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- [00:01]
A
Now we've got this world where you can meet your creative vision behind the brand. You're literally exposed to everyone in the management chain in one room and you can kind of see the brand top to bottom. You can often go and see your actual watch being made. You're kept in the loop in terms of where it is in the production process and blah, blah, and you can see where your money's going and that's true luxury, really.
- [00:26]
B
What's going on, everybody? And welcome to Collector's Gene Radio. This is all about diving into the nuances of collecting and ultimately finding out whether or not our guests have what we like to call the Collector's Gene. If you have the time, please subscribe and leave a review. It truly helps. Thanks a bunch for listening and please enjoy today's guest on Collector's Gene Radio. Today I'm sitting down with entrepreneur and influencer Tom Exton, otherwise known online as tge. Tom first made waves when he and his twin brother launched a pioneering digital fitness company. And while that endeavor introduced him to a massive audience, it was his content on watches and cars that struck a nerve. With his following over time, he's built a loyal following of hundreds of thousands following his every move in the collector space. And an even more impressive collection. A true collector at heart, Tom began his journey with watches, starting with brands that resonate with most of the world. But these days, he's a devoted fan of independent watchmakers. Watchmakers who truly push the boundaries of design and craftsmanship. And yes, there's even a story about acquiring an FP journe elegant at a petrol station. A story that sums up his two passions. When it comes to cars, Tom stable is just as impressive. From Porsches, Ferraris and even a Carrera gt, he's chased the thrill of the drive and the artistry of design. His latest acquisition though, a jaw dropping Ferrari 250, pinned Farina, a grail for vintage car enthusiasts everywhere. Beyond collecting, Tom has turned his passions into business ventures, including a luxury watch giveaway platform and a company producing protective stickers for watches. At the end of the day, Tom brings a unique perspective to the idea of doing what you love. So please enjoy. This is Tom Exton for Collector's Dream Radio. Tom Exton, AKA tge. So great to have you on Collector's Dream Radio.
- [02:17]
A
Hello, Hello. Thanks for having me. Appreciate it.
- [02:20]
B
My pleasure. So most know you online under your handle tge, but before we get started, you're a car watch enthusiast, you're a collector. What's on the wrist and what's coming out of the stable today?
- [02:33]
A
What's on the wrist? So I'm literally just sat in a fairly miserable UK at the moment with a Vacheron overseas, 2300V on the wrist. Today it's 37 mil blue dial overseas. No date, just with a little sub dial on it. Quite a sneaky reference actually. Don't really see many of them out. I think they've stopped it now. What's going out the stable today? Absolutely nothing. Not leaving the house, but probably Defender. I live in my Land Rover Defender. I just think it's fantastic, the new generation. So arguably not a Defender at all, but yeah, I'm living things. Fantastic. Great.
- [03:07]
B
So you're an entrepreneur and for all intents and purposes, a collector. What was the moment that you realized collecting wasn't just a hobby for you, but ultimately something that would take on as a bit of a career?
- [03:21]
A
Well, I kind of started my career online, if you can call it a career. I mean, it's just messing around really. But I started in fitness and I had a lot of young guys that follow me on my platforms for predominantly just building bigger arms and doing chest workouts and whatnot. But I've always been a watch and a car guy ever since I was a kid. And I would obviously do the fitness stuff on my social platforms and I would document whenever I was buying watches or sort of cars. And I started doing more and more of that online because I realized that actually these guys loved it. And very early doors on my platforms I actually had a car brand reach out to me and offer me money to go to St. Moritz and a light bulb sort of pinged above my head and I thought, wait, what? I can commercialize messing around with cars. How's that thing? I mean, I'm not going to argue it. Happy days. So very early on I realized it would actually pay to share my unhealthy, expensive habits online. So, I mean, it's a great ecosystem. The more money I spend on things that I love, the more kind of engagement online and the bigger my audience grows and then the more money I earn that enables me to then go and plow it back into the things I love. So, yeah, pretty wild. It's a mad ecosystem and not one that I envisaged when I was doing my studies and I was at law school envisaging being this kind of 70 hour week lawyer, being trapped in the office every day. And now I'm literally just sort of messing around doing stuff I love. So, yeah, it's a Crazy love.
- [04:52]
B
Pretty epic. Now, which came first for you? Was it collecting cars or collecting watches?
