Deebo & Joe - Part 2: Josh Cribbs on Shedeur Sanders, Infamous James Harrison Hit & Kent State Stories

Summary

Club Shay Shay: Deebo & Joe - Part 2

Episode: Josh Cribbs on Shedeur Sanders, Infamous James Harrison Hit & Kent State Stories
Date: May 11, 2026
Host: Shannon Sharpe (Shay Shay Media & Playmaker)
Guests: Josh Cribbs, James Harrison (Deebo), Joe (likely Joe Thomas), Chris (likely Chris Carter)

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Episode Overview

This episode of Club Shay Shay reunites NFL legends—chiefly Josh Cribbs and James Harrison—with host Shannon Sharpe and other football friends to dig into raw and entertaining stories from their careers. The conversation runs from infamous on-field collisions (especially Harrison’s controversial hits), life at Kent State and early NFL days, the behind-the-scenes of team dynamics, through to hot takes on the Cleveland Browns’ quarterback controversy involving Shedeur Sanders and Deshaun Watson. The tone is candid, humorous, deeply personal, and rich in locker room camaraderie.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. James Harrison’s Notorious Hitting and Its Impact

• On-field Physicality:
  • Josh Cribbs and guests recount James Harrison’s ruthless approach—both in games and practice.
  • Harrison’s infamous hit on Cribbs and Mohamed Massaquoi is discussed in detail, both the pain it caused and the controversy around how teammates and even families reacted.
• Locker Room & Off-Field Fallout:
  • Cribbs jokes his wife and others wanted him to confront Harrison about the hit.
  • Quote: “His mom, his mom hit him like he was 10 years old. Like right in the back of the soft spot of the head.” — James Harrison (04:18)
• Pro Bowl Stories:
  • Harrison describes being a lone wolf, skipping the Pro Bowl festivities and sticking to business, illustrating his distinct mentality as a player.
  • Quote: “Mean as hell. Just... nobody. He's a loner at that.” – Chris (06:01)

2. Infamous Game Hits and Concussions

• Cribbs and others recall being knocked out of play after Harrison’s hits—raw, unfiltered discussion about concussions, anger symptoms, and memory loss.
• Quote: “In the symptoms of a concussion, it's obviously forgetting. One thing that's high among players... is anger.” – James Harrison (08:51)
• Humorous retelling of how hurt players were lost in the showers, not remembering where or why they were there.
• Quote: “We both got hit... We in the showers. The game is going on now. So I'm mad, bro. Which is a symptom.” – James Harrison (09:12)

3. Kent State Days: Legendary, Wild Stories

• Recruitment & Partying Tales:
  • Stories about taking recruits to meet Harrison, resulting in wild episodes with hard liquor (151 proof) and even joking about revolvers to “encourage” newcomers.
  • Harrison and Joe debate the true version of the “151 story,” each embellishing aspects for comedic effect.
  • Quote: “Allegedly, right? Yes. So we walk in there with the young recruit, still in high school, you know, in the choir. Never tasted a lick of alcohol before.” – James Harrison (12:12)
• High School Legend & Scandal:
  • Harrison’s time at Archbishop Hoban becomes almost mythical. Rumors and stories persist at the school, with staff reluctant to discuss “the incident” that led to his departure.
  • Harrison details a fight over a discovered journal, leading to his expulsion.
    • Quote: “I hit him so hard. And it was... the chapel was right next door... the priest came out.” – Joe (23:00)
• Reflection: Both Harrison and Cribbs discuss missed opportunities and lost scholarships due to off-field behavior.

4. AFC North Battles & Team Dynamics

• The guests contextualize the Pittsburgh Steelers’ and Cleveland Browns’ fierce rivalry during the 2000s, the strength of the division, and the challenge of making the playoffs.
• Quote: “You guys... had Hall of Famers on offense and defense. That’s just facts.” – James Harrison (27:37)
• Stories of winning and losing in freezing temperatures, ingrained traditions like fines for wearing sleeves, and the psychological and physical challenges of AFC North football.
• Quote: “Coldest game I ever played in my life, bruh.” – Joe (36:17)

5. Special Teams & Underdog Mentality

• Cribbs describes how his underdog roots as a free agent shaped his attitude, driving his deep engagement with the Cleveland community.
• Quote: “Just two spots. It was thirty guys... So just looking at how I made the team, you know, blue collar, like, ground up.” – Cribbs (32:58)

6. Quarterback Debate: Shedeur Sanders vs. Deshaun Watson

• The Browns’ QB battle is dissected: Cribbs leans toward Shedeur, valuing potential and the desire for a united fan base, but also considers salary and business implications for Watson.
• In-depth discussion about what the fanbase wants, coaching philosophies, and whether preseason snaps signal a winner.
• Quote: “For me, you can't judge the type of quarterback Shedeur is from practice. It's when the lights cut on.” – James Harrison (40:19)
• Strategic angle: Cribbs offers that Watson’s value could be built up and traded if needed, but recognizes the battle will stay tight-lipped until late.

7. Changing NFL Rules – Defensive Frustrations

• Harrison shares his struggle adapting to new “no headshots” NFL rules, emphasizing how difficult the job became and how fines stacked up regardless of intent.
• Quote: “When I went into meet with Roger Goodell... I said, if I go to tackle a guy... at the last second... he bent his whole body in half and put his head down there and I hit his helmet. That's on me.” — Joe (38:49)

8. Super Chats & Fan Interactions

• Fans engage with questions about special teams’ importance, new players like Drew Aller, and playful jabs about team loyalties and legacies.
• Cribbs underscores that special teams’ excellence is vital for championship teams (“a no brainer”).
• Quote: “Special teams can change a game... all you need is the superior special teams, and they could change the play in one game.” – Cribbs (57:24)
• Endearing banter about the meaning of “true blue” and brotherhood among players.

9. Memorable Closing & Hall of Fame Praise

• Joe and Chris call for Cribbs to be considered a Hall of Famer, comparing his legacy as a returner to elite QBs who never won rings.
• Quote: “You are that as a returner in this game... I really hope you make it to the Hall, man.” — Joe (54:11)

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Notable Quotes & Timestamps

• “His mom hit him like he was 10 years old.” — James Harrison [04:18]
• “We both got hit... the game is going on now. So I'm mad, bro. Which is a symptom.” — James Harrison [09:12]
• “You don't want your linebacker to be friendly... mean as hell.” — Chris [06:01]
• “A life or death situation... you gotta do that right now.” — James Harrison (on rookie drinking story) [24:30]
• “The AFC North consisted of teams that... even when a team went 10-6, they still couldn't go to the playoffs.” — James Harrison [27:37]
• “For me, you can't judge the type of quarterback Shedeur is from practice. It's when the lights cut on.” — James Harrison [40:19]
• “Special teams can change a game... and they could change the play in one game.” — Cribbs [57:24]
• “I really hope you make it to the Hall, man.” — Joe [54:11]

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Timestamps for Major Segments

| Timestamp | Segment / Highlight | |-----------|---------------------------------------------------------| | 03:06 | James Harrison’s hits on Cribbs & fallout | | 06:00 | Pro Bowl experiences, Harrison’s “lone wolf” demeanor | | 08:51 | Effects of concussions, angry showers story | | 12:11 | Recruit party/151 story (Kent State lore) | | 17:20 | The “incident” at Hoban High and school legacy | | 27:37 | AFC North division strength in NFL | | 36:17 | The coldest game ever played (NFL/NFLPA implications) | | 40:03 | Browns' QB debate: Shedeur Sanders vs. Deshaun Watson | | 52:19 | Discussion on quarterbacks’ future and team strategy | | 54:11 | Hall of Fame praise for Cribbs | | 57:24 | Special teams’ role in championship football |

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Memorable Moments

• Harrison describing Cribbs' mom’s reaction after the hit, blurring pain with humor.
• The “151 and revolver” recruit initiation tale—an urban legend on the wild side of college football.
• Open reflections about the brotherhood—even after violent on-field collisions.
• No-nonsense debate on the Browns’ stubborn search for a true franchise quarterback.
• Honest, sometimes self-deprecating wisdom about life lessons from off-field mistakes.
• Candid hall-of-fame-level acknowledgment and respect exchanged among the panel.

