Deebo & Joe - Part 1: Chris Boswell MONSTER Extension, Deebo GOES OFF on NFLPA, Steelers QB Room

Summary

Club Shay Shay – Deebo & Joe, Part 1: Chris Boswell Monster Extension, Deebo GOES OFF on NFLPA, Steelers QB Room

Podcast: Club Shay Shay
Date: May 12, 2026
Hosts: James “Deebo” Harrison & Joe Haden

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Episode Overview

This episode of Club Shay Shay, featuring James “Deebo” Harrison and Joe Haden, dives deep into several big NFL storylines: Chris Boswell’s major contract extension with the Steelers, a passionate critique of the NFL Players Association, and an honest look at the Steelers’ current quarterback room. The hosts bring their signature blend of candor and playful rivalry, pulling no punches on league politics, player advocacy, and the realities of building a championship team. Basketball playoffs and NFL roster rankings round out the lively, insightful discussion.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. NBA Playoff Banter and Sports Allegiance

Timestamps: 04:51–09:30

• The show opens with friendly trash talk about the NBA playoffs, especially highlighting Donovan Mitchell’s explosive performance (“Donovan Mitchell, he scored 39 points in the second half. ... Did you see that display of crossovers, of step backs, of I will dunk on you, I will float on you?” — James Harrison, 05:26).
• Joe sticks with Detroit, refusing to back Cleveland even if invited to a game.
• The segment sets the tone for honest, sometimes heated, back-and-forth that continues through the episode.

2. Chris Boswell’s 4-Year Contract Extension

Timestamps: 09:38–15:08

• Steelers reward kicker Chris Boswell (“Bankroll”) with a 4-year, $28M deal, tying him for the highest average salary among kickers.
• “They done signed one of the most reliable kickers in the NFL to a four-year deal... This ties Bos to Pittsburgh through the 2030 season.” — Joe Haden, 09:51.
• Boswell’s consistency earns respect: “Career average, bro. 87.7 on the field goal percentage.” — Joe Haden, 10:28.
• The hosts share personal anecdotes about motivating Boswell during low points, emphasizing mental support over stats alone (“Whenever he had missed something, I would always come, dap him up… I just was always letting him know I was there for him” — James Harrison, 12:47).
• They also reflect on the longevity and professionalism required for elite kickers, drawing parallels to Phil Dawson and other NFL veterans.

3. Steelers Quarterback Room: A Reality Check

Timestamps: 15:09–20:36

• Responding to a beat writer’s assessment, the hosts candidly agree the Steelers QB room is currently the weakest in the AFC North.
• “We got two guys that ain't even played a game in the NFL yet on the roster… and Mason Rudolph has some experience, but I'm not taking him over any of those quarterbacks.”—Joe Haden, 19:19.
• Comparison with division rivals (Burrow, Lamar, Watson) underscores the rebuilding task ahead. “Right now at this date, that list is about right.” — James Harrison, 20:28.

4. NFLPA and the Grass vs. Turf Controversy

Timestamps: 21:02–44:47

• The hosts dissect the NFLPA’s critique of owners switching to grass for FIFA (World Cup), but not for NFL games, despite player preferences due to injury risk.
• Joe absolutely blasts the union’s lack of power and transparency:
  • “NFLPA leadership has been trash... It's been trash since we lost Gene Upshaw and they got D. Marie Smith as executive director and he proceeded to make all the changes necessary in rules so that he and his staff could keep position in power.” — Joe Haden, 23:37
  • Criticism of secretive executive votes, lack of player empowerment, and the union’s tendency to posture for public sympathy rather than real change.
  • Calls out excessively long CBAs: “No major union in the history of the world have ever signed a 10 year deal as a union that long. Nobody.” — Joe Haden, 27:35.
  • “FIFA went there and said, grass or nothing. That means no money or you won’t get a chance to be put on the world stage to get coverage.” — Joe Haden, 26:10
• The segment highlights how soccer’s leverage for the World Cup forced owners to install high-quality grass, yet football players remain on turf.
• Negotiation strategy: Advocates for a player lockout and significant savings to build real bargaining power for the next CBA.

5. NFL Roster Rankings & “Most Complete Teams” Debate

Timestamps: 45:55–54:56

• Discussion of NFL.com’s top 10 “most complete rosters” for 2026—Rams, Seahawks, Eagles, Ravens, Bills, Lions, Broncos, 49ers, Texans, Patriots.
• Hosts question methodology, especially absence of Steelers/Browns and high rankings for teams with playoff doubts. “If you don’t have a quarterback on your team, you can’t be [a] complete roster.” — James Harrison, 46:16.
• “Bills, Ravens, and Eagles and the Lions. Lions shouldn't even be on there.” — Joe Haden, 53:07.
• Additional critiques of playoff performances, leadership, and team construction.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Donovan Mitchell… Did you see that display of crossovers, of step backs, of I will dunk on you, I will float on you?” — James Harrison, 05:26
• “I just knock on his door. Even if he wasn't there, I make sure he saw me on the ring... Just cause I ain't there don't mean the rules don't still apply.” — Joe Haden recounting mentorship to Boswell, 12:19
• “NFLPA leadership has been trash... It's been trash since we lost Gene Upshaw...” — Joe Haden, 23:37
• “The only way the players will get all that they deserve won't be until the NFL either loses money or misses the opportunity to make money.” — Joe Haden, 28:41
• “If you don’t have a quarterback on your team, you can’t be a complete roster.” — James Harrison, 46:16
• “Bills, Ravens, and Eagles and the Lions. Lions shouldn't even be on there.” — Joe Haden, 53:07

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Tone & Style

The language and exchanges are direct, authentic, and true to the athletes’ personalities. The banter is relentless and the criticism of league and union structures is unfiltered. The conversation is packed with practical football wisdom, inside stories, competitive edge, and seasoned skepticism about the powers shaping the game.

