← Cold Case Files
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- [00:01]
Narrator
From 1989 to 1995, nurse Kristen Gilbert murdered four of her patients at the Veterans Affairs Medical center in Massachusetts, and she's suspected of killing dozens more. On Mind of a Monster, a podcast from ID, criminal psychologist Dr. Michelle Ward dives into Kristen Gilbert's twisted mind to try and find out why she killed her patients and and how she was able to do it in front of her colleagues. She speaks with detectives, journalists, nurses and victims families to unpack Gilbert's life and crimes on Ward C. Listen to Mind of a Monster the Killer Nurse Wherever you get your podcasts, Audible's romance collection has something to satisfy every side of you when it comes to what kind of romance you're into. You don't have to choose just one fancy a dalliance with a duke or maybe a steamy billionaire. You could find a book boyfriend in the city and another one tearing it up on the hockey field. And if nothing on this earth satisfies, you can always find love in another realm. Discover modern rom coms from authors like Lily Chu and Ali Hazelwood, the latest romantasy series from Sarah J. Maas and Rebecca Yarros, plus Regency favorites like Bridgerton and Outlander, and of course, all the really steamy stuff. Your first great love story is free when you sign up for a free 30 day trial at autumn audible.com wondery that's audible.com wondery hi, I survive listeners.
- [01:33]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
I'm Marissa Pinson, and before we get into this week's episode, I just want to remind you that episodes of I Survived as well as the A E classic podcast, Cold Case Files, City Confidential, and American justice are all available ad free on the new A E Crime and Investigation channel on Apple Podcasts and Apple plus for just 4.99amonth or 39.99 a year. And now onto the show. This episode contains subject matter that may be disturbing to some listeners. Listener discretion is advised.
- [02:04]
Philip (Missionary)
To me, it felt like it went from a color day to a black and white day that I was driving into no man's land and I was. I was dead.
- [02:13]
Ali (Tunneler)
Real people when they saw me, it's almost like they saw a ghost because they're expecting three people and there was.
- [02:19]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Only one who faced death.
- [02:22]
Karen (Survivor)
He was sort of poking me with that knife and talking to me the whole time. And I remember thinking I'm going to.
- [02:29]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Die and live to tell how.
- [02:32]
Philip (Missionary)
The minute that gunfire hit me, I just knew that chances were pretty good and I was leaning towards dying that day more than anything else.
- [02:41]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
This is I survived it's 2001 in Port au Prince, Haiti. Philip, a missionary, runs a non profit charity. He organizes building materials, food and clothing for Haitians in need.
- [03:02]
Philip (Missionary)
I founded an organization that gleans resources in the United States and channels them into the Haitian churches to help Haitian pastors develop their own programs.
- [03:14]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Philip was about to drive to Port au Prince with five year old Shelton and his father. Shelton, a local boy, had an eye injury and needed a visa to get treatment in America.
- [03:25]
Philip (Missionary)
That morning I woke up early and Shelton, his father and I jumped in the Ford Ranger. Our intent was just to run into Port au Prince. It was about a 40, 50 mile trip. Get in there, get his visa so I could bring him home to the United States for surgery on his eye. We had got into the outskirts of Port au Prince near Airport Road. There was a UN checkpoint. I was pulled over. My license was checked.
- [03:56]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
The UN soldiers were in Haiti to keep peace among warring political factions. Several miles past the checkpoint, Philip approached Ashanti town.
- [04:06]
Philip (Missionary)
I'm driving 45 miles an hour, 50 miles an hour. The roads are clear and I glance back, I see movement on both sides of the vehicle and a little boy out in the middle of the road who had just chucked a rock at the windshield. In that instant that I saw the rock and duct gunfire broke out all around the car. The movement I saw in my peripheral vision were gunmen. And there's a 12 gauge shotgun just a foot off of this side of the car that blasted through the driver's side window. There were a number of guns on that side of the car. Bullets came through the windshield and you know, that was just a boom. The minute that gunfire hit me and I felt that shot hit me, I knew, I just knew that chances were pretty good that I was leaning towards dying that day more than anything else. I was shot. I'd felt something hit me. I was shot pretty bad. And I'm thinking, options, options, options, what's next? All I could think of was get the truck stopped, get your hands up and get out on your own two feet. Maybe you'll have a chance. And I was immediately mobbed. I mean mobbed, seriously mobbed by 20, 25 people. They just all grabbed me, hands in every one of my pocke, moving me around the back of the truck towards the sidewalk. One guy just ripped my shirt off. Most of the hands are now in my wallet pocket trying to get my wallet out. They're fighting for my wallet. I mean, that's the treasure chest as far as they're concerned. I got it pulled Out. And the minute that thing hit the air, man, they grabbed that and they were all gone. Everybody disappeared. And it was so crazy because it was just like everybody around was going about their business, their daily business. The shoeshine boy, the lady with the basket of charcoal on her head, somebody walking by with a donkey.
