Best of NFL News Part 2: Browns DODGE Shedeur, Jets STRUGGLE, Richardson DISSED?!

Summary

Club Shay Shay: Best of NFL News Part 2 – Browns DODGE Shedeur, Jets STRUGGLE, Richardson DISSED?!

Podcast: Club Shay Shay
Date: November 1, 2025
Host: Shannon Sharpe (Shay Shay Media)
Guests: Bucky Brooks, Ocho (Chad Johnson), Daniel Jeremiah
Episode Theme:
The episode covers the most compelling storylines and debates around NFL quarterback controversies, team struggles and management decisions, with a particular focus on the Cleveland Browns quarterback situation, the Minnesota Vikings’ QB woes, the value of elite skill players, and blockbuster trade rumors.

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Episode Overview

This episode of Club Shay Shay dives deep into quarterback debates around the NFL, with a primary focus on the Cleveland Browns' reluctance to play rookie Shedeur Sanders, the Minnesota Vikings’ puzzling benching of J.J. McCarthy amidst QB injuries, and critical analysis of front office decision-making. The co-hosts debate whether coaching staffs are "protecting" their reputations at the expense of team success and dish on wide receiver duos, trade rumors, and the art and science of player development and team-building.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Cleveland Browns' Quarterback Saga (02:51–14:53)

• Joe Flacco Benched; Rookie Dylan Gabriel Struggles
  • The Browns’ decision to stick with Dylan Gabriel, despite a 1-3 record as a starter, frustrated both fans and analysts. The question of whether Shedeur Sanders will get an opportunity is brought up repeatedly in the Cleveland media.
  • Quote (Bucky Brooks, 03:17): “Y'all know this man don't want to play Shedeur.”
• Organizational Politics and Player Development
  • Ocho explains that Shedeur was an Andrew Berry ("not Stefanski or the owner") pick, suggesting a lack of organizational alignment.
  • There's a sentiment that the Browns are inventing injury excuses (e.g., back tightness) to keep Shedeur sidelined.
• Concerns About Losing the Locker Room
  • Ocho highlights leadership risks when a coach “stands on the table” for a QB who’s not producing.
  • Memorable moment (05:08): “At some point, you’re gonna lose the locker room, too, huh? ... It just takes the right person to say something. A Denzel Ward, a Miles Garrett...”
• Shedeur’s Instagram Likes and Public Pressure
  • Shedeur Sanders reportedly liked posts calling for him to be the starter, indicating his own desire and growing public support.
• Coaching and Playcalling Constraints
  • Both agree that scheme limitations and weak skill positions hamper the offense, but also question whether the OC is doing enough to “hide” Gabriel’s flaws via creative playcalling.

Notable Quotes

• Ocho (04:58): “What we’re asking of in order for you to win games, [Dylan Gabriel is] not giving the Browns their best chance...Offensively, we not getting it done, knowing the check needs to be made.”
• Bucky Brooks (06:19): “Push Shedeur, man. They don't seem as interested in putting Shador in as we're interested in seeing him.”

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2. Minnesota Vikings & the QB Carousel (23:03–34:44)

• J.J. McCarthy’s Extended Absence
  • Co-hosts skeptical about the “high ankle sprain” excuse for keeping McCarthy out six weeks.
  • Ocho: “You know goodwill, ain’t nothing wrong with that ankle.” (25:06)
• Regret Over Losing Sam Darnold
  • Consensus that Minnesota is paying the price for letting Darnold walk after his solid season.
  • Ocho: “You don’t let a quarterback...that can maximize everything you want to do offensively...walk out the door.” (23:48)
• Front Office Gamble and Player Development
  • Discussion of team-friendly contracts, QBs sitting and learning (e.g., Jordan Love, Aaron Rodgers), and concerns over investing in a 1st-round pick who isn’t ready.
  • Bucky Brooks (31:34): “I don't have to make a decision on J.J. McCarthy until year four, going into year five...But Sam Darnold is [only] 28.”
• QB Weaknesses Will Get Exposed
  • Ocho spotlights how talented WRs can mask a QB’s flaws, but only for so long.
  • “With Addison, Hockenson, and Justin Jefferson, you have so much talent...if you can’t throw the ball to them, you don’t belong.”

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3. Critical Analysis: Skill Players and Playcalling (10:40–39:40)

• Wide Receiver Duo Debates
  • Ocho claims his team's duo is better than Dallas’, with a lively back-and-forth:
    • “Not only do I believe that our duo is better than Dallas's duo…but because of Jamar Chase, it edged us out.” (11:00)
  • Praise for aggressive receivers like Pickens and dynamic duos like Chase/Higgins.
• Artistry of Slot Play and Yards After Catch
  • Ocho and Brooks analyze Cooper Kupp, JSN, and Puka Nacua’s ability to thrive in the right system. They highlight how creative OC playcalling can allow big target WRs to dominate, as Kupp did in his Triple Crown season.

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4. NFL Trade Rumors: Miles Garrett and the Eagles (58:33–66:35)

• Eagles "All-In" on Miles Garrett
  • Discussed the rumored trade package: three first-round picks and a player for Garrett.
  • Analyzing which players the Browns might want back, with Ocho arguing, “It’s damn well worth it. One thing about Howie Roseman, if you watch the way he maneuvers...he’s pushing all his chips in.”
• Locker Room and Star WR Discontent
  • They speculate about A.J. Brown’s targets, his happiness, and whether he could be included in a deal.
  • Bucky: “All we can go by is body language. Something’s going on—AJ doesn’t seem happy...He’s looking at a 1-uno up in Cincinnati. That man got 42 targets. I haven’t got 42 all year.” (62:55)
• Draft, Develop, and Pay Model
  • The Detroit Lions are lauded for their approach: “We drafted them, we developed them, we paid them.” (65:10)
  • Ocho and Brooks praise the importance of drafting both talent and the right character.

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5. Defensive Line Play & Player Criticism (50:09–58:33)

• Carl Banks Criticizes Dexter Lawrence
  • Banks claims “Nobody respects you anymore” regarding DL Dexter Lawrence’s performance.
  • Ocho responds: “I’m not sure what Mr. Banks is watching...Every first down it’s gonna be a double team. If they weren't scared of him anymore, they wouldn't be [doing that].” (52:28)
• Perspective on Double Teams and Defensive Greatness
  • Brooks: “You and I both know, when you become that guy, you can’t give excuses. We pay you to be that guy.” (53:13)
  • Ocho: “You gotta realize they got 600 pounds rooting your ass up out of there.” (55:51)
• Discussion of Aaron Donald’s Skill
  • The group marvel at Donald’s ability to split double teams through quickness and “making himself skinny.”

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Ocho (04:58): “What we’re asking of in order for you to win games, [Dylan Gabriel is] not giving the Browns their best chance...Offensively, we not getting it done, knowing the check needs to be made.”
• Bucky Brooks (06:19): “Push Shedeur, man. They don't seem as interested in putting Shador in as we're interested in seeing him.”
• Ocho (11:00): “Not only do I believe that our duo is better than Dallas's duo…but because of Jamar Chase, it edged us out.”
• Brooks (31:34): “I don't have to make a decision on J.J. McCarthy until year four, going into year five...But Sam Darnold is [only] 28.”
• Ocho (52:28): “I’m not sure what Mr. Banks is watching...If they weren't scared of [Dexter Lawrence] anymore, they wouldn’t be double team knock.”
• Brooks (59:48): “Goddamn Harry Roseman is pushing all his chips in on the table. I know what I need. I know the piece can help us.”

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Timestamps for Major Segments

• 02:51–14:53: Cleveland Browns’ QB Controversy – Shedeur Sanders vs. Dylan Gabriel
• 23:03–34:44: Minnesota Vikings’ Quarterback Situation – J.J. McCarthy, Sam Darnold
• 10:40–39:40: WR Duos, Play-Design & Offensive Skill Talent
• 50:09–58:33: Carl Banks vs. Dexter Lawrence & Defensive Line Play
• 58:33–66:35: Trade Rumors: Miles Garrett to Eagles, A.J. Brown’s Future, Detroit’s Draft Strategy

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Tone and Style

The tone is animated, honest, and conversational, with the co-hosts bouncing between roasting teams for poor management (“damn, man, you...you got what you wanted. You got your quarterback. But you’re still in the same...position.”), offering football-insider wisdom, and trading playful jabs. Ocho brings energy and colorful metaphors: “All you do is that you short fish, bro. Because the big fish...they out the deep”, while Bucky Brooks cuts through with analytical precision.

