Deebo & Joe - SNF REACTION: Aaron Rodgers & Steelers LOSE to Jordan Love & Packers

Summary

Club Shay Shay — "Deebo & Joe: SNF REACTION: Aaron Rodgers & Steelers LOSE to Jordan Love & Packers"

Podcast: Club Shay Shay
Hosts: James "Deebo" Harrison & Joe Hayden
Episode Date: October 27, 2025

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Episode Overview

This episode features NFL legends and former teammates James "Deebo" Harrison and Joe Hayden breaking down a rough Sunday Night Football (SNF) for both their former teams. The Pittsburgh Steelers suffered a lopsided loss to the Green Bay Packers, led by Jordan Love, while Joe's Cleveland Browns were soundly defeated by the New England Patriots. The duo dives deep into the defensive breakdowns, frustrating offensive performances, and emotional highs and lows of the weekend, all while maintaining their signature banter and authenticity.

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Key Discussion Points

1. Raw Reactions to SNF: Steelers & Browns Losses

• Both Hosts' Teams Lose:

  • Deebo attended the Steelers game in person, hoping to inspire the team but left disappointed.
  • Joe's Browns also took a tough loss.
  • "I ain't gonna lie, man, it was a tough football Sunday. [...] Both of our teams got whooped." — Joe Hayden [01:56]

• Deebo's Steelers Game-Day Experience:

  • Deebo took part in the ceremonial tunnel walk, pumped up the fans, and felt the energy — only for the defense to fall apart.
  • "I'm also used to my defense... being the reason that we win, not the reason that we lose." — James Debo Harrison [02:30]

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2. Play-by-Play: Packers vs Steelers (SNF Detailed Breakdown)

• Optimistic Start, Early Signs of Trouble:

  • Steelers open with energy, make some strong starts on defense.
  • Special teams delivers a field goal for a 3-0 lead.
  • Packers respond with short passes and a touchdown: "This dude threw like four short passes... then the 16 yard touchdown is 7-3." — Harrison [05:25]

• Missed Tackles and Defensive Errors:

  • Both hosts highlight missed tackles and poor defensive discipline as the game slips away for Pittsburgh.
  • "There's a lot of missed tackles out there, gangster, early." — Joe Hayden [06:00]

• Second Half Collapse:

  • Steelers defense is gashed for multiple big plays; fundamentals break down.
  • "They let these boys go 90 yards in nine plays... Like, we are not stopping anyone from doing anything." — Harrison [11:44, 17:08]
  • No sacks recorded, repeated third-down conversions by Green Bay.

• Offensive Struggles and Missed Opportunities:

  • Steelers convert only 1 of 10 third downs.
  • Multiple drives stall due to penalties and negative yardage runs.

• Brutal Honesty About Pittsburgh's Identity:

  • "Pittsburgh Steelers are built on defense. Your defense is not the one that's supposed to be letting you down. I don't know when I've ever seen the defense be this bad." — Harrison [16:57]

Notable Quote

“We're the 30th ranked defense in the NFL. We're the highest paid defense in the NFL. Those two things don't go together.”
— James Debo Harrison [20:36]

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3. Browns-Patriots Deep Dive

• Strong Defensive Start, Offensive Inconsistency:

  • Browns get early stops, including a turnover, but fail to capitalize on good field position.
  • "...from the defense, from the turnover, like, yeah. To get the ball on 34-yard line to not get no points. That's just bad ball, that's what that is." — Hayden [32:18]

• Second Half: Defensive Breakdown & QB Critique:

  • Patriots rack up big chunk plays, with Browns’ defensive eye discipline crumbling.
  • Joe criticizes Browns QB Dylan Gabriel for poor decision-making and costly turnovers.
  • "He wasn't not only helping us, he was also hurting us... tossing the ball to the other team." — Joe Hayden [35:09]

• Calls for Change:

  • Discussion on whether it's time to give rookie Shador Sanders a shot at QB over Gabriel.
  • "Should Shador get a shot? ...I think it’s about that time that he should be able to go out there and play." — Hayden [48:09]

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4. Defensive Culture, Identity, and Accountability

• Steelers Defensive Disarray:

  • Deebo and Joe agree the defense lacks the discipline and communication of past years.
  • "You got to be able to have your eyes in the right spot because people are running scot free." — Hayden [20:55]

• Lack of Effort & Internal Accountability:

  • Reference to Cam Heyward suggesting effort issues on the defense.
  • Speculation over defensive scheme changes, loss of discipline, and the need for simplified roles.

• High-Priced Defense, Poor Results:

  • Frustration at the Steelers having the league's highest-paid defense but bottom-tier performance.

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5. Extended NFL Roundup: Dolphins, Jets, Ravens & More

Dolphins Rout Falcons

• Miami throttles Atlanta 34–10.
• Tua throws four TDs in efficient outing.
• "Maybe you need to do a pirate thing, just wear a patch over his eye before the game." — Harrison (on Tua playing through injury) [51:06]

Jets Upset Bengals

• Jets rally to beat Cincinnati 39–38, Justin Fields emotional postgame.
• "Yesterday I'm praying, I'm praying like crazy. Just for a win, just for a win... found myself in my closet crying on the ground." — Justin Fields [52:15]

Ravens’ Culture Reset

• Baltimore overhauls locker room focus, eliminates distractions.
• Strong outing with scheme adjusted for Lamar-style QB.

Eagles Tush Push Controversy

• Discussion of whether the "tush push" play needs changes after a controversial call.

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6. Team Management & Roster Philosophy

• Steelers’ Need for More Weapons:

  • Deebo advocates for keeping talent like George Pickens despite off-field issues, considering their contributions and contract value.

• Browns’ Miles Garrett Commentary:

  • Discussion around stars (like Garrett) choosing money over contending and the impact on team culture and competitive expectations.
  • "If you really that frustrated, tell them you'll give them back some money if they trade you to a contender. You ain't that frustrated, though." — Harrison [42:12]

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7. Notable Banter & Memorable Moments

• Personal Stakes:

  • Deebo references his son’s injury struggles and how tough the season is personally.
  • "My son done came to the game... Now he down again. This is gonna be four surgeries in 18 months... This is the toughest I know in my life." — Harrison [22:41]

• Giveaway & Fan Engagement:

  • Show highlights winners of ticket giveaways. One fan even proposed at the game in a Debo jersey.
  • "You know what I'm saying? I'll make -- I'm making marriages." — Harrison [67:25]

• Classic Steelers-Browns Trash Talk:

  • Deebo: "Joe, you came from a line of losers. Y’all gonna always be losing." [22:11]
  • Joe: "Now you’re being disrespectful." [22:15]

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Important Timestamps

• [01:56] – Opening reactions, both hosts’ teams lost
• [03:26] – Deebo describes being at the Steelers game
• [05:25] – Steelers’ early field goal and Green Bay’s fast answer
• [11:44] – Defense collapses, Green Bay marches 90 yards
• [16:57] – “Pittsburgh Steelers are built on defense” — Deebo
• [20:36] – “30th ranked defense / highest paid defense” quote
• [26:12] – Debate over WR George Pickens and offensive weapons
• [32:18] – Browns fail to capitalize after turnover
• [35:09] – Joe critiques Dylan Gabriel, calls for QB change [48:09]
• [51:06] – Dolphins-Falcons, Tua’s 4 TDs
• [52:15] – Justin Fields “crying in the closet” quote after Jets’ first win
• [64:49] – Discussion on Tush Push and NFL rule debate
• [67:25] – Ticket winner proposes at game in Debo jersey

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Tone & Takeaways

• Raw, Unfiltered, and Relatable:
  The hosts mix in frustration, authenticity, and humor as only ex-NFL stars can, offering tactical insight along with real emotion. Deebo is especially vocal about the loss of identity and physicality in Pittsburgh, while Joe tries to balance analysis with hope (and Browns realism).
• Defensive Identity Crisis:
  Both ex-defenders repeatedly stress that defensive mistakes—especially missed tackles and “bad eyes”—are ruining their teams.
• Roster and Culture Honesty:
  The guys do not hesitate to challenge management decisions (Steelers’ spending vs. results, Browns’ loyalty to Gabriel over Shador) and star-player motivations.