- [04:56]
A
Watches definitely came first, I think because the entry point was definitely, obviously a lot lower. I was big into Panerai back in the day, in the Paneristi days, Breitling, Bell and Ross. So not, not entry level pieces by any stretch. I mean they're still real punchy pieces but obviously the barrier to entry there we're talking must be 15 odd years ago now. I'm old but, you know, a couple of thousand, couple of thousand dollars at most for any of these pieces. I then eventually branched out into. Into a Rolex, but even back then Kermit Sub was like three grand, something like that. So definitely the car. The cars came down the line as I started making a little bit more money. Yeah. Not. It wasn't through lack of wanting, just through the numbers not stacking up and nowhere to put them as well. I was just living at home with my mum being a Pratt. So, yeah, the watches were easier to store rather than parking outside my mum's and her screaming at me.
- [05:54]
B
Yeah, for sure. Well, now you're kind of, you know, we talked a little bit before this show and independent watchmakers are currently the rage at the moment, not only for you but kind of in the watch world. And some of these watches you actually got in on pretty early on in terms of the craze, like your FP Jordan Elegant that you actually bought at a petrol station.
- [06:17]
A
Yeah, I mean it's a nice one if anyone's in the uk. Beckonsfield Services. I mean, it's one of the good ones, but yeah, it is just a fuel station with a few like a McDonald's and whatever in it. So, yeah, gas station. Yep.
- [06:29]
B
Tell me about that story because you actually bought it pretty well under market value.
- [06:33]
A
Yeah, so at the time market value was what I paid, but right now it's gone astronomical. So I paid the equivalent. Let me try and convert it to us, maybe 11,000 us for it. And I think retail at the time was maybe 12,000 US. So they weren't dramatically expensive then. But no one really wanted them. No one really. The Jaun guys were into Jaun, don't get me wrong, there were people buying Jaun and collecting Jaun and the mainstream hadn't got hold of it. And I'd always had a bit of an interest in the Indies, but I wasn't in the financial stage where I could take any risks in terms of what I bought. Just completely losing every penny that I spent. I don't like looking at these things as financial instruments. But again, I don't have enough zeros to my name that I can completely ignore that element. So I'd always kind of viewed the Indies with a bit of suspicion in terms of, yes, if it was just pure passion and I had all the money in the world, I'd be buying these things like packets of crisp. But actually, I do need to keep an eye on what they're going to be like in the future. And I saw that genre, I was like, how badly can this go wrong? 11,000 US, how much value can it lose? And it seemed like a really sensible place to get myself into the Jaun brand, but actually not risk everything. But we're talking at the time, a chronometri blur was maybe like 20,000 US. So they hadn't gone crazy yet either. And I remember, I think it was 2014, maybe 2013. I bought a Patek 5711 blue dial. And it was between that and a Jaun Chronometre Bleu at the time. And they were about. I have to keep trying to convert maybe 16,000 US, maybe around then, between 16, 20,000, something like that. And I was looking between the two and I still saw the Jaun as a bit of a punt. I thought the Patek might be slightly safer residual wise. Never in my wildest dreams did I think these things would even go up in value. I was buying them because I loved them and I thought maybe if I lose a couple of grand, at least I've had a nice time and I've liked it. So, yeah, it was a completely different market. I don't know which I prefer, really.
- [08:39]
B
Yeah. I don't think you could have gone wrong, obviously, on either of those purchases. Seeing how the market played out.
- [08:44]
A
No benefit of hindsight, hey. But I bought what I loved and I figured I could afford to do and I could afford to risk. But yeah, more of the story. I should have made money earlier, basically, and then I'd had a most crazy purchase.
- [09:00]
B
Well, you know, speaking of buying, what you love, another independent watchmaker that you have such an affinity for is Ludovic. And you know, you have a piece from him and your focus is really set on what he's doing. What do you love so much about his watches that have you so captivated right now?
