Nightcap - Hour 2: Unc, Ocho, and Samba discuss Thibodeau gets fired from the Knicks and Jaycee Horn goes off on NFL nerds!

Summary

Club Shay Shay Podcast: Nightcap - Hour 2 Episode Title: Unc, Ocho, and Samba Discuss Thibodeau Gets Fired from the Knicks and Jaycee Horn Goes Off on NFL Nerds!
Release Date: June 5, 2025
Hosts: Shannon Sharpe (Unc), Chad Ochocinco Johnson (Ocho), and Special Guest Simba

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1. Pro Football Focus Rankings and Jaycee Horn's Critique

The episode kicks off with a heated discussion about Pro Football Focus' (PFF) rankings of NFL cornerbacks, specifically focusing on Jaycee Horn's placement and subsequent criticism of the analysts.

Key Points:

• PFF's Evaluation of Jaycee Horn: PFF ranked Horn 25th overall, attributing his struggle to injuries despite his status as the second-highest-paid cornerback in the league.
• Host Disagreement: Both Shannon Sharpe and Chad Ochocinco Johnson argue that PFF's rankings are flawed, particularly taking issue with placing Denzel Ward at number 10.

Notable Quotes:

• Shannon Sharpe ([01:57]): "Matter of fact, let me tell you something. The fact that you know this list isn't correct."
• Chad Ochocinco Johnson ([04:32]): "Sauce was a defensive rookie of the year. All these guys are phenomenal."
• Shannon Sharpe ([04:42]): "Honestly, I mean, no disrespect, but Denzel. Denzel is top five right now. I'm talking about in the entirety of the league."

2. Debating the Top 10 Cornerbacks

The hosts delve deeper into the cornerback rankings, highlighting discrepancies and advocating for a more accurate assessment based on firsthand observations.

Key Points:

• Critique of Current Rankings: Sharpe emphasizes his extensive review of players beyond just game-day performances, including practices and game films.
• Alternative Rankings: Both hosts propose their own rankings, pushing players like Denzel Ward higher and questioning the inclusion of others like DJ Reed.

Notable Quotes:

• Shannon Sharpe ([02:03]): "No disrespect. I've watched everybody. I've watched everybody who said play..."
• Chad Ochocinco Johnson ([07:44]): "Revis had technique at the end game."
• Shannon Sharpe ([07:59]): "When it comes to playing a position, when it comes to playing DB, I've always said. I've been saying it for years. I think DB is the hardest position on the field. Outside of quarterback."

3. Tom Thibodeau's Firing from the New York Knicks

A significant portion of the episode centers on the unexpected dismissal of Tom Thibodeau from his role as the Knicks' head coach.

Key Points:

• Performance Review: Despite leading the Knicks to four playoff appearances, including back-to-back 50-win seasons and an Eastern Conference Finals appearance, Thibodeau's tenure ended abruptly.
• Shane Bowen's Comments: Rick Carlisle expressed disbelief upon learning of Thibodeau's firing, initially suspecting it to be an AI-generated announcement.
• Reasons for Termination: The discussion touches on perceived outdated coaching styles, lackluster bench management, and declining performance in critical moments.

Notable Quotes:

• Simba ([10:18]): "I kind of expected it. I kind of expected it. I feel like Tibbs, and no disrespect to Tibbs, cause he's a legend, but I feel like his style of coaching is a bit outdated."
• Chad Ochocinco Johnson ([12:11]): "No, they gonna have a new coach. He ain't gonna be the interim. He ain't gonna be nothing."
• Shannon Sharpe ([13:10]): "He does running players into the ground. They were tired. They were tired, especially when they got to the back end of the season."

4. Future Coaching Directions for the Knicks

Post-Thibodeau's departure, the conversation shifts to potential candidates to fill the head coaching vacancy.

Key Points:

• Potential Candidates: Names like Mike Malone, Frank Vogel, Budenhoser, Mark Jackson, and others are discussed as viable options.
• Local Talent Consideration: There's a sentiment towards hiring someone familiar with the New York atmosphere, with suggestions like Mark Jackson who has roots in the city.

Notable Quotes:

• Chad Ochocinco Johnson ([16:46]): "Well, you got some guys out there. You got Mike Malone, you got Budenhoser, you got Frank Vogel. Hell, give Sam Cassell a chance."
• Shannon Sharpe ([17:10]): "What about Mark Jackson?"
• Simba ([17:28]): "Mike Brown, Luke Walton."

5. Evolution in Sports: Training, Technology, and Media Influence

The hosts explore how advancements in training, nutrition, and technology have transformed modern sports, contrasting it with past eras.

Key Points:

• Improved Athlete Care: Advances in medicine have extended players' careers, allowing them to return from injuries that would have previously been career-ending.
• Impact of Social Media: The pervasive influence of social media has democratized opinions but diluted the expertise once held predominantly by former athletes and analysts.

Notable Quotes:

• Chad Ochocinco Johnson ([20:31]): "LeBron be four. No. In the finals, as opposed to four and six now, that's still four wins."
• Simba ([21:57]): "And the crazy thing about that. I just seen something the other day. I think, what was it?"

6. Personal Anecdotes: Work Ethic and Childhood Influences

Sharing personal stories, the hosts reveal the challenges and motivations that shaped their relentless work ethic.

Key Points:

• Chad Ochocinco's Upbringing: Grew up without basic amenities like running water, which instilled a profound sense of determination and resilience.
• Shannon Sharpe's Early Responsibilities: Taking care of children early in life motivated him to excel in the NFL to provide for his family.
• Simba's Personal Growth: Overcoming fear of failure and learning to trust in his own abilities without relying on others' validation.

Notable Quotes:

• Chad Ochocinco Johnson ([33:02]): "I have no running water. That'll do it. Going outside with the mosquitoes biting you..."
• Shannon Sharpe ([33:37]): "I had kids early, boy, I had kids early. And obviously my dream was to play in the NFL."
• Simba ([35:19]): "And my mom says. She said. She said, when you growing..."

7. Zion Williamson and the New Orleans Pelicans

A spirited debate ensues over Zion Williamson's future with the Pelicans, with Simba advocating for his departure to ensure his health and longevity.

Key Points:

• Zion's Importance: Zion is viewed as the face of the Pelicans, with significant investments made to retain him.
• Health Concerns: Emphasis on Zion needing a healthier environment, including better dietary options to maintain his physical condition.
• Future Prospects: Discussions on whether the Pelicans can sustain their success without Zion or if they need to facilitate his move to preserve his career.

Notable Quotes:

• Simba ([39:04]): "You got all that good food out there. You got all you got vegan options. You gotta get him out of New Orleans immediately."
• Chad Ochocinco Johnson ([40:06]): "It's hard to give up a superstar, trade a superstar, unless you're going to get one back in return."

8. Q&A Session: Evolution of the Game and Player Comparisons

In the Q&A segment, the hosts address questions about the evolution of sports, comparing different eras and discussing player legacies.

Key Points:

• Advancements in Training and Medicine: Highlighting how modern athletes benefit from superior training techniques and medical care.
• Player Comparisons: Debating where modern teams and players stand in comparison to legends from previous generations.
• Locker Room Dynamics: Addressing how respect and team harmony are maintained, referencing historical team dynamics in the NFL.

Notable Quotes:

• Chad Ochocinco Johnson ([51:42]): "It's called evolution. It's called technology. That's what happens."
• Shannon Sharpe ([57:21]): "I got Deuce McAllister. Walk down and... I'm gonna cut Deuce."

9. Light-Hearted Banter and Fitness Challenges

The episode concludes with playful exchanges about fitness routines, showcasing the camaraderie and competitive spirit among the hosts.

Key Points:

• Weightlifting Challenges: Shannon Sharpe and Chad Ochocinco Johnson engage in a friendly debate over their ability to lift heavy weights, highlighting their commitment to fitness.
• Future Plans: Plans to demonstrate their strength in upcoming gym sessions, adding a humorous and relatable end to the episode.