- [06:15]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
The young boy Shelton and his father also disappeared, leaving Philip alone.
- [06:21]
Philip (Missionary)
I'm looking at myself. My arm is just hamburger and I got bullet holes in my chest and I'm a mess. There was blood pouring off all five of my fingers. I had two holes in my chest where large buckshot or something hit me and I had rivers of blood going down my stomach. But this time I just felt like, wow, this is it, buddy. You are in the crap now. And you know, that's like I said, it just to me, it felt like it went from a color day to a black and white day that I was driving into no man's land and I was dead and I had rivers of blood going down my stomach. My first concern was I have to get somewhere and get this patched up now. A group of young men, they were probably between the ages of 16 and 22, six or seven of them kind of stuck their head around the corner and they said, what you gonna do? What you gonna do? And I said, I need help, man. That's all I know, I need help. I'm bleeding.
- [07:31]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
The young men took Philip to a house deep in the slum to treat his wounds.
- [07:36]
Philip (Missionary)
Three Red Cross workers, Haitian Red Cross workers walked in. Two women and a man dressed in, dressed nicely in the Red Cross uniforms with their, with their stuff. And they went right to work. I mean, they, they no monkey business at all. They couldn't talk to me. They weren't allowed to say anything. I greeted them, they didn't greet me back. Just about the time the Red Cross was leaving, somebody brought Shelton down.
- [08:04]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Shelton was the five year old boy who urgently needed eye surgery in America. Philip was driving Shelton to Port au Prince to get a visa when they were ambushed.
- [08:14]
Philip (Missionary)
They just brought him in and gave him to me and we were reunited. So at this point it was he and I. It was only minutes then that the people who had brought me there suggested that we go for another little walk. For the most part, you know, they're ignoring me or they're just making fun. You know, this is a game to them. It's my life, but it's a game to them. They took me from there and we started marching back through the, through this ghetto area.
- [08:52]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Philip and Shelton were Delivered to an armed gang and taken hostage.
- [08:56]
Philip (Missionary)
We were met about halfway up by a pretty rugged looking group of people carrying arms, AKs and 9 millimeters machetes, you know, about half a dozen of them. Pretty rough looking characters, you know, at this point. It's pretty interesting when you're that close to death, you know, there's not a whole lot in the world that you want besides just to be able to look into somebody's eyes and connect, you know, I'm feeling like, man, this could be my last couple hours on earth. They parked us in a house. It was a little room, about 15 by 15. And they took me in there and they started talking. The main man, who was my new host, started talking and asking me about who I was and this and that. And he eventually gave me a telephone and said, call somebody. Call somebody. You know, we're going to hold you for ransom and we're going to ask $300,000 for your release. So call somebody.
- [10:13]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Philip phoned his son Chad, who worked for his charity in Haiti.
- [10:17]
Philip (Missionary)
So I called him and I said, man, you're not going to believe this. You got to do something. You're the man on the outside.
- [10:24]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Philip's son called the US Embassy to help him assemble a negotiating team. It was comprised of Haitian police and a private negotiator.
- [10:34]
Philip (Missionary)
When my final host informed me that he was going to ask $300,000 for my release, I really just sort of laughed at him to begin with. And, you know, I tried to explain to him, look, man, how are you going to get $300,000 for a missionary, you know. And then I went on to tell him, you know, I don't have money in the bank. I don't. I'm not a tourist, I'm not a businessman. I'm not down here for the sex trades. I'm not down here fishing. I'm a missionary. Everything I do is about giving what I have or what I can get together, giving it to your people.
- [11:20]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
The authorities were convinced the kidnappers would kill Philip after the ransom was paid. But Chad was confident his father could survive.
- [11:29]
Philip (Missionary)
So Chad and his team came together and started doing negotiations. In the meantime, I'm still in the room.