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The Conversation’s Tone & Style

• Raw, unfiltered, and deeply personal.
• Surprising humor—even when discussing violence, pain, or NFL politics.
• No-nonsense honesty about the game’s toll, the struggles of underdogs, and the realities of football business.
• Continual reminders of mutual respect and fraternity beneath the tough talk.

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This episode offers classic sports storytelling—myths, legends, locker room banter, and hard-learned wisdom—with an insider’s view of NFL life, Browns/Steelers rivalries, and what it takes to go from cut days to Sundays.

Transcript

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[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

That boy exaggerator, man.

[James Harrison]

So look, let me tell you this. Because of that, he would hit me not only in practice, but just like that for the Browns. Like, no, no. Like, I' ma just, you know, a nice form tackle. That's my teammate. That's my former teammate, my quarterback. Let me go ahead and take him to the ground. No, he has to give me a concussion. He has to give me eliminated from the game. I'm like, bro, cribs, brother, man, don't

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

bring this on here no more.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

No, no. Is that the Cribs?

[James Harrison]

No, no, I ain't done.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

No, you ain't done.

[James Harrison]

Go ahead, Chris, let him have it.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Let him have it.

[James Harrison]

So, people, I was even looking in the comments when I was coming on the show, people was like, hey, crib still cool with James? Like after he be hitting him? Cause that's the same thing. Look, my wife be like, hey, man, do you reach out or you won't reach out to him and tell him like, hey, like the hit was. That wasn't cool. Like, we teammates, people really upset. Like, man, that's your teammate. But James, hey, do you remember what your mom did after that hit, man?

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I don't remember what you talking about. My mom ain't do that, man.

[James Harrison]

Yeah, see, he already know, man.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

He exaggerate, man.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Truth telling, Chris, what you do?

[James Harrison]

His mom, his mom hit him like he was 10 years old. Like he like he did something wrong at school. Like right in the back of the soft spot of the head. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Right in the scoop.

[James Harrison]

Yeah, right there, right there. And then I gave his mother a hug and looked at him like, yeah,

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

that's cause he can't listen, man. He came over there looking like a lost, lost puppy. And you know what I'm saying?

[James Harrison]

Looking like his mom was like, he

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

getting all the fake.

[James Harrison]

His mom was like, come here, baby. And then smacked him on the head. I was like, I know Right? I was like, yeah. I reached out to his mom.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

You remember what you told me? You remember what you told me about Master Quiet? You was like, shit, I ain't. I'm good. He was like. He was like, man, Master Quiet, man. He's still messed up. He don't know where he at.

[Public Investing Sponsor]

Right?

[James Harrison]

See, bruh, Cribs, we was in the. You, I think. Hold up. Was you there yet on the team?

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Crips, Cribs, Cribs, Cribs. This was my rookie season. And this is why I told Deebo, you. You got. When he put you down, that made me. I was your backup returner. And that's when I got back at kickoff return. And they spun my ass around, too. They was hitting out there.

[James Harrison]

Hey, you seen how I was getting hit? You was like, what you mean? I'm there. What you mean? Cribs, hold up. Cribs out. Oh, hell. And you was looking at coach like, me, bro. You mean me, bro.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

It was me. They hit your man, Deebo. It was me. Well, you got hit Massaqua, and then he hit Colt in the same jones.

[James Harrison]

Yeah, so?

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

No, I hit Colton the other game. It was a different game.

[James Harrison]

Nah, it was. It was. It was me and Massacre because, okay, people would talk about the hits, right? And I'm gonna tell you about the hit, like, everything that you expect from a linebacker. J. Bo James, you were. You were it. You were the. The antithesis to an offense.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yes.

[James Harrison]

Like, he was the prototype. You don't want your linebacker to be friendly and, you know, y' all hanging out and, you know, going to the store.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Yes.

[James Harrison]

He was the prototype. Like, mean as hell. Just, you know, nobody. He's a loner at that. We ended up. We had the Pro Bowl. He ain't want to come out his room. We, like, man, we in Hawaii. You remember that, James? We had the Pro bowl, bro.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Hey, he ain't even. That was my first one.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

That was your first one. He ain't one.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I knew the protocol, what they was gonna do if I came down to that bar. You know, the rookies, they go, hit your tab. They go put it on your room. I had to stay.

[James Harrison]

I had to stay out the way, bro. Like, ain't want to be friends with nobody. I'm like, bro, like, we having fun, bro. We just. It's a luau out there. Our families are out there. It was like a reunion between our two families. And he and I went up to his room. He in there, like, looking at TV like a 7 o' clock and I'm like, bro, we. We outside at the pool, bro. And he like, nah, man. Like, basically like, that's for y' all suckers, man.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

That was 2007, right? Yeah, that was. Listen, that was my first Pro Bowl. What I did not know is the Pro bowl wasn't a game. No, no. So listen, I get to practice, bro. And I got. I got. I got Ray and Ed there. And, you know, okay, we going. We moving. Da, da, da. And they like, damn, baby, what's wrong? Slow down, man. What you doing? Slow down. I'm like, what you mean, slow down? I'm trying to. What you mean? I'm like, all right. So they don't take it. They don't. They don't go hard in practice, right? Like, all right, cool.

[James Harrison]

Whatever.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Whatever. We get into the game, right? And it's kickoff. I'm gonna kick off. Wow. Fire off from Jason on Jason Wynton, I think Cowboys, right?

[James Harrison]

Yeah.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I get to the sideline, the boy say, oh, my God. What the hell did he do to you, man? Why did you hit him like that? I said, man, I'm playing football. What y' all talking about?

[James Harrison]

Yeah, everybody's about to start quitting. It's like, well, like, nah, man. James, the Steelers. Yeah, he out there hitting, man. Somebody go talk to him. Cause look, that was the same year. Look, we on the same squad. And I don't know if you remember Ray Lewis, he brought my ties to our meeting. And that was when I knew it wasn't a game. Like, it wasn't gonna be like, you know, hitting her. You know, it was gonna be fun. Supposed to be when Ray Lewis ordered my ties for the meeting, but this guy didn't want to have fun. And I'm gonna take it back to, you know, our game when we. When he put out me and Massacoy. Yes, we was. Look. So, you know, in the symptoms of a concussion, it's obviously forgetting. And one thing that's high among players. Cause they wanna play is anger.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Yeah.