- [09:17]
A
I love Ludovic Balois watches. I think in a sphere where every single complication's pretty much been done, people are. Loads of brands are just rehashing what they're all doing and his complications are truly unique. You know, I love. I think what I really love about it as well is the backstory. I don't know if you've seen the documentary he's done. It's him, I think. Is it Max Boussa or Philippe Dufour? There's other guys in there, but I watched the documentary just to see. Just to see. I think it's called Making Time. Yeah, great little documentary, anyway. But his backstory is amazing, and I think for me, he's kind of a blueprint as to what indies are about. And having met the fellow a couple of times, I just think he's fantastic. I think the work he does great. I think the complications are genius. He's obviously got the halftime, which is. They're all kind of jumping hour. He only does the halftime and the upside down at the moment. I have the upside down and he has got a chronograph coming. And I've been to his Italian, and he showed me the kind of. I don't know what you call the book that has all the technical diagrams on it. So they're kind of. I think they're at working proto stage or nearly there. And he was showing me how it worked, but I was lost within seconds. I mean, it doesn't take much, but I was absolutely lost as to what was going on with it. It's basically a chronograph, but with his Ludovic Baloa kind of mad take on it. So that'll be exciting. And I think that may well propel him into the mainstream. I do love his ethos. I love the way he does things. And he just loves his life, his little setup there. He. He can expand, but he doesn't want to. He doesn't want to ruin his enjoyment for life. He likes hanging around with his other half, his wife, I think they're married, and his dog. He just likes his little setup. And he doesn't want to expand because he doesn't want to potentially ruin his kind of way of life, which I think is great because so many of these brands are just out to churn, which, you know, I probably would if I was in their shoes. But he's just like, no. And I spent the day with him when I hung around with his mates, when I sat, sat playing with these motorized airplanes in the local field, just sat in the sun, drinking a beer with his pals. And I was like, this is. This is it, you know, he pops into the workshop, does a little bit of watchmaking. He's living the dream that Bloke, I think he sussed it, the work life balance off to the bloke. So I hope to buy one of the chronographs off him as and when, whenever he's finished finishing the field nearby. I love the fact if you buy a watch off him and he gets anyone being rude to him, he doesn't want to deal with them. He just doesn't want anyone, like basically ruining his life, which I guess is fair. Absolutely. Great, yeah. Top bloke.
- [11:56]
B
Are you on the docket to snag one of the chronographs?
- [12:00]
A
I am, yeah. We'll see what this year brings, what I can make money on and what that looks like and actually when they're released. But, yeah, I will try and jump in on one of them. I haven't seen sort of what it looks like, but, you know, he spent so many years on it, he's not going to release something that's rubbish. So, yeah, I'm earmarked in for one. We'll see what happens, though.
- [12:22]
B
You know, a big problem that a lot of people have with independent watchmaking is the barrier to entry. A lot of the pieces are pretty expensive, you know, and, you know, a lot of people that are saving up to buy a watch have to make that decision. Do I go with something that's really blue chip or do I go with something that's really avant garde? What do you think the future holds for independent watchmaking in the overall collector's market?
- [12:47]
A
I think it will continue to grow. I think your average collector that was buying Rolexes 10, 15 years ago, I think they're sick of it. They're sick of having to WhatsApp their dealer every other week saying, hey, how are you? How are your kids? Blah, blah, blah, let's pop in for a coffee, you know, like, we're all busy. No one's got time for this kind of nonsense or what rubbish can I buy so I can get something that I like that's not a luxury experience? It's terrible. And that was all we thought was the norm and that the only options available. But now we've got this world where you can meet your creative vision behind the brand. You're literally exposed to everyone in the management chain in one room and you can kind of see the brand top to bottom. You can often go and see your actual watch being made. You're kept in the loop in terms of where it is in the production process and blah, blah, and you can see where your money's going and that's True luxury really. I think when it comes to these sorts of high end purchases and we've seen it in the car world as well, people don't want to play the games anymore. They'd rather whether or not that's the resto mod scene or sort of buying classics and doing restorations. People want to be involved in the creative process and have a. Have a hand in it rather than just sucking up to an enormous corporation and being treated like a number and having to wine and dine sales assistants, which, whatever, that's your jam, you go for it. But I don't enjoy that and certainly the big brand journey for me is pretty much over. I'm kind of done with it. The Rolex side of it, you know, if I get allocated something I'll buy it just because, you know, your net worth goes up if you go and pick it up. But I've got. I don't take any enjoyment out of your standard Rolex churn. I don't get anything out of that. I've got Pepsi's sea dweller, 43 submariners, all of this stuff and I couldn't tell you the last time I even saw them, let alone wore them. Zero interest. I think the indie side of things will continue to grow. I think there probably are too many indies for them all to do well. I think we have reached saturation point in the amount of brands that are out there and the market can support and the amount of additions all of these brands are doing. But I do think we might see a slight shift and this will be potentially controversial in Chinese indie brands. So we've got behrends in the mix and I don't know if you're familiar with behrends.
- [15:15]
B
Yeah, sure.
- [15:16]
A
Slightly different obviously to the Swiss brands and they're kind of challenger brands if you like doing similar things but in a different way. And we've got another brand called Fam Al Hut. I don't know if you've seen that.
- [15:28]
B
It's got this.