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Notable Quotes (With Timestamps)

• "I'm also used to my defense... being the reason that we win, not the reason that we lose." — James Debo Harrison [02:30]
• "We're the 30th ranked defense in the NFL. We're the highest paid defense in the NFL. Those two things don't go together." — Harrison [20:36]
• "He wasn't not only helping us, he was also hurting us... tossing the ball to the other team." — Joe Hayden (on Dylan Gabriel) [35:09]
• "You came from a line of losers. Y’all gonna always be losing." — Harrison (playfully, at Joe) [22:11]
• "If you really that frustrated, tell them you'll give them back some money if they trade you to a contender. You ain't that frustrated, though." — Harrison (on Miles Garrett) [42:12]
• “You know what I'm saying? I'll make -- I'm making marriages.” — Harrison (on a fan proposal) [67:25]

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Final Thoughts

This episode is essential for any Steelers or Browns fan seeking a cathartic, in-depth, and honest breakdown of Sunday’s chaos. James and Joe combine x's and o's with street-level honesty, inside locker room perspective, and just enough dark humor to reflect the mood of tough fan bases. If you want to know why the Steelers defense looks broken or why the Browns still haven’t found their quarterback, all without sugar-coating, this episode delivers.

Transcript

[James Debo Harrison]

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[James Debo Harrison]

Welcome to Debo and Joe. I'm your host, James Debo Harrison and I'm here with my co host Joe Hayden. Please make sure you guys like and subscribe. You don't want to miss nothing. How you doing today, Joe?

[Joe Hayden]

I ain't gonna lie, man, it was a tough. It was a tough football Sunday. I know it was. But like, you, you, the Steelers got smacked. Both of our teams got whooped. My Browns got whooped and the Steelers got whooped. So, you know, I know you. I'm like you. You told me previous to the show that I'm used to this. So that was so much.

[James Debo Harrison]

You is dude so messed up.

[Joe Hayden]

I understand. Because it's like, I don't know, you gotta be able to live a fight. That's just. That's the one thing about the Steelers fans being able to play for this.

[James Debo Harrison]

You're so used to here, man. Listen here, listen here. Used to winning.

[Joe Hayden]

Yeah.

[James Debo Harrison]

Yes, yes. That is true. That is true. Okay. But I'm also used to my defense. Our defense. The Steelers defense being the reason that we win, not the reason that we lose.

[Joe Hayden]

No. Okay.

[James Debo Harrison]

My voice a little scratchy because I was at the Game, right? I do the. I come out the tunnel, I do the walk. You know how I do my walk, right? Come through, stare through here, stare through here. Give them all that. We're all the towel. All that. Gas them up. We going. I'm thinking. I'm feeling the energy. I'm like, we got this. This is what. This is what's about to go down, bruh. We lose. We lose. Yes, we lose. And the score ain't even really the. It don't say how bad we lost, because we still. We scored the trash. Touchdown, I think.

[Joe Hayden]

Is this the. You. You went to the game last night.

[James Debo Harrison]

I went to the game last night. I did the walk out.

[Joe Hayden]

You kept calling me during the Browns game. You telling me that you was at the crib before that. That was before you went to the Steelers Getting ready.

[James Debo Harrison]

Yeah. That's two different people right now. Yeah, I'm. Listen, Lord, I'm gonna try and not cuss. I promise you. I am.

[Joe Hayden]

But let's get to it then. Debo, I might crash something.

[James Debo Harrison]

So listen, bro, I'm sitting there at the game, man, and. And I do the call out. I come out, the tunnel is going. Everything. I'm getting the feel, you know what I'm saying? I'm like, I'm. I'm. I didn't told myself, like, you know, maybe I could go out here for three snacks. There you go, you know. You know, get up to the top, bruh. Sit down. Green Bay, they. They win the toss. They. They get the ball. First man defense come out there. It was third and one. I'm like, I'm a little dude. We hold. We.

[Joe Hayden]

Yeah. I'm like Joey Porter Jr. Man to man. You need that?

[James Debo Harrison]

Yes. I'm like, yo, this. This. This is. This is. This is looking more like stealing football, brother. Still, let's get out there, man. We get a tackle eligible, throw to the tackle to let him know that we ain't just bringing him out here for nothing. Four yards.

[Joe Hayden]

Nice, nice.

[James Debo Harrison]

Opening up the playbook, opening up the playbook, man. I'm loving it, man. Then on the third down, the third and short, I think it was like third and three. Wilson get 45. Oh, it's going gravy. I'm sitting up there, I'm yelling, I'm screaming as you can hear everything going gravy, man. And then we actually get a little setback. We get a PI on the dk, the push off. That's cool. That put us behind the sticks, but you know who we got in there if we can't hurt if anywhere close to 60 we go put bank on the field.

[Joe Hayden]

Yes.

[Ryan Seacrest]

Right.

[James Debo Harrison]

I hit 56 right there. We. We up 3, 0. I'm like, hey, it's a good start. It could have been better, but I ain't tripping. I ain't tripping at all. Green Bay get back out there. Love do his thing. But this is what I'm upset about. This dude threw like four short passes. Dude like that went for like 24, 6, 13. And then the 16 yard touchdown is 7, 3.

[Joe Hayden]

There's a lot of missed tackles out there, gangster early.

[James Debo Harrison]

I, I really ain't. I really ain't tripping. You know what I'm saying? Still, let's get back out there again. We get a little illegal shift on this. On the second offense.

[Joe Hayden]

That Thor behind the sticks, that's when they was messing up. Remind us.

[James Debo Harrison]

We could have been third and what? Third and three. Now we second and 13. We end up having to punt the ball. Man, look here, I'm gonna tell you right now, my red cup. Don't y' all worry about what's in it. Might not be nothing in it. I'm doing a little bit of everything right now, trying to compensating and, and make me feel better so I don't crash out right here, okay?

[Joe Hayden]

Yes.

[James Debo Harrison]

Green baked out there again, dude. A little short pass. My dude busted for 33.

[Joe Hayden]

Yak Kraft was getting all the yak. He was breaking tackles and stiff arming people. All right, my bad.

[James Debo Harrison]

And here's the crazy thing, bro. They're able to actually get a field go to tent before the hat, right? But no, that ain't even it.

[Joe Hayden]

We ain't number one before the quarter.

[James Debo Harrison]

It's missed. He missed it. Thank goodness. He ain't used to kicking in in Aure Stadium. I wanted to say Hinesville, we still up, you know, three, seven. Okay, cool. We got a short field now. So with the short field, we get enough yardage to. To give boss again we stall out.

[Joe Hayden]

Yes.

[James Debo Harrison]

You go for 50 this time. Six or seven? Six, seven.

[Joe Hayden]

Six, seven.

[James Debo Harrison]

Ain't that how the kids say six, seven? When it went six, seven, I was like, ah, I don't know if I like that. Six, seven. Okay. Green Ray come out and the defense do a stud dizzle. I ain't gonna lie. They did it. Hot three and out. Hot three, hot three and out, baby. Pittsburgh come out there like, dude, again the drive gets stalled, we get. What was that, that five yard loss on the first down. Dude just blew.

[Joe Hayden]

Oh, yes. On the Run. Jaylen Warren tried to tow it. Got it. Set him behind the sticks again.

[James Debo Harrison]

Get a false start, too, on the field goal try, but we got boss. So he said, you know, instead of 43, 48, it's 48. I ain't tripping. 97. 97. I'm still feeling. I'm still feeling pretty decent about it. You know what I'm saying? Defense come out, stand up again. I'm like, whoa, we standing up. This is the defense or the type of defense I'm using.

[Joe Hayden]

2, 3 announce in a row.

[James Debo Harrison]

Stillers come out there. We mix it up a little bit, we get a little run, we get a little pass, you know what I'm saying? Get a little help on the third down with the PI. Which it gives us a first, you know what I'm saying? That's all good here. I'm like, yo, we should have maybe used up a little more of that clock, you know, because we had three timeouts. You know, we kind of rushed it when DK ended up scoring that touchdown. Because I don't want to give him no more time, because I know what we've been doing. We scored a touchdown with DK. It's 16 to 7. I'm feeling okay. But even though it's only 34 seconds, I know what we have been doing this year.