[James Harrison]

And I was like, so I'm in the showers mad, like. Like, I had a whole package in running the wildcat, and I can't play no more. So I'm in there angry. And Massacoy got hit so hard, he ain't know what he was doing in the shower. He was like, I ain't going, bro. And this my dog, bro. I was mad at him for asking me.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

I love Massaqua.

[James Harrison]

He's the. I love him. I was asking him. I was mad for him asking me. So hold On. So we both got hit. And I was. So I responded like, bro, we in the showers. The game is going on now. Like, what do you mean? So I'm mad, bro. Which is a symptom.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Yes.

[James Harrison]

And he looking up like, what are we doing in here? Yeah, he got.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

You got symptoms of anger. He got symptoms of memory loss.

[James Harrison]

Both of us. Yeah, we both in the product getting hit by this guy.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

See?

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yeah, but look, cribs, I think. Do you choose. You choose loyalty or over anger when it comes to Deebo? Because end of the day, you know, it's a game. You know, it's football. You know, he was doing what?

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

His job.

[James Harrison]

Was he doing his job? Okay, that's his job. So even though.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Hey, listen.

[James Harrison]

Even though people hated him, even for the. Like, they hated him. They like, oh, man, he's a. You know, he's low, below the belt. This. And I'm like, man, that's what you want your linebacker to do. Like, you want your linebacker to hit, man. That's football, man.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Appreciate it. Appreciate it, brother.

[James Harrison]

I appreciate it. It ain't no. Because, look, people don't realize he played for Kent and Roethlisberger played for Miami of Ohio. If you show him what he did to Roethlisberger, people would feel different. Now, he sacked Roethlisberger. Not regularly. He ran up, hit him from the back and then suplexed him and then flipped him behind his shoulders and made him fall on his head. Like. He grabbed him, bro. And then did a suplex, bruh. Put him on his head, bro.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I didn't suplex him. I went to the side. Not over my back, bro.

[James Harrison]

You went like this. No, I got the highlight, bro.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Exaggerate, man.

[James Harrison]

He ran up on him.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

He got the film.

[James Harrison]

Chris got the film. Because, look, Ben is tough to bring down. So. So he was like, okay.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

He wants.

[James Harrison]

Yeah, yeah, you got. You got to look at that again, bro. And I gotta look at it again. I'm gonna tell. I'm gonna tell this alleged story.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

And it's a recruiter Myron Wyler story.

[James Harrison]

No, it's a recruiting story.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Oh, okay, okay, okay.

[James Harrison]

Cause, you know, we used to recruit and we used to bring certain players over to guys house to meet them, and we made a mistake, Joe. And brought a recruit to Jaaybo.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Yes.

[James Harrison]

And it was just like a pre. Before we hang out. Yeah. So alleged. And I'm allegedly an eyewitness. I'm saying all this so we can. We can. I'm giving him cover. So this may or may not happen. Right. But we know it happened. But maybe. Allegedly, right? Yes. So we walk in there with the young recruit, still in high school, you know, in the choir. Never tasted a lick of alcohol before.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

For sure.

[James Harrison]

We about to take him out to show him a good time and show him, hey, Kent State has a lot to offer. We gonna stop past one of our, you know, our star linebackers, you know, place let you meet him. We get in the spot. Jaaybo sitting at a round table, bro. He's sitting at the table. We like, yeah, this Such and such. And he told him he slammed a bottle, a glass shot. A shot glass on the table.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Bang.

[James Harrison]

Yeah. He was like, take a shot. We like, what? Like. And we laughing. And he put.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Oh, he missing the story. He messing the story up.

[James Harrison]

151. 151.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Oh, my God.

[James Harrison]

151.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I'll tell you.

[James Harrison]

And he told me, I'll let him finish.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I'll tell you the story.

[James Harrison]

Get some hair on. Get some hair under your arms. Young butt. Get some hair under your arms. You ready for division one? Get some hair under your arms. He like, we like, take a shot and we like, yeah, man, he don't drink, man. Yeah, yeah, he don't drink. And. Hold on, man, let me get. I ain't gonna mess my story up. Y' all still got me?

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yeah, I got you.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

All right.

[James Harrison]

So the guy we. We like, man. He don't drink. He pulled out a revolver, who Allegedly.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Allegedly.

[James Harrison]

And slams it on the table. Boom. No, you gonna drink. And we like, hey, yeah, you gotta drink that.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

You got.

[James Harrison]

I know you don't drink, but you gotta drink that. So the young buck. The young buck take he 151, and he kinda starts weeping a little bit. We like, all right, Jaybo. We just wanna introduce ourselves to him and the youth, and we just gonna head out.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Yeah.

[James Harrison]

Took him out of there. We like, man, we can't bring no recruits over here no more. Ain't nobody gonna come here.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Ain't nobody gonna come there.

[James Harrison]

151, bro. For the first time, his first three.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Listen, listen.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

I tell you.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Stop, stop.

[James Harrison]

Witness like Peter Paul.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I'm gonna tell you. I'm gonna tell you the truth for the story. Listen, listen, listen. I'm gonna tell you.

[James Harrison]

Allegedly.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Sit back, sit back. I'm gonna tell you the real story. Okay? He got it messed up. He got it messed up. I'm listening. So I was a little different back then.

[James Harrison]

Yeah, for sure.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Okay.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I was something different.

[James Harrison]

That's an understanding

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

now. So this is what happened the Recruit had nothing to do with that. He just happened to be there. The person that wanted the drink was, dude, Myron Waller. That's who you're talking about.

[James Harrison]

Okay?

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

So I'm sitting there and I got a fifth and a pint. I used to drink so heavy back then, that's what it took me to get a buzz.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Oh, my goodness. Okay.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Myron is.

[James Harrison]

You see the monster we was dealing with, Joe? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Listen, listen, listen. So Myron is sitting there like, yo, deebo Jaebo, let me get a drink. Let me get a drink. I'm like, no, man, I need all this to drink. I need all this, man. So finally, I'm trying to drink. To hell with it. Red solo cup, right? I take the red Solo cup and I pour him a shot. But I pour my shot, so the shot is like that big. And I say, all right, here you go, man. Drink it. He say, I can't drink all that. I say, what you mean you can't drink all that? You done sat here and begged me for this shit. And you telling me you can't drink all that? Nah, nah, J. Bo. I can't drink all that, man. I can't drink all that at one time. I said, well, could you drink it if your life depended on it? He said, yeah.

[James Harrison]

I said, that's even worse now, that Crips.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

And he drank it.

[James Harrison]

You. Oh, okay. And I told the PG13 story.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

It wasn't EPG. You was P. Then he went straight.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

It wasn't a recruit. I'm just tell you this real.

[James Harrison]

He turned it into a documentary.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

You know, that's that. Like I said, I was. I was.

[James Harrison]

I was unsolved mystery back then. Hey, and that wasn't. That was just a tip. That was just a. You know. You see what type of guy he was feared.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yeah.

[James Harrison]

So we stayed clear of him, Joe.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Hey, you know, I lost a bunch of scholarships off of who I was back then, Joe. I could have went anywhere, Joe. I could have went. Real talk. I could have went anywhere.