Notable Quotes:

• Shannon Sharpe ([46:31]): "I'm gonna go with Warwick done soon before what he does in the community. I'm gonna start war."
• Chad Ochocinco Johnson ([47:00]): "But he did it on the incline."

10. Closing Remarks and Acknowledgments

While the episode primarily focuses on in-depth sporting discussions, it wraps up with acknowledgments of guests and calls to action for listeners to support the podcast.

Key Points:

• Guest Appreciation: Special thanks to Taron Armstead and Simba for joining the conversation.
• Promotions: Encouragement for listeners to subscribe, like, and check out affiliated products and media platforms.
• Upcoming Episodes: Teasers for future episodes, including coverage of the NBA Finals.

Notable Quotes:

• Chad Ochocinco Johnson ([59:04]): "I got the tight ends, you got the running backs. You want me to go first?"
• Shannon Sharpe ([60:33]): "If you know Micah personally, he ain't falling for that."

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Conclusion

This episode of Club Shay Shay's Nightcap provides an engaging blend of in-depth sports analysis, personal anecdotes, and light-hearted banter. From dissecting controversial player rankings and coaching changes to discussing the evolution of sports training and the future of superstar athletes, Shannon Sharpe, Chad Ochocinco Johnson, and guest Simba deliver insightful and entertaining commentary. The inclusion of notable quotes with timestamps enhances the listener's understanding of key discussions, making it a valuable summary for those who haven't tuned in.

Transcript

[Shannon Sharpe]

This is an iHeart podcast.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Craftsman days are here at Lowes with big savings on the tools you need. Save $100 on the Craftsman V26 Tool Power Tool Combo Kit now at $199. No matter what the project is, Craftsman's high quality, high performance products empower you to build on Stop by your nearest Lowe's store and check out the full line of Craftsmen tools today, valid through 618 while supplies last selection varies by location. The volume The Panthers cornerback J.C. horn went up on Pro Football Focus of their top 10 cornerback rank rankings. This is what happens when you let nerds who never touch the field feel like they know ball man. Pro Football focus ranked him 25th in the NFL, saying Horn is talented but has struggled with injuries in the NFL despite being the league's second highest paid corner. Horn ranks 23rd in pro football Focus Advanced coverage grade over the last three seasons and 23rd in standard PFF coverage grade of 79.6 across the past two Sauce Gardner is 1. Pat Surtan is 2. Trent McDuffie is 3. Jalen Johnson is 4. Daryl Stangley Jr. Is 5. D.J. reed is 6. Marlon Humphrey is 7. Kristen Benford is 8, Jair Alexander is 9. Denzel Ward is 10.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Matter of fact, let me tell you something. The fact that you know this list isn't correct. The fact that Denzel Ward is all the way at 10.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

But okay, let me ask you this Ocho. Who you taking off this list and putting J.C. horn in front of?

[Shannon Sharpe]

What number? Wait, see I need to. I can't see it in front of me. Run me the first 10 real quick.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Assault Garden is one.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Passer one or two should flip, but go ahead.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Okay, Trent McDuffie is three. Kansas City Jalen Johnson, Bears four. Daryl Stingley Jr. Texans five. D.J. reed, he's with the Lions now, if I'm not mistaken, he's with the Jets. Last year he's 6. Marlon Humphrey, Baltimore Ravens 7. Christian Bedford, Buffalo Bills 8. Jair Alexander 9. Green Bay Denzel Ward 10. Now the people on that list, who you taking off and putting them on in the top?

[Shannon Sharpe]

No disrespect. I've watched everybody. I've watched everybody who said play and I'm not talking about just watching them on Sundays. I'm talking about I've seen films of them actually in practice and what they've done and I've seen the game film. Now DJ Reed, I don't know much about. I don't know much about DJ Reed. I'm going to be honest, I Haven't seen him play. I haven't watched him. So if I was to take anybody off, it'd be DJ Reed. Excuse me. I mean no disrespect to Young Bull. I'm sure Young Bull is good because he's on there for a reason, but I know, and I've seen J.C. horn play.

[Simba]

Yeah.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Consistently.

[Simba]

I'm a big Stanley fan, man.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Hey, Stingley. The real deal Blade.

[Simba]

I'm a big Stanley fan, man. I love the way he play. You know, he remind me of, like, what football used to be when I was in there watching it with my grandpa as a kid. I love his energy that he bring. But honestly, when it come to these lists, sometimes I be trying to understand what's the criteria with some of these things, like, what are they coming up with? Because sometimes it feel like they pick somebody because they got a bigger following on social media or something. It ain't got nothing to do with their game. So I'll be trying to figure out where. Where does this stuff come from?

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I agree with you. Oo. I think Pastor Tan, for me, is the best corner in football. Stingley obviously had a magnificent season. Trent McDuffie, he's never made an all pro team. I don't. I think he's made one. Let me take that back. I think he's made one, but I don't think he's ever made a Pro Bowl. He's sensational, especially in the slot. Sauce. We know what sauce is. Sauce was a defensive rookie of the year. All these guys are phenomenal. We know Marlon Humphrey is not what he once was on the outside, but.

[Shannon Sharpe]

In that slot, he's nice.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Bedford really came into his own last year. We know Jair, what he is, what he represents. Yeah, Denzel, fluid, smooth transition, looks really well.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Honestly, I mean, no disrespect, but Denzel. Denzel is top five right now. I'm talking about in the entirety of the league. You know, forget this list. I understand.

[Simba]

I think he top five.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Hey, when we talk about a technique merchant, I'm talking about, okay, technically, it don't matter. It don't matter who he playing. Well, he could be party. And he's switching up based on who he playing against, too. He gonna play everybody different. So I'm sitting there watching him depending on. Okay, let's say when they play the Bengals, for instance, the way he played T. Higgins, he played Chase different. And I'm sitting here watching this man, dog, I'm talking about. It's like art. It's like watching art because he has a different approach depending on who it is. Every single time. The naked eye, the casual fan can't see it, but I'm looking at it. I'm like, what the. And I'm into my. To me a. I'm looking at him like Sam, I'm looking like, well, damn. The defensive coordinator in Cleveland. In Cleveland gave him that much freedom to be able to do stuff like that. Normally when you get out there and line up, you line up the same way the same time based on the coverage. The coverage of the defense.

[Simba]

That's called now what you. How you think you would have reacted if he would have been guarding you, what you would have did to him, Ocho?

[Shannon Sharpe]

Oh, I would have turned that 21 to 12 playing with me. Hey, I respect. Hey, listen, I told. I forgot where it was at. It might have been super bowl or something. Boy, I sat there and told him. I told him about plays. He did though. He is a tremendous man to man corner boy, especially in bump. I talk about technique sounding when the ball in there. He never panicked, never panic.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

He played a ball.

[Shannon Sharpe]

He got elite ball skills. Him and Stingley boy got some of the best ball skills along with Sertane I've ever seen, bro.

[Simba]

No, that's why I like Stanley so much for exactly what you just broke down. And that's why I got quiet. Because you speaking from experience. I'm speaking from a fan. So you looking at it from you actually playing the game. I'm looking at it as a fan. But what I see with Stantley is kind of what you just explained. He plays. Different players difference. He can kind of play both sides of the field. He get to it. He get off his line fast. So I rock with him.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Yes, sir. He nice.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Yeah, I like guys. I like guys that travel. You know, you look at Sauce and Pat, they're kind of more. They kind of like. They're tall, angular guys. Pat is so smooth. He transitioned extremely well. The way he can flip his hips for a guy his size, it's hard pressed. You probably won't find a guy because Satan is like six two. I mean, he's a big sauce guard.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Six two?