[Joe Hayden]

Are they giving up explosive plays?

[James Debo Harrison]

Dude, they get a run of eight, and then a pass of 19. TJ get an incidental face mask. Another one of nine, and here we go. They about to kick this field. Go. Luckily, a field goal kicker is trash. He had a bad day. I really appreciate you for that. I really appreciate you for that. So 16, 7, we go in. It's all you're. I'm. I'm sitting. I'm feeling. I'm feeling six, seven. You feel me? Because it could have been. It could have been 13 to 16 if he make those two field goals.

[Joe Hayden]

No, no, for sure, for sure, for sure, for sure.

[James Debo Harrison]

So we come back out, still has got the rock, and then we lose. Friarmouth. Yo, I'm gonna tell you right now, in my head as. Not even in my head, me as a person, I think that's a dirty play. You hitting that man low. He can't see where you going, but he has.

[Joe Hayden]

He has no other choice. He gotta take them legs out the way, right?

[James Debo Harrison]

That's the way y' all made the shows, so understand on this one, too.

[Joe Hayden]

They didn't get the offsides call. A rod didn't get the offsides call.

[James Debo Harrison]

How you don't how you don't. Y' all sit down and you discuss.

[Joe Hayden]

It and still don't give it to him.

[James Debo Harrison]

You still do.

[Joe Hayden]

I don't like.

[James Debo Harrison]

The man is literally in the gap when you snap the ball.

[Joe Hayden]

So that was crazy. And they had to punt the ball. I think that right there, it was. It started getting a little ugly. That. That right there was not a good. Dude, that was messed up.

[James Debo Harrison]

Listen, it. It. It kind of went down there because on Green Bay, get the. Get the ball. And on the third down, the third and five, the tight end go damn near 60 and we lose Elliot.

[Joe Hayden]

Why miss tackles? He running down there with Elliot. He kind of like pushed him off. He's stumbling, looking around. Ah, you gotta. You gotta make that. You gotta make that play.

[James Debo Harrison]

Now on top of that, you let These boys go 90 yards in nine plays. It's 1460.

[Joe Hayden]

Yep. And it's bad eyes. They hit you on the 4th and 1, too.

[James Debo Harrison]

I ain't even want to say no.

[Joe Hayden]

The man had to because that happened. All right, still, let's get the Rock back.

[James Debo Harrison]

Still is back out there. So now we get sacked. Sack funk. We lucky. The review saw that he had the.

[Joe Hayden]

Ball, he really had control of it.

[James Debo Harrison]

And dude just snatched it up out of his hands. You know what I'm saying? We. We. We get really nothing after we get the ball back.

[Joe Hayden]

But who we got Bankroll Boss.

[James Debo Harrison]

We got boss man boss for 56, 19 to 14. Now I'm like, all right, defense, stand up, stand up. We did whatever we did. It's cool. Now it's time to stand up. They started letting these cats work their way down.

[Joe Hayden]

Well, he started. Then a big bomb.

[James Debo Harrison]

Boom. Third and seven, we get 33. And then I think it was even a. A PI on that. But they. They didn't take it. Wasn't that. Wasn't that the one? And they, you know, they declined it. And then Jacobs, he.

[Joe Hayden]

Oh, that was. Yeah, first play of the fourth quarter.

[James Debo Harrison]

He. He. He get the little, you know, three yard touchdown. And then the two point conversion. Bro, did you see that?

[Joe Hayden]

The two point conversion? That. That they. They didn't. They didn't convert.

[James Debo Harrison]

Yes, they did. They. They converted that.

[Joe Hayden]

Oh, they did convert the two more conversion.

[James Debo Harrison]

Green Bay 22 to 19.

[Joe Hayden]

My bad.

[James Debo Harrison]

Bruh. Whole half of the end zone, it my.

[Joe Hayden]

And now from this. This point on the fourth quarter is where it got. Where it got real, aren't you?

[James Debo Harrison]

No, dude, it got bad after the second.

[Joe Hayden]

It got bad the second. It was two different halves. It was the first Half and the second half. But God damn, that fourth quarter, soon as it turned to the fourth, got ugly.

[James Debo Harrison]

Dude, we get sacked on the first down.

[Joe Hayden]

As soon as we get the ball back behind the sticks, lost to 10. There's nothing you could do like check.

[James Debo Harrison]

We. We. We thr out. And then we get an unnecessary reference on the punt. Like Green Bay, you done gave these.

[Joe Hayden]

Dudes another short field on the 45 yard line, brother.

[James Debo Harrison]

Four plays later, bro. On all short passes.

[Joe Hayden]

Yeah, like what Yards after catch, he getting it. He got the. He caught the ball and was running. And everything Kraft was getting was after the catch. Yeah. We down 29, 19, coach.

[James Debo Harrison]

With just what, under or over 10 minutes left? Under or over 10 minutes left. We are not built to come back from something like that. Especially when our defense is not tackling and we playing trash. I'm trying not to yell because I'm gonna lose my voice. We come back out, get the rock right second down, we get a. A. What was it? A P?

[Joe Hayden]

It was a personal file.

[James Debo Harrison]

Oh, yeah. We get unnecessary roughness on DK dude. 3 and out. We gotta punt the ball again, man.

[Joe Hayden]

Now this is when. Because like you said in the second half, this one, I was listening to the announcers. They was like this. This has been 18 straight completions. And then they just started talking about.

[James Debo Harrison]

How he had 20 total straight said.

[Joe Hayden]

This is the point where they started talking about how many completions my man had. I was like, oh, my God. I wasn't really counting. But nobody's dropping the ball.

[James Debo Harrison]

Dude. They come in, they burn off a hot. Almost three and a half minutes. And damn field goal kicker make like he want to be able to start like he can kick the damn smack.

[Joe Hayden]

Yep.

[James Debo Harrison]

Yeah.

[Joe Hayden]

So he hit the field goal. We down 32, 19.

[James Debo Harrison]

We get the ball back. Fumble. And you let Green Bay recover gain.

[Joe Hayden]

Well, strip.

[James Debo Harrison]

Now, yo. After that, I ain't gonna lie to you. I knew it was over with Green Bay. Just added insult entry and added another three points with a field goal. 30, 35, 19. You know, we. We score. You know, we score one of those touchdowns where you up there, Defense plan prevent, you know, trying to make sure they tackle you inside, do all that stuff, burn off the clock, you know, end up being 25 to 35. For all intents and purposes, the game over. They kneel down.

[Joe Hayden]

It. It's.

[James Debo Harrison]

It's done. It's done.

[Joe Hayden]

They gotta get. They. They definitely. They ended it with a first. They ran for total for a good first down and kneeled that thing on out like.

[James Debo Harrison]

What is happening? Like, Pittsburgh Steelers are built on defense. You go back to defense, your defense is not the ones that's supposed to be letting you down. I don't know when. I don't know if I've ever seen the defense be this bad. Dude, we can't tackle nobody. Like, we did okay in the first half, sure, far better than we have. Like, and then the second half, dude, we just totally collapsed, dude. Like, we're on the field in the second half. Almost 20 minutes, bro. First half, it was barely 12 and some change there. Like, they converted no third downs. I think we was 40 on third downs in the first half. The second half, man, these boys went 5 foot 8. They only missed three of them things. And then on top of that, bro, Green Bay take away the last possession, had 11 possessions, bro. It was only two where they. No, I take it back. It was only three where they had to punt. And the crazy thing is they could have scored on all of them, but dude missed two field goals. Like, we are not stopping anyone from doing anything. Love. What was he, 360? I think they only averaged 359. Three tugs and we ain't sacking one time, not once. Like, he only threw six, five or six balls that were above or 10 yards or more airtime, bro. Everything else is jack. Yeah, we're giving up way too many points. Like, they didn't run the ball, but they didn't have to. And they aren't a running defense anyway. They're. I mean offense, they're like 15. They mid pack.

[Joe Hayden]

I mean, they. They didn't do a bad job running the ball though. Jacobs and other. Jacobs and 23, they were toting that pill. 23 was toting that joint too, for sure. Like it. Him, him and Jacobs was toting. He was able to get the ball off fast. Their offense in the first half, I wasn't as mad, you know what I'm saying? Like, they know.

