Rob Gronkowski (2:56)

This is Rob Gronkowski from Dudes on Dudes with Gronk and Jewels. For the second season in a row, I partnered with T Mobile's Friday night 5G lights powering up hometown football across America. This year, T mobile invested over $4 million in prizes to help schools take their Friday nights to the next level. Now it's time to crown our $1 million grand prize winner. A huge congrats to Derrick's High school in Derrick's Arkansas, home of the outlaws and your 2020 5T mobile Friday night 5G lights champion. They scored a home field upgrade, Gronk Fitness weight room, a 2026 tailgate party and an all expense paid trip to the SEC championship game. To every school that competed, posted and rallied your communities. Thank you And a big thanks to T Mobile for making it all possible and helping communities shine under the Friday night lights. This season may be over, but the story isn't. Stay tuned for season three in 2026.

Wale (4:07)

But I think the way that people saw it is like, yo, 20 year old, like you feel me? Like that's what they acting like I did and I'm like, yo, couldn't you.

Shannon Sharpe (4:20)

Have given a little grace the man 20.

Wale (4:21)

That's the thing. Now you got me all my life been grinding all my life Sacrifice, hustle, paid the price, wanna slice got to roll the dice that's why all my life I've been grinding all my life look all my life been grinding all my life Sacrifice, hustle, pay the price.

IBM AI Advertiser (4:42)

Wanna slice got to roll a dice.

Wale (4:44)

That'S why all my life I've been grinding all my life.

Shannon Sharpe (4:50)

Hello. Welcome to another episode of Club Shay Shay. I am your host, Shannon Sharp. I'm also the proprietor of Club Shay Shay. Stopping by for conversation on the drink today. King of hip hop and R and B fusion. A poetic writer and international artist. Grammy nominated and diamond selling rapper. He's the first rapper to open the State of the Union. A cultural influence and a tastemaker. A fashion icon, a D.C. legend. He has his own day in Maryland. Here he is, Wale. Ah, what's up, bro? It's been a minute. It's been about what, two years? I think we were both on a flight back from Vegas to la.

Wale (5:24)

Yup.

Shannon Sharpe (5:25)

And I think you was running to catch another flight.

Wale (5:27)

I was running somewhere. And you had your dog.

Shannon Sharpe (5:30)

Yeah.

Wale (5:30)

I was like, we both. It's one of them black men in the industry thing. Like I see you play, I see you play. And we just running. We got to the bag. Yeah.

Shannon Sharpe (5:37)

Hey, man, you know what? New album's out. I don't know if you, you know, this is my cognac shaped by Le Portier. Ok. A VSOP cognac. You know, a vsop. Very special. Old, pale, aged between four and six years. Some of these bottles have been aged for up to eight years. So that's what makes it special. Has to originate in that region. Your album, everything is a lot.

Wale (5:57)

Let me know when you need some product placement in the video. We can figure that out.

Shannon Sharpe (6:00)

Okay, we can do that. We can do that.

Wale (6:02)

DC Is the brunch capital of the world, baby. The black brunch capital of the world.

Shannon Sharpe (6:06)

Y' all done took that from Atlanta, Houston.

Wale (6:07)

Nah, I mean, we kind of. We originated that.

Shannon Sharpe (6:11)

Y' all originated.

Wale (6:12)

That might be a little. Let me retract. But we just got our own thing, you know? You know.

Shannon Sharpe (6:17)

So what's so for brunch? What's a dc? What do y' all got? Crab cakes.

Wale (6:21)

And it's everything. It's not really the brunch.

Shannon Sharpe (6:27)

Oh, just.

Wale (6:28)

It's the ambiance.

Sophie Cunningham (6:29)

Yeah.

Shannon Sharpe (6:29)

It's the mingling, the talking, the getting together.

Wale (6:31)

Yeah. It's like always, like. It's like a party from two o' clock somewhere. Then there's one at five, then there's one at nine, and then they go like, we party city, for real. But Atlanta got. Atlanta different, though. Cause I saw a brunch party at a Nobu, and I was like, all right, y' all got it.

Shannon Sharpe (6:45)

Yeah. Yeah.

Wale (6:45)

You know what I'm saying? Y' all win the brunch wars, for real.

Shannon Sharpe (6:48)

So let's talk about the album. The fans have been showing a lot of love for the album online. They said this timeline is healing. It's rap music. It's back right. When you hear that. Because I'm sure you've heard. You know, you have your feet in the street and you hear. You have your ear to the pavement and you know what's going on. But when you hear fans say, okay, he's bringing it back, he's brought it back. How does that make you feel?

Wale (7:10)

I mean, they say that every time I ever drop, I think it's. Cause I probably ain't dropping, like, a little while. Like a whole project.

Shannon Sharpe (7:15)

Right.

Wale (7:16)

They say that all the time. But like we was talking about earlier, the game is like. It's just moving at such a fast pace now, like. And a lot of things has changed. So it might bring people feelings back. Like, to hear me since they haven't heard it in a long time, but ain't nothing really changed. I think they probably just got exhausted from hearing the same stuff.

Shannon Sharpe (7:35)

So you said you've been away. It's been about three or four years since you last dropped something. Like, when you away that length of time, do you feel like, damn, has it passed me by? Do I still have what it takes? Do you ever second guess yourself? Questions?

Wale (7:48)

Not my Talent, not my talent. One of the worst things about music business is like, it's subjective, okay? Like, you know, I grew up playing sports like running, track, basketball, all of that. Like in football, like, you know, if I got 40 yards, if I got 40 points or 150 yards, that's that. I don't care who like it. Right?

Shannon Sharpe (8:07)

Any aborted.

Wale (8:07)

Yeah, I could write the best, the most perfect song that makes the most sense and the catchiest hook. Somebody could not even hear it because they just don't want it. You know? You know what I'm saying? So it's one of those things that like, I cannot. I don't. I know the talent is there, but the, the landscape is completely different.

Shannon Sharpe (8:25)

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Wale (9:49)

I let it go. I just let it go. Especially when I'm starting. I'm kind of. It's chaotic at the beginning and it's chaotic in the end. I just let it Go sometimes, you know, I went to Nashville a little bit. I went to London for a while. I went to Monaco. I went a lot of places just to go and just. Just let it go, like, you know, get some little tree. Maybe we can get some of the cognac next time, you know, and just get the. Get the vibe going and just see where it's at and just start writing. I got so many. It's, like, scattered all over the place until it starts coming together.

Shannon Sharpe (10:22)

So you get an idea, you get a vision anywhere. So let's just say you in Monaco. Something comes together, you start writing.

Wale (10:32)

Yeah.

Shannon Sharpe (10:32)

You mentioned you was in London or you were here. Something. You start writing, and then all this comes together, and then you says, okay, I think I got something.

Wale (10:41)

Right. I mean, I think it's just. It's such a weird, like, they call it, like, a Rain man thing. I be doing, like. Cause sometimes. Cause I get so upset with myself sometimes. If I've been like. Let's say I've been in the studio for six hours, and I haven't picked a beat, and I know I'm about to leave, like, the session about to be over. I just be like, yo, whoever's in the studio, pick any beat. I'm gonna go take a walk, come back. Whatever beat it is, I'm gonna write to it. A lot of songs have come like that. Like, it's just really just, like. Because I just want. I need to write something. You know what I'm saying?

Shannon Sharpe (11:15)

So you need to be under the gun. You need to. Your back. Seem to be your back against the wall sometimes.

Wale (11:19)

Sometimes. Yep. Yep. I remember one time I was talking to. I was talking to J. Cole. This was my last album, and I felt like writing. I just didn't know what to write about. And we was just talking. I was like. Before we got the phone, I was like, give me a word. Any word. I don't care. And he was like, semi automatic. And I was like, all right, cool. And then I just started writing Semi automatic, and I just used it as a metaphor for my brain. And then I made it a song, and it went on the album. It's just like. Sometimes you feel like I didn't have no inspiration, but I felt like writing. And then when somebody gave me something, I built around it. You know what I'm saying?

Shannon Sharpe (11:54)

Have you ever been in a situation where you're not in the mood? Like, it's like, okay, I ain't got anything coming out, but something just hits you, and you write for a Later, date and time.

Wale (12:02)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, a lot on this album. Like, things in life was happening. And maybe not the very same day, but like, I was pulling from situations a lot on this one. Like, that's why I kind of took a lot out of me emotionally to make this joint. Cause I took a lot of stuff out of my life. Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, real trauma, real stuff.

Shannon Sharpe (12:25)

Is it easier to write like that from a personal experience level?

Wale (12:31)

Sometimes it is, sometimes it's not. Sometimes you gotta push yourself to places you don't wanna go to talk about stuff you don't really feel comfortable talking about. So that's kind of tricky sometimes. And then it's like you kind of. Sometimes you think about how I might make other people feel, you know, if you're not wording things in the right way or you just trying to tell your story, whatever. So it's tricky, you know what I'm saying?