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Yeah. Ain't no. Ain't no. Ain't no. Yeah, ain't no six foot. He's six foot? No, no, no. He's six two, Maybe even tall. Denzel Ward is maybe not that tall, but they kind of got sauce. Pat and Denzel kind of have the same body type. They're like thin framed. But sir, Tan is like as good a Technique for someone. He has good a technique. Like now. Revis has some techniques.

[Simba]

I was just thinking about Darrell Revis when you was talking earlier.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Revis had technique at the end game.

[Shannon Sharpe]

When it comes to playing a position, when it comes to playing db, I've always said. I've been saying it for years. I think DB is the hardest position on the field. Outside of quarterback.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Oh, it absolutely is.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Outside of quarterback. Revis got the patience at the line of scrimmage of Sallie Mae. Cause you know, everybody still owe them loans for years and years and years. That's the kind of patience I spoke with God. Yeah, that's kind of patience Reevis got. You can make all the moves you want. He not moving. He not budging until you go.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

He biting that first move.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Yeah, he might not, but he might not bite the second move.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Hey, Ojo, you can. You could do all this right? You doing all this right here. That was still sitting right there.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Waist. Because your waist ain't going nowhere.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Simba]

Shout out to Josh Norman, too, man. Josh Norman, he needs to lock things down out there as well.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

J verse troll puking the for looking like Lord Farquar. Watch this, y' all. I know we have famous people in the building now. Check it out. Shake it out. Check it out. Yeah. Lord Farquhar got Lord Farqu this mug. That's. That's what it's all about. That's what elo. That's what you miss. All that Jody, that goes on in ota, that goes on in many camps and training camps and all. Dude, this is what you miss, man. You can't. Where you gonna get this from, Ocho? When you leave the game, where you gonna get this from? You're not gonna be around.

[Shannon Sharpe]

It's impossible. It's impossible. You. You try to listen, you try to recreate it with your friends that have nothing to do with the game of football that you've known all your life. But it would be nothing like being in that locker room. Nothing.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Nope. All right, so we're gonna get to your favorite. We're gonna get to some NBA news.

[Simba]

Oh, yeah.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Five seasons with the Knicks, Tom Thibodeau went 226 and 174, led the Knicks to the playoffs four times, including back to back 50 win seasons, including Eastern Conference finals appearance for the first time in 25 years. Advanced. And they advanced to the East. East finals. That wasn't enough. Even Rick Carlisle said today, when I first saw it, I thought it was one of those fake AI things. No, Way. There's no way. Simba. When you first heard the news, you read it, you're like, man, they fired T. What went through your mind?

[Simba]

I kind of expected it. I kind of expected it. I feel like Tibbs, and no disrespect to Tibbs, cause he's a legend, but I feel like his style of coaching is a bit outdated. I feel he kind of looks for things that the game doesn't call for anymore and he doesn't really go deep into his bench. And by the time his players get to the fourth quarter, they gassed. And we kind of seen that in the playoffs. We seen Indiana kind of run them back and forth. He tried to get deep in the bench in basketball, just like football, anything of sports, it's a game of rhythm, you know what I mean? So you can't just throw somebody in the playoffs when they ain't been playing all season in the third quarter and expect them to knock down shots. So I think Brunson could definitely benefit from a different coach. The Knicks could. And I don't see. I seen what you guys were saying the other night. I don't see why Tibbs kind of brought Cat in if they had the same issue back in Minnesota. I kind of don't get where that came from. But I think. I think the call was a good call. It might be a bit confusing, but I think it was a good call.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

In the wake of Ocho, let me read this. In the wake of Tibbs fired, more reports have come out about the Knicks coaching staff. Multiple Knick players have reportedly been unhappy with the presence of assistant coach Rick Brunson, who happens to be the dad of Jalen Brunson. Per hoops Wire, multiple Knick players have been unhappy with the presence of assistant coach Rick Brunson, who happens to be the father of star point regard Jaylen Brunson. What that issue is exactly has not been determined, though sources suggest that Rick has too big of a say in things.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Well, is he probably gonna be the interim coach or maybe the coach that. That stepped in?

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

No, they gonna have a new coach. He ain't gonna be the interim. He ain't gonna be nothing.

[Shannon Sharpe]

So you don't think getting him.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

No, I. I don't think they know. I don't think they will give him the job. I don't think if they would have they.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Okay.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I think Leon Rose in Worldwide west who runs the Knicks for Dolan, they're looking. Is it going to be Budenhoser? Is it going to be Vogel? Is it going to be, you know, one of these guys.

[Shannon Sharpe]

What's Mike Malone?

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I like Malone.

[Simba]

I like Mike Malone.

[Shannon Sharpe]

The funny thing about it is, is Tibbs. Tibbs led the, the Knicks to one of their greatest, not greatest season, but he took him very far. It's been a very, very long time since they've been in a gain of that magnitude or a series of that magnitude. And when you look at the records of the past coaches, I mean, he's done the best. Again, I. I agree with Sam. Based on what I've come. You know, the little bit of basketball knowledge that I do have is he does running players into the ground. And they. They were tired. They were tired, especially when they got to the back end of the season, the back end of the series. Yeah, them boys ain't had no legs.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

But let me ask you a question. Okay. It's like, oh, man, they lost to. They lost to the. They lost to the Pacers. Had they. Had they lost to Boston, would you still have fired it? Because I think the thing is maybe, maybe beating the, beating the Celtics, who's the defending champs, maybe that set them on unrealistic expectations. Because now, man, we knocked off Jason Tatum and Jaylen Brown, the team that won the championship just a year ago, won 60 games, and now we lose to the Pacers. But if you go back to look at the places they got five, six guys with double figures every game, that's what they do. They're committed. So you don't know who going to light your ass up for one or two games, it might be Siakam. Another game, it might be NE Smith. Another game, it might be Halliburton. So it's hard for you to determine, well, who do we take away? Who do we take away? So I think that's what happened. I think once they beat the Celtics, everybody's like, oh, oh, man, Nick going to the finals.

[Simba]

Yeah.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Oh, we got the Pacers. The Pacers just beat y' all last year in game seven on your home court.

[Shannon Sharpe]

I was one of them people, too, right there. My bad.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

This was. This was. This was a worse matchup for the Knicks because the thing that the Pacers do, the Knicks don't do well is get back on defense. If you look at the Pacers, they're looking to run, make or miss, they'll take it out. They'll take it off the rim or take it out the net. You saw the last game on your. The Knicks make a basket, and in.

[Shannon Sharpe]

One pass, they scoring.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Pascal Siakam. Is Euro stepping Laying the ball up, up the floor. So. And you look at it. So now you got cat. And people complained. They were complaining about Cat playing defense. When have you known Cat is a defensive guy? So what? You gave up getting Mikael Bridges, all those draft picks, you weaken your bench, and in the process of weakening your bench, now you got the ride guys, got the play guys extended minutes into regular season, and you overload them come playoff time. He expanded it. But if you remember, the first couple of series, he was only playing seven guys. And then it got to the point he was playing eight, nine guys. It's too late. Too late.

[Simba]

I agree. I agree. I think. And New York might tear me up for this, but I think Boston lost that series more than New York wanted. And what I mean by that was we didn't see great coaching from Tibbs in the first two games. We seen Boston get comfortable and the Knicks make an incredible comeback twice. We didn't see great coaching and great tactics. And I think Boston kind of just like what you just said, how the Knicks felt about the Pacers, felt that way about the Knicks. Like, oh, we got the Knicks. We got this. It's easy. And they kind of got comfortable, let their feet off the gas, and they suffered in the long run.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Well, what happened was that they shooting all them damn threes. And you see what happened now when you make them, that's great. But what happens when you miss them? And now they don't because they've been so successful making those threes. Come crunch time, clutch time, they can't run no sets. They still jacking up a bunch of threes. And you see the Knicks operating every time they getting layups. They're getting whatever they want to get, man. I mean, Tim's like, well, damn, I probably. We shot. We probably should have lost to the Celtics. Because I do believe, and I could. And I could be totally wrong, Sam, but I believe because they beat the Celtics, they had unrealistic expectations. They thought they were going to have a cakewalk to the NBA Finals.