[James Debo Harrison]

I was like, okay, I saw. I was concerned, but I wasn't tripping.

[Joe Hayden]

It was just more too for me, the offense didn't have any. Anytime we got behind the sticks, like the penalties, the first down runs, when we're only gaining maybe one yard, if we're getting stopped behind the backfield, then it's like the drives always get killed with that. And then we were able to win with when Bob's getting those field goals, but we got to be able to score touchdowns instead of keeping getting field goals. Do you know what I'm saying, bro.

[James Debo Harrison]

I totally understand what you're saying, don't get me wrong, we got some offensive issues. Like we were what, one of 10 on third downs, one of 11, something like that. Like, we can't keep drives together. We stall out. And when we can keep a drive together, or we're looking like we're able to keep a drive together, we get penalties that stop it. We are freaking cooked. Like, we're cooked, bro.

[Joe Hayden]

That was not.

[James Debo Harrison]

Yeah, we're the 30th ranked defense in the NFL. We're the highest paid defense in the NFL. Those two things don't go together.

[Joe Hayden]

This is, this is why, this is why I'm with you with the prime Sunday night.

[James Debo Harrison]

What the fuck are we doing?

[Joe Hayden]

Let me tell you with the defense, Debo, a lot of it is eyes, miscommunications. There are people like, you know what, coach? Don't get beat to the flat. Tight ends running fast to the flat by themself. You know what I'm saying? It's a lot of eye discipline. It's a lot of simple, simple things. It's like when people are running scot free through the defense, you can see like play actions. Those things are keeping people just running all around them. I'm like, dude, you got to be able to have your eyes in the right spot because people are running scot free through the defense. So there, the, the, the people are there, the players are there, but they're not playing at. They're not playing at a high level. Do you know what I'm saying? Like something. They, they have to, they have to perform better. They have to put the eye.

[James Debo Harrison]

How you, how, how you don't get up for, for Sunday Night Football if you can't get up for nothing else, ain't nothing else on but you home in front of your family, your kids.

[Joe Hayden]

I, I was not.

[James Debo Harrison]

Make that name on your back mean something. Make them three stars on your chest mean something.

[Joe Hayden]

Debo Deebo. It wasn't me not performing. It wasn't me not performing. I'm just trying to let you know, that's why I'm. I'm. Like you said. I think I could think I could be like your, your counselor, bro. Because it's okay. It's all, it's all gonna be okay. Everything's still gonna be okay.

[James Debo Harrison]

Joe, you came from a line of losers. Y' all gonna always be losing.

[Joe Hayden]

Damn. Now you've been disrespectful. Now you're being disrespectful. I'm trying to catch. I'm trying to. I'M trying to just be here for you, and then you just gonna.

[James Debo Harrison]

That was a personal attack.

[Joe Hayden]

I feel you.

[James Debo Harrison]

I'm here for you, my brother. Listen, my voice gone. They done. Listen, you know, had me have my kids up late.

[Joe Hayden]

Yeah, they had you.

[James Debo Harrison]

On top of that. My son done came to the game. He blew. Listen, man, he. He got a subluxation of his right shoulder. Now he down again. This is. This is gonna be four surgeries in 18 months. This dude done missed basically all the last almost two and a half years of football his. His senior year. This is the toughest I know in my life, dude. And you heard. And y'.

[Joe Hayden]

All.

[James Debo Harrison]

Y' all don't give us nothing to celebrate.

[Joe Hayden]

Yeah, man, come on. I don't know, Debo. It wasn't. It wasn't what I. It wasn't. It. Look, yeah, offense got to do better, defense got to do better. They got to look at the tape. But end of the day, hey, man.

[James Debo Harrison]

Things got to get changed. People gotta go highest paid, 30th rank don't match. I don't know what needs to happen, but we need to go ahead and maybe something. Redo this whole. This whole thing and. And. And get something else going. I think we also need. On offense, we got to get somebody else besides dk. We got to get a true. A true. True too. You know, a one, a one and a half, a 1.5.

[Joe Hayden]

I actually, though, do you think. Do you think even, you know, Geor Pickens with him having that off the field?

[James Debo Harrison]

Hey, I'm. I'm tell you right now, we kept.

[Joe Hayden]

Him for the low. We still had him for the low. I don't care.

[James Debo Harrison]

With all that came with pickings, outside of the actual incidents on the field with, you know, basically it came down to a. The play issue wasn't the problem. The boy, he can do what he can do. That's. That's not the issue. It was. It was the. The head. It was the maturity. All that other stuff. Like, right now, I am. Like, I would have dealt with all that. Right?

[Joe Hayden]

That's what I'm saying, Debo. And guess what? I'm saying it, too. The only reason why I'm saying it is he knows he has to ball out to be able to get another contract. You're paying him 600,000, $700,000 this year to be able to be a number two. To know he knows he's going to have to get the bat.

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[Joe Hayden]

He's going to be gone, so I would deal with that for 500, 600,000 to have a real another threat. That's all I'm saying. If you know you're not going to pay him, just keep them while you still got them for the low and then let them go because you still got a rod, you got dk. Just keep them. You know what I'm saying? Don't just dispense them for no reason. I would just kept them for that one year and then had them like that because right now it would be really nice to have George Pickens on the team.

[James Debo Harrison]

Dude, it would. Yeah, it would be great, great right now if they could figure out a way to incorporate management of different personalities and how you have to, you know, work with that. I think we getting, you know, even it's just across the league. You, you look at, look at Stefan Diggs. You let a guy do something here, he gets used to doing that and when he can't do that, he may start acting out. Now Stefan went from here to there to there and now all you hear is positive things about him. He took that time to mature, understand that, you know, it's not Them it's me. And.

[Joe Hayden]

And.

[James Debo Harrison]

And he was able to do that. And I think Pickens may be in a situation right now where he's like, you know what? He. Maybe he had to have that move for him to be able to realize that, hey, I need to do ABC and not xyz. And now, you know, he's in that position. But, I mean, I don't know if, you know, he could have did that here because of, you know, what he was able to do or not do here.

[Joe Hayden]

You know what I'm saying here, though. That's the only reason why if it's. If it's anybody now you got a rod like. I like that. This was another weapon.

[James Debo Harrison]

Yeah, I can't. Yeah. 30. What would I gave up 30 something in the last five, four, five, six games. That's. That is not stellar defense. That is not stellar football. Nothing about that correlates to the black and gold. Nothing. Nothing.

[Joe Hayden]

Yeah, you correct you. I'm with you on it.

[James Debo Harrison]

At least I got something good to talk about. The Browns.

[Joe Hayden]

You the worst, bro.

[James Debo Harrison]

Literally. I mean, well, I mean, I'm sorry. The Browns ended up losing to. To the Patriots, 32 to 13. Joe, I. I actually was, you know, a little concerned that they might be able to do something, especially, you know, when they went out there right after. Go ahead. I'll let you. I'll let you do your thug. This one that, you know, I'll let you get excited because you only got. Only thing you got to be excited about is, you know, maybe the first half.

[Joe Hayden]

Yeah, Honestly, Debo. Honestly, I had. I had the first quarter. I'mma go with the first quarter. I was. I was good. I was good to go. Whole first quarter. Excited.

[James Debo Harrison]

Yes, sir. Happy.

[Joe Hayden]

Like. Like. Okay. Okay. You know what I'm saying? All right, let's just.

[James Debo Harrison]

Let's just.

[Joe Hayden]

Let's get to the game. Patriots. So they started out Patriots got the ball first. You know, 12 plays. And this is the.

[James Debo Harrison]

We. We're.

[Joe Hayden]

We're Ben. But don't break on. On the Brown secondary, Henderson was running the ball may. They ended up getting down there, but we ended up making three stops. Miles Garrett got his first sack, you know what I'm saying, on the third down. Field goal.

[James Debo Harrison]

Yeah.

[Joe Hayden]

So good. They started off Bimber. Don't break. They made some plays. Three out. Browns get the ball. All right, first drive. Drive the ball all the way down. We make some. And. And this is the part too. Dylan Gabriel, he didn't throw. He didn't have to throw the ball too Far down air passes, no air yardage was not a lot, but we were able to get some runs. We was able to get some sweeps. And then he threw a touchdown pass and it was really offensive play call. And we were scheming this. We threw some jets. The just. He was kind of wide open when he came out of the backfield. Ran the seven round. So we up seven, three off. Rip good. Happy Patriots get the ball back. You know what I'm saying?