- [11:39]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
By 5pm the negotiations had stalled and the kidnappers began to torment them.
- [11:45]
Philip (Missionary)
My new post, you know, he's the kind of guy that, you know, if he wanted to, he could kill you. And I'm just like that. He carried a 9 millimeter, but his buddy Trashmouth, that guy was just brutal. He's the one that Would. He's the one that would heckle me, you know, over and over again. I'm gonna kill you. I'm gonna cut your head off. You know, by morning you're going to be dead. I don't care what this guy does. I'm going to kill you. You know, I looked him in the eye and I said to him, I said, I would be afraid of that, but I'm a missionary and I believe with all my heart that the only reason I'm here, you didn't bring me here. The only reason I'm really here is that God has me here. And he has me here for a reason. You can threaten to kill me. In fact, you can kill me, but I choose to love you. Whatever happens, I choose to love you. And if you kill me, I will forgive you. For the first time in my life, I'm realizing that, you know, I could be martyred. The negotiations continued through the day. Maybe I talked to Chad maybe four times that day. And every time I would talk to him, you know, and hang up the phone, my host would do his thing. You know, they're still not offering. You're not never going to get out of this. And, you know, it came to one point late in the afternoon where Chad, I'm starting to get on him, man, what is wrong with you people out there? And he's finally telling me, he's saying, listen, dad, you just have to trust me. And he said that about three or four times. And finally a light came on and I said, okay, all right, I'll trust you.
- [13:46]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
A ransom of $3,000 was agreed upon, but too late for the exchange to be made.
- [13:51]
Philip (Missionary)
That day, I was really getting bummed out when I noticed the sun was going down. I was going to be stuck there all night and probably the worst night of my life. That place is scary.
- [14:04]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
After dark at nighttime, shooting would often erupt.
- [14:09]
Philip (Missionary)
Sometime probably close to 11 or 12 o' clock at night. Just all hell broke loose. Just all of a sudden, it's like the whole slum just erupted in gunfire. Every caliber gun you can imagine firing out for minutes. I mean, thousands of rounds. And then within minutes, a whole nother volley of gunfire would erupt from the UN camp that was a quarter of a mile away. And they're throwing lead back into the slum. All their guns, the M16s and the thumping 50 calibers, just round after round after round. And then that would stop and it'd be quiet for a while. And then, you know, just when you're starting to relax, the slum would erupt in gunfire. And it went back and forth like this about six or seven times. And then it stopped, you know, and we're tentatively wondering what's going to happen next, you know, is somebody coming in to rescue us or what's going on here?
- [15:21]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
By late morning, the kidnappers brought a community leader to the shack.
- [15:25]
Philip (Missionary)
He came up and he started talking to me in nearly perfect English and just started a conversation like we met at the grocery store or something. Hey, how you doing? I hear your name's Philip. So, you know, and he started to tell me a little bit about himself and that, that he had worked for a particular institution in Haiti that was, that was a non profit, sort of a benevolent organization. And that's when I started to talk to him. You know, he finally took a moment, I started to tell him about my family. And, you know, he says, philip, will you drink with me? And I said, yeah, sure. So he uncorked a bottle of rum, took a big hit on it, handed it to me. I hit on it and handed it back to him. And he said, you're free. He said, we got you free. You know, we've made the deal and you're out of here. I said, you serious? Are you serious? Yeah, you're free. Somebody unlocked this door and they unlocked the door and I said, wow. I stepped outside. I said, well, let's go.
- [16:37]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Philip and Shelton flew to America for Shelton's eye surgery. Philip's son Chad has now returned to America. Philip still suffers from his injuries, but continues his charity work in Haiti.
- [16:50]
Philip (Missionary)
Bottom line is the people, they're fantastic people. They're just full of love, full of energy, full of joy, and they're amazing. Even in poverty, you know, these people come through with just such pure joy and such a love for living. I believe that I survived because God's hand is on my life. And it would bring him more glory for me to survive than it would have brought for me to die.