[Simba]

Yeah, I totally agree with that. Let me ask you guys this. Where do you see Tibbs going? And what do you think is the next head coach for the Knicks?

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Well, you got some guys out there. You got Mike Malone, you got Budenhoser, you got Frank Vogel. Hell, give Sam Cassell a chance.

[Simba]

There you go.

[Shannon Sharpe]

What about Mark Jackson?

[Simba]

Bring Mark back.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

He played in the Garden. He's from New York. I'm trying to think who. I'm trying to think who's a hot cannon.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Stephen A Smith.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Bad. Stephen a tried to. Stephen a tried to coach no basketball. I'm like, look, I mean, Sam, Mark Jackson. I don't even. Hell, you don't even hear. Mark Jackson ain't even mentioned for coaching.

[Simba]

Yeah, yeah. It feels like they completely pushed Mark Jackson out. I think Mike Malone would be great for New York. I think his style of coaching would be great for the city. It'd be great for Brunson. But I also think they got to bring somebody else in there that can knock down some shots. So Brunson ain't controlling the ball so much because I feel it slows the offense down when he's doing that in the fourth quarter. And sometimes when Anunoby is getting going or Cat might be getting going or Bridges might get going, now Brunson kind of comes in and he takes the next four shots, and it kind of gets everybody out of rhythm. So I definitely think they got to bring in another ball handler or score or something to help complete it.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

What about the names mentioned? I made Udoka, Jason Kidd. Both of those guys have current jobs. Jay Wright, former coach of Villanova. Luke Walton, Mike Brown.

[Simba]

Mike Brown, Luke Walton.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Where is Luke Walton at now? I just saw him on somebody. Is he with the Cavs? I saw him somewhere.

[Simba]

New York could tell. Luke Walton up, huh?

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

The Pistons. Yeah. That's where I saw J.B. bickers. Oh, J.B. bickerstaffs. But you got Budhoser, who lost the job, got a job, got fired. You have Vogel, who had a job, got a job, got fired. Mike Brown got fired after he had just signed a contract extension. Budenhoser had another four years left on his contract. Vogel had another four years left on his contract. I mean, matter of fact, feels like.

[Simba]

The last 10 years of coaches of the Year got fired.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Yep.

[Shannon Sharpe]

It got to be the right coach, too, to deal with that New York atmosphere. Everybody ain't built flat.

[Simba]

Definitely.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Draymond Green says he would rather lose in the first round than the NBA Finals. Black Sports Online tweeted about Draymond comments saying, I can call. I can call this my LeBron theory. And you can use it for any elite player, it is better to go undefeated in the finals than and go to a bunch of finals and lose. If LeBron was 4, 0 in the Finals as opposed to 4 and 6, would the perception be different if the same thing was really Simba? What do you think?

[Simba]

I agree. I 1,000% agree, man. That's a tough thing to do, right? You got to think about. You guys played Professional sports think about all the thing that goes on from on the field, off the field, right? And to win a championship or even to get to the finals, playoffs, let alone y' all gotta be on one accord, you know? So to constantly keep getting there, that shows the signs of greatness. Whether you keep failing or not, you still keep getting there. Everybody like to talk about Mike getting there six times and him winning the six rings and everything like that, but he also had a road of trying to get there. That was a process. LeBron kind of got there a little faster. So I agree with him.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Yeah. Cause LeBron be four. No. In the finals, as opposed to four and six now, that's still four wins.

[Simba]

If you ask people say LeBron got five rings. If you ask me, I count that in season tournament.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Because here's the thing, Sam. Let's just say for the sake of argument, LeBron got four rings in 22 seasons. They gonna say what he do in the other 18 seasons?

[Simba]

Go to the finals.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

So I get it. It's just like, look, social media. And social media has its place. It's done a lot of good. It's made a lot of people famous. It's made a lot of people wealthy beyond expectations. But I think the thing is that now everybody is a general manager. Everybody is a coach. Everybody is a player personnel director. Everybody is a former NFL player or former NBA player or MLB player. And so it gives. Everybody. Everybody has an opinion now.

[Simba]

Yeah.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Whereas before a lot of these guys, it'd have been very interesting if. Let's just say we start. We gonna start social media in the 80s and everybody can have an opinion. When Jordan was getting bounced in the first round, I wonder how they would take that. If he the best player, if he the goat. Because they crowned him to goat in 1989. They said he's the greatest player we've ever seen with no Finals appearances.

[Simba]

And the crazy thing about that. I just seen something the other day. I think, what was it? NBA did the deal with NBC in 89 or something like that. So we didn't even get to see, like those first couple years of Joe. Like, where's the tape of everybody talking? Like, we see highlights, but, like, we didn't get to see everything.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

So it's like, nah, you didn't see basketball game. There was not a whole lot of. You didn't get a chance opportunity to watch basketball during the week. You watch basketball on Sunday.

[Simba]

Got you.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Now, once the playoffs started, okay, that was a different story. But I. I grew up in an Era where the games were tape delayed, even the NBA Finals, the playoff was tape delayed. You didn't get an opportunity to see those.

[Simba]

Wow.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

So, and when, when, when it first started, the first round was the best two out of three. You win two games and then you advance and then you went to the semifinals. And if you won three out of five, the best of seven wasn't till the conference finals and the NBA finals. And it used to be you got three shots to make two at the free throw line. So once you got to the bonus, you got three shots to make two.

[Simba]

Yeah, see, I think Bron would have dominated in that era. And just like if we look at it like the road LeBron had to travel, right, we talking about somebody that's coming in from high school, he 18, 18 years old, all this criticism on him. And this is like when the Internet is kind of coming into his. Absolutely got an opinion on him. Mike didn't necessarily have to deal with that type of pressure. Now, Mike did deal with people outside the hotel rooms waiting on them and newspaper articles. But like you just said with social media today, it's one thing, it's a bittersweet thing. Everybody has an opinion, but everybody opinion is invalidated because they haven't done it right. So I can't come to you, unk and tell you I think you wrong about anything in football. I ain't never played in the NFL. Who am I to tell you as a fan saying, I could give you my opinion. And that's what I always try to speak from, from a fan perspective.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Right.

[Simba]

But when we talking about people that did it at a high level, sometimes you just gotta shut up, you know what I mean, and listen to what the greats is saying.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I mean, it's not very often that an 18 year old gets to come in. He's the number one overall pick and they hand him the keys to the franchise. They said, okay, we're gonna go. We're only gonna go as far as you take us.

[Simba]

And he lives up.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

He didn't have a whole lot of experience. He didn't get an opportunity to go to college and learned under a legendary coach. He didn't. I mean, think about what he had. He came from a single parent home and he bounced around. So everything that you see, he's kind of like had to get it on his own. He had like trial and he hadn't had, you know, he hadn't had any missteps for the most part. Yeah, you could say people like, well, what about the decision? Well, The Girls and boys club got 500,000. Exactly. That wasn't a misstep.

[Simba]

Exactly.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Cause guess what? Somebody wanted to hear it. I tell you what. You think it's misstep if he wasn't who he was? Tell somebody else to have a decision.

[Simba]

Yep.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

And see how they get covered.

[Simba]

Yeah, I'm totally with you. I think in my opinion, Bron is the greatest to ever do it. I think he went up against some of the greatest talent. Right. Like Dwight Howard. We talking about Baby Shaq in his prime. Like, you gotta go up against that seven games. Right. You gotta go up against the San Antonio Spurs. So he beat the Spurs. You know what I mean? Like, they had to go up against the Dallas Mavericks, who was incredible. We may not look at them as the most athletic team, but them as a team, the Dallas Mavericks, around that time, they were incredible. And then to top it off, Kevin Durant and the Warriors.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Yeah.

[Simba]

You know what I mean?

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

That's my thing.

