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- [00:01]
A
Thank you for coming back. Part two is underway. You said something very interesting. You said, it takes more than one great player to win a championship. You see LeBron leave Cleveland and then go to Miami, team up with D. Wade, team up with Bosh. But it's still. It took a badier making shots. It took a Mike Miller making shots. It took a real making shots. Can you explain to people that watch the game of basketball, love the game of basketball, why and how it's so difficult to win a championship? Because you play, I mean, all the 82 games and, you know, a Tuesday night game, man, I don't feel like it. But somehow you gotta summon it up to give it everything that you got. Why is it so difficult to win an NBA title?
- [00:53]
B
Because you have to be good and lucky. Like, there's gonna be an element of luck involved in every championship run and year. And what I mean by that is health is a thing.
- [01:07]
A
Yep.
- [01:08]
B
Cause if you think about it, like, Toronto is not beating Golden State.
- [01:11]
A
If KD, it's 100% healthy. Absolutely not, right? No.
- [01:16]
B
And there's just certain things that happen along the route that is just like if Kawhi misses that shot that bounces off the 15 times in your head. Yeah. Just like. Luck is a major factor. And health, like, if you're one of the elite, I always say this. They like Paul, who's going to win the championship. So every year, you got about four or five teams that can win it.
- [01:38]
A
Can realistically win it.
- [01:39]
B
So I say, all right, whatever team is the healthiest at the end will win. So, like, look at OKC's run. They win seven games with Denver. The kid strains his hamstring. What's his name? Gordon.
- [01:57]
A
Gordon.
- [01:57]
B
Gordon.
- [01:58]
A
Aaron Gordon.
- [01:58]
B
I'm thinking, like, man, they pushed him to seven. If he's healthy, it's gonna be tough. And look at Indiana.
- [02:06]
A
Tyrese Halliburton, how lucky was he?
- [02:09]
B
Them shots, boom. Like, there's an element in all of this.
- [02:14]
A
I think he hit like three game winners.
- [02:16]
B
Three game winners that win in Indiana.
- [02:18]
A
And then they go seven in Indiana. But he turns his Achilles early in the game. So who knows?
- [02:26]
B
Like, does OKC beat a healthy Boston team?
- [02:30]
A
Right.
- [02:30]
B
You know, who knows? So, I mean, it is what it is, and it's part of the game. So I always say that luck is an element. I feel like in 2010, if Perkins don't tear his ACL, we got somebody that we can put on Casal to where. Cause Gasol went crazy on us in game.
- [02:46]
A
Yes.
- [02:47]
B
And so I Feel like, man, man, maybe they got lucky.
- [02:50]
A
Right?
- [02:50]
B
You know, so it's always something, you know, So I feel like those are the two big reasons you win or you don't.
- [03:01]
A
Being around the game, following the game. You still study the game. Has there been a player ever been as criticized as LeBron James?
- [03:09]
B
Never. Like the pressure that was on. Like I told you earlier in this conversation.
- [03:13]
A
Cause you said when you was in the locker room, you was in the All Star game. In Phil, they say there's a 17 year old kid that's in high school that can play in this game right now.
- [03:22]
B
That's the hype he was getting. And under these conditions, with the social media and to be able to live up to it, like when you look at all the great athletes all through time and you know people will say, I don't like LeBron, that's not true. I have much respect for LeBron. Like LeBron.
- [03:40]
A
Cause y' all had battles.
- [03:42]
B
Like, LeBron is the reason I am who I am.
- [03:44]
A
Right.
- [03:45]
B
You know, like I became a better player playing against him. And what I will say, there's nobody in the history of the game that's been as hyped, that's lived up to it and surpassed it and had to carry so much weight on his shoulders, politically, athletically, and then be under the microscope to be a household citizen.
- [04:11]
A
Yes.
- [04:12]
B
Like he has no blemishes.
- [04:14]
A
Yes. He got no margin for error and.
- [04:17]
B
He has no margin. Think about all our great athletes. Ali had his, you know, Russell went through his magic, went through. Jordan had his thing with the gambling, like every. Floyd Mayweather had his issues going with the jail. Tyson, all the great, great greats at the top went through something. LeBron is 20 something years in and I don't no blemish. Yeah, that's incredible to me. Cause I had to really sit back at it like, damn. You know, Cole dealt with his thing in Colorado, got past that. Like, he ain't what he deal with, man. Man, he been model citizen. Like, even if it's some speculated rumors nationally, whatever, whatever he deal with, behind whatever, who cares? But to add, to go through your career, how he's went through it is incredible, man.
- [05:10]
A
I tell people all the time, I say, no matter what you thought he would be, he superseded it.
- [05:15]
B
He became that and more.
- [05:17]
A
Ain't no way you thought you was like, yeah, he good, he really good. But you ain't thought this man was gonna be no four time league mvp, no four time finals mvp would play this many years, be the. Because people Thought Kareem's record was gonna be untouchable because Biggs. Because you know, Biggs, after Kareem got. Hey, they went. Kareem, get the rebound. Pass it out. Magic, hold that thing up. All right, get on down there. Go get that cap and throw it to him. He's a wing guy. Guys ain't supposed to play that long, play that well. Pete Truth, that ain't supposed to happen. I don't care what anybody say. You not supposed to play 23 years, 22 years and play at the level. The man was an all NBA selection. The man was sixth in MVP voting and in year 22, and he's still regarded as a top 10 player.
- [06:03]
B
I'm just trying to think, like, if I was given the nickname Truth my rookie year and I made one All Star game, I'd be getting killed. Like, he had the nickname King from day one.
- [06:18]
A
From day one.
- [06:18]
B
And lived up to it.
- [06:20]
A
Yes.
- [06:20]
B
You know, think about it. Nobody got their nickname. Only one that got their nickname early was Magic.
- [06:25]
A
Yes.
- [06:26]
B
That.
- [06:26]
A
He had that in high school.
- [06:27]
B
Lived up to it.
- [06:28]
A
Yeah. Yes.
- [06:29]
B
Like, who had a nickname as a rookie coming in and lived up to it? Like, we all got our nicknames. Like Allen Iverson. The Answer got his when he became.
- [06:39]
A
The Answer and the Ticket got his when he got that big contract, right?
- [06:42]
B
He got a big contract. Like, the nicknames didn't come until you really did something right. You know, he got us before he actually did something and lived up to it. So that's crazy right there.
- [06:52]
A
Those battles that you had with LeBron, you say it helped shape who you became, and you knew that you had to go through Cleveland when he was on Cleveland, in order to get to where you wanted to go, the destination you had to go through. You had to go through the King.
- [07:08]
B
Well, yeah. I mean, I'm not a top 75 player today if I don't have battles with him and having those type of game sevens and playoff moments against him. I'm not a Hall of Famer if, you know, I don't do those things against him and Kobe, like, so that's why I say, like, you know, me being able to put on that jacket, he was a big part of that.
- [07:30]
A
Right.
- [07:30]
B
You know, you gotta. You gotta go through some real battles with some real players, like, to really get that kind of credibility, you know? Yeah, I was an All Star player, but you gotta have shining moments versus the best. You do, you do, you know, Versus the best. And when you do that, then you get verified. And so I Needed him. And I think he needed me too.
- [07:52]
A
For sure, like.
- [07:54]
B
Cause when I look at it like we was putting him out the playoffs and that critical game six in Boston that he had. If he loses that game, that changes.
- [08:05]
A
Oh, yeah, that changes. He's not thought of. He's not thought of in the light that he's thought of now. Absolutely. After losing the weight, losing in the fashion that they lost the previous year to Dallas and to come back and to lose in six games and. Yeah, but it was that game that now it reinvigorated, like, okay, now we see why people call him back. Now we see why 45 and 15. Nobody expected that.
- [08:31]
B
Yeah, but like, that was a game where he went into a hostile environment. We win that game, we go back to the finals.
- [08:36]
A
Yes.
- [08:36]
B
So he went there. He had to have the mindset where people was like, he's not. He doesn't have the killer instinct. He's not clutch. It was all these things being said about him. He erased all that in that game. And then in game seven, when they beat us in Miami.
- [08:50]
A
Cause he had like 30.
- [08:51]
B
Well, he had like 30 something there. He's like 40. Probably that game too. So, like, when you start having games like that, it builds. That builds that in you now. So, like, when I start hitting game winners, I feel like I hit them all the time. You know what I'm saying?
- [09:04]
A
They give Pete, hey, hey, let's run this pin down. Let's run this flare to P. Let P come up off this thing.
- [09:09]
B
So now that aura in them, I felt like it grew.
- [09:11]
A
Yeah.
- [09:11]
B
Going. Going through Boston and having that type of game.
- [09:14]
A
Wow. You get to your first finals, unfortunately you gotta play your hometown team. You got a team that you grew up thinking about. You saw magic with all those titles. You saw cap Caribbean worthy and all those. You grew up. You understand the tradition of the Los Angeles Lakers, but you also understand the rivalry that is the Los Angeles Lakers and the Boston Celtics. So now like, damn, I wouldn't have it any other way. Boston versus the Lakers. But they got a mofo over there that wear that number. He be 24 at the time. I think he's 24 then.
- [09:50]
B
He's 24.
- [09:51]
A
Like, man, why could I get somebody else that's a little easier to get.
- [09:55]
B
Me the first one. And Shannon, you know this, like, to win is stressful.
- [10:01]
A
It is.
- [10:01]
B
It's like. Cause like, people don't take into the account. I'm not. I'm not talking to family members. I'm not.
- [10:09]
A
I'm like, I'm you locked in?
- [10:12]
B
I'm so locked in that it's putting stress on my wife and kids. Cause I don't wanna sleep in the same room now. Cause I wanna be over here. And now I lose a game. Now I'm not talking to nobody. Like, it's so stressful. And it puts a strain on the.
- [10:27]
A
People around you, around you.
- [10:28]
B
And that's the part that don't get talked about enough. Like, it's more than a game.
- [10:32]
A
It is. You got that seven times. See, we in the super bowl with one game. So my family's coming, the kids are coming. I go see them for like, 30 minutes. That Thursday. When they arrive after that, my mom, everybody said, y' all not gonna see your dad until after the game. Ain't nobody gonna call me until after the game. Cause I'm focused. I don't need. Hey, go to Sea World, go to Disneyland, Go wherever y' all wanna go. Hey, it's on me. But don't call me unless it's an absolute emergency. Somebody going to the hospital. I don't hear nothing.
- [11:05]
B
Just the rise and fall of the emotions. It is like, all right, we beat LeBron. All right, cool. Now we got Cole King, Cole Mamba. Like, man, it's like, you can't sleep some night, right? You gotta figure out, like, you know, you up watching tape, then you in the whole day. This part, they'll talk when you in the hotel. They might. People yelling outside the hotel.
- [11:29]
A
Yeah. Like, pull the fire alarm. You can't get no sleep at night.
- [11:32]
B
It's all kind of things that can distract you, dude. It's like. That's like. But I wouldn't have wanted no other way. You know, for me, as a kid growing up in Inglewood to play the Lakers, a team that I grew up a fan of. And then now I'm a part of this history of Boston and la. Like, I couldn't have asked it to be any other way. It was almost storybook, right? Like, damn, I'm really playing the Lakers in the finals. Like, I'm be part of this forever. Forever.
- [12:03]
A
Let me ask you this, because I've heard. And not just in basketball, but I've heard this in football, too. I've heard guys said that when they won a championship, it's not what they thought it would be. Like, is this it? When you won the championship, was it everything that you thought it would be?
- [12:24]
B
Man, Shannon. It was everything and more. I built my whole life around this. Like, it's just like, I don't know who say stuff like that. But, like, when I dedicate my life to this.
- [12:35]
A
Yes.
- [12:36]
B
And for just this one moment, even if it was only for, like, that night or whatever, I can say this for the rest of my life. It was everything and more. I still feel it. When I go to Boston, it's cheers. When I look up and I see that banner. It's not going nowhere.
- [12:52]
A
It never. It never everything. I'm a part of this.
- [12:56]
B
When I go to Paris, the mill is on us.
- [12:59]
A
Yeah.
- [12:59]
B
Like, it's everything and more than I thought it was gonna be. Cause I didn't know. I mean, the feeling is there, but when you. It's getting. It's constantly like, you still feel it. Like, it's been 17 years since I won, and it's still. Every time I'm in the city, it.
- [13:16]
A
Still feels like yesterday.
- [13:17]
B
It still feel like we won it yesterday.
- [13:19]
A
It does, you know, because to be a part of it. Denver. I was a part of the first one. The winner Championship in Denver. Went back to back. I went to Baltimore, was the first to win there. You. When you put. And that's what. I don't know how you feel. Because I. And I always. I like to ask athletes. They was like, man, when you lost, I said, man, it broke me. I said. Because I knew how. I said. Things hurt when you put so much into it. When you put so much of your time, your energy and effort into something and it doesn't work out. It don't just have to be sports. It can be a relationship, it can be a business. The more you put something, the more you put into something, the more it hurt when it doesn't work. Man, look here. I still. I lost to Jacksonville in 96. I still ain't got over there. It's been 30 years.
- [14:07]
B
Yeah. I ain't got over 2010 game suck. Man, we up in the fourth quarter. Like, it's still.
- [14:13]
A
Because you know what you put into it. You know how many times you ran those dunes? You know how many times that you denied certain things just so you could be the best truth you could possibly be? And when it doesn't work, man, it's.
