Podcast Summary: Afghan CIA Fighters Face Stark Reality in the U.S.

Podcast: Consider This from NPR
Date: December 12, 2025
Host: Mary Louise Kelly
Reporter: Brian Mann
Guests: Daoud (former Afghan fighter), Geeta Bakshi (former CIA agent), Thomas Kaza (U.S. Green Beret veteran)

Overview

This episode delves into the journey of Afghan fighters who served in elite CIA-backed “Zero Units” during the U.S. war in Afghanistan. Focusing on the struggles faced by these fighters after their evacuation to the United States, the story is anchored by recent news: Rahmanullah Lakhinwal, a former Zero Unit member accused of shooting two U.S. National Guard soldiers. The episode explores how trauma, bureaucratic delays, and feelings of betrayal and abandonment have deeply impacted these veterans’ resettlement and mental health.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

U.S. Involvement in Afghanistan and the Zero Units

• Background: Begins with the 2001 U.S. invasion of Afghanistan and the ensuing 20-year conflict, involving both Republican and Democratic administrations.
  • President Bush’s speech (00:13, 00:38) frames America’s purpose in the region—fighting “the patient accumulation of successes.”
• Zero Units: Elite CIA-led Afghan commando groups took major roles in battling the Taliban, often absorbing the greatest risks.
  • Major Kevin McCormick (U.S. Army, 2016): “These skills are perishable, so they require... continuous training, continuous mastery...” (01:22-01:29)

The Fall of Afghanistan and U.S. Evacuation

• Collapse: The Taliban retake Afghanistan in August 2021, prompting a rushed and deadly evacuation of U.S. forces and Afghans who worked with them.
  • Geeta Bakshi (NPR, 01:45): “Hundreds, maybe even thousands of Afghans are trying to get out from there.”
  • President Biden pledges to support “SIV eligible Afghans and their families” (02:37).

Life in the U.S. for Zero Unit Fighters

• Trauma and Neglect: Many Zero Unit veterans report feelings of abandonment, struggling with bureaucracy, finding employment, and mental health challenges.
  • Reporter Brian Mann: “Some have struggled with mental health since coming to the U.S. At least four have died by suicide.” (04:39)
• Daoud’s Experience:
  • On rigorous vetting to join the CIA units:

    “You needed somebody to recommend you in the unit and after two, three months, you know, background check and vetting process, you would get a call.” (05:27)

  • On misconceptions about Zero Units:

    “People think we were a death squad... No, we were out there, going out there because we needed to bring these folks alive. If you bring a target alive, you get more information from him.” (05:59)

  • On the bond with U.S. forces:

    “He [the CIA agent] said, grenade. And he grabbed me from my... body armor, pulled me back. Bullet went through my body armor, but, you know, was fine.” (06:22)

Barriers to Asylum and Integration

• Immigration Struggles: Despite extensive vetting, many Afghan fighters struggle for years to obtain green cards or asylum due to classified records and bureaucratic hurdles.
  • Daoud:

    “We asked the agency, could you please share our information... They said, oh, no, we can't share this. It's classified. And I was like, then how would they know, like, who we are?” (07:34)

  • Lackinwal’s experience paralleled these struggles—he received asylum nearly four years after his arrival.

Mental Health Crisis

• Widespread Distress: High rates of trauma and suicide among Zero Unit veterans are reported.
  • Daoud:

    “We had worse cases than Lackinwal.” (08:32) “He was like, ‘I'm going to go kill myself.’ That's how bad it was.” (08:46)

• Advocacy:
  • Geeta Bakshi (Famil USA): “Individuals from the Zero Units unfortunately suffer death by self harm. We raised this issue to the Biden administration…” (09:06)

Changing U.S. Political Climate

• Security Fears and Policy Shifts:

  • Former President Trump, now in office, freezes Afghan asylum claims and vows to reevaluate refugee status.

    “This heinous atrocity reminds us that we have no greater national security priority than ensuring that we have full control over the people that enter and remain in our country. For the most part, we don't want them.” (10:38)

  • CIA Director John Ratcliffe questions the wisdom of welcoming Zero Unit allies:

    “This individual and so many others should have never been allowed to come here…” (10:53)

• Impact on Afghan Community:

  • Daoud:

    “I was very shocked with the head of the CIA's comment. I felt so betrayed.” (11:12) “We are part of this nation at this time. You don't want to send these folks back to Afghanistan. You're sentencing them to death.” (11:25)

• Veterans Rally for Allies: U.S. veterans who fought with Afghan partners push to protect resettled Zero Unit fighters, but political rhetoric remains fierce.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Service and Abandonment:

  • Geeta Bakshi:

    “They were the tip of the spear... facing the maximum danger on the battlefield and taking the maximum risk due to their affiliation with U.S. intelligence.” (06:50)

  • Thomas Kaza (Green Beret):

    “In the span that Americans would do one deployment, these guys are doing three, four, five… [no one's] really thinking them for the service. And with that service also goes... the side effects... all the PTSD, and that... has never been... provided for the Afghan population.” (09:48, 10:09)

• On the Mental Health Toll:

  • Daoud:

    “We had worse cases than Lackinwal... I'm going to go kill myself. That's how bad it was.” (08:32, 08:46)

• On Policy and Betrayal:

  • Daoud:

    “I was very shocked with the head of the CIA's comment. I felt so betrayed.” (11:12) “You don't want to send these folks back to Afghanistan. You're sentencing them to death.” (11:25)

Important Segment Timestamps

• 00:00–03:43: Historical context, fall of Afghanistan, intro to Lakhinwal case
• 04:39–06:50: Introduction to Zero Units, Daoud’s experience, U.S.-Afghan bond
• 07:07–09:06: Resettlement barriers, trauma, and lack of U.S. support for Afghan veterans
• 10:09–11:25: Shifting U.S. political climate, security rhetoric, community betrayal
• 11:33–11:59: Veterans advocate for Afghan allies

Tone and Language

The episode strikes a sober, empathetic tone, blending personal testimony, policy critique, and reports of bureaucratic indifference with urgency and compassion. Afghan interviewees speak with understated conviction and sorrow, while American veterans and advocates stress the moral responsibility owed to their partners.

This episode is a concise, moving exploration of the cost of conflict—especially for those who once fought alongside U.S. troops—and the complicated, often harrowing, reality of building a new life when politics and bureaucracy fail to honor old alliances.