← Coffee N° 5 with Lara Schmoisman
Coffee N° 5 with Lara Schmoisman
The Non-Linear Path to Building a Science-Backed Skincare Brand with Allison McNamara
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Foreign.
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This is Coffee Number Five. I'm your host, Lara Schmoisman. Hi, everyone. Welcome back to Coffee Number Five. And you know a little bit about me by now and you know that I've been all over the place, but I don't believe in all over the place just because I believe that we are on a journey and the journey takes places. I don't know what I would be doing today as a marketer if I didn't have my screenwriting degree. I use that every day in direct response, understanding my consumer or the brand's consumer. I use that all the time. My degree in production and direction, I use it all the time using film, television. Everything adds up. And so everything that happens to you in your life, you don't know why because. But please use it and learn from it. So today I have, like always, a treat for you. I met casually in another part of my life. Alison McMara.
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A
Hi.
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B
I'm so happy to have you here. I mean, I was always so impressed with your brand and then I heard your story and I. You were all over the place like me too. So tell us a little bit about your journey and how did you end up on owning an incredible brand?
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A
Thank you for that. You know, Mara is by far my greatest accomplishment, I think, so far. But I did have a lengthy history, a full career, really a full life before I launched the brand seven years ago. So with my first life, I went to college thinking I was going to either do something, something like molecular biology, law, or just talking on camera was always very natural to me. But I didn't know how I was going to parlay that. So I did like microbio law, but then ended up as a television host and a writer, went into journalism school instead. You know, I feel that back in the day, women weren't really showed like how to be a boss besides being a journalist or being a lawyer or being something like that. So I felt like I went on this journey. I graduated usc, I had a journalism degree I got. I graduated in the height of the recession. So it was like a really crazy time to find a job. 2009 and ended up working at E. Entertainment as a tape librarian before everything was digitized. I would like pass around tapes, believe.
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B
Me, I remember we were in the same companies at the same time. And it's weren't only the tapes was like shooting and then going back to this, the office so we can get our tapes and then you can send them by satellite.
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A
Yes, it was crazy. And like even the producers that I worked for at the time, they would have to like go into these tape libraries and like say they wanted from like 18 seconds to 27 seconds. And then they would have to request the digitization of that particular clip. And then they would pull it. It was cr.
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B
And let me tell you something from the producer side. You had to log everything. Yes.
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A
Yes. The logging was crazy.
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B
It was. Oh, my God. I cannot explain how many hours I spend in front of the TV just logging. Woman walking. I know. Oh, my God.
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A
Yeah. One of my internship projects, I was at E. In the news bureau and I had to Transcribe like a 7 hour set visit with Ken Baker. And I forget where he was, but it was a seven hour set visit. I had to transcribe the whole thing. I feel like people today who are working in production just have no idea how hard it used to be. Even when we would interview people on the red carpet. As I grew in my career at popsugar, I would have to go home and transcribe the interview. Like, write it all down.
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B
Absolutely. Not only that, I remember you're gonna have to go to the pre show, get ready. It's not like you show up on the red carpet and you're fighting for the spot.
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A
Yes, always.
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B
Or like, yes, trying to get the. The. Then you need to go wait until the show ends, do the post shows, do the post parties.
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A
Totally.
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B
And then on top of that, then you need to go and edit.
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A
Yeah. And the editing is something I never did, but like, I would sit with an editor and like literally edit packages. It kind of. So I started at E, graduated in the height of the recession, then ended up getting a job at who, what Where? Which is a digital fashion website. Gave me my first on camera job and I was like, I love this. Continued on the career path of hosting broadcast journalism. But I was also always a writer. So, like doing the transcriptions, writing the stories. I worked January 29th to PopSugar to Entertainment Tonight. I did work for FYI Network. I hosted the Oscars red carpet for ABC. I did a litany of sorts. But then ultimately in like 2016, I really saw the shift with social media and I felt that broadcast like magazine was eventually going to be irrelevant. And the shows that I wanted to host weren't necessarily what people wanted to watch. So no one was waiting till like 6pm to watch E. News because they have Instagram and they've gotten the updates live on their phones. So took a little bit of a hiatus and came up with the idea for Mara. And that's How I decided to launch my skincare routine. I totally just went on a whim, had this idea.