[James Harrison]

Yeah, he could have. Hey, look. Hey, Joe. My son goes to his old high school in Akron.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Hoban.

[James Harrison]

Yeah, yeah. My son go there and they. They tell stories of him like I

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

was only there my freshman year.

[James Harrison]

Legend, like, fictitious. They. They like, oh, James. James Harrison. Yeah. Yeah.

[DirecTV Advertiser]

Oh, yeah.

[James Harrison]

He went here for a hot minute, and then it was. And then to that incident, I was like. The incident. I was like, what you mean? They was like, oh, we don't talk about that no more. That's what they Said we don't. They were looking around like, we don't really talk about that no more. Just tell your son he gonna have a good education here. He gonna play football. I was like, james, we're here for real. I was like, I ain't know. You know, we went to college and we played. He was like, yeah. I was like, so what happened? Nothing. I mean, we just going. And they wouldn't tell me what happened.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

You wanna know what happened?

[James Harrison]

Nah, Nah, we gotta say that for the next show for show for show.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

This is what happened. So my freshman year, it was me and my dude, Wayne. Wayne. Wayne Humphrey. So we was playing ball. Whatever. Da, da, da. So Wayne got a hold of a. A diary, a journal. A dude had a journal, okay? And in this dude's journal, this is a private Catholic school. He's talking about how they doing all these drugs and all this sex and all this stuff, right? And dude is a senior at the time. So Wayne has it. I look at it, we read through it, whatever. Da, da, da. Laughing, whatever. Yeah. He goes somewhere else with it. He shows a bunch of other people. It gets back that I have the book, or we had the book, whatever. I'm like, listen, I ain't got the book, bro. And I don't know who got it because I, you know, I ain't no snitch. I don't know.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yeah, my name.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Don't press me. Don't press. Go ahead, right? So he goes away. He comes back like three days later, and he presses me right before homeroom. Everybody's out there, bro. Everybody's out there. I know you got the book. They already told me. Da, da, da, da, da, da, da da. All this. I'm like, dude, I told you I ain't got the book. So go ahead and get out my face. He says something and I. I go to swing on him, and dude grabs me. My. Dude grabbed me. I'm like, all right, cool. I'm like, I ain't gonna hit him. Blah, blah, blah. Let me go. Bell rings. We about to go to homeroom, right? So as I go to walk, he done pulled me back.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Oh.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I'm like, yo, I got. I gotta walk, like, towards him. And he's like, no, no, no. I'm like, I gotta go that way. My homeroom is that way, bro. I gotta go that way. And bruh, as I'm walking, I get like two feet from this dude, maybe four. And he goes, yeah, that's what I thought. And I just let loose. Bang. He fall into the classroom. Dude, I jump up over top of

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[James Harrison]

Hello?

[Malcolm Glabel]

Hello, this is Malcolm Glabel from Smart talks with IBM. Today we're diving into a fascinating conversation with Stefano Pallard, head of Fan development for Scuderia Ferrari hp.

[Stefano Pallard]

Your pronunciation is strongly American. It's more Scuderia Ferrari.

[Malcolm Glabel]

I'm still working on rolling my R's, but what I was able to learn from Stefano was the importance of engaging the Tifosi the Ferrari superfans in the digital age.

[Stefano Pallard]

Ferrari fans and super fans want to be part of something, want to belong to something. So they want to be part of a community and ultimately they want to be part of a winning team.

[Malcolm Glabel]

You've got Ferrari, which has a long history, design history, and now you're interacting in a kind of digital space. I'm curious how you balance those two traditions.

[Stefano Pallard]

When it comes to fan engagement, it's really digital technology and digital channels are being able to create a deeper connection with our fans.

[Malcolm Glabel]

To learn more about how Ferrari and IBM are using technology to build deeper connections with fans, visit IBM.comferrari

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[Podcast Host]

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[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Give him some more.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Don't grab me again. He already out he sleep. I knocked out his molar, bro. I hit him so hard.

[James Harrison]

And it was. I hear it was a church right next door. The chapel was right next door. So the priest come out and it was the ladies and take him to

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

the hospital and everything, bro. I tried, bro. I tried. I tried. I tried to give him everything I had, bro. I don't know what he thought. He thought. He thought it was something sweet because I was a freshman, bro. That wasn't even happening, bro.

[James Harrison]

A different breed.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Joe, listen, don't lie on me, bro.

[James Harrison]

I'm just told you I didn't have.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

The one thing he's not doing is lying on you.

[James Harrison]

Maybe I don't take it to the level at which he's taking it for sure. I'm trying to tell a story that can be that kids can learn a lesson.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Maybe you learned the lesson, man. Hey, I'mma saved, man.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Hey, cribs, this is the lesson I learned. You got to understand where not to take the recruits. I'm like, you already know. Don't go over the debo crib for

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

a show that wasn't even it, dude. It had nothing to do with the recruit. He's saying that right now. The recruit just happened to be there.

[James Harrison]

Okay, yeah.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

When you saw that. Go on.

[James Harrison]

Maybe we just happened to be there. You know what? That's what it was. Y' all had Y' all own thing already going on.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Yes.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

And y' all just walked over.

[James Harrison]

We came over upperclassmen, you know. Yeah. You know, I'm the qb. I go to my. The linebacker, you know. Yeah.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

I go to my man's jones.

[James Harrison]

I'm thinking, this ought to be all cool.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Yeah, it was cool until he started asking me for a drink. And I'm like, dude, I need all this.

[James Harrison]

A life or death situation in his. Life or death, Joe. It's life or death for all of us. We all felt like, hey, bro, you gotta do that right now.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

I go over there for a pregame, I leave fighting for my life. I don't know.

[James Harrison]

Yes, bro.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I swear, man. Y', all, y', all, y', all, y'. All. Y' all some work around here, man.

[James Harrison]

Hey, look, when he did that, I was like, what's the number to campus security again? In my head, like. Like, man,

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

hold up. What's the number to nine one, one?

[James Harrison]

Yeah, bro, I lost, bro. I couldn't think of nothing. The thoughts just left my mind. I'm like, what do we do in case of emergency?

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I wouldn't go kill him, but I knew that was gonna get him to drink it. You know what I'm saying?

[James Harrison]

Oh, you had all of us straight.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Oh, my God. Had y' all boy scared straight in there.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Yeah, bruh, listen, I knew we shouldn't have had him. I knew.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

I was thinking in my head, I

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

wonder how much he actually remembered asleep. So you know what I'm saying, that memory.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

That, man, memory is on point.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

It's body, though.

[James Harrison]

It's body, though.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I had to clean it up.

[James Harrison]

It's spotty, just a little. I just told. I told. You told Peter and Paul story. I'm telling. Telling Luke, you know, like. Like. Like it's Jesus from the. You know, in the Bible. We telling different accounts of our different experiences of the same event.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Okay, okay.

[James Harrison]

Same event.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Okay.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Same event. Okay.

[James Harrison]

Same event. Okay.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

It's his perspective. Your perspective in the. In the. In the true perspective.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Yeah. Hey, man, how many times did y' all beat us, man?

[James Harrison]

Oh, there he goes. So why you gotta try to flip it like.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

No, I'm asking the question because I wanna. I wanna get to how that felt because I know the one game y' all did beat us, man.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yeah, we was getting.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Remember the real record game. Y' all beat us, we would get geeked.