- [14:26]
B
Equivalent to a man being married 20 years and divorcing. And you like, damn, I done invested all of this, all this time, time and energy, and it didn't work out. That feeling is not a good feeling.
- [14:39]
A
It's not.
- [14:39]
B
And it sticks.
- [14:40]
A
Cause you feel like you a failure. Because what did I. What. What did I do? What could. Because now guess what I got to do, P. I Got to play, replay it over and over, over and over. What could I have done differently? What should I have done differently? Man, if I'd have trained, man, if I'd have trained a little harder, if I'd have lifted a little bit more weight, maybe if I didn't go out that night, maybe if I'd have studied a little. I mean, all that is the same thing.
- [15:03]
B
Same thing. It's crazy. It's crazy. I'll never let it go. You know, to this day, I never watched that game, that game seven we lost.
- [15:12]
A
I haven't watched that game, that division.
- [15:13]
B
Round playoff, this game.
- [15:15]
A
I don't need to see it.
- [15:16]
B
I don't need to see that. I know what happened. Right? Right. People always ask you what. No, I ain't watching that. I ain't watching that. I know what happened. Right. Like you said.
- [15:24]
A
But in that game, man. Hold on. I'm just trying to figure out how you get wheeled off in a wheelchair, Pete.
- [15:31]
B
All right, look, so the diagnosis is a strained meniscus. That was the diagnosis the next day. Have you ever strained a meniscus?
- [15:40]
A
I have.
- [15:41]
B
You know, you can still play on that. Yeah, but it hurts. It still hurt, you know, and I don't know. And then your knee is kind of loose.
- [15:49]
A
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. You don't have stability. I mean, maybe y' all could play on it. It's hard to play on that if you a football player. All that platinum cut that we gotta do.
- [15:57]
B
And so when it first happened, it was like a sharp pain.
- [15:59]
A
Yeah.
- [16:00]
B
So it was going down my leg, and I was just like, I ain't never felt no sharp pain in my knee.
- [16:03]
A
Right.
- [16:04]
B
And so that's why I reacted the way I reacted. But I didn't know the severity of it.
- [16:08]
A
Right.
- [16:09]
B
I just felt the sharp pain, and I knew it was something. So, like, doctors like, oh, get away from them, you know, I mean, like, dang, pick them up. Pick them up. Get the wheelchair. I ain't ask for no wheelchair. They say, hey, hold on. Get the wheelchair. You know, they just brought it out. And then they had cameras all on everything in the hallway and everything. So I was just like, man, when I got back to the back, I was like, all right, hold on, man. Let me stand up. Let me see how to put weight on. I hadn't put weight on it. Think about it. Cause they carried me, and I sat down. So let me see where it's at. So I stood up. I was like, all right, it ain't bad. It ain't that Bad. I'm doing this and it's kind of loose, right? But it ain't. I'm weight bearing and you know, anything that's weight bearing. You good?
- [16:58]
A
You good? Yeah.
- [17:00]
B
You know. Cause you know how a sprained ankle feel. It's hard to put the weight on. Any other injury that when it's in your legs, it's hard to put the weight on. So once I put the weight on it, I was like, it ain't as bad. Let me get me a knee brace. It just feel like loose, like it's gonna tear any second. Let me just stabilize it and let me see how I feel, right? And it's the finals, right? I ain't never been to the finals, and it's game one, and I don't.
- [17:24]
A
Know if I'm ever gonna come back to the finals.
- [17:26]
B
If I'm ever coming back. I'm going back out there, right? Doc was like, no, there's no. I said, man, I can put weight on it. I just ran out there. I was supposed to be on the thing. He was supposed to test it, do all this other stuff just to make sure it wasn't nothing, Man, I ran out of there. I was like, no, I'm good. Give me the knee brace. And I just ran out of there.
- [17:41]
A
So it wasn't for you to go to the bathroom?
- [17:43]
B
No, no. I made a joke up on the halftime show, man. Come on. Why would I go to the bathroom in the biggest game of my life? You know what I'm saying?
- [17:56]
A
But if you all have to go.
- [17:58]
B
Never had to go to the bathroom during the game. Never.
- [18:02]
A
Cause we gotta go. We go on the sideline.
- [18:04]
B
Yeah, but I ain't like. I ain't never walked off the bench to go to the bathroom.
- [18:08]
A
Really?
- [18:08]
B
Never. If I have to, it's gonna be at halftime.
- [18:11]
A
No, you can't wait that.
- [18:13]
B
I ain't never left the bench to lose the bathroom ever. Ever.
- [18:19]
A
You end up with dropping 15 points in the third quarter, shooting 70% from the field. People like, man, I don't know if. I don't know if Trooper really hurt.
- [18:29]
B
I love that this is gonna live forever. Hey, I love.
- [18:34]
A
That's your Kirk Gibson moment. Kirk Gibson against the A's when he.
- [18:41]
B
Hit that home run, that lean over, that stretch out home run. Yeah, I remember that. Oh, man.
- [18:46]
A
You mentioned you win it the first year and then you come back, you're back in the finals, and you're facing the same team, and it comes down.
- [18:55]
B
To a game seven against the Mamba again. Again. Man, that's tough, you know? Cause he talking about we gotta play the greatest. And he ain't gonna just keep struggling, you feel like. But they was built. And Kobe his will and he didn't have the best game, but he turned Paul Gasol into Pau Gasol, right?
- [19:21]
A
And that was because y' all neutralized him. It was Powell and then Metal Ortez, Metal World Peace. But then he hit that shot. When he hit that shot, Paul, what went through your mind?
- [19:32]
B
You know what? I couldn't even be mad cause I didn't watch the game. But I know to play. Because think about this. You got Kobe Bryant is isoed on the left wing on Ray Allen. And this is a crucial possession, right? So.
- [19:48]
A
Cause I think they're up one.
- [19:50]
B
They up one. So if we get a stop, we like. Cause Kobe known for icing the game right here. So I'm like, all right, let me help off of meta. Cause that's Kobe. Like, let's not forget who this is. Like, we'll worry about him later, right? So when Kobe drove, I stepped up to like, hell no. We can't let him beat us.
- [20:12]
A
Cause he can beat us, right?
- [20:14]
B
They gonna have to prove that these other guys can beat us. And when he hit the shot, it just proved that he had other guys that can beat us. Right? So I couldn't even be mad. You know that, Ron. Cause he was struggling from three all series long. So I was just like, he had a late contested three, then hats off, couldn't even be mad because I'm not. We can't let this dude beat us.
- [20:34]
A
Anybody but Kobe.
- [20:35]
B
Anybody. Cause we know he can beat us. Cause he's beaten too many teams. So it was just like, damn. And we had to lead most of the game. I think we led like 90% of the game, right? Like, it was unreal. I can't even.
- [20:50]
A
You mentioned game seven. Is it fair that Doc receives criticism for the game Sevens that he lost? He's lost them to the Clippers. He lost. You guys had a 3, 2 lead in that series. Cause they went back for both games and they won game six and game seven. Is it fair that Doc receives the criticism that he receives for losing game seven? No coach in NBA history has lost more Game seven.
- [21:13]
B
Really? Really?
- [21:15]
A
Nope.
- [21:16]
B
Oh, wow.
- [21:17]
A
Remember they lost the. Really? The one that really. Is that when they had them beat and hard and they lost? I think it was. I think they had. And they lost to the Hawks. Remember they lost to the Hawks.
- [21:27]
B
They lost to the Hawks.
- [21:28]
A
Yeah. When Ben Simmons wouldn't take that shot.
- [21:31]
B
Oh, damn. Oh, right, right.
- [21:34]
A
He had a dope. Yes, yes. And then they had another one, I think.
- [21:37]
B
Who did they lose to?
- [21:38]
A
They might have lost to the Celtics.
- [21:42]
B
Yeah, I said the Celtics, I think.
- [21:44]
A
In a Game seven.
- [21:45]
B
Yeah. A couple years ago. Yeah, Yeah, I think so. But the thing is, like, I will say this about the NBA, and it's different from football. Like, you can have a player carry you to a win. One player is good enough, your best player, to say, come on, guys, I get high eight. You know what I'm saying? You done seen it too many times. Nah, I got this tonight. We done seen Dirk Nowitzki do it to the Heat. Like, y' all get on my back.
- [22:13]
A
Right?
- [22:14]
B
Like. And then when you get to the Game seven, really coaching is out the window. It's like, they know all our plays. You know, they. The scouter.
- [22:23]
A
You know what they do?
- [22:23]
B
You know what they do. This comes down to your stars.
- [22:27]
A
Yes.
- [22:28]
B
All game seven comes down to your stars. And point blank period. So it ain't. I can't put that on Doc. You know, I could put the three, one blown series leads on Doc when he, you know, he's been up three, one. Yeah, he blown like two or three seasons.
- [22:44]
A
Yeah. With Clippers. And it's just the Nugget. He had that with the Magic against the Pistons.
- [22:50]
B
Yep, yep.
- [22:51]
A
Tracy McGrady.
- [22:52]
B
I remember that. Cause Tracy was like.
- [22:53]
A
Tracy was like, yeah, I know what it's like to go to the second round. He ain't making.
- [23:00]
B
That's on the coach and the player then. But, like, game seven is on your best players, truthfully. Like, they gotta step up and bring you home.
- [23:09]
A
We need some clarification. The Ray Allen Ray decides to go to the Heat, right? You, kg Rondo, Are you guys. Are you upset that he left or are you upset? Part of you might be upset that he left, but did it have more to do with where he left and went to?
- [23:31]
B
Absolutely. It was absolutely where he went. You gotta understand, we've been battling on LeBron for the last four or five years. Yeah. So now they're our rival. The Heat on our rival. It's LeBron. He's our rival. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. So, like, dude, we just played them in the playoffs a year ago. Like, you can't go play with them.
- [23:55]
A
So you don't want him to go help them. Help him get a championship.
- [23:58]
B
Yeah. Nah, that ain't how this work. Nah. I would have been better off him going to the. To the Lakers. And that's our biggest run. Damn, I would have been cooler with him doing that.
- [24:10]
A
So Ray Ella said, you know what, hey man, look, I'm leaving, you know, blah, blah, blah, I'm going to Lakers, I'm going to join Kobe. You cool with that?
- [24:19]
B
If we had that conversation and it was like a conversation, I think the biggest issue, Shannon, was we didn't have no conversation with him. Listen, we and I tell this story all the time. We, we was a brotherhood when you win and you know, our wives are friends and our kids are friends. We doing family stuff, Halloween, Thanksgiving. And for you to abruptly leave without a conversation like, hey, I'm thinking about, you know, doing this. We built something here. Like is it.
- [24:51]
A
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- [24:59]
B
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- [25:02]
A
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- [25:19]
B
Something like if there was an issue with contract, maybe there's something I could talk to Danny about or wic, like lean on us first. Like to us to wake up and hear it right? Like that's the issue I had. And me and him had that conversation. I was like, damn, we couldn't even get a phone call or nothing. Like is it something we could have done? Like we could have maybe talked to Doc if the contract wasn't to your liking or whatnot. You didn't like your role on the team. Like something like what is it? You know, maybe we can help but like to just like get up, leave the house, don't tell us where you going, then we see where you at. You know mama didn't like that. You know I couldn't do that.
- [26:02]
A
Rumor had it that Ray was looking for homes when he.
- [26:07]
B
While during the Miami series the year before. Like before.
- [26:10]
A
Is that true?
- [26:11]
B
No, this was the rumor that we were playing Miami in the playoffs the year before.
- [26:16]
A
Right.
- [26:17]
B
While we was down there, he was already looking at houses.
- [26:21]
A
I mean, Miami is nicey.
- [26:23]
B
Like you can't be in the middle of a series. You already checked out.
- [26:27]
A
No, no, I ain't checked out. But you know, mama want to live to Miami? Nah, the weather's nice. I don't want to live in Boston year round.
- [26:33]
B
You already in this Series like this, some bullshit. I'm coming to play for them next year, who we're battling.
- [26:39]
A
You think he was upset with his role?
- [26:42]
B
I think he was upset with his role and then went to Miami and got the same role. If Ray stayed, we could have won, too.
- [26:52]
A
I feel like you felt at that point in time, if Ray comes back, y' all are equipped to deal with LeBron.
- [27:01]
B
Yeah, yeah. You gotta understand, we went back to the Eastern Conference finals.
- [27:06]
A
Yeah.
- [27:07]
B
Two years. Like, we went to the finals 2010. But then we played them again in the conference finals, like, two or three years later in Miami. Remember that?
- [27:15]
A
Yeah.
- [27:16]
B
Yeah. So we was equipped for a few more years if he stayed.
- [27:19]
A
Right.
- [27:21]
B
So that's. I mean, that's.
- [27:22]
A
It's funny how you guys used to handle disagreements. In Boston, it's reported that there was a disagreement between Ray Allen and Rondo, for sure. And you brought boxing gloves.
- [27:33]
B
Yep.
- [27:34]
A
And y' all say, okay, settle it, man.
- [27:37]
B
We was having a lot of tension at the time in the locker room, and it was like little clicks. You know, the teams be, you gonna click up, you clicking up. And, you know, we was in a. We was in a situation. Our team was built old, young. The young guys kicked it. The old guy kicked it. So we felt the young guys was like, y' all don't mess with us no more. You know what I'm saying? Cause something happened, Shan. Like, something happened, man. We was on the road one day, and something got back to the wifeys.