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B
And I hear that you were interested in biology earlier.
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A
Yes. So I've always, like, I thought I was going to work as a microbiologist or biochemistry, something in the science world, but then, you know, when you're. When you were younger and like, especially when I was younger, I think around the same time, I just didn't know of the jobs that were available to me. I thought I had to be like a lawyer or like a writer to be a successful person, because that's what I was seeing. I was shown in movies, like I watched, like, how to Lose a guy in 10 days and she's a writer or like Sex in the City and she's this like, boss ass bitch, but she's a writer. So I was like, oh, that's what I have to do to be successful. So I didn't even know, like, brand founder. All those things to me were not something that I thought about back then. But biology and science have always been really important to me. And so that's kind of how Mara took shape. Because I've always been deeply inspired by the ocean. My last name means hound of the sea, so Mara means sea in Gaelic. And I was like, what a cool space.
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B
In Spanish, mar means sea.
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A
Yeah, Mar is the Latin derivative for ocean or water. Sea. So that's why you see it in so many languages as, like, I think Italian. It's mare. Yeah. So I thought this, this whole idea around, like, finding organisms, algae, that have been around for billions of years and have survived the harshest of conditions. Like, there has to be an amazing connection to skincare. And so really started as a side hustle. And I'm so proud of how we. How we've evolved.
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B
So let's talk for a second about the side hustle. So you started. You were still working?
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A
Yes, I worked. I worked a full second job up until 2022. So four years after. Three years after launching my brand.
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B
So you launched your brand and was an oversight success?
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A
No. Well, I thought it was. Honestly, by all measures of my success in 2018, we crushed it. But I think, you know, we. We sometimes sell more in a day today than I did all year in 2018. So obviously my. My bar was not that high in 2018, but I only had one product, and I think we sold like $80,000 worth of product that first year. I was just like, wow. People, like, are responding to this idea. We got some great press placements and so kind of took that as a sign to continue the process of Mara and I had the. I had the products I wanted to launch. I just didn't have the capital. So each product is so vital to our future growth because they really fuel the success of the next one and the formulation and development of the next product.
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B
So, I mean, that's very interesting. I mean, you did it seven years ago, which is a completely different space that we are today in the beauty industry. I feel like today is a lot more competitive than it was then. Why you think that happened?
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A
You know, every. Everyone says this, right? Like, hindsight's always 20 20, so we always think the past is easier because we've done it before. But in 2018, yes, the Satur was less. Like, there weren't as many brands to compete with, but the education element wasn't there. So educating customers on clean beauty, on ingredients like that was all new. And at the time, we had Instagram when I launched, but Instagram stories like that, that feature launched the year that I launched Mara. So I feel like the touch points for a brand today. I feel like there's so many more opportunities to reach new people. Like, you can go viral on TikTok. Like, TikTok is this crazy platform that really has no bias, right? So we didn't have that type of discovery. You really needed, like, retail celebrity and like, in, like, influencer back then. But now it's like, I feel like there's a little bit more control on the brand side on exposure, based on, like, all of these different levers and tools that we have in social media. But I do also think it is hard because there's a lot of competition. There's a lot of people saying the same thing. There's just a lot of redundancy in the category.
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B
And also there is a lot of copycats that they see that something is succeeding, and then they go and they produce something very similar to compete.
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A
Yes, I have a funny story. Are you familiar with Trader Joe's?
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B
Yes.
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A
Okay, some executives.
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B
Don't say anything about Trader Joe's, please, because I love my Trader Joe's.
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A
No, I love Trader Joe's too. No shade. I actually took it as a compliment. Some executive's wife at Trader Joe's for sure is a big Mara fan. Because my third year in business, after we went viral with Chrissy Teigen, they kind of combined my. My vibe. So it was like a blue. Kind of a blue bottle, glass bottle. But then they used Marula oil, which is kind of like the signature of drunk elephant Kind of took our two bestsellers and put them into one product. But they made it visually so similar to Mara.
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B
Well, Mara, packaging is gorgeous and we'll talk about that for a second. But I want to ask you a question because you mentioned something just now that you were like every product development depends on the success of the product before totally product. So can you explain that a little more?