[James Debo Harrison]

Hey, let me stop you for a minute. Let me stop. I got a phone call. I ain't gonna say who was from. Okay? And they was geeked excited, you know, they was real geeked inside. They said, oh, oh, oh, what happened? What happened? What's going on? I said, listen, man, it's early. Listen, even a broke clock is right once a day now. The sun shine on every dog's ass once in a while. Go on here. Hilarious.

[Joe Hayden]

But I actually was a little geek. So the Patriots come back out. Browns defense gets a stop on third and one, trying to run through. Boom. Good stop. Browns get the ball back. Punt incomplete passes. You know Dylan Gabriel. Okay, so, yeah, we fund again. Now this. Now this is where. All right, the Patriots, they. They. My man, the linebacker, we got Carson Swearinger, he gets a pick on the. And then we bring it back to the 34 yard line. We're up 73.

[James Debo Harrison]

Yes, sir.

[Joe Hayden]

So I'm like, defense is still balling. Now this is our time to make a good play.

[James Debo Harrison]

All right?

[Joe Hayden]

We get down to third and.

[James Debo Harrison]

Hey, Joe, what happened?

[Joe Hayden]

What happens is we get to a third and five, and this is what I'm saying. Dylan Gabriel, my man, is running scot free down the sideline, and he throws the ball out of. And carries him out of bounds. I don't think he could see over the line or nothing, but it was enough time for him to stand up in the pocket and just throw the ball into the end zone. He drips it and throws out of bounds. And then you know what we do? We miss the field goal. And after. From the pick, from the defense, from the turnover, like, yeah. To get the ball on 34 yard line to not get no points.

[James Debo Harrison]

So, hey, you know what that is?

[Joe Hayden]

That's that's just bad ball. That's what that is.

[James Debo Harrison]

That's the Browns, man. Go ahead, baby.

[Joe Hayden]

So then the. The Patriots. So then the Patriots get the ball back. You know what I'm saying? Dry the ball. Doing good. Our secondary just. Bimba, don't break. They still made a couple of plays running down the field. Miles Garrett, another sack. His second sack. And then they only. We only bimp it on.

[James Debo Harrison]

Break.

[Joe Hayden]

We give up another field goal. It's seven, six.

[James Debo Harrison]

Like, right, right.

[Joe Hayden]

Defense is. Is hooping. We're putting them in positions to win. We already got a turnover into the red zone. And the offense didn't give us no points, didn't give us nothing from it. Okay, I'm getting. Okay. Browns get the ball again. Third and four. Can't convert.

[James Debo Harrison]

What?

[Joe Hayden]

Punt. We punt it back to the Patriots.

[James Debo Harrison]

That's a damn shame.

[Joe Hayden]

They get a. The Patriots are doing good. They get a false start on third and one. We'll mix it. Third and six, and then we make another play. Make them punt the ball again.

[James Debo Harrison]

You hear?

[Joe Hayden]

This is a lot of punts. A lot of Patriots now punting the ball. They're not. They're getting to the red zone. They're getting three. So they only have six points right now. The Browns defense is continuing the ball. Then Browns ball. Browns get the ball back again. And this is where I'm looking at Coach Stefanski like, what. What are we doing? Okay, the play calling. Dylan Gamble does a good scramble. We get a first down, and then he starts doing a first. First down. We do a flea flicker. Okay, what are you doing? Second down. My man. My man. Juggins gets a run. Loss of yardage in the fourth down. I mean, we try to do a double pass, and I actually laughed at it because it looked crazy. I knew it wasn't going to work. So we get nothing out of that punt. Patriots get the ball back. May does his thing, create some plays. Miles Garrett gets another sack going before halftime. They get another field goal. So we go. So all this is they. They scored three field goals. They continue to get to the red zone. It's just defense keep stepping up, keep standing up. Miles Garrett keeps making plays. Ben and Bideau, break. They're making some plays. They're getting big yard chunk plays on us, but we're not letting them score. Offense isn't answering now. Now it's a whole.

[James Debo Harrison]

Now is where I want to talk. I mean, go ahead. Keep going. This is when.

[Joe Hayden]

So it's nine to seven. Okay? And now defense is balling. They keep on getting you positions, but eventually the dam's gonna break. I mean, how much. How many times can I keep. Like, you know what I'm saying? I need you. You scratch my back, I scratch your back. That's what I normally like, you know what I'm saying?

[James Debo Harrison]

Like, I'm just trying to tell you The. The quarterback for. For the Patriots. Dylan. Dylan Gabriel was giving. Giving them the ball. He was. He was throwing it to his teammates over there in New England.

[Joe Hayden]

Hey, look, I was always talking about. The one thing I did say about Dylan Gabriel was he didn't turn the ball over. And something changed in this second half of the game. He wasn't not only helping us, he was also hurting us in a way of tossing the ball to the other team. And I think I see why he doesn't throw the ball too far down the field, because when he threw that deep ball to covered man, that one hand picked it like Odell. I was like, whoa. Maybe this is why you only throw the ball. Check down little drag routes. That was not good. That did not look on time. It looked like you almost threw your shoulder out of socket. So, I mean, we're going to get to that play. We start off, the Browns get the ball. We come out third and nine. It just looked like a bad scramble. Two receivers in the same position tipped it, incomplete, punt. Then the Patriots get the ball. What do we do on defense? We start.

[James Debo Harrison]

Y' all did what y' all started.

[Joe Hayden]

Letting people run through us. Henderson was running through the defense in the second half like shredded cheese. And it was actually a little. It was. It was sad to see Bad eyes by the second, Bad eyes by the secondary, bad eyes by the secondary. They went seven plays, seven plays, 77 yards for a touchdown. It was a lot of like. Like the same thing I was saying for the Steelers on defense. It looked like the Browns with eye discipline. People running scot free. You know who your man is. You could tell when you look and you see somebody looking like this, and then they have to go and run the other way. I'm like this dude. You're not looking at your job. You know what I'm saying? So it was a lot of quick switches, a lot of people just missing where that man was. Went down there, 16 7, right? So they end up scoring. And the score goes to 16 7. And then the Browns get the ball back. This is our second drive. So the first one, we didn't do nothing. We got three and out. And the next series, this one, it starts to get real bad. Gabriel throws a drag route two yards behind the receiver, behind the receiver. Robert Splikak picks the joint off, smiling like. Like a. Like a kid on Christmas Day, and starts running it back to the. To try trying to run back to the end zone.

[James Debo Harrison]

I told you he got confused because he was. He thought he was playing.

[Joe Hayden]

Ran it Back to the seven yard line. Okay, Miles Gary gets his fourth sack. Then my man Tyrone Campbell gets hurt. And then Diggs gets a touchdown. So now the score is 237 and it's in.

[James Debo Harrison]

It's.

[Joe Hayden]

And it's getting. And it's getting ugly fast.

[James Debo Harrison]

Okay, but what happened on that next drive, right?

[Joe Hayden]

Okay. We couldn't really get nothing going. And this is.

[James Debo Harrison]

I'm talking about the Patriots. I'm talking about the Patriots.

[Joe Hayden]

The Patriots. Next draft. Oh, it was. It was another. It was another TD to booty.

[James Debo Harrison]

What. What happened? What happened? Because I, you know, I think that was. That was a long drive.

[Joe Hayden]

Yeah, it was a lot. It was a lot. Drake May was scrambling. They had a 49 yard, 49 yard play. 27, 28 yard play. DF so the 30 to 7 depot. Okay, from this point, from. It just started getting uglier and uglier. Fourth quarter starts, Browns get the ball. Good scam. I just turn over on down.

[James Debo Harrison]

Hey, what's this? What's this? What's this? Joe with this?

[Joe Hayden]

That means the safety. We didn't. We didn't get a safety though, did we? Oh, yeah, yeah, we did. Yeah, we did. No, we didn't. It's just from that point.

[James Debo Harrison]

Hey, Joe. Crashing a little bit, right? It was, it was. You was a little more disgusted than what you thought, huh? Hey. Yeah, this is the crazy.

