We’re gettin’ Belayed!

Summary

Podcast Summary: Conan O’Brien Needs a Friend – “We’re gettin’ Belayed!”

Release Date: April 17, 2025

Guests:

• Phil – Founder of High 5 Adventure Learning Center
• Sona Movsesian – Conan’s sidekick
• Matt Gourley – Co-host and comedian
• Adam Sachs – Executive Producer

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1. Introduction to Phil and His Background

The episode kicks off with Conan welcoming Phil to the show. Phil introduces himself as originally hailing from Ipswich, England, but currently residing in Vermont. He shares his journey from intending to become a teacher to founding the High 5 Adventure Learning Center in Vermont.

Notable Quote:

• [02:02] Phil: "I live in Vermont... I'm originally from a town called Ipswich in England on the East Coast."
• [11:01] Phil: "I came over to the States to do a summer camp program. It's a rite of passage for a European to enter America and work a summer camp program."

2. Adventure Learning and Team Building

Phil elaborates on his organization, which utilizes adventure-based activities for team and leadership development across a diverse range of participants, from fifth graders to professional athletes like the Boston Bruins.

Notable Quote:

• [04:01] Phil: "I use adventure-based activities for team and leadership development from fifth-grade kids all the way up to the Boston Bruins. So, a spectrum."

3. The Mechanics and Safety of Ropes Courses

Conan dives into the specifics of the ropes courses, questioning the safety measures in place when participants, including children, are elevated 40 to 50 feet in the air. Phil reassures him by explaining the belaying process and the safety protocols that prevent accidents.

Notable Quote:

• [05:21] Phil: "You start to get calls from parents immediately after this is over. No, they're on a rope. We belay them."

4. Humor and Team Dysfunction

The conversation takes a humorous turn as Conan and his team engage in playful banter about their own dynamics, suggesting that their slight dysfunction may be the secret to the podcast's popularity.

Notable Quote:

• [08:02] Conan: "Is it possible that it's our dysfunction that makes this podcast popular?... Yes, that might be the glue here."
• [09:52] Phil: "So everywhere around you is destroyed, but this group stays intact. Wow, beautiful."

5. Team-Building Exercise: Exploring Emotions

Phil introduces a team-building exercise involving a number grid where participants select numbers that correspond to emotions. Each member shares experiences where they felt two emotions simultaneously, fostering deeper understanding and connection within the group.

Notable Quotes:

• [24:25] Phil: "Pick two numbers that's a level of risk because you don't know what's behind them. But there are emotions and feelings words under these numbers."
• [25:08] Phil: "17 is angry... All of you have experienced feeling both angry and embarrassed alongside your chums today."

6. Personal Anecdotes and Banter

The episode features personal stories and jokes, including Conan recounting his experience at a summer camp in New Hampshire where his British counselor met an unexpected fate, and humorous exchanges about their professional and personal lives.

Notable Quotes:

• [11:53] Conan: "We killed him and we ate him. It was delicious."
• [23:00] Conan: "All this shame is molding me into an amazing comedian."

7. Reflecting on Risk and Team Dynamics

Phil discusses the importance of risk management in his programs, emphasizing that adventure encompasses various forms of risk—physical, emotional, and social. He highlights the significance of rescue training and maintaining a calm, supportive environment for participants.

Notable Quote:

• [23:23] Phil: "I am in safe hands because not only can we deal with the mental side of how to help people, but we can also deal with the physical component of getting someone down if necessary."

8. Conclusion and Future Prospects

As the episode wraps up, Conan expresses genuine admiration for Phil’s work and hints at a potential future visit to Vermont. The team shares final jokes and well-wishes, solidifying the camaraderie built throughout the conversation.

Notable Quotes:

• [33:43] Conan: "Phil, thank you so much. Lovely to talk to you. Continued success and I hope we cross paths in the future."
• [31:35] Conan: "Sona, I want to belay."