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A
I've learned so much through this like accounting journey that I've been on. You know, I didn't study finance, you know, surprise. So with how my business is structured since we have not taken outside capital, we run on a cash basis. So we're not on the gaffing structure run as a cash basis business. So we have to have cash coming in in order to have output. And so because of that reason, when I had I think I put in $50,000 around marginally and then I think my dad gave me another 50,000 to launch the business and that a hundred thousand paid for bottles, droppers, formulation costs, website development, the little lack thereof and photography. But after that, like when I launched universal oil, I had no capital left so I had to sell what I made in order to future fund not only growth of the business but also like hiring a team, getting that next product out. And so it really is like this rolling cycle. Now that we're bigger, we have so many SKUs that are performing that we don't each launch isn't as precious. But at the beginning those secondary and third launches were crucial for the business.
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B
So what now that when you're planning your season, like now for example, probably you already plan your 2026 and do you know that you're gonna be dropping so many SKUs next year?
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A
Well, we only drop one to two SKUs a year. So the Mara way, the whole ethos behind the brand is obviously science backed algae skin care, but it's really trying to minimize your routine and have more luxurious, more effective, potent products in as few steps as possible. So to remain true to that ethos it is we have to be very selective on the products that we launch. And so I have two products slated for next year. I am very excited about both of them. But like this year for example, I only launched one product the whole year.
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B
So I know you are in Sephora. Like everyone dreams to be on Sephora, you are on Revolve. I mean your target audiences, they are. But do you think that it should be every brand's goal to be on a Sephora?
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A
I think it just depends on what the brand goals are and where what retailer they best align with. Right. We're in a new age where depending on who you're marketing to, like, there's so many avenues for people to shop. Right. There's Amazon, which is building like hundred and two hundred million dollars supplement businesses with just one point of distribution. There are places like luxury retail I think is super interesting for us, like cost bars and Blue Mercury. There's like a very interesting different subset of customer there. So to answer your question, like, I know I don't think every brand has to be at Sephora to be successful, but. But I do think Sephora is the premier prestige retailer in the United States. And I think having their stamp of approval goes really far. But that's not to say that Ulta also has like a great assortment of other types of brands.
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B
So how was your transition from being D2C or smaller retailers when you got big retail? Because I hear these stories over and over saying I wasn't ready for what it takes.
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A
I'm still not ready for what it takes, to be honest. I think it just depends. Like, I first, I always knew that Omnichannel was going to be my strategy for the brand. So I had never, I was kind of like, I came after the Glossiers of the world, right there was like the darlings that were D2C that these businesses that grew astronomically in the early 2010s. And I, I knew that I wanted something that had retail exposure. I thought retail was really vital to my distribution plan. But I think with retail, it's interesting we, we still haven't figured out retail. I think you've got to first figure out who your shopper is and where they're shopping and whether that's just placement on dot com, whether that's in store, whether it's going in store with a larger footprint. Like, these are all big decisions that are part of the strategy. And now with hindsight, I'm learning that sometimes going everywhere is like, not the best approach. Right. Like, I think brand founders, myself included, get so excited when they're like, when a retailer wants you or you want to be put here and they want.
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B
To put you there, your brand can get diluted. Diluted, yeah, that's everywhere.
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A
So I think having being disciplined in your retail strategy is something that I'm now revisiting because I think at the beginning. So to answer your question, when I launched in 2018, I launched D2C, but then I launched Credo Beauty in June of the same year. Credo is like, I think the ultimate clean retailer in the United States. There are like 15 locations. They have a great assortment. They have the best clean brands.
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B
There is a reason we call it CREDO Clean. You want to be.
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A
Yeah, Credo Clean. So. So that was important to me. And then after that, I did slowly launch new partners. But even. Even if you're a brand that's starting out, like, you don't even know how much it takes, like, how much preparation it takes even to get your items to the warehouse in a way that each different retailer can receive it. I was shocked.
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B
And also, as you evolve, you might need to change those logistics.
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A
Yes. I switched warehouses last year. It was a nightmare.
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B
Everyone says that. It's so funny.
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A
Yeah. I think, like, in the scope of the hard things that I've had to do, I think a warehouse move was one of the most challenging that I've. Because I don't have an ops team, I oversee my operations. And we had to move warehouses because the previous warehouse that we were at didn't do edi. If you're not familiar, EDI is an electronic transmission of information. And so I had.
