Podcast Summary: Consider This – "Is There a Trump Doctrine for Foreign Policy?"

Episode Details:

• Title: Is There a Trump Doctrine for Foreign Policy?
• Host: Scott Detrow, NPR's Consider This
• Release Date: February 7, 2025

Introduction

In this episode of NPR's Consider This, host Scott Detrow delves into the complexities of former President Donald Trump's foreign policy. Titled "Is There a Trump Doctrine for Foreign Policy?", the episode explores whether Trump's approach marks a significant departure from previous administrations or simply rebrands longstanding strategies under the banner of "America First."

Defining Trump's Foreign Policy: Restraint vs. Expansion

The episode opens with Scott Detrow posing a fundamental question: "What is President Trump's foreign policy?" He juxtaposes Trump's inaugural address, which emphasizes restraint, against his more aggressive posturing, such as threats to annex territories like Greenland and Canada.

Key Quotes:

• Caroline Levitt (White House Press Secretary) at [00:11]:
  “We will measure our success not only by the battles we win, but also by the wars that we end, and perhaps most importantly, the wars we never get into.”

• Scott Detrow at [00:22]:
  “Or maybe it will be defined by expansion. He has threatened to take over Greenland, make Canada the 51st state. He has plans for Panama, too.”

• Caroline Levitt at [00:37]:
  “Panama Canal, and we didn't give it to China, we gave it to Panama, and we're taking it back.”

These statements illustrate the apparent contradictions within Trump's foreign policy rhetoric—promoting both withdrawal from prolonged conflicts and aggressive territorial ambitions.

The Anti-Interventionist Stance

Detrow and Levitt further explore Trump's critique of past military interventions, particularly in Iraq and Afghanistan, which played a significant role in his 2016 Republican nomination.

Key Quote:

• Caroline Levitt at [00:53]:
  “This destructive cycle of intervention and chaos must finally, folks, come to an end. We've spent, at last count, $6 trillion in the Middle East... We gotta start spending on ourselves.”

This emphasis on ending "nation-building" efforts aligns with Trump's broader narrative of reducing America's military footprint abroad to focus inward on domestic issues.

Contradictions in Policy Implementation

However, Trump's actions sometimes contradict his stated intentions of avoiding entanglements. A notable example is his announcement to "take over the Gaza Strip after relocating the Palestinians who live there" during a press conference on [01:30], which suggests a potential expansionist move contrary to his anti-interventionist rhetoric.

Key Exchanges:

• Caroline Levitt at [01:45]:
  “I do see a long term ownership position and I see it bringing great stability to that part of the Middle East and maybe the entire Middle East.”

• Scott Detrow at [01:55]:
  “White House Press Secretary Caroline Levitt said the plan would not involve U.S. taxpayer dollars... But when pressed, he did not rule out American troops in Gaza last night. Are you doing that now?”

• Emma Ashford (Senior Fellow, Stimson Center) at [02:09]:
  “I am saying that the president has not committed to that just yet.”

This segment highlights the evolving and sometimes contradictory nature of Trump's foreign policy statements and the administration's attempts to manage public perception.

Breaking with the Status Quo

Detrow underscores that Trump's approach represents a significant break from traditional U.S. foreign policy. Levitt emphasizes Trump's role as "an outside of the box thinker and a visionary leader."

Key Quote:

• Emma Ashford at [02:20]:
  “Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. President Trump is an outside of the box thinker and a visionary leader who solves problems that many others, especially in this city, claim are unsolvable.”
  (Timestamp: [02:20])

Labels and Definitions: Nationalist vs. Globalist

Detrow mentions the various labels assigned to Trump's foreign policy—ranging from "America First" to "imperialist." To clarify, he introduces Emma Ashford from the Stimson Center to provide expert analysis.

Key Discussion Points:

• Transactional Deal-Making:
  Ashford explains that Trump's policy is heavily based on transactional approaches, focusing on immediate American interests rather than long-term ideological goals. This contrasts sharply with Biden's foreign policy, which emphasizes democracy versus autocracy.