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Timestamps for Highlights

• NBA Trash Talk & Playoff Debate: 04:51–09:30
• Boswell Extension & Kicker Wisdom: 09:38–15:08
• Steelers QB Room Reality Check: 15:09–20:36
• NFLPA Critique & Turf/Grass Battle: 21:02–44:47
• NFL Roster Rankings, Rebuilding, & Franchise QBs: 45:55–54:56

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Summary Takeaway

This episode goes far beyond basic sports talk, offering candid insights into player advocacy, team leadership, and what it takes—on and off the field—to build a winning culture. With raw honesty and the first-hand experience only legends bring, Deebo and Joe pull back the curtain on what’s working (and failing) in football’s upper echelons, challenging fans and athletes alike to demand more from those in power.

Transcript

[Podcast Host]

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[James Harrison]

You know how I'm doing today, brother Debo. I'm doing great. I'm doing great. Did you see great? Did you see what happened yesterday?

[Joe Hayden]

Great. Oh, I. I see. I seen what happened.

[James Harrison]

But great.

[Joe Hayden]

I wouldn't say great.

[James Harrison]

Okay, great. Not, not great. Not great, but good.

[Joe Hayden]

Okay, I give you good one side.

[James Harrison]

You know what I'm saying? But this is what I expected to happen. But let's talk about the good side.

[Joe Hayden]

Dude, stop. Stop. Ain't nobody 23 point like stop. What do you mean don't happen? It ain't gonna happen again.

[James Harrison]

What?

[Joe Hayden]

20 run. Stop it, bro.

[James Harrison]

Come on, man. You've seen what happened. Donovan Mitchell, he scored 39 points in the second half. Deebo, did you see that display? Did you see that display of crossovers, of step backs, of I will dunk on you, I will float on you? I would do everything. James Harden did what he had to do in the first half. Evan Mobley, grown man. Everybody's talking about all this. Yeah, whatever. He's out there balling him. And Jared Allen. This is Jared Allen jersey right here. Shout out to the Cavs. Shout out to them. Sending me the gear with the care package. You know what I'm saying? So I had to rock. I had to come through. Yes, Debo. So, you know, I really realized.

[Joe Hayden]

I'm glad you got.

[James Harrison]

It's not a curse.

[Joe Hayden]

Listen, listen. You ain't having enough on. Last time you. All you had one was Cleveland. You didn't actually have on the cash gear. You got the cash gear.

[James Harrison]

Yeah. Sir.

[Joe Hayden]

Now is when it kicks in, man.

[James Harrison]

I don't want to hear nothing. I don't want to hear none of that. I don't hear none of that. Now. We about to go back. Hey, you got to go to Detroit.

[Joe Hayden]

What happened over there in la? Okay, Your boy talking about. He, he. I don't know what's going on over there.

[James Harrison]

Like I told you before, Oklahoma City Thunder has too much firepower. I was telling you, being a fan, I will tell you what I would want to see. I would like to see LeBron and them get through. They didn't have Luka Ar was coming back. Aiden played well, but he wasn't doing what he had to do. Most of the series, they didn't have enough firepower. Okc, too much Luke Dort. They didn't even have Jalen Williams out there. They don't even have that full roster. But they have too many players that can ball. We outnumbered, out, powered, outgunned.

[Joe Hayden]

I ain't never heard of having too many.

[James Harrison]

That's what I'm telling you. OKC is one of them. And they got draft picks. They gonna be good for a long time. So OKC is a problem. I'm not. I wasn't worried about. I told you they were gonna go to the ship. I was speaking crazy. If I was saying the Lakers gonna go. That's just the fan in me. That's the wrong fan in me wanting them to go. Okay, they're not going. OKC's gonna make it. Over on this east side, though. That's why I'm standing on business, because I honestly believe, and I told you it's two to two. Now you say, oh, yeah, they gonna.

[Joe Hayden]

Yeah.

[James Harrison]

Detroit going no playoffs. They. They did what they had to do. We held our home court. Now we gotta go steal one in Detroit. So when they come back to Cleveland on game six, I'm be in a building and we're gonna take it over.

[Joe Hayden]

You go be there for game six, and you go watch them get it closed out, because they gonna come back three, two, and close it out right there in Cleveland.

[James Harrison]

I'mma tell you this. Look, we got to get by Detroit. We got to get by Detroit because I'm telling you, the series, when we play the Knicks, that's going to be live. That's going to be live. The Knicks are fire. Brunson is going crazy. Donovan Mitchell going crazy. Both of them scoring every time. ISO Hesses Tre ball. You want to see good ball, Debo. Next series when the Knicks play the Cavs. Get you to a game with me, that'd be fine.

[Joe Hayden]

You mean Detroit?

[James Harrison]

No, after we beat. After we beat Detroit, we got to play. The Cavs are going to play the New York Knicks to go to the championship.

[Joe Hayden]

Go be playing the Knicks.

[James Harrison]

No, you heard me correctly. Stop talking about. Okay, they just got cade. They got K. We're gonna have to maintain. KK's a baller, but you know what I'm saying, they don't have enough yet.

[Joe Hayden]

That's crazy. That's wild. That's wild. Look, I ain't gonna even. I mean, yeah, just. Just take my word for it. You know what? You know what, man? No, I ain't gonna. I ain't gonna do it. I ain't gonna do it because I know they go, come back down, three, two, and then y' all gonna be in Cleveland. Then I show up there and, you know you there. You know that's what I'm saying. And then I'm like, yeah, you know, I'm. I'm gonna be Detroited out.

[James Harrison]

No, never mind. I'm definitely not bringing you. Hell, no. Never. No, so never mind. Not. Bro, if you're gonna be rocking the. No, if I bring it, you gotta rock something, man.

[Joe Hayden]

Listen, man, I gotta. I gotta stick to my. I gotta stick. I gotta stick. I gotta, man, and. And be what I am, man. That's against Cleveland. Okay? Anything, any day, all day, every day, always.