- [28:06]
A
Who pillow talking, man.
- [28:07]
B
It was some pillow talk going on to where it was messing with the locker room.
- [28:11]
A
Oh, for sure. Absolutely.
- [28:13]
B
You know what I'm saying? It came from the young guys, so the old heads. We was like, man, we gotta just move like this now. You know what I'm saying? We have to move different now. They like, man, we ain't. Y' all don't mess with the young dudes. And then.
- [28:28]
A
Nah, y' all talking. Y' all pillow talking.
- [28:30]
B
Yeah. And so then KG got into it with Perk. Rondo got into a rail or something. It was just like a division then, right? So it was just too much going on. It was just like, man, all right, we gonna get your issue off. I brought these gloves. I had an issue at the time. We had another dude on our team named Patrick o'. Brien. So I started off.
- [28:50]
A
Yeah.
- [28:50]
B
I said, all right, we gonna get our issue off. Let's put these gloves on. Cause I got an issue with you.
- [28:55]
A
Damn.
- [28:55]
B
Put the gloves on. We put the gloves on. Right? So. No, no, no, no, we gonna go three minutes. Boom, boom, boom. So then next. So then, we didn't know that Big Baby had an issue with Tony Allen. So now Big Baby and Tony Allen, they get they issue. All right, who next? Rondo. I want them. Me and Ray.
- [29:16]
A
Damn. He called Ricky.
- [29:19]
B
I want him. Come on, let's get it all. And when I tell you. I was right there, man. You remember you just watched that fight. Canelo, Bud. Canelo and Bud. Remember that ninth round how Bud came out?
- [29:33]
A
Yeah.
- [29:33]
B
Ninth round. Rondo came out like that, with conviction. He wanted to take. Like, he missed all of them. Yeah, but.
- [29:41]
A
But he was trying to tear Red head off.
- [29:42]
B
If he had a connected on one of them, bro. Man, Man, I'm glad he didn't connect on one of them. Cause he was swinging with some conviction. I'm talking about. It wasn't no jabs. It was all.
- [29:56]
A
He wasn't going up a haymaker, man.
- [29:58]
B
It was no jabs.
- [30:01]
A
So Ronda was throwing one hit, a quitter.
- [30:03]
B
Whoa. And I was like, damn. Okay, you got that?
- [30:07]
A
We got that out.
- [30:08]
B
We got to break this up. Cause this is gonna. If somebody connect, this is gonna get out of control. So we broke it up. But, yeah, they had a little issue. And, you know, I don't know.
- [30:17]
A
Did they mend once they got past that? So was it better after that, or they still had friction?
- [30:22]
B
It was friction still, you know.
- [30:25]
A
Cause the report was, is that Ray wanted Chris Paul.
- [30:29]
B
Ooh, I don't know that. Oh, maybe. So it was like. Yeah. And I think it got back to Rondo. Yes, that's one of them. But it was a lot of other stuff, I believe, that Ray was doing. Cause I think, you know, Ray would often go to DOC and be like, you know, rondo not give me the rock. Give me the rock. Right? And I used to be like, right. You just go to Rondo.
- [30:49]
A
Just go, Rondo.
- [30:50]
B
Yeah. Cause I used to be like, rondo, run that. Like, come on, dawg. Like, come on, dawg. Hey, we gotta. Like, come on, man. Don't go to.
- [30:58]
A
Yeah.
- [30:59]
B
To go to him.
- [30:59]
A
Cause he gonna feel you snitching on him.
- [31:01]
B
Yeah, like, go to him. Cause I'll just go right to Rondo sitting right here like, Rondo, come on, man. What we doing out here?
- [31:08]
A
Right?
- [31:09]
B
You know what I'm saying? That was like, all right, P. I got you. All right, cool.
- [31:13]
A
But see, Ray's personality is not like yours. See, Ray not confrontational. Ray gonna go to the coach. Hey, Coach, handle that. And then Ray. But See, Rondo gonna realize where it's coming from.
- [31:25]
B
Yeah, yeah. But Ray is not as controversial, but he's political.
- [31:30]
A
Yeah.
- [31:30]
B
So you could politically talk to Rondo. Like, you could use them words to make like, me and Rondo might have a shouting match, but we gonna get over it. You gonna talk better to him than me and him.
- [31:42]
A
Right.
- [31:43]
B
Like, yours gonna come off different. We gonna shout it out, and then we gonna be cool, though. But that's. I mean, that's how we are.
- [31:50]
A
But you guys. And then there was a ceremony, I think the championship ceremony that Ray didn't come back for. Or maybe. Or maybe there's something that he was. You guys didn't invite him back?
- [32:02]
B
No.
- [32:03]
A
Oh.
- [32:04]
B
Oh. It was something Ray didn't come to. It was a few things Ray didn't come to, dawg. I'm telling you. And that's what made the relationship tough. Cause when Rondo first re. Signed his new deal.
- [32:13]
A
Yeah.
- [32:14]
B
We all had a get together for him at a restaurant. He didn't show up.
- [32:19]
A
Man, look here. The man tried to tear my head off. I ain't coming, P. I'm gonna be honest with you.
- [32:23]
B
It's a team thing, though. And so, like, all that built up to where, man, I might have came.
- [32:26]
A
And kicked that whole cake over.
- [32:29]
B
So. But we just felt like no matter your relationship, like, we gotta support each other.
- [32:33]
A
Okay, I see what you're.
- [32:34]
B
If I got a bowling event, y' all all gotta come.
- [32:36]
A
Yeah, for sure.
- [32:37]
B
Like, if they doing this, like, come on. Everybody support each other. We on the same. We trying to win, bro. Like, you ain't gotta stay long, right? You know, and that's, you know, and that was kind of like the beginning of the breakup with all of us. And it was just like, man, I wish we could have stayed together a few more years.
- [32:53]
A
You mentioned one of your former teammates, Glenn Big Baby Davis, and he had an unfortunate situation where got involved with some activities, and now he finds himself in federal prison. How difficult is it to see. You know, for me, it's very difficult to see my former teammates when they fall on hard times, because I remember, you know, I choose to remember the great times that we have in the locker rooms, on the bus, on the planes, laughing and joking on the practice field. And to see him going through what he's going through, how difficult is that.
- [33:22]
B
Up, man, you hate to see, you know, a few things when you're done playing that you've accomplished so much with people. You hate to see, you know, them go broke.
- [33:33]
A
Yeah.
- [33:33]
B
You know, and need something from you. Cause I'm always willing to help.
- [33:36]
A
Yeah.
- [33:36]
B
You hate to see them go to jail, which has happened in this situation. And I haven't had a chance to talk to Big Baby. I would love to, like, reach out. You know, I've had a few teammates go to jail, actually. And, you know, sometimes, like, it's hard to communicate. Cause you got the letter writing and the visitations. You gotta do so much. And then they. In other states.
- [33:59]
A
Yeah.
- [34:00]
B
And so you try to just talk through other people. You can get the mess closer to family members. But you hate to see that type of stuff. Cause of the bonds you built. You built. And you hate to see people fall on tough times. And, you know, hopefully this makes him stronger. Because, like, him going in, he seemed like he was on some positive vibes. He didn't seem, like, worried. Cause he was all on Instagram. And you never know. Instagram covers up a lot of our emotions.
- [34:25]
A
Yeah, Instagram fake.
- [34:26]
B
Yeah. You know, it covers up who we really are.
- [34:29]
A
Cause Instagram got me thinking I'm broke. Cause everybody living, everybody got culinary. Everybody got urisance. Everybody. I'm like, well, damn, what they doing that I right? I'm like, well, damn.
- [34:39]
B
Y' all got it like that, right? Right?
- [34:42]
A
Everybody happy. Everybody in a happy relationship.
- [34:44]
B
Pete.
- [34:45]
A
Everybody been married for 10, 15 years. They got the woman of their dreams. They got the man of their dreams. The family is great. I'm like, come on now.
- [34:52]
B
Nah, what you see on there and what you see in person is two different things entirely. That makeup come off. We know what's under that makeup.
- [35:03]
A
Kg, you mentioned that you guys had a great relationship. And everybody talk about how, you know, how intense he is and how much he talks. Could you tell when KG was getting under people's skin?
- [35:18]
B
Yeah. I mean, dude, KG just is just an intimidating force. Just, like, looking at him like, man, like his.
- [35:28]
A
Yeah.
- [35:28]
B
Like, he got a whole aura about him. Like, just walking in the room. And then if he start barking at you and saying stuff, it's just like, you gotta understand. A lot of the. And he do it to the younger guys, too. A lot of the younger guys looked up to him.
- [35:42]
A
They did.
- [35:43]
B
And it was just like, you know, I done heard some stuff like, ooh.
- [35:47]
A
Is that true what he told. What he told Joachim Noah? Cause he's like, hey, man, I admire you, man, the way you play. He said, man, get off my D, man. Stop.
- [35:56]
B
I was right there. I was right.
- [35:58]
A
He said that?
- [35:59]
B
For real, Pete, man. 100% dojo Kim. And they made up since then. And we laugh about it, though. And Joe Kim is cool. So we was at the free throw line. He was like, man, I'm sitting right there. I heard the whole thing. I'm right there. He was like, yeah, kg, man, I just want you to know, you know, man, I look up to you, man. I had your poster and everything, man. Damn. You know, I would love to work out something along that line. Like, man, get off my D. Like, yo, dude. I was like, damn. No, but look. No, but look. It was another one. Here go another one. Here go another story that I don't think got out. It was another player. He was like, hey, hey, we had the free throw line again. Cause you know, this what guys like to talk. He like, hey, Kev, man, I just want to invite you. You know, I'm having my wedding this summer. You know, I would like to continue advising Kevin, man looked up and said, fuck you. Like, oh, damn. I was like, damn, kg.
- [37:10]
A
I look like.
- [37:11]
B
So the one thing I did learn, dude, don't talk to Kevin during the game.
- [37:15]
A
Right?
- [37:16]
B
Talk to him before or after or text him that. Like, y' all over here telling this stuff during the game. He is in full gladiator moment right now. Dude, leave him alone.
- [37:26]
A
Right?
- [37:27]
B
Like, come on. Stop that, y'. All. The.
- [37:30]
A
The. The. The. The situation that he and Carmelo got into it. The Cheerios. Things have been debunked. Yeah, but how surprised were you? Were you that Melo was waiting at the bus and wanted to throw hands at kg?
- [37:42]
B
Yeah, I see. I didn't know what was going on. Cause I think I was still in the shower or something.
- [37:46]
A
Yeah.
- [37:48]
B
You know, before I realized what was going on.
- [37:51]
A
Right.
- [37:51]
B
Like. And I didn't even hear what was said to this day. And I've never asked him.
- [37:55]
A
Right.
- [37:55]
B
You know, it's just certain things, you just don't even want to know if it's true or not, you know? And that's one of them for me. And it was just like, damn, he must have. He really got under Melo's skin. And then when it came out that he was talking about something about his wife and all that, and I was like, man, I done heard KG talk a lot of shit, but he ain't. I don't think he went there with it.
- [38:15]
A
Right.
- [38:15]
B
You know what I'm saying? Maybe he thought he heard something like that. But I ain't never heard nothing to that. To where you, like, that's crossing the line.
- [38:26]
A
Yeah. Oh, yeah.
- [38:27]
B
You know what I'm saying?
- [38:28]
A
Hey, man, People. Wife, man, people don't play about the wives, the girlfriend, kids. Hey, you stay away from that.
- [38:33]
B
Yeah, stay away from that. Everything else is fair game. We playing a game. It's whatever. But, like, the personal family and kids and wives, they keep that out of. Now, I've heard the girlfriend stuff a lot. The girlfriends is open, yo.
- [38:48]
A
They do? Yeah, for sure.
- [38:49]
B
If it's just your girlfriend, that's open season. I done heard stuff like that. Not for real, but other players, like, hey, that's your girl. Oh, yeah, she was with me. It's like you said that, like, in the game. I was like, what? To the other player. And the player was out of his game the rest of the game, man. It's some stuff. I know you done heard some stuff, too.
- [39:10]
A
Oh, for sure.
- [39:10]
B
Oh, man, I might have uttered a few things.
- [39:14]
A
Let's go ahead. Like you said, fair game. Fair game. Fair game. Did you smack talk? Trash talk to Kobe.
- [39:28]
B
Sometime. But, like, Kobe, he different. Like, he just. Like, sometimes his smack talker was breathing hard on you. Like, he just had this look in his nose. He had this thing with his nose clarity. Like, he wouldn't say nothing. Oh, shit. You know what? I shouldn't have said? Nothing to do. No. But it was one All Star Game, so we beat them in the finals. So the next year, in the All Star Game, he at the free throw line, and I yelled something from the bench, like, that's why y' all blew it last year or something. I said, something foul?
- [40:11]
A
Yeah, you gonna choke like you did in the finals last year. He choked.
- [40:13]
B
Yeah, I said he choked. You gonna choke, man. We was about to fight in the All Star Game for real, dude. He came over to me on the bench, walked right dead over there, got in my face. I had to stand up, like, hold on.
- [40:26]
A
You ain't gonna stand up on me now.