- [17:19]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Hey there, it's Marissa. If you're loving, I survived. You need to check out Crimes of the newest show from Crime House studios. Hosted by Sabrina Deannaroga and Corinne Vien of two girls one ghost. Crimes of is a weekly true crime anthology series that explores a new theme each season from crimes of the paranormal, unsolved murders, mysterious disappearances, and more. For their first season, Sabrina and Corinne are diving into crimes of infamy. The real life events behind Hollywood's most iconic horror villains. From cult classics to massive franchises. Norman Bates, Buffalo Bill, Ghostface, Jason Voorhees. The names alone are enough to send a shiver down your spine. And now you'll be immersed into chilling crimes that inspired them. Crimes of is a crime House original powered by Pave Studios. Listen on Apple podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, or wherever you listen.
- [18:14]
Narrator/Advertiser (Jonathan Dixon and Greg Owen promo)
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- [19:18]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
It's 1994 in Yonkers, New York.
- [19:21]
Karen (Survivor)
I met Ron on a blind date. He was very different from most of the men I was used to. He had sort of a kind of like an edge to him. There was something attractive about the bad boy, but not quite the bad boy. He was spontaneous. He just liked life. And I said, oh, this was kind of nice. Even though my friends when they first met him were cautious, I think, but friends are supposed to be cautious about you, that eventually they got to like him. So he was very easy to get along with.
- [19:49]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Karen was married to Ron for four years.
- [19:52]
Karen (Survivor)
It was around Father's Day and we'd gotten up. We were planning to spend the day together, actually. We were going to go out and visit his dad, and he said he was going to go buy the Sunday morning paper. So we left the house. And about half an hour after he left the house, the phone rang. And I answered the phone, there was a woman on the phone. And she said, can I speak to Ron? And I said, I'm sorry, he's not home, but this is his wife. Can I take a message? And I remember she went something like, oh, my God, I have to talk to you. And then she started to talk. And that's when I found out that this is a woman, that he actually had a relationship even before we got married. As a matter of fact, this is kind of like a soap opera. But on our first blind date, she was in the hospital giving birth to their son. You can tell when another woman's not lying to you because she just knew too many intimate details. She could describe my car, she knew when my husband had had he ruptured his Achilles tendon. So she knew a lot of things. So I just knew that she wasn't lying.
- [20:58]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Karen confronted Ron about the female caller.
- [21:01]
Karen (Survivor)
He got upset. First of all, I think that this woman called. He was yelling at me. He couldn't believe that I would believe her over him. We argued for hours back and forth. And finally it was about 8:30 and I figured, you know, this is enough. I began to get a sense that if I pushed it any further that something bad was going to happen. I just got a sense that he was going to hit me.
- [21:25]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Unknown to Karen, Ron had assaulted his previous partner.
- [21:29]
Karen (Survivor)
About 10 o' clock that same night, the phone rang and it was this woman calling again. And her words to me were, you okay? And I said, yeah. And she said, did you tell Ron what? I said? And I said, yeah. And she kept saying, are you okay? But I was trying to talk to her so that he kind of wouldn't know it was her on the phone because I didn't want the argument to start again. So after a few minutes, I hung up the phone. And after I hung up the phone, Ron turned toward me and he had this weird look in his eye and he said, oh, so now the two of you are plotting against me. She calls you up on the phone, you believe everything she says. So now it's you two against me. And I'm kind of wondering what's he talking about? And he says, he says, so I tell you what, I'm gonna punch you in your face and I'm gonna break your jaw. He said, then I want you to call her on the phone and tell her all about it. And I just very nonchalantly said to him, if you put your hands on me, it won't be her I'll be calling, it'll be the police. And I meant it, but that's just what I said. And he sort of chuckled and he kind of turned away from me and he turned toward the nightstand that was on the left side of the bed. And when he turned back to me, he had a knife in his hand. The knife had a brown wooden handle and a blade that was about 6 inches long and it was jagged on the edge. And he stood, stuck this knife right in front of my face. And that's when he started screaming at me. And he kept saying, who'd you say you were gonna call? Who'd you say you were gonna call? And I just sort of stared at the knife, and I just remembered saying to myself, don't say anything. If you don't say anything, he'll calm down. Then after a while, he closed the knife, and as he's turning away from me, I guess to put the knife back in the drawer, in my mind, I was thinking, okay, now you have to get out of here, but how are you gonna do this? So I sort of eased my legs off the side of the bed, put my feet on the floor, and I just very casually turned to him and said, I'll be right back. I have to go to the bathroom. And I reached on the floor because my pocketbook was on the floor, and I picked up my pocketbook, and when my feet hit the floor, the next thing I remember is I was running out the front door. I remember going down the stairs and out the front door, and I didn't stop running until I was two blocks away at the police station.