[James Harrison]

God. Okay, all right, I see that. You just a hater of the land. You don't Okay, I respect. Okay, for sure. I see what it is.

[Joe Hayden]

Now look here brother, they done went on ahead and signed one of the most reliable kickers in the NFL to a four year deal. He gonna be sticking around. You know who it is, right?

[James Harrison]

Bank roll.

[Joe Hayden]

They done sign. I got Chris Bankroll. He has agreed to a four year deal. 28 million dollar extension. This ties buys to Pittsburgh through the 30, 30 season. It also makes him tie with the Dallas kicker Brandon Aubrey.

[James Harrison]

Uhhuh.

[Joe Hayden]

For the highest average, uh, salary among kickers. I wonder what the guarantee is. The average is a good thing, but

[James Harrison]

I think it's four. I think it's like 14.

[Joe Hayden]

Okay, so we got, what is it? He got 11 years in now.

[James Harrison]

Yes.

[Joe Hayden]

Career average, bro. 87.7 on the field goal percentage. Yes.

[James Harrison]

Six.

[Joe Hayden]

Yes, bruh. Look here bro, I'm gonna let you in on a little secret.

[James Harrison]

Please.

[Joe Hayden]

Hey man, got the money deserved.

[James Harrison]

Yes.

[Joe Hayden]

But I realized boss is 35, man.

[James Harrison]

Like.

[Joe Hayden]

Yeah, I know that bro. 11 years. I like that's. Well, he did start late.

[James Harrison]

Started a little late. So seven years 35. But look, right.

[Joe Hayden]

And then when he got to the Steelers, that's when I turned him into the kicker. That day is the day.

[James Harrison]

Come on. You scared the scared, scared the legacy.

[Joe Hayden]

Here's the crazy part, man. I don't even, I don't even wanna. I only want to bring this up though. I don't even want to bring this up. But I got to. I remember, you know, when I retired in 2018, bro. And the end of that season, bruh, you know, I'm looking at, I'm looking at boss man and I see this man finished the year 65 on field goal percentage, bro. That's the lowest he had ever been in his career, man. Yes, bro. Yes.

[James Harrison]

Okay. No, I remember he had. Was one.

[Joe Hayden]

It was 65 in 2018, bro. When I retired. Yes.

[James Harrison]

I was on the squad.

[Joe Hayden]

And I remember, dude, I had to go over there to his house, bro, at the end of the season. And I'd stop over there at least once every other week while the season was out. And once a week when the season was in. Yeah. And I just knock on his door. Even if he wasn't there. I make sure he saw me on the ring.

[James Harrison]

On the ring.

[Joe Hayden]

And you know what I did? I let him know, hey, just cause I ain't there don't mean the rules don't still apply.

[James Harrison]

Cdc, Debo, you done go to my dog house. See out.

[Joe Hayden]

You still go do what you need to do or you gonna be Washing my back immediately. Joe, he went 94, 95, back to back seasons.

[James Harrison]

Okay, okay, okay. I was thinking Debo, that's you. You a wild man, Deebo. You are a wild man. I would say every time you could go. Look back when me and my man Boswell Bankroll, I love him. Whenever I ran off, when he kicked the field, when he did kickoffs, we would run off, dap each other up every time. Whenever he had missed something, I would always come, dap him up. When we exchanged, when the defense came onto the field, I would always make sure. And I dapped up bars every time before we came out. So that was me and my man's thing. Always, like if he missed, it didn't matter miss or make. I was running over the ball, showing him love. And we always look for each other. So you motivated him in a different way. And you know what I'm saying? I just was always letting him know I was there for him when it wasn't going the way it needed to. I believe in bankroll. 50 plus field goals, my man is made. What we got. My man did two Pro Bowls, one All Pro, and his 50 yard plus is what is his biggest thing. So I'm with Bankroll, I'm rocking with him. And we had a kicker when I was in Cleveland, my man Phil Dawson.

[Joe Hayden]

Oh, yeah, Goaded.

[James Harrison]

Go to Phil Dawson. Old man Phil, we had training camps. He would put on his door, don't come knock on my door. I got kids, you know what I'm saying? I'm sleep. And you just got older vets that like. I think Bankroll could get into that category where the kickers, when you were just consistent, you doing what you're doing, you can play for a very long time. I think Phil was up there, 40 years old, still kicking that ball beautifully. So when I think about Bankroll, I think about just keeping his body up. Bankroll looks young. Like when you look. I was. I didn't know bankroll was 35 years old.

[Joe Hayden]

Dude, I did.

[James Harrison]

Right around 30 years old, you know what I'm saying? Still looks young, still moving around like, takes care of his body. And you know how those kickers are too, bro. He ain't doing too much.

[Joe Hayden]

They don't do much. They don't do much.

[James Harrison]

Bankroll got his little schedule. He walking in that thing, he kicking at the beginning of practice, walking around, chilling, making sure everything is everything. But he got his routine. He's very professional. He knows what he gotta do, like you said. So I'm rocking with it. I'm liking. You need a kicker. And if you got one like bankroll that, you know what I'm saying? For the next, for the foreseeable future. I like it.

[Joe Hayden]

Pay the man what he work, man. And that's what they did.

[James Harrison]

Be that man his money.

[Joe Hayden]

Yes, sir. Ain't no problem with that man.

[James Harrison]

Bankroll.

[Joe Hayden]

And now I guess this is supposed to be news. Some Stillers beat writer, he writes that, you know, the Steelers had the worst quarterback room in the AFC north. Worse than the Browns.

[James Harrison]

Yeah.

[Joe Hayden]

Yeah. Okay. Like what? Yeah, what are we talking about? You know, like what are we talking about? I mean, tell me something I don't know. Yep, we got two guys that ain't even played a game in the NFL yet on the roster, you know, and when you look at what you're going up against as the other quarterbacks. Come on, man, like, it would be ridiculous, especially considering that to think that we weren't at the bottom.