- [40:27]
B
Come on. Yeah, yeah. You ain't been killing me. Yeah. So I had to stand up, like, what you talking about then? So I'm thinking like, dude, like, he. He really, like, it's the All Star Game.
- [40:37]
A
I know we about to, like.
- [40:38]
B
I'm thinking we about to squabble in the All Star Game. He was hot. I was like, damn. All right, you know what? I ain't trying to do all that in the arsenal, for real, man. I was like, damn. I should. You know what? Let me chill.
- [40:52]
A
You mentioned the battle, like you said, look, I'm not a top 75 player. I'm not thought of as the player I am. If I don't have those battles with LeBron, when he's at Cleveland, when he's at Miami, he's in Miami, I'm in Brooklyn. You. A lot of times you guys guarded each other. That game, that game, I think was that game six. I think it was game six. You had 40, he had 42. Or you had 42, he had 40. But you guys were going at it. You guys were. I mean, back.
- [41:25]
B
That was we game seven, Boston, we both had 40.
- [41:28]
A
Yeah, you guys were going at it.
- [41:30]
B
Yeah.
- [41:31]
A
So how you. What are you trying to do to get him off his game? Is there a spot you're trying to keep him from getting to? Are you talking to him like, bro, this is not your year. This is not it.
- [41:43]
B
I would talk to LeBron, go our meetings at the free throw line again. Like, oh, you know, I always used to say, he gonna choke at the line. Cause at the time he was always missing big free throws, free throws. But like, when he's on, you can't stop him because the strategy is to make him shoot jumpers, Right? But if his jumper is on, if he hitting, then it's. Oh, right.
- [42:05]
A
And that's what happened in that game, that Game six in the Garden.
- [42:08]
B
Yeah, he was hitting everything. Fade aways, threes. Cause the scouting is to go under the pick and roll. Let him shoot jumpers. And if his jumper is on, it's nothing you can do. Cause he's on. Now when you get down, you don't want to give him the free jumper. Cause now you gotta get up now. He going by you and doing all that, man, it was just like, man, you gotta pick the. The lesser of two evils. But if he got them both going, it's a long night. And he's so strong, man, I just remember trying to foul him Brute. You damn near had to wwf him to just stop him from getting the and one. Like, I remember so many different fouls I gave and I'm damn near tackling them. And he still almost.
- [42:48]
A
Cause you see the one with the Morris twin when he's playing Boston and he grabbed him by the back. And LeBron still lays it up and get the ass.
- [42:55]
B
He did that so many times to where it's down, you damn near gotta tackle him to stop him from like getting the and one right. Especially when he got that full steam ahead.
- [43:03]
A
It's like, man, you mentioned it's reported that you told him I have the ball to take that shot in Game 5 of the 2000 Eastern Conference Finals. You said that.
- [43:12]
B
That sound like me. That sound like, something I say.
- [43:18]
A
I'm trying to figure out why you and UD Got here. You and UD Iron y' all differences out.
- [43:23]
B
I ain't talked to ud. I really ain't got no beef with ud Like. Cause. And I said some things. And the reason I said what I said, because I didn't appreciate what UD Said about Russell.
- [43:36]
A
Russell Westbrook.
- [43:37]
B
No, Bill Russell.
- [43:38]
A
Bill Russell. Okay.
- [43:39]
B
You know, he said something. I thought that was foul. You know, Russell was passed by then. Yeah. You know, And I didn't appreciate that. And, you know, we got a long rivalry in Boston, Miami and everything. And I threw a shot.
- [43:50]
A
Yeah.
- [43:51]
B
You know what I'm saying? And that's all it was. Because, like, when we played against each other, it wasn't never no me and him and each other face. It was more like me and D. Wade or me and Bron, you know? So it wasn't nothing like that. So I said what he said, what he said. And I was like, kind of like, defending our culture, our side. Because what I said was, I went on Stephen Jackson page, and he got his jersey retired. You Downis. And Stephen Jackson was like, well deserved. And I said. I think I said not giving it wasn't deserved. It was given.
- [44:27]
A
Right.
- [44:28]
B
Like, something like that. And it was a shot. And I probably. And I probably shouldn't have said nothing like that. But I just. Yeah.
- [44:33]
A
You know damn well you ain't supposed to go on somebody else page and take no shot at nobody.
- [44:37]
B
Cause that ain't me. I usually don't do that. Cause I tell a person.
- [44:41]
A
Right.
- [44:41]
B
You know, And I just felt the need to, like, say that. Cause of what was said. I felt it was a disrespect toward Russell. But, like, you know, I ain't got no issue with ud. But, like, if we see each other, like, face to face, you know, I tell them the same thing. Like, man, I ain't really got no issue with you. You know this. We grown, we retired. We got kids.
- [45:03]
A
We got kids.
- [45:03]
B
Yeah. You know what I'm saying? I ain't trying to have no issue with nobody.
- [45:07]
A
Who you think talked more, Gary Payton or kg?
- [45:11]
B
Gary, bro, you can't shut Gary up. That's why I didn't mad GB Be.
- [45:17]
A
Out of his mind, man.
- [45:18]
B
You can't shut him up, like, once he get going, man. I'm telling you, man, when gp, you know, he played in Boston with me, man. Gp Me and GP Was fighting one day. And I looked up to GP Like, I completely looked up to GP he from Oakland. I followed him all the way through. You know, him and my brother knew each other growing up. And GP Was saying something, and I was like, man, shut up, Lil man. I'll beat your ass. He was like, we'll do it. Then he was like. He started yelling, and he started getting all hyped up, you know, I was like, come on, Eddie. I was like. He got so turned up. And I'm like, man, I respect G. You know, I'm bigger than him. I'm younger than him. I'm like, gee, yeah, come on, man. I had to smile it off. I had to let him get off. But G, G, G, my man. I love G to this day. That's my big brother, man. But ain't nobody. Ain't nobody talk more than G. He's not going to stop. Like, KG gonna spit here and there, but G is just gonna keep going, like, all night. It's like, damn, I done turned him on.
- [46:23]
A
A guy that's caught a lot of criticism. I think he does a great job on television. I work with him on both shows, Undisputed and espn. It's Perk, okay? He played his role. You know, look, Perk, you know, Perk ain't gonna give you no 20, but he gonna set great screens, he gonna rebound, he gonna hard foul you. But he's caught a lot of criticism. Russ, he said that. You know, he and Russ had a falling out because he said something about Russ and his wife sent him a letter. He and KD been going back and forth a little bit on Twitter, stuff like that. What was it like playing with Perk?
- [47:00]
B
Man, I love playing with Perk. He understood his role, and, you know, he was our enforcer. You know, he was our big man. And I'll never forget when I felt like I knew we would win the series. I'll tell you this one series, this was when Cleveland was the number one seed with Shaq. We were the four seed, and we played them in the second round. And I remember Shaq tried to punk Perk, man. Perk stood in Shaq face like, I beat your like. And I was just like, ooh, okay. You know, I ain't never seen nobody stand in the Shaq. Like, I was like, ooh, that gave me confidence. Like, oh, yeah, we gonna whoop. You know what I'm saying? Cause Shaq is intimidating. I don't care how old Shaq is. I don't care. He could be 99 years old. Shaq is intimidating to this day. And I'm like, oh, yeah, Perk just like, low Key kind of got in Shaq face, right? So I'm like, oh, man, we about to get them. And, you know, but that Perk understood his role. And that's why I say, if he don't get hurt, I feel like we win two rings.
- [48:04]
A
Did Perk have hot takes in the locker room? Was Perk a talker back then?
- [48:10]
B
I mean, he understood the game. And most of the time, it'd be me and Kevin. Cause we stuck around longer in the locker room. Me and Kevin, like, we be there. Cause we. The old men, they usually leave. But Perk was always knowledgeable. He always had his say in the concert, but, you know, they gone. But then when we retired, you know, he would. All Me and him would talk, and he'd just be like, man, you know, I'm looking to get into the business, Pete. You know, what you think, you know? And I was like, he's very strong opinionated.
- [48:35]
A
He's always been that perfect.
- [48:37]
B
That's what you gotta have. You gotta have an opinion. It's very. Been strong opinionated. And that's what you have. You gotta stand on.
- [48:42]
A
You gotta stand on it. Anybody can say, well, I like both guys. You know what? It's really. No, you gotta have an opinion and stand when you. Cause criticism's gonna come eventually. Criticism's gonna come because you're not gonna be on the right side of everybody's opinion.
- [48:56]
B
Right.
- [48:56]
A
And you got to stand on it.
- [48:58]
B
And you can't be in this, trying to be liked all the time.
- [49:01]
A
Nope, nope.
- [49:02]
B
You know, you gotta say what you.
- [49:03]
A
Feel, what you feel.
- [49:04]
B
And, you know. And he's always done that.
- [49:06]
A
Yes.
- [49:07]
B
And so that's why he's great in this space.
- [49:10]
A
What was it like playing with Shaq? Because you didn't get the Magic, Shaq, you didn't get Lakers. Shaq, you didn't even get Heat. Shaq, you got a guy that had been around. I think he had gone to Phoenix and came to you guys. I think he ended up going to Cleveland last. But what was it like with Shaq?
- [49:31]
B
Man, that was one of the funnest teams I ever played on. We didn't win it. But I promise you, Shannon, if Shaq had been healthy, we would have won it. That really, dude, go back and look at our record with Shaq. I think we were like 28 and three.
- [49:45]
A
Wow.
- [49:46]
B
Like, and then he gets hurt. Yeah, something like that. Like, we were rolling with. All we needed was his presence. Because the thing about Shaq, when you drive to the lane, ain't nobody helping off of him. So the lane wide open, right? And you not helping off kg. I was having a field day with them. Like Rondo was having a field day with them too. In the lineup. Double layups. But then off the court, man, just the laughs we had with him. And you just know, you know, Shaq, he just. He funny. He's just a comedian.
- [50:11]
A
You're a big ass kid.
- [50:12]
B
Big old kid. And then we had Nate Robinson with him. Oh, man, that was one of the funniest times because we all kicked it. We all went to dinner. And this was the one, the only person, Shaq is the only one that had a bigger aura than kg.
- [50:30]
A
Wow.
- [50:30]
B
Cause going, you know, being in practice, in the locker room, kg, he got the biggest aura. Then you see another big aura coming in there and you like, it's bigger than that one. It's like, I'm in the locker room. This is like a big sun in the locker room shining. I'm like, man. And then we sitting there having story time after practice. You know, the OGs, we gonna sit there after practice, be chopping it up, talking about whatever, shooting the shit. So that was one of the funnest times.
- [50:56]
A
Was Shaq still pranking people when he got to Boston?
- [50:59]
B
Was he still pranking? Man, that is never gonna stop, man. Come on. Shaq was doing. Putting stuff in people's shoes.
- [51:07]
A
Yeah, he was doing. T. Lue told a story of how he took a dump in Devin George shoes.
- [51:13]
B
Man, he was doing, man, he was still doing stuff like that. Him and Nate Robinson, dude, I'm telling you, it was the two. It was crazy. But that's who Shaq is, you know, so it made the locker room fine.
- [51:26]
A
Yeah. You also have had a teammate, Delonte west, who's kind of fallen on hard times. He's dealing with some issues. Mark Cuban has tried to help him out, but he kind of had a relapse and he's back in it. What was he like? What was playing with Delonte like? And did you see anything that would lead you to believe that this could possibly be a fate down the road?
- [51:49]
B
No. I mean, actually, Delonte was one of my favorite teammates. Cause I had a young Delonte. You know, just having him and Tony Allen together was like, man, you wouldn't believe it. They was like the good friends on the team, and they was my youngins. And Delonte was really good dog. But just to like be around him every day, his competitive spirit, and to know where he came from. And I knew when he was in the league, he Needed medication. It was our.
- [52:18]
A
Really.
- [52:19]
B
Yeah, yeah. It was like, when he was playing for us. He needed medication then, and I didn't know it would turn into what it turned into the crib today. But we knew he had, like. I don't know if it's a bipolar disorder or something like that. I think he was diagnosed with. To where, you know, Danny would, like, talk to him and try to make sure he take his meds and all that, because, like, you saw a couple episodes, like, to where he go off and, you know, he had a couple fights in the locker room, but, you know, you didn't think it had just turned into, like, full on. Just like, he just had an episode.
- [52:56]
A
Yes, yes.
- [52:57]
B
Like, and, you know, it just goes to show you how difficult it is to deal with mental health. I have two nephews, and I have a chance to see it firsthand. Shannon with schizophrenia is like. Like, it's the worst thing that you can have for a family to deal with every day, because every day is new and it's different, and you don't know what can happen, you know, and, you know, I just encourage people to just. If you're dealing with this in your family and the people around you, you know, just show the love and make sure that you can get the support that you can give, because it's a real thing and it can damage. It could break a family apart.
- [53:43]
A
Oh, for sure. Absolutely.
- [53:44]
B
You know, I've seen, you know, that firsthand, and, you know, you try to pray and you try to not wish that upon people, but it's just. It's difficult. And like I said, it can break families apart.
- [53:58]
A
Wow. LeBron, heading into year 23, year 22, averaged almost 25 points a game, eight rebounds a game, eight sizzles a game. Shot over 50% from the floor, shot 38% from the three. Shot one of his career highs from the free throw line. You said you believe 23 would be his last season. You still believe 23 is his last season?