---

Key Takeaways:

• Phil’s Expertise: Phil provides insightful perspectives on team building and leadership through adventure-based activities, demonstrating the universal applicability of these principles.
• Safety First: The detailed discussion on safety measures in adventure learning highlights the meticulous planning and training involved to ensure participant well-being.
• Humorous Dynamics: The episode balances serious discussions with lighthearted humor, reflecting the authentic and engaging rapport among the hosts and guests.
• Emotional Connection: The team-building exercise underscores the importance of understanding and managing emotions within a team, fostering stronger bonds and effective collaboration.

Overall, “We’re gettin’ Belayed!” offers listeners a blend of informative dialogue on adventure learning and team dynamics, interspersed with Conan’s signature humor and camaraderie with his team. This episode not only entertains but also provides valuable insights into the art of building effective and resilient teams.

Transcript

[Conan O'Brien]

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[Sona Movsesian]

Conan O'Brien needs a fan. Want to talk to Conan? Visit teamcoco.com call Conan. Okay, let's get started.

[Matt Gourley]

Hey, Phil. Welcome to Conan O'Brien needs a fan.

[Conan O'Brien]

Phil, how are you?

[Phil]

Hey, Conan. Sona. Matt.

[Conan O'Brien]

How's it going?

[Phil]

There's no particular order to the way I said your name in terms of priority.

[Conan O'Brien]

It's fine, it's fine. And it's nice to talk to you, Phil. Tell us a little bit about yourselves. I like to, you know, get the parameters of a man before we continue speaking. What? Where are you right now?

[Phil]

So I live in Vermont. And.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah, you've got that Vermont accent.

[Phil]

I was almost gonna say it and you said it for me. I know this traditional Vermont accent.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah. Where are you from originally?

[Phil]

I'm originally from a town called Ipswich in England on the East Coast.

[Conan O'Brien]

Okay, very nice.

[Phil]

I felt I should experience New Eng. And so that's where I live now.

[Conan O'Brien]

It's so funny. I grew up in New England and really believed when I was a boy that England had stolen the names of our towns. I really believe that.

[Matt Gourley]

Is that what they tell you?

[Conan O'Brien]

No, I just was. I found out that you know. Cause I grew up in Boston and there's Cambridge and just on and on and on and I just thought, you know, Sturbridge. And then I started to hear about these places in England and thought, well, why can't they get their own names?

[Phil]

So I remember I went to Ipswich, Mass. So you may be familiar, but they have an Ipswich, Mass. Brewery. And I went in and I said, I'm from Ipswich. And they said, well, no shit, we're in Ipswich. And I said, no, no, the original. And I expected to be carried on shoulders. But that did not happen.

[Conan O'Brien]

No, there's not a lot of. Ever since we got rid of your king, we don't go carrying people around on our shoulders. It's. But well, I'm. So you live in Vermont. How did you choose Vermont? What made you say, okay, you have the entire United States to play with. What made you choose Vermont?

[Phil]

I would say the beauty if you've been gorgeous. A beautiful state. And it also happens to be Howells, the location at which I work. So it was through work that I ended up in Vermont. It wasn't necessarily a choice, but I am very glad for the choice. Very good.

[Conan O'Brien]

To raise a kid. Very good. I. I like New Hampshire, I like Vermont. I've spent a lot of time in. And I'm curious what you do. You mentioned a job. What is your job?

[Phil]

Yeah, so I work for an organization called High 5 Adventure Learning Center. And I use adventure based activities for team and leadership development from fifth grade kids all the way up to the Boston Bruins. So a spectrum.

[Conan O'Brien]

It's very interesting to me that it's the same principles if you're talking to someone in the fifth grade or if you're talking to a professional athlete. It's the same principles, I guess, leadership, how to work together, how to have fun.

[Phil]

And I'm a. Yeah. And I would say I'm unique in that I get to take people on a ropes course in Vermont. So, you know, we bring participants up to 40, 50ft in the air and kind of have stretch moments for them. So really have kind of really extreme experiences. Really that allows them to kind of develop more as a team. And it doesn't matter if you're a fifth grader or you're a professional athlete. The heights is the great normalizer or the great equalizer.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah. Now, okay, let's get into the safety of it. Because you send a fifth grader up a pole, how many feet in the air?

[Phil]

Let's say 40, 40, 50.