[James Harrison]

Oh, why you try to say like it's.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

That's what.

[James Harrison]

We had an advantage. The real, real south of.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I'm just saying. On the same field I'm talking about, that game was. I'm not gonna lie, them boys was over there celebrating like they had won the Super Bowl. What was that, 2008 or something like that? 2009. Hey, look, it was our super bowl running over us.

[James Harrison]

We cannot guess it was our super bowl because, look, any. Anytime we had a winning season, we had to go through. And I'mma school you because you was in a winning organization for a long time. So I'm going to school you about the total scope of the AFC North. The AFC north consisted of teams that even when a team went 10, six, they still couldn't go to the playoffs because Baltimore was 11 and 5 and y' all was 12 and 4. So we still couldn't even make the playoffs at 10 and 6. You guys, if you look at your team, you arguably had hall of Famers on offense and defense. Facts, I mean, that's just facts off. I mean, offense and defense, you guys had Hines Ward, you had Palamalu on defense, you had yourself. Y' all had Porter. I mean, if you look at your. Your offense, you. You know Ben, he's a Hall of Famer.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Yes.

[James Harrison]

Y' all always had a star running back, that quarterback. You look at y' all squad, Baltimore squad. And this was when Flacco was in his. His heyday. And then we. We brought up the rear with, you know, Cincinnati, the Battle of Ohio. So the AFC north in that time was so stacked, everything ran through the AFC North. Whoever was on the top of the AFC north, they're going to the playoffs and have the best chance to win the Super Bowl. So when you say I have to put it in perspective for your fans who already know not to just say, oh, the Browns was some trash. Nah, we went 10, six, and we still couldn't get in the playoffs. That's crazy. And then that's the year y' all went to the super bowl against the Cardinals. Who was like 9 and who made it? They was like 8 and 8 or 9 and something like that. 9 and 10 and they made it and they weren't supposed to be there. And you got Super Bowl MVP running that kickback. Running that.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I should have got it. What's the name? Got it. Tone. Got it.

[James Harrison]

You ain't get that?

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

No, that's a. That's a whole nother story. I should have got it. They wanted to give it to me. Go ahead.

[James Harrison]

I was biased. I was biased. But yeah, I remember he did get that. That catch in the back of the end zone. That we're see.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yeah.

[James Harrison]

Yeah, that was the catch in the end zone, but that you stopped him from scoring and you ran it back full test. I thought that was more impactful. And again,

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

it was an argument about it. Let's just say that when I got to the podium, they hadn't picked it yet. They thought it was gonna be me. But sources say that somebody put a hold on and said if I get it, they wouldn't go be doing nothing else with the. With the NFL because I had dogged the punt returner. I mean, on the punt return, I had. I had mushed the dude that tried to cut me. What's his name? Yeah.

[James Harrison]

So you. Basically, they was like, he not gonna represent the shield. Well, we can't give it to.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I got a flashlight.

[James Harrison]

You can't give it to him. They looked at your history.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

No. Well, that play right there, they were like, oh, no, he shouldn't get it because of that. It was just one person, though. No longer with us, though.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Oh.

[James Harrison]

Oh.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Now just go back to the game. Think about who's no longer with us. I ain't gonna blame.

[James Harrison]

Wow.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Very, very popular person, though.

[James Harrison]

Hey, I thought you should have got it, though, like, because we wasn't there. I was rooting for. And look, you know, I got hate for rooting for you. And I was trying to tell people to separate that because I'm like, look, like, I can root for a guy. I'm not rooting for his team. Like, when he made it, you know, as far as he made on the biggest stage, like, we out of it, man. We at home watching. I'm like, I'm rooting for that guy to do well. And when he, you know, made it today, he was like, man, that's. He's a Steeler. I'm like, yeah, man. He a golden flash first. So people couldn't understand that. Even though he. I feel like, honestly, I'm gonna just say that I feel like he ain't have all his screws. Like, dang. I was like, you gonna hit the quarterback like that? I'm like, man, hey, man.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Yo.

[James Harrison]

Hey, man. He's. He's a little challenged on the rules of football.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I am not challenged on the rules of football.

[James Harrison]

He sees red, and then after he

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

sees red, he gonna steal his football.

[James Harrison]

He's gotta wait till the whistleblow come

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

out of the Browns in, what, 2005, right?

[James Harrison]

Say that again.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

You came to the Browns 2005, right? Yes.

[James Harrison]

And you was already in.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

And then Joe came in 2010. Yes. Right. What Was Joe like as a rookie, did he come in there with all that money, throwing it in y' all face, talking crazy?

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

No, sir.

[James Harrison]

The opposite, the opposite. Come on.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Hell no. You better say something.

[James Harrison]

Reckless Joe came in, let him know Chris. And we was torching Joe. Ah, you remember that Joe week. The whole receiving core was like, we gonna make at the very.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Got all this money, go routes.

[James Harrison]

We basically had to put the test on him. Hey, just go.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Just go.

[James Harrison]

Go route, everybody. And look, he was like, man, what's going on? Like, we ain't give him nothing but straight go routes. And was catching everything. It was like, huh? He just couldn't believe, like it wasn't going to be a dig, a slant, straight go routes.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Every time.

[James Harrison]

Every single time.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

And then you got to come back for the next play.

[James Harrison]

I'm gonna tell you this. He came back for training camp. Locking everybody down. Come on. Locking everybody. We had to give it to him. Locking everybody down. In training camp, it was as if he watched film on all the receivers

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

on his, man, I'm about to get into training camp. I'm a whack.

[James Harrison]

Exactly.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Now, like, he came.

[James Harrison]

He came ready out here looking like,

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I ain't a first round pick, but

[James Harrison]

that's what we wanted from him when he came to camp to minicamp ota, we like, man, we about to let him know what the league is gonna be. If you can't stop the simple to go route, you gonna get tossed in this league. He came in training camp. Ready?

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yeah.

[James Harrison]

Balls to the wall. Ready? Ready.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Thank you.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Did that have anything to do with that slow 40 time you ran?

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Man, shut up. That was my back. Hey, look, go back to cribs when I got there, bruh. This one I'm gonna say, you were so deep into the city of Cleveland, bro, like, doing everything, everybody, like, the biggest fan favorite. What was that for you? Like, what, what, when you got to Cleveland made you want to be so involved into the city? Cause that's what I did also, bruh. And I really kind of got it from you, like, moving, grooving, getting around.

[James Harrison]

I think it was more so, you know, who, How'd I got there, you know, not being drafted, you know, from the bottom up. It was only two spots that they was, you know, letting on the team. And it was either, you know, practice squad or, you know, special teams. And it was just two spots. It was 30 guys, just two spots. So just looking at how I made the team, you know, blue collar, like, ground up, you know, getting in from the back door. You know, making it from the ground up. It was like, that's what I identified as. And then, remember, I came in with Braylon Edwards, who was 18, 5. That's how I remember. And I'll tell a story about him in a second. But, you know, seeing all the money y' all got coming in, I'm like, you know, I have to represent the guys who. The free agent guys who make. Make their way to the top. So how did. And I'm always thinking long term, like, man, the fans pay a lot of money. Let me treat them right. Yeah. You know, life after football type stuff, having that mentality, man. Treat the guys. They rooting for us. Even like Jaybo said, man, he. You know, we beat them. We beat the Steelers one time, and our fans treated us like royalty. Yeah. We was at the Cavs game.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yes.