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[Martha Stewart]

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[James Harrison]

You got. You got the way you out the way.

[Joe Hayden]

You got Lamar Jackson.

[James Harrison]

Boom.

[Joe Hayden]

And then you got Should Dirt and Watson and Watson. We have Will Howard, zero games in the NFL. Drew Allen, zero games in the NFL. And Mason Rudolph has some experience, but I'm not taking him over any of those quarterbacks on that list.

[James Harrison]

Yep.

[Joe Hayden]

So, yes, we are divine.

[James Harrison]

We are. That is, you know, that's just. It is what it is. That's just. Honesty is the best policy. And until they show otherwise, then we got to be able to see it. If you looking at it and you could think Joe Burrow or Lamar Jackson. If you're looking at the rankings, you could say, no, I like Lamar more than I like Burrow. You could switch up the top two. But I'm looking at it like there's no history for the Steelers. Aaron Rodgers is not on the team. So we're talking about Drew Eiler, we're talking about Will Howard, and we're talking about Mason Rudolph's in the ranking. You know what I'm saying? When you're talking about the division. So you're looking against your peers. Who are you going against? Well, this room's better. That's. There's Joe Burrow over there, Lamar Jackson over there. There's desean Watson and Shador, actually, he played. So we gonna, we don't know for sure, but we still know what desean did. We got Will, we got Mace, you know what I'm saying? We got Drew. So, like, just as far as the room goes until they prove us and get out there on the field and show what they've done. Right now at this date, that, that, that list, that list is about right?

[Joe Hayden]

Oh, yeah, you can't, you can't go against it. I mean, it is what it is. But yeah, you let the year play out. Let's go back to that list.

[James Harrison]

Oh, a thousand percent. That's all, that's all we do. Them draft rankings, how good was their draft? Yeah, they, they picked good picks. If they're not good, then your draft was bad. If you found some third rounders that people are like, oh, why'd you go get him? You know what I'm saying? Looking back, people drafted Russell Wilson. Why would you pick Russell? Next thing you know, he balls out, you win the Super Bowls. The draft looks better. Yeah, draft looks better after that.

[Joe Hayden]

Definitely. Definitely. Hey, brother. The NFL Pennsylvania, I guess FIFA was like, yo, we coming through, but we need grass. So I guess the NFLPA issued a reminder to the owners that, you know, they're, they're going to install high quality grass for FIFA. Yeah. So as they said, as FIFA commandeers 11 stadiums, the venues that have artificial turf for football will be installing high quality grade natural grass for soccer. NFL association. The NFL Players association also issued a reminder that the owners will give player will issued a reminder that the owners will give players in a different spot in a different. Sorry. In a different sport. The surface that NFL players almost unilaterally, uniformly prefer. Sorry. The reality is that the owners who are having or who are hosting World cup games and start grass fields because FIFA demanded it put simple. They had no choice when it comes to the NFL game, they have a choice. And many are still choosing a surface that is cheaper to maintain and easier to handle. Then when it's time to generate revenue and handle when it's time to terminate revenue through other events, like, you know, when they want to do like concerts and all that. Yeah, you know that stuff. All like that. Here's. So here's what the NFL PA just did. What the NFL PA just did is Is what I would do.

[James Harrison]

Yes.

[Joe Hayden]

Like, at this point, you know, I'm obviously, like, I obviously have no power. So I would be like, hey, everybody, the NFL don't care about the players. They did this for them. But hey, I'm only doing that because I have no power to change anything. The only thing I could do is maybe get like public opinion, a little support from fans, all that other stuff, like, hey, you know, that can help that. That ain't. They are the NFL pa. And this is one of the things y' all didn't go for, you didn't have as a non negotiable last cba.

[James Harrison]

Yeah.

[Joe Hayden]

So why are y' all pointing the finger? Don't point the finger. Make sure y' all stand in the matter of. Make sure y' all stand in the mirror when y' all point the finger. So you could be pointing at yourself. Because the NFLPA leadership has been trash. I will keep saying it and will be trash. Trash. It's been trash since we lost Gene Upshaw and they got D. Marie Smith as executive director and he proceeded to make all the changes necessary in rules so that he and his staff could keep position in power. And that's why we have the leadership we have right now, because it's insider trading, bro. Like, it's the good old boy system. You know, if we don't like you, we're not letting you in. And I know that they didn't like me and they said, I know this because I was told, hey. They couldn't even consider James, a real possibility as a serious candidate because he. He talked bad about our leadership. Jalen Reed Mabin, NFL. Still trash. Still trash. Go always be trash. And the executive director Y' all hired, J.C. trotter. Yes. Same guy in 2000. In July 2025, he stepped away because of the turmoil that was going down with Lloyd Howe him resigning.

[James Harrison]

Yeah.

[Joe Hayden]

Said, you know what? I don't want nothing to do with this. I'm not pursuing the executive director role. I'm getting out of here. And then six, no, seven, eight months later, in March of 26, he was now elected as the director. That's crazy.

[James Harrison]

Yeah.

[Joe Hayden]

I don't want nothing to do. He goes with, like, I don't want nothing to do with this, bro. I want nothing to do with this. To. Hey, I'm back.

[James Harrison]

Right back. I'm on.

[Podcast Host]

I'm.

[Joe Hayden]

I'm ready to fight for you guys. You know what I'm saying? I'm being lying for. I'm ready to fight for the players. I'M here. No, no. You just had enough buddies. Nine, two. You just had enough buddies on the executive committee that wanted to have him in there so they can help secure their jobs. Point blank, period. The committee themselves make all the votes and nobody knows who they vote for. Yeah, because it's no record of it. The whole process is secretive and it's no transparency to it. FIFA went there 92. FIFA went there and said grass or nothing.

[James Harrison]

Grass or nothing.