[Joe Hayden]

Gabriel took it. Yeah, he did. He damn sure did. He definitely took a safety. He was in the end zone trying to throw the ball away to nobody.

[James Debo Harrison]

Now this is why I'm trying to tell you, you getting a little more upset over this. You giving me all this positive energy about. Oh, the still is this, that it ain't bad. And then you just crashed right there. Yeah.

[Joe Hayden]

You know why? Debo, I.

[James Debo Harrison]

You want some of that?

[Joe Hayden]

No, this. This is, this is what it was. That Browns game, though. It just. It was. It was. It was two halves. I just felt the defense, they. They ended up. They were going to fold, you know, and then. But the. But on the opposite side.

[James Debo Harrison]

Hold on, hold on. How you go forward, you know, one.

[Joe Hayden]

No, you're not, you know, you're not going to fold. They need to play. They have to play Elite every single snap. Like the reason why when I'm watching the Steelers and I don't get as emotional because I know on the offensive side of the ball, when you have Aaron Rodgers, you're going to be able to make something happen. You know what I'm saying? Like he's going to be able to use his Feet, he's scrambling. He's throwing the ball down the field. Like, I've seen it. I know that he's capable of it. I know that he's working on it. I know that he's one of the best to ever do it. So that's why.

[James Debo Harrison]

Oh, so you're saying you just ain't got no hope?

[Joe Hayden]

No, no, no, it's not that. I mean, not that I don't got no hope, but with. With Dylan Gabriel, I mean, if we thinking that he's going to be the way. The reason why the Browns can continue and get better. And then it didn't help at all that Juckins had nine carries for 19 yards. We couldn't get ahead of the sticks at all. Offense just look bad, period. Like, it wasn't his. It wasn't only Dylan Gabriel. It was the offensive line. Wasn't. Wasn't given the. Wasn't giving my man Juggins a chance to run the ball. So it was all. It was just all bad on.

[James Debo Harrison]

Oh, I mean, you still gave up like almost 180 yards rushing on that number one defense, I believe. You know, that's not really.

[Joe Hayden]

No, no, no, I. I.

[James Debo Harrison]

Know. I think old dude only had like maybe what, nine, 10 carries for about 80 yards. He was busting y' all in the head. I think what Henderson was like, we gotta type.

[Joe Hayden]

It was too. We gotta play good the whole game. You can't that. And that's the. And that when you don't. When you know you're not going to score any points, you can't give up. And you. You could. All of that stuff is going to matter. So we got to look at the taste. You mean like Bimba don't break. A lot of the times he did get a bunch of those yards, they didn't score. He kept them out of the end zone. But some of the passing. We got to keep those passing touchdowns, those eye disciplines, you know what I'm saying? We got to keep them dudes out of the end zone. So. Yeah.

[James Debo Harrison]

You know what's crazy, though? Drake made that boy one 18 for 24 for 282. And y' all sacked him six times. He still went on here, got three tugs and threw a picture. Y' all said, here, I'm gonna give y' all something to give you a little bit of hope.

[Joe Hayden]

Then we gonna snatch what I'm saying, you know, once you get that pick and bring it. When you get the pick, run the ball back to the 34 yard line and you get nothing. You just. I'm telling you, listen, you just come back out to.

[James Debo Harrison]

The boy was sitting over there, and he's like, yo, May threw a pick. I ain't gonna let this boy outdo me. I gotta throw two.

[Joe Hayden]

I gotta throw two, Debo.

[James Debo Harrison]

And you know, that's. That's what. You know, that's. That's just what happens, man. But your. Your boy Miles Garrett, you know, he was a little frustrated with losing, you know, despite having five sacks. Hey, Miles, I understand your frustration, but when you signed that contract, you knew you signed for the money. You can be frustrated all you want. If you really that frustrated, tell them you'll give them back some money if you. If they trade you to a contender. You ain't that frustrated, though. No, you knew you signed up to get that money, play your game, and lose, because that's what the Browns do. At least you're getting paid extremely well. Yep. Extremely well for a team that, you know, ain't gonna really go nowhere. I mean, you. You. You said you love the game and all that other stuff and you want to win, but you ain't love it enough to turn that money down.

[Joe Hayden]

Yeah.

[James Debo Harrison]

I mean, so we can't. You know, I understand. You go be frustrated. Nobody like losing. You know what I'm saying? I don't like losing either, but I can't say that either. If I had to lose, I would love to get paid a whole lot more to do it, but I've been in a situation where I've won them and lost them, and I would far give up way more money to win them than I would to lose them.

[Joe Hayden]

Yeah, I think in my situation, man, like, obviously, when you had those contract negotiations, you knew before it happened, like, you can be able. This is your time. You need to get up out of there. You want to get out of there. You've been there for seven years when I was there. If you don't feel like the organization is really doing, moving in the right steps, there's organizations that you see, like Eagles, Kansas City, spots that continuously are making playoff runs, continuously winning Super Bowls during that time. Miles, when it's now your contract is about to be up, you cannot sign nothing and just wait until you can go to a free agent or till they got to try to franchise tag you. But you can hold to your really, like, no, I'm not going to play here. Once you get there, you're in there. You know what I'm saying?

[James Debo Harrison]

Especially with what you were telling everyone. I just don't want to. I I, I, I want to be with a contender. I want to do this. I want to win. It's not about the money. And then you let them hit you with the money. All money.

[Joe Hayden]

And this the part I would say with Miles too. He was going to get that money from any team. Any team would have paid Miles $40 million a year. Anybody.

[James Debo Harrison]

Hey, but a bird is more than.

[Joe Hayden]

A bird in the feather. I feel you. But, but that, but that's what, but that's the part where I'm saying I'm with you, Debo. I'm with you because you keep. If you saying that I want to be with a contender, like I'm trying to go go somewhere I want to go in. And then you sign with the Browns again. I'm like, what did they tell you that that makes you think that the direction was going to be different than what was been there the last seven years that you were there. Like now that you're there, you can't, I mean you can be sad that you're losing, but it's like you, you kind of know what you signed up for because it hasn't been different than any other thing that you've done since you've been there. Like you gonna hoop. That's not, I'm, nobody's questioning that. But the losing is still gonna come with you going all pro every year with you still going, you know what I'm saying, all the Pro Bowls. Right. So that's just the part where I'm like young. If you really was like wanting to go win and I know and I'm not and I'm not saying he doesn't. I know he wants to bring in Cleveland. That would be the best because they, you will be. You're gonna be idolized. Cause they never won. So you. That's what I want.

[James Debo Harrison]

Exactly.

[Joe Hayden]

When there you, you'll be idolized. You're gonna be good. But don't now say like there's no.

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[Joe Hayden]

You got to be all in it now. You got to be like, yeah, well, in there with ownership. Like, man, what's up? What we doing here? Like, because you in there, you're not going nowhere.

[James Debo Harrison]

Come on now. You talking about he got to be in there with ownership. You've been there, Joe.

[Joe Hayden]

You think they ain't going to let that man in there with ownership. He got his 40. They paying him his money, so he can't.

[James Debo Harrison]

I'm just saying I want to stick with the Browns, but I want to ask you a question. You said Dylan Gabriel is not the reason they're winning as long as he's not the reason they're losing. Right now I see him as the reason that they're losing. Do you believe that Shador should remain the backup? They say they go stick with Dylan starting. Do you believe Shador should get a shot?

[Joe Hayden]

I believe that Shador should definitely. I mean, now is about time. Should be able to get his shot. I think they go, they're going into the bye week. They're coming off of a bye week, and I think they're playing the Dolphins when they come off their bye week. So I know they're not going to give Shador his shot because coach is all in for Dylan Gabriel. They going to give him as many opportunities as possible. And I think if, if this, if it was a game and they knew that Shador was going to come off a bye week, give him that whole week to study up for Miami. I think he might come out there and look and looking sweet. So, I mean, I think that it's, it's about that time that he should be able to go out there and play because Dylan hasn't proven to be. I know for sure, a franchise quarterback, but not adding any real. He's not helping us. But now he's starting to kind of. Now he's starting to hurt the team.