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Summary Takeaway

This episode is a quintessential example of Club Shay Shay’s style: intelligent, unfiltered, and highly entertaining discussion about quarterback controversies, GM decisions, and superstar player value. Viewers get a candid snapshot into the high-stakes drama of NFL management, how coaches risk locker-room mutiny, and why player reputation and system fit matter as much as talent. The conversation leaves listeners with fresh insights into the current state of several NFL franchises—and more than a few memorable soundbites.

Transcript

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I turned off news altogether.

[Bucky Brooks]

I hate to say it, but I don't trust much of anything. It's the rage bait.

[Ocho]

It feels like it's trying to divide people. We got clear facts.

[Bucky Brooks]

Maybe we could calm down a little. NBC News brings you clear reporting.

[Ocho]

Let's meet at the Facts.

[Bucky Brooks]

Let's move forward from there. NBC News reporting for America.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

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[T-Mobile Commercial Voice / Bloomberg Host]

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[Bucky Brooks]

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[Daniel Jeremiah]

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[Bucky Brooks]

My fellow Americans, this is liberation day.

[T-Mobile Commercial Voice / Bloomberg Host]

Stories that move markets.

[Ocho]

Chair Powell opened the door to this.

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First interest rate cut impact politics, change businesses. This is a really stunning development for the AI world and how you think about your bottom line. Listen to the big take from Bloomberg News every weekday afternoon on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Stephen Curry (Promo Voice)]

From. NBA champion Stephen Curry comes shot ready. A powerful never before seen look at the mindset that changed the game.

[Ocho]

I fell in love with the grind. You have to find joy in the work you do when no one else is around. Success is not an accident. I'm passing the ball to you. Let's go.

[Stephen Curry (Promo Voice)]

Steph Curry redefined basketball. Now he's rewriting what it means to succeed. Order your copy of the New York Times bestseller Shot ready [e-mail].

[Bucky Brooks]

The Browns benched Joe Flacco after a 13 stint as a starter. Rookie Dylan Gabriel is one in three. Many in Cleveland are wondering if Shador Sanders now deserve his own shot. Well, today Kevin Stefanski was asked by Mary K. Cabot whether he's considering the possibility of playing Shador. His response? The focus is where we are right now, Mary Kay. That's not my focus, guys. Can we stop asking the question? Y' all know this man don't want to play Shador.

[Ocho]

You know that. Young people, we know that. And people I know, I see people, you know in the chat. Not, not in the chat, but just in general when we talk about the Cleveland Browns.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yes.

[Ocho]

Oh, it's. It's. Damn. What's the word? When they don't like someone and they. They now they doing them wrong. I forgot the word to use. But listen. We already know what the play was. We already know what the play was. They didn't want him. It was Drew Barry. No. And Andrew Barry.

[Bucky Brooks]

Andrew.

[Ocho]

It was Andrew Barry's pick. It wasn't. It wasn't the owner. It wasn't Stefan. So this is exactly what they want. This is exactly what they want. It seemed as if they were. That someone forced their hand to take this pick and they don't want to give him an opportunity to play the game. From the small sample size that we've seen from Dylan Gabriel, he has now had he played four games that they're.

[Bucky Brooks]

1 and 3, he won't push the ball down the field. It's hard. You can't run the ball. And all you do is that you short. You fish, bro. You short fish. Because the big fish, the big fish don't swim close along the shore. They're out the deep. And so to get points, you got to push the ball down the field at some point.

[Ocho]

Yeah, but maybe he's. Maybe he's not. He's not that comfortable doing just that yet. Because we saw him push that, push the ball down the field in the goddamn preseason. We saw him push the ball down the field. I see him. I saw him throw short balls. I thought I saw him throw 80 meted. I saw him throw dig routes. I didn't really see him throw anything deep, but I think there's a certain level of uncomfortability that, that they don't have because offensively, they're not calling plays for him to push the Ball down the field. Because obviously, maybe that's not what he's good at. That's the only thing I think of. Because if he was good at doing it, you would call the plays that call for him to do just that. What we're asking of in order for you to win games, he's not giving the Browns their best chance to win games. And the fact that Kevin Stefanski understands that my job is on the line because this is the guy I stood up on the table for and who I wanted to make know the start of our team. At some point. You're gonna lose the locker room, too, huh? Yeah, you're gonna lose the locker room. It just take the right person to say something. A Denzel Ward, a Miles Garrett. You know, you know your captains. You'd be like, listen, we need to do something. I mean, to see Miles Garrett frustrated like that, the way. The way he was understanding that offensively, we not getting it done, knowing the check needs to be made. I mean. But I think that's a heel that Kevin Fanc is willing to die on because this is my guy. And he knows. I mean, his job ain't in jeopardy. He's not in the hot seat. Not in the hot seat.

[Bucky Brooks]

So you don't think so?

[Stephen Curry (Promo Voice)]

No.

[Ocho]

Hell, no. Absolutely not.

[Bucky Brooks]

Joe Flacco training camp completion percentage was 58.7 in his first. In his four start, he was at 69%. Then he went to 56%. 58. In his last game as a starter, he was 47%.

[Ocho]

Hey, somebody in the chat. Funny as hell to. Yeah, Gabriel did throw down the field, but it got intercepted.

[Bucky Brooks]

Hey, look, man, look, I. I'm just tired of, like, man, push youror, man. They don't seem as interested in putting Shador in as we're interested in seeing him. And who knows what would happen if he got in there, but I think we want to see what would happen.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Bucky Brooks]

And my thing is he, like. Well, he didn't play. He wasn't even the number two. Bailey Zappy was the number two on Sunday. Say he had to deal with a back injury. Well, how you heard? Well, he just standing on the sideline so I could get why his back was tight. Hold on. How.

[Ocho]

How he have a back surgery, but he was out there throwing balls in pregame.

[Bucky Brooks]

I'm just. I'm just.

[Ocho]

Look, you know, ain't nothing wrong. Ain't nothing wrong with him. The same way there ain't nothing wrong with J.J. mcCarthy.

[Bucky Brooks]

There's nothing wrong with him.

[Ocho]

This is just the game that they do play, if you understand the game and understand what they will do and what they report, knowing that there's nothing wrong with you to cover their, you know what, get us on the outside to shut up. But listen, I, I played the game. I understand that some of the things that you will do when you don't really want a person to actually be in the game and to contribute, you don't want to look wrong, you don't want to be wrong in the decisions that you've made. Of course you're not going to play him because you know he probably will go in there and succeed. Shador Sanders works and operates very well in a chaotic environment. And that's the environment that has been created for him because of who he is and obviously also because it's, that's, that's. They, they didn't want him, but he will operate very well in the type environment and they don't want that to happen. So what do we do? We say he's hurt, his back is messed up. You tell, you tell the reporter chemist effects. He says, hey, don't ask me. The focus, the focus is what it is right now. It's Dylan Gabriel and doing everything we can to make sure he improves week to week. But the clock is ticking because the next thing that's gonna happen, it ain't gonna be the reporter saying something and asking questions. It's gonna be the own players in your locker room.

[Bucky Brooks]

Dylan Gabriel is training count completion percentage was 55% and his four starts he was at 58, 56, 72%, 60%.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Bucky Brooks]

So it looks like he's right about where he was in training camp. Yeah. And because they're, they don't have the best playmakers, they don't have, they don't have the Detroit skill position players, they don't have Green Bay skill position players. They don't have senses, they don't have a CD and pick. That's not what they have. So when you don't have that level of talent on the outside and you have a marginal quarterback, what do you think you're going to get?

[Ocho]

Listen, you know what? Then the owners, the onus at that point is on the offensive coordinator who's calling the playski. Okay, well, listen, I understand I have a quarterback right here in Dylan Gabriel. There are certain weaknesses that he does have. I have Njuku Tillman, Jerry Judy. I know what they can do. I know what they can do. I know what their strengths are. How can I put them in the positions? Creativity, creativity, In a creative way, creatively and. Yeah, creatively. What, the rope? What's wrong with me? I'm talking too damn fast creatively to hide some of the things and the flaws that Dylan Gabriel is not good at. So now you.

[Bucky Brooks]

You can't make him taller, so you can't. You can't make him grow 4 inches, so you can't do anything about that. You can't make him have a stronger arm. You can't do anything about that. No, his offensive line is not the best. There's not anything you can do about that because you have what you have. So I don't really know where you. I don't know how much better it can get for the Browns based on what you have currently.

[Ocho]

Yeah, I, I. Listen, I don't know. I'm. I'm all. I'm. I'm all out of suggestions. I mean, everyone else has suggested, you know, do this, do that. What everybody wanted, they got. You got what you wanted. You got your quarterback. You got Joe Flacco going now having success, you know, in the air, throwing to two of the greatest. The. The greatest duo in the NFL. Now Dylan Gabriel's your quarterback, but you're still in the same. You're still in the same place. You sit in the same position.