- [15:30]
A
It's being developed at the moment. Fairly interesting fella. So I think we'll see some challenger brands coming out the kind of the Far East. And there's another one, it begins with. I think it's Yozoku something. I mean I'm butchering the names but I think he's a Japanese fellow that he lives in Lelock in Switzerland and so he's doing some cool stuff as well. I think we'll see some stuff like that. So yeah, I think that's where we're going to see the market going potentially. I've got something on order with Barrens, an ultralight. I think it's cool watch. I think it does give brands like. Wow. It doesn't give Rishabh Miller a run for their money. No one gives Richard Miller a run for their money. But I do think it's, it's demonstrative of what can be done without the constraints of billion pound marketing budgets and hype. It's an interesting side.
- [16:18]
B
Yeah. Well you actually have a couple businesses in the watch space that I want to talk about. You have a giveaway platform, you have a protective sticker company and I think the listeners will be excited to hear about both, especially the giveaway company because as you know, most people are just never sure how that works.
- [16:35]
A
Yeah. So obviously if you're listening in the US or anywhere outside of the uk, every jurisdiction different but in the UK we have a, it's effectively just a Raffle. It's called grailwatchclub.com not much of a plug because I suspect you don't have a huge amount of UK listeners. So this isn't a sell on anyone, just explaining what we do. You buy a ticket for 10, 20 quid. We have a fixed amount of tickets per watch and we give away a watch every three days. So at the moment I think we've got a Rolex root beer being able to be one. Just buy a ticket by the time it ends and on a fixed time we close it and then however many people have entered, we give it to, we just pick a number via a random number generator and someone wins it. Pretty simple business. Obviously from a commercial perspective we aim to sell more tickets worth than what we've paid for the watch. Otherwise it's pretty crappy business. And on the whole we do, I mean we sell pretty much all of them out, some of them a day or two early. So yeah, we're on our 200 and something watch by now. We're sort of a few years in and it's going from strength to strength and it's great. And we give a percentage of our profits to Roy Castle lung cancer charity as well. So I'm not going to pretend it's a charitable organization. It isn't, it's, it is a business. I have my own bills, I have mortgage, blah, blah, blah. But we do give a chance charity as well. And the second thing that I'm involved in the watch space is it's called the Watch Protect Company. So everyone knows when they buy a Rolex or whatever it is they Often come with protective stickers on from factory that often have like overhanging ugly tabs and red bits on them. All that kind of rubbish. We basically just sell people. It's like PPF for cars, but for watches. So we'll sell people a kit. Some people apply it all over their watch, you know, depending on the model, like bezel, sides of cases, blah, blah. But some people just want it on the clasp because they're at their desk all day and they batter their clasp. So yeah, for Tudors, Rolex, Amiga, ap, Patek and that goes really well, we've got like scratch removal, paste and all sorts of stuff. So anything, any sort of thing that you want to do with your watch are looking after and preserving it. Yeah, and that's going from strength to strength as well. So we do ship internationally on that. So maybe that's a bit more of a plug. But yeah, so it's cool to be able to build brands around my social media. So I'm kind of the in house marketing for these different enterprises and I do that in the automotive space as well. So my business model is I just grow an audience of people that kind of trust what I say. I put my money where my mouth is. I am a collector first and foremost of cars and watches and then I start brands with talented, hard working other people that use kind of my audience as a stepping stone to create a footprint and kind of kickstart the business from there. So that's been working pretty well and I hope to continue to grow these businesses and exit over the next few years and then delete my social media.
- [19:32]
B
Well, I have a question about the watch protection stuff because obviously the stickers have to be so exact to each model. What's your process like to get the measurements or the CAD model for all of these models that you have to get protective gear for.
- [19:49]
A
So we have, we just have to get the watch for a day or two and then there's a, there's a very expensive scanning machine somewhere in the uk. I actually don't, I'm not, I'm not allowed to touch the clever side of it. All I am is just in house, in house gobshite. So I'm not a party to clever side. You name it, there's a business and there's a, there's a clever part of it or an engineering part of it. They say, tom, go in the other room, don't touch anything. So we just, we just scan the watches basically. But we, we can't do it just off pictures or off diagrams or anything like that, we have to physically have the watch. So we have collectors reaching out with these kind of niche vintage models, you know, Patek 2499s, all this kind of stuff. And unless we've got one, or we can borrow one for a good few days and either send it away, which no one's going to do with a watch like that. We do struggle, but we're constantly building our inventory. So every time I buy a watch, I will kind of send it off to the fella, he will scan it and hopefully make. Make designs and we'll get the stickers made up. But yeah, they do have to be exact, because unless they're invisible or as close to invisible as humanly possible, it's just crap. Because no one wants to wear a watch that looks like it's in a bin bag today.