[Joe Hayden]

That means no money or you won't get a chance to be put on the world stage to get coverage. Yeah, that's what they want. They want worldwide. That's what they want. That's why we got all these international games. They want more money, dude. Yeah. And this is why the NFLPA should be telling their players to save money. Because the current CBA does not end until 2030 to the end of the 2030 season. Dude, you talking about five seasons away. You should be telling your players right now, say 30 each season leading up to the end of the 30, 30 season. That'll give you five seasons. You'll save up 150 of your yearly salary so that y' all could withstand 18 months of being locked out. Yeah, because you're not getting what you want, what you deserve, unless they lose money or have the potential to lose money. This 2030 CBA that's coming up, this will be the best opportunity they'll have since the 2011 CBA when they locked us out. Yep. Trash leadership. D. Marie Smith signed. Unheard of, bruh. 10 year CBA. No major union in the history of the world have ever signed a 10 year deal as a union that long. Nobody. And then you know what he did to back that up?

[James Harrison]

What do you do to back that up? Debo?

[Joe Hayden]

In 2020, he did an 11 year.

[James Harrison]

Damn.

[Joe Hayden]

That's because he did it a year early. So they just said, hey, here we do it a year early, finish the 2020 and then jump on to this. If the NFLPA Bruh does a deal before the deadline and they don't get everything that the players deserve, they are 100 incompetent, bruh. The only way the players will get all that they deserve won't be until the NFL either loses money or misses the opportunity to make money. And that's only happening when they lock out. Yeah, bro. It's no advantage for the NFL to give in to any demands that the NFLPA has. They still got five seasons left of the OCBA under their belt right now. But they're trying to get this Deal done early. Why? Because we get the deal done early. We know we got the leadership in now. That's gonna be more for the NFL than they are for the players anyway, because they have been since 2011. And then unless the deal 100% like benefits, bro, there's no way I'm the NFL. If I'm the NFL, I got five years on my deal coming to me telling me, you want all this? You want this, this, this, this, this, this? I ain't giving you nothing. I'll wait the five years out and then I have to give it to you when it happens. FIFA came in there and said, grass or we ain't coming. They said, okay, we don't want to miss the opportunity or potential money.

[James Harrison]

It's the money for sure.

[Joe Hayden]

And then, dog, the nflpa, they go on Twitter, you go on X, you go, sorry, X, whatever you want to call it. Twitter. Okay? You go on X and Twitter and y' all say, hey, look, look what they doing? Like, what? What have y' all been doing since 2011? Like, you look exactly like what? Y' all are weak. You're crying to the public for public opinion when y' all should be filing a formal grievance. Maybe. But you can't. You can't because I just said that wasn't one of the things you fought for in the 2020 CBA was a non negotiable natural grass mandate. Yes, yes, again, FIFA grass,

[James Harrison]

because they know Debo. It's. It's like you said, it's a money thing. They really realize, end of the day turf is cheaper. And they saying that the NFL, the owners try to say that injuries are the same amount like the grass, you still get the same amount of injuries as you get on turf. All I want to tell you is anybody that ever played on turf and then you played on grass, you wake up in your joints. Grass gives. You give a little. You're able to break. It takes your cuts and all that stuff. So you get some. It feels so much better to play on grass. Just natural grass is the best thing you can play on, fall on. When you're playing on these turfs and these fields, they can go do other things. They can have concerts come in, roll it out. It's so much cheaper. The Buffalo Bills, it comes down to ownership, you understand you're going to pay for your, like, if you want to have your players out there playing on the best thing. And you know what it is? It's recognizably known. People know grass is better than Turf. So the FIFA comes in there. We're not bringing our athletes to play on anything. That's not the best. Why would you have us play on turf? We're going to play on grass or we're not coming. Then they're like this, oh, okay. We got NFL teams that are switching their turf to grass and then switching it back.

[Joe Hayden]

Then switching it back, bro.

[James Harrison]

Switching it back. That's what I'm saying. That's crazy. Like, you have to understand, it's the ownership of the logical thing to do. Like you said, nflpa, you got to get that in the contract. Obviously, they wouldn't have to switch it if they don't want to, but you have owners, Buffalo Bills building a new stadium. It's going to be natural grass. They admit it. Natural grass is better. Like, you just got to know, if you're an owner and you have this, you want to protect your investment. But at the same time, it's like you're saying, nflpa, we need to get grass in the deal. That's something for sure. But then it's really the owners if, you know, grass is better.

[Joe Hayden]

Here's the crazy thing, Joe.

[James Harrison]

What's up?

[Joe Hayden]

Atlanta, bruh. Atlanta. You got the Patriots. Dallas, bro, get Houston and oh, my

[James Harrison]

goodness, who else was it?

[Joe Hayden]

I want to say maybe Kansas City. Any way it go, you got them teams right there. You got la, all turf. They switch all switching out to grass and then putting it back.

[James Harrison]

Putting it back. It's. It's money because they. They got. They. They're running so many different events there. They're using that. That field for so many different things that they're like, if it's natural grass, it's gonna kill it. It's going to take them.

[Joe Hayden]

So if y' all really want to do that, bro, you could, you could. I remember when I played in Europe,

[James Harrison]

roll it in, roll it out, roll it in.

[Joe Hayden]

That's what it was.

[James Harrison]

It was a turf Arizona.

[Joe Hayden]

It was natural.

[James Harrison]

They rolling the whole field. They rolled it out, roll it out.

[Joe Hayden]

Arizona got that, too.

[James Harrison]

I forgot about Arizona.

[Joe Hayden]

You can use the stadium for whatever

[James Harrison]

you want, but a thousand percent now

[Joe Hayden]

still take care of it and have it all going.

[James Harrison]

Yes. It's like you got a little. Like you got a little, like a little farm that you just taking care of that field, that whole thing, you can roll it in where you need to, roll it out where you need to and set it. And it's a grass field beautifully, because I tell you, Cleveland's brown field, natural grass, it's different you love it. It's going to be. You know what you're going to get? Your feet, you're sticking. You're gonna be able to get that. It's just grass. That feeling underneath your feet. And when you're falling, it's nothing like it.