[James Debo Harrison]

Yeah. I mean, what you go do y' all already two and six. You know, you're last in the AFC North. Of course, Pittsburgh is still sitting on top. For now, we're four and three. But I'm with you. Like, I'll Maybe. Maybe they're giving it one.

[Joe Hayden]

I think they're gonna give him one.

[James Debo Harrison]

More week for sure, you know, and they. And when they play the Dolphins. Speaking of the Dolphins, The Dolphins went out there and Molly Wap. Atlanta 34, 10, bruh. Dude said he woke up with a swollen eye. Glad he was able to play. He said, I went out there and did this to you boys with my eyes shut. That's basically what he's saying. I mean, that's. That's what I got from. It would. I mean that. Which. What did you get from that statement that he, you know, I woke up with my eyes, went up out there and put. Put. Put the whammy on him. And also, I really think that Atlanta came in there thinking it's the Dolphins dude, thinking it was sweet. Thinking it was sweet, Dude. Like, you don't realize you ain't got Phoenix. You know, he's not playing this game. You. You sitting up there with cousins, you know, and then it's just un. Like, Bijan, he didn't. He didn't do business.

[Joe Hayden]

No things. Not at all, man. I ain't gonna lie to you. That Dolphin. Dolphins defense didn't. Didn't act like they was the worst defense. They came out there and balled out. They held Bijan to 25 yards. Brody on nine carries.

[James Debo Harrison]

Yeah, I mean, I don't know what it was, dude. They. They got. I don't know. They probably stood up, put their foot on the ground, you know, and. And said. You know what, man? Enough is enough. Yo, I used to have a shirt in college, like, we was getting whooped so bad, bro. Our slogan for that year was enough. I swear, bro. I know that's. Dude, it's horrible, bruh. But it. The thing was enough is enough, dud. Like. Yeah, that's not. That's not.

[Joe Hayden]

No, it'd be like that sometimes.

[James Debo Harrison]

It was toting the rock on them.

[Joe Hayden]

Yeah, they ran for 141, two or three for four TDs. 20 for 26, 205, dude.

[James Debo Harrison]

Right. For only. Only on 20 completions. That boy got four. And it was only 200 yards, like maybe two, five. Maybe you need to do a pirate thing. Just wear a patch over his eye before the game. Be like, I can't see. And then when he go back out there, you know, he work, you know, work that match. I don't, I don't.

[Joe Hayden]

I think it was too though, at the end of the day, their run game did good. Like you said, they ran for the Dolphins, ran for 141. They said the first in the first quarter, that TD drive was 13 plays, 79 yards for 8 minutes and 30 seconds. And they did 10. And they did 10 runs on that drive. So you can be able to, if you come in that joint like you said, man, just establish dominance, run the ball, hand it off directly and walk it down the field. Taking off time like that's Tua. Didn't have to really. You ain't gonna have to do too much. And that's gonna open up that play action to where like you see Waddle, all them dudes, them bang eights, them quick play actions where Waddle was able to get that like 50, some yard touchdown catch. He was like catching that because they running the ball so well. Play action. Able to have the linebackers shoot up and just toss it behind them.

[James Debo Harrison]

Yeah, for sure. Going over here, listen to jets just went on ahead, came back and, and the Bengals, they'll be Cincinnati 39 to 38. I ain't gonna lie. I was a little questionable on why he was going for two, but now I see why he was going for two. That's why, I guess you start doing things to get that win. You know, if he hadn't did that, it might have went into overtime. They let, they let Joe go ahead and do it. Justin Fields, they say he was, he was crying on the ground after Willie Johnson's criticism. Calls it outside noise after leading the jets to his first win. We got some sound. We got the sound for that. Let's play that. Yesterday I'm praying, I'm praying like crazy. Just, just for a win, just for a win. And you know, this, this I'm gonna get pretty vulnerable right, right here. But this week I kind of, you know, I found myself in my closet crying on the ground, laying down. Not because of, not because of the hardships, not because of the troubles. I felt like, you know, I was built to handle that and I was put in place to handle this situation. But in that moment when I was talking to my best friend, you know how hard it was and just, you know, not Wavering faith wise. Yesterday I was just. I was just praying over and over and over again like, yo, like, this is just one. One win. Yeah. I don't know about. I don't know about praying for a win. I pray for. I pray for health, I pray for protection, you know, being. Being safe from injury or harm.

[Joe Hayden]

And Asia.

[James Debo Harrison]

Yeah. Yeah. I don't. I don't. I don't know if the, the prayer for when is. Is the thing to go. I think if that's the case, everybody pray for a win. Somebody gotta lose. Yeah. So, I mean, it's. It's cool. But, you know, what happened is y'. All, Y' all started running the ball down them boys throats. You know, you started. You started being able to. To make some connections, you know, here and there. And the big thing is Cincinnati's defense did what Cincinnati's defense had done the previous before last week, the previous weeks, all before that. And you know, as they got to stand up. That's not. Yeah, that's. That's. That's not what you want. And the offense, you know, I mean, with Joe over there, dude, they're. They're nice. It's just they got to get the defense, the defense. Defense, you still need defense. Pittsburgh, you need defense. Your defense got to go out there and do their job too.

[Joe Hayden]

They got to as well. If you score 38 points, like, in no situation, you're feeling like you should ever lose these games, you know what I'm saying?

[James Debo Harrison]

Like 30, dude, they had almost 180, 185 yards of rushing, dude. Like, Flacco was 2, 32, 20 something.

[Joe Hayden]

Flaco, 223, two touchdowns.

[James Debo Harrison]

Like, that is not a performance that you should be losing. Dude, like, you're. You're Talking about over 400 yards of offense, bro. Yep. And you know what? Your defense, they want to say we can top that, we can give up.

[Joe Hayden]

I have 502 yards, 255 on the ground, 247 in the air. Like, you not gonna win like that, brother. I don't care how much Joe Flacco throwing it to Chase and Higgins. Like, you gotta be able to stand up. And I think that's where.

[James Debo Harrison]

Dude, Chase had 12 targeted. 19.

[Joe Hayden]

Oh. That's what I'm saying. They can only and they eating, but you stay scored. You still taking the L because you got to be able to make a stop. You got to stop somebody at some point of the game. It ain't.

[James Debo Harrison]

And it's not just one stop, dude. You gotta be. You gotta Be consistent for sure. You, you have to have a high rate of, of consistency of stopping people. When you, when you don't do that and you get that one stop, you know, it's like, okay, that's cool. We did it. And now say the office don't go out and, and, and, and make the points or they don't do what, what would need to be done to get you back in that position? Like, you got to come back out and make that stop. Again, I say this all the time. If the defense do their job, they are the only ones who can both stop and score. Like, I am hella hella bent on. If you do your job 100%, there's no way we can lose this game. And I think that's how. That's just the mindset that we had when I played for the Steelers. It's like, okay, the offense ain't doing nothing right now. Cool. What we got to do, we got to go sack, fumble, get a touchdown. We gotta get it picked, we gotta score. We gotta put them in a position to be able to score on a short field, an easy touchdown. Like, we gotta go out here and make it happen. And we were able to do that. And right now, we can't stop you from going 100 yards down the field. And it's disgusting. Dude, it is the most sickening feeling in your stomach to know that when you're up, defense steps on the field. If it's close, you're like, six, seven. I don't know what is going to happen, but I know in the pit of my stomach, I'm thinking, they about to go down here and score and that's gonna be it. Because we cannot stop anything, dude. They cutting through us like a knife through hot butter, dude. And then when we get in position to be able to stop it, we can't even tackle the guys. I think it was like five or six plays where somebody broke at least three tackles. Like, that is not your job is to tackle. Like, that's it, bro. When you, when they make the catch, secure the tackle, get them down. All this jack is crazy. Yeah.

[Joe Hayden]

And it wasn't like that. And I ain't going to lie. Them. Those packers receivers aren't like, oh, no, ain't no all Pros out there.

[James Debo Harrison]

It ain't.

[Joe Hayden]

It ain't no killers not to knock them at all. But you know what I'm saying, they ain't. They're not Jamar Chase, you know what I'm saying? They more just guys that are nice and they Leave. They're NFL receivers.