[Bucky Brooks]

You. You think. You think your duo better than Dallas duo.

[Ocho]

Come again? Ask me. Ask me that one more time. Wait, wait, wait, wait. Before you ask me, think about what you asking me. Then ask me again. Then ask me.

[Bucky Brooks]

I will ask you. Do you believe that your duo is better than Dallas's duo?

[Ocho]

Well, not only do I believe that our duo is better than Dallas's duo, but it's. It's. It's.

[Bucky Brooks]

We're.

[Ocho]

We're. We are. We are better. We are better as a whole. And this is no disrespect to cdn Pick, but they right below us, and it's close, too. You hear me?

[Bucky Brooks]

Yeah, he damn right it's close.

[Ocho]

I mean, let me stay with me now. It's. It's close. But because of Jamar Chase, it edged us out. Okay. And T. T is very good. You know, George Picking could do what T. Higgins does.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yeah, I think you do a little better.

[Ocho]

Yeah. I mean, yeah. I mean, yeah.

[Bucky Brooks]

I think so bad.

[Ocho]

They. They.

[Stephen Curry (Promo Voice)]

They about.

[Ocho]

They about equivalent. Now he can go up and get it. You know, T. Get running routes. Them. Them 50, 50 balls. Turn 80, 20 when it's them, too.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yeah. And the thing I like about Pick is. Pick is angry. He get his ball. Hands on the ball. He like, you gotta tackle me. I ain't going down. I ain't running out of bounds. You gonna have a tackle me?

[Ocho]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Bucky Brooks]

I love that. And I love. I love the focus that I've seen from him since he's arrived in Dallas. I love that. I love. I. I love that.

[Ocho]

I told you it was a simple.

[Bucky Brooks]

I just. Shador has been liking IG posts today that are calling for him to start for the Browns after the bye week. Hey, we'll see.

[Ocho]

Whatever you got to do. Whatever. Whatever you got to do. And obviously, going into the bye week, this is the Browns bye week, right?

[Bucky Brooks]

Yes.

[Ocho]

They definitely not. Definitely not on our name, the starter doing the bye week. But we're gonna see what happens. We're gonna give Dylan Gabriel another week, another week to get. To get better, to improve himself based on what he's done so far with the four stars he's had. I wonder who they got coming out to buy Humphrey.

[Bucky Brooks]

That's as usually have coming out of the buy.

[Ocho]

Oh, man.

[Bucky Brooks]

And my thing is, Ocho, is that, no, you don't have to do anything. It's just like, who they got the jets coming out of the buy.

[Ocho]

Shoot, ain't no telling.

[Bucky Brooks]

I think that's as good. That's as good as any time to let your door start.

[Ocho]

Well, in the Jets.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Ocho]

I. I think Dylan Gabriel will be the start against the Jets. Ain't no telling. Jess might come out there and. And Molly walk. They. You know what that.

[Bucky Brooks]

Oh, they already beat y', all, so they got confidence now.

[Ocho]

Don't do that. Don't do that. Let's not bring up the past. Let's not bring up the past. Let's look forward, because in the Bible, it said, do not look that behind you, therefore, so you can see where.

[Bucky Brooks]

You go with, I don't know, your eyes closed. The way they beat y' all up, you know, look, there's only so much. I mean, because I think the thing is, I think for the most part, he's done. He said all the right things, and I'mma support Dylan, you know, hey, he block. You know, we're in that room. I think everybody. When Joe is in the room, I think Shador is saying all the right things. I think he's been coached up. I think he's been groomed to play that position, to say all the right things, because you are corporate when you're in that position.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Bucky Brooks]

But I think deep down, he believes he's better than Dylan Gabriel.

[Ocho]

You know, he believe that every player that has competition at a Pacific position, believes they're better than the person that's in front of.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yeah, you know, and unfortunately, y' all won't. He said, unfortunately, y' all won't give me an opportunity to show you that I'm better. I mean, look, there's only one way. There's only one way to prove it. Give him.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Go.

[Bucky Brooks]

Let him go out there and. And give him four stars. And let's see. I think the thing is, oo, I think they're going to let this thing with Dylan Gabriel go a little longer for the simple fact you don't want to play. You've already moved on from Joe Flacco. Joe Flacco got four starts. Are we really trying to give Dylan Gabriel four stars? Okay, give Shador four starts. It don't work out with Shador. Go back to Dylan Gabriel. It don't work out with Dylan Gabriel. Go back to Shador. I. I don't know if that's where you want to be at. Oo. I don't. I don't think that's where you want to be.

[Ocho]

Listen, listen, defense. He's in a tough position now. He's in a tough position.

[Bucky Brooks]

Damn. If you do damage, you don't.

[Ocho]

Yeah, basically, that. That's exactly what it is. But I think it's okay for them to. To. To have a quarterback carousel and being able to make those changes, those changes when necessary, because you need to find out what you need to do for the foreseeable future.

[Bucky Brooks]

If they're probably going to go back into. They're probably going to go back in the draft and get a quarterback. But, I mean, looking at the quarterbacks, I'm looking around college right now, I don't see anybody. I don't see anybody that blowing my socks off like, oh, I got to get them. I gots to have him.

[Ocho]

And I'm glad you just said that because obviously everything at the quarterback level. There's been some great quarterback play in college football, but there's none that can come to the Cleveland Browns and be like, oh, shoot, we found the one. There's nobody.

[Bucky Brooks]

Cleveland is more than a player away, though. Ojo. That's the problem. They're more than a player away.

[Ocho]

Wait a minute. But they're more than a player away. But if they can get the right quarterback, which is the problem for the past now 36 years, then you're a little closer to where you want to get to. But you can't get past. You can't even get past step one.

[Bucky Brooks]

No. Well, you had the quarterback. You had the quarterback. You just needed to get some pieces around Baker and let him heal. Yeah, but, you know, the damage was done. You, you, you. You know, I guess, conversation, you know, he felt like they wanted him to be something that he wasn't. They wanted him to be more button up, more structured, and he's a guy that. He wants to dance. He. He cool with the locker room. The guys like him, and so that wasn't their cup of tea. Well, if the guy's going to win, damn your cup of tea. I'm trying to win.

[Ocho]

Yeah. Hey, that's all that matters at the end of the day, especially for quarterbacks, is based on wins. Wins and losses.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yes. So we'll see how this thing plays out. I think, you know, Cleveland goes quiet for a minute. There is no games. There's nothing to report. I don't know how much they're gonna. Oh, they get the whole week off of the bye week. They gone.

[Ocho]

What you mean gone? They practicing.

[Bucky Brooks]

They ain't practicing. You gotta get the week off.

[Ocho]

Wait, they change the rules or something?

[Bucky Brooks]

Yeah. Ash, look up and see. I think that's a rule. You get the whole week off.

[Ocho]

Man, I ain't never see, man. What?

[Bucky Brooks]

No. Hell no. We got. We got Thursday week, man. We got fried. We normally. We got Friday, Saturday, Sunday off. We had a half day Thursday. If everything went good, you know, we got a half day Thursday. But it. I hope now we got a week in Baltimore. But Mike Shanahan wasn't playing that. I don't know what. I don't. I was like, damn, man, they. Man, such and such. Yeah, we got the. We getting the whole week off. I like, well, damn. We ain't got no week off. They get the whole week off.

[Ocho]

Yeah. That's crazy. So they got to do any work they want to do all by yourself. But obviously during the bye week, you want to get away from football.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

You want to reset mentally. You want to reset mentally. Get yourself away from anything football related. Go home, you know, get in your game. I mean, just do whatever you need. Detach from the game of football in your bye week. That's. That's the point of it. And when you do come back, you'd be ready to hit it. You'd be ready to hit it.

[Bucky Brooks]

All I know is I. I heal my. A lot of my own injuries. You're not going to keep me here on the bye week. No. Because I got something. I'm Nick. Oh, no.

[Stephen Curry (Promo Voice)]

Yeah.

[Bucky Brooks]

You good?

[Ocho]

Yep.

[Bucky Brooks]

They sell ice at the convenience store. Your ice don't have medicine in the only other you got that rabbit turd ice. I got to get that cubed ice. It's all the same.

[Ocho]

Yeah, it all does the same.

[Bucky Brooks]

Morning Zoe.

[T-Mobile Commercial Voice / Bloomberg Host]

Jeff Bridges, why are you still living above our garage?

[Bucky Brooks]

I want to be in a T Mobile commercial like you.

[T-Mobile Commercial Voice / Bloomberg Host]

Teach me Suldana I couldn't possibly AT T Mobile get the new iPhone 17 Pro on them. It's designed to be the most powerful iPhone yet and has the ultimate pro camera system.