- [23:52]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Two days later, Karen returned home with the police. Her husband was upstairs.
- [23:57]
Karen (Survivor)
He was upstairs watching, of all things, the O.J. simpson trial, because that was actually going on at this time. And I heard them talking to him. And a few minutes later, he came down with, like, a duffel bag in his hand. And he stopped at the bottom of the stairs, and he just stared at me with this, like, look of hatred, and, like, my blood boiled chill just thinking about it. And then he walked out the door, and off the police went, and off he went. And I kind of thought that that was going to be the end of it.
- [24:26]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Karen took legal action, obtaining a restraining order which prevented Ron from returning home. But two weeks later, Ron broke into the apartment through a side window.
- [24:36]
Karen (Survivor)
So Saturday morning, I woke up, walked over to the bedroom door, opened the door, and when I opened the door, Ron was standing in the doorway. He was naked except for a pair of green plaid boxer shorts. He had nothing else on. I think I just was, like, shocked, and I just said, what are you doing here? You're not supposed to be here. That's when I think I started to get nervous. And that's when I noticed the knife and the ropes. All he said to me is, you're going to listen to me now. And then he said, lay down. And I just said, no. And before I could get the no out good, he punched me with a closed fist square in the middle of my chest. And then he got on the bed on top of me, and he put One knee on this part of my arm and another knee on that part of my arm. And then he took those two ropes that he had. And he tied my wrists to the headboard. I went to scream, and at which point he took the scarf that I was wearing on my head off my head and shoved it in my mouth. And he got a pair of black pantyhose out. He cut them in half. And then he tied my ankles with the pantyhose. He walks around to the foot of the bed. He steps out of those boxer shorts, climbs up on the bed, he takes the knife, and he cuts off my underwear. And that's when he got on top of me. And that's when the rape happened. The thing that just held me together was I just kept saying, keep your eyes open and watch everything. Because the police are gonna want details, and you're gonna have to tell them. He walked over to the bed, and he took the gag out of my mouth. And he says, I need some money. Where's your pocketbook? Now that. I think that made me angrier, even in the rape. Because I'm thinking, you break into my house, you rape me, and now you want to take my money. And I'm thinking, I don't care what happens. I'm not letting him have my money. So I wouldn't answer him. He smacked me in the face. I still wouldn't answer him. And then he started rummaging through the room. He rummaged through the bureau. He's looking under the bed. He's looking in the chair. And right when he got to the closet door, which is where I remember my pocketbook was, that's when I said, wait a minute. My pocketbook's not here. It's at Brenda's house. I'm just lying through my teeth. But then I said, but you have to let me call her. We're going to go shopping, and I don't want her to come right now. So you have to let me call her. And he thought about it for a moment, and then he took the knife and he cut the pantyhose. I thought that I'd be able to dial 911 and pretend that I was talking to Brenda so that I could get help. But in effect, he was standing right in front of me with the knife pointed right at my neck. And he said, okay, now call Brenda. She said, hello? And I said, brenda? She said, yeah. I said, listen, I can't go shopping today, so, you know, don't come over. And she's like, karen, what are you talking about? And then I said, listen to me. I can't go shopping today. Don't come over. And she said, are you okay? And I said, no. Then she said, is Ron there? And I said, yes. And then very casually, she said, let me talk to him. So I handed him the phone. I said, here, she wants to talk to you. And I thought, good, he's talking to her. Now's my time to escape. And then it dawned on me. When I'd gotten home that night, I locked myself in with the deadbolt lock. The key to the lock was in my pocketbook. My pocketbook was in the closet. Plus, I knew that there was no way I could get across the bedroom, open the closet door, reach in, get my pocketbook, get the key out, get down the stairs, unlock the door. I just knew that I couldn't get away from him. And the first time I ran, he didn't follow me, but I was convinced he was going to follow me this time. And he still had the knife. I could see him sort of hunch over a little bit. And then I heard him start to cry. And the only thing he was sort of mumbling, the only thing I did remember hear him saying, was something to the effect of, well, I guess this means that I can never come back home now. And then he said a few more things to her. And then he said, okay, goodbye. And he hung up the phone. And then he turned around, he looked at me, and he said, brenda said she'll be by later. And then he said, are you okay? That's when I got really mad. And I just said to him, I said, you'll have to kill me before I ever let you touch me again. And that's when he started to laugh, and it was this real creepy kind of laugh. And he said, well, you know what he said? Monday, you're going back to court, and you're going to tell the judge you changed your mind. And I'm packing my stuff and I'm moving back in. And you're not going to tell anybody about this, because if you do, he said to me, I will kill you.