[Simba]

Everything he had to go up against.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Where would you. And that's what I always tell people. Of all the NBA champions, where would you rank that 1718 warriors team? How many teams in history would you have over them? Let's just go back to the 90s when Jordan won his championships. What team did he face? Was the 1718 warriors? Was it Seattle?

[Simba]

No.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Was it Utah?

[Simba]

No.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Was it Portland?

[Simba]

No.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Was it Phoenix? I'm just trying to figure out. And so you looking at it. Look, I mean, think about it. On that team, you got Steph and Clay. I mean, Steph and Draymond, all 75 team. You look at Portland. Not Portland, San Antonio. Tim Duncan's all 70, 75th anniversary team. Kawhi, 75th anniversary team. Manu is not a 75th anniversary guy, is he? I don't think so. Or Tony Parker is. Tony Parker won. I don't think Tony Parker won.

[Simba]

I think so.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Yeah, but. But they make it seem like the only. The. The only. The only. The only team that I think they should have beat. But when you go back and look at it, the Mavericks swept. See people sweep this under the rug, Sam. That Mavericks team swept the Lakers team that had just went back to back.

[Simba]

I just said we. We forget about that. Because they weren't the most sexy, they wasn't athletic, but that was.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

They swept the Lakers that had just went back to back. They had a gentleman sweep on okc.

[Simba]

Yup.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

But still, for me, I think that was the only time that LeBron has probably been favored and he didn't win.

[Simba]

And it was a thing I truly believe of him. And D. Wade didn't know who team it was yet. So I think.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Can you make that case?

[Simba]

I think they was looking for each other to lead and kind of see who was going to take the lead. And it was kind of getting too late. By that time, the Mavericks had already won two games.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Right? Adam Silver on the NBA All Star Game next season at the Clippers Intuit Dome. The All Star Game will feature some form. Team USA versus Team World. All Star Game now will be in the afternoon instead of the evening. You like that change, Sam?

[Simba]

I don't know. I don't know. I feel like All Star Game is. It's been a tragedy the past few years. Oh, man, it's been a tragedy. And I think when things keep becoming a tragedy and you keep trying things and it's not working. Just go back to the original way. Just go back to the original way.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

But the thing is, though, they don't play anymore. See them, I don't want to see no games and the NBA scoring 200 points them.

[Simba]

But, you know, now all it is.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Is dunks and threes. They ain't play no defense.

[Simba]

But you know why that is? Huh? You know, like, I know those weekends ain't about the game no more.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

N part of the city.

[Simba]

It used to be about the game. You, they not coming in there. Anthony Edwards had about nine events on Saturday, seven on Friday, three on Thursday, a brunch on Sunday before the game. I'm tired, man. They got me doing all this. So they, they gotta find a way to bring the events kind of down a little bit or something to get these players time to kind of enjoy their families, enjoy their week off and show up on Sunday ready to play and play.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

They gotta play. But Ocho, I, I, I said this, I remember when I, when I saw this thing going left with the Pro Bowl, I said, they gonna cancel this before you know it. Nah, man, not, I'm telling you, they not finna keep paying y' all this money. They paying y' all, Ocho, they paying them a hundred thousand just to compete. I remember. And we was. Ocho, you went. Shortly after I left the league, y' all probably was making 15, 20,000 tops.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Yeah, it wasn't that much.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Now they making. Now you get 80, you get a hundred thousand if you win, you get 50, 75,000 if you lose. And God, now they out there playing touch football now they've turned it into a flag football. And they got all these festivities where, you know, you try to hit the bullseye and you hit a moot. I'm like, come on, dude.

[Shannon Sharpe]

I don't think back then when we played on, I mean, everything, it was about competing, and it was competitive. Might have been an all star game. It might have been a pro bowl where, you know, those that were selected. But when it was time to play, man, hey, Sam boy, it was real. You know, when George, Kobe and them boys and Shaq, them boys, when they made all. When they had all star game, oh, they was finna play.

[Simba]

I feel like, too, it was a different level of focus back in y' all time because it wasn't so many distractions. So everybody was kind of like zoned in on their craft, zoned in on what it is they did. So when they came to play with the ocho, right? When Charles woodson got a guard of ocho, he want to prove his point out there.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Absolutely. I'm trying to prove mine.

[Simba]

Yeah. Now, everybody okay.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I told Ocho, I said, look, when I went across that water, I was looking to light somebody ass up one on one. Cause I didn't want you to think you get back to the mainland and can cover me. You couldn't cover me across the water. You can't cover me on the mainland. So don't even come over with that bull job now.

[Simba]

Yeah.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Oh, that's fine.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

But I was just like. And the thing is, like you said, now it's a layup or three point shot. Oh, but I said, bro, y' all quick to holler Jordan. Y' all quick to holler Kobe. Y' all don't say nothing about them. When it comes to the all star game, y' all don't mention Kobe or Jordan. But y' all quick. That's all about. They was killers.

[Simba]

Yeah.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Okay. When y' all gonna be turning some killers? At the all star game.

[Simba]

Yeah. I think it's just a different time now, Unk. Like, man, I seen this shout out to Jason Crow Jr. A young player coming up out here in California. I went to one of his games, and I seen a few players, and they was just talking. And one of these kids was like, long as I get an nil deal, I don't even worry about going to NBA.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Yeah.

[Simba]

And I was like, man, like, the competitive nature of just grinding and wanting to achieve your goal, and that process is gone now because these kids getting so much money. You go to some of these colleges, the parking lot look like a Benz dealership. Like it does. It's different.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

It ain't no more. Ain't no more scat packs, no Hellcats. And all them track halts. Them jokers got Ferraris, they got Lambos, they got Cullodens in there.

[Simba]

Yep.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I'm like, damn.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Listen, hey, Sam, that's a short dream. You short changing yourself. No, the big dream, the big money. I mean, listen, Nil ain't nil. That's gonna.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

That's good money. Hey, that'll hold you over, but I'm trying to get the 50, 70, 100.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Million until you see everybody else. You play with getting 250 million. And you talk about some IL money. Man, she speaking.

[Simba]

Speaking of that, quick question for both of y' all. What's something from you guys childhood that fueled your work ethic?

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I have no running water. That'll do it. Going outside with the mosquitoes biting you, and you got to take rage and spread to keep the mosquitoes off you. And you got to put a. You got to put an overcoat on to go go out in the woods. That'll motivate you. You ain't got no indoor plumbing. You ain't got no running water. You ain't got no air condition. That'll motivate you. You. I mean, you go like a warehouse, and they got cement floors. That's what we had. That'll motivate you. You got a tin roof and you can look up and you can see the sun. That'll motivate you. Sometimes an empty stomach is all the motivation you need.

[Shannon Sharpe]

I had kids early, boy, I had kids early. And obviously my dream. My dream was to play in the NFL. And I had put in too much work as a little shorty, as a legit. I not. I had to make it. I told myself, I'm gonna make it to the league. I remember telling coaches in high school, remember telling teachers I was gonna make it. They told me I never. I never was going to mount to nothing. I needed that. He gave me and gave me a little chip. So I'm gonna make it, obviously. And having kids early, so I had to be. I gotta take care of these kids, boy. I ain't had no choice. And I wanted to be good at my craft. I wanted to be good. I didn't need the best. But whenever I left the game, people gonna say, boy, he was one of the. One of the best to ever play.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

That was motivating. Boy, an empty stomach and an empty wallet. What more motivation you need facts.

[Shannon Sharpe]

And I ain't need nobody else, too.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

What else you need? That's it. Your grandma's Like a. A boy ain't got no light, ain't got no phone, the phone off. Cause you can't pay a 50 phone bill and they got no lights. So, you know, you gotta. You gotta. My grandma gotta juggle some stuff around and you gotta make do until she can come up till the next payday.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Yeah.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Oh, yeah. All right. Son, you gotta go out there and get some eggs. Cause we ain't got no eggs. So now we gotta go out there and get eggs. We gotta find eggs. We gotta run the hens off the eggs. Man, please. No.