[Bucky Brooks]

Impressive. Let me try AT T mobile you can save up to 20% versus the other big guys. You heard them.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

T mobile is the best place to get the new iPhone 17 Pro on us with eligible traded in any condition. Check them out. See how much you could say versus.

[Ocho]

The other big guys@t mobile.com switch the.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Forces shaping the world's economies and financial markets can be hard to spot.

[T-Mobile Commercial Voice / Bloomberg Host]

Even though they are such a powerful player in finance, you wouldn't really know that you are interacting with them.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

And even harder to understand, Donald Trump's.

[Bloomberg Podcast Host]

Trade War 2.0 is only accelerating the process of de dollarization, which in a way is jargon for people turning away from the dollar.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

That is where the big take from Bloomberg Podcast comes in to connect the dots.

[T-Mobile Commercial Voice / Bloomberg Host]

How unusual is a deal like this?

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Unprecedented. Every weekday afternoon we dive deep into one big global business story.

[Ocho]

The biggest story of the reaction of the oil market to the conflict in the Middle east is one of what has not happened.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Katie, you told me that ETFs are your favorite thing.

[Bloomberg Podcast Host]

They are.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Explain that. Why is that the case? And unpack what it means for you.

[T-Mobile Commercial Voice / Bloomberg Host]

Our breakfast foods are consistent consumer staples and so they sort of become outsized indicators of inflation.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Listen to the big take from Bloomberg News every weekday afternoon on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Stephen Curry (Promo Voice)]

Greatness doesn't just show up, it's built. One shot, one choice, one moment at a From NBA champion Stephen Curry comes Shot Ready. A powerful never before seen look at the mindset that changed the game.

[Ocho]

I fell in love with the grind. You have to find joy in the work you do when no one else is around. Success is not an accident. I'm passing the ball to you. Let's go.

[Stephen Curry (Promo Voice)]

Steph Curry redefined basketball. Now he's rewriting what it means to succeed. Shot Ready isn't just a memoir, it's a playbook for anyone chasing their potential. The discover stories strategies and over 100 never before seen photos order shot ready now. @stephencurrybook.com don't miss Stephen Curry's New York Times bestseller Shot Ready. Available now.

[Bloomberg Podcast Host]

Run a business and not thinking about podcasting? Think again. More Americans listen to podcasts than ads. Supported streaming music from Spotify and Pandora. And as the number one podcaster, iHeart's twice as large as the next two combined. So whatever your customers are into true crime, sports, comedy, culture, they'll hear your message. Plus, only iHeart can extend your message to audiences across broadcast radio. And all this reach means everything. Just think about the universal marketing formula. The number of consumers who hear your message times the response rate equals the results. Now let's get those results growing for you. Think podcasting can help your business? Think iHeart streaming radio and podcasting. Let us show you at iHeartadvertising.com that's iHeartadvertising.com or call 844-844 iHeart. One more time, call 844-844-IHEART and get podcasting working for you.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

What's up everybody? Daniel Jeremiah here and I'm Bucky Brooks. On Move the Sticks, we take you inside the game. From scouting reports and player development to team building philosophies, coaching trends and how front offices construct winning rosters. Every week we study the tape, talk to decision makers and share the insights you won't find anywhere else. It's the kind of conversation that connects the dots. From college football prospects to the NFL stars of tomorrow, we break down the draft, analyze matchups and evaluate how teams put it all together on game day. Plus, we dig into coaching strategies, roster construction and the trends that shape the.

[Bucky Brooks]

League year after year.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Whether you're a die hard fan or just love understanding the game on a deeper level, we give you the full picture. If you want insight that goes beyond the box score, this podcast is for you. Don't miss it. Listen to the Move the Six podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Ocho]

End of the day.

[Bucky Brooks]

Viking quarterback Carson Went is set that undergo season ending shoulder surgery on his non throwing shoulder ocho and will be placed on injured reserve. J.J. mcCarthy began the season as the starter but who has missed the last six games with a high ankle sprain. He's expected to play Sunday in Detroit. The only backup Minnesota roster is undrafted rookie Max Brosmer. JJ is not huh? Yeah, exactly. He was undrafted so you know even less about him. J.J. mcCarthy has not only played two of 24 regular season games since he was drafted with the number 10 pick in the 2024 draft. Ojo, how bad are the Vikings missing Sam Darnold?

[Ocho]

Listen, they missing Sam Darnold very, very much so. Very much so. Listen, the way Sam Donald played last year, I still for the life of me can't understand why you let him walk out that door. I just don't understand. For the life of me. And not knowing what you were getting with J.J. mcCarthy, understand, he was a high round pick. I know what he did in Michigan. I get that. But listen, there's no problem with him sitting behind and learning from Sam Donald with the way he played last year. You don't let a quarterback, as hard as it is to come by quarterbacks that you can find that can maximize everything you want to do offensively. He did everything well. He didn't look like the Sam Donald with the Jets. He didn't look like the Sam Donald in goddamn Carolina. But for some reason, everything in Minnesota, it looked good. He looked very good. Similar to how Daniel Jones looked with the goddamn Indianapolis Colts. Like a completely different person.

[Bucky Brooks]

Oh, yeah, a completely different person.

[Ocho]

And the same person is still carrying on right now in Seattle. He's still doing the same thing.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yes.

[Ocho]

And now you're struggling. Now you're having quarterback woes. He didn't know what to do. And I think they not playing JJ McCarthy on purpose. Ain't no, it can't be nothing wrong with a monk.

[Bucky Brooks]

I mean, he was out a long time with a high ankle sprain. Normally guys get. Guys were getting back in three high end four weeks. This would be six weeks that he's missed. I'm just saying, right?

[Ocho]

You know, goodwill. Ain't nothing wrong with that ankle. Ain't nothing wrong with that ankle. You know that boy, J.J. hey, Justin Jefferson, boy, he gonna cut up this week, you hear me? But let things don't go right. Let things don't go the way they should be. You know, they love. They love calling players divas and all this that are passionate and want to win and understanding that. And in order for me to have success, in order for us to have team success, we got to have the most important position, have a good person, a good player with the ball. And we don't have that. Hey, them great players that we all love, they start to act up. Now you laughing. They love the. I'm not sure where that term diva came from. I'm not sure, you know, but you know, when, sir.

[Bucky Brooks]

When certain it came from y' all misbehaving.

[Ocho]

Yeah. Hey, we don't misbehave. We're Just passionate about the position that we do play.

[Bucky Brooks]

We like what y' all call it.

[Ocho]

Yeah, we like to show a little enthusiasm, you know, a little in it, a little energy, you know.

[Bucky Brooks]

Okay.

[Ocho]

When we do it, it's called divas when they do it. It's called passion. Huh?

[Bucky Brooks]

Called passion.

[Ocho]

Yeah, it's called. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know the word, the definition change depending on the. Let me, let me. I'm not gonna go there.

[Bucky Brooks]

It's been reported that went tore his labrum and dislocated his shoulder in week five and they still sink in. So he's got a torn labor in his non throwing shoulder and it's dislocated. You're asking him to play through that.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Bucky Brooks]

You got a guy that you took with the number 10 pick last year that you were so set that he was going to be your guy, that you let a guy walk out the door that had thrown like 30 plus high 30 touchdown for you and fewer than, I think fewer than 15 interceptions if I'm not mistaken.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Bucky Brooks]

So you let that guy walk out the door. But now you got a guy that's a journeyman. He's turned into a German. Yes, he was the number two pick in the draft and yeah, he had a nice two to three year run and Philly, then it all fell apart and he's bounced around ever since. But so now he's a journeyman quarterback. You're willing to keep a journeyman. You're willing to ask a journeyman with a torn laborman what's being reported? I don't know, I'm just reading what's being reported. You're asking a guy that's a journeyman quarterback that has a torn labrum and a dislocated non throwing shoulder to go out there and gut it up instead of putting a guy out there that was a high draft pick that you believe so much in, a guy that you saw go through the totality of a season and play exceptionally well, you let him walk out the door.

[Ocho]

Hey, I know what Sam Donald looks like. Before he left might have left a bad taste in a lot of people's mouths, but the position he put you in in the regular season to even be in contention to be in the playoffs was phenomenal. It was a great run and it was the kind of run where you bring someone like that back who gives you a chance, he puts you in position, he allows you to maximize what you want to do offensively with his decision making and chemistry that he built with Hageson, Addison and Justin Jefferson, you don't let that walk out the door. Because now you have a situation like you do now, where we're saying, goddamn JJ McCarthy has been on the sideline with a high angle spring for six weeks. I know that's a lot. I know the devil is a lie. Somebody lying. I don't know who it is. Because now you're not sure. Now you really don't want to put him out there based on what you saw already when he was. When he had the opportunity to get out there. It didn't look like it should. It doesn't look like you guys made the right choice. So now you're relying on Carson Wentz to save the day.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yeah, look. And he look, oh, he's only in the second year so he could get better. But I had my questions about him because they ran the ball way more at Michigan than they threw it. So I was always like, okay, what happens when they. When they're going to require you to throw the ball? The days of you just being able to run the football, you got to throw it in this league. I don't care who you are. They're going to come a time that you're going to have to, and more time than not, you're going to need to throw the football. And so I was always a little leery on that part. Now, I will say this.