- [54:22]
B
Is that this year? Yeah, yeah, I think this will be his last season. You know, I mean, he's accomplished so much. He's played so long, and I truly believe that now that you've had the opportunity, like. Like you've done something that's never been done in a game multiple times.
- [54:42]
A
Right.
- [54:42]
B
And the one ultimate thing that's. There's two things that's never gonna happen while I'm alive. Nobody's gonna break his scoring record, and no other player will play with their son. Right. I don't believe that those two things will happen. I think, like there has to be.
- [54:57]
A
Unless you had a son in high school.
- [55:00]
B
And I just have to believe that he has a sense of fulfillment now that, you know, he's done it all and accomplished so much. And now he's built up such a great off the court presence with his businesses and things of that nature, that that's gonna be his next challenge and growing that and becoming the best in that field. Cause I know it eats at him every year he doesn't win a championship. And I know he loves the game, but I truly believe that.
- [55:33]
A
You don't believe KD can break his scoring record. KD's at almost 30,000.
- [55:39]
B
Where's LeBron at 50?
- [55:41]
A
42 regular season points.
- [55:43]
B
So no, so much things have to go, right. He has to be healthy for like the next 10 years, I think.
- [55:49]
A
Cause I mean, he has to play. He has to play basically at least seven years.
- [55:54]
B
And play all the games.
- [55:55]
A
And play the game.
- [55:56]
B
Yeah, all of them. No injuries, no sit outs.
- [55:59]
A
And LeBron's playing this year.
- [56:01]
B
I don't think.
- [56:01]
A
I think it's really hard because normally guys retire when they can't play at the level they're accustomed to. You averaging 25 points of game, Pete, with eight and eight, it's hard to walk away. And you make it. Now it's different because we've never seen LeBron in the final year of his contract. Unless LeBron really wants to be in the final year of his contract. It's reported that the Lakers like, nah, we gonna wait and see how this year turns out. So I don't think LeBron goes. I don't think he. I don't think he really wants to go anywhere else. He's building a compound here in la. He loves la. He came to la. They didn't recruit him. He came to them. Yeah, it's like winning the lottery. I ain't even played the lottery, but I won. Magic ain't do.
- [56:46]
B
He showed up.
- [56:47]
A
He and Rich Ball showed up at Magic's house.
- [56:50]
B
That's gonna be a hard. That's gonna be a hard decision because this is all he knows.
- [56:55]
A
Over half this man's life has been in the NBA. Think about it. He's gonna be 41. This will be so since he was 18, all he knows is the NBA.
- [57:04]
B
But I have to believe that he doesn't wanna play just to play true. You know, he wants to win like he wants to win a championship. And if there's a situation to where if the Lakers lose the first round or how they lose.
- [57:21]
A
Well, he should want to go. If you lose in the first round with Luka and Austin Reeves and what you have, I get it, you don't have no history. You don't got no great big man. But with Luka and LeBron, you should never lose in the first round.
- [57:33]
B
Right.
- [57:34]
A
That in and of itself, you should never lose in a place first round.
- [57:37]
B
Yep. So I believe it's all going to depend. I don't think he'll announce it, but I think, barring the circumstances on how they go out this year, he'll make that decision.
- [57:50]
A
You, LeBron. Mom almost beat you up for filing that man hard. That was LeBron. LeBron told Glow. Glo, sit down.
- [58:04]
B
Glo tried to get. Hey, Glow. Come on, Mama. You know we love you. Come on, mama. Hey, why you trying to come? I'm just trying to just not let him make the layup. Mama. I wouldn't try to hurt him. I ain't never tried to hurt him.
- [58:19]
A
You guys have played. You guys have played a lot.
- [58:21]
B
Yeah, we played.
- [58:21]
A
LeBron has beat you 35 times. You beat him 34 times.
- [58:25]
B
Yes.
- [58:25]
A
You wanna go back and get. Try to tie this thing up?
- [58:27]
B
Tie this thing up with a dagger 3. I sit in the corner. I need to go back and tie this up. Damn. I'm trying to think, what was the last game? The last game was probably in Brooklyn. Yeah. Or Washington. Washington. Oh, this is regular season, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah. Okay. Damn, that close.
- [58:50]
A
What. What if you guys were the same age? What if you came in. Cause you came in 98. LeBron came in 03. If you guys were like, if we.
- [59:01]
B
Were the same age, I don't believe he would have had four championships. He wouldn't have got.
- [59:06]
A
You kept him from four.
- [59:07]
B
He wouldn't have got those two in Miami. Cause I gotta believe if we're the same age and I could offset him and that would have been good enough, right? You know, like, if he hada got 40 in game six and we the same, I would probably got 40 and offset him.
- [59:23]
A
Right?
- [59:23]
B
You know, I was at an older age then, a lot of miles and stuff, and it was hard for me to keep up with him. I ain't gonna lie. I'm looking. I'll be looking at that tape, Shannon, and I'm like, like, like, damn, I couldn't even move. Like, as a younger, I could have moved with him. But I'm like, yeah, but.
- [59:41]
A
Cause you know, in Brooklyn, you say, you got it. You gonna DM up at Brooklyn, I don't know what you was on that day.
- [59:47]
B
My mind and body say two different things.
- [59:50]
A
Your mom was saying one day that body said, nah, I ain't gonna be.
- [59:53]
B
I got him. You know, I thought I did. Oh, man. Gonna lie. That's right.
- [60:02]
A
You was very outspoken about KD going to the war. You said, it's not so much that they have the ability to go. LeBron and KD had the ability to go wherever they wanted, but it was KD going to a team that won 73 games to have the MVP and they had just lost the finals. Do you believe that KD would have been judged differently had he gone somewhere else and helped that team win a championship, as opposed to the Warriors?
- [60:30]
B
Yeah, of course we would have got judged differently because the way. And it's the same thing with Ray. We just lost to Miami. Then you join them, right? Kd, you just lost the Golden State, who you should have beat, right?
- [60:42]
A
Cause you was up 3:1.
- [60:43]
B
You was up 3:1, and you joined them. And so that's why. That's where the criticism come in. Because it was just like, damn, kd, you good enough to beat them. Right? Like, we feel like that's. Cause that's how the old school stars won. We like, man, I'm gonna get over the hump. I'm gonna take my lumps.
- [60:59]
A
Take my lumps.
- [61:00]
B
And people just thought. Felt like he took the easy way out, okay? And that's all. But, like, you know, I get it, because we live in a culture to.
- [61:09]
A
Where rings now, it rings, everything now.
- [61:11]
B
Comes off your championship. So he said, let me get that out the way.
- [61:14]
A
Yep.
- [61:14]
B
So now what y' all gonna talk about, right? And so I get it, you know, it's more understandably now because I come from the old school, and I feel like, man, you gotta get it the hard way sometimes.
- [61:24]
A
You gotta take your luck and maybe. Hey. And maybe you don't get over the hook.
- [61:27]
B
Yeah.
- [61:28]
A
Charles Barkley and Karl Malone. Maybe you don't get over the hump, but what you don't do is. I look at it like this. He paid his debt to society. He paid his debt to the Thunder. His contract was up. I'm trying to think. I don't know if he could have gone. Where could he have gone and won a championship? If you look at the landscape, if you go back, if you can remember, if you go back and look at the landscape, where is he going? If he goes to the Knicks, he not beating Kyrie and Kevin Love and Bron in Cleveland, if he goes. If he goes anywhere else, they're not gonna beat the Warriors. He gotta go back to okc.
- [62:11]
B
He's gotta stay in okc.
- [62:12]
A
Okay. Okay.
- [62:13]
B
You gotta stay. Right? You went to the finals with that team, right? And you up three. One against. This was supposed to be the rivalry that we should have saw the next five, six years to where one of these two teams is gonna go to the finals every year.
- [62:26]
A
Right?
- [62:27]
B
You know, you stay there, you got the team. Yeah, but I think a lot of that had to do with Russ.
- [62:33]
A
Yeah.
- [62:33]
B
You know, I think they had. They was bumping heads.
- [62:35]
A
They were bumping heads.
- [62:36]
B
And it looked like it on the court because you felt like Russ should have got him the ball more, but Russ felt like, I'm the man.
- [62:42]
A
Right. You know, and then, you know, it's hard to argue. Cause the next year, he goes to win the MVP and average a triple double.
- [62:48]
B
Right?
- [62:48]
A
So it's hard to say that he couldn't be the man. And that's the hardest thing, is that Shaq and Kobe should have won more championships together.
- [62:55]
B
Right?
- [62:55]
A
But Kobe, like, I'm the man. And Shaq, like, nah, you little bro. He's like, nah, not no more.
- [63:00]
B
Damn.
- [63:01]
A
Cause just imagine the perfect situation is Kareem and Magic. If that magic was Kat. Where you want the ball? Gotcha.
- [63:10]
B
Right?
- [63:11]
A
It's hard when one guy believes that he can be the man. And he should be the man Magic knew he could be. Cause Magic. Cause when Pat Riley challenged him and said, I need you to. To score more, Magic went out and scored more, averaged over 20 and won the MVP.
- [63:26]
B
Right?
- [63:27]
A
But he's like, Magic tells the story that when Pat Riley told him that he needed to score more, he like, you run that by Cap. Hey, I need you to clear that up with Cap.
- [63:39]
B
Right? But damn, that was Magic's game. Was passing. Yes. You know, when you got two guys who they game and scoring, then you gotta say who's gonna, you know, take the lesser role in all of this.
- [63:50]
A
It's hard because the way we live in a society, we gotta determine credit. Somebody. It ain't no 50. 50.
- [63:58]
B
No truth.
- [63:59]
A
We gotta get somebody to be 51. We gotta get somebody 49. We gotta be 60. 40. We gotta be 70. 30 ain't no 50. 50. So whose team is it?
- [64:07]
B
Right.
- [64:08]
A
Kobe got tired of hearing he Batman. I mean, he got. He robbing, right? That he riding Shaq's coattail.
- [64:15]
B
He was chasing something else. Yes, he was chasing something else.
- [64:18]
A
He knew that in order for him to become he Couldn't. He can't. Yes. He got. He had the mama name with Shaq, but in order for us to look at him differently, he had to do this without Shaq.
- [64:28]
B
Yup.
- [64:30]
A
We're never gonna look at him if he's doing all the. He win five championships with Shaq. We not looking at Kobe the same as we look at him now.
- [64:37]
B
100%. Yeah. He was on a mission. He knew that he had to get under that shadow.
- [64:42]
A
He had to.
- [64:43]
B
Damn. You just. It's a lot of. Just in the histories of the sports is a lot of what ifs. Damn.
- [64:50]
A
Plus, we gotta assign credit to somebody.
- [64:53]
B
Yeah.
- [64:54]
A
We gotta sign. We see this in football with Coach Belichick and Tom Brady. Who gets the most credit?
- [64:59]
B
Right.
- [65:00]
A
Well, when Tom left, Tom went and got a championship with new Ink with Tampa.
- [65:04]
B
Yep.
- [65:05]
A
Coach Belichick went to the playoffs and then two years of mediocrity. He's the coach at Uncle.
- [65:11]
B
Yep.
- [65:11]
A
We look at the 49ers, we look at Bill Walsh, we look at Joe Montana. Coach Walsh retired. Joe wins another one with Tom. With Seifer. George Seifert. So we can say. So now we can definitively say, okay, it was him.
- [65:25]
B
Right.
- [65:25]
A
We gotta be able to determine who. The reason why we win the championship.
- [65:29]
B
Truth.
- [65:29]
A
We got. That's just the way we're wired.
- [65:31]
B
That's the way.
- [65:32]
A
It's not good. It's not good enough.
- [65:34]
B
Right.
- [65:35]
A
Shaq and Kobe.
- [65:36]
B
Nah.
- [65:37]
A
Nah. Nope.
- [65:38]
B
But Shaq was so dominant.
- [65:40]
A
Bet he would. You had to see it. People don't. Real people. Cause people look at Shaq now and they see him, he having fun. People just don't realize, man, he's trying. You couldn't do nothing with him.
- [65:53]
B
Do nothing? Nothing. They changed.
- [65:56]
A
Just imagine if they called foul. Shaq would shoot like 50 free throws a game. If they called every foul.
- [66:01]
B
Man, come on, it's. Damn. You couldn't do nothing with the big fan.
- [66:05]
A
You couldn't. People don't realize just how athletic. Considering his size, considering his agility. People don't realize how good people think. Oh, Joel Embiid. Joel Embiid couldn't move like Shaq. When Shaq. When Shaq. Orlando, Shaq and first three years of la. Shaq.
- [66:26]
B
There wasn't a better athlete on the planet.
- [66:28]
A
No.
- [66:30]
B
Yep.
- [66:30]
A
He's 7 1. He's 330 pounds and he can move like a 6, 7 guy. That's 200 pounds.
- [66:38]
B
Yep. Yep.
- [66:40]
A
You had to see it. Like I said some things. Like you had to see Barry Sanders play in person. To really appreciate what he was doing, you had to see Jerry Rice. You had to see Prime. You had some things you just have to see in person.
- [66:53]
B
So why is it you don't think that Jordan is better than LeBron? You saw him both.
- [66:58]
A
I did. I saw him in person.
- [67:00]
B
Like. Cause.
- [67:01]
A
Go, James, man, come on.
- [67:04]
B
Come on. I mean.