[Conan O'Brien]

Anywhere within that range is the child tethered or is there a good chance the child could fall to his or her doom?

[Phil]

I would assume that if we did it untethered, we wouldn't be allowed. So. No.

[Conan O'Brien]

It is a weird way to go. Yeah. I would assume that were one to have an untethered child, that if found out, one would be discovered and one could be in trouble. I think you have untethered children, and I think kids are falling like apples, apples in October. I think they're tumbling and you're just catching them.

[Phil]

You start to get calls from parents immediately after this is over. No, they're on a rope. We belay them. And I would say the. I've seen you climb. I believe there was a Conan Moscow episode where you climbed. Your incredible physique mastered the climb.

[Conan O'Brien]

Hey, I like you, by the way. You're fantastic. And clearly you don't have a very good. You don't have a very good television screen. But, but I. Yes, I did climb. I did a rock. A rock wall.

[Sona Movsesian]

Yeah.

[Conan O'Brien]

In Thailand, I believe.

[Sona Movsesian]

Yeah.

[Phil]

The, the differing factor, I would say for our programs is we actually teach our participants to do the belaying. So that is that demonstration of team and leadership development is actually giving them a skill and allowing them to be responsible for their team members. And so that is something that I really. I think the three of you bring Eduardo, bring Blay, but teach Sona how to belay and then have Sona in charge of Conan.

[Conan O'Brien]

No, no. Guess what, Guess what, Phil. I've experienced Sona in charge of Conan. I think I did about 10 years of Sona in charge of Conan and I was killed multiple times. Shit. Went half assed all over the. So you're saying that I would be hanging 50ft in the air and the only thing between me and death would be a rope and Sona's holding onto it.

[Sona Movsesian]

Yes, yes.

[Conan O'Brien]

And then Sona sees a glass of white wine in the corner. Let's go of the rope wine. And I go. And you go, slurp, slurp, slurp, slurp, slurp, slurp, slurp, slurp, slurp, slurp.

[Sona Movsesian]

Yeah, I like that idea. I think we should do this team building thing. I think that would really bring us closer together.

[Conan O'Brien]

So is it all climbing for all teams? Is it all climbing? What other things would we do?

[Phil]

No. So I would say we range it from ground initiatives. They may be problem solving activities on the ground. There is connection activities to get you more connected as a team. And then we focus on the development of your trust and your responsibility and your decision making. And then you bring you to that point of belaying each Other. Really? That's that ultimate point. We'll get you there. Right.

[Conan O'Brien]

But Phil, have a question?

[Phil]

Phil? Faith in my abilities, Phil.

[Conan O'Brien]

I have a lot of faith in you, Phil. Is it possible that it's our dysfunction that makes this podcast popular? That it's our inability to get along, our childishness, our peevishness, our just overall, I don't know, just refusal to act like good people? Yes, that might be the glue here.

[Matt Gourley]

That's right. It's that we don't have a balance. We have a like equal amount of repulsion for each other that we're pulling on each other with equal amounts so we stay tethered.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yes, yes. Is that possible?

[Phil]

It's highly possible. And actually I, you know, I've listened to all of the episodes and from my professional lens, I would say you're a really high functioning team, despite the repulsion. I think that repulsion could be there and your team could still be successful. I like the head nod, Cynthia.

[Conan O'Brien]

No, no, I am, I am agreeing with you that there is some. In architecture, sometimes an arch works because various forces are acting upon each other in an aggressive way. But that's what holds it all together. I've often heard. Often I've heard aviation experts describe a helicopter as a machine that wants to pull itself apart, but it's engineered in such a way that it doesn't. And that's actually what gives it analogy. I think we're a helicopter that desperately wants to fly apart. Rotors zipping in every direction. Adam Sachs walking into the room, his head being lopped off. Carnage, massacre, flames. But something keeps it all together. And because of that we're able to fly around through the air and give the local traffic report. Yeah.

[Phil]

So everywhere around you is destroyed, but this group stays intact. Wow, beautiful.