[James Debo Harrison]

Like we need help. Maybe we can pray. Maybe God will care. I'm telling you to make us a good defense again. Like Justin prayed for the win. Yeah, maybe, but I don't think so. A lot of things you can ask for now.

[Joe Hayden]

Them dudes, I think, man. Ah, yeah, they gotta start watching a lot. Like I said, Debo, like, like, you know, a lot of this stuff too isn't just like the scot free stuff. The, the eyes, the eye discipline. They need to. That, that's something that, that's something that they can improve on. That's something you can literally at practice do. Like, but keeping your eyes on your man. Like trying to make sure, like not getting confused because a lot of this stuff is getting beat to the flats. Coming down on the run, thinking in the play actions. You're just not reading your keys.

[James Debo Harrison]

You know what? And I believe Cam said something about, about effort. I guess he was saying he didn't think that the effort was there. I don't. And he's on the inside, so I mean, I think that's something that somebody may want to ask him if he wants to elaborate on.

[Joe Hayden]

No, for sure. You know, for sure. I mean that it, it's not, it's not too hard to see who's getting beat, who's missing assignments on every single play. You know how it is, Debo, when you go to those defensive meetings after those games.

[James Debo Harrison]

Yes.

[Joe Hayden]

That each play coach is sitting right next to people and you're getting checks and X's and like I'm on, like what are these meetings looking like, who's getting addressed? Like this is not okay, these plays. And like, why is it a coaching thing? The coach is not telling them what to be looking at. Are they correcting the players? Are they not? You know what I'm saying?

[James Debo Harrison]

Like, I will, I will say this though. I know that this is not the defense that we used to have. It is not that true. Dick Le fire zone defense that had rules and schemes.

[Joe Hayden]

This is for. This is some new. This is what, this is what ta got. This is what ta putting up now.

[James Debo Harrison]

I know when I got back back in 14, even when, you know, coachable boy had just, they had just, you know, let him go. It was changed. They had trying. They had tried to change things to make it easier for guys to play and not have to think. But dude, if you don't have a complicated system or defense and be able to execute it and understand it and you try and change one thing for this person and one thing for that person, you put too many gaps and holes in the defense and you're not gap sound. And when you're not gap sound, you're not able to stop anything, dude. And on top of that, like, we couldn't even stop the little simple two point conversion because it was nobody on that half and field. Like, they're not understanding or they're both not understanding. And with that not understanding, you can't execute it correctly.

[Joe Hayden]

Yeah, some gotta shake because it looks kind of. It's looking.

[James Debo Harrison]

Some gotta give. We have players, dude. Like, we have players that can make plays like. And then when we're in position, they.

[Joe Hayden]

Have to make those plays. Like those missed tackles, bro. That's, that's, that's.

[James Debo Harrison]

I'm going to sit there and tackle all day on Wednesday. We're going live to the ground. It's none of that. To the ground. It's none of that. Oh, I tagged him off and I made it. No, we're not doing that.

[Joe Hayden]

And then on top of season, Debo.

[James Debo Harrison]

Bruh, listen, I'm gonna crash out. I told you, dude. I told you. We are down bad. We down bad, bad, bad. And on top of that, the Ravens won. They beat the Bears. They looking like they defense know how to play.

[Joe Hayden]

Like they what had. Yes.

[James Debo Harrison]

What, what they do, though, what they do? They say, hey, we getting rid of everything that y' all got that is not conducive to us being able to play football. Directed to football. PlayStation's gone, gaming's gone. All that going. Everything you do in here is going to be about playing football ball, understanding ball and focused on ball. I don't care about your free time. Your free time here should be when you eat, and in between that, you should be learning, talking to each other, figuring out what it is you're supposed to do on every single thing that you have going on. And dude, they won the game 30 to 16, bro. They gave Dave Henry about 20, 25 touches, something like that. With Smart, you got a quarterback in there who can do the sort of things that Lamar does.

[Joe Hayden]

Well, he can move, he can move around. He could like, he looks lively. You know what I'm saying? Yes, yes. That's what you got to do. The Lamar Jackson offense, you put a Lamar Jackson ish, you're not going to have Lamar Jackson, but you going to put somebody in there that can move his legs and like shake, move around.

[James Debo Harrison]

I ain't tripping that bad though, because of anybody winning. I would prefer to be the Ravens versus anybody else. Because they were, like, dead last, and now they're like, maybe third or something. I'm cool. I'm cool with that, you know, so I ain't tripping. The Eagles, they ended up whooping on the Giants, but they lost. Giants lost. They lost.

[Joe Hayden]

They lost up to that young man that's, you know, gotta blue.

[James Debo Harrison]

Sorry. It's scatterable. Scatter Boo. Yeah. I said ski boat. I said scatter Boo, Debo. Ski boat. That's why I was trying to make it rhyme. They lost Scatter Boo on that.

[Joe Hayden]

It looked crazy.

[James Debo Harrison]

Yeah.

[Joe Hayden]

This whole little ankle.

[James Debo Harrison]

Yeah. Jalen hurts, though. He fumbled on the tush push wrong. So what you. Officials wrongly ruled forward progress stopped on the tush push. You think they need the. This is my thing. At some point, when you do the tush push or any of those type of things, you get stopped. Boom. And then that's when dude comes and pushes you behind. If that's the case, as soon as he gets stopped, it should be done.

[Joe Hayden]

So the tush push then eliminates the touch push. Yes, yes. I feel you, Dee, but I'm over the touch brush.

[James Debo Harrison]

Competition committee might wanna. Might wanna look at that, though.

[Joe Hayden]

No, for sure, because, like, soon. You said if he initially stops the thing. Momentum. And then you. Then the people run up behind them. It's already done.

[James Debo Harrison]

Stop it.

[Joe Hayden]

Like, I feel like they always give him a little forward progress when it's. They going backwards or the ball falls out. Whistle, whistle, whistle. Like, it's real quick for.

[James Debo Harrison]

No, no.

[Joe Hayden]

Full momentum.

[James Debo Harrison]

Oh, we. We at that point. Before we get out of here, Joe, I think you have some videos to show me. What's that?

[Joe Hayden]

Hold up before we get out of here. Congrats to our giveaway winners. You gotta. Bri and Eddie.

[James Debo Harrison]

There they go.

[Joe Hayden]

Hey.

[James Debo Harrison]

Some great seats right there, baby.

[Joe Hayden]

Yeah, they got. They got you out there, Devo, bro.

[James Debo Harrison]

That's when everything was born. It was getting ready. It was live. That's why I'm a voice like this, bro. There they go.

[Joe Hayden]

Hey, but I got.

[James Debo Harrison]

I hope y' all had a great.

[Joe Hayden]

Time, bro, but I got. Eddie proposed to his now fiance, Nikki, and he did it. A Debo Jersey.

[James Debo Harrison]

The ticket winner.

[Joe Hayden]

Wow. I think so, brother.

[James Debo Harrison]

Let me see that.

[Joe Hayden]

Let me.

[James Debo Harrison]

He gotta have that. Okay. Congratulations.

[Joe Hayden]

Come on, man. Come on, man. Go ahead, Debo.

[James Debo Harrison]

You know what I'm saying? I'll make. I make. I'm making marriages.

[Joe Hayden]

That's what I'm talking about.

[James Debo Harrison]

You know what I'm saying?

[Joe Hayden]

Love is love.

[James Debo Harrison]

Love is in the air. Love is in the air. Even though ain't no W's, you ain't lying, right? Listen, we want to thank y' all for joining us here on Debo and Joe. Man, make sure you guys hit the like and subscribe button. We appreciate y'. All. We'll be back here tomorrow. And Joe, what you got?

[Joe Hayden]

Same bro. Monday Night Football. We're gonna be here to let y' all know how the games go. Appreciate all of y'.

[James Debo Harrison]

All.

[Joe Hayden]

Make sure you make sure you like, make sure you subscribe to Debo and Joe and.

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[Ryan Seacrest]

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[James Debo Harrison]

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[Joe Hayden]

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[James Debo Harrison]

Work, getting dressed in the car, running from the parking lot.

[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Joe Hayden]

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[James Debo Harrison]

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[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Joe Hayden]

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[James Debo Harrison]

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[Ryan Seacrest]

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[James Debo Harrison]

This is an iHeart podcast.