- [67:05]
A
Cause you think about it.
- [67:06]
B
Come on.
- [67:07]
A
Because he could do more. He could rebound better.
- [67:12]
B
So what do we go off of, dude? Cause this is the argument that I have today. Like, you know, like, better player is one thing.
- [67:21]
A
Yes.
- [67:22]
B
Like, is he just like, let's take away all the accolades?
- [67:26]
A
Yeah.
- [67:26]
B
Like, LeBron is probably the greatest player of the game. Right. But it's unfortunate that we gotta add the accolades.
- [67:35]
A
Yeah.
- [67:36]
B
We have to act.
- [67:37]
A
So we gonna.
- [67:38]
B
The team successful. So how many.
- [67:39]
A
So we gonna. We gonna. So we gonna put those, like, 20 all NBA selections in there. 21 all NBA selections. Yeah, you gonna put it in there?
- [67:47]
B
Okay, we're gonna put that in.
- [67:47]
A
We're Gonna put those 20. Those 20.
- [67:49]
B
No, no, no, we're not going to put those in.
- [67:51]
A
Okay, so we. Okay, we will do.
- [67:54]
B
We're going to take the 15 years or 13 years Jordan played the first, and let's match him up with the 15 years.
- [68:02]
A
My guy's still playing.
- [68:02]
B
Huh?
- [68:03]
A
My guy's still playing. You can't say this guy. If this guy was.
- [68:07]
B
So we're, we're crediting longevity as a reason.
- [68:10]
A
You make it seem like LeBron just out there.
- [68:12]
B
No, he. Not out there, but I'm saying the peak of your superpowers.
- [68:17]
A
Did you see. Did you see Jordan. Did you see Jordan in. In Washington?
- [68:21]
B
I never seen Jordan disappoint in a big moment.
- [68:23]
A
Did you see Jordan in Washington?
- [68:25]
B
Yeah, I played against Jordan in Washington. Yeah. That was like a, A, A farewell tour.
- [68:30]
A
We don't do. My guy still going at 23. Ain't no farewell. Ain't no telling. Witness. Ain't no witness. Ain't no telling. We got. We got a book that's a th. Page. It ain't the end yet. We ain't at the end yet.
- [68:43]
B
Oh, man, you ain't lying. I mean, that's. Nothing's ever going. You're not gonna do that. Nobody's gonna do what he's doing ever again.
- [68:50]
A
LeBron, I mean, think about those points. Truth.
- [68:53]
B
But is this a statistical thing then? If it was, then why don't we say Kareem was the greatest before LeBron did that?
- [69:00]
A
But see, that was. But here's the thing, because people Say championships, but they crowned Jordan as the greatest players when he had none. If you go back and look at the late 80s, the early. The late 80s, they crowned him as.
- [69:13]
B
The best player in the league.
- [69:14]
A
They said he was the greatest player that we'd ever seen, and he had no championship.
- [69:17]
B
They didn't call him the goat, though. First of all, they didn't call him the goat.
- [69:23]
A
They said he was the greatest player we've ever seen.
- [69:26]
B
Yes, just like when Barry Sanders was there. That was the greatest running back we ever seen.
- [69:29]
A
Yes, but they said running back the Goat. They didn't say he's the greatest player. They said Jordan was the greatest player we had ever seen and he had no championships.
- [69:37]
B
Yeah, but then they say he's the goat. But there's a difference between greatest player and the goat. But how did he get like Tom Brady? When we just look at Tom, he's the goat, right? Yeah, but, like, when you look at him compared to, like, Rogers and Mahomes, if you just watch him, right? Like, he don't look better than them.
- [69:59]
A
Right. But see, for me, I mean, look, I think Tom, because the quarterback is so, so damn important, but I can make a case that LT or Jerry Rice is the great greatest players of all time, but they're not as important as the quarterback because he touches the ball. LeBron Jordan was never asked to do what LeBron has been asked to do. Jordan had a specific task. LeBron, they asked. LeBron said, LeBron, we need you to give us 27. We need you to give us 10, and we need you to give us 10,and we need you to do that every night. And in the meantime, we still need you to guard the best player.
- [70:35]
B
All right? I will say this. LeBron has. He has the greatest of all time influence on winning, okay? Like, from day one, you put them on this team, they're a.
- [70:52]
A
They're a better team. Than what if he's not on it?
- [70:54]
B
Well, you can say that about Jordan, but just like his influence on winning is greater than Jordan because you look at the teams he took to the finals, you know, it's like, damn, you dragged them. You dragged them, too.
- [71:05]
A
That 2018 team ain't got no business in the finals.
- [71:07]
B
And then you kind of erase that, because then you be like, damn, how did you lose when you had this?
- [71:13]
A
I think if you think about it, the only thing. The only team. The only time that I think LeBron really should have won the championship was against the Dallas Mavericks. He wasn't favored in any other championships, really.
- [71:27]
B
Does the journey matter how you win? Does that matter?
- [71:32]
A
It does to me.
- [71:34]
B
It matters, right? It does, like. Cause if you're saying Kobe became something different because he stuck it out with the Lakers and won without Shaq, that matters. That's elevated Kobe well.
- [71:44]
A
See if they could have got him pieces. Do you think Kobe win if he doesn't get Powell? If they don't get medals, Powell is.
- [71:49]
B
Not a top 75 player.
- [71:51]
A
But I'm saying if they don't get him.
- [71:52]
B
No, they don't.
- [71:53]
A
LeBron couldn't get nobody to come to cleats, bro. He took. Think about. He got Timothy Mosgar 75 million. He had Delladova. Delladova is your starting partner. See, that's my point. That's what he was up against. Just imagine if Jerry west was his GM. He would have knew what pieces to put around LeBron.
- [72:16]
B
But that's what makes the journey matter. Like when you go through the rough times, like. Like me and Cole, like we talked about earlier, we were like, oh, we gon the journey's over. But he stuck it out.
- [72:32]
A
Yeah.
- [72:33]
B
And that meant something for him to stay a Laker and wait for them to see if they were gonna do something.
- [72:39]
A
Right.
- [72:40]
B
He never ran.
- [72:42]
A
LeBron waited. LeBron waited.
- [72:45]
B
What year was it?
- [72:47]
A
Yeah, like year seven. He just realized.
- [72:50]
B
What year did Jordan win? Seven or eight.
- [72:54]
A
Yeah, yeah, yeah. But here's the thing. They got him Scottie Pippen. They got him whole grand.
- [73:00]
B
Scottie became something. You don't know Scottie. They didn't go get Scottie Pippen. They drafted well, but I'm saying they.
- [73:07]
A
Weren'T drafted well, though. Truth.
- [73:09]
B
But they were trying to do everything to get him. They got Ben Wallace, Shaq, Antoine. They was trying.
- [73:14]
A
But Ben Wallace was my age.
- [73:17]
B
Yeah.
- [73:17]
A
I mean, Shaq was my age.
- [73:19]
B
But you think that. Think about this. The great players, people always gravitate towards great players. Yeah, the good role players gravitate.
- [73:25]
A
Yeah. But they ain't going to Cleveland to gravitate towards them.
- [73:28]
B
Why not, people?
- [73:29]
A
Because I ain't trying to go to Cleveland.
- [73:31]
B
Milwaukee won. Milwaukee won.
- [73:33]
A
Yeah.
- [73:33]
B
Denver won. We want to go.
- [73:36]
A
I tell you what, let me ask you this. You think Giannis is going to finish his career in Milwaukee?
- [73:42]
B
I mean, in the landscape we are today, it's hard to say that somebody's gonna finish a career with one team.
- [73:47]
A
Yeah. Because he wants to win. And you know, once you get a taste of that winning truth.
- [73:52]
B
Yeah, but whose journey was better, Jordan's or LeBron's?
- [73:58]
A
You think it's harder to win as many championships as Jordan did with one team or win the championship that he's won. Like LeBron, on multiple teams.
- [74:06]
B
It's hard to win, period.
- [74:08]
A
Yeah. Oh, for sure. We said that. We've agreed to that. We gonna agree with that.
- [74:13]
B
But now if I go say, all right, I wanna go over here, but then I get the hand pick. What part of the journey is that? That has to mean something. That has to mean, like, Jordan didn't say pick Pippin, did he?
- [74:30]
A
Right.
- [74:31]
B
They got him on a hinge that's saying, hey, maybe he becomes something, right? You know, like the journey has to, like, mean something. And, you know, it doesn't take away from LeBron's ability, right? Like, he's like, just take away all. Everybody. Take away everybody's championships. LeBron has the greatest ability of any basketball player ever. Like, skill wise, right? Like, I mean, dude, he's the scoring champ. He can pass like magic, he can rebound like Rodman. I mean, he could.
- [74:57]
A
Yeah, he could do it all.
- [74:58]
B
He could do it all. Like, if I'm building a basketball player, I want to build LeBron like an athleticism.
- [75:03]
A
Yeah. No players, baby, they've been able to do more.
- [75:06]
B
But the mental fortitude is what we always questioned about him.
- [75:12]
A
Well, just let me ask you a question. Let's just say for the sake of argument, LeBron James would have had a historically great coach. Say he had a Dean Smith in college for three years and then he get a Phil Jackson for the better part of his career. What coach did you believe that LeBron James gonna have that's gonna go to the hall of Fame? Maybe Spoelstra.
- [75:36]
B
Spoelstra will go to the hall of Fame. Tylou will go to the hall of Fame. Let's see who he with right now.
- [75:45]
A
JJ Reddick.
- [75:45]
B
JJ Reddick.
- [75:47]
A
Mike Brown, Vogel.
- [75:51]
B
But who made who, who made who did Phil make Jordan?
- [75:57]
A
All I know is Phil left somewhere else and went and won a championship.
- [76:00]
B
But did Phil make Jordan?
- [76:02]
A
I'm just asking you a question. Did Healy? Tell me the coach. Tell me the coach. Tell me the coach that's won a championship after they left LeBron.
- [76:11]
B
Probably nobody. Why that? Because LeBron elevated the coach, right? Yeah. So did Jordan.
- [76:22]
A
Phil won three more. Phil won five championships after he left Jordan.
- [76:25]
B
I mean, come on, you inherited Kobe and Shaq.
- [76:29]
A
I just said. I just said what he did.
- [76:31]
B
You inherited. That's like right now, if you inherit, like, who ain't won a championship? A great player in the league right now.
- [76:38]
A
Vogel inherited Vogel inherited. Didn't he have KD and Book?
- [76:45]
B
Oh, Vogel won with Bron. Yes.
- [76:48]
A
But did he get Book? Wasn't he in Phoenix?
- [76:51]
B
Yeah, that was trash.
- [76:52]
A
Oh, my goodness.
- [76:54]
B
Yeah. I mean, I'm not taking nothing away, LeBron. I think the coach.
- [76:58]
A
I think me personally, I give more.
- [77:01]
B
Credit to the player than the coach, though.
- [77:02]
A
Do you?
- [77:03]
B
Yeah.
- [77:04]
A
Yeah, I see that.
- [77:05]
B
I give way in the NBA.
- [77:07]
A
Yeah.
- [77:08]
B
NFL is coaching NBA. It's the player. You know that.
- [77:12]
A
Yeah.
- [77:13]
B
One player can change your fortune in the NBA. It's different in the NBA.
- [77:17]
A
I agree.
- [77:17]
B
You know what I'm saying?
- [77:18]
A
I definitely agree with that. Let me ask you this. Clippers. You go to the Clippers. You said that you hated that. You demanded a trade to leave Boston if you had it to do over again. You finished your whole career in Boston, even though you don't win another championship because it seemed like once you won, you start tra. You still. You know, that high. That high of winning a championship is like, they say it's called chasing the dragon. So you never get that high that you initially felt the first time you did it, but you chase it.
- [77:49]
B
Yeah.
- [77:50]
A
So you won it in Boston. Let me go to Brooklyn. Let me go to the Clippers, or let me go to the. Or let me go to the Wizards. You chasing that you wish you had. Like, you know what? If I'm gonna win another one, it's gonna be here in Boston.
- [78:06]
B
Yeah. I wish I could have stayed there my whole career. Yeah. I really do. But I'm not mad at my path because I had a chance to be an influence on some other young teams.
- [78:15]
A
Yeah.
- [78:15]
B
You know, and I enjoyed that experience. I really did. Like, just. Cause being in one place your whole career is great, but to go to Brooklyn, the Spirit's the big city.
- [78:24]
A
Right.
- [78:24]
B
And then go to Washington to play with these young two All Stars and give them some games, and then to reunite with Doc at home to finish it out. Like, I love the way I ended it, actually. Even though I would have loved to end in Boston, I loved having that experience on the way out, the way I did it. Cause, like, even being back home in la, it was like, it gave me a chance to retire and really kind of, like, put my feet down and ease into retirement in a smooth way.
- [78:53]
A
Right.
- [78:53]
B
Cause I hadn't already had it figured out. Cause I'm home. I have my house here, my kids, everything. I retired. I jumped into sports analyst, media, and it was a good transition for me.
- [79:05]
A
How difficult was it for the Clippers? Cause, bro, you're a 10 time All Star. You're a Finals MVP. You're an all NBA selection. And you coming off the bench.
- [79:14]
B
Oh, man, I was. You know, it's crazy. I just called game in Washington, too. Yes.
- [79:22]
A
Yes.