[Conan O'Brien]

Where did you first become interested in all of this, Phil? You're a young boy. You're living in Eastern young boy. Well, I'm saying he's a young boy. He's in Eastern coast. I'm imagining of England, the salty air. Sausage for breakfast, please. You know, also some beans, the ever present beans. And some tea with milk. Milk? Yeah.

[Matt Gourley]

Syrup?

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah, and then something.

[Phil]

Vermont, please. You're getting me very heightened.

[Conan O'Brien]

Right. I thought we were talking about Vermont and then suddenly you get into team building. Was there another plan along the way or was this always the plan, do you think?

[Phil]

So I was. My education is in teaching and so I was going to become a teacher and I came over to the States to do a summer camp program. It's a rite of passage, it seems like for a European to enter America and work a summer camp program.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yes.

[Phil]

I felt like I had to do it. And at the camp they had a ropes course, they had team development and they did year round programming and I kind of just fell in. They said, you've got a teaching degree, we'd love for you to stick around. And they sponsored my visa and.

[Conan O'Brien]

Very cool.

[Phil]

18 years later, I'm still here. So I've yet to find my way home.

[Conan O'Brien]

Well, I think you're thriving. It's reminding me. I went to summer camp in Freedom, New Hampshire and there was a camp there called Cragged Mountain Farm. And I had, one of my counselors was from Britain and I remembered climbing the presidential mountain range and there was this gentleman with a British accent who would tell us to move our asses, get up that hill. And we killed him and we ate him. It was delicious.

[Phil]

Appropriate.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah. We were running low on food. We only had six more weeks of food left for a two day hike. So it was necessary that he die and be eaten. Phil, I really respect people that teach for a living and it's absolutely wonderful. And do you find ever that a kid or even an adult gets up to the top of the pole and they just won't budge and they just won't move. And you, you're coaxing them and coaxing them, but they don't move. What do you do at that point? Push them. BB gun.

[Phil]

So I think it really. Push them.

[Conan O'Brien]

Push them in. BB gun. This is what I'm working with. Are you up there with them or is someone up there with them?

[Phil]

So, but, but I would, but I would say the, the question to push them does come up often and it's the number one thing we say not to do. So sorry. So.

[Conan O'Brien]

Can I congestion electrify the pole? They, they suddenly, they suddenly spread out like a flattened squirrel and they fall through space. I love it. An electrified pole. That's the answer. You don't have a big. No, it's not my concern. What I'm saying is that a BB gun, you have to hit them 50ft.

[Matt Gourley]

That's a whole nother activity for some other children, for some team building, you know. So you're kind of combining another group.

[Phil]

Yeah. Off to the side. Yeah. So to answer the question, there's two parts to it. I like that you laughed at that. There's two parts to it.

[Conan O'Brien]

What? We're clearly not trying to learn any question. Well, I will, I will answer your question and give you the knowledge you need to the three idiots to BB gun pushing and electrifying the pole.

[Matt Gourley]

I'm wondering if I'll find myself in a situation where I have to push a kid down a pole. I don't know, but I'm eager to hear how to do it.

[Phil]

This is the next career path for you, Matt.

[Conan O'Brien]

We drink so much water every day and it's just water. And I'm like hello boring. There's gotta be a way to make water more exciting. Well guess what? Someone cracked it. With authentic flavors and lively carbonation. Waterloo sparkling waters bring full flavor artistry. Blay, you're drinking one right now.

[Matt Gourley]

Drinking one right now.

[Conan O'Brien]

I got the raspberry nectarine and it is tasty. It's very good. Very tasty. Everyone here in the office has been enjoying them. They're excellent. They are delic delicious. And you know you say what's flavor artistry? Some people think. Are you just talking a lot of high class nonsense, Conan? No, it's about custom crafting multi sensorial flavor experiences of aroma, taste and mouthfeel that make you say wow wow to that sentence. Waterloo waters are crafted, not formulated or off the shelf. Just purified sparkling water and non GMO project verified natural flavors which I insist on.

[Sona Movsesian]

Me too.

