Coaching for Leaders – Episode 763: Leading with Poise When the Stakes are High, with Eileen Collins

Podcast: Coaching for Leaders
Host: Dave Stachowiak
Guest: Col. Eileen Collins, first woman to command a U.S. space mission
Date: December 15, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode centers around what it means to lead with poise when the stakes are extremely high. Host Dave Stachowiak is joined by Colonel Eileen Collins, a pioneering astronaut and author, who shares her personal journey, leadership philosophy, and the lessons she’s learned commanding high-pressure NASA space missions, including the critical "return to flight" mission after the Columbia tragedy. Collins discusses overcoming adversity, the importance of clarity of mission, decision-making under pressure, and the crucial roles of preparation and teamwork, both in space and on Earth.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Early Adversity, Resilience, and Personal Growth

• Eileen’s Upbringing and Challenges

  • Collins describes growing up in a lower-middle-class family, facing shyness and a stutter, and dealing with her father's alcoholism and parents’ separation at age nine.
  • Quote:

    "I was very shy as a child... I stuttered. I was afraid to speak up in school.... My mom asked [my dad] to move out when I was nine years old because he was coming home drinking." (02:37)

• Wisdom from Adversity

  • She learned about controlling what you can and letting go of what you can't, referencing the Serenity Prayer and lessons from Alcoholics Anonymous.
  • Quote:

    "Don't run away from your problems. Take one day at a time.... There was also the 12 step process that I would read about. I got a lot of wisdom from watching my dad struggle." (04:30)

• Message for Leaders and Parents

  • Security and love are fundamental for children; perfection is less important than being present and supportive.

2. Performing Under the Spotlight and Finding Poise

• The Roosevelt Room Announcement

  • Collins recounts her panic when about to be presented at the White House as the first female shuttle commander.
  • Quote:

    "For perhaps only the second time in my life. I had a full on feeling of panic... I remember saying to my husband, I'm not going in there." (06:30)

  • She overcame it by stepping into the larger role of “the first woman commander” and focusing on the mission at hand.
  • Quote:

    "Just go in there and be the first woman commander." (07:39)

• Mission First, Self Second

  • Collins stresses the importance of clearly defining the mission—for herself and her teams—and keeping focus amid distractions.
  • Quote:

    "Focus, focus, focus is always something that I would use to keep myself on track with the mission." (10:55)

  • Her flying instructors drilled her to always be thinking: “What’s next, Lieutenant Collins?” (10:45)

3. Making Difficult Decisions in the Public Eye

• Saying No with Principle
  • She declined a visit from First Lady Hillary Clinton during pre-launch quarantine to avoid setting a precedent that could compromise crew health.
  • Quote:

    "By inviting in the First Lady or answering yes to her invitation, I would be setting a precedent for all the crews to follow me." (12:06)

  • Leadership lesson: Decide quickly when possible, but gather the team for complex or ambiguous issues.
  • Quote:

    "My first question is, can I make this decision right now and get it out of the way?... If not, do I need to pull in the team?" (13:46)

4. The Columbia Tragedy and Return to Flight

• Leadership Amidst Crisis

  • As commander of the first flight after the Columbia disaster, Collins faced skepticism about continuing the shuttle program.
  • She articulated NASA's mission, acknowledged risk, and shouldered symbolic responsibility as a leader and source of hope.
  • Quote:

    "I felt that we had a certain amount of control over the safety of our flight.... Their mission was worth it. And it's the mission of space exploration." (16:14)

• Commitment and Confidence

  • Collins delayed her retirement to see the mission through, emphasizing loyalty to her crew and faith in their training.
  • Quote:

    "There is no way I was going to quit that mission. First of all, it would have looked very bad if the commander of the next flight quit... I was very confident in my ability to do that and my crew." (19:10)

5. Decision-Making About Risk and Safety

• Fuel Cutoff Sensor Dilemma
  • Collins discusses the nuances of trusting management during technical issues, like the fuel sensor problem before launch.
  • Quote:

    "When you're dealing with a difficult mission... you gotta make a decision.... In that particular case, I just put my trust in management and they did the right thing." (22:30)

6. Adapting and Training for the Unexpected

• Skill vs. Task

  • A critical, unplanned spacewalk required improvisation. Collins emphasizes training for “skills” rather than only specific tasks, to adapt in unpredictable situations.
  • Quote:

    "Train for the skill, not for the task.... You can't possibly come up with every possible task. Just train for the skill, and then you can put them together later." (25:00)

• Team Confidence

  • She trusted in her crew’s skills and adaptability, enabling them to handle surprise challenges safely.