Shannon Sharpe (12:52)

That's happened.

Wale (12:56)

Nah, nah, to be honest, it hasn't happened. Because, I mean, most people that I have a fondness for, even if, like, women, as far as women, like, if I have a fondness for them or if I ever had a fondness for them, I really won't have nothing negative to say about them, even because they not artists, they don't have a platform. They can't, you know. And plus, I'm not that type of person, you know what I'm saying? Like, if it's done, it's done. Like, I don't really got nothing to say negative about nobody.

Shannon Sharpe (13:22)

When you see that your music has surpassed Taylor Swift on the Apple charts, you're number two behind Summer Walker. Cause, like, obviously you said it, like, If I score 40 points, that's 40, no matter what. I got 40 points. And people understand 40 points in a basketball game is 40 points. I get 100 points, two touchdowns in a game. People know that. One hundred and fifty two tuddies. We know what that is. But when you see people actually accept it and it zooms up the chart and we know who Taylor Swift is, and we know who some of those other people that were there and you surpass them, how does that make you feel at that? You're like, okay, I did it right.

Wale (13:58)

Let's frame him. You know what I'm saying? Taylor Swift doing stadiums and her album been out for a long time. But I mean, that's just how you frame it. Whatever. But I don't really. I mean, not to say I don't look at the numbers because They I try to quantify stuff cause of how I grew up playing sports. But like I don't really get into it too much, you know what I'm saying? Like. Cause I ain't have a great first week album sales on this album, but it's one of my most highly praised projects I've ever done in my 15 year career. So you know, I try to like focus on that even though, I mean it is good to see that people is receiving it. But you know, the numbers thing is tricky now anyways. Cause a lot of numbers is fake. A lot of things is bodied. A lot of things is being like, you know, narrative. But you can't fake the word of mouth though, so.

Shannon Sharpe (14:44)

Correct. You don't get too tied up into the numbers because you don't want to get too high or too low.

Wale (14:50)

Well, I mean I can't really do nothing about them. Like, you know, I can't. Like it's the streaming era. Like a lot of these young, like my fans, like a lot of them be having full time jobs and kids and a busy life. They can't listen to my album 15 times in a day.

Shannon Sharpe (15:07)

Right.

Wale (15:07)

You know, some of these other people got fans that they can, they gotta go to school, they gotta da da. They studying. Like they have a lot of time to hear their music and it's like different, you know what I'm saying? The numbers is like kind of like when it was when we was back before streaming. I used to be. I'm very blue collar. I'd be in Detroit, I'd be in Chicago, I'd be in D.C. signing joints block me, you know what I'm saying? I was knocking out 150, 160, first week around that time. And with the streaming, it kind of chopped in half. But the fans ain't never go nowhere. They set up the shows. But streaming is not a really good indicator of like, is that the biggest.

Shannon Sharpe (15:40)

Difference that you've seen? Because like you said you used to go to Detroit or you go to Chicago, you go to these places and you pop up to the store and you know the hard copies, they're leaving.

Wale (15:49)

Yeah.

Shannon Sharpe (15:50)

Now not so many people are not really purchasing.

Wale (15:52)

1500 plays equals one sale, you feel me? 1500. I said it right, Cass. It's like 1500 streams is one record sale.

Shannon Sharpe (16:03)

That don't seem right.

Wale (16:05)

I mean, you know, the game is the game.

Shannon Sharpe (16:06)

But who decided that 1500 equals one album sale? Who decided that?

Wale (16:12)

I don't know man, but it's been like this for a minute. It's been like this for what? Like what? Since probably like album or nothing. Was that like 2016? Probably around 2014? Something like that, yeah. So that's just for Apple or Spotify? One of them. But yeah. 1500. Like, I can't even remember my favorite album. Thriller, Whatever. Like, I ain't. The first week that joint came out. I ain't spending 1500 times or whatever. I never. I spent Reasonable Doubt that many times. You know what I'm saying? But I don't know, it's just a tricky game now. So I put my faith in my fans, in that tour. For real.

Shannon Sharpe (16:45)

Here's a question. If you walked into a stash house and you found it full of $20 million, how much would you steal? That's the question Matt Damon and Ben Affleck have to answer. In the Netflix new movie the Rip, they play a team of Miami cops alongside Teyana Taylor, Steven Yoon, Catalina Sandino Moreno, Sasha Kaje, and Kyle Chandler, all trying to decide, are they the good guys or the bad guys? This movie is an edge of your seat thrill ride the entire time, keeping you guessing till the very end. Don't miss the Rip, only on Netflix on January 16th. Well, will hard copy album sales ever be what it once was? Or have screaming taken the platform and ruined it?

Wale (17:25)

That's over with. But vinyls is making a little. Vinyls is kind of like, gives it a little bit of that.

Shannon Sharpe (17:33)

Like, there's still a little mom and pop store here and there that sell the vinyls and stuff. Like the incense, candles. Kind of how we grew up, Wally, you know, we used to go and you could listen to. Hey, you listen to it. Have the headset on. You listen to it. You ask them to cut you at a time.

Wale (17:48)

And you would appreciate music differently. Back then. You appreciate it differently. Cause it wasn't so easily accessible. Like, you had to be like, man, I gotta go get my book back and get my cd.

Shannon Sharpe (17:58)

Right.

Wale (17:58)

You know what I'm saying? You get your cd. It's just that you get that peace of mind. You just listen to the song you had in your head.

Shannon Sharpe (18:03)

Yeah.

Wale (18:03)

Now you can just be like, man, let me put my phone on and hear this joint. Get my quick dopamine hit. If music is a little cheaper now, that's why I always ask people, do you think, how would Michael Jackson do if he was in his prime right now? I don't even know if it's possible.

Shannon Sharpe (18:16)

Nah.

Wale (18:16)

Cause it's too much access. It's too much. You know what I'm Saying the access.

Shannon Sharpe (18:21)

Has diluted a lot of things.

Wale (18:23)

The music, the star power, the Hollywood movie stars, all of it.

Shannon Sharpe (18:27)

Yeah. I don't know if in today's time we'll ever see somebody as big as Mike.

Wale (18:32)

Nah, nah. People passing out.

Shannon Sharpe (18:37)

Just the thought. I mean, crying and breaking down. Literally crying. Yeah, yeah, we're not seeing it.

Wale (18:43)

One thing I'm excited about is to see the Gen Z and even Gen Alpha, like if this movie's handled right. Like to see them getting to experience Mike for the first time and seeing what he really was. Cause like, bruh, if all that Michael Jackson footage wasn't documented on camera, you wouldn't believe it.

Shannon Sharpe (19:00)

They wouldn't believe it.

Wale (19:01)

You wouldn't believe that a man could come on stage at the super bowl and just sit still for two minutes, not even move and every people be passing like. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, that's crazy.

Shannon Sharpe (19:09)

Or to have him come up to it, you know, he's in a hotel and there are thousands and thousands of people.

Coca-Cola Announcer (19:13)

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Rob Gronkowski (19:16)

All.

Coca-Cola Announcer (19:16)

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Shannon Sharpe (19:30)

Coca Cola.

Coca-Cola Announcer (19:32)

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Shannon Sharpe (19:57)

So grab a Coca Cola and keep.

Coca-Cola Announcer (19:58)

That HBCU pride going.

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Shannon Sharpe (24:11)

Wanting him to wave on the balcony?

Wale (24:13)

Yes. And also starting at age five. Bro.

Shannon Sharpe (24:16)

Yeah.

Wale (24:17)

You feel me? Like, your whole life, you gave it to this business, you know what I'm saying? So, I mean, I'm excited to see how they react because I was watching them on YouTube the other day, and it was like a young Gen Z kid. He was like, Michael Jackson, the ultimate. Ora farmer. And I was like, oh, this is my type of crossover episode. Yeah, I like to see. I wanna see. I want them to see how crazy Mike was.

Shannon Sharpe (24:38)

But when you hear people say, well, this person is as big as Mike, and this person, it's not.

Wale (24:46)

No musician. You know what I'm saying? No, there's blasphemous things that can be.

Shannon Sharpe (24:52)

Maybe, but maybe only Jesus was bigger than Michael Jackson.

Wale (24:55)

But then you tap. You moonwalking around. Blasphemy right there. So you can't really say that. But after that, it's like, yo, who more the mic, the other Mike, maybe, But, nah, it's still different.

Shannon Sharpe (25:06)

But when Halloween, when you get the costume, when you get the red jacket or you get the glove, people still. They still doing plays.

Wale (25:12)

This nigga still up on Hollywood Boulevard. Just like Michael.