[Conan O'Brien]

With zero calories, sugars or sweeteners. I drink water constantly. I just had a couple of glasses of water and it was just regular water upstairs and I regret that time. It was boring. You'll never get that back. I'll never get that time back. Three full glasses of water. I wish it was Waterloo and I could have had. What did you have? Raspberry. You know what, what's that one cracking open a peach right now. Okay, well you could have offered that to me. You just ate a second when I haven't had one. Oh, sorry. Nice. Thanks a lot.

[Phil]

I'm so thirsty.

[Conan O'Brien]

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[Sona Movsesian]

Yeah, your voice changes when you do a car.

[Conan O'Brien]

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[Sona Movsesian]

That's crazy.

[Conan O'Brien]

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[Sona Movsesian]

Yeah.

[Conan O'Brien]

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[Sona Movsesian]

What?

[Conan O'Brien]

I call it Miller Time. Oh, I came up with that. It's the 50th anniversary of Miller Lite. Can you believe it?

[Sona Movsesian]

I can't.

[Conan O'Brien]

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[Sona Movsesian]

Yeah, it's crisp.

[Conan O'Brien]

It's crisp. Mm.

[Matt Gourley]

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[Conan O'Brien]

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[Phil]

So either we have adequately prepared the students so that we're not having people up who shouldn't be up there. We don't force them up.

[Conan O'Brien]

Oh, so there's a long amount of training before they go up the pole.

[Phil]

Yeah, I would say there's loads of sequencing, planning as part of the risk management thing. And then. But the other component is that I teach, as well as teaching the team building stuff, I also teach rescue training for those kind of scenarios. So we can have participants go up to height, or staff members. Sorry, go up to height and then help pick a participant off the course. So there are, there's like a spectrum or a range of rescue scenarios that we can do, and I, I teach those too.

[Conan O'Brien]

Wow.

[Phil]

So from a, like a risk management lens, I would say you're in safe hands because not only can we deal with the, with the mental side of how to help people, but we can also deal with the physical component of getting someone down if necessary. We wouldn't want to push someone, though.

[Conan O'Brien]

Unfortunately, that would be terrible. I think electrifying. Much better. Sona brings up a good. Sona brings up a good point. Are you. It could be valuable to shame. Shame someone who doesn't.

[Phil]

Yeah, yeah.

[Conan O'Brien]

And you know I know your first reaction as an educator is that, oh, you can't shame a fifth grader. But I was shamed many times as a fifth grader, and I think it molded me into the person I am today.

[Matt Gourley]

Case in point.

[Conan O'Brien]

Hold it. Excuse me. Okay. I'm driving home in three Maseratis, all tied together. Not easy to do. But what I'm saying, Phil, is that if a child fails and has to be brought down, is there any ceremony where the child is maybe drummed out, little epaulettes are torn from his shoulders, pelted, you know, or in some way made to suffer for his cowardice?

[Phil]

I would say that regardless of anything I do to try to reduce that from happening, that will probably happen in some way.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah. Kids will be kids.

[Phil]

I would say. I would say the worst people that would. If there's a school group, sometimes the worst people are the teachers. And if it's a family group, the worst people are the parents. They're the ones who are screaming the obscenity. Sometimes. But. But for the most part, I think that we are very calm and relaxed about the way that we talk with our students. And we attempt not to shame people if they were to come down. I know. I'm sorry, you're a teacher.

[Matt Gourley]

Because I understand you have a little game for us to play.

[Conan O'Brien]

Work with us. Okay. We've just shown up in Ipswich, Vermont. Our car broke down. It overheated. It was a 1977 Hyundai, which didn't even exist.

[Sona Movsesian]

We weren't even planning on going.

[Conan O'Brien]

No and no. We were driving through. We're on our way to a yard sale. Because they have a ton of those in New Hampshire and Vermont. You've probably noticed that on the weekends, everyone just puts, literally, toilet seats on their yard and says it's a yard sale. I beg to differ. Vermont. But anyway. And please, no angry letters. I won't read them. So we come wandering in and we need your team building. What would you have us do?

[Phil]

So first, I would say you're in the wrong place. Cause there's no Ipswich, Vermont, so. But after. You.

[Conan O'Brien]

Son of a bitch.

[Matt Gourley]

He just shaved you.

[Conan O'Brien]

He just sh. You just shamed me. I'm feeling. And all the other kids are laughing.