- [29:29]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Once Ron left the room, Karen called the police.
- [29:33]
Karen (Survivor)
I remember hearing him walk down both of the flights of stairs. And I remember I heard the refrigerator door open. And as soon as I heard the refrigerator door open, I picked up the phone, and that's when I dialed 911. I was frantic, and I was whispering, you got to send the police to my house. My husband's in the house. He has a knife and he just raped me. I have an order of protection. I'm just babbling, but I'm sort of. It's a hysterical whisper because I didn't want him to know I was on the phone. The woman on the phone was calm, and she said, okay, ma', am, I want you to calm down. I remember her saying, is he still in the room? And I said, I think I said, no, he's downstairs. He has a knife. And she's saying, okay, well, the police are on their way. And after I hung up the phone, that's when I remembered I had a wall phone in the kitchen. And it was the kind of a phone that there's a little red light. So when you pick up the phone upstairs, it lights up. Extension in use. And I'm thinking to myself, oh, my God, he knows I'm on the phone. And I just remember just laying in that room, panicking. It seemed like an eternity, but it couldn't have been more than minutes because I started to hear sirens and I heard a lot of sirens. Eventually it dawned on me that he was gone. So I got up enough courage to go down and I let the police in.
- [30:52]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Ron had fled when he heard the police sirens.
- [30:55]
Karen (Survivor)
I worked with the detectives because they said that I was going to have to help them catch him. They said that he will eventually call you. And I said, okay, how am I going to do this? And then I got this clever idea. While we were married, he had gotten injured on the job, and he had a workman's compensation case pending. And about three weeks or so after the rape, while he was still out there and they hadn't caught him yet, a letter came from the Workman's Compensation board that they had scheduled a hearing date for him for the 26th of August.
- [31:30]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Still at large, Ron called Karen at her workplace.
- [31:34]
Karen (Survivor)
And I don't even remember what he said to me, but I remember saying to him, I've got good news for you. You won your compensation case, and you're going to get three years back salary in one lump sum and a check. But you have to go to the Workman's Compensation Board in Brooklyn. I gave them the address and the time. It was the hearing date. I don't know what the status of his case was, but I was lying. But you have to go there and be there at this date and this time to get this money. And apparently, from what I was told, he was sitting in the audience, and when they called his name, he stood up, and then so did the detective that was on this side of him and on that side of the room. And that's how they got him.
- [32:12]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Ronald Coleman was sentenced to nine years in prison. Karen is now the associate director of the Bronx Sexual Assault Response Team.
- [32:21]
Karen (Survivor)
I survived because I refused to close my eyes, that I stayed awake and I watched everything. And I think I survived because I refused to be silent about it. I told right away.
- [32:41]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
I survived is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. You chose to hit play on this podcast today. Smart Choice. Progressive loves to help people make smart choices. That's why they offer a tool called Auto Quote Explorer that allows you to compare your Progressive car insurance quote with rates from other companies so you save time on the research and can enjoy savings when you choose the best rate for you. Give it a try after this episode@progressive.com, progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates not available in all states or situations. Prices vary based on how you buy. It's 2007 in Fall River, Massachusetts.
- [33:18]
Ali (Tunneler)
What we do for a living is we build tunnels. In order to do a tunnel, you gotta do a shaft. You know, that's for access to the tunnel. On this job, we had just sinked the shaft. We just dug our way all the way down from where we started the surface. We dug our way down 120ft and we just got to the bottom of it.
- [33:39]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Ali, Kenny and Johnny are tunnelers digging out rock at the bottom of a 120 foot shaft.
- [33:47]
Kenny or Johnny (Tunnel worker)
So we're off to the side and all of a sudden we get a loud pop. And we thought it sounded like compressed air, like an airline let go or something at first. But then a lot of sand and muddy water starts hitting the top of my excavator.
- [34:03]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
An excavator is a mechanical digger that removes rock and soil.