Shannon Sharpe (25:15)

Exactly.

Wale (25:15)

But I'm saying, he got. Mike got his impersonators, too.

Shannon Sharpe (25:18)

Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

Wale (25:19)

But, yeah, but Michael Jackson, different. He's like the closest thing to Superhuman that you can see. It's a whole thing. If I win five more Grammys, I'll take off my glasses. Thank you.

Pets Best Insurance Announcer (25:34)

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Wale (25:35)

You ain't gonna see that nowhere else.

Shannon Sharpe (25:38)

You being from the dmv, Kevin Durant had very high praise for you. But there have been a lot of. I mean, Chappelle from the dmz, Quaid, Taraji Martin. I think Wanda Sykes is from the dmv, too, also.

Wale (25:52)

Is she.

Shannon Sharpe (25:53)

She a little bit farther than us.

Wale (25:54)

She's funny like us. She Jones like she from Ronda Way. Stephan Diggs.

Shannon Sharpe (25:58)

Yeah.

Wale (25:58)

You know what I'm saying? We got a couple people. Caleb Williams Yeah, yeah, we pretty. We a small little community, but. And we jaded.

Shannon Sharpe (26:07)

But KD said you inspiring. What's your relationship like with kd, man?

Wale (26:11)

Like, if you grew up around, like, where we from, like Isaiah Swann, Big Moons, Eddie Badden, Delonte west, like Ty Lawson, you know, James White, like kd, man, it's just like we got. It's a community, you know what I'm saying? And I was always around that community, but like, they kind of kicked me out of the community when we started getting taller. And I just. They were like, yeah, it's enough aau. Just stay with track. Just stay with track. But, you know, you know, I grew up around all of that. Like, you know, I remember James White when he was. He was one of the biggest recruits in the nation. And I remember it might have been Roy Williams at that time. I think he had already signed with Cincinnati. But we like, in the hood, we was at 1:24. Like everybody outside the head coach, we see him on ESPN all the time. He come out to see James, you know what I'm saying? So, like, it's just like there's so many of these little stories and all these little moments in this community that we had in the Hoopers community. And KD come from that, you know what I'm saying? And we both kind of started getting famous at the same time. And man, like, we just been cool for a long time. Like his family know my family, you know, we got a lot of the same mutual friends, you know what I'm saying? Like I said to James White and all of that, like, we just all proud of him and they proud of me, you know what I'm saying? I used to record music at his old crib in Oklahoma. You know, I meant. Shoot, man. I had one of the most legendary parties when all the OKC team came over for me and KD's birthday in D.C. we just been locked in. I was at a couple of his rookie year games. You know, my man Craig used to play with him in Texas. It's just like all love over there. His mom always, always showed me love when she see me support me.

Shannon Sharpe (27:59)

When you guys was growing up, did you know, I wonder if I had an opportunity, I would ask him and I. But I have you, so I'm gonna ask you. When you guys were growing up, obviously he was probably a little taller than. Not much bigger than what he is right now, but a little. But he was always tall. Did you know Kevin Durant was gonna be kd?

Wale (28:16)

Well, when I met I mean, I knew of him. Everybody knew of him. Macho's Christian. I wonder if. Can I say the N word? They gonna meet me out.

Shannon Sharpe (28:24)

No, he good.

Wale (28:25)

I'm overthinking, but nah, man. I don't think niggas was going to class, but they just. But DC got. Man, DMV got so many of them schools. But yeah, I didn't know. I didn't really know him personally till maybe midway through his freshman year of Texas.

Shannon Sharpe (28:41)

Okay.

Wale (28:42)

But we'd known about each other for a while.

Shannon Sharpe (28:45)

So you like. Okay. But it always feels good because you got someone from your community and he went just bent and became successful.

Wale (28:54)

Yeah, you did.

Shannon Sharpe (28:56)

Your from that same community went successful. So many people from that community. I mean, like you said, you didn't really know a whole lot about him.

Wale (29:02)

It's hard to get out that, though.

Shannon Sharpe (29:04)

Really?

Wale (29:05)

Really. Like, I mean, hooping, sports is different. Music is definitely, like. You know what I'm saying? Like, it's Go Go music and like everything else, but there's not that many musicians from the joint. But I think we gotta. We like a staple for hoops now, though. But KD's a big reason for that, right?

Shannon Sharpe (29:22)

But, yeah, and that's interesting that. Go Go. And I remember when I was in college and we had some guys from.

Wale (29:27)

D.C. i know you. I know Savannah State, right? Yeah. And I know you had the D.C. then they probably at the parties playing the jump, like, what the hell is this shit?

Shannon Sharpe (29:34)

That the first time Sardine and Po Camp. I'm like, babe, what is this?

Wale (29:40)

They weren't playing doing the butt at the party like that. But they was turning up, though.

Shannon Sharpe (29:44)

They were turning up.

Wale (29:45)

I know that made sense.

Shannon Sharpe (29:46)

Yeah. But I was like, what? What? I didn't know what it was. And then everybody. I mean, when they started playing it and everybody started, like, vibing to it.

Wale (29:54)

Yeah.

Shannon Sharpe (29:55)

So obviously, house House and Go Go was huge. What made you decide, like, yeah, but I ain't going that way.

Wale (30:03)

I mean, that's what's so unique about me is, like, I played in Go Go bands when I was growing up. Something was real small, real nothing. And then when I. Like, I was always getting better at rap. And then, like, before I blew up, I started, like, some of the bigger bands in the city was letting me come and rap with them. So I was, like, getting my fan base up, learning my stage presence and all of that. Like, why. But that was always. The rap was always gonna be my way. Like, once I stopped playing football, it was straight music, you know? What I'm saying, straight music. Like that realization in college when I was like, okay, I ain't going to the NFL. Yeah. Cause I'm. I played at Robert Morris for Joe Walton. He coached the Jets. God bless his soul, man. Yeah. And I played Robert Morris.

Shannon Sharpe (30:51)

That's in Pennsylvania.

Wale (30:52)

Yeah. Yeah, I went there. And I went there. Cause, like, one of my senior year, I was like 150, you know what I'm saying? I was real small.

Shannon Sharpe (31:00)

What position you played?

Wale (31:01)

Running back.

Shannon Sharpe (31:02)

You toting the rock like that at 50.

Wale (31:04)

But what happened was they was like, okay, we got a couple schools trying to see. But like, they all want you to play receiver. So I moved to receiver my senior year.

Shannon Sharpe (31:12)

Okay.

Wale (31:13)

And I mean, I was getting busy at receiver. Like, they put some little jet screens and all for me or whatever. Cause I couldn't really run. I didn't. I wasn't a receiver, right? But cool. I got all my offers and it was all for high jump and to play receiver. So I signed with Robert Morris. First day of camp, it was like. It was all the freshmen, you know what I'm saying? Got all the New York dudes here, you got the DC dudes there, you got the Florida dudes there. And we. I'm sizing everybody up. Like, I'm like. I'm kind of small. Cool. I go with the receivers. There's some small. There's some small motherfuckers that. Receivers, right, brother. When I seen all these from Florida running routes, I immediately was like, yo, I'll go back to running back. I was like, I can't. They was doing. I ain't know what the route tree was like that or nothing. Like, they was running routes for real. So I was like, man, I'll go back to running back. So I had to work my way back up there and I couldn't get cleared to play. So I tried transferring to Virginia State. Got there. And I mean, I got my confidence back. But I just. Me and that coach, man, we.

Shannon Sharpe (32:13)

Y' all butted heads, huh?

Wale (32:15)

Man, he was like. Like, to go from, like, Coach Walton, who, like, coached the jets coach, NFL. He don't be mad. He don't be mad when you fumble or drop the ball. He's execution based, right? So, like. You know what I'm saying? Like, you run, do your play, do it full speed. He ain't tripping. If you try. Coach Fazin at Virginia State, if you like anything. If he. He might not like the way you toss the ball back to the. He gonna make it, like. And I Just couldn't get. I couldn't get through that. And I was killing. I was doing my thing over there, right? But he made it a. He made it his duty to be like, oh, I'm gonna show this motherfucker. And sent me home during summer camp. And then I tried to get into a school in the same division and.

Shannon Sharpe (32:56)

It wouldn't clear you.

Wale (32:56)

Wouldn't clear me. That was it. I said, God's got he. You know, you know better.

Shannon Sharpe (33:01)

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Wale (34:32)

Gonna be my job. I would be, like, entertaining my teammates.

Shannon Sharpe (34:35)

Okay?

Wale (34:36)

You know what I'm saying? But I think for real, one of them, one of the real moments, I knew that maybe this could really go somewhere. The first time I went to Carol City, one of my teammates from Robert Moore, I went to his people for the holidays. And I remember he was just beating on the back of the bus, and I just started freestyling, and all these people started gathering around me, and I never experienced nothing like that no more. And then I remember he just was like, bro, you should just do this for real, for real, for real. And never took it serious until NCAA was like, no, thank you. And I just went hard with it.