[Matt Gourley]

It does come from the teacher.

[Conan O'Brien]

Lizard.

[Phil]

Sorry.

[Sona Movsesian]

You little pussy.

[Matt Gourley]

Oh, no. You're a geography imbecile.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah. I'm gonna shove you off from New England. Thank you. Wait a minute. All this shame. Stop firing bbs at me. All this shame is molding me into an amazing comedian. Thank you, Phil.

[Phil]

Task done. Task done, you arrive and then I say get back into your car, please. We don't. My services are no longer needed.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yes, very good.

[Phil]

No, but if you make it to the right location. And I think the first thing we would start with is because adventure, I think, sometimes gets misinterpreted as the climbing parts. But adventure is any form of risk. And it could be physical, it could be emotional, it could be social risk. The first thing you're going to start with is actually talking about our emotions, which can be a risk for some people I know. And I can see the excitement in your faces and the pointing of other people. So what we're going to do is I am going to share with you on the screen a number grid. So you've got one through 57. So what I'm going to ask. I'll ask one of you at time. We can start with Conan. I'm going to ask you to pick two numbers that's a level of risk because you don't know what's behind them. But there are emotions and feelings words under these numbers.

[Conan O'Brien]

Okay.

[Phil]

What I would like you to do once you see the words is describe an experience or name an experience that you have had where you have experienced both of those feelings at the same time. Because we as humans are not only experiencing one thing at a time when it comes to emotions.

[Conan O'Brien]

Okay.

[Phil]

And so, but the, the situation I wanted to be that you've experienced as a trio. So an experience you've had that you've experienced these two months.

[Conan O'Brien]

Oh, three of us have had. Okay. And wow, this is. I gotta thread a lot of needles here. It's gotta be, it's gonna be two emotions I've felt at the same time with these two.

[Phil]

Okay, so I'm gonna go chew chums.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah, I'm gonna go with 17. And I'm gonna go with 44.

[Phil]

Okay, so 17 is angry.

[Sona Movsesian]

Oh, my God.

[Matt Gourley]

No problem.

[Phil]

All right, hang on. No scenarios yet. And you've also experienced embarrassment. All of you both angry and embarrassed alongside your chill chums today.

[Conan O'Brien]

Oh, well, I mean, yeah, excluding just now and the interview we did before this. Listen, I talked to some, you know, I worked hard to become, you know, a fairly well known celebrity, and then these two are coasting on my coattails. I'm often sitting here with some of the biggest names in the business or if you're a bumblebee, the buzzness and out of control. He's out of control.

[Sona Movsesian]

I'm angry about that.

[Conan O'Brien]

I'm embarrassed. I'm here with these Two. I mean, you were my assistant, and somehow you were elevated to the top of the showbiz pile. Yeah. Matt Gorley is in a zither band. He plays some of the coolest, you know, spots in Pasadena, and he haunts the Rose bowl swap meet. And I've put both of them in rooms with Harrison Ford. You know, some of the biggest stars in the world, all of the Kardashians have been here at the same time. And, you know, do I sometimes get angry about that and feel embarrassed that they lack the skills that I've spent years in the minds of comedy working? Yes, I do. I feel both of those things. But I'm gonna specifically name a time. I think it was one of our. Just pick one. But I think I was angry and embarrassed when you guys, both of you, became intoxicated in one of our chil chums shows.

[Sona Movsesian]

One of.

[Conan O'Brien]

Well, it's happened several times. Every time. And I, you know, I pride myself on being a professional. And of course, I imbibed little, but was still in plenty of. I know my levels, my tolerance very well. And so I still was in control. And I was ashamed. I'm gonna add ashamed to embarrassed and angry. I was angry, embarrassed, ashamed. And I felt superior to both of you. I'm adding that one, too. I'm also adding. Yeah, okay, so I just. I guess I won that contest.

[Phil]

Yeah.

[Conan O'Brien]

Okay.

[Phil]

I appreciate that. When it feels like I've really set.

[Conan O'Brien]

Wasn't that the idea to win? Didn't I win.

[Matt Gourley]

The same team?