[James Harrison]

On the front row of floors all the time. They put us on a Jumbotron. Yeah. Like. And show highlights of the game. And was showing me ball out. I was like, oh, my gosh, I can get used to this. You mean all we gotta do is beat the Steelers? We weren't nothing but like six and two.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Oh, that's the tall feet. Tall.

[James Harrison]

But it was. Y' all was super bowl playoff contenders every single year. So we beat that team, but y' all didn't make it that team. So we played spoiler. We played spoiler to them.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Joe. Joe.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yes.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

It was so cold that game. We did not give a damn about losing. We wanted to get back inside, and it kicked us out of the play.

[James Harrison]

It's an excuse,

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

But I'm trying to

[James Harrison]

tell you they played their hearts out.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

I know they played their hearts out, man.

[James Harrison]

You think Tomlin would have had them playoffs.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

They're not going out.

[James Harrison]

Exactly. Exactly. Debo.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

You saying now, Debo, that's how.

[James Harrison]

I know you a lot.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I'm telling you. I'm not lying to you, Joe. Excuse telling me you was too cold

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

to play the game. You love you was, uh, you a lot.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

They won. Y' all won. No question about it, bro. I don't.

[James Harrison]

That.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

That. That's. That's what happened. But I'm just telling you that it kicked us out of the playoffs. And I was so cold after we lost, bruh, I didn't care. I just wanted to get off that field.

[James Harrison]

But you know what?

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

That's.

[James Harrison]

After that, it was cold. I remember hitting the ground, and it felt like concrete, bruh. The ground felt like concrete when it's cold.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Listen, bruh, I'm trying to. That's the coldest game I ever played in, in my life.

[James Harrison]

I'm.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I'm sitting it. I never go out to warm up, bro. I never, never go out to warm up. Everybody coming in talking about, oh, man, it's so cold. It's this and that. I'm like, man, shut up, man. It ain't cold outside, man. I'm from Ohio, man. I know what it's like, man. Right? So we had a thing that if you put on sleeves as a linebacker. That's a fine, Joe.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yeah.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

When I stepped out that tunnel and the cross breeze came, it was raining, but it already turned to sleep. And it was needles. It hit my arms, Joe. I got three steps out and I did like this and started to turn around to put sleeves on. And I said, if I do it, they're going to kill me. That was the coldest game I ever played in my life, bruh.

[James Harrison]

That's funny. My coldest game was in Pittsburgh. It wasn't snowing or nothing. It was. It was so cold.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Oh, you talking about zero.

[James Harrison]

It was so cold. I was catching a cramp, shivering. And I remember getting hit and blocking and doing all that.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Y' all was losing. That's why.

[James Harrison]

That's what I was going to tell you. You only felt the cold. That's why I was losing.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

You only felt the cold that time y' all lost. That's why this game after you.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

That's the coldest game ever played in the.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Oh, it's a lot colder.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Ever. Ever, bruh. Ever in my life, bruh. Like, I would have. I would have took a. I would have took a fine just to be warm, bro. That's the only game where at least half of the team, bro, was running to the heater every time out.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Facts.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

If not the whole team, bro. If not the whole defense, I'd be

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

stuck by the eater question.

[James Harrison]

Look, I got a question for you.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

That off the lake, wind blowing, all that?

[James Harrison]

Yeah.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

That is not pretty.

[James Harrison]

Go ahead. So you know how. You know how they changed the rules, right? Far as, like, hitting the quarterback.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yes.

[James Harrison]

Did that make for James? Did that make you feel like. Because I know you were still hitting the quarterback the same way, and you was getting fine the same way, and you and Goodell kind of had that back and forth for a long time. Did you get the. This is for me not being in y' all locker room. Did you get an okay from. From Tomlin? Like, go, do you. I always wanted to know that. Did you get that okay from your squad?

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I never got an Okay, I changed how I was hitting guys, to be honest with you. I tried to change. I tried to lower my strike area, but when you lower and they lower, you end up hitting at the same place, Right? Like. Yeah, listen, I went into the. When I went into meet with Roger Goodell, right? And I'm giving them the most impossible scenario. I said, if I go to tackle a guy and I said, at the last second, I'm going to tackle his ankles. I said, I'm going to tackle his ankles. I'm talking to Merton Hanks. Tackle his ankles. And I said the last second, he bent his whole body in half and put his head down there and I hit his helmet. That's on me. Yeah. I said, well, we ain't got nothing else to talk about. We got nothing else to talk about.

[James Harrison]

So you was like, I'm going to just go play because I know I'm going to get fined either way.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Either way, you're fine it for anything.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

If my helmet touches his helmet. Yeah.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

It don't matter that it's my. It's my fault. Or him lowering his head into the position. Like, I tell you, the worst possible could ever happen, that he literally sees me diving at his ankles and he dropped his head to his ankle and I hit him helmet down. That's on me. I'm gonna get.

[James Harrison]

So in today's game, would you not be as effective?

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

No, I would be way more effective, to be honest with you, because I started lowering my target area. You remember, I almost tore some ACLs.

[James Harrison]

But that's the thing, you can't hit QBs, though, and used to hit, bro.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Uh, a running quarterback, you can hit however you want to. I never, like, really had issues with tackling the quarterback. I got like fined twice on the tackle from a quarterback, and that was because of. It was Fitz Fitzpatrick. And I hit him in the chest, I guess, and that was a form tackle, bruh. Face up. And they were like, oh, it was too hard of a tackle. But I never really got fined for like, just outright, like, oh, you hit the quarterback elite. It was. It was play. It was on receivers and running backs and stuff like that.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Hey, Cribs.

[James Harrison]

Yes, sir.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Think, man, what you think? We've been having big conversations about our Browns or quarterback decision. We got Shadow, we got desean Watson.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

What do you think?

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

What do you think, Cribs, my fellow

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Brown quarterback, what do you think?

[James Harrison]

I'm gonna be honest. This is. You be honest. I'm gonna be honest. I'm gonna tell you what I want. Yes, I want your door. I think when, when. And I only say that because our fan base is divided on desean because we just wanna win.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yeah.

[James Harrison]

So I'm in a camp of, hey, I just wanna win. I don't care who the qb. I just want somebody there that's gonna help us win, Right?

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yes.

[James Harrison]

And for me, you can't judge the type of quarterback Chidori is from practice. It's when the light's cut on, just like Baker Mayfield. When the lights cut on, then he's able and capable of doing something special, especially with an off season.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yes.

[James Harrison]

However, it's business. How much? How much Desean getting? 46 million.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

46. 46.

[James Harrison]

Regardless if he sit the bench or not.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Yes.

[James Harrison]

And if it's our team and I'm spending that money, I'm like, man, look, man, you come on, you get. Cause the money's going to be spent regardless. Yes.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

So, I mean, it's been spent the last couple years and you ain't got a chance to use him. What's the difference in giving him his last year and saying, hey, go ahead and get the rest of the.

[James Harrison]

Because the hit.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Let me see what my young boy could do.