Shannon Sharpe (35:14)

So that was your. Like, hey, I mean, at that point in time, I kind of. I guess they kind of forced you to take it seriously because.

Wale (35:19)

And I was doing. I mean, it was. I was like. I would go to. I would be at school, or I'd take the bus to work, and I'd be writing raps. And then I go to the studio and some of these freestyles, they was playing over the radio. And then I had done, like, 20 freestyles and did the mixtape. And then people were like, oh, can he make a song? Then I started making songs on the radio, and it just. I was. I was literally working at the local shoe store and Sprint with, like, two songs on radio rotation. So I knew it was time I could, like, I could probably drop out. You know what I'm saying? And I got offers to tour with Mark Ronson. So, you know, and I had meetings with Jay Z and all these labels, so I had to tell him up.

Shannon Sharpe (35:57)

Like, what did she say when. She said when you told your mom.

Wale (36:02)

It was too late. It was too late. I'd already. I probably hadn't been to class in, like, a semester and a half, but.

Shannon Sharpe (36:10)

She know you hadn't been to class.

Wale (36:11)

I bought my father. I bought my father a truck. And he said, let that boy.

Shannon Sharpe (36:16)

That boy don't need to go to class.

Wale (36:17)

Nigerian parents. That's how my mother's generation. Nigerian parents, they not gonna. If the money is right and you're not in trouble with the law, you don't worry about it. You good. You know what I'm saying? So I bought my father a truck. He ended up taking it to Nigeria. A lot of Nigerian parents do that. But, yeah, once that came through, she knew it was good. And then I was. Next thing you know, I was on doing, like, Glastonbury with Mark Ronson, 70,000 people. And then had a bidding war when I came back from London.

Shannon Sharpe (36:46)

Wow, you spent some time in the atl, right?

Wale (36:48)

Yeah.

Shannon Sharpe (36:48)

You go to atl. So was that immediately after you, like, started doing Your thing. Like, okay, I can do this. I'm doing this. I got noticed. How soon was it that you DC.

Wale (36:58)

That you trans to Atlanta? Yeah, I think I had got dropped from Interscope. I feel like that's every artist's story. Arc, villain arc. Like, Interscope dropped me and then I blew up. Boom. I got dropped from Interscope. And I just would. I would be in the South a lot. I'd be in Atlanta a lot because they just embraced me, right? Like yo Gotti and Gucci Mane, like, they really embraced me and TI So I remember. Cause I put Gucci Mane on my album on Interscope on the Go Go song. But he had been locked up, like, for a long time. So, you know, I was just running around with everybody. My man twin was like, bringing me around everybody from, like, the strippers to the everybody. So I'm like, I'm soaking up all this culture. Meanwhile, I just got dropped. But, like, you know, we get no hands done and all of that. And, like, when Gucci came home, he made sure that I was at his welcome home party.

Shannon Sharpe (37:55)

Okay?

Wale (37:56)

And like, that was a long. That was like the longest day of my life. But that was the night I did no hands. And then, like, so I have this cult following. I just got dropped out of this cult following, this backpack hip hop following. And then I got this super huge record coming out of Atlanta at the same time. So, like, everything really, really hit right there. Like, right? Cause I had already. I was already done with the whole, like, Mark Ronson thing. Interscope was done with me, did that. And I just turned up in Atlanta.

Shannon Sharpe (38:25)

Is that where you met Thug at? You met Thug then?

Wale (38:27)

Yeah, yup, yup. I met Thug a long time ago. I tried to bring. I tried to take Thug and God rest his soul, Rich Homie Quan, I tried to get them on Roc Nation. I just had a meeting up with Jay, and I think Quan and his pops went, whatever. But yeah, I know Thug for a long time. And, like, he a good nigga. That's my man, for real. I seen how far he came. Like, he not one of them people like that. I just, like. I just remember, like, he would meet me at the radio station out there, and I just was seeing how he was moving. And I always look at him now and I be like, bruh, y' all have no idea how far this kid has come. Like, you know what I'm saying? He was really outside.

Shannon Sharpe (39:13)

Yeah, he was outside, actually.

Wale (39:14)

That's what the shenanigans, you know what I'm saying?

Shannon Sharpe (39:17)

Let's talk about this new album of yours. You sampled a lot of classics on it. SWV is I'm so into you. Keith Sweat, get up on you, Michael Jackson, the way you make me feel. Soul to soul, back to life, Raphael, Sadiq. How hard was it to get some of those sample cleared, man?

Wale (39:35)

Luckily, my people know that I'm like a spaceman when I'm recording. And they don't even. They, like. I could feel the tension that was going around with the sample clearances, right? I kept myself ignorant in order to finish the project. But knowing what I know, I don't think it was the easiest thing in the world. I know Keith Sweat was like, hey, hey, hey. You know what I'm saying? It took a little bit with that. But when you love the music, man, you gotta do what you gotta do, you know?

Shannon Sharpe (40:05)

I talked to people, talked to ll. I've talked to people that had their music sample. And L says, look, you sample mine. I got to hear it first. Obviously, Michael can't hear it. He's no longer. He's deceased, obviously. But did they want to hear what you. Wait.

Wale (40:18)

Mike wasn't on this one. Mike was on Sean, I believe. Right? He ain't sampled Mike on this. I think it was his melody.

Shannon Sharpe (40:23)

Melody from Michael.

Wale (40:24)

Which one? What song is it on? That's the new one to clear the samples. I might have been Sean, but I do know, like, I'm a big Mike. I'm Brow. Can't say nothing about Mike around me. I moonwalk on stage every night. Like, you could play Moonwalker, that movie. I could say every. I could do the whole thing.

Shannon Sharpe (40:45)

The whole cadence, the whole sequence in which you.

Wale (40:47)

Yeah, yeah. So, you know, I mean, that meant a lot to me when I did sample. I went to go see Katherine. I went to go see. Wow. I went to go see the. I went to the house, you know, I'm looking in the room. I'm looking for Ben, where Ben used to be hanging at and all that. I'm soaking in. I saw Reby, you feel me? Like, I'm really. You know what I'm saying? I'm sampling Mike again. I just want y' all to know. And again, I might just do the whole Michael Jackson mixtape if they let me. I don't need the money. I just wanna do it for Mike.

Shannon Sharpe (41:17)

Right? Do. Like, when you sample a song, I mean, obviously, do they want to hear.

Wale (41:25)

I don't. I don't even. Did that happen at all on this jump? Did anybody want to hear? Yes, one person. Who sitting on fire? The one we didn't get. We didn't. Wow. Oh, yeah. Okay. Good one, man. Bro, you. I don't know if you've ever been in a position where you felt, like, bothersome, like, like, like, like make finishing the album. Everybody's like, bro, this is deadline.

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Wale (41:54)

All.

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Wale (42:14)

Mmm.

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Wale (46:49)

You calling me at 3 in the morning, you high in the studio, you trying to make like it. So I just, I had to call to change this, change that, change this and we got a record called Cities on Fire with odile shout out my man Odile. And I had cut it in London and I just was. I was running. I do a lot of my playbacks when I'm like, running. And I just was like, yo, I think we gotta change the beat. And like, everybody on my team was like. Cause to do that, it's a lot. You know what I'm saying? Cause it was a sample, and it was like a Bollywood sample or something like that. And they like, their reply was so crazy. I was like, y' all don't. Y' all don't respect this genre, this what's going on, so whatever. So I like. I like, worked night and day, like, for like a month to change the beat. And it really took a lot. Cause you gotta call this person, call that person. This one's in London. This one's in Paris. This one's in. So, you know, artists out there, be careful what you sample, please.

Shannon Sharpe (47:54)

Do you let artists sample your music?

Wale (47:57)

We've got. I think probably like two or three have done it, like, above the board maybe. I would probably want to hear it, though. For real. I ain't trying. Don't butcher my stuff. You know what I'm saying?

Shannon Sharpe (48:09)

That's what Bobby Brown said. Bobby Brown said the exact same. A lot of people, LL said, I got to hear it. Bobby says I need to hear it.

Wale (48:16)

I wonder if Mike had to hear, hey, lover, this is more than a curse. Cause he's simple lady in my life. Ask LL I want to know if Mike, you want police advice? I'm sampling LL Cool J now.

Shannon Sharpe (48:28)

You gonna sample it?

Wale (48:29)

Nah, I'm fucking with you. I don't want no smoke.

Shannon Sharpe (48:31)

LL Song breakdown conundrum.

Wale (48:33)

Mm.

Shannon Sharpe (48:34)

You said my baby mother told her new husband she had to move on?