- [20:56]
B
I'm curious to know, I mean, do you ever get burnt out, especially from watches, having businesses in the space? I mean, maybe that's why the independent stuff is so interesting to you now.
- [21:06]
A
Yeah, I've definitely got fatigue with the kind of the usual stuff. And I do find the indies interesting. They're constantly pushing boundaries and, yeah, I'm not sick of watches, so I think I've been lucky in that I've come into it absolutely adoring the subject matter. And I've also spent years in jobs that I've absolutely hated. I've seen what's on the other side of the curtain. I used to clean toilets. I've done all sorts of jobs. I can't say I loved that. The job I hate the most, I guess, was just being at a desk in the city. I went into finance after I went to law school and just having someone looking over my shoulder just annoying me every single week on a Monday morning, what are we doing this week on a Friday afternoon, what have you done this week? All this rubbish. So I haven't got fatigue with watches or the watch world or cars or the car world. Some of it's annoying, particularly cars. Having multiple cars is a complete pain in the backside, especially if you're not actually loaded enough to have someone managing them. But because I've seen on the other side of the curtain, I didn't just go into influencing and having my own businesses and messing around from day one. I am still every day grateful for the fact that I get to just indulge my passions and do actually, on the whole, what I would be wanting to do for free anyway. It's what I would be doing if I had the time and the money to do it. This is what I'd be choosing to do, just to immerse myself in cars and watches. But I am bored. You know, if someone says, oh, I've got a new Rolex, whatever, I don't really care, to be honest, unless it's like an off catalog or something really odd or a vintage oddity, I'm not that bothered anymore. That probably sounds awful, doesn't it?
- [22:48]
B
No. Let's talk cars for a bit, because you just brought home, arguably the grail of all grails for most vintage car lovers, a Ferrari 250 Pininfarina, and you got it from Octane in the UK, but you actually went there to look at another Ferrari before you stumbled on this.
- [23:07]
A
Yeah. So as part of my YouTubing, I do drive lots and lots of cars. It's good fun. And I went down to drive a 360 Challenge Stradale because I've never driven one before. And they're kind of reaching that now, like modern classic, like, kind of might be a very good buy to get in now. I think they've reached that kind of slump in bottom of their value curve and I think they're going to start going up. And I think now we're seeing all the hybrid Ferraris and all the kind of nonsense that Ferrari are doing. I think people are now starting to look back. They're not looking forward and thinking, oh, I've Quite like a V6 with a load of electric bits in it. I think people now look back at it. I thought, I'll go and drive one. And I had a V12 Lusso at the time, GTC4 Lusso, the bread van thing. I thought maybe, maybe I'll get out of this thing and jump into something slightly older. So, anyway, I put in a cheeky offer and the rest is history. I managed to get it financed and, yeah, I'm there, it's at home. But I'm now having to redo my garage because apparently it's too damp in there to store a 50s Ferrari.
- [24:06]
B
That car has oddly lagged behind in value to your benefit. Right. I mean, is that your first vintage car that you've bought?
- [24:13]
A
So I've got a 60s Porsche 912 with nothing like the value. And I also had an 80s Testarossa Mono car, the collectible one, had that for about a year or two. And you know what, it's one of those cars that I think the best Testarossa is someone else's because they look amazing and Actually, if I could have that car again and just without an engine or anything and stick it in my front room, I'd have to extend my front room, but I would, because I think it's art. It's probably the most iconic Ferrari bar, the F40, and they've lagged as well. They're starting to take off over here. But, yeah, I got rid of it because I saw the paint bubbling and stuff and I was like, here we go. I'm not interested. No, no, no, we're not doing. We're not doing a bare metal restoration on a Ferrari. No, thanks. Bye. Bye.
- [24:58]
B
Well, I think what most people would be shocked to hear is that it was actually probably easier to finance the 250 than it would be a modern Ferrari.
- [25:06]
A
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, very strangely, the only other time I think I've had this is with my Carrera gt, the banks, because I finance all my cars, right, I asset back, lend against them, you know, whatever you call over there. The banks obviously have to do a kind of values trajectory. They have to look into what it's going to be worth, ultimately, because they're lending against it and they've valued it, basically. They think it's going to go up, which they never really do. They usually take a fairly salty look at these things and they've said it's basically undervalued. So the finance on it is actually relatively cheap. It was costing me the same monthly payment as the Lusso, the modern GTC4Lusso. It didn't really take really any much cash or much of a change to jump into the two. And the difference in value between the two is huge.