[James Harrison]

The hit has to quantify the talent. If he didn't have it no more, and you saw it, that's one thing. But if you see him, he looks.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

But my thing is this. How much better does he have to be for you to say, I'm going put you in here and risk having to pay him another 40 and not give Shador the chance to develop?

[James Harrison]

He's going to get the 40 regardless.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I understand that. But if he goes in there and say he plays not extremely well, but he plays well enough that you win, you get into the playoffs, you win a playoff game. Now you go, you go let him go for sure.

[James Harrison]

If we get in the playoff game, we winning.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I understand that, but his contract is

[James Harrison]

up after this year.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

You go give him another 40. No, no. So let me say this put him in a position.

[James Harrison]

Then let me say this is the ideal situation for me.

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[James Harrison]

I just I Mean, our fans want to see it and I want to see if he can win with a full all season. But the scenario would be for him to start to be the guy once the new stadium is built. So we're building a new stadium. You know that Joe. Yeah, it's supposed to be super bowl worthy of our fan base and it's going to be fire. How good would it be to feature Shador as the new starting quarterback? Then once the. And I don't want to say DeShawn fiasco or. But once we see that through, then in come a new era. Yeah, I still want you. That still doesn't. That's where I kind of like. I'm kind of like iffy about. Because I'm still on his side because I want to see it change. I want our fan base to be united right now. It's not because desean is getting the first reps. He's just getting the first reps in practice and he looks good. If I'm a quarterback coach, if I'm a head coach, he looks like the protege, the prototype for qb. That's what desean looks like. Todd Monkin, he came from the Ravens where his last game, DeSean Watson's last game, he led a comeback against him in great fashion before he went out with the injury and had to, you know, had all that happen. The game he came back, he was leading a victory. He was leading the Browns into score before the Achilles. Every time he got. He's gotten injured. He was on his way back to do something special. He was propelling the team. You saw it, it was like, oh, can they find something from him? And yes, the fan base and the media around here, they're kind of done with him. But if you look at the reps that he's taken, if I'm a betting man, I'm thinking it's going to be desean because of the reps. And we heard what Todd Monkin said. Todd Monken said, you know, I want to give, you know, my starter, whoever going to be the first, you know, the leading quarterback, QB1, most of the reps. Well, DeSean has been getting most of the reps. That's not me wanting him to be the starter. That's just what is being seen.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

What you see.

[James Harrison]

Yeah, that's just what was seen. Again, I've been around Shador and you know, Joe, we played in the celebrity softball games. We had fun and we got to be around the team and alumni weekend,

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

those guys going back to that. Listen, going back to Monkin and you saying he's giving the guy, you know, all the reps. Don't say no, no. Oh, don't forget he did say. He said now this can change. And then he added that, you know, it can change even if it's someone that's getting 2/3 of the reps or someone is getting one third of the reps because he said you still have to play the preseason and you still got to see what you got. So you want your guys to get the reps. But just because he's getting 2/3 of the reps, he said, that doesn't mean he's going to be the starter.

[James Harrison]

They don't play in the preseason. Like when have you. If, if, if I think they're going to know who the quarterback is before the first preseason game because you don't. The Browns have, and that's under Stefanski. I didn't like that because I felt like now the first few games they're going to be rusty. I like how we used to do it, how they give, you know, the, especially the last preseason game, they give the starter a whole series and a half, you know, to get acclimated before that first game. However, that first, you'll see how the reps go. They don't. Teams don't really play their starter well. The Browns haven't really been playing well.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

You got a new coach, so you got a new coach. It may be different. He also said that once we get back on the field for those four weeks at the end of spring, that he would have a better idea. So. Yeah, I believe he'll know who his starter is before the actual first he will game. But he's also, he probably already knows could change. And even though you're getting more reps doesn't mean you're necessarily going to be the starter.

[James Harrison]

Right. So I want to, I want to be real for a second. Right. You the head coach, it's just incumbent upon you to kind of keep things, you know, keep the media quiet a little bit. Hey, everybody start off as an A and you earn your grade from there. That's kind of like blah, blah talk right there. That's like, you know, finagle. Yeah, I think they understand who the starter is. I believe they talk as an organization who they want the starter to be and they're going to get that guy prepared behind the scenes. And then we, as we in the media or fan base, we kind of surmise we make our opinion, you know, based off of not just who we want but who, who we See who's looking like is going to be the favorite right now we know the favorite for the fan base and you know, national fan base, they want to see Shador, you know and we, we heard Mary Kay make her opinion on what she sees out there, right. And, and I remember Shiloh like Shadow's family, he don't like, they didn't like what she said. But she out there, she's seeing the same thing that we, you know, I see it on online, I'm like dang, Deshawn taking all.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I mean you gotta realize she's credible too. I mean when it comes down to it, it's an opinion and she's stating facts of what she's seen. So you can't get upset with that because facts in an opinion, that's the

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

same way when you talking about it, you're saying at the very beginning you stated I would like it to be Shador. But then knowing at the end of the day that it is a business and seeing that if Deshaun Watson is healthy, he's out here playing well, that could be a reason. I'm more where you were at first. I like Shador.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

We got weapons.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

We're going to get a line around him. We got a coach that can show him and teach him. Last year he wasn't getting no reps, he wasn't getting no vibes. He doesn't know exactly. No, no love. So I think a coach that can help him grow, I think that'd be great. So with desean, I understand when you bring it to the money part, that's 46 mil. And we know even if he does ball out this year and wins the playoff game, he's not, we're not re signing him to any more money. But I'm with you to the point where I'd rather go Shador first. And if Shador doesn't perform, then we can let, then we can put desean back in and see what happens. Or Jalen Green, the third string quarterback. But having Deshaun Watson start off first and him potentially being able to go out there and ball, he's not our long term future.

[James Harrison]

See, that's the fan in me. I have your opinion as the fan in me. As the football fan, I want just that. But as a coach, the only reason I would say Deshaun is because now he's built value. Even though Shedor is the future. Now I can trade. It's going to be some trades, people. Quarterbacks will go down, Deshaun will have some value. Maybe not at that high level, but enough so we can eat, so another team can eat the cost and offset the call.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

He's done off, he's done that this

[James Harrison]

year, but that's what I'm saying. But he could be traded even in the beginning of the year if he shows that value.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Taking that 42, 46. Right. Nobody taking that 46.

[James Harrison]

They don't have to. They don't have to. They can, it can be an offset. They don't have to. They don't have to take the whole thing and, and look, teams will get

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

45, 41, I mean 45 one.

[James Harrison]

Teams will get desperate when they need a QB one. When you need a QB one for your season, teams will get desperate. But regardless, I think you're toggling the one and the two from the Shador or desean. It's a battle of them two right now. That's all I see. And it's really in the fact cause I think that the coaches made their minds up. They just keeping it tight lipped.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Well yeah, this is something else too. A lot of hell coaches, players don't realize they can ask you a question you ain't gotta answer, you just gotta be available for it.

[James Harrison]

Exactly.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

You can say whatever the hell you want to say to the question. You can say, hey James, how do you feel about, you know, Joe going out there and doing that? I like peanut butter and jelly.