[Sona Movsesian]

You are really. You're tearing our team even further apart.

[Conan O'Brien]

But, Phil, wouldn't you say what. Whatever they say, it's not going to be as good as that. So don't I win and I'm the winner? Do I get. Is there a prize?

[Phil]

I think your experience. Are you questioning children?

[Conan O'Brien]

Are you questioning your whole professional.

[Matt Gourley]

You just made that man say poof.

[Conan O'Brien]

Is going to get out of the team building business.

[Phil]

I have trained, I have worked with professional hockey athletes who have told me to F off.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Phil]

And I Even in this. That made me. Oof. But I would say I really set you up there with those. Almost those two words.

[Sona Movsesian]

Yeah.

[Phil]

I'm gonna. I'm gonna pass it over, if I may.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yes.

[Phil]

To Sona.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Phil]

So to pick two words. Let's see if we can think of a situation you've maybe had and let you. Oh, two. Two numbers.

[Sona Movsesian]

10 and 40.

[Phil]

Okay. These are. I can tell they're good. It's serene. Oh, my goodness.

[Conan O'Brien]

Well, I know when she's Serene. Yeah. Matches your dummy.

[Phil]

And then. And then number 40 is frustrated.

[Conan O'Brien]

That's an interesting combo. Serene and frustrating.

[Sona Movsesian]

I know. That is kind of.

[Phil]

You felt both, you know, chilchumps.

[Sona Movsesian]

When I was drunk, I was happy. I was drunk, and I was also frustrated. I wasn't also a little high.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Sona Movsesian]

Yeah.

[Conan O'Brien]

That's a really good answer.

[Sona Movsesian]

Yeah.

[Phil]

Yeah, that is.

[Conan O'Brien]

It speaks a lot to the team. I picture Sona being serene and frustrated when she's got a bag and it's got four gummies in it and she's had three. And so she's serene, but she can't get it that fourth one because it's jammed down into the bottom of the bag.

[Sona Movsesian]

I'm like Winnie the Pooh with the honeypoon.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah. And your hands aren't working that well. So you're both serene and frustrated. Cause that last gummy evades your grip.

[Sona Movsesian]

Yeah. Okay. All right. I like this game.

[Phil]

W. I know. I like what you're doing. And I'm also sensing that they're both tied to the Chill Chums experience beautifully. So. Yeah. Alcohol involved in both. I will highlight that. Also, lastly, I'll come to you, Matt, for the last one.

[Matt Gourley]

Okay. I'll do numbers four, and how about 57?

[Conan O'Brien]

See how we all do experience?

[Phil]

Four is surprised. Ah, okay. 57 is chill.

[Conan O'Brien]

What an end. Oh, surprised and chill.

[Matt Gourley]

Okay. Well, I feel like I've gotta carry on with this tradition with Chill the Chill Chums. I felt very chill because we were having alcohol and a lot of it, so it kind of mellows you out.

[Sona Movsesian]

Yeah.

[Conan O'Brien]

And you make an amazing drink. I want to compliment this gentleman. One of the best mixologists. I'm not even kidding. Your drinks are superb.

[Matt Gourley]

That's nice. Thank you. Still, I gotta say, I was surprised when you said that you weren't drunk on the Chill Chumps thing, because I remember you slurring some words and at one point talking to us, but looking inside the drink while you're talking to us like it was a microphone.

[Conan O'Brien]

I had suffered a terrible cerebral event unrelated to alcohol that night. And for you to mock me for was a total coincidence that I had. Yeah. Eruption of blood into the brain. Well, it looks like we're just a bunch of terrible drinkers.

[Matt Gourley]

Wait, do you do anything with that?

[Phil]

Oh, absolutely. And I think what's nice is that what we've able to do in this, in the small moment is reflect on stuff that's happened in the past, talk about it as a group, share some of these experiences together that have tied Us together. And that allows us to progress into doing stuff that's a little bit more risky as a group. So all of those things are really positive.

[Conan O'Brien]

You're saying we should drink more out to Vermont?

[Phil]

Yes, sure. Or come to Vermont and I'll get you. Belaying each other. There you go. That's that next level.