Wale (48:37)

Uh huh. Yeah.

Shannon Sharpe (48:40)

Was it hard to see your baby mom get married?

Wale (48:44)

Uh, it's one of the most polarizing, like, things. It's like, I mean, like, you could have let. She's a great, like, great mother. And like, she's like a very, very strong black woman. And it's like life be happening and you just. Y' all grow apart, you know what I'm saying? And just, you know, like, you don't want to see nobody hurt, you know what I'm saying? Like, you don't want to see nobody. Like, you don't want to see nobody like that. And then you don't want to be the reason for it.

Shannon Sharpe (49:19)

Right?

Wale (49:19)

You know what I'm saying? And it's like we fighting and fighting and fighting it like, you know, and I'M out here chasing this dream, this thankless drive and this dream, and it's like, right? And it's taking its toll on me. It's taking its toll on us. And it's like, you just gotta let it go, like. And I couldn't stop. I couldn't. To stop it at that point, for me would be selfish.

Shannon Sharpe (49:41)

Yeah, for sure. A thousand percent.

Wale (49:44)

You know, live, like. See what I'm saying? Let our daughter be around, like, a conventional kind of. You know what I'm saying?

Shannon Sharpe (49:51)

Yes. Traditional family.

Wale (49:53)

I just like the pride and ego. It kind of is jarring, but, like, I'm blessed because her husband is like. He's like, I just feel like, man, this is a big step, like, for me as a person. Like, the relationship that we've obtained, like, we talk. Me and her husband, we talk. Okay, that's great. I can't. Me and her can't even really talk, but me and him talk about, like, okay, like, how's she doing? The school? Da, da, da. Like, when she coming? Like, he's just. He get it. Like, he get it. But I call him. I be like, man, what's good? He's like, man, like, yeah, okay. How you think about how you. How you doing? Cause I know the album just came out, like, da, da, da. And that's just the type of person that. I'm grateful that she found somebody like that, and I'm grateful that my daughter could have somebody like that around, that I don't have to worry about what type of environment she's in or whatever. So that's a silver lining in it all. Like, I know I'm not. Bruh. Chasing this stuff is not like, you know what it is. You going, everybody knows. Everybody not gonna understand it. And it's like, it's hard. Like, you gotta. You gotta. Some people ain't gonna be the same. Like, your circle gonna change and people not gonna understand it. But when you're trying to make these things happen and you are the glue to your family, you gotta do what you gotta do.

Shannon Sharpe (51:14)

Do you think it's because the wounds is still so fresh? Is it still so hard? I'm sure she felt a certain type of way about you, and now it didn't happen probably the way she envisioned. She probably envisioned a traditional family. Her, you, your child, together happily ever after. That didn't happen. So you think the wounds. Because it's still so fresh. That's the reason why I said, I think it's fresh.

Wale (51:37)

No, it ain't fresh because of the Separate, like the. We've been done for a long time.

Shannon Sharpe (51:45)

Okay.

Wale (51:45)

You know what I'm saying? And, like, I can't. We disagree on a lot of things, but it's like, we don't disagree on, like. I just know that, like, she deserve something that I can't give, like, you know what I'm saying? Like. And she can't be wasting her years on, like, waiting for you to figure it out. Yeah. And there's somebody that's right there, that's present, that's like a good person. Like, it's like, that wouldn't even be right, you know what I'm saying? And I still be trying to figure myself out too, you know what I'm saying, In that world. Cause there was a time that I wasn't try and date nobody publicly because I didn't want. I didn't want to hurt her, you know what I'm saying? Even though I knew I wasn't going to be. We weren't going to be together, I just didn't want to, like, pour salt on the wound, whatever, you know what I'm saying? So it's like. So like I said, it's just a bittersweet thing, like. Cause she deserves that happy life. She deserves those things that every woman wants, you know what I'm saying? Or most women want.

Shannon Sharpe (52:41)

Did you have to meet. Did you meet your child's mom? I mean, her husband, future husband? Did you meet the boy? Did you have. Did you have to. Was it a prerequisite?

Wale (52:54)

Man, I went through every single. Cause it was just. The way I found out was like, just.

Shannon Sharpe (53:00)

Oh, she didn't tell you?

Wale (53:02)

Nah, but I mean, damn, you know.

Shannon Sharpe (53:05)

I mean, well, maybe she didn't want to hurt you. You say you didn't want to hurt us by this?

Wale (53:08)

I don't know. I don't know. But it's life, though. But when I, like, it just. It went through phases. Like, I think once I got to. Cause I never really got mad. Cause it's not like. It's not like we were emotionally tied in with each other. It's just like the transparency kind of thing. But like, when I, like, you know, I went through like a. Like. Like high, like. And then like when I met him, it was like. It's. To anybody that's working on co parents and know it's never gonna be like, easy, bro. It's actually gonna feel weird. Like, first four, five, maybe six, seven times, maybe first year. But, like, there'll be a moment that happened when y' all realize Y' all not in competition. Y' all realize, like, bruh, like, whatever energy y' all got with each other is gonna somehow morph into the child. You know what I'm saying? So now it's, like, blended, because they have a. They got a. She has a new child. You know what I'm saying, with him. And my daughter has a brother. That's not my child. So it's like. It's just. These are things that. That you just have to deal with and you have to, like, come to grips with as a man and just, like, you know, process them. It's a process. It ain't easy, but, like, shoot, there's nothing. I don't think that. I don't think nobody on this planet in any type of entertainment business has a conventional situation.

Shannon Sharpe (54:19)

Right.

Wale (54:19)

Just doesn't exist, I don't think.

Shannon Sharpe (54:22)

Is she allowed to meet the person that you're dating that's gonna be around.

Wale (54:25)

The child if she want. If she want to?

Shannon Sharpe (54:29)

She hasn't asked that yet.

Wale (54:30)

Mm. Mm. She probably don't care, though. I don't know.

Shannon Sharpe (54:34)

Come on.

Wale (54:37)

In.

Shannon Sharpe (54:38)

Conundrum. You also said, was it lust or did I love her? Her clothes are off. I'm closed off. Which one is worse? Which one is worse?

Wale (54:46)

I don't know. That's why I asked it.

Shannon Sharpe (54:48)

When you ask the question, you supposed to have the answer.

Wale (54:50)

Nah, it's rhetorical. I'm close off, like, you know what I'm saying? Like. Like, lust is a man, like, lust still have you.

Shannon Sharpe (54:59)

Like, you got to have it.

Wale (55:00)

The lust goggles make you think it's love.

Shannon Sharpe (55:02)

Yes.

Wale (55:03)

You know what I'm saying? And, you know, some people like, you might got the most crazy chemistry with physically, but, like, when it's over, like, you don't understand none of the jokes on this Martin episode. You don't understand. So you don't understand why I'm laughing like this when he dragging this little fake rottweiler. But we just had the craziest little. You know what I'm saying? Smoked a little something. We feeling we in a laughy mood. And you can't. You not laughing at this. Are we not. We don't have no other chemistry other than the thing we just did. You know what I'm saying? So you close. You start realizing, like, okay, maybe we don't, you know, be like, damn, like, I'm a little bit cold. For real. Like. Cause it's like, I don't. You. Not really my. It's not really what I thought it was. Yeah.

Shannon Sharpe (55:50)

Cause we not gonna spend every waking hour in the bedroom.

Wale (55:52)

Yeah, and it's.

Shannon Sharpe (55:53)

But don't you. Do you figure that out beforehand? Hopefully.

Wale (55:56)

Hopeful honeymoon, everybody. No, there's always a honeymoon stage, though. You know what I'm saying? There's always a honeymoon stage.

Shannon Sharpe (56:01)

But you go out to eat, you get a nice dinner, you know, she eating a salad. She ain't leaving nothing. You know, she ain't all embarrassed about. I ain't that hungry. Leave half the stuff you like.

Wale (56:10)

I disarmed women when they try to do that I ain't hungry thing because we eat sushi. I'm using a fork. I don't care about all that. I'm practical. I'm showing you I'm practical.

Shannon Sharpe (56:19)

Okay?

Wale (56:20)

I'm stabbing the sashimi. He like, yo, so what you say? What's going on? Because I'm not. So you don't have to do that. Eat what you want to eat. You feel me? Like, no, that's how that. So you.

Shannon Sharpe (56:29)

I mean, don't you have a good sense? Let's just say you go to dinner. I don't know. People don't probably go to the movies anymore. The movies.

Wale (56:34)

I guess that's overstimulating for me. I don't know. The movie, it's too much. I'm gonna see sinners at like 9 o' clock in the morning in the corner. I don't want too many people, too much loudness. It's too Michael B. Jordans on the screen. It's too much all the time. I need to simplify some things, right?

