff out of your house and into the next house or whatever. Just. Just enjoy time within the community. Really the biggest thing.
- [99:47]
B
Yeah.
- [99:48]
A
I don't have like a job I'd like to do or want to do.
- [99:51]
B
I only ask because it's. It. I think the more balance you can have between where you're going and the things that you're seeing and something back home, I mean, there's a burden and a weight to what you're doing.
- [100:01]
A
Yep.
- [100:02]
B
I think having a stress release valve and maybe that is just interfacing with community and friends and. But I don't think there's any right or wrong because I think we all have a different volume that we can handle of that stress and we all have a different relief valve as well. Yeah. Jewelry. What's the coolest piece you've ever made?
- [100:22]
A
I mean, made some chains and stuff like that. Like Cuban links, but a little like just some pendants with putting some emeralds in them and stuff like that. Those are pretty fun.
- [100:34]
B
So what'd you do with them?
- [100:37]
A
Yeah, this lady gave me the money and I didn't. I don't charge anything for him. Is literally just pay for the materials because I'm learning.
- [100:43]
B
Yeah.
- [100:43]
A
And so that's all it's ever been. It doesn't work well when I'm going back and forth, back and forth. Still got some stuff to guess that actually. I know we still got some stuff to unload from the garage and finish getting the house set up so I can put my bench together, get the, you know, oxygen and the propane tank so I can get my torch, get all the stuff, get a few different things and then so I can make stuff. So I mean, it'd be great if someone's like getting out of the industry and they're just like, ah, I'LL just donate all the tools or all the. The. The, you know, the furnace, all the different pieces and everything you need in order to do jewelry making. But, yeah, I'll just have to start piecing together because there are some things you can do where you don't need all the fancy stuff.
- [101:29]
B
Yeah.
- [101:29]
A
You know, you just pour a line, and then now you have this little gold bar. Run it through, you know, stretch it, pull it, shape it, cut it, solder it together. And the next thing you know, you have a basic ring. Yeah. You know, then add some prongs to it and then put a little stone on top. Now you have a ring with a stone on it, and you can build it up from scratch. But there's easier ways. You know, you make a carving out of wax, and then you put it into. Into this mold, and you set that, you burn that out, and then you take it over here, flip it over while it's hot, pour your metal into it. It pulls it into it, and then. Made the process more efficient.
- [102:13]
B
Yeah, for sure. You got me thinking when you were saying tools.
- [102:18]
A
You'Re a tool, so.
- [102:20]
B
Oh, definitely. Michael. Kid Michael 100 tell you that? No, I'm thinking.
- [102:26]
A
Okay, go on.
- [102:28]
B
You gotta. You're gonna do EOD stuff, but you can only take three tools with you. What are you taking? Like, what are the most important tools for an EOD guy? Strip away, like, the knowledge and like, whatever. You can have whatever resource you want, but you don't necessarily know what you're gonna have to disarm. But you can only take three things.
- [102:44]
A
What would you take a Gerber with a punch? Ed Gerber or Leatherman, Whatever. Multi tool. A rope.
- [102:57]
B
Yeah.
- [102:57]
A
Just for some kind of hook. That's it.
- [103:00]
B
To be able to, like, move it.
- [103:01]
A
To remote move it. So even if you get yourself 20 meters away.
- [103:04]
B
Yeah.
- [103:05]
A
And you're pulling on something, it blows up every meter, every foot totally matters.
- [103:09]
B
Plus also dig a little hole for yourself, you know?
- [103:11]
A
Yep. Yeah. A little defilade. I like to hide behind the tree that's about that big around, you know what I mean?
- [103:17]
B
Totally.
- [103:18]
A
If I can't see it, it can't see me.
- [103:19]
B
Just let it all tuck it all in.
- [103:24]
A
Plastic surgery.
- [103:25]
B
That's it.
- [103:25]
A
Across my entire waist.
- [103:27]
B
Just multi tool. A rope and a hook. Okay. All right. I like where your head's at. What is the. Explain to me this.
- [103:35]
A
Yeah, it's just a standard. It's just a standard mine sign. So let you know that there's dangers in the area, obviously, like, depending upon what country you're in. If you're in Cambodia, it'd be written in Cambodian.
- [103:47]
B
Yeah, Cambodianese.
- [103:49]
A
Yeah, Cambodianise. And yeah, the most typical thing is red and white.