[Ocho]

I.

[Bucky Brooks]

Look, I thought they could have kept Sam Darnold, but I knew they wouldn't keep Sam Darnold for the simple fact of the money. And they tied up into JJ McCarthy. He was the number 10 pick in the draft. Ojo. And. But it wasn't a lot of money. Now, if Minnesota had backed the Brinks truck up, said, okay, we got 40. We got 40, 45, 50 million, I get Minnesota. But this is a very digestible contract. This was almost like a Baker Mayfield contract. Yes, 30 million is the lower level of a starting quarterback.

[Ocho]

Yep.

[Bucky Brooks]

And so I was a little surprised that they didn't. That it didn't go to third, that they didn't look, at least for another year or two. Hell, if. And I get it, this is not a very fair assessment, but Jordan Love rode the bench. Now he's backing up somebody much more substantial and proven. But he sat his ass on the bench. Aaron Rodgers sat the bench. So there's no harm in that. And look, if Sam Darner doesn't make it this year. But Sam Darnold is not old. Sam Darling is 26. So if he continues to play, well, hell, I move on from JJ McCarthy. I ship his ass out.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Bucky Brooks]

Cause JJ McCarthy is what? How much younger is JJ McCarthy than Sam Darnold, Ash? Cause I think Sam Darnold is 26 years of age, so it's not like he's 30, 32. And plus you're dealing with a quarterback, so they like dog years. That 20. That 20. That 26 is really like 14.

[Ocho]

Oh, yeah.

[Bucky Brooks]

So it's not like other positions. How old is J.J. mcCarthy and how old is Sam Darnold? Okay. Sam Darling is 28. J.J. mcCarthy's 22.

[Ocho]

Only 22.

[Bucky Brooks]

22, yeah.

[Ocho]

Oh, man. Listen, I. I'm not. I'm not a gm. I'm not an owner, but I understand. I know who gives us our best chance to win and I'm not gambling. Regardless of him being the number 10 pick, there's no problem with him sitting. He has a team friendly contract. Even being a number pick, I'm bringing Darnold back and giving him that lower tier. No disrespect. I'm speaking in football terms of quarterback and quarterback money to see what he can do for us the next two or three years.

[Bucky Brooks]

At least the next two before I have to. Because I really don't have to make a decision on J.J. mcCarthy. Ocho until year, year four. Going into year five, I got to make a decision.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Bucky Brooks]

So I don't have to do a deal with him. I mean, obviously guys that are playing get deals done after their third year if they're that guy. So I get that. But theoretically I can go in. I could go into year four. Says, okay, I've gotten two years of Sam Darnold. I think we've maxed him out. Okay, jj, I'm gonna give you a year to prove it. And then with a. But I'm not in a situation. But I think the thing is, Ocho going into that year, that year four, now I got to pick up his fifth year option.

[Ocho]

Yeah. And one thing about it too. You know what I don't like? You know, I think it's the perfect situation for him. You played at Michigan, so you used to being in that type of environment, obviously you come from a school where you ran the ball, you know, a high percentage of the time. But quarterback, your quarterback, you're in the NFL now, and if you can't throw the ball to Jordan Addison Hawkinson and Justin Jefferson, you don't belong. You just don't. Oh yeah, you just don't belong. Because that's one of the better receiving cores in the NFL. And even if Even if you can't bring yourself to their level of play, they're so good, they can hide whatever weaknesses you do have as a quarterback. And the fact that he can't play going into week six and we talk about it's still an ankle sprain, something ain't right, and it damn sure know how it goes. Frame. That's not it. I mean, we know that. And I'm not sure what they're trying to hide, but whatever weaknesses that he may have as a quarterback, they have to find a way to hide it, because you have the players around them that can hide it. You have the players around them can hide it.

[Bucky Brooks]

Well, I think the thing is, Ocho, you can only hide it for so long. It's like an Easter egg. They might not fight it, but somebody's going to find the MIGs. So whatever your weakness is as a quarterback, Ocho, we gonna find it sooner or later. Cause as long as you continue to play, we gonna find out where you weak at. That's just. That's just. That's just how. That's just how it is. And so I agree with you. I just knew based on the NFL, the number 10 pick, they really like this guy. That, and also, I don't know if it's true. It's like reports that he wanted to be guaranteed a starting job. Seattle guaranteed him a starting job.

[Ocho]

Okay.

[Bucky Brooks]

Oh, you.

[Ocho]

But you talk about Sam Darnold. Okay, okay, okay, okay.

[Bucky Brooks]

And so under that. Those circumstances, but it's hard for me to believe, Ocho, somebody gonna pay you $30 million and you don't start.

[Ocho]

Yeah, yeah. And there. There aren't very many places that he could have gone to after he left Minnesota where they weren't going to guarantee me. Guarantee him the starting job. It wasn't anybody there. You're gonna have to look over your shoulder and understand, okay. Their pressure is on me. If I don't play well, they're probably going to put this guy in. You.

[Stephen Curry (Promo Voice)]

You.

[Ocho]

You in a great. You in a great spot. I think Minnesota would have been a great spot for him to come back. I'm not sure what management was thinking.

[Bucky Brooks]

I do, too.

[Ocho]

There's a reason why I'm not a gm. There's a reason why I'm not an owner, because that's, you know, the choice of decision I would have made. And now he's in Seattle and he's flourishing. He is flourishing. JSN are having a effing ball.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yeah, they. They and I. I think Ocho, when they moved on for they moved on from Geno.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Bucky Brooks]

Now you look at a situation. They moved on from dk, they moved on from Lockett. It seems like Lockett went to Tennessee. Now he's going to be reunited with Pete Carroll and Gino in, in. In Las Vegas. Maybe. A lot of people like, man, what do they have? They got Jackson, Smith and Jigba. They got JSN and he is phenomenal.

[Ocho]

And listen what we can do as well, because he's not too far removed from winning a Triple Crown. I love Cooper Cup. He might not be the Cooper cup of old. Cooper cup at.

[Bucky Brooks]

He can still make plays.

[Ocho]

He can still make plays. He can still. He's still one of the better route runners, one of the better creatives of what I like to say, artistry when it comes to running routes.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yes.

[Ocho]

He's still one of those. Despite what people may think.

[Bucky Brooks]

He just not. He's not going to be used like that. That's not Sean McVay's system. Sean McVay. If you look at the way Sean McVay used Cooper cup, you look at the way Sean Mcvay used Puka Nakua.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Bucky Brooks]

That's not what he is. They're not going to use him like that because first he's not the number one. That's jsn. Yes. So now the jsn, he's going to get the favorable. He's going to get the favorable play calls. He's going to be the first target. And so. But if you go back and look at it, Ocho, I think Cooper cup only had one 1000 yard receiving season. That was the Triple Crown season. That's.

[Ocho]

That's funny how that works, right? That's funny. And I saw that before with understanding with them. You won the Triple Crown. And I remember going back and looking at some of his numbers. Me and tj, who from Zada were talking about at one point and he told me, well, go look at all the stats from, from before that. And it's unbelievable. With the right system, with the right coach and putting you in the right position and right position to make certain plays, they can manipulate the. To where you can succeed. No matter what.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

No matter what. He could do it. And obviously when it was time to work and wiggle him out that system. Here comes Puka Nakua.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yeah. You draft players, you draft players, you need smart players. Those guys on the bigger side, they're not your typical slot. You look at Puka, you look at Cooper cup, they're not these. They're not the Julian Edelman. They're not the West Welkers. They're not your typical slot receivers. They're on the bus on the bigger side, which means they're going to have to be able to take more punishment. Because when you catch that many balls, Ocho, you got to get a damn ass load of targets. Cause Cooper cup caught 140something balls. That means he's 19200 targets, 1900 and what, 1930 yard receiving yards. He was well over 2000. He was probably. He was damn near 200 catches on the season. When you tally up what he did in the postseason, right? And you look at the yardage, he was. Well, he was like. I think he was like 23, 2400 receiving yards.

[Ocho]

Christ.

[Bucky Brooks]

And you look at what he did in the playoff games, so he probably had another 30, another 30 plus catches. So you figured, tackled another 30, 35 catches with another 45, 50 targets. Now you see, hell, he might have had 230, 250 targets and call 190 of them.