Shannon Sharpe (56:51)

So and so you saying, like, damn, has that happened when you get to a situation, like, everything is great, but you come to the realization you have this epiphany. Like, you know what?

Wale (57:02)

I just. I just. There's been times that it's like, the love is there, but I got this, like. And I know this joint. It started with sports, but it's like I got this thing where it's like when I have something that I want to do and I create by myself most of the times, like when I'm like in it or I'm in this, like, I'm trying to still achieve these dreams and stuff. I just lock in. And then I'm not as. I'm not as, like, eager to have conversation or maybe I just want to sit in silence. Some people can't understand that. And I've been told I've been cold in relationships. Like, I'm not as affectionate or whatever. Whatever. And I think that just stems from Just like being locked in on the go. You know what I'm saying?

Shannon Sharpe (57:49)

Blanco, mama say, why are you single? I said, mama, I'm sorry, I'm trying. But nobody gonna love me like you do.

Wale (57:59)

So on that line, I'm saying, like, Woke up at 4 in the morning, went to bed at 4 in the morning in the club for an hour or something. I was up for like 48 of them from the Capitol, back to Mulholland land, over and back to Rodale. Making sure that my circle is small. No, making sure that my circle is tight. So nobody I know got an angle. Got me drinking whatever this is, white or brown. Cause I gotta be gold in my beautiful house. No friends, nevermind. Where's my casamigo? And my mama don't ever say hi. She say, why is you single? I said, mommy, I'm sorry, I'm trying. But nobody gonna love me like she do. And that's the blanco. And nobody gonna love me like she do. And that's the rubber side, though. And nobody be loving like we do. You know what I'm saying? And I'm just basically talking about, like, I do this thing where I have to be out and I have to be in these places and I'm overly informed and I know what's going on. I don't keep a lot of friends around. I gotta be like this. I'm not mom. I'm not thinking about no wife right now. I'm trying to survive this industry and beat the game, you know? Or I get to the next level without my morals. So I can't be looking for love actively like you would like me to. LeBlanc. Go on inside of them. They got me in a dark place, but it's where I need to be to get to where I'm going.

Shannon Sharpe (59:18)

Do you believe you'll find a partner that'll love you like your mom do?

Wale (59:22)

My mother love differently, but, man, Nigerian mothers, man, God bless them, well, you never know. You hope so. You know what I'm saying? I got a unique way about me, so you never know. They said somebody for everybody.

Shannon Sharpe (59:37)

So you're not actively looking, though?

Wale (59:41)

I got this, this, this, this. I'm not looking right now.

Shannon Sharpe (59:45)

You about to say you got.

Wale (59:48)

I got a couple more minutes to talk to one of the NFL all the time. Damn, Travis Kelce just passed you, man.

Shannon Sharpe (59:54)

Oh, no, he been past me.

Wale (59:56)

Nah, somebody who else just passed you. Mm. You got one more season just to get to the.

Shannon Sharpe (60:02)

Nah, nah, nah, nah. I ain't got no more season. Maybe Zach Ertz.

Wale (60:06)

It couldn't have been. I don't want to say it like that. He just got like.

Shannon Sharpe (60:09)

No, no, no, no. But I think he got. I think he passed him as far as, like, catches or something.

Wale (60:13)

Travis Kelsey, man, the NFL use tight ends a whole lot more now.

Shannon Sharpe (60:18)

They absolutely do. The thing is that there are more of them that can do what I did. When I came along, there weren't a whole lot. There was probably like three or four. Now they got.

Wale (60:27)

But I was gonna use the receiver first and then the tight end.

Shannon Sharpe (60:29)

Yeah. So now they. Of, you know, 10, 15 guys that could do what I did.

Wale (60:35)

Who you like? Not the obvious ones.

Shannon Sharpe (60:37)

Like, I like McBride from the Cardinals. I love him. I love Warren.

Wale (60:42)

I like Fannin.

Shannon Sharpe (60:44)

Oh, I love Fannin. Yeah. He's growing. I like Warren from the Colts.

Wale (60:48)

Tyler. Tyler.

Shannon Sharpe (60:49)

Yeah. I love Loveland.

Wale (60:51)

Colton Loveland. Yeah. From Michigan. Yeah.

Shannon Sharpe (60:54)

Yeah. Obviously Kittle. Kittle is probably the most complete Kittle.

Wale (60:57)

My man.

Shannon Sharpe (60:57)

Being able to grow up to be able to.

Wale (60:59)

I know that archetype.

Shannon Sharpe (61:00)

Whoa.

Wale (61:01)

You know that archetype. And they got that one Youngin from Oregon who like that. It's a tight end who probably go first round from Oregon. He good?

Shannon Sharpe (61:09)

No. You been to that?

Wale (61:11)

I really, you know, I really want. I know it's unorthodox, but I really wanted to help with the scouting. I really do. I really know how to, like. Cause I work at University of Maryland with Coach Lock Shot, Coach Locke and all the Terps. You already know this, but, like, I be around a lot, like. And also, like, what I've learned is, like, these kids mental. I be knowing, like, oh, I know how this gonna end if you don't change. X, Y, Z.

Shannon Sharpe (61:36)

Correct.

Wale (61:36)

You know what I'm saying? So that's one of the things I told the ownership with commanders. I would love to, like, go to the Senior bowl and like, tell you what I see. Cause I've been around the game a whole lot. I know what's going on. Okay. You know what I mean?

Shannon Sharpe (61:49)

You gonna take your.

Wale (61:51)

Do you ever feel like getting back in the game in any capacity?

Shannon Sharpe (61:54)

I don't have the place.

Wale (61:54)

Not even ownership, Nothing.

Shannon Sharpe (61:56)

Own what I'm gonna own. I can buy some Gatorade.

Wale (62:00)

Minority ownership, man, please.

Shannon Sharpe (62:02)

But you see them teams going for.

Wale (62:03)

Hey, listen, we gonna get these in some more stores. I'm gonna make sure we get them some more stuff. And we gonna come circle this back later, man.

Shannon Sharpe (62:11)

Okay.

Wale (62:12)

We gonna sit with Magic and see. Hey, what's the method?

Shannon Sharpe (62:14)

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Wale (62:15)

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, you know, I mean, that's. I want to. I would love to do like minority and just again, that's something that I just enjoy watching. Cause when I stopped playing, I was kind of. I hate. I was kind of resentful to the game for like five, six years, but now I'm like, okay, I get it. And I wanna.

Shannon Sharpe (62:33)

You feel you can give something back to the game.

Wale (62:35)

Yeah, yeah. Like seven on sevens here and there. Talk to Tory Smith about doing some stuff around the way. Hopefully with Snoop I could do something. But yeah, I wanna do that. Like help with the commander's organization.

Shannon Sharpe (62:47)

Okay. The breakdown, where to start. I'm unthawing this heart I never thought I'd use again about the Lord my guard so kill me now unless you want.

Wale (62:57)

Unless you. So it's like a little, you know, I'm allowed to. Lord my guard, so kill me unless you want to kiss. You know what I'm saying? So that's just me, like jumping back out there, throwing myself back out there. Somebody like that caught my attention and like kind of slowed things down, you know what I'm saying? Like, all right, I'm gonna try this again. I know the ramifications if it don't work, you know what I'm saying? I know the ramifications if I jump out there and like, you make me look stupid or you know what I'm saying? Like, whatever.

Shannon Sharpe (63:27)

Is that why you feel it's so hard to love again?

Wale (63:31)

Yeah. And also I'm very. There's a lot of arrested development for sure. I'm self aware enough to know that like, you can't take a kid in a sophomore year in college and then throw him into the music industry for 15, 20 years and think he ain't gonna have some like, arrest pjd.

Shannon Sharpe (63:49)

Yeah.

Wale (63:50)

Cause he knows he's seen things, I've seen things. And also I'm very, very immature in some way. Cause I've never experienced certain things, you know what I'm saying? So. And you know, and again, like touring the world and seeing married women, how they. Some of them have behaved that make you just think, like, okay, you know. And don't nobody wanna be on the receiving end of like that betrayal, you know what I'm saying? Cause it hit different. It's like, one, why you do that? And two, like, why you do that? You know what I'm saying? Like, it just hits you, you know what I'm saying? So nobody wanted. I don't wanna be all. Cause it'll affect your Career, your job, your energy, you know what I'm saying? Don't nobody got no time for that. Don't nobody time with that.

Shannon Sharpe (64:27)

And watching us. I like to chase too much.

Wale (64:30)

Yeah, that's Lee, man. That's Leon. There's his words on that. But yeah, I mean, you sampled it, you did it. But everybody, I mean, I mean. Well, I won't say that because I don't think. I think that chasing game is kind of like. It's like it's not actually. I don't think it should be a thing no more, man. Like, we just. We had Covid, man. We was in the house, man. We was at. We was the whole everything. We know what this look like when everything shut down. Like time is of an essence, you know what I'm saying?