- [103:56]
B
Yeah.
- [103:56]
A
You can add the different stuff to bring it out. And they can be made out of plastic, they could be made out of on a metal tin, but that's just your standard.
- [104:08]
B
And this one's from Ukraine.
- [104:09]
A
Yep, from Ukraine.
- [104:11]
B
Michael, this goes behind you.
- [104:13]
A
From.
- [104:13]
B
From how much of your camera angle though, can you see other than the flag?
- [104:18]
A
We could put it like right here.
- [104:20]
B
Okay, yeah. Good. Yeah. It needs to be displayed.
- [104:22]
A
Yeah.
- [104:23]
B
This will just show that Michael is dangerous.
- [104:25]
A
He's dangerous.
- [104:26]
B
Yeah.
- [104:27]
A
You can see it. Not when he walks.
- [104:29]
B
Right now, this means actually Michael for those of you. This is Michael in Russian Ukraine. Starts with an N. That's it.
- [104:36]
A
Nailed it.
- [104:39]
B
What else you want people to know about? How can people support you? Been at it for a couple hours. I want to get you out of here and join.
- [104:43]
A
No, absolutely.
- [104:44]
B
So there's obviously we're @invictus global response.org and this is great because people can find out about what you guys do, but if they want to support the mission of making things not go boom.
- [104:56]
A
Yeah, not only that, we also support through doing the humanitarian emergency response capacity buildings. They put people on their. Oh, yeah, perfect.
- [105:06]
B
Right on. There's a donation section just on the main page, if you scroll down.
- [105:10]
A
Yep. And we're still working on it. We're actually trying to revamp the website. Getting a lot of feedback from people that do this stuff for a living. Because we only know what we know. Yeah, we definitely don't know what we don't know.
- [105:22]
B
It's amazing. A super slick, high end website, man.
- [105:25]
A
It.
- [105:26]
B
It will draw people in.
- [105:27]
A
Yep. And the biggest thing, like they said, is it needs to be for the donation stuff. It needs to be one click. You know, if you have to go through an entire process, people lose their focus.
- [105:38]
B
So just click it every time you put a barrier up the.
- [105:42]
A
Because people want to support. Yeah, yeah, people want to support, but then they just get lost. And I don't know. And that's all of us. There's my wife on the right. There's John Prior, Air Force. There's Stu Prior, army combat engineer. And then of course, I love how ugly guy on the left.
- [106:01]
B
Each of those pictures, they're all looking at the camera. They're engaged.
- [106:05]
A
Except for me.
- [106:07]
B
Steely, you know, blue steel from Stu there. And you are literally bored out of your mind in a meeting, not paying attention not bored.
- [106:15]
A
I'm contemplating the world domination takeover. All right. Yeah. But support in any way. Biggest thing that we're going right now is we're trying to reach a point for our organization to have stability, that we can start going after grants, start going after different funds from, you know, government, non government organizations. But if anyone has any information or they know a philanthropist or they want to do a. A donation event or some kind of drive, or they want to support us in any way, reach out. I'm game to do literally anything to keep the mission, to keep the guys, to keep the girls, to keep the help flowing. There you go.
- [107:03]
B
You're gonna get some nice requests.
- [107:04]
A
Yep.
- [107:04]
B
And we're not game for anything.
- [107:06]
A
For anything. Remember the foot thing?
- [107:09]
B
Whips and chains? Oh, you could. Your only feet page would be interesting at this point. Would it be only foot?
- [107:16]
A
Well, I can.
- [107:18]
B
You could.
- [107:19]
A
I can definitely do a healing now.
- [107:20]
B
Dude, you could stand out in the crowd of the only feet. You could be the only foot. I guess. No pun intended.
- [107:32]
A
Every time I try to kick a ball, it just doesn't work.
- [107:37]
B
Yeah, they're just like, what in the actual Is wrong with you, too?
- [107:42]
A
Nothing. My mama said I was a beautiful, healthy baby boy. My.
- [107:45]
B
I've tried to explain to my wife, who has no real touch points with people in the military. We have. We have a buddy that does jiu jitsu with us, and he's in a wheelchair. And I make fun of him, and I tell him that I think he can actually walk. And that's what he does when he goes home at night. He has blackout curtains and he's walking. And she. Probably one of the maddest times that she ever got with me, I think. Or she wasn't mad. She was appalled at the human being that I was. She basically was like, you can't fucking say that. I'm like, first off, I just did.