[Joe Hayden]

Hey, ain't nothing like being able to hit the ground and slide 10, 10 yards and not have all your skin off your. Off your left arm or your rider.

[James Harrison]

Yes. Them dudes, I couldn't even astroturf. Them dudes out there wearing the Jordans, wearing the literal basketball shoes.

[Joe Hayden]

You ain't got to worry about your foot getting caught in the turf. No, that foot get caught in that turf. No, all that ground go give right. It ain't gonna catch like that turf. Go catch. And how you tear everything up in your leg you need.

[James Harrison]

We gotta get. They got the natural grass. They wasn't playing soccer. Teams came in that joint not playing.

[Joe Hayden]

No, listen, listen. We don't need to be here.

[James Harrison]

Yeah.

[Joe Hayden]

We are FIFA.

[James Harrison]

We are uncle.

[Joe Hayden]

Our players are number one to us. And we will make sure they play on nothing but the best surfaces.

[James Harrison]

Yeah.

[Joe Hayden]

So you do it or we don't come nflpa. That's all y' all gotta do. But I, I probably, I mean, I, I would kind of almost guarantee they go get a deal done before this 30 for this 20, 30 deal is up because they, they have no real leadership this week. Disorganized. And I wouldn't be surprised, they do another 10 year deal. Dude, they shouldn't do another deal longer than five years. The CBA should never be any longer than five years. Turn over entirely too fast. Everything, everything entire too fast. The salary cap turns over too fast. You name it. Everything turns over entirely too fast for a 10 year deal. Don't nobody do a 10 year deal. It's not even economically sound for a union to do a 10 year deal and think it's going to help them.

[James Harrison]

Like that's too much time.

[Joe Hayden]

Unless you're trying to get a paycheck for your executive director.

[James Harrison]

Unless you sitting comfortable, though.

[Joe Hayden]

Sitting comfortable.

[James Harrison]

You want that, John? I'm on the deal as long as possible.

[Joe Hayden]

Right.

[James Harrison]

Cool.

[Joe Hayden]

Get another one. Go get another. You ain't worried about these players, man, you worried about your position. You done made it to where when we first started, each player's vote counted. They counted the number of the votes of the players, period. Now they counted just the executive committee votes. And whatever they vote, that's what happens. Yeah, it don't matter. You could, you could tell them whatever you want to do here or there. The players could tell them that. Even the reps. The reps. Not even reps. It's the executive committee. They make the move on what's gonna happen and they put each other in place. That's the crazy thing like that. None of these people are voted in. They're all voted in by a committee or the player reps. So it's already the people that's there. Like it's the good old boy system, man.

[James Harrison]

Yeah, it's your homies. We gonna get in there, man. We got. It's the office is in DC So it's up the street. I got to try to get in there and see what's going on.

[Joe Hayden]

Debo bruh, they ain't gonna let you come in there and figure out nothing, bro. I went. I went there when I retired the first time, I think the second time I can't remember.

[James Harrison]

And they ain't tell you nothing, bro.

[Joe Hayden]

And we here if you need us.

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[Joe Hayden]

Health AI presents painful thoughts I. I can't stop scratching my downtown. Yeah, but I'm not itching to go

[Martha Stewart]

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[Joe Hayden]

to talk about my downtown. Some things you'd rather type than say out loud. There's no question too embarrassing for Amazon Health AI. Chat your symptoms and get virtual care 24. 7 Healthcare just got less painful. I. I really.

[James Harrison]

I don't.

[Joe Hayden]

I don't need you. But what is it that you do? Like, you know.

[James Harrison]

Yeah, I play. Yeah, I feel. I play. I play with Shredder, I play with jc and I heard what you said, so I want. I wanna. I think I can get him on the line, so at least. Yeah, have a conversation.

[Joe Hayden]

He damn sure ain't gonna come on here with me.

[James Harrison]

No, no, for sure. I mean, I got him. I would love.

[Joe Hayden]

Yeah, get him on the line. Ask him what. What was the big thing that changed his mind, where he was. Just like, I'm so done with this. It's going. And now, you know, to now, hey, I'm the best option, and I'm gonna be here to fight for these guys like never before because I care the hell out of here, bro. You tapped out. You tapped out. And why did you tap out? Did you tap out because you thought they was about to throw you out and make you resign your way out, choke you up out of the spot?

[James Harrison]

Oh, man. That's what you want to ask them?

[Joe Hayden]

Like, really?

[James Harrison]

Okay. No, I feel you. I got it. I'm not.

[Joe Hayden]

All of a sudden, you back, everything's great. And like, dude, that whole process. Brockets. That whole process is crooked, and it is mishandled so far. It's ridiculous, bro. God damn.

[James Harrison]

Nice. The hiddenness. Debo, when you saying we used to be able to vote, Everybody had a vote. Everybody saw what's going on, and now your reps don't even have the votes. So now it's like, what does it even matter or what you're voting for? Because they gonna make decisions without you regardless. So I'm.

[Joe Hayden]

So. I'll take it back. Your reps do get a vote. So your reps are the ones that will actually vote.

[James Harrison]

Okay.

[Joe Hayden]

Your executive committee are the ones that put the people in place for you to vote for.

[James Harrison]

Yes.

[Joe Hayden]

So if they decide it's only one person, we want you to vote for it, or two people, whatever that may be. However they bring that down, put them in front of it. You know what I'm saying?

[James Harrison]

Yeah.

[Joe Hayden]

Like, I'm gonna make you. I'm gonna make you pick between A and. And. And B, which I know you don't want. So you're gonna have to go with A, like, hey, man, all y' all had to do is put me in front of the boys, let them see what they. Let them make a decision. They. They was too scared to do that. They was too scared to put me in front of.