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Shannon Sharpe (65:00)

All.

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Wale (69:25)

Like me, I like you. Like let's make tomorrow today. You know what I'm saying?

Shannon Sharpe (69:29)

How about this? Do you believe women still pursue men like they once did?

Wale (69:35)

I don't know. That's another. That's another place. I'm kind of jaded with that. I don't, like, I don't know. You know what I'm saying? I don't know.

Shannon Sharpe (69:42)

Cause it used to be women, women would ask a guy out.

Wale (69:45)

I think I'm warped because we on social media era.

Shannon Sharpe (69:49)

Like social media's warped.

Wale (69:50)

I don't know because like I remember a long time ago I was talking to this one girl and I don't know, man, I didn't think nothing was gonna happen from it, but it was whatever. We on the phone, whatever. Like third conversation, she talked, she brought up a bag and I'm like, oh, you got me confused with one of these that don't got no charisma or no nothing, no conversation. And they just, they pay you in bags for your time. Like I know, you know what I'm saying? Like none of that on this side. And that's what I think that people think it is now. Like these women, not me, not. Cause that sound very red pillish. Nah, we ain't doing that. But I'm just saying like there seems to be like a certain standard, an expectation that people, that people base their whole personality off of me. If I like somebody, I'm paying for like I'm paying for dinner, I'm paying for like.

Shannon Sharpe (70:40)

But like I got you.

Wale (70:41)

You talking about bags and all that. Girl, you better. What you mean? Like grocery bag, like bro. Cause I just feel like I got way more to offer than just buying shit for somebody.

Shannon Sharpe (70:50)

Yes.

Wale (70:51)

And I feel like if you see me as somebody that if I come across as a guy that's just gonna be buying you stuff cause I got.

Shannon Sharpe (70:56)

Money, then you already telling me how you see me.

Wale (70:59)

We just wasting time, right? And it's like some women think that's the way a man can show you he with you. And I just always think the way a man can show you he like you is like by liking you, you know what I'm saying? By like calling you when you don't expect or like treating you nice or really being locked in on your interest or like giving you good advice or whatever, like. Or finding you inspiration, you feel me? Like all that other stuff is. And that's what the dating pool is these days. A lot of the time. I'm not generalizing.

Shannon Sharpe (71:30)

I saw a Survey that said 45% of the men 18 to 25 has never asked a woman out on a date.

Wale (71:37)

Damn. 18 to 25 and 25%.

Shannon Sharpe (71:41)

45%, 45.

Wale (71:42)

And that's gotta be like in person. Cause you got. But I always was thinking about this like, since COVID Like, bruh, imagine if we was, like, in that age group around 20, 20, like, formative years. Like, yeah, like, we like, you got 2020. That was doomed. 2021 was kind of 2022's kind of coming back.

Shannon Sharpe (72:04)

You tried to break it.

Wale (72:05)

Yeah, yeah. So your social skills are out of whack crazy. Like, you. You know what I'm saying? You, like, you live. You don't.

Shannon Sharpe (72:12)

You kind of just camped up with whoever's available because you really couldn't get at it.

Wale (72:16)

There's gonna be some things that's gonna be like, the next couple years. So it makes sense why they don't really know how to. You know what I'm saying? And then also in the media, the music ain't like, lover boy music. For real.

Shannon Sharpe (72:29)

Nah, nah, nah, nah. There ain't no candlelights. It ain't no bubble bath. It ain't no.

Wale (72:33)

I be like, I remember being in elementary school when you had that crush that don't even know, and you think of a certain song when you see it running on the playground. I don't know what they listening to now.

Shannon Sharpe (72:43)

Yeah, ain't no more Teddy P. Yeah, yeah.

Wale (72:45)

Nah, ain't no my love do ever, like, come on. Like you. I mean, I'm at the dance just, like, imagine I'm dancing with my crush, and I don't think that's happening no more. And let's blame Covid and Trump for that.

Shannon Sharpe (73:02)

So what is it about? What do you think so hard? Because Willow Smith, Will and Jada's daughter, she went viral, said, why don't men ask women out on date? Where are the old school where men used to walk up.

Wale (73:17)

I think she probably just saying that, but. But I'm sure, like, I'm sure there's men that probably try and holler at her that they probably might not be her type. She's a pretty young girl. Like, she got probably her picture.

Shannon Sharpe (73:30)

You got a lot of options. Yeah.

Wale (73:31)

And she probably just being hyperbolic, but, like, you know, maybe they don't know. You know what I'm saying? Like, a lot of men are like, yo, the fear of rejection is a thing, too. At my big age, I've been in shadow approaching girl before, like, still, like, you know what I'm saying? This happened.

Shannon Sharpe (73:48)

That's real.

Wale (73:48)

Yeah. I feel like the fear of rejection that might turn you into, like, never mind. I don't like her anyway. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, but Willow lying. She thought, willow, stop lying. Stop lying. Cause they probably jumped in your DMs that day. And you probably. You know what I'm saying?

Shannon Sharpe (74:03)

Yeah.

Wale (74:03)

Maybe not what you want, but I don't know, you gotta probably leave Calabasas or something.

Shannon Sharpe (74:08)

Tattooing a woman on you. You said I got you tattoo.

Wale (74:12)

Uh huh.

Shannon Sharpe (74:13)

You got a woman tattooed on you.

Wale (74:16)

I got angels and stuff.

Shannon Sharpe (74:18)

Nah, nah, that.

Wale (74:20)

Nah, nah. I got Martin Luther King, Malcolm. I want to get a Whitney Houston joint. No, no, no. I'm talking about nobody. No, not specific. Nah.

Shannon Sharpe (74:27)

Would you do it?

Wale (74:28)

Yeah.

Shannon Sharpe (74:30)

You what?

Wale (74:30)

I live in the moment, man.

Shannon Sharpe (74:32)

Come on. You know that's forever.

Wale (74:34)

Where I got like.

Shannon Sharpe (74:38)

I don't think you got no room go. So it ain't gonna happen.

Wale (74:40)

I'm gonna do it. We gonna stream it.

Shannon Sharpe (74:45)

So watching us, you said, epic. Let's go to Paris.

Wale (74:48)

Yep.

Shannon Sharpe (74:49)

You random like that. I mean, you, you, you fly by the seat of your pants like that.

Wale (74:52)

Because that's like I'm trying to tell the girl, like, you know, like watching us is like. You know how it is, man. Like we got watching. This is like me and a hypothetical woman that's in our crazy business. And we talk and I'm trying to navigate how we do this, you know what I'm saying? So you know, I'm famous, you famous, they see it. So now what? Right now we gotta decide how we feel inside. And the outcome. The hard launch, dopamine rush. You know how that go. Now women come to you as a woman until you're not sure. Like I'm painting the picture as like how I feel. Like you wanna go out with your person, but you know that it's better to protect it. You know what I'm saying? So let's go to Paris. Cause ain't nobody over there. Ain't nobody watching. I mean, I know I ain't nobody, but I ain't no wembayama. So you know what I'm saying? So it's like Paris. When I go to Paris, I can hold your hand in the street, I can kiss you in public. And nobody gonna be. So that's. I was just trying to paint the picture.

Shannon Sharpe (75:53)

You ever done that? First time meeting somebody, you know? Yeah, I like you and dip.

Wale (75:58)

Yeah, that's rock star out the country. Not the country.

Shannon Sharpe (76:01)

Oh, I gonna say.

Wale (76:02)

But we gonna do. We might gotta do it on this. We're just watching us. Joint beer. I ain't done it like that before though. Now I'm a little bit more responsible than that. Shane.

Shannon Sharpe (76:13)

As a muse might do music. Truthfully about you, you write songs About.

Wale (76:19)

Sometimes they're hybrids of people. Sometimes it's one person. Sometimes it might be a fictional person, like from a movie. But when I'm. When it's there, it's there like. Like you could. You could feel it. Like, you know what I'm saying? But most of the time it's about something or somebody, but sometimes it's a little hybrid.

Shannon Sharpe (76:40)

Yeah.

Wale (76:40)

Because I don't want to. Like, I don't want no smoke with nobody. Like.

Shannon Sharpe (76:44)

Well, you say sometime it's their lotus flower bomb. The rumors are it's about, you know.

Wale (76:52)

Nah, that's. No, we was real good friends and how good we was. Like, she's got a great ear. She was one of the first, like, super, like, celebrity people that really like for my music. And I remember we performed together at the VMAs. You know, my band was the house band for that joint. And we performed together and we just got cool. She put me on, like. Cause I was still very, very, very, like, underground. And she put me onto a lot of stuff. Like, back then, like, we was just cool. Like, she put me on there, like Givenchy, and she put me on the Victor and Ralph Flowerbomb. You know what I'm saying? And that's how that. That's how the opening lines go. But it ain't about nobody.