- [34:08]
Ali (Tunneler)
Then all of a sudden, all the soil start coming with the water. So when everything get black, you can't really see what the water looks like, except for you could feel it and hear it coming down on you. And I'd say the water pressure was almost like someone turned a really, really heavy hose straight at you.
- [34:28]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Water was pouring out of a burst sewer pipe above them. The three men were in danger of drowning in the shaft. Their only link to the surface was a two way radio.
- [34:40]
Ali (Tunneler)
We realized that whatever was coming in was heavy and the rate that it was rising, you know that there was something wrong. But the water washed our communication out and it washed the lights out. So the whole place go dark. Well, the big gush that we hear or the big boom that we hear never stopped it. Just kept going on. Everything just went black. No communication, no radio because the water was so heavy, along with whatever is coming with the water, you know, everything went out.
- [35:09]
Kenny or Johnny (Tunnel worker)
John and Ali said, what's that? I go, this is not a good thing. I says, I go, the soil culvert just breached open and I says we're gonna get a lot of water. We just started getting looking for higher ground. The higher the better. Cause the pump wasn't pumping enough, it wasn't handling a lot of water. So we just started getting a little higher and higher on the walls and the rock. We kind of stuck together. I grabbed the pump electrical line to get a little higher. Not a good thing to grab. It's electric in water. But at that point we were trying to like climb it, scale in the walls like rats.
- [35:49]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Ali, Kenny and Johnny held onto rock bolts to keep their heads above water.
- [35:54]
Ali (Tunneler)
I started freaking out because I know I can't swim. Even if we could float to the top, I don't think I could float to the top because I, you know, I probably would just panic in the water. I know I'm from Jamaica and I'm supposed to know how to swim because they think Jamaica is one big beach. But I don't think there was time to panic. You know, you just, you know, do whatever you think it is that you're going to survive. I see something bobbing in the water and when I saw something bobbing I thought that was the top of the excavator. I thought that was the excavator bobbing in the water.
- [36:25]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
In seconds the water had covered the seven foot tall excavator. Ali couldn't swim and knew he was in danger of drowning.
- [36:34]
Ali (Tunneler)
And as I reach over to grab the top of the excavator, I said to myself, if the excavator is bobbing, that mean I'm dead. From the time that the water start coming in and the time when I'm heading for the excavator when the water's up to our neck, it's like 20 seconds. I said to myself, I thought about my wife and I thought about my kids and I said, you know, this is it, there's no way out. What are you gonna do? As I'm heading towards the top of the excavator and as I reached out to grab onto the top of the excavator to go up, I felt the expanded metal and I said, this is not the excavator, this is the cage.
- [37:11]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Attached to a crane. The cage was used to lift the workers in and out of the shaft. Both the excavator and the cage were on the floor of the shaft, covered by water.
- [37:22]
Ali (Tunneler)
I just felt my way around and I dove through the window of the cage. And the moment I dove through the window of the cage, the cage took off.
- [37:30]
Kenny or Johnny (Tunnel worker)
And so me and John were left down the hole. But we were still in the same spot that we were. And when our eyes adjusted to the darkness, we realized that the cage was going up.
- [37:41]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
The cage, with Allie inside was lifted out of the shaft by the crane driver above.
- [37:46]
Ali (Tunneler)
At the same time, I was swearing at the guys up top because I taught they up top could see what's going on in the hole. Knowing that they're taking off with me and there's two other guys there. That was the worst feeling in my entire life. The moment I reached to where I could see the people up top, which was about five people up there looking over into the shaft. When I came up and they saw me in the cage, that's where they know we had a problem. Because when they saw me, it's almost like they saw a ghost, because they're expecting three people and there was only one. Well, the moment I get up there, they was gonna pick the cage up and swing me over, put you on the ground, then swing the cage back and go get the other two guys.
- [38:26]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Safety protocol strictly forbids employees to perform rescue operations. Ali decided he couldn't wait for an emergency rescue team to arrive.
- [38:35]
Ali (Tunneler)
But some circumstances like that one, there was no time to wait. You wait a second. I know the fire department probably would really want to go rescue the guys, But, I mean, time for them to get in the cage would have been too late.
- [38:49]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Water was rising up the shaft at a rate of 10ft per minute.
- [38:53]
Ali (Tunneler)
The water was rising so fast down there, I just tell them, hey, you guys, throw me a flashlight and drop me back in the hole. I know where those guys are, you know, and they throw me a flashlight. And the crane started going back down. And as soon as the cage hit where the water is coming in, the cage started going from side to side, swinging, hitting the rocks. But they keep lowering it down slowly, and they drop it in.