- [25:52]
B
Well, you've got an affinity for Porsche too, as do most, and it's led you to owning the Carrera gt, amongst others. Which one feels more special to own, the 250 or the GT?
- [26:02]
A
Ah, now, it's unfair because I've only driven the GT for. Sorry, the 250. I've only driven that for a minute and a half. I did feel like the coolest person on the planet at the time. I was out of my depth. I had no idea what's going on in there. I think the career GT for me, because I grew up and I saw that thing being launched in Paris around the Arc de Triomphe, it kind of popped out on that sort of rainy evening on those cobbles. I still remember that. And I just think it was a formative, not a formative part of my childhood. I mean, it wasn't that important, but I remember that that was part of my kind of my teenage dreaming years. Was I teenager, I'm aging myself here. I think probably the career gt because that is the genuine realization of a childhood dream. And that was my bucket list. Car. That was the car. Money no object. You know that stupid question that people ask each other. Car geeks ask money no objects. What car would you have? It's that car. So for me, the GT will always be up there and it scares the living Jesus out of me. It's so scary. I mean it's got better with modern tire tech, but it's. I, you know, I don't know what I'm doing behind the wheel. I'm all knees and elbows. So me in that thing. And obviously they're all left hand drive. We're right hand drive cars over here and on the other side of the road it's chaos in there. So GT definitely. But the 250 is a different kind of experience. I think the 250 is a, is a door opener. I don't think there's a person on the planet that would see someone in a 250 and despise them. I think in most sports cars or supercars, I don't particularly in the uk, we're quite negative towards each other. You see someone, a nice car, you hate them. I mean, I don't, but it does go on. I think the 250 is. Everyone can appreciate that. So they're totally different vibe. But Craig definitely is the noise from that thing as well. It sounds like a Formula one smashing into a wall. It's just unbelievable. It's ridiculous.
- [27:54]
B
Something I find interesting is that, you know, you bought this vintage Ferrari which was completely restored to the nines, but you're not into vintage watches. Why is that?
- [28:04]
A
So the vintage car versus vintage watch thing, I liked. I like the idea of having something vintage that is, is now is usable and is like modernly robust almost. And I think in the vintage car sphere you can, you can have something restored and it's not frowned upon. There's no denigration of value. It's fine if you get it restored properly by a proper person and blah blah and document it, all that jazz. But with vintage watches you kind of almost it's a badge of honor having them original and just a little bit screwed up. You know, obviously you've got the unpolished which whenever anyone says it's unpolished, it's usually being polished anyway. Right?
- [28:45]
B
It's usually not.
- [28:46]
A
Yeah, it's usually just nonsense. It's just been Restored really well. I don't know. I'm yet to kind of get into the vintage watch thing. That's not to say I don't have some older pieces in my collection, but it's not where I'm going with my collection at the moment. Certainly the early Rolex sports pieces, they're meant to be kind of robust, daily usable watches. I do feel every time I handle a vintage Daytona or vintage sub, it just feels like a piece of ham. It doesn't feel like something that's like you can just. You can knock around. And the value on some of them now is just so crazy. It's kind of their tool watches, but you can't use them as tool watches anymore. Not that I go diving or anything, but I don't know, it just hasn't tickled my pickle. And that's not to say there's anything wrong with it. I could. I really appreciate, you know, if one of my friends gets a vintage Daytona. Some of. One of my friends got Daytona Big Red. And I love it. I think it's incredibly special. And the sizing on all of these models is amazing. It's much better than the modern sizing, but it's not where I'm. Where my area of interest is. And that might change.
- [29:51]
B
I'm curious to know, because you daily drive a lot of times your Land Rover. What about vintage Land Rovers? Because that's huge in the UK especially, you know, out there in the Cotswolds and more of the country life.
- [30:02]
A
It is, yeah. I'm not sure how many people are actually daily driving like a series like the OG Defender. I don't know how many people are doing that. They are. Look, they are rubbish. They're cool, but they're rubbish. I had a 2016 model TD5, like basically the Ford Puma engine in it, whatever it was called. They are really, really cool, but they're just. They're slow, they drive worse than tractors and they do rust. And now they get stolen like Billyo. Whether or not the whole thing goes or the whole thing goes and you find it stripped out, they do just get robbed left, right and center. So the grief that comes with them. And if you drive them into London now, you have to pay. You guys have just got congestion charged in New York, haven't you?