- [79:23]
B
And Dog Doc put me on the bench. I was hot. I was like, I just. I could have stayed in Washington. Yes. It started like. I was just like. I had. It was like when you get to that level. And I understood what Russ felt in la. Now, Russell Westbrook.
- [79:39]
A
Yes.
- [79:39]
B
This is my first time ever coming off the bench. Yeah, it was like a shock. I was just like, damn. It was just like, hold on, you gotta see who I'm coming off the bench for.
- [79:49]
A
Cause Lance Stevenson wasn't.
- [79:53]
B
Was Wesley Johnson. Oh. And I was like, you know, it ain't a knock on Wesley, but I think I'm still.
- [79:59]
A
It was a knock on Wesley. You said it.
- [80:01]
B
I think I'm still better than him. And I was just like. You know, it got to the point to where I just had to be.
- [80:06]
A
Like, but you was coming out the bitch. You coming in the cleanup time. They be like three, four minutes in the game.
- [80:10]
B
Truth that they put you in at some point. But then it got to the point I wasn't playing for at all. At all. I was like, man, you know, I had to accept.
- [80:18]
A
Did you talk to Doc?
- [80:21]
B
Man, we had little conversations, but then it was just like. It got to the point to where I understood my world. Right now I'm at the end. This is when the light.
- [80:30]
A
The light comes on. Like, bro, this is it for me.
- [80:32]
B
Like, this is it for me. And then I was like, Cause Sam. Cause Sam was on the staff, right? So, you know, practice is going. I'm on the sideline. I get to practice early workouts. So he like, pete, get in there, get some reps. I looked at Sam. I said, sam, in your last year, did I bother you? I said, get away from me. Cause he was with us in his last year. Yes, I remember. He said, he get it. I looked at him like, boy, I was on the sideline chilling.
- [81:14]
A
Hey, Bobby, you bad.
- [81:15]
B
Don't come. I got here early, got my workout in. Now I'm watching practice.
- [81:23]
A
Everybody remember the viral clip? You going back and forth with Draymond and Draymond. I mean, it's quiet. And Draymond, hey, you thought you was gonna get that Kobe treatment. They don't love you like that, man.
- [81:36]
B
Yeah, yeah. You know what's crazy? I didn't hear him say that.
- [81:40]
A
So you didn't hear him Say, no.
- [81:42]
B
I'm on the bench and I'm talking to Draymond. Cause, look, Golden State warriors was like big brother to the Clippers.
- [81:47]
A
Yeah.
- [81:48]
B
And I'm coming over there like, you know, I'm the OG like, hold on. Y' all ain't about to be punking us while we're over here. And I'm like, blake, you know, I'm trying to put a battery in Blake back, you know? Cause Draymond, he. You know, he going to. Yeah, man, he going. He trying to go at Blake. But Blake a all Star, too, now. And he was like, shut up. You ain't Kobe. I guess I didn't hear it until after the game because he said it under the basket where the mic picked it up. So everybody on TV heard it. But, like, in them arenas, it's hard to hear, right? Okay. So I didn't even. I couldn't even hear it when he first said it. I didn't know until I got into the locker room and Twitter going off.
- [82:23]
A
And everybody said, everything going crazy.
- [82:25]
B
It's going crazy. Cause, you know, everybody thinking I'm just ignoring him, but I'm just kind of like, I didn't hear him right? And so, you know, it was funny. I give it to Draymond. He one of the all time trash talkers. He got me. He got me.
- [82:42]
A
Oh, baby. You also bet you've been going viral because you said you better than D. Wade.
- [82:52]
B
I did say that. Yeah. But you know what, Shannon? That's what made me who I am.
- [82:58]
A
You artists who believe that, too.
- [83:00]
B
Yeah. That's what gave me my edge.
- [83:04]
A
Right?
- [83:05]
B
You know what I'm saying? You know, I never cared about what people thought of me or other people's opinion. When I step on the court, I'm better than all of y'. All.
- [83:12]
A
Right?
- [83:12]
B
You know? And that's what made me who I am. And I'm a work toward it.
- [83:15]
A
You gotta believe that, though.
- [83:16]
B
You know what I'm saying? And so I'm never gonna. Like, I'm retired now, and I can. And I knew I was retired then when I said it, but, like, that's who I was, and that was my age. I felt like every time I stepped on the court, I was the best player, best player. And that's why I made the accolades I made.
- [83:34]
A
Right? Why didn't it work out with Kyrie and the Clipper and the Celtics, man?
- [83:42]
B
I don't know, man. Cause I thought, you know, in the preseason, I was at that game, at the practice, he said, I'm gonna be a Clipper for life. I mean, a Celtic for life. And I'm a re sign and, man. But, you know, Kyrie different. You know, he think on a whole different level.
- [83:57]
A
He On a whole different wavelength.
- [83:58]
B
A whole level wavelength, a whole different stratosphere. And I thought that could be something that was gonna work out. They can win a championship with him. But, you know, Kyrie, you know, it didn't work out with him and Bron. It didn't work out with him and KD in Brooklyn. It didn't hurt. It work out, you know, so you never know what Kyrie is thinking.
- [84:18]
A
Right.
- [84:18]
B
We would have loved to have him in Boston for all them years, but it worked out. You know, it allowed Jason and Jalen to grow on they own because, you know, Kyrie was the. Was the OG and, you know, but everything happens for a reason.
- [84:32]
A
What do you expect from the Clippers? They got Chris Paul, they got Bradley. Bill, they got James Harden. Kawhi seems to be healthy. He worked out for like, a month after the season, talking to T. Lou. T. Lou said he wanted to make sure his body. He missed half of the season last year, but he looked good, and they're a different team when he plays. What do you expect from the Clippers with Kyrie. Excuse me. With Kawhi being healthy and all the additions?
- [84:58]
B
Man, I just think. I think they'll be competitive, but I just think their time has kind of passed. Yeah, you know, they older. James Harden is older, Kawhi is older. Dealt with so many surgeries, and Bill is older. It's just like this is a young man's game, you know, and these young teams is good. Okc, Minnesota, and you still got Denver over there. I think they'll be competitive, and Tyloo's a great coach, and y' all got talent, but them is a lot of big names. And we all know that older big names usually don't win. They don't win, and so they'll be good. They may be better than the Lakers, maybe, but I don't see it. I don't see it.
- [85:42]
A
John Wall called it a career. Are you surprised at how soon it ended for him?
- [85:48]
B
Man, John had a lot of lengthy injuries. You know, sometimes that can take a toll on you mentally.
- [85:54]
A
Then I think he lost his mom.
- [85:56]
B
Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, he's made a lot of money, you know, in this game, and, you know, he probably didn't accomplish all the things he wanted to accomplish, but, man, he had a great career.
- [86:06]
A
He had an unbelievable career.
- [86:07]
B
He Had a great career. He's been an all star. He's the number one pick, man. My shout out to the young fella. I'm glad I had to spend a year with him, give him some game, you know, and I text him from time to time, hit him up and just be like, you know, how you doing young fella? And you know, he has nothing to hold his head down. And I know it didn't end the way he wanted it to end.
- [86:27]
A
Correct. And we all, we all want that storybook ended though.
- [86:29]
B
Yeah, we all want the story book end, but sometimes it don't go that way. You know what? He had a storybook coming from where he came from and being a hundreds of millions. Why is that on a storybook, Shannon?
- [86:39]
A
Yeah, you right.
- [86:40]
B
We always gotta judge on championships and all that. Like what?
- [86:43]
A
Or retiring on our terms.
- [86:45]
B
Yeah, like, nah, he's made hundreds of millions of dollars. He's played in the NBA. He was the number one pick. He got a storybook life. Yes. How about that?
- [86:53]
A
How about that? You're right. You walked to work 20 miles in a bath roll the Knicks. You really, you was convinced the Knicks were gonna lose to the Celtics, man.
- [87:04]
B
Oh, I was sick. I was convinced. I hate the Knicks and they hate me. They hate me. You know, that's a Boston New York thing, man. I know I put my foot in my mouth. I said that on national television. And to this day I don't regret it. And people everywhere I go say, did you really want.
- [87:29]
A
You saw it. You saw me in my room, walk inside the road.
- [87:31]
B
You saw it, you saw it.
- [87:35]
A
You got a new show, Truth After Dark.
- [87:38]
B
Yeah.
- [87:38]
A
Where it seems you're talking, you giving advice about relationships and people seem to don't want to take advice from anybody that's not married, that's not in a relationship for 20 plus years. Been stable. Why do you feel you're one of the best to give advice on relationships?
- [87:57]
B
I mean, because I've seen all sides of a relationship, you know what I'm saying? I've been married in long term relationships for 10 plus years. A couple of them. I've had kids, I've had long term girlfriends. I've been on both sides. So I can speak on it. Like it's like you being in the NFL. You can speak on it.
- [88:17]
A
Yes.
- [88:18]
B
Like I can speak on being married. If I'm not married now I can speak on it.
- [88:21]
A
Right.
- [88:22]
B
Cause I was married for a long time, you know, and I been engaged and I've had girlfriends and like I just you know, I see my perspective the way I see it, and it ain't for everybody.
- [88:33]
A
Right.
- [88:34]
B
You know, I mean, I try to speak for everybody, but, you know, everybody different.
- [88:39]
A
Right.
- [88:39]
B
I just go off a lot of my experience, Shannon, and you can take it how you want it.
- [88:44]
A
Right.
- [88:44]
B
You know, but, like, I've seen it all. And even if I didn't experience, I've saw other people experience, and I learned from them. And that's why I feel like I'm more than qualified to give, you know, relationship advice.
- [89:03]
A
You once said that marriage is for poor people. It offers no advantage to a man.
- [89:09]
B
Yes.
- [89:10]
A
So under that premise, would you get married again?
- [89:15]
B
That's a good question, man. Like, yeah, I'll get married again. Cause I'm getting old.
- [89:23]
A
You want a hospice wife?
- [89:24]
B
You want somebody taking, yeah, I'm getting old. Yeah, I'll get married again. I mean, I mean, it just. I hear too many of the horror stories, like, especially for, like I said, old people and poor people. Like, think about a man, successful, rich man. Like, I hate seeing stories like, she got 70% of his wealth and she got the kids, and she, like, feel like you stripped a man down of his dignity.
- [89:54]
A
Yep.
- [89:55]
B
Like, I hate seeing them stories.
- [89:56]
A
Right.
- [89:57]
B
Man, it just drives me nuts. And there's too many of them.
- [90:00]
A
Right.
- [90:00]
B
And the percentages ain't in our favor as successful. Not only black, just people in that upper tax bracket. It's just like, no advantage for us. And I'm not saying don't do it. Just, you know, wait till you get old or you broke.
- [90:21]
A
Did you and your wife grow apart because you had, like, you said, you'd been married 10 plus years. You got kids?
- [90:26]
B
Yeah.
- [90:28]
A
How did you come to the conclusion? You're like, you know what, babe? We need to part ways, man.
- [90:34]
B
You know, I think it happens over time. It wasn't like a sit down one. Sit down?
- [90:38]
A
Yeah. Oh, no, no, no.
- [90:39]
B
They're the continuation, you know, and it happened in retirement. And a lot of players, you know, get divorced in retirement. And it's just like, it's a whole new dynamic that happens.
- [90:50]
A
You hold all that, people.
- [90:51]
B
Yeah. Because, like, it's cool when you in and out, you miss each other. You're going through whatever you're going through, and you can deal with it. And, you know, she get to get on, go to the game, highlight herself. And she in the limelight still, too. But then the lights come, and now you coming home, telling the kids to do this and changing the whole family dynamic.
- [91:12]
A
Yes.
- [91:12]
B
And it causes a rift you know what I'm saying? And it just like, it causes. Like, you start side eyeing, looking at each other like, nah, I wouldn't allow this if I was home all the time.
- [91:22]
A
Right.
- [91:23]
B
You know what I'm saying? And then it just causes a divide. And I just think, like, kind of like that's what happened. Yeah. You know, the divide and the communication wasn't there in my situation. And, you know, and it happens to a lot of us.
- [91:38]
A
Yeah.
- [91:39]
B
You know, it's hard to make that adjustment after you done playing, be home all the time, and then now you home all the time. Then you just get up, be like, I need to go somewhere. Right. And now y'. All. You arguing because you got.
- [91:49]
A
Why you. Why you go. You ain't got. You ain't got no practice.
- [91:52]
B
Yeah.
- [91:52]
A
You ain't got no.
- [91:53]
B
Where you going like now. Cause you just so antsy. You used to traveling every week.
- [91:58]
A
You used to leaving every week.
- [91:59]
B
You just like, I don't know how to sit down.
- [92:01]
A
Right.
- [92:01]
B
And then now that's.
- [92:03]
A
That's a conflict.
- [92:03]
B
That's a conflict. And, you know, if I had it to do all over again, what I know now, I would have been probably more sensitive to their needs instead of being selfish. You know what I'm saying? It was selfish.
- [92:18]
A
Well, you gotta be selfish to be great.
- [92:20]
B
Yeah. And I still have a lot of.
- [92:21]
A
You hear LeBron, when LeBron talks, LeBron says, I denied. And the first thing he says is family. Because. Because when you. What you and I did. Because family's the closest. That's why we mentioned them first, is that we apologize to them for being selfish. In order to be great, you gotta be selfish because you're gonna miss recitals, you're gonna miss certain things. You're gonna miss this because guess what? Oh, I can't go play in the game because I got my daughter's recital. Well, I can't do. To celebrate my anniversary because I gotta miss this game. So. Cause I gotta do my wife's anniversary. So you become selfish.