- [39:16]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Ali had only minutes to locate Kenny and Johnny in the dark and get them out. Kenny and Johnny were struggling to keep afloat.
- [39:25]
Kenny or Johnny (Tunnel worker)
So me and John were just kind of staying together and we're agreeing on what we were gonna do. We were trying not to panic because that's the worst thing you could ever do. You wanna stay on top of your game. So we can get out of this thing. By that time, there was a good 6, 7ft of water in the hole. So both of us were swimming. We need to stay right here because they're gonna send it back down, but they're not gonna know where we are. And we don't want to be in the middle where the cage just was. We want them to land the cage back down. So we want to stay against the wall where we were, because we were safe where we were at.
- [39:56]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Kenny and Johnny clung to the walls of the shaft as the water rose around them. As the Ken returned with Ali inside, it plunged into the rising water.
- [40:07]
Ali (Tunneler)
By the time I get back down there, it was about 15ft of water in the hole. And Johnny was hanging on the wires right in the water right there.
- [40:14]
Kenny or Johnny (Tunnel worker)
He yelled for us, and I jumped off the rock bolt that I was hanging on and kind of swam to the cage.
- [40:20]
Ali (Tunneler)
And I said, kenny, the cage is here. And he swam over. I dragged him through the window, put him in. Johnny saw the flashlight, the little light in the thing, and he jumped over and jumped on top of the cage.
- [40:33]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
The cable went slack, which caused the crane to pull the cage up to steady it.
- [40:39]
Ali (Tunneler)
But I guess after I found out that they saw the cable get loose to the crane and they pulled it back. When they're pulling back the cage for one second, I said to myself, I hope to God they're not pulling back the cage again. And I didn't get the guys yet, and I grabbed them off the cage and pulled him through that window. And the cages took off again because they have no communication. So whether or not them guys were ready, the cage was going up again.
- [41:03]
Kenny or Johnny (Tunnel worker)
We jumped and climbed into the cage, just gave a big hug and said, I love you, man. It was just a good feeling when we came up and saw everybody up on top. And everybody was whistling and clapping and yeehooing. I could say that we all made it out.
- [41:20]
Ali (Tunneler)
And the crane operator swing us over the cage, landed on the ground, which was. You wouldn't believe how happy that feeling was to be on dry ground. I never been kissed by so many men in my entire life. It's unbelievable. We had this. We had this. It was good. It was real good. It's almost like you could have a heart attack and die from being so happy.
- [41:44]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Heavy rain had caused the sewer pipe to burst at a weak point the shaft.
- [41:48]
Ali (Tunneler)
Took about eight minutes for that whole shaft to fill all the way up to the top. But I think they said it was like 10,000 gallons a minute or something like that.
- [41:57]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Ali had managed to rescue his colleagues from the flooding shaft in just over five minutes.
- [42:03]
Ali (Tunneler)
If anyone had thought about what we're supposed to do, two guys would have been dead. But no one thought about what we're supposed to do. We just do what we had to do.
- [42:13]
Kenny or Johnny (Tunnel worker)
I survived because everybody stayed into their safety game. We try to stay on our game. We look out for one of another. That's why I survived, because everybody stayed on their game.
- [42:29]
Ali (Tunneler)
I survived because luck, the guys up top and God. That's the three reasons why I'm here today. It's the only three reasons why I survive.
- [42:45]
Karen (Survivor)
This September, CBS hits are streaming free on Pluto tv. Coming in for this month only. Stream full episodes of Matlock.
- [42:52]
Ali (Tunneler)
I'm a lawyer.
- [42:53]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
Like the old TV show Fire Country.
- [42:56]
Karen (Survivor)
Elsbeth.
- [42:57]
Narrator
I do love a mystery.
- [42:58]
Karen (Survivor)
NCIS Origins, Watson and Ghosts.
- [43:02]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
What the hell?
- [43:03]
Kenny or Johnny (Tunnel worker)
This is the most amazing sight I've never seen.
- [43:06]
Karen (Survivor)
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- [43:09]
Ali (Tunneler)
Only on Pluto tv.
- [43:11]
Karen (Survivor)
Stream now. Pain? Never.
- [43:14]
Host (Marissa Pinson)
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