- [30:48]
B
Yes, they did just try and implement that. We'll see how it goes, you know.
- [30:52]
A
United riots or anything. Because we did. We don't really write over here. We kind of just. We just get screwed over and take it.
- [30:57]
B
It's good fun. I'm sure there's going to be some riots for sure.
- [31:01]
A
We've got Ulez charge anyway. So, anyway, anything with polluting diesel engine, we get charged extra on top as well. So it's nearly like $20 just to drive in, just because it's a diesel. And then there's another almost $20 on top to get into the city in that. So, yeah, they are in the Cotswolds now. They're not. They're not in the cities. But I did have my dalliance. I did actually put money down on a series and I didn't get my deposit back because I bet I bailed out at the last minute because I realized I was an idiot and it was just going to be grief and I had no business driving an old one.
- [31:33]
B
Well, out of all the cars that you have acquired and sent the wire for and gone on that initial drive for, is there one that gave you the most joy?
- [31:45]
A
Yeah, I mean, they're all different levels of enjoyment for different occasions. In terms of a car that I don't envisage ever selling, I mean, I don't ever want to sell my Crow gt, but I might have to. It might get to the price point where I can't ignore the money sat there. But my 997 GT3Rs, I think, is one of my favorite driver's cars. You know, I think that's peak Porsche for me. I think you've got enough of the old visceral and enough of the new bulletproof, enough of the old kind of smaller sizing of cars that you can actually use it on sort of country roads and things. Not too much power. It's manual. It's the last manual GT3s. I think that's kind of peak 911 for me.
- [32:29]
B
What about the Dakar? Because I feel like that's perfect English countryside.
- [32:33]
A
Oh, yeah, that's a great car. And I think it's a truly limited Porsche. They've never done anything like it before. I don't know if they'll ever do it again. I mean, maybe now they've seen it's a cash cow and they will, but there's 19, 50 of them, something like that, I think. And they're back down to list price here and I just think it's a great car, particularly the state of the UK roads. I think it's phenomenal. I'm over my kind of buying everything under the sun and getting into everything phase, but if I was a few years ago, I probably would have one of those because you don't have to baby it at all. You can just leave it out in all elements and ram it through potholes, speed humps, whatever you want.
- [33:10]
B
And it would you just rummage through.
- [33:14]
A
Yeah, it loves it. Absolutely loves it. The things I've seen people doing to those cars online, particularly. I mean mainly the Porsche wash, a press car, to be honest, I think that's had quite a difficult life.
- [33:23]
B
Yeah, it's been through a doozy.
- [33:26]
A
Yeah. I mean, it's not quite whistling diesel level, but people have been giving it a good go. Great car. Great, great car.
- [33:33]
B
I love it. Tom, let's wrap it up with the collector's gene rundown. You can answer these questions based on any of the things that you collect, whether it's watches or cars or real estate, whatever it may be. First question is, what's the one that got away?
- [33:46]
A
The one that got away? I was looking at an F40 way back when. 600 odd grand and I'm an idiot. Didn't make it. Yeah, whatever.
- [33:59]
B
It'll come back.
- [34:00]
A
No, it bloody won't. Not the price we are now. That's long gone.
- [34:06]
B
How about the on deck circle? So what's next for you in collecting? Maybe something you're hunting after or a watch that's caught your eye.
- [34:13]
A
Okay, so car wise, I. I think potentially Jag XJ220.
- [34:18]
B
Beautiful.
- [34:18]
A
I'm having vicious conversations with old Mr. Toledano, Mr. Enthusiast about his. So I think I'm gonna fly to New York and I mean, if he's still insane and let me drive it, I might fly over there, go see him whiz around his x 80 20. So maybe. I think they're very, very undervalued. It's a very rare car. It's not without its downsides, but I think that car is definitely an icon.
- [34:42]
B
Well, he's always selling stuff too, so you can probably convince him he's an animal.
- [34:47]
A
Yeah, I've looked into it, but getting it into the UK and the import taxes and all that boring stuff is just crap. So. Yeah, cheers. Government work.
- [34:56]
B
How about the unobtainable? So this is something that's too expensive in a museum, A private collection, just complete unobtainium.
- [35:04]
A
I love a 300 SL gullwing or an F50, a black F50. I mean, not too much to ask for, surely.
- [35:12]
B
Yeah, no, I mean, just. Just a couple favors. Right.