- [92:58]
B
Right.
- [92:59]
A
The greater the player, the more selfish he or she is.
- [93:02]
B
Right. I've said this. I said I took those traits that made me who I am, and it affected my man.
- [93:08]
A
You took it in a relationship or to ruin it.
- [93:10]
B
Yep. It affected the relationship.
- [93:12]
A
Yes.
- [93:12]
B
Cause now you're seeing it all the time when you home.
- [93:15]
A
Yes.
- [93:16]
B
Selfishness. Doing what you want to. Just so many things. And, like, you just.
- [93:21]
A
And they might let it pee. They'll let it slide. When you got a basketball. When you play basketball, you Play football, You play a professional sport or you have a business, but when you retire, says, oh, I want to spend more time with the family.
- [93:32]
B
Yeah, you.
- [93:34]
A
That ain't what you. Man, you ain't been there 20 years, right? And then you gonna come in there and think, she gonna let you change everything. How the app, how. This is how the system work.
- [93:43]
B
Yeah.
- [93:43]
A
Ain't gonna happen.
- [93:44]
B
I didn't know what the system was. I tried to come in there and change it, so. But you know, to this day, you know, everybody cool.
- [93:51]
A
Yeah, that's great.
- [93:52]
B
You know, kids is where everybody get along. So, you know, like it's an experience.
- [93:57]
A
Yes.
- [93:57]
B
You know, and you go through it, you learn from it, and you move on.
- [94:02]
A
Did you see the story where the. The guy sent the young lady $200 and she sent him back. She sent it back to him, say, because she knows her worth. Was it 200 or 2,000?
- [94:16]
B
I know my worth. If a girl sent me 2,000, it.
- [94:18]
A
Was 2,000, wasn't it? It was 2,000.
- [94:21]
B
2,000, yes.
- [94:23]
A
He sent her $2,000. She says, I know my worth. We've been dealing with each other for an extremely long period of time. She sent it back to him.
- [94:34]
B
That's a red flag, Shannon. Anybody can use two racks. I'll take two racks right now. I could use two racks. I mean, damn. Like, what you mean, like, girls like that, you stay away from them because like, oh, you must used to be dealing with who you dealing with.
- [94:52]
A
Yes, who you dealing with that's doing somebody that throw. Well, such and such used to do this for me. Well, he not doing it no more. So why he stopped doing it, right? You telling me who used to do it? I wanna know why he stopped, right?
- [95:05]
B
That's the question right there. That's the question.
- [95:09]
A
They quick to throw that up in.
- [95:10]
B
Your face though, P man, that's why I be trying to tell him, look, you gotta. It's messed up right now, Shan. It's messed up. The game is messed up.
- [95:21]
A
You been giving some good advice. You told us that. Look, a hard working man that's building something. Leave them pretty girls alone. Get you a five, six. Get you a solid six.
- [95:29]
B
Keep it real.
- [95:30]
A
Get you a five, solid six.
- [95:32]
B
Get somebody that's humble.
- [95:34]
A
Yeah.
- [95:34]
B
That don't require all this cause.
- [95:37]
A
9, 10, that's a lot of maintenance. That's a lot of upkeep.
- [95:40]
B
And see, and I always have to go back. I'm not gonna tell her she a five or six, right? Like we all know. I'm gonna Let her give her a nine.
- [95:50]
A
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [95:51]
B
But you know, the public know you a five or six.
- [95:54]
A
Look.
- [95:54]
B
But I'm gonna make you feel like a nine. Ten.
- [95:56]
A
I'm a six. You a six.
- [95:58]
B
Yeah.
- [96:00]
A
That's over a ten, right? We good.
- [96:02]
B
We good. Yeah, man. Somebody who humble, who don't care about, man. Let's go get a sandwich on a Friday night, Right.
- [96:08]
A
And not, you know, and not be tripping. You.
- [96:10]
B
We ain't got.
- [96:11]
A
Look, I understand that, you know, occasionally we gonna go to the master's, we gonna go to state 48. We will go to the nice establishment. But that is not a prerequisite. You don't have to walk on the red carpet, you don't have to be seen. We don't have to post everything on social media. Oh, look, you know, my soul mate, my rib and all that other food because you. You hiding things.
- [96:31]
B
You understand what I'm saying? I feel like this thing, the prettier girls are like that. They're caught into the clout. They're caught into the nice things. Because we feed them that.
- [96:41]
A
Yeah.
- [96:42]
B
You know, because when, like, if I'm not constantly feeding her ego as like a beautiful woman and a beautiful. That's why I say that you're on your phone and somebody is, and that's what you want all the time.
- [96:53]
A
Yes.
- [96:54]
B
And I can't keep up with that.
- [96:55]
A
Yes.
- [96:56]
B
You know what I'm saying?
- [96:56]
A
Yeah.
- [96:57]
B
Yes, I know I can't keep up with it.
- [97:00]
A
Hey, it was one like, you had to tell her all the time that you would. Babe, you amazing. You awesome. You this or that. But I've never been in a situation like that when I had to constantly reinforce who she was and who she is and what type of person and you know, what type of body and how she looked and everything. I'm like, well, damn. I felt like I was a full time cheerleader.
- [97:24]
B
Yeah. They constantly getting it, so they need it. They want it from you. And the minute you don't, I'll get it somewhere else.
- [97:31]
A
Yes.
- [97:31]
B
Or somebody will. Like, it's hard to keep up with that, man. And I hate that it's like that. And that's why I said, man, let me. I'm gonna go this route. You know, somebody who. A little more humble, who actually, like, appreciate the comments.
- [97:48]
A
Well, you know, you shot your shot at Ruby Rose. I mean, I mean, the truth. He normally call gang. The one thing I know about truce. He called game. It go in, you hit that bucket, you pulled a step, pulled up for 30.
- [98:09]
B
I had to catch myself. I had to catch myself.
- [98:16]
A
Cam just went viral. He says he wants to know a girl's past, the man that she slept with.
- [98:24]
B
Ooh.
- [98:25]
A
I don't be wanting to know.
- [98:26]
B
I don't either.
- [98:26]
A
No. But how about this here? A woman's past is as important to a man as a man's future is to a woman. Would you agree with that?
- [98:41]
B
A woman's past is important to a man as a woman, as a man's.
- [98:46]
A
Future, as a man's future is to a woman is. Cause you wanna know if he gonna get that bread, he gonna be racked up. He wants to know how many bodies you got and if any of them in the NBA, NFL, or mlb. She wants to know, you going to the NFL, you in the NBA, you gonna play in the major leagues, or you gonna be, you know, you gonna be work CEO.
- [99:10]
B
No, I don't know. Cause most of them girls, they chasing them. That's already in there.
- [99:15]
A
So his future is important to her.
- [99:17]
B
Yeah. Yeah. That is true. That is true. Damn. I don't wanna know the past.
- [99:22]
A
I don't either.
- [99:23]
B
I don't really care. Because you like me asking. You can lie.
- [99:27]
A
Yeah.
- [99:28]
B
I'm gonna go. More time I spend with you, it's gonna show.
- [99:32]
A
Yes. Yes.
- [99:33]
B
You know what I'm saying? It's always gonna come out.
- [99:35]
A
Yeah.
- [99:36]
B
Like, anytime I've ever caught a girl up on something, I didn't have to look.
- [99:40]
A
Yeah.
- [99:40]
B
It was just like, damn, what's this? It's right here in my face, right?
- [99:47]
A
We go somewhere how you knew everybody.
- [99:50]
B
Like, damn, that's my boy. Like, it's right.
- [99:53]
A
How many boys you got?
- [99:54]
B
Right?
- [99:54]
A
I give you one.
- [99:56]
B
You can't get your phone, my friend. That's my friend.
- [99:58]
A
Yeah, it's gonna come out for sure.
- [100:00]
B
Every time. It never fails. I never had to look, right? I'mma just chill, you know, and then it's gonna. Oh, okay. That's what it is. I see it. I see it.
- [100:13]
A
You have daughters and, you know, they hear you. You know, my daughter like, daddy, you gotta say that. You gotta talk like that. Cause I got. You know, my daughter's in their 30s, and so they asking me questions, you know, I said, baby, I'm in the entertainment business, but can you find another way to entertain Daddy?
- [100:31]
B
Right?
- [100:32]
A
Like, damn.
- [100:34]
B
Right.
- [100:35]
A
How difficult is it to have that conversation with.
- [100:37]
B
Man, that's difficult, Shan, because, like, you know, I had to deal with the situation, you know, the ESPN situation where the live stream. The live stream, you know, I had to deal that was difficult situation because it was just like, damn. And you know, even doing this Truth After Dark, I say some things, you know, about, you know, relationships or black women and everything. And I'm like you on this. Like, you know, at this point, I'm entertainment. But then it be some hard conversations too that we gotta have. When you make the mistake, it's just like, man, you know, I'm human. But it don't change the fact that I'm still your dad, right? And I'm human. And I know you probably look at me like a superhero sometimes they do and all of that, but, you know, I make some mistakes.
- [101:24]
A
Yes.
- [101:25]
B
You know, I'm. I'm just like anybody else out here. I make some mistakes, you know, some of them I regret. And I say some things and, you know, they might not come off a certain way, but like, some of these things I believe, you know. And don't you want a dad that's truthful and stand on his words? And I know they not always sound like the best thing, but at the end of the day, when I'm long gone and everything, the one thing you can say about me is like, you know what? At the end of the day, dad, he was solid. He was solid. He spoke his mind and he didn't give a damn what people said about him. And I know sometimes it may be hurt or something like that, but hopefully some of the traits I give and my opinion and the things I do and say can carry over to make you a strong person. Because I block out the crowd noise, I block out the negative. And I hope that my kids can do the same thing, right? You ain't gonna always be the most popular person in the room. You ain't gonna always be liked. And that's what's gonna build your character and make you stronger, right? And that's what it's done for me.
- [102:34]
A
You still gamble like you used to? You don't gamble no more, huh?
- [102:37]
B
No, not that much. Like once every six months maybe, right? Like if I go to Vegas, hang out. But no, not like I used to.
- [102:48]
A
Because you try to fuel that competitiveness. Cause we competitive.
- [102:52]
B
Yeah, for sure.
- [102:53]
A
And that never leave. And that's why we miss the sport. What can we do to replace what we done for the last 20 years?
- [103:03]
B
It's hard. It's no replacement.
- [103:05]
A
None. Nothing can replace that bus ride, that plane ride, that locker room, that chemistry, that camaraderie. Ain't nothing.
- [103:12]
B
You just gotta find what makes you happy. You know, I've been trying to like for me, it's pouring into my kids.
- [103:19]
A
Yes.
- [103:20]
B
You know, the more time I do with that and just like, try to stay busy. Try to get. The key is when you retire is try to get routine.
- [103:28]
A
Yes.
- [103:29]
B
You know, Cause we are.
- [103:30]
A
We're so routine. Cause we know the structure. Okay. I got practice at this time, so I need to get my workout in at this time. I need to do this, I need to eat, I take my nap, get on the bus, go to the stadium. I will play the game. Everything is so structured.
- [103:42]
B
Structured routine.
- [103:43]
A
Now I got all this time on my damn hand. What the hell am I gonna do?
- [103:46]
B
You gotta get your. When you first retire, you be like, I got free time. I can just do whatever I want. I can travel here.
- [103:52]
A
That's the worst thing.
- [103:52]
B
That's the worst thing. So now since I've been back in routine, I've been good. I got, you know, I get up, I work out. It's the first thing I do. Take care of the mail, run my emails, kids, sports with them. Like, it's just I got a good routine going to do my podcast and this and that. So I got a good flow right now. So. But it's hard, you know, Right? It's hard.
- [104:16]
A
What's next for Paul Pierce?
- [104:18]
B
What's next for Paul Pierce? Man, you know, I'm getting older. My kids are. I got a couple kids in high school. I got a young one. I'm just trying to still go out here and build out my media career. You know, I've been doing that for. From day one, since I retired, I stepped into the media field, and I enjoy doing that.
- [104:38]
A
Right.
- [104:38]
B
You know what I'm saying? I enjoy talking sports. I enjoy talking life and relationships, and I'm just trying to build on it, you know, I'm trying to be a positive influence. I'm trying to have a respectable opinion. And, you know, I really love what you've been able to build, Shannon. A lot of us in this culture, we look up to, like, a lot of things that you've been able to build and admire and appreciate, you know? Cause we got a lot of things in common.
- [105:05]
A
Yep.
- [105:05]
B
And, you know, I think it's important for all of us to support each other.
- [105:09]
A
Yes.
- [105:11]
B
And that's it. Just try to be a positive influence, take care of my kids, and, you know, eventually ride into the sunset.
- [105:18]
A
The truth. Paul Pierce, ladies and gentlemen.
- [105:24]
B
Wow, that's good.
- [105:25]
A
All my life been grinding all my life Sacrifice, hustle, paid the price, wanna slice, got to roll the dice that's why all my life I be grinding all my life look all my life Been grinding all my life Sacrifice, hustle, paid the price, wanna slice, got the rolling dice that's why all my life I've been grinding all my life.