7. Structured Mission Objectives and Team Collaboration

• Objective Planning
  • For every mission, Collins defined clear objectives in order of priority to guide decision-making under stress.
  • Quote:

    "As the commander, I had to make sure those objectives were fulfilled. Or if something unusual happens... what is the order of priority of those objectives?" (28:03)

  • Teamwork with Mission Control and reliance on experts, like flight surgeons, demonstrated the importance of collaborative decision-making.

8. Preparing Families and Managing Anxiety

• Supporting Families During Risky Missions
  • Collins prioritized family and crew support, organizing events for families to bond and understand the shuttle experience.
  • Quote:

    "Getting the families out to the training to understand what we're doing and get to know each other was a big deal." (31:01)

  • After the Columbia accident, she increased family support even more, believing commander attitude impacts crew and family confidence.
  • Quote:

    "The attitude of the commander is very important. If it looks like the commander is nervous... that attitude is going to make the crew or the team nervous." (32:55)

9. Progress and Representation

• Evolving Gender Roles in Space
  • Collins reflects on the new generation’s expectations and the importance of opportunity, not quotas.
  • Quote:

    "The important thing today is not that we have 50% women in the astronaut program... it's for women that want to be astronauts, they have the opportunity." (34:50)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Adversity and Growth

  “Until we're tested, we don't know what we're capable of.” – Eileen Collins (01:11)

• On Stepping Into Leadership Roles

  "Just go in there and be the first woman commander." – Eileen Collins (07:39)

• On Decision-making

  "My first question is, can I make this decision right now and get it out of the way, put it behind us?" – Eileen Collins (13:36)

• On Trust and Team

  "I have trust in my crew. They know what to do. They were confident in themselves, and they went out and did a task that they had not trained for." – Eileen Collins (26:45)

• On Confidence and Leadership’s Impact

  "The attitude of the commander is very important... if it looks like the commander is nervous... that attitude is going to make the crew or the team nervous." – Eileen Collins (32:55)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [02:37] – Eileen’s childhood adversity and the impact of her family’s struggles.
• [06:30] – Collins’ panic facing media spotlight at the White House.
• [09:22] – Defining the mission and maintaining focus as a leader.
• [11:48] – Saying no to external requests (First Lady visit) and decision-making principles.
• [15:33] – Leadership after the Columbia accident and the return to flight.
• [19:10] – Commitment to leading the return to flight mission and building crew confidence.
• [21:51] – Navigating technical risk with NASA’s management (fuel cutoff sensor issue).
• [24:51] – “Train for the skill, not for the task”: coping with novel challenges in space.
• [27:21] – Objective planning and collaborative problem-solving on missions.
• [30:24] – Supporting families and managing anxiety before high-stakes flights.
• [34:23] – Changing attitudes about women in aerospace; focus on creating opportunities.

Tone and Style

The conversation is warm, candid, and practical. Both Dave and Eileen share personal reflections in an accessible, encouraging way, offering hard-earned wisdom in plain, unvarnished language. Eileen Collins is especially humble and down-to-earth, often making leadership lessons tangible with relatable anecdotes and concrete examples from her time in command.

Summary Takeaways

• Resilience through adversity builds leadership capacity.
• Clear mission focus helps leaders perform under intense pressure.
• Preparation is key, but adaptability and focusing on transferable skills matters most.
• Fast, principled decision-making is vital—know when to decide alone and when to consult the team.
• Leaders must have the confidence to support not only their teams but also their families, especially in risky endeavors.
• Progress in gender representation is measured best by opportunity and skill, not quotas.

For Further Listening

• [Episode 567] – How to Lead and Retain High Performers (Ruth Gotian)
• [Episode 681] – The Way to Handle Q&A (Matt Abrahams)
• [Episode 752] – How to Start the Top Job (Scott Keller)

For more, visit CoachingforLeaders.com and join the free membership for searchable episode archives and resources.