[James Harrison]

Let everybody be on the ballot.

[Joe Hayden]

They was too scared to put me in front of the boys. But then all they had to do then, though, was control. They. They 32 player. They 32 player reps because that's who would have voted for the actual, you know, executive director for the nflpa. Like, that's. That.

[James Harrison]

That.

[Joe Hayden]

That's who would have made. That's who would have made the votes. But again, some of those dudes sitting there like, yeah, how long I'm gonna be here? I gotta get. Yeah, I gotta get into the. I gotta get into the office. How many guys you know that are actual players that are just like. Like top of the line at their position, at their skill, whatever it may be, and their. Their representatives. It's very few, bro. Yeah, don't nobody want to do it. And then it ends up a lot of the time getting given to a guy that they like, hey, yeah, here, go and do this.

[James Harrison]

Yeah.

[Joe Hayden]

And he's like, you know what? Yeah, okay, cool. He think it's gonna keep him around. It'll keep him around a little bit. But you still got to be on the team just to be a representative. To be a representative. So if you ain't on the team now, that's where you got to get into the upper rankings. You got to become president and all that other stuff.

[James Harrison]

You gotta. You got.

[Joe Hayden]

You gotta get a higher position. So that's where all the a. I'm gonna vote for you this and that. Then when my time come, you vote for me to get me in here.

[James Harrison]

See that, that, that. It gets like. It sounds real politicish. Oh, I mean, that's the whole thing. It's kind of like.

[Joe Hayden]

It's good old boys, clicky.

[James Harrison]

Good old boys cliquey is what we don't like. Because that is not. When you're protecting the athletes, you're protecting yourself, and you are. There's too much turnaround in the NFL for you to be trying to. You shouldn't be able to. I mean, you. You can be there for a while if you have the good intent, but you need to be able to have people that are voting on it, being able to see what's going on, keeping it open to literally the process of helping the players. Because the more and more it starts making it about self and how people can get themselves and keep their jobs and positions.

[Joe Hayden]

Gene Upshaw passed away. It has not been that.

[James Harrison]

I feel you, Deebo, but I'm just saying, just from listening to you, you give it more of the perspective. Because I didn't. I wasn't. Oh, I wasn't really. I didn't pay attention too much. I should have, because I'm. While I was in it, just playing, you know what I'm saying? Like, trying to get my job done. Nflpa, that's fine. Like, listening to my benefits, but I wasn't as listening as I needed to be 1000%. So when I listened to you, you know, way more about it and how they got in it. And now with keeping their own positions, keeping their jobs is real. You would think that it's not like that because you're like, oh, no. NFLPA all you hear, nflpa. We're here for you. Like all of the meetings and stuff. But then when you really say like this, what do you really know? You know what I'm saying? Like, how much are we really able to make a change or make decisions? Not that much.

[Joe Hayden]

Listen, man, the devil looked like the devil. You'd never make a deal with him, would you?

[James Harrison]

No, you're correct. You'll run. So that will look exactly. Looking just like what you like that

[Joe Hayden]

would look like, like, like, like what you thought he was supposed to look like. You wouldn't do no deals with him.

[James Harrison]

No. Got tricked. Got to be more careful.

[Joe Hayden]

NFL.com ranks the top 10 most complete NFL rosters for 2026. What do they mean by most complete? They got Rams, one Seattle Eagles, Ravens, Bills, Lions, Lions, Broncos, 49ers, Texas and Patriots.

[James Harrison]

You know, a top 10 Debo, it's full NFL rosters. I'm going, you gotta hate, you gotta. I'm saying you got to be good at everything. Not, maybe not great, but you got to have a solid offense, quarterback, you got to have a good defense and you got to have a special teams. I think if you don't have a quarterback on your team, you can't be complete roster. So it starts off with legitimately, if you have a complete roster, you got to have a quarterback on your team.

[Joe Hayden]

Well, yeah, that's number one. So I mean, I'm not tripping that we not on the rosters.

[James Harrison]

That's, I mean, that's why when I, I was trying to look and see

[Joe Hayden]

why not have a franchise quarterback, why

[James Harrison]

the Steelers are on the roster. I knew why my Browns weren't going to be on the roster. I'm like, okay, they did my dogs. I know how they'd be looking crazy. They're not in the top 10. Understand. Steelers not on here. I'm like, everywhere but the quarterback position. I don't see how they couldn't say that we couldn't be one of the most complete rosters. But the quarterback position is the main reason that people are on it. So you got to look at it. I'm like, okay, Matthew Stafford, Rams, solid defense team, receivers, special teams. If you want to go roster, I will go coach too. Like you want to put the coach in there. That's a little, that's a full scale team. You got your quarterback, you got your defense, you got your receivers, you got your special.

[Joe Hayden]

I ain't tripping on the placement of one and two.

[James Harrison]

Okay, Boom.

[Joe Hayden]

I'm not tripping on that we go Eagles and they say Eagles, Ravens, and then the Bills and the Lions.

[James Harrison]

I mean, yes, I'm their rosters. They, you gotta have the quarterback, offense, defense, quarterback, Ravens.

[Joe Hayden]

That's what I'm trying to figure out. Are we talking about like the most complete roster?

[James Harrison]

Yes.

[Joe Hayden]

Barring no actual play.

[James Harrison]

Barring no actual play. Deebo, all of this stuff that we get to talk about right now is since what acquisitions they got, who they got on their team, and if their team stays healthy and plays the best that they can together, we're assuming everybody's healthy, we're assuming everybody that they got. If we're assuming that the rosters are going to work out for what they got,

[Joe Hayden]

assuming this is going to work out for what they got. I don't, I don't know how See

[James Harrison]

if I'm say this. If Aaron Rodgers, Aaron Rodgers is on. If Aaron Rodgers is on our team. If Aaron Rogers on the Steelers, I'm liking us on the complete roster. I'm liking us on this list for show. You can't tell me where we could be up there. I like us over the Ravens. I like us right around like we could, we could be three, bro.