[Ocho]

When I think about it like that, as dynamic, as dynamic of a playmaker as he was, I would always, I always sit back and hypothetically think, damn, I wonder what my numbers would look like in that situation. Being that, you know, that's a lot.

[Bucky Brooks]

Of punishment, Ocho, huh? That's a lot of punishment.

[Ocho]

Hey, I could take punishment, you know, I ain't got no problem going across that middle and doing some of the. Doing some of the things that really made me uncomfortable. I can sit there and tell you now, I mean, I wasn't comfortable, you know, sitting there running, running screens. I don't like that. I like to be having a somewhat of a.

[Bucky Brooks]

No, you're not gonna catch that many balls getting pushed down the field. Little. They can't throw that big. The ball pushing you out of. Not no, not no hundred. And you know, he caught 140something balls. So think about how many, how many, how many screens, bubble screens that he actually caught. I don't like how many, how many, how many little smoke routes?

[Ocho]

Yeah, I don't like those. Huh? I mean, I'm gonna be honest with you. It gives me a certain level of uncertainty, a certain level of uncomfortability with me not being able to have my eyes on what's in front of me and me having to focus on the ball now. Having to run around and understand and being able to read defenses and knowing where everybody's going to be and what their job is, and knowing when I get out of breaks, I can protect myself. I know what's coming. I know where you're coming from, I know where the pursuit is coming from. But having to turn real quick and everybody got eyes on me like I'm a damn pump returner, that makes me uncomfortable.

[Bucky Brooks]

There it is.

[Stephen Curry (Promo Voice)]

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[Bucky Brooks]

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[Stephen Curry (Promo Voice)]

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[Bucky Brooks]

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[Daniel Jeremiah]

World'S economies and financial markets can be hard to spot.

[T-Mobile Commercial Voice / Bloomberg Host]

Even though they are such a powerful player in finance, you wouldn't really know that you are interacting with them.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

And even harder to understand, Donald Trump's.

[Bloomberg Podcast Host]

Trade War 2.0 is only accelerating the process of de dollarization, which in a way is jargon for people turning away from the dollar.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

That is where the big take from Bloomberg Podcast comes in. To connect the dots.

[T-Mobile Commercial Voice / Bloomberg Host]

How unusual is a deal like this?

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Unprecedented. Every weekday afternoon we dive deep into one big global business story.

[Ocho]

The biggest story of the reaction of the oil market to the conflict in the Middle east is one of what has not happened.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Katie, you told me that ETFs are your favorite thing.

[Bloomberg Podcast Host]

They are.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Explain that. Why is that the case? And unpack what it means for you.

[T-Mobile Commercial Voice / Bloomberg Host]

Our breakfast foods, our consistent consumer staples, and so they sort of become outsized indicators of inflation.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Listen to the big take from Bloomberg News every weekday afternoon on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Stephen Curry (Promo Voice)]

Greatness doesn't just show up. It's built. One shot, one choice, one moment at a time. From NBA champion Stephen Curry comes Shot Ready. A powerful, never before seen look at the mindset that changed the game.

[Ocho]

I fell in love with the grind. You have to find joy in the work you do when no one else is around. Success is not an accident. I'm passing the ball to you. Let's go.

[Stephen Curry (Promo Voice)]

Steph Curry redefined basketball. Now he's rewriting what it means to succeed. Shot Ready isn't just a memoir, it's a playbook for anyone chasing their potential. Discover stories, strategies and over 100 never before seen photos. Order Shot Ready now at Stephen Curry Book don't miss Stephen Curry's New York Times bestseller Shot Ready available now.

[Bloomberg Podcast Host]

Run a business and not thinking about podcasting? Think again. More Americans listen to podcasts than ad supported streaming music from Spotify and Pandora. And as the number one podcaster, iHeart's twice as large as the next two combined. So whatever your customers are into true crime, sports, sports, comedy, culture, they'll hear your message. Plus, only iHeart can extend your message to audiences across broadcast radio. And all this reach means everything. Just think about the universal marketing formula. The number of consumers who hear your message times the response rate equals the results. Now let's get those results growing for you. Think podcasting can help your business? Think iHeart streaming radio and podcasting. Let us show [e-mail] that's iheartadvertising.com or call 844-844 iHeart. One more time, call 844-844-IHEART and get podcasting working for you.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

What's up everybody? Daniel Jeremiah here and I'm Bucky Brooks. On Move the Sticks, we take you inside the game. From scouting reports and player development to team building philosophies, coaching trends, and how front offices construct winning rosters. Every week we study the tape, talk to decision makers and share the insights you won't find anywhere else. It's the kind of conversation that connects the dots. From college football prospects to the NFL stars of tomorrow, we break down the draft, analyze matchups, and evaluate how teams put it all together on game day. Plus, we dig into coaching strategies, roster construction and the trends that shape the.

[Bucky Brooks]

League year after year.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Whether you're a die hard fan or just love understanding the game on a deeper level, we give you the full picture. If you want insight that goes beyond the box score, this podcast is for you. Don't miss it. Listen to the Move the Six podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Ocho]

I'm gonna like that.

[Bucky Brooks]

Through the first eight weeks of the season, the cold and Daniel Jones have been the biggest surprise. When Andy signed Jones this offseason, he was widely viewed as another option behind 2023 number four pick Anthony Richardson. But Jonathan Taylor realized the job with Jones after the first practice when he first got into training camp and he called check. That's in the playbook. But if you've been here one of those checks that's like, oh yeah, we call that. Sometimes the fact that he called it is like, did this guy have the playbook six months ago? That's when I understood, oh, okay. His level of preparation is different. For him to come in day one, day two and make that call, make that check. He's been studying. It's day one of install and he's already that far ahead. I'm like, this guy is legit. Yes, sir. I don't know how I'm gonna ask you. I know how I took that. I know how I took that. He didn't say it. He heaping praise. But that was a. I think that was a shot at the go ahead. But you go ahead what you think.

[Ocho]

You know, I, I think players don't intend to take shots at other individuals that play the same position when praising another. I think he just praising the fact that Daniel Jones was so well informed with the offense to have already been there to know it. The way to know what the ins and outs and the nuances of it after just getting there. It's like, well, golly, we also have to understand what Daniel Jones is fighting for. He's fighting for a job, an opportunity to start after leaving somewhere. It just didn't work. And maybe this could have been a good thing for Anthony Richardson to see. Okay, now I gotta now have a better understanding of or what I need to do. The way to conduct myself not only as a pro, but as quarterback number one. Well, was quarterback number one of a team. This is the stuff I needed to do, make sure I succeeded not just in the classroom, not just in practice, but the results of doing so and putting the work in is going to show up on Sundays where it mattered most.

[Bucky Brooks]

I don't think Jonathan Taylor was intentionally trying to take a swipe at Anthony Richardson. He was heaping praise, but in the process of heaping praise, people gonna look like, well, damn, yeah, he just got there a month ago and you got a quarterback that's been there for two years and he never did anything like this. And he had the playbook. So that's the thing. Ocho. No. Was he out there trying to say, well, hey, we've heard stories. Use the first elite first. Use the last in the first out. They benched it for a reason. But that's what I mean. The quarterback. The preparation has to be so intense and if you. And a lot of times that's why they go ahead and get married because they like, I can't be out there. I need to be home. I need to be in front of this projector and I need a. Well, an iPad, not Ocho. And I need to be going through and I need my mind focused on hiding at home. And so they're going over and over and over and over. I told you from day one and once I saw what he was getting paid. I said, well, he gonna be starter.

[Ocho]

I'm not. I'm not even sure when I saw that, too. Obviously, it's just having common sense and understanding the game, understanding the business at that dog.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yep.

[Ocho]

Damn. What.

[Bucky Brooks]

What I didn't understand, if you got a project, okay, somebody say you got a project car or you got a project home. Oh, so you don't try to drive the car. You say you got to fix something. You got a project, it's going to take work. It's going to take you six months, it's going to take you a year to get it operational. You got a project home, you're like, oh, man, I got this. I bought this home, but I'm going to fix it up. You don't try to live in it. You said this guy was a project. He had immense talent, and he does. And you start him. What changed? Just go back and look at his tape from high school, look at his tape from college, and you tell me this man should have been a starter from day one. No, Ocho, no. You did him a huge disservice. Can he go somewhere else? It's going to take. I mean, he's got some. He needs to go get with someone to understand mechanics of throwing everything. You can't be throwing the football like you're trying to throw it through a hurricane because nothing has touched everything is a hundred miles an hour. Shallow cross is throwing it like he's throwing a far cross or deep over. No bro. Yeah. And look, give Daniel Jones credit. He's came. He's come in, and like you said, the situation didn't work out in. In.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

In.