[Conan O'Brien]

That's nice. I want to belay. I believe it.

[Sona Movsesian]

So I want to belay you guys.

[Phil]

Yeah.

[Conan O'Brien]

What?

[Sona Movsesian]

Yeah, I want to belay. I want to be in charge of your life.

[Conan O'Brien]

Okay.

[Matt Gourley]

Let's get belayed.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah. Yeah. Spring break, we're getting belayed. Yeah. Cut to me hanging on a rope. Hey, tonight I'm getting belayed. Me hanging on a rope. You firing away with your 22. Well, I think we learned.

[Phil]

I can already tell. I can already tell the name of this episode, so that's great. That would do me one.

[Conan O'Brien]

We're getting belayed.

[Matt Gourley]

Yeah, we're getting belayed.

[Conan O'Brien]

Okay. Thanks, Phil. You're doing all the work for us. Well, Phil, lovely. Absolutely lovely talking to you. You are. Again, I say this without irony or just no joke, when people teach for a living, I think that's a beautiful thing. And you seem like you'd be great at. You've already demonstrated that you're affable and you're funny and you're smart. And so thank you so much for the work that you do. And I bet you are helping a lot of people of all ages. And you never know, I might make my way up to Blank Vermont very soon. Ipswich? What's that?

[Sona Movsesian]

Is it Ipswich?

[Conan O'Brien]

It's not Ipswich. Sorry for being so fascinated by your British roots, but maybe we will. Maybe we will make it up there someday. And I'd like to shake your hand. You're a fine fellow and you look a little bit like. You look a little bit like a younger Billy Bragg. Just gonna say that. I put that out there. He's great. Yeah.

[Phil]

Wow. So. So the difference is, a fifth grader once said to me, hey, Phil, do you know who you look like? And it doesn't often go well. And I was a little concerned and I said, no, who do I look like? Sona and Matt might get the reference, but I. They told me I looked like Llama. Llama. Red pajama.

[Matt Gourley]

Oh, yeah.

[Sona Movsesian]

I was gonna say Gronk.

[Matt Gourley]

I was thinking Gronk.

[Sona Movsesian]

Oh, no, I was singing Josh Homey from Queens of Estonia.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah, Queens of Estonia.

[Adam Sachs]

Yeah.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Matt Gourley]

But you know what? You sound like Clive Owen.

[Phil]

These are so much nicer, don't you think?

[Matt Gourley]

He sounds like Clive Owen.

[Conan O'Brien]

He does sound like Clive Owen. Yeah.

[Matt Gourley]

Yeah.

[Phil]

This is so much better. You are better than fifth graders.

[Sona Movsesian]

Yeah.

[Conan O'Brien]

Is that a compliment? That's the nicest thing anyone said to me in a while. Phil, thank you so much. Lovely to talk to you. Continued success and I hope we cross paths in the future.

[Phil]

Thank you so much, friends.

[Conan O'Brien]

Take care. Bye bye.

[Matt Gourley]

Conan O'Brien needs a fan with Conan O'Brien Sonam of Session and Matt Gourley produced by me, Matt Gourley executive produced by Adam Sachs, Jeff Ross and Nick Leow Incidental music by Jimmy Vivino Take.

[Conan O'Brien]

It away, Jimmy.

[Matt Gourley]

Supervising Producer Aaron Blair Associate Talent Producer Jennifer Samples Associate producers Sean Doherty and Lisa Berm Engineering by eduardo Perez get three free months of SiriusXM when you sign [e-mail] Conan Please rate, review and subscribe to Conan O'Brien needs a fan wherever fine podcasts are downloaded.

[Adam Sachs]

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[Phil]

If you've been having your McDonald's sausage.

[Conan O'Brien]

McMuffin with an iced coffee from somewhere.

[Phil]

Else, now is a great time to reconsider.

[Eduardo Perez]

In the Pacific Northwest, it's never too cold for an iced coffee in the morning. Grab yourself a medium caramel, French vanilla or classic iced coffee for just $2.29. Warning beverage may cause craving for McMuffin or hash browns. Prices and participation may vary. Cannot be combined with any other offer or combo meal.