- [35:15]
A
Reasonable stuff. Yeah, they're kind of out there. Or a Zonda.
- [35:19]
B
Yeah, Zondas are crazy. But I can't I can't imagine that car cruising around the UK There.
- [35:25]
A
People do is. Yeah, you surprise what people just drive around in the crud that we call this country. It's. It's mad. Particularly in London. Nothing surprises me anymore. Nothing.
- [35:36]
B
All right. A question that you're not too keen on, but I'm curious to know which is the page one rewrite. So if money was no object and you could collect anything besides cars and watches, what would it be?
- [35:46]
A
Oh, what have I shown an affinity for? Over the. Over sort of. I mean I did get into trainers. I mean I somewhat. I kind of collect trainers. I think that's probably the most reasonable. I've not been particularly a wine or a whiskey guy. I've dabbled in whiskey probably trainers. And yeah, I do. I do collect some sneakers. Sorry, I should call them sneakers on this podcast.
- [36:14]
B
No, I got a lot of UK listeners.
- [36:17]
A
Yeah, probably sneakers. I probably should have stuck to that because I guess it's a slightly cheaper hobby.
- [36:22]
B
Yeah, yeah, it would have. Would have paid you a little better maybe.
- [36:25]
A
Yeah, definitely.
- [36:27]
B
How about the goat? Who do you look up to in the collecting world or who do you think is a great collector?
- [36:32]
A
I quite like the way that. I mean he's not really known as a watch collector. I just think he's a cool guy and he does cool stuff and the stuff he buys, he. I just think he does it well. That be period correct. FELLA on oh, sure, Brian. Yeah, I think he's just a cool guy. I mean, I don't know whether or not you expect an answer, but I think he's cool.
- [36:52]
B
No, I love it. He's probably a tastemaker for sure.
- [36:56]
A
Yeah, yeah, he is. And I think his coolness has probably gone down a notch now I've said that change what he's doing. He's pretty considered himself to be doing something wrong with the likes of me. Like it. Who else I like. Do you know what I like? Justin Haast in this country. I like the way that he collects. I like his rationale for collecting. I like the way that he buys what he likes and I like the way he knows. Knows why he's buying stuff that not necessarily anyone else would particularly understand until he vocalizes it. I think he's a. He's a tastemaker in his own way for sure.
- [37:31]
B
And on top of that, he's just the best guy.
- [37:33]
A
Yeah, he's a friend. Yeah, he's a good friend of mine. But also I do most people when they buy stuff, I'm like, yeah, whatever, you know, you buy everything. Who cares? But I think when. When he buys something, I do sit up and listen and he's a cool guy. So. Yeah, Justin last. I'll send him an invoice for that plug.
- [37:52]
B
Yeah, me too. The hunt or the ownership? Which one do you enjoy more?
- [37:57]
A
Oh, God, I've got to say the ownership. Because I do hold on to stuff. I don't come out of stuff at all. I know Justin. I think he's more of the hunt, definitely. Now. We just spoke about him. I think he's definitely the hunt for him, but for me, it is the ownership. I like just having not worn a watch for maybe a year, being like, oh, my God, I still have this. And having that kind of honeymoon period all over again, to my financial detriment. I do hoard and I don't sell anything. It's a cold day in hell if I do ever sell anything. So, yeah, it is the ownership experience. And actually I get told off this in my cars as well. Just knowing that I have it. I know this sounds awful, but just knowing that I have it and occasionally kind of maybe looking at the garage or seeing it in the vault, just going to my vault and just sort of playing around with them and then putting them back, not even necessarily wearing them. I do get pleasure out of that. Definitely the ownership, I would say.
- [38:47]
B
And most importantly, do you feel that you were born with the Collector's gene?
- [38:50]
A
Yes, unfortunately.
- [38:53]
B
So I think it's been unfortunate for all of us, but it's something that makes us happy. So, Tom, thank you so much for coming on Collector's Dream Radio today. Can't wait to get together in the UK and let me know when you're in New York. And I'm getting in the back of the XJ with you in you and Phil. We're going for a ride.
- [39:09]
A
Yeah, I'm not sure there's back seats, but we'll wed you in there somehow. Even if you need an ambulance afterwards. Perfect.
- [39:14]
B
I'm a tiny guy. We'll figure it out.
- [39:16]
A
Nice one. Cheers, Cameron. Appreciate it.
- [39:21]
B
All right, that does it for this episode. Thank you all for listening to Collector's Dream Radio.