[Bucky Brooks]

In New York. He had to sit the bench in. In. In. In Minnesota. But he got an opportunity, and he says, if I get another opportunity, take.

[Ocho]

Advantage of it, because you're not.

[Bucky Brooks]

I'm not letting this one go.

[Ocho]

Not gonna get too many. Not. Not to be.

[Bucky Brooks]

No.

[Ocho]

Not to be a starter. Not to say, okay, this is my team. I have nothing to worry about. You don't get too many of them chances, especially coming from New York. Shoot. If you can't get it done in New York, you know, which is obviously what I would consider. I mean, the big. One of the biggest markets. Maybe the biggest market.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

You know, if you could deal with that meeting, you could deal with anything.

[Bucky Brooks]

It's just like, you know, Trey Lance, he was a project. He played.

[Ocho]

I forgot about.

[Bucky Brooks]

I just. I. I don't get it.

[Ocho]

Where'd Trey Lance at as a backup, huh?

[Bucky Brooks]

Is he in Dallas still a Houston, because I know he wasn't. Oh no, the Chargers.

[Ocho]

Okay.

[Bucky Brooks]

Because he played basically he played all the preseason the Chargers. Car Banks, who's the radio analyst for the Giants, was extremely critical this week of Dexter Lawrence on his podcast with Bob Papa Pop. Dexter Lawrence. Nobody respects you anymore. Nobody. Bank said before going on, going in on to say Lawrence wasn't playing at the same level as previous seasons. Lawrence strongly disagreed with Banks assessment citing at the rate in which he gets double team. Those are strong words. That's how you feel. Effort. He's delusional. Lawrence is getting double team a league high. 75 of the pass rate. 75 of the rate on his pass rush opportunities. Yeah, I know Banks. I played against Banks. Obviously he's older than me, but I played against Banks. I think he was still at the Giants. I know I played against him when he was at Cleveland because when Coach Belichick went to Cleveland, he took Banks with him. Banks was originally one of the Giants him. It was him Pep, Harry Carson and lt. So that's why I know him for me. So I, I, I know, I know, I know, I know Banks.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Bucky Brooks]

What do you, what do you, what do you think Ojo when, when analysts come out played the game. He played the game at a high level. I think one year base was the first team all Pro. As a matter of fact, I think he beat lt. LT that year. He was the first team. What, what, what do you say when guys are, are critical? I mean, I, I, you know, he just, this is his opinion that he doesn't believe that, that, that Dexter is, is playing at the level in which he's played in years past and playing at a level in which he got the big contract that the Giants giving him, which he earned.

[Ocho]

I mean, honestly, you got three defensive, defensive tackles in the NFL that are considered the best right now. Chris Jones is one of them.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

Jeff Jeffrey Simmons is another. And that third is in, in no particular order, in the third is Dexter Lawrence. Now, I'm not sure what Mr. Banks is watching when it comes to football, especially the New York Giants. I'm sure he probably watches all the Giants game being that he had.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yeah, he's the analyst. Yeah, yeah. He ain't Bob Papa yet.

[Ocho]

He has a podcast that he's doing with Big Papa, but you can see and understand that they scheme ways to stop Dexter Lawrence. Every first down it's gonna be a double team. Second down it's gonna be a double team. So you understand how difficult it is for him to have the efficiency that Carl Banks is looking for. Saying that nobody's scared of anymore. If they weren't scared of him anymore, they wouldn't be double team knock.

[Bucky Brooks]

They just. Let me ask you a question.

[Ocho]

One on one.

[Bucky Brooks]

Let me ask you a question. How many times you think AD got double now?

[Ocho]

We talk about two.

[Bucky Brooks]

Two total.

[Ocho]

Different dogs. We talk about two totally different dog.

[Bucky Brooks]

You and I both know when you become that guy, you can't give excuses. You can't say, hey, man, get up with Ocho, man, they doubling me. We pay you to be though.

[Ocho]

You've been in them trenches, right?

[Bucky Brooks]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

You know what it's like dying and now. And this I'm not. No, I know. I play around a lot. I don't. Hey, I don't be down there, but I know what them strong jokers could do and I know what it's like.

[Bucky Brooks]

And having they move your ass about.

[Ocho]

The way now, and having to take on two of that every time, no matter how strong you are. You mean I gotta get. I gotta deal with two of me?

[Bucky Brooks]

What we do, what we do, Ocho, is that we don't do it every time, but we do it enough that when we don't do it, you're anticipating it so you hesitating. That's all I need. He who hesitated so that's all I need to do. Ocho, I'm gonna double your ass enough that now when I don't double, you're anticipating the double to come. Hey, what do they, what do they do to receivers that used to getting the ball? What I'm gonna do is w early on, I'm gonna get you frustrated. I ain't gonna w the whole game. I just want to do it just the first quarter, get you frustrated. Then I got you.

[Ocho]

Damn.

[Bucky Brooks]

So I, I look, I, I get it. You look. I think when you, when you're losing. Okay, what's going on? Why aren't we winning? Because I, I think you look at. They got Law, they got Thibodeau, they got Carter, they got Brian Burns. Ain't no reason you give up 33 points in the fourth quarter. I don't give a damn what you say.

[Ocho]

Squad. They got a nice squad of names, huh? They got a nice squad of names, man.

[Bucky Brooks]

Brian, Brian, what's, what's his name? Brian Burns. Been to the Pro Bowl. Desta Lawrence was an all Pro. They got, they got guys that complete. Now the back end leaves a lot to be desired. Okay? Because if they don't get that, it's gonna be A completion?

[Ocho]

Absolutely.

[Bucky Brooks]

He said it's been double, but it's hard. Oh, I mean, people like these people talking. And the thing is, Banks knows football. Bank studies the game. He's a student of the game.

[Ocho]

Anybody?

[Bucky Brooks]

No, no, no, no. It's. It's not. It's absolutely not all. I can tell. Tell Dex. Hey, just keep plugging, bro. That's all you can do. Just keep plugging away.

[Ocho]

That's all you do. You. That's all you can do. But that goddamn double team, boy, that's just. What a thing. Hell, bro, it.

[Bucky Brooks]

It is. I mean, you got to realize they got 600 pounds rooting your ass up out of there. You know, he's. You know, he under his shade knows. Hey, bro, you got the center and the guard. Oh, they're gonna get your ass up out of there.

[Ocho]

That's tough. And it's so funny. Speaking of that and watching Aaron Donald and some of the clips with him and his ability to get off so fast and make us make himself skinny to where he's only dealing with one man out of the double team. Hey, that. That.

[Bucky Brooks]

That.

[Ocho]

That's. I thought. That's crazy. And every blue moon, you'll see him. He'll grab one in the middle of the chest with one hand and have the other one in the middle of the chest with the other hand.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

And he.

[Ocho]

And he looking. He controlling everything. I'm like, how the hell is he? How the hell are you doing all that?

[Bucky Brooks]

A lot of times, you have to. You have to be able to feel the double team. You see how the guy. How. How if he trying to reach me, they're trying to scoop me or they accept him. They're trying to call, you know, they're trying to power. They're trying to combo block me. But that's instinct. That's years and years of playing that double team and understand it. Cause, you know, like you said, hey, you gotta make a pile. But he was so good at playing on the edge, so he's not. And the same thing I tell tight end, bro, don't let that man square you up. You give him a side. You give him. Hey, you decide. Don't let him put. Don't let him put his hands in your breastplate.

[Ocho]

Oh, it's a rap.

[Bucky Brooks]

You're not going nowhere.

[Ocho]

And don't let him be strong. You definitely move.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yeah, you better be able to whack. And that's what. That's what the good D tackles look at. Look at Aaron Donna Royce. You see he doing. He's doing like a wide receiver, tight end. He's up there doing this trying to get skinny, trying to. Trying to run the rim. What we. They used to have a circle and guys run around it and see how low they could get and get around there.

[Ocho]

I remember that.

[Bucky Brooks]

It's frustrating when you lose Ocho, you know that and when you lose, okay, who makes the most money? Because guy making $750,000. Why are we talking about him?

[Ocho]

No attention to that. And listen and almost. And the funny thing about it is a lot of people will see this as Hayden obviously when it comes to probably the best player on the defense.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

He is Dexter Lawrence. And to come out and say something like that where people know people aren't scared of you anymore when obviously statistically based on the numbers that you just said that anyone that's being blocked and Dover team 70% of the time or more. I mean there's your answer. There's.