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B
Which is super, super important, you guys. When you're scaling, if you don't have edi, it's like all your product can get lost in translation.
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A
Yes. And you get chargebacks. You're not. It's just a whole, whole thing. So I had to switch warehouses. And that was really challenging. But that's the other thing. When I went into Credo Beauty, I was shipping the products to their DC myself. Like, myself taking them to FedEx. And that worked for Credo. But it's so funny because, like, at the time, I really wanted to be at Sephora that first year and I was pitching them a bunch, but, like, we weren't ready for that. Like, no chance. Like, I could never have shipped my own products to Sephora. That would have been clinically insane. So there are these like.
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B
And you could have lose a lot by not doing things right.
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A
It's like so expensive. Every chargeback is so expensive. Like, even my warehouse, if they're listening, they are incredible. But even they make mistakes and they're professionals. So, like, it happens. And so just imagine like, and everything.
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B
Is another cost for you. And this is. I talk to so many brands all the time that they forget to include shipping in their cost.
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A
Girl, we don't. We don't. We don't forget because it's so expensive.
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B
That you can't avoid it and it getting more expensive. So let me ask you a question, because originally you. You Started with skincare, but now you launch a lip.
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A
Yes, I just put it on.
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B
Yes, I saw you and I tried it. I had it. I got exactly the same one. I was looking. Where is it? I think it's in my purse now, not in my drawer.
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A
You know, color, like, color cosmetics is something that's very close to my heart, and I think. I'm not sure if it's the right fit for Mara to explore more makeup. In a way, maybe in the future I'll create my own cosmetics line in some capacity. But I've always loved color cosmetics, and I thought this was a fun, natural extension of the brand. But the lip category is so competitive right now, and it is so saturated by the big guys. Right. We know the big ones.
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B
Was it a passion project for you?
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A
You know, so my ex. My ex was a pretty big smoker, and I. I'm always like an. I'm an ideas person. So when we would talk about it, I like thinking there aren't really any lip balms that actually have Actives in them. Like, lip balms are what, like glycerin, some seed butter, some vegan waxes. But, like, do they have any actives actually support, like, trans epidermal water loss? Do they actually help with aging? Do they fight fine lines and wrinkles?
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B
And so lips, when, as you get older, it gets old, crinkly.
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A
And if you're smoking, you get this stuff up here. So I kind of developed it as a need. I was like, this is like, a thing I think needs to exist. So I started with a clear shade, and we have this beautiful algae plumping complex that is clinically proven to help by lines, fullness, volume, volume loss. And so I loved it. And then I was like, this will be fun to, like, try out some shades. I will say, like, these two shades are quite popular. C latte one. Yeah. But the one that I love the most, the two that I love the most are the toasty rouge.
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B
And I have to say that's my favorite.
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A
So I. I think people don't, like, they're scared of it because it's such a. It's such a. Like an intense red. But, like, the people who actually use it, like, love it so much.
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B
I love our colors. So you look great in dark colors. I feel very accepted now because I did the color matching and red colors are my thing. So.
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A
You look great. I can tell your lip looks so nice. But lip isn't, like, a big category for us, I think in the Mara landscape, like, being known for our skincare is more important for us than being like a lip product brand.
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B
Well, but it's complementary. I really think that lip maintenance is a lot more important than color. And I mean, there now all these lips oils that they became really popular, they don't do much for me because you want more nutrients in your lips.
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A
I mean, oils can be so nutrient dense. But I think what you're, what you're pointing at, which I agree with, is I love oils for skin, but sometimes lips in particular really need something occlusive to seal everything in. And an occlusive formula is usually something with like a petroleum, a petrolatum, some sort of like glycerin. And so I think the lips really do benefit better from like a balm or salve than a lip oil. Everyone asked me why I didn't launch a lip oil because we're so known for like our oils in general. But that's kind of why I didn't.
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B
So something that makes your brand very unique also is that you are not the typical influencer, but you're still consistently the face of your brand.
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A
Yeah, I feel like. Well, to that point, I feel like when I was creating this line, I really looked up to what I thought were like the first great wave of female founders at Sephora. So there was like Tata Harper, there was Tiffany Masterson from Drunk Elephant, there were Connie and Sarah from Glow Recipe and Greg from Youth to the People. And I remember going into Sephora and they'd have like their next big thing wall and they'd have like the cute little founder picture next to it and like they'd have their few products. And look, those brands have gone on to be massive brands and I hope I can emulate that same type of success. But in a world now it is much more challenging because every influencer thinks and wants to have their own brand. So you're right, I'm not an influencer, but I'm not also. I do have like a. I am public facing for my line.