Shannon Sharpe (77:37)

Like, it ain't. So y' all ain't in the room.

Wale (77:39)

Nah, nah, nah. That's just. That's my people. If anybody knows Solo, they know that she's always. She's ahead. She's like. She thinks ahead. Like, she saw what. She saw, what a lot of people. She saw what a lot of people. Seeing me now back then, Right? Yeah.

Shannon Sharpe (77:56)

Dating celebrity or non celebrity?

Wale (77:58)

That's a good question. It just. It varies because sometimes you, like, it's like, dang, like, the non celebrity woman is like, she might be having. She might have more time on, you know, on her hands. You know what I'm saying? Like, she might. But also, there's a weirdness that come with this lifestyle if you. Not if you just come around me and we already got feelings for each other, but now you see how this shit is and how it's moving around. It might be too much for them. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. And that's the whole thing. Or then you got the celebrity. Like, they got money, they got this, they got that. But it's just like.

Shannon Sharpe (78:44)

Like.

Wale (78:46)

It'S too much eyes. It's too much. It feels like a brand more than, like, than a union.

Shannon Sharpe (78:53)

A Union relationship.

Wale (78:54)

But it's fun when it's like, y' all both got motion and this, that, and the third. But again, like I say, it's tricky because the overlays in the industry, like, you know, now I'm probably gonna know who you've talked to. You gonna know if I've talked to the rooms might get weird or, you know, would that bother you? Not me. For real. I don't care. Cause it's like, bro.

Shannon Sharpe (79:17)

Cause a lot of guys. A lot of guys. A lot of guys would care.

Wale (79:19)

That's too much. Cause I'm like, I can't police that, bro. Like, I got too many other things to do. Like, I can't police that.

Shannon Sharpe (79:25)

Yeah. Cause whatever.

Wale (79:26)

I mean, as long as they not lying, don't lie to me. But, like, you know what I'm saying? I don't care. It's not the big deal. You know what I'm saying? Right to me.

Shannon Sharpe (79:34)

City on Fire how you got me out the game? Now you trying to play? Yeah, man, now you done got me. See, I done cleaned up my ass. I don't do that no more.

Wale (79:44)

I'm trying, I try.

Unisom & Pluvicto Advertiser (79:45)

I ain't sliding.

Wale (79:46)

I ain't out.

Shannon Sharpe (79:47)

You know, I ain't doing none of that.

Wale (79:49)

Oh, my God. And now you gonna kill me, you know what I'm saying? Like, you outside. But, you know, the City on Fire is a very. Like. You know, the thing about this album is a lot of people just kind of see the surface level, what the song is like. Like, if you break down City on Five, it's really like the story of an ego being broken down. My ego, Like, I'm supposed to be like, okay, somebody told me that we broke up. Cool. Now you wanna fly Getting paid in the zoo but it's cool. Get your bell run. You know, Like, I'm condescending. Like, we broke up. She's out with her friends, you know, and I'm looking at her Snapchat or whatever, and I see the bottles coming. Like, a lot of men go through that. You know what I'm saying? And like, dog, how we get. How we get here? How did we get here? Now you got me at the game. Now you trying to play straight shots to the face. What you trying to chase, you know what I'm saying? Like, that's. I've been there. Like that. I ain't mad, I ain't tripping. I ain't tripping. Yo, your girl in this joint, she acting, fool. She going crazy. Like, she got busting up. What's her name at her table. All the da, da, da, whoopty whoop that play for the.

Shannon Sharpe (80:52)

I mean, don't you hold her. You said, hold on. Look here. If you see my former people out, don't tell me, don't you. Are you on her? Like, if you seeing some young lady and y' all not seeing anymore, you go on her store as you go on the page.

Wale (81:06)

I don't even. That's too treacherous. Like, yeah, you ask for trouble, but in the city on Fire, somebody's telling me. Yeah, you know, they're telling me that somebody, like, they think they doing me a solid. And maybe they are like, you know what I'm saying? Cause everybody been there. Like, you know, but I'm at home playing Madden. Like, I don't care. I don't care. I don't care. I don't care. And they sending me pictures and like, you know, that's why I said on the last line of the song, you standing on the couch in hills. I'm watching Martin. So every time I hear what's up? I got, ah, ah. Cause when they telling me what's up? And then I'm sitting here, what's up? On the tv, I'm like, okay, all right, cool. You go have it. Go have it out. You know what I'm saying? Oh, some more spots. It's more over there. Oh, the rookie of the year is at her table. They all over there. They kept the club open for them.

Shannon Sharpe (81:48)

Damn.

Wale (81:49)

You know what I'm saying? Yeah, but when it's over, it's over. Casualty.

Shannon Sharpe (81:54)

But I don't think your homies would do that if they know you're not together. Maybe you hadn't told them yet type shit. Yeah, maybe you haven't told them yet. Like, man, me and old girl ain't seeing each other anymore. So they figure they give you the play by play, a running down. But it's really like, bro, I ain't really need that right now.

Wale (82:08)

Hey, hey, Shannon. Gotta get behind that camera and start directing now. We was talking about the. We was talking about that earlier today, like, how, like how some of these songs come to life.

Shannon Sharpe (82:19)

Yes.

Wale (82:20)

And the way we just did that exchange is like, that's how healthy scripts come together. Because I talked about how this. Four years I ain't dropped. Like, I honestly think four years ago, City on Fire would have been. Everybody would have understood exactly what I'm saying. Where is it going?

Shannon Sharpe (82:36)

Right?

Wale (82:36)

But I don't think. I think it's more ambiguous now when the fans Hear it. They be like, it just sounds good, Odile. Sounds good, Wale. Sounds good. Oh, wahala. Oh, that's cool. They not really realizing the song is like, yo, somebody told me that we broke up. Now you on a flyer getting paid in a zoo. It's cool. Get your bell rung. I do this shit begrudgingly. You do this for the love of the game or to see that you ain't follow up. Like, I'm really like battling, like, yo, what are you doing? How is this happening? Nevermind. You know what I'm saying? And those are real human emotions. And I don't think people really, even when I talk to fans about it, they love it. But I don't really think they all the way know, like, what. How deep. Like what we was just talking about how deep it goes. Like, for sure. When you going through that, like, oh, she out. I'm not even a jealous type, but I know her friends don't like me. She out. Why is it? Why is it.

Shannon Sharpe (83:24)

And they eggin her own, you know.

Wale (83:27)

Why is it your homegirl birthday every day? Oh, I'm going out. It's Stacey birthday. Stacey, what is this ad? Stacey birthday pictures from three months ago. Like, you know what I'm saying? So it's just like, just like the little small nuances that happen in the relationship, I just wanna, like, I wanted to highlight them in from an honest perspective. Like, whether I'm the good guy or the bad guy on the song City on Fire, I'm definitely a little bit lean into the bad guy.

Shannon Sharpe (83:54)

Yeah. This concludes the first half of my conversation. Part two is also posted and you can access it to whichever podcast platform you just listened to part one on. Just simply go back to Club Shay Shay profile and I'll see you there.

Wale (84:07)

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Shannon Sharpe (84:25)

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Wale (84:29)

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Shannon Sharpe (84:43)

And a flat trim toothbrush.

Wale (84:45)

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Sophie Cunningham (84:56)

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Coca-Cola Announcer (85:36)

What a matchup we got, y'.

Wale (85:37)

All.

Coca-Cola Announcer (85:38)

This is that classic HBCU vibe. Non stop action. The band is rocking and the crowd lit. Chance echo drum beat everybody showing that school pride. A game like this. Yeah, it calls for an ice cold Coca Cola. Ah, crisp and refreshing. That's a game changer right there.

Wale (85:56)

There.

Coca-Cola Announcer (85:58)

Yeah, that taste always hits the right note. Just like the band at halftime. And just like that, we're back at it. Passionate fans, school colors everywhere and an ice cold Coca Cola. That's a winning combo no matter the sport, no matter the yard. Everybody knows fan work is thirsty work. So grab a Coca Cola and keep that HBCU pride going.

Unisom & Pluvicto Advertiser (86:22)

Honestly, Honestly.

Wale (86:24)

Honestly, no one wants to think about hiv, but there are things that everyone can do to help prevent it. Things like prep. PREP stands for pre exposure prophylaxis, and it means routinely taking prescription medicine before you're exposed to HIV to help reduce your chances of getting it. Prep can be about 99% effective when taken as prescribed. It doesn't protect against other STIs, though, so be sure to use condoms and other healthy sex practices. Ask a healthcare provider about all your prevention Options and visit findoutaboutprep.com to learn more.

Shannon Sharpe (86:51)

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