[Bucky Brooks]

Oh. Oh. The Eagles are reportedly interested in a potential blockbuster trade involving star pass rusher Miles Garrett. According to Yahoo Sports, Charles Robinson. I've heard it from a couple of other super high ranking people in other teams that are clearly on the phones and that Howie Roseman and the Eagles are super hot at the Miles Garrett that high. Roseman will give up like three first round picks and a player. You know. You know what? I think they'd probably be willing to give up three first round picks and probably Jordan Davis or one of those superstar, you know, one of those young players. I don't think they'd be willing to give up Carter but I think they'd be willing to give up Davis. But it's going to take three first rounds.

[Ocho]

Absolutely. And it's damn. Well, it's damn well worth it with one thing about how he Rosenho. If you watch the way he maneuver, the way he conducts business when it comes to getting players and building a team, building a roster, you know and obviously right now the main thing is the main thing with the Philadelphia Eagles, despite what everybody talking about, they trying to go back and repeat them.

[Bucky Brooks]

Absolutely.

[Ocho]

Back and repeat. And goddamn Harry Rosemas is pushing all his chips in on the table. I know what I need. I know a piece can help us and that's going to get.

[Bucky Brooks]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

God damn. What happened? What happened if with that trade through three first round picks and a player. What if they want AJ Brown in exchange?

[Bucky Brooks]

Hey, they won't. You can have him.

[Ocho]

What? What?

[Bucky Brooks]

Yes. Because the way I look at it, Ocho if I get him and I'm And I'm the Philadelphia Eagles that I believe I can beat. Where are we going to be picking the bottom half? You're going to get somewhere between 28 and 32. We're not going to be in the top 10, so it's not going to hunt us. It's not going to hurt us. See, now you mess around and you pick it in the top 10. A Chicago. Who's that? No, Carolina. Remember, Carolina wanted the first pick and the next year, boom. That, that pick that you gave up is Caleb Williams.

[Ocho]

Yeah. And I, I honestly me just thinking about it, the only thing that makes sense, okay, you're giving us three first round picks and we need something of equal value if we're letting, if we let not.

[Bucky Brooks]

But I wouldn't give up both the ojo. I would give up three first round picks. You don't, you don't get A.J. and Carter. A.J. and right. You can get, you can get A.J. you know what? I might be willing to give up Carter and keep Jordan Davis.

[Ocho]

No, no, absolutely not.

[Bucky Brooks]

I would.

[Ocho]

No, I'm going the opposite way. And obviously it might not be any, anybody defensively with all the smoke, with all the talking, you know, they might let sticks go because I think that's the, the value.

[Bucky Brooks]

Who, Devonte?

[Ocho]

No, I say sticks. I mean number 11.

[Bucky Brooks]

Oh, oh, oh, yeah. AJ. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I can see that. Yeah, I think, but I, I think Ocho Carter hadn't been the same player in the injuries. He didn't, wasn't in shape like he was supposed to. See teams factored that in. Ocho, your kids, 24. So if he's not in shape at 24, what makes me think he's gonna be in shape at 26, 27, 28. Because. And, and now Ocho, I got to get a big car. I got to put a big contract on the table. Now he's gonna want 30, 32, 33, 34 million. Am I willing? Is that someone I can trust to invest that kind of money in? I already know what I'm gonna get. Miles Gary. I'm cool with that. I already know Miles Gary's gonna play like he's broke and he's one of the highest played defensive players in football. So I'm not, I'm not ever worried about him being in shape. Now I got to worry about him speeding a little bit. Hey, damn, Miles, slow it down. Damn, bro. But I'm sure they've had, I think Andrew Barrett has had a conversation with him. I think he's got like six speeding tickets a couple of them, excess of 100 miles an hour. That's something that he needs to work on. But I don't have to worry about him when it comes to being in condition and being. Him playing hard. I don't have to light a fire up under him. Ocho, if I pay you that kind of money, Ocho, I don't need to give you no pep talk. I don't need to say, come on, son, we need it today written. What I need you to say, hey, hey, son, I don't need. You can't practice today because I don't want you to hurt nobody. That's. That's. That's how it should be. Look, I. All we can go by is Ocho, by body language, what's being said. Something is going on that AJ doesn't seem happy. He doesn't feel like he's getting the targets that. Cause he. Ocho, he's looking at a 1 Uno up in Cincinnati. That man got 42 targets. I haven't got 42 targets all year. This man got 42 targets in two games. He's looking at Puka, he's looking at Jetta, he's looking at all these guys that. He said, I'm a number one. And I see number ones. They get their targets. They get seven, eight, 10 targets a game. I get three or four. And I'm supposed to be okay with that?

[Ocho]

Yeah, we're supposed to be okay with that when you're winning. And that's. That's what everybody says. But you got to be careful what you wish for, huh? Because you got to think.

[Bucky Brooks]

You gotta tell me.

[Ocho]

Think about the situation. Trade deadline ends, what, the 4th?

[Bucky Brooks]

November 4th. So Tuesday, Tuesday at 4, 4 o' clock Eastern.

[Ocho]

You got to be careful what you wish for because you're coming from a perfect situation. And what happens if you end up in Cleveland because there's inconsistent play at the quarterback position? Yeah, just you. I. I think if you. You put A.J. brown in that system now, I think they will put you in position to be able to get 42 goddamn catches a game.

[Bucky Brooks]

But who can get it to him? Man, you trusted. You trusted. No, no, no, no, no, no. It takes a vet. It takes a veteran quarterback.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Bucky Brooks]

To target somebody 23 times. And the guy caught, what, what did he catch? Like 16 of them? He got targeted, what, six, 19 times? He caught 12 of them. Everybody, every. Everybody doesn't know how to do that. But the thing that I love most about the Eagles and I love this about the Lions, is that not Only are they developing players. They're not afraid to go get somebody that they feel that can really help them get to the. You see, you look at and where it's. Are we gonna talk about it a little? I. I'll touch on it right now. You look at Detroit, they say, man, we need. Look, Matthew Stafford, he wants to go block. Okay, we'll make a trade. Okay, Rams give us two first rounders and Jerry Goff. Now they go get Penny Soul. They get Jameer Gibbs. Now they get J. Mo. They get Almond Ross, St. Brown. They get Aiden Hutchinson, and guess what? They've done, Ocho. We drafted them, we developed them, we paid them. Look at the money that they paid all these guys. You see? 4 years 212, 4 years 184 years 124 years 112, 4 years 93. You see, you see a reoccurring thing. Guys know now if I come here and I work my butt off, I'm gonna get paid. Ain't no dilly dialing around, ain't playing no mind games. And the buck stops with me on my desk. And don't nobody get this. And that ain't about no egos, Brad. Kudos to Brad Holmes, the general manager.

[Ocho]

And also kudos to him for drafting, too. For drafting.

[Bucky Brooks]

Well, because Brad Holmes, that's him.

[Ocho]

How you draft players and hope they pan out. And they actually don't pan out. But it's like everyone they drafted today, it always just seemed to pan out, which is why they've been able to pay players and develop them and. And they get the money that they.

[Bucky Brooks]

Get because Kirby Jones. Really well, man, you know, they. I mean, they've done. They've done a great job. You look at that D line, you look at those linebackers, Campbell, and you look at what's the big D lineman that just came back. They've done a great job of identifying a player that fits their system. You know, Coach Belichick used to take a lot of criticism for guys like, who is this guy? But Coach Belichick knew what he was looking for. He was looking for two gap defensive linemen. You not going to get no sacks. Remember Chris Long left? He said, yeah, it's fun to win, but I want to be a player. I just don't want to hold up so the linebackers can make plays. My job as a defensive. As an edge rusher. Excuse me, chat. I want to hunt the quarterback. I don't want to just sit on the porch and bark. Let me hunt. And so you identify the player that's going to fit the system. A player that personality wise will fit your system because it don't do any good if the guy fits the system but he's a jackass. You have to identify that. You identify that. You do your homework. Now you're going to miss some because sometimes guys can fool you.

[Ocho]

Absolutely.

[Bucky Brooks]

But I just love what they do.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

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[Bucky Brooks]

Morning Zoe.

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[Bucky Brooks]

I want to be in a T Mobile commercial like you. Teach me.

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[Bucky Brooks]

Impressive. Let me try AT T Mobile. You can save up to 20% versus the other big guys. You heard them.

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@T mobile.com switch the big take podcast from Bloomberg News keeps you on top of the biggest stories of the day.

[Bucky Brooks]

My fellow Americans, this is Liberation Day.

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Stories that move markets.

[Ocho]

Chair Powell opened the door to this.

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First interest rate cut impact politics, change businesses. This is a really stunning development for the AI world and how you think about your bottom line. Listen to the Big Take from Bloomberg News every weekday afternoon on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

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[Ocho]

I fell in love with the grind. You have to find joy in the work you do when no one else is around. Success is not an accident. I'm passing the ball to you. Let's go.

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