[Joe Hayden]

I'm trying to figure this out because I, I ain't gonna lie, I'm a little lost. Is this like teams that could possibly win a championship or. It's just, just I got a team and I have all the positions filled with high ranking names and like rated guys or whatever it is, like, because right now the Eagles, I'm questioning the Ravens, I'm questioning the Bills, I'm questioning the Lions, I'm questioning. And the Broncos, y' all got them at seven. They gotta come up, bro. Like Josh Allen is the biggest issue. Why damn, Buffalo shouldn't be at 5. He Getting to those. Well, besides him having to run into Patrick Mahomes all those times he get into the playoffs and he turned over at the wrong times. Yeah, Mark Jackson, they shouldn't be that high either. He the same thing. He is a turnover machine in the playoffs. That man got seven interceptions and a couple lost fumbles in just eight playoff games and he's only three and five in them.

[James Harrison]

How you put the field goal miss was not on him. Andrews dropping the ball was not on him.

[Joe Hayden]

I understand what you're saying, bro. I understand what you're saying. So he's 4 and 5 then with, with, with. Well, sorry, he'll be. Yeah, he'll be four. He'll.

[James Harrison]

He, he be.

[Joe Hayden]

He'd be four and three and four and Three or four and four. Sorry. He'd be four and four. Still has seven interceptions. Still have. Like, what are we talking about, man? What?

[James Harrison]

That just. You said we want. We want to make more excuses for

[Joe Hayden]

Lamar than a little bit when the time comes, bro.

[James Harrison]

I'm not trying to make excuses for

[Joe Hayden]

Lamar and then Philly. We don't even know what they doing, man. I don't know how they. I don't know what they got going over there, man. The. The office is. I don't know what's going on with the offense. Didn't they miss the playoffs?

[James Harrison]

Eagles.

[Joe Hayden]

You got Denver all the way down there, bruh. Denver.

[James Harrison]

Denver. Denver's definitely better.

[Joe Hayden]

And the quarterback was hurt when they lost and they still almost won.

[James Harrison]

Nah, for sure. Denver. Denver could step up. Denver could step up. I like the 1 and 2 Eagles. Ravens. I think they're. They're. They're too high. They are too high.

[Joe Hayden]

Yes.

[James Harrison]

The Patriots.

[Joe Hayden]

Lying. I ain't gonna lie. I think. I think might. Might be a. Might might be a little low, but maybe a spot or two up. I just, I don't like. They ain't. They couldn't, you know, really come up with too much offense in the playoffs, you know? And like the Lions, bruh, they've been. They've been dropping like, each. Each year. They, they, they, they. They seem to fall off a little more.

[James Harrison]

They lost Montgomery, but they still got.

[Joe Hayden]

They broke. And they just broke their one two punch, bro.

[James Harrison]

Did they think they signed it back? But they got. They still got Gibbs. They still.

[Joe Hayden]

The center just retired. Who.

[James Harrison]

Yeah.

[Joe Hayden]

I don't even know how they had six. Did they make the playoffs? I don't remember. Yeah, they didn't even make the playoffs. Like, what. Where is this coming from, bro?

[James Harrison]

They believing in the coach. Golf, My young bull. The receiver. The other one that takes it up top Skinny Williams, James,

[Joe Hayden]

Bruh. I don't know who made this list. I don't. I don't. I'm not too sure about this list. Like, see what.

[James Harrison]

Houston.

[Joe Hayden]

I could get Houston.

[James Harrison]

Houston.

[Joe Hayden]

I ain't tripping. I ain't tripping on them being where they at because of the offer.

[James Harrison]

So you're just saying the Bills. Bills and Ravens are too high.

[Joe Hayden]

The Bills, the Ravens and the Eagles and the Lions. Lions shouldn't even be on there.

[James Harrison]

Okay, I'm with you.

[Joe Hayden]

Like, it's no way. They should be on there, bro.

[James Harrison]

Still is. Once you get the. Once we get our quarterback, our roster is looking nice, so we'll be able to be solid. The Only reason why I was saying,

[Joe Hayden]

man, listen, I ain't talking about once we get a quarterback. We just need to see what we got first before we start talking about.

[James Harrison]

We do know.

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[James Harrison]

That's what I'm saying. Once the people know. Once the people know. Once. Once he gets some. Once they get some snaps.

[Joe Hayden]

You need some, right? You need something. You can't.

[James Harrison]

You can't just say they're nice if they haven't played. No credit yet. No credit.

[Joe Hayden]

True, True. Hey, I ain't gonna lie to you, man. That's a. That's. That's a. That's a true statement.

[James Harrison]

Because you got to build some equity, bro.

[Joe Hayden]

You got. Right? You got to build, like. And that's the thing. And that's why we have no. No real trust. And.

[James Harrison]

And.

[Joe Hayden]

And Rudolph, man, like, he done built. He lost a lot of equity watching him play.

[James Harrison]

And he said in the game, he's had time. He's had time.

[Joe Hayden]

Had way more than enough time, bro. Eight years. Eight years. I believe so.

[James Harrison]

But, like, look. But that's why the younger guys. Shador and my fact, this is going to be only his second year. Will Howard only his second year. Drew allergic. First year. Young dudes, they're going to have to get their bumps and bruises somehow. They're going to have to get out there and learn, like, the first year. You can't be as confident to go tell other dudes what to do and where to go if you don't know yourself what to do or where to go fully. You know what I'm saying?

[Joe Hayden]

I got you, so I got you.

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[James Harrison]

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[James Harrison]

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[Podcast Host]

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[James Harrison]

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[Joe Hayden]

What?

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[Joe Hayden]

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[Joe Hayden]

Welcome to the history books.

[James Harrison]

New home, same family. Your BET favorites are now on Paramount Plus subscribe now.

[Podcast Host]

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[Podcast Host]

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