• "America First" Doctrine:
  Ashford summarizes Trump's policy as "America First," noting that while it aims to prioritize U.S. interests, it often does so through narrow interpretations. For instance, Trump's demands from Canada and Greenland reflect this transactional nature.

Key Quotes:

• Emma Ashford at [05:56]:
  “Trump himself gave us the best description of his policy years ago, and it was America first. Now, I'm not always sure that he ends up getting the best deal he can because he construes US Interests very narrowly.”
  (Timestamp: [05:56])

Shifting Global Dynamics

The episode contrasts Trump's approach with Marco Rubio's recent statements about operating in a multipolar world, acknowledging that the unipolar dominance of the U.S. is no longer feasible.

Key Quote:

• Emma Ashford at [07:23]:
  “It's not normal for the world to simply have a unipolar power... Foreign policy should always be about furthering the national interest of the United States and doing so to the extent possible, avoiding war and armed conflict.”
  (Timestamp: [07:23])

Potential for a More Restrained Foreign Policy

Ashford expresses cautious optimism that the current administration may pursue a more restrained foreign policy compared to Trump's first term. She credits new advisors, such as J.D. Vance, with wariness towards unnecessary military engagements.

Key Discussion Points:

• Reduction of Military Escalations:
  The new administration appears less inclined to escalate tensions with Iran or involve U.S. troops unnecessarily, focusing instead on deal-making and strategic pressure.

• Desire for Systemic Change:
  Ashford suggests that Trump's willingness to break from the status quo, even without a clear replacement plan, could lead to necessary overhauls in U.S. foreign policy, such as reducing reliance on European security defense frameworks.

Key Quotes:

• Emma Ashford at [08:34]:
  “The different personnel this time are going to play a role, if only because they are more willing... to let Trump express his own opinions.”
  (Timestamp: [08:34])

• Emma Ashford at [10:26]:
  “Trump seems to be someone who is willing to just break with the status quo, even if he doesn't necessarily have a good idea of what is going to replace it.”
  (Timestamp: [10:26])

Conclusion: A New Chapter in U.S. Foreign Policy?

The episode concludes with Ashford acknowledging that while Trump's policies may have both positive and negative aspects, his administration presents a unique opportunity for substantial change in U.S. foreign policy. This includes potential advancements in Middle Eastern diplomacy and a recalibration of European defense partnerships.

Final Thoughts:

• Emma Ashford believes that the Trump administration offers a better chance for "wholesale change" in foreign policy, moving away from the inefficacies observed in the past 15 years under different administrations.

• Scott Detrow wraps up by highlighting the significance of understanding whether Trump's foreign policy constitutes a distinct doctrine or merely a rebranding of existing strategies.

Notable Quotes Summary:

• Caroline Levitt [00:11]:
  “We will measure our success not only by the battles we win, but also by the wars that we end, and perhaps most importantly, the wars we never get into.”

• Emma Ashford [02:20]:
  “Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. President Trump is an outside of the box thinker and a visionary leader who solves problems that many others, especially in this city, claim are unsolvable.”

• Emma Ashford [05:56]:
  “Trump himself gave us the best description of his policy years ago, and it was America first...”

• Emma Ashford [07:23]:
  “It's not normal for the world to simply have a unipolar power... Foreign policy should always be about furthering the national interest of the United States and doing so to the extent possible, avoiding war and armed conflict.”

• Emma Ashford [08:34]:
  “The different personnel this time are going to play a role...”

• Emma Ashford [10:26]:
  “Trump seems to be someone who is willing to just break with the status quo, even if he doesn't necessarily have a good idea of what is going to replace it.”

Final Notes

This episode of Consider This offers a nuanced exploration of Donald Trump's foreign policy, presenting it as a blend of isolationist rhetoric and transactional pragmatism. Through expert analysis and direct quotes, listeners gain insight into whether Trump's approach signifies a new doctrine or is merely a shift in emphasis within the broader framework of U.S. foreign policy.