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B
Yeah. I say you are not the typical influencer because I do believe that you are, but you were before and you, you were like both at the same time. You merged there beautifully.
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A
Thank you.
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B
So what about. We were talking about color and because all this algae. How can you integrate science with skincare but also color. How was the challenge of including algae with color?
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A
Well, I mean, the color's pretty easy. Like once you have the, the clear shade down. Like we, we knew that the algae already worked within the formula. It's a oil emulsion. So there's like water and oil inside the. The balms. And so I felt that the color wasn't difficult actually with the algae in general because it's just like any other ingredient once it's already formulated. But the bigger picture was like finding the right types of algae that supported the goals that we were looking for of that product.
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B
How long was the development for you of working on a lip?
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A
Lip took me about like two years to develop before we launched. It was a quicker formula, transparently. The ones that were long, I mean, long long. The cleansing oil took me a long time. Sea Dream, which is our affirming algae cream, took me a long time. And the sunscreen, those are probably my three most challenging products.
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B
Do you believe that for your skincare you have a target audience that fits in H box or you have. You're going across different age groups and how do you address connecting with them?
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A
I think we're still trying to answer this question ourselves. I think with how what we've learned about our customer is she mostly female and she is between the core age of like 30 to 50, with like late 30s, early 40s being like our true median sweet spot. Spot. But I do think that the Mara customer is a little less about age and more about what they're looking for. They value aesthetics, they value luxury. They value. They also value things at a good value. Mara is affordable luxury. We're not commanding like a hundred and something dollars for a moisturizer. We're offering you stem cell technology at $64. So I think it's women who are valuing how things look on their shelf, how they make them feel, who are looking for a sensorial experience. And my goal with the brand is to kind of meet. Meet the luxury customer in every phase of their life journey. So maybe in their teens they discover the lip balms, and then maybe you know, in their 20s they get the universal oil. And then maybe in their 40s they kind of discover one of our treatments.
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B
I think you just mentioned one of the biggest trends lately or the hashtags, steam cell or. I feel like that there are two words that are being used in every product. Maybe you want to clarify a little bit. I mean, there is a stem cell and the growth factor that the overused.
- [23:18]
A
Lately, human growth factors, we haven't played with those yet in the Mara formulas. But stem cells are interesting. Like they. Ours are vegan, so they're derived from Swiss apples and they really mimic like the. The matrix of the skin and they help visibly tighten the look of skin And I love them because it kind of just helps like lift everything up, like Botox in a, in a jar. And I think it's a really powerful ingredient. But you can derive them from so many different things. Right. They can be derived from apples in my case, or they can actually come from like actual humans. So I think figuring out what I don't love formulating around like an ingredient like that, mine usually is around something like an actual skin function or something I'm trying to achieve and then I kind of backwards into it. I do formulate around ingredients, but more like a key pillar ingredient, like a retinol or a vitamin C. I've never formulated around a trend, if that makes sense. Yeah.
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B
So what's next for Mara?
- [24:14]
A
Oh my gosh. So much in store. Like, I'm just so excited. I feel like this has been a challenging year for a lot of founders. I feel like rises in tariffs, cost of goods, market instability, shifts in consumer behavior. Like it's been a year, but next year I'm really excited because I feel like for the first time in a long time I have very clear direction on who I'm talking to and where I want to go. And, and I think our.
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B
That's amazing to get to that point that you feel it, you feel grounded, that I know who I am and where I'm going.
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A
Yeah. And I think, I think back a lot to like the first early days of the business. And I remember like freaking out with my second product, like not knowing like what kind of bottle to put it in or like how the line would look altogether. There was so much unknown. And for the first time really in my career in Mara, I feel very sound in what our choices are. So we've got a really exciting product. I can't share what it is just yet, but it's launching in April and it is a follow up. Yeah, it's a follow up to one of our best selling products. We're launching a bunch of size variations so like different ways to experience the brand. Minis Deluxes. And then I have. How do I say this? One of our other really popular products. I've always wanted to build out a franchise within the business. And what I mean by that, I'll give you an example is like Too Faced had their chocolate bar and. And then they had like the whole chocolate bar family. Right. They had like the EY shadow palette, they had the bronzer. So they built out that as like a theme within the brand. And I've been looking for my theme since I started the Business and nothing has felt quite right. And I think I finally found my theme. So this is our first theme extension that's happening next year.