- [108:24]
A
I've used that same thing. I just did.
- [108:26]
B
And secondly, I guarantee you he appreciates it. And she finally asked him about it. He's like, no, that's how we talk to each other. So she just still doesn't get it. But, dude, if we work together, I'm making foot. I'm making fun of your club foot. Every day your call sign is going to be whatever it might be, five toes or some shit like that. Like, that's how you know, you care.
- [108:51]
A
Yeah. I was gonna say, you know, how you know that you're not part of a team.
- [108:54]
B
Yeah. They're not with you.
- [108:55]
A
Not with you.
- [108:56]
B
That's when you should be worried.
- [108:58]
A
Yeah.
- [108:58]
B
Yeah.
- [108:58]
A
Are you worried yet?
- [109:00]
B
Michael's.
- [109:01]
A
Well, I get fucked with all the time so I'm feeling pretty good.
- [109:03]
B
Can you imagine the weapon he's being forged in too as a 23 year old man? Just it's a crucible of life.
- [109:07]
A
He's a man in the eyes of the law.
- [109:11]
B
In the eyes of the law. Yes.
- [109:12]
A
I didn't want to assume.
- [109:13]
B
Yeah. I guess now you should ask.
- [109:17]
A
Yes.
- [109:18]
B
But yeah. She was utterly appalled and I'm like I don't know how to explain it. Like it's okay.
- [109:26]
A
Yeah. All right. Have a. Now I guess the other big thing is I showed you the. The demining machine we're trying to do which is going to help us.
- [109:35]
B
Oh yeah. Pull that up.
- [109:36]
A
Michael, let me tell you a little bit.
- [109:39]
B
Okay. This is your X or twitter invictus_gr.
- [109:45]
A
Yep. So when we were trying to push for this of course whenever you get an invoice it only lasts for so long. Yeah. So we kind of missed the window for the machine that would have cost at about 21k. It changed just spin and yeah, they spin and beat.
- [109:59]
B
Beat the shot of the ground. Yeah.
- [110:00]
A
Yep. They. It's a flail type. But demining machines are typically hundreds of thousands of dollars if not million plus and then to run them can be tens of thousands of dollars a month.
- [110:11]
B
Okay.
- [110:12]
A
With innovation and stuff that they've done, this company has basically made a small demining machine and currently our ticket price because they have made a bunch of improvements. There is a GPS package on it now that we missed the window to get it in the older version. So it is 29,000 something dollars. I can look it up essentially $30,000. So we. But we have been able to work with them. We've got the machine ordered as of this week. So and we have time to try to close that last about nine thousand dollar gap. So the biggest thing is we're trying to do that one thing that we can do or what we're trying to do is try to make this the NASCAR in the demining world. Oh, I like where if you wanted cleared hot right there and you want to pay for a demining machine right there, that little robot face is bam. And then every time we come across mines we can just send you the video.
- [111:10]
B
I just want a picture of Michael's face.
- [111:12]
A
We could. I mean it only cost you like 30 grand to have that.
- [111:16]
B
You could be a hero to the Ukrainian people, Michael.
- [111:20]
A
Yeah. And then currently it's. We're looking at about $2,200 a month just to run it. Yeah. So fuel replacement, change, replacement parts. This machine's actually done fairly well. It's, it's. They've tested it, ran over anti tank mines and within an hour they've had it back up and running. So it's, it's taking hits, it's doing what it's supposed to do and yeah. So I mean I wish we would have met our goal in time to, to meet that first invoice. But it's not a loss because the increase actually has more features and more safety. The gps, the, the additional camera. So it's, it is better. And they are working with us because we are a small organization to, to make sure that we don't have to have that 90% up front down. They're just going to do it and then we'll worry about and we'll figure out the payments. So that's the biggest thing. If anyone wants their own NASCAR machine.
- [112:24]
B
I like it.
- [112:25]
A
Demining machine. Hit us up.
- [112:26]
B
You could aggregate it across individuals and brands too. I mean you could actually get quite nascari with it.
- [112:31]
A
Yep. So if you wanted it the sole responsibility or the sole thing right there on top. 30 grand. We'll get that thing. We'll have your. Have whatever logo, whatever you want on it. Or if we can get a bunch of 5k donations, we can do six logos across it.