[Shannon Sharpe]

That's what I hate too, you know, I hate Sam and I is people that, you know it needs to be done right, but you're waiting your friends to do it. Like, there's no self motivation. You can't get nothing done unless somebody else is doing it with you. So that means you fooling yourself. You fooling yourself.

[Simba]

And I used to. I used to have that same problem. I used to have that same problem because I was afraid of fear and I was afraid of failing by myself. So I was like, I either want to win with somebody or we fail together. And one thing I had to learn is like, God, don't bless me. You know what I'm saying? So you might bring in the wrong person. You might have the wrong person that you trying to walk into a situation that he don't belong in. And it's like, God ain't gonna grant you what you looking for because you bringing damaged goods to the table of what I'm trying to set for you. So I had to learn how to develop that confidence for myself. For just sitting in that studio, writing and being in. In this room and, you know, looking at my son in the face like, I'm doing it for you, bro. I'm not doing it to. Because I'm afraid no more, or bringing all these people with me for validation because I'm afraid of what might happen if they not there. Like, nah, you gotta get up and go do it. If you fail, just fail forward and get up and keep going.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Yeah. I remember having. When I had dreams about being something and it wasn't a whole lot of people in my dream, I was like, well, damn. I guess he tried to tell me something. I wasn't supposed to bring a whole lot of people with me.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Oh, man.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Even the biggest planes can only carry so much of a load. Even the biggest planes, Ocho. Even the biggest cargo planes, they can only carry so much.

[Simba]

Man. That's so true. My mom said something to me the Other day that it stick with me. I was telling her she was trying to introduce me to somebody, and I was like, mom, I don't even like meeting too many people no more because they come around with these expectations and they think you supposed to do something. And I remember wanting to be in this space and be like, when I get my shot, I'm never gonna be mean or turn people down. I'm gonna take every picture. But people take that for granted. And my mom says. I was like, it's hard for me to get along with people to. Now I feel like they don't understand me. And my mom said. She said. She said, when you growing, she said, it's not that people don't love you when you growing. You hard to understand, right? If someone hasn't tried to grow, you're gonna always be hard to understand because they stuck at where they at and you trying to go somewhere else. And they may see that as, oh, you changing. And because you not adopting the ideologies they have now, you feel like you. They feel like you devalue them when it's just like, nah, bro, it might be a better way we could grow together. So that's something I had to learn right there.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

It's tough. It's tough because, you know, a lot of times you want the people that were around when you didn't have anything. But a lot of times those people, their minds doesn't grow like yours grow. They think just because they're around, they're supposed to always be around. And. But at some point in time, you can look, I understand, but there has to be value that comes along with something. The New Orleans Pelicans will continue to move forward with Zion Williamson as the face of their franchise, per Joe Dumars. I've had some real honest conversations with him, some real direct and honest conversations. We're going forward with Zion. He's going to continue to be the focal point as we go forward.

[Simba]

Sam, since Zion in Milwaukee, man, you gotta. For Giannis, you gotta get. Not for Giannis. Let him go play with y. But you gotta get him out of New Orleans. You. You got all that good food out there. You got all you. What's that plate Dragos? They got that. Them big oysters over there.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

You got the crab. The crab cakes.

[Simba]

Oh, my God. You got all that good food, man. You can't get Zion where they got vegan options. You gotta get them out of New Orleans immediately. I think the run is done. I think that the time has come for them to kind of blow this thing up and let them move on. It's over with.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Damn, Ocho.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Hey, you know, we talked about Zion in length, you know, for a very long time now, and he hasn't spoken at all. You know, we've all had our opinion, obviously. I want to see him play ball. Whether it's New Orleans, I don't care. I don't care where it is. I just want to see him on the court because I know what he can do once he's out there, when he's healthy, whether it be New Orleans, I'm not sure what's going to happen. You know how this business works. And most of the players have all the leverage. So unless he says he doesn't want to be there, he's going to be a pelican. If he's going to be there, I just want to see him on the court, bro. That's it.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

It's hard to give up a superstar, trade a superstar, unless you're going to get one back in return. And that's why, you know, he's a star. I mean. I mean, look, we had. They're like, Damn, we had A.D. we lost A.D. and the next year, we get Zion. Ain't nobody, ain't no stars coming to New Orleans. And so that's why when these small market team, when they. When they land one of these big fish, they try to hold on to him as long as they possibly can. That's why Milwaukee, bending over back, was trying to make sure. What do you need? You need 10 Harley Davidsons? We'll get them for you. What do you need? You need an Airbnb in Belize? We'll get it for you. Because think about it. You go Kareem, and then Kareem leaves, I think, at like, 76, 75, 76. It's 30 years before you get Giannis. So it's not. You're not la. You got Will, you got Jared west, you got Elgin Baylor, you got Kareem, you got Magic, you got James Worthy, you got Kobe, you got Shaq, you got LeBron, you got A.D. now you got Luka. It don't work like that for everybody. It don't work like that for everybody. See him?

[Simba]

Yeah.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

So when I get a guy, I'm gonna do everything I possibly can. So Cleveland got Lebron. They. Hey, you want to build us. You want you to. Okay, we'll build our training facility close to where you live in Akron. Okay, cool. No problem. You want access? No problem. You want your mama to sit here? No problem. Because what's the likelihood of you ever getting another LeBron James if you Cleveland.

[Shannon Sharpe]

And they have none?

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

So with that being said, you move heaven and earth and you do everything you can to make sure they're happy. Look, I agree with you, Ocho. I just wanted to be healthy. I wanted to be healthy for two years in a row because I believe he can turn the corner. Because Zion can't be more than what, 25? Yeah, 24, 25.

[Simba]

He's some. He's somewhere around there somewhere. But I'm telling you, hunk, in order to keep him healthy, you gotta get him out of New Orleans, man. You gotta get him some vegan options. We gotta get him some acai bowls. We gotta get him healthy out there. Hunk, like, we all want to see them ball, we want to see them play, but it's always been a dilemma and they just, they can't seem to get it together.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Well, good luck with that, Joe. Dude, look, Joe Dubars has been around the game. He bit. I mean, he's been around the game 40 plus years. He's played with some great players, he put some teams together, and so we'll see what he can do. Euro cup champion Tel Aviv are expected to make Russell Westbrook an offer never before seen in European basketball. Should Russ accept the money or stay. Basically, he's going to be on a mid level or minimum contract. Ocho Sim. Does he take the big dollars to go overseas or does he stay right here?

[Shannon Sharpe]

Now you say big dollars, how much we talking?

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I mean, I mean, in order to make it make sense, it's probably going to need to be 12, 15 million.

[Shannon Sharpe]

That's it. Nah.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Well, consider he make 4, 5 million in the NBA.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Hell no. Absolutely not. Not for someone of his caliber.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

What's the most money somebody's made in European basketball? Can we find that? We need to get. We need to. Hey, AI, anybody want to advertise? So we can just pull that up and it just pop up on my screen. So.

[Simba]

No, I think, I don't think Russ need the money, man. You know, Russ is invested in a lot of things.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Don't need the money.

[Simba]

Yeah, I don't think he'll go out there and play for the money.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

And then he don't want to be away from his family. He ain't moving his family overseas.

[Simba]

That's the reason.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I think his wife's name is Nina. He got kids, he got twins and that.

[Simba]

Not.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

He ain't going.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Absolutely not. Makes no sense. And they couldn't offer him. They couldn't offer him enough.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Oh, hell, no. The most money anybody's ever made in Europe is $4 million a year.

[Simba]

It's over. They might as well. They might as well get after me, huh? They might as well get after me. I go out there, give them 12 or 10, you know, say I give them something.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Hey, you know, it can get crazy. Now, if the Saudis had a league now, they.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Oh, like they. Like they got. Like. They got.