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B
How are we gonna get algae bubblegum?
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A
I don't know, you'll have to wait and see. But I'm, I'm really excited because I think that that is, that's something that I felt like I've been wanting to do for a long time.
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B
So something that is very interesting to me is that you started your skincare line as a face line, but then you went into body tube. Why did you decide that you need a body product? And that's how, how did you introduce that to your audience? And how was the reception? Because that was educating them.
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A
Again, great question. So I feel like, okay, Bodi is interesting. So when I have these conversations about Mara and what the brand really stands for, we are first and foremost an algae oil based company. Our blend is oil soluble, which is why a lot of our products are oil based. So we've got the face oil, we've got the retinol oil, we've got the vitamin C oil, we've got the cleansing oil. And when I was thinking about skin holistically, I was only covering, you know, 10% of the whole body with my products and I'm like, well, we're known for oils and we can apply a really, the Mara lens to a beautiful body oil. And we have the, have the technology, we have the customer base for people who love oils. Like a body oil makes so much sense. So I definitely put my spin on it. We've got three actives in that product that help with cellulite, stretch marks, firmness. But more importantly, it's our biggest new customer acquisition skew, which is so interesting.
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B
It is.
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A
I think it's interesting because a lot of people are scared to put oils on their face, but who's scared to put oils on their body? No one. So it's been a great way for people to experience, experience the sensorial luxury of the brand without putting oils on their face. And then they fall in love with it and then they're like, okay, maybe I'll try like something else from the line.
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B
Yeah, well, I mean, did you feel like you had to start bundling for people to try it?
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A
No, that the body oil was like pretty instantly a success. And I think the reason why is feels different than other body oils. It's got a weightiness to it, like a medium viscous, but it doesn't leave you greasy. Like it really sinks into the skin. It really hydrates and the scent profile, in my opinion is the best on the market. It is just expensive, luxurious, fresh. Men and women both love it unisex. So it doesn't kind of have like I love Sol de Janeiro as well, but like it doesn't have like a super fragranced feel. It has like a luxury feel. So no, we never really bundled. I launched it with a lymphatic drainage tool and it's just kind of like this silent killer for us. Like people love it.
- [28:15]
B
That's amazing. So I have one more question for you, Alisa.
- [28:18]
A
Of course. Ask away. How do you funny. I am now a just a classic whole milk person latte. I like a whole milk latte if I'm making it at home. I do like to froth up my whole milk. I like to use. Yeah, I use a brand called Strauss is my favorite. But if I can't use straws, I like Alexander. And I do add one scoop of cowboy colostrum to it, which is deep. Yeah, I like the cowboy colostrum. It has like a vanilla y flavor profile and it kind of like adds this like warmth to the whole milk. So it's like not. I don't love sweetened coffee, but I like the way that that works together. And then if I'm feeling frisky, I'll add in a little cold foam at the top. So I'm like making my own lattes at home.
- [29:02]
B
And then if it's a little late, you can put something else to make it.
- [29:06]
A
Yeah, Bailey's or something.
- [29:07]
B
Yeah, yeah, you can make a little Irish there.
- [29:10]
A
Yeah, I love it. But I'm a coffee fiend. I do love my coffee. How do you take your coffee?
- [29:14]
B
Very similar to yours, actually. Clean with 2% milk. And at night I may add something else if it's a long light. Totally. I love it.
- [29:25]
A
Well, thank you for having me.
- [29:26]
B
No, thank you for coming and this was really, really fun.
- [29:30]
A
I can't wait to see you again. And hopefully we'll get you some products so you can see the glow.
- [29:34]
B
Oh, I would love that. And to you guys, I will see you next week with more coffee number five. Bye. Find everything you need@larashmoisman.com or in the episode notes right below. Don't forget to subscribe. Was so good to have you here today. See you next time. Catch you on the flip side. Ciao, ciao.