[James Harrison]

Yeah, exactly.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I mean you ain't gotta go that far with it. But I'm just saying, you know, look here man, we go jump into these super chats, but bro, I want to tell you man, you should be in the hall of Fame, man.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Thousand percent.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I had to go and, and look at your comparison, man. You know, it's a good comparison, but it's a bad comparison for a guy that you know, has played his career as has, has been as great as you have at the position of returner, man, you look at Barry Sanders, you look at Dan Marino, guys that haven't won a chip, you are that as a returner in this game. I, I, I, I really hope you make it to the hall, man, and you know, I wish you all the best. We go jump into these super chats though.

[James Harrison]

Appreciate y' all man. Love it.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Yes sir. Man, we got. Oh you Mads $5. He said what do you think of Drew Aller? I'm not sure if he's, I'm not sure if you've given an assessment, but I would like to hear what you think of him. What do you think of Drew Allen.

[James Harrison]

I think y' all trying to find a qb. Y' all drafted the same. Y' all trying to find y' all next. Ben Roethlisberger by drafting these big quarterbacks. Y' all did it last year with Will Howard from O State. And this year, Drew. Hey, hey. You should have saw and you probably seen it. Joe, he had a hard time putting on that Browns hat. He's a die. I mean, that. That still is hat.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

That still is hat.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

He a die Hard.

[James Harrison]

He's a die hard Browns fan. 30 years. His family has had season tickets. He'll do well for you guys. Reluctantly. He'll reluctantly play well.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Listen, listen. I'm gonna tell you this. I'mma tell you this right now.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

I'm have

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

you way more off the fantasm and all that stuff that, that, that, that, that go out the window when you see who signing your check. And I know that. I've been to Cincinnati. I've been, I've been, I've been. I've been in New England. You a Steeler. You got Brown is on your check. Yeah. No, no, you got craft on your check. You a Patriot now. Yeah, you can say that all you want to. That boy know where his bread is butter right now.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

That's a fact.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

That's a fact. You understand. Look here. Covenant to life back $50. Covenant life coming to life is our biggest fan, bro. Yes, 100%. It ain't nobody that's bigger than her. She said, hello, my Joe.

[James Harrison]

Yep.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

She said, I am just trying to accept the things that I cannot control. And that is that the jersey you have on. Josh, how important is special teams really to building championship teams? That obviously isn't a Browns question.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Ringless ring. She tried to say ringless. See? Coveted Life cribs.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I'm a coveted life. Covenant Life.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

I like, coveted. She a big Steelers fan, but she sometimes just shoots shots. Sometimes I get evo just a shot shooter.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

So how important is special teams to building the championship team?

[James Harrison]

Well, the best teams had some of the greatest special teams units. You can look at the dynasty that, you know, Tom Brady, Bill Belichick had. They're special teams. And y' all know this. The special teams, it was top tier, you know, and, you know, a lot of the better teams at the collegiate and the NFL level, special teams is like a no brainer, Joe. You know, it's been sometimes why our defense and special teams was the only thing to keep us in the game.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Thousand percent.

[James Harrison]

That was the only thing that we had. Like, why is the returner and the kicker heralded in. In Cleveland, because there was a time where that. That's all we had. And it change. And special teams can change a game when you have a good offense, a good defense. All you need is the superior special teams, and they could change the play in one game.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Yep.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Facts.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Okay?

[James Harrison]

Facts, facts.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Look, here, we got two. We got. We got $2 from telling Heckle Santi or something like that. It says JH92. True Blue Brothers keeper. That's true. True blue brothers keeper. What is that, Josh?

[James Harrison]

True blue, Maybe Kent State,

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I guess. So it gotta be.

[James Harrison]

Or the blue collar, you know, special teams.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

What is true blue?

[James Harrison]

I don't know. Hey, you know, James. Hey, yo, you know, James was on special.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

You have to explain.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yes, yes. That was his initial.

[James Harrison]

He went up against me a couple times when I was in the box, too. Yeah, you had a.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Like, what you mean, kick off a turn?

[James Harrison]

Nah, punt. I had to block him.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Oh, no.

[James Harrison]

Yeah, he had just freestyle rush on me, bro. Like, just not even trying to block a punt, bro. He just gonna come and just tee off on me. I'm like, bro, hey, like, come on.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I ain't about to let him run down there. I ain't about to be chasing him down that damn field, bro.

[James Harrison]

I'm like, bro, come on, man.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I'm firing off on him, man.

[James Harrison]

Hey, we had to punt so many times. Look, I cut him the first few times, but ain't but so many times you can cut him. We punting seven times. I'm like,

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

he hip.

[James Harrison]

I done gave him all my moves. I'm like, dang, we got punt again. Hey, bro, I went over to the other side. He followed me to the other side.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

You switch your sides?

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Yeah, they, they, they. They was like, yo, he go make the tackle. I'm like, nah, man. Listen, y', all, I'm gonna do it, but listen, I'm not. I'm not trying. I'm not trying to block. I'm gonna try and maul him right here on this line.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yes.

[James Harrison]

That was crazy. He wasn't even trying to get the block. I was like, man, go, Brock the punt. He like, nah, man, I'm getting you.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Yes. Oh, man. Coming to Life. Back again. $50. She said, Please don't. Please don't say anything smart, because I know you'll be drilling me. Get out of my way. I had a vision of you, of you signing books. And the title was From Cut Days to Sundays. It was a best seller in 30 minutes. Built from rejection.

[James Harrison]

That's a hard title. That's. That's.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

That's a nice name right there.

[James Harrison]

That's a hard title. Go ahead.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Coveted.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I don't know. Covenant might be over there drinking again. She might be on that wine.

[James Harrison]

Hey, that's when the best ideas come up. Right there.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Yeah, sure. Hey, listen, some of the best ideas,

[James Harrison]

you know, you know.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Hey, hey,

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Joe know facts.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Come on, man. But, DJ, I want to tell you.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

$2, he said it means you realize.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Means you realize.

[James Harrison]

True blue.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Oh, true blue. Real true blue through and through. True blue. Oh, brother's keeper.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yes, sir.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

True blue. Brothers keep it. For sure.

[James Harrison]

I might to use that show.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

I mean, on the field. Not really, but I got to do my job. But on, off the field, like, yo, I told you, that's my guy right there. I bucks with him for show 100%. You know what I'm saying? Yay. Tell wifey.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yes.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

We ain't even gotta go ahead and, you know, I ain't gotta do nothing. We just. Could I go to the game. Matter of fact, win the homecoming game up there at Kent.

[James Harrison]

I. I'll let you know. I send it to you, man. Okay. We open up with South Carolina, we got Old State, you know, we got our work cut out.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

They gotta make that money. Shut up. Hey, hey.

[James Harrison]

I'm telling you, hey, we gonna get them up.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

You right. You ain't lying.

[James Harrison]

Special teams gonna be on point. I tell you that. Yes, sir.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Chris, man, Shout out, man. DMV legend, bro. I love you, bro.

[James Harrison]

Thank you. Love y', all, brother.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Thank you, man, for coming on. We appreciate you, man. Look here. Hey, tomorrow we have Omar Khan.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Okay?

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

Okay. So we want to thank you guys for joining us on this episode of Debo and Joe. Please make sure you, like, subscribe and download where you get your show. Joe.

[Chris (likely Chris Carter)]

Yo, Catch us tomorrow with Omar Khan. Same time, same place. Let's get it.

[Joe (likely Joe Thomas)]

And we out.

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