[Shannon Sharpe]

They could pull you. They could pull some NBA players that fight it there.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

They. Oh, yeah. You see what Ronaldo's getting, man?

[Shannon Sharpe]

Don't know, man, please.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

200 million a year. Hell, yeah. LeBron will leave for 200 million a year.

[Shannon Sharpe]

A year?

[Simba]

That's ridiculous.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Yeah, I gone over there. Hey. Going over there for a quick four, five years.

[Simba]

Damn. 200 a year, Unc. I ain't never coming back.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Yeah. Hey, as a matter of fact, give me a place to do a. With no tax on. I don't think. I don't think. He probably don't even pay taxes on it. And they gave him a jet, and they gave him. What's it called?

[Shannon Sharpe]

Everything.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Yeah, they gave a house. Yeah.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Hey, that money over there. Different, man.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

They got it. They got it.

[Simba]

Big money.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Samba, check this out. Apparently, Ocho was in the gym today, and he was tossing around some 120s. Apparently. We got video evidence. Let's see what we got here.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Hey, hey. I'm.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I'm just trying to figure out. I don't see no side. We got to zoom in. We got to see if the 120, because them could be hundreds.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Them damn weights bigger than my damn chest. Somebody could be. You know what it is?

[Simba]

Oh, yeah. Them some big weights. Okay.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm strong now.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I'm strong.

[Shannon Sharpe]

I just. Like this 4. It's a life finding.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

No, no, no, no. We don't do anything less than 6. We don't do anything less than 6.

[Shannon Sharpe]

When I go in there tomorrow, right? Tomorrow is legs for me, right? But Sam, just for him, I want to show him. I saw Aaron Donald doing 130s, right? So I'm like, okay, Aaron Donald doing one. I know I could do 120s. I could do five. So tomorrow I'm gonna go to 100 and 40s. I'm. I'm gonna do a set while I'm fresh.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

You ain't gonna do nothing.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Listen to me. You. You. You told me I couldn't do 120s, and I just gave you five right there.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

But he did it on the incline.

[Shannon Sharpe]

I can do it in the incline.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

What's the. Oh, this Me.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Look at me.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

What you mean, what's the difference? It's me.

[Shannon Sharpe]

It's me. I could do that, man. You keep telling me what I can't do, and I keep showing you I could do it. You told. Hey, Sam, you gonna see me tomorrow, right? I'm gonna post it. Tomorrow's leg day. But I just want to show Unk I could do 140s, and I'm gonna do it on incline. Cause he just told me I couldn't. Hey, he sound like my teachers in high school. They told me, now I'm on nightcap.

[Simba]

I mean, there it is. He said he go do it tomorrow.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I'm gonna let him have it. He gonna catch me. I'm gonna sneak into Florida one day and catch him in the gym. Let everybody see what I for. What they doing real bad.

[Simba]

What you putting up in there, uncle? What you looking like in there?

[Shannon Sharpe]

Nothing. Nothing. Hey, listen, we lift the same amount of weight, and. No, we about the same size right now, but we live the same amount of weight.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

See him right now, I lost about £20. I got a little something going on right now, but give me a little bit of time. I'll get past that. I deal with you down the road.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Listen, you don't lost weight, and I'm gaining weight, but it's cool.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

That's okay.

[Shannon Sharpe]

I still.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I probably still could do those 120s. I ain't at the 150s like. Like I used to be, but give me.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Hold on.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Give me 650s.

[Shannon Sharpe]

You do 150s. Okay. Did I do 150s?

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Tomorrow just to show you where I'm at, man. You gonna cave your drill in, man.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Listen, hey, Sam, you know, not on. No. Funny. You could see. You could see the frame, man. I'm sculpting like a. Like a Greek. Like a Greek God, man. Hoodie on, so you really can't see it. And you know my girl be tripping about having my shirt also.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

No, I thought you. I thought you had what you call a nightcap tattooed on your chest. Oh, you got a hoodie on. Oh, my bad. Damn, Ocho, I like. Damn, he really like that cap. He done got tattoos. Yeah.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Hey, listen, uncle, I'm ready. I'm ready for the summer, man. I said, when does summer start?

[Simba]

Summer's here.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I think June 20th. June 21st, 22nd.

[Simba]

Official summer age, boy, from what I appreciate you.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Stop.

[Simba]

Summer's here. I see some nice, soft legs today, Unc. Summer's here.

[Shannon Sharpe]

She said what?

[Simba]

Some nice soft legs. Some soft.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I got tunnel vision. I ain't seen nothing.

[Simba]

No, I appreciate. I appreciate y' all for having me, man. Big fan of the show, as y' all already know.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Love.

[Simba]

We going up tomorrow for the NBA finals. Shout out to the payout scouts. Big watch party tomorrow. Love what y' all doing here at Nightcap, man. Appreciate you. Oh, appreciate you. Y' all keep.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Appreciate you, bro. Tell them where we can find you. What are you on IG? You got a Facebook? You got what? YouTube? What you got going on? Tell us where we can find you at.

[Simba]

The real symbol on all platforms. That's T H E R E A L S Y M B A. You can find that amongst all socials, man. And keep support Nightcap because we like to do something before two. Something.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

That's what I'm talking about, Sam. We appreciate that, man. All the best. Continued success. When you get some time, stop back by again for us.

[Simba]

Definitely will, huh? Appreciate y' all.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

All right, guys. Oh, we gonna get you out of here on this one. It has time. For our final segment of the evening. It's time for Q and A.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Hey, again, you know, Come on, huh? Anything but nice and clean. And nice and slow, too.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Quentin Mobley said Ocho was having a seizure with them 120 dumbbells today. That boy was shaking worse than a Woman in Area 29. Hashtag much.

[Shannon Sharpe]

I hear him talking, they making jokes, but I wasn't shaking. I was nice and slow with perfect form. Shaking like a leap on a 90 degree angle. I don't think. Hey, you know what's funny? I think people don't really understand how heavy that is.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Huh?

[Shannon Sharpe]

I mean, you. You see it all the time. You've done it all the time. But I think people that go to the casual gym where they. Where they don't even have 120 pound dumbbells, I don't think they understand how heavy that is. I really like that. I told you, if she ain't 180.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Dr. Frankie L. Bellamy. Hey, fam. What's one thing today players do better than your era? And what's one thing they'll never touch from your generation? Their mortality. It's called evolution. It's called technology. That's what happens. They got better diet, they got better training. They got a better. They got. They got. They starting from a better foundation.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Most definitely.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I do think we have a better appreciation, but I ain't finna sit here and say, oh, look, there are certain players that Were talented. But I'm talking about overall, the talent in all sports because they got better training, they got better nutrition, they got better technology. Just the way it is. I mean, think about how. Think about when Tiger, Tiger 1997 burst onto the scene. Think about how far he was hitting the golf ball. He was the only one that could do it. Now they got 20 ball, 20 guys, 30 guys that can hit the golf ball. As far as Tiger, look at the guys. We were in awe the way Reggie Miller and Larry Bird and Mark Price, them guys shot the ball, man, they got. They got three, four guys, a team that shoot the COVID off the ball. It is what it is, Ocho. I accept it. I don't know, man. My generation, we did, we did. But they got better technology. Now they got more. It's called advancement. You know how I know? Look at medicine. They don't do surgeries the same way. Ocho. Ain't no guy missing. Your career is not over when you have acl. Your career is not over when you have an Achilles injury. I mean, stuff that used to people were doing now. Guys, come back. Kevin. Look at Kevin Durant. If somebody didn't tell you, you wouldn't know. Kevin Durant came off an Achilles injury. Lainey Ray finally back Lainey Ray. Hey, guys. Loving Shannon's T. Who's your favorite Simpson character? Mine is Ralphie.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Who? Shoot Bart.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Yeah, Homer. Bart. Lethal Marge.

[Shannon Sharpe]

You can't name all of them. We said who's your favorite one?