- [112:49]
B
You know, be cool.
- [112:51]
A
And then just once a week just refresh it because it's going to get beat up.
- [112:55]
B
Yeah. What else, man? What do you want to close it out with, man?
- [113:00]
A
I mean where do we begin? At the end? No. First and foremost, thank you for having me back.
- [113:06]
B
Of course. So you have an open invite, man. Anytime.
- [113:09]
A
Appreciate it.
- [113:10]
B
As long as you keep bringing signs and all Right. Fins and missiles.
- [113:14]
A
Yeah. I'll have to figure out what else to bring you next time.
- [113:18]
B
If you can bring a live piece of ordinance that we could put on Michael's desk that he has to disarm before leaving, that would be pretty amazing.
- [113:26]
A
I'm not saying I can't go to the stores right now and make that happen.
- [113:31]
B
Yeah.
- [113:31]
A
Can we do that?
- [113:32]
B
And I'm. Oh for clarity, you get a multi tool and a hook and a rope. Michael.
- [113:35]
A
Yep. Well, you, you. One thing that you have seen or have you seen about Ukraine is like the innovation 3D printing, right?
- [113:43]
B
Yeah.
- [113:44]
A
So they're making a lot of their own stuff because demand for all this ordinance stuff. So yeah. There are things that are being 3D printed stuff and I'LL bring one or send it to you in the mail because it's all ffe. There's no explosion or anything. But, yeah, you have a little. Little landmine that's been 3D printed.
- [114:03]
B
Yes.
- [114:04]
A
And if it didn't go with me, it would have gone the other way. So. Yeah, yeah, I'll get you one over here.
- [114:11]
B
Open invite. Anytime, man. Anytime you're in the area, let me know. Let me know about the dinner fundraiser thing. I'll do everything I can to help spread the word for it.
- [114:17]
A
No, absolutely. So whether it's $5 or $5 million, if anyone out there has anyone any ideas, put me in front of somebody, or, you know, they want that. That tax break or whatever, and they just got to get rid of money. Sometimes people just need to lose 10,000 to save 50,000. Sometimes big organizations need to lose 10 million to save a hundred million. It's. It's a thing. So if, you know, people reach out to them, see what they do on that buy me a coffee link. You can get part of, like, the patch of the month, where we get different patches while we're over there, and then we send you a patch, so. And it just goes to supporting the general cost. I think we got 14 or 15 people signed up, but if we had 100 people signed up to that, we would be able to cover food, fuel, and what do you call that, housing for the team. Currently, as is, you know, we're looking to basically be able to pull in about 3,500amonth, which will cover costs and cover basic maintenance and other stuff. So that's our operational budget right now. And for the most part, we just go out and get sporadic jobs here and there and then keep doing what we're doing. But the goal is to be able to have this as our 100% focus. So that's why I'm shifting over to the more fundraising, the more advocacy, the more we got to get this thing going. We got to support the team.
- [115:38]
B
You're going to have to do that to go to the next level.
- [115:40]
A
So, I mean, to close it all out is just always follow us, see what you can do. Got any ideas? Someone just sent us something, I believe, off of Twitter, actually. They got this wood plaque with a soldier with wings coming off of it and a shield. A shield. And it's got a saying on it. It should be coming in today at the house. I got a picture. It's on the Twitter somewhere. But look, guy does really cool woodwork, burning stuff, so.
- [116:09]
B
Yeah, cool, man. Well, I'm glad you're out there doing what you're doing. We'll get you back out to Montana. You gotta. Today's a good day. Huge white, puffy Montana summer clouds. Not too hot.
- [116:22]
A
Yeah. Yesterday there was this that we're walking around, it was just slightly cloudy and then for like two minutes just absolute downpour. You know. I'm not gonna lie, I didn't step out into the rain and ah, enjoyed it a little bit just. But yeah.
- [116:37]
B
Well, cool, man. Until next time.
- [116:38]
A
Absolutely.
- [116:39]
B
Hell yeah. Thanks man. Where you work is important. It's part of who you are and who you're going to be. At Providence, we want you to grow where you work. We want you to glow where you work. We want you to succeed and laugh and belong where you work. We want you to love where you work. No matter your role or experience level. We'll help you reach your goals. So here you can love where you work. View Openrolls at Providence Jobs Love.