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

But I'm just saying, Ash was asking me, do I know any of the Simpson characters? Look, I like the Simpsons. American Dad's.

[Shannon Sharpe]

What about South Park?

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Stewie. Give me. Give me Stewie. Give me Stewie and Brian.

[Shannon Sharpe]

You watch South Park?

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I watched a little bit of it.

[Shannon Sharpe]

You have a favorite character. You don't know most of them.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I don't really know the cat I used to watch. What? What's the one used to come on mtv, Beavis and Button?

[Shannon Sharpe]

It was funny.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

So if I had to say, man, Homer, man, the Simpsons been on damn near 40 years at 30 something years. They was. They was coming on when I was in college.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Funny. And for some reason, the Simpsons are very good at predicting history. But they damn near close to it every time. That ain't no goddamn coincidence. Every time.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Nope. You right. NZR said UNC and Ocho, you were both leaders in your locker room. How would you have handled the Dolphins bullying scandal if that would have happened in your locker rooms in Denver, Baltimore, Cincinnati? Well, first of all, that would have never Happened. Ain't nobody. Ain't nobody gonna be saying all that. What? What happened? They said it wasn't bullying, but there was some racial appetite being being thrown around in the locker room. Now, to the extent of it, I don't know. I wasn't there. But that ain't what we did.

[Shannon Sharpe]

What are we talking about? Bullying win. I know we.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I guess a. Richard. Richard. Yeah. Incognito. And, and, and.

[Shannon Sharpe]

And bullying. You grown ass man man in the NFL, you 300 something pounds about somebody, but get your ass.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

No, we don't do that. But even if it wasn't bullying, we ain't gonna. We ain't gonna be hurling no racial epitaphs right now.

[Shannon Sharpe]

I don't remember that part. Okay, my bad bully.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

But look, hopefully they got it resolved. I mean, look, our locker room was harmonious. Did guys fight there? But they fought over. They fought over, you know. Oh, they fought in the locker room. Damn training camp. We had to get Tracy, you know, hey, you say the wrong thing or you know something you don't. Hey, look, I think sometimes don't show. People think because you make X amount of dollars that some of the same things that will sit somebody off that doesn't make money will set a person off that make money. And I'll tell you guys ain't gonna let. There's a certain level, I don't care how big you are, how old you are, certain guys ain't gonna let. Just let you blatantly disrespect them. Because no matter where you are, the number one currency is respect. So Casey Taylor. Start, bench, cut, Deuce McAllister, Warwick Dunn, Brian, Brian Westbrook. Unc, this is for you. So, Ocho, you got Deuce McAllister, Warren.

[Shannon Sharpe]

No, no, he said unk. He said uncle.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

No, no, no, this is for. No, he said unk. For you, I got Alga Crumpler, Randy McMichael, Chris Cooley. So I got the tight ends, you got the running backs. You want me to go first?

[Shannon Sharpe]

Yeah, I'm gonna go first.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

You want me to go first or you going first? I'm going first. Okay, I'll take.

[Simba]

I'll.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I'll start. Alger Crump. Six in one hand, half a dozen the other. I guess I go McMichael, bench him and cut Cooley. But you can go either way. I mean, I mean, I probably should start bench Cooley and Randy McMichael, but I'll go Algae, Randy or Cooley.

[Shannon Sharpe]

So I got Deuce McAllister. Walk down and. Oh, My God. Nah, I, I, it's my start is out of Brian Westbrook and I just, I'm trying to figure out which one because Brian Westbrook, they're very similar guys. I'm going to say the same thing.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Very similar guys.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Who was a little bit more dynamic. Brian Westbrook was nice. Warwick Dunn was nice as well. They both played the same. They can catch the ball out the backfield. Deuce McAllister was a big back, huh?

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Yep, he was.

[Shannon Sharpe]

He is a big boy. I wonder who had the better career at a out of work and see.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Because, you know, Warwick had started at Tampa. In Atlanta.

[Shannon Sharpe]

In Atlanta. Yeah, I remember. Damn, that's a good one.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Well, give us a good answer.

[Shannon Sharpe]

You know what I'm gonna go with, I'm gonna go with Warwick done soon before what he does in the community. I'm gonna start war.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

I'm gonna start work done A lot.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Of single moments in my bench Westbrook. And I love, I love Deuce. That's my boy, my New Orleans Saint dog. I'm, I'm gonna cut Deuce.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Damn. Sir K said my guy should Michael Parsons play, sit out until he gets his contract. Well, look, he's at OTAs. I don't know if he's doing it. I don't know if he's like participating, but I know he shows up. He's getting his workout in, probably doing his conditioning, but he's probably not doing anything on the field. I think they're going to get something done before he goes. He keeps telling them is David Mugletta is his agent. Jerry is trying to get it, you know, hey, I can talk to Michael, blah, blah, blah. No, you didn't. But he didn't do all this stuff. He didn't do this with dad. He didn't try to go to Dax. Hey, Dak, let's work this contract out. He went through Todd France, but he.

[Shannon Sharpe]

Also, also what he did is he waited till the last minute.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

But I'm saying he trying to circumvent like he gonna. He didn't do that with Tony Romo. He didn't say, hey, hey, Romo. Now all of a sudden he want to do that.

[Shannon Sharpe]

The only thing about it is Mike ain't falling for it. If you know Mike. No Mike.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

He didn't do that with Mike. He didn't do that with Mike. He didn't do that with Emmett. He didn't do that with Troy. He didn't do that with time. I'm trying to figure out now why.

[Shannon Sharpe]

He trying to do this if, if you know Micah personally, he ain't falling for that.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

No.

[Shannon Sharpe]

He's not falling for that. No.

[Chad Ochocinco Johnson]

Aaron Owens. Can I get my birthday shout out is my 29th birthday, Aaron. Happy 29th. Hopefully you did. So I don't know if it was yesterday or is it today? Because if you're on the east coast, it's today or it was yesterday. But whatever the case may be, hopefully you have a blessed and enjoyable birthday. Celebrate many more of these things. Hopefully you did something fun. Got an opportunity to share it with family, friends and loved ones. So happy birthday, Aaron and thank you for supporting Nightcap. That completes this episode of Nightcap. We want to thank our special guest, Taron Armstead, the pro bowler. He retired after years in New Orleans and Miami. He says, you know what? Body just can't take it anymore. I got a standard in which I play to I can no longer play at that level. And the Bay Area LA base now talented rapper, my boy Simba Sam. Thanks for stopping by, man. We really, really appreciate that. Thank you for joining us for another episode of Nightcap. I am your favorite unc, Shannon Sharp, my partner and co host, Liberty City's own, the guy that's shadow boxing pro bowler all pro, that's Chad Ochocinko Johnson. Please make sure you hit that subscribe button. Please make sure you hit the like button. And guys, go subscribe to the Nightcap podcast feed wherever you get your podcast from. Thank you for your support. Thank you for your continued support. Thank you for helping Nightcap ascend to the heights that we've ascended to. None of this is possible without you, so thank you for your continued support. Please make sure you check out Shave by laportier. We have it in stock now. If you can't find it in a city or state near you, you best believe in the next five or six months we're coming to a city or state from you. But in the meantime, if you cannot find it, order it online. We'll ship it directly to your door. Please drink responsible and stay safe. Go check out my media company page on all of his platforms. Shay Shay Media and my clothing company with 84 being spelled out and my clothing company, that's my clothing company, 84. The link is pinned in the chat. Supplies are very limited now. Once they're gone, they're gone. So please grab yours while supplies last. Again, we want to thank our special guest Taron Armstead and Simba. Thank you guys for joining us. We'll see you tomorrow night after game one of the NBA finals. Indiana Pacers travel to Oklahoma to take on the OKC Thunder. We'll see you tomorrow after the game. I'm Unc, he's Ocho. See you tomorrow.

[Shannon Sharpe]

The Volume. This is an I Heart podcast.