Marco Rubio pivots to America First diplomacy

Summary

Consider This from NPR: Marco Rubio Pivots to America First Diplomacy

In the March 7, 2025 episode of NPR's Consider This, host Scott Detrow delves into the significant shift in foreign policy approach by Secretary of State Marco Rubio. The episode, titled "Marco Rubio pivots to America First diplomacy," provides an in-depth analysis of Rubio’s transition from a staunch global leader to an advocate of the Trump administration's America First policies, exploring the ramifications of this pivot on international relations, particularly concerning Ukraine.

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From Senator to Secretary of State

Marco Rubio's Earlier Stance on Global Leadership

Marco Rubio, a Republican senator from Florida, has long been recognized for his commitment to promoting democracy and maintaining the United States' role as a key global leader. His advocacy was particularly evident in his vocal support for Ukraine amidst Russian aggression. On March 7, 2025, during his tenure as Secretary of State in the second Trump administration, Rubio's policies exhibited a stark departure from his previous positions.

Supporting America First

As Senator, Rubio was a vocal supporter of U.S. involvement overseas. For instance, during a Senate floor speech in 2014, he emphasized the importance of strong support for Ukraine in the face of Russian aggression:

Marco Rubio (02:07): "I think this will be used as evidence to our allies and other countries around the world why America is no longer reliable, either economically or militarily. And the consequences of that could extend far beyond Europe into other regions of the world like Asia. This is not a game."

Rubio's commitment to supporting Ukraine was unwavering, advocating for extensive aid and a strong military presence to counteract Russian influence.

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Shift to America First Diplomacy

Changing Course Under the Trump Administration

Fast forward to March 2025, Rubio, now Secretary of State, has adopted a markedly different approach aligned with President Donald Trump's America First agenda. This pivot has raised questions about the consistency and future direction of U.S. foreign policy.

Criticism and Challenges

Professor Daniel Dresner of Tufts University's Fletcher School provides critical insights into Rubio's transformation:

Daniel Dresner (05:42): "The Rubio that's shown up is the one that will defer to Trump's America first image... He has demonstrated tremendous ideological flexibility."

Rubio’s alignment with Trump’s policies has led to significant policy shifts, particularly concerning Ukraine. Instead of the proactive support he once championed, Rubio now endorses a more restrained approach, echoing Trump's sentiments on resolving the conflict swiftly.

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Impact on Ukraine and Global Order

U.S. Policy Repercussions

Rubio's America First stance has tangible consequences for Ukraine and the broader international community. The episode highlights a pivotal moment: a meeting in the Oval Office where Rubio remained mostly silent as Trump and Vice President J.D. Vance confronted Ukrainian President Vladimir Zelensky.

Notable Insights and Reactions

The body language and Rubio's subdued demeanor during the meeting were telling. Professor Dresner notes:

Daniel Dresner (07:17): "He has the world's worst poker face. It was obvious that this was not something he wanted to see happen."

Rubio’s reluctance to openly support Ukraine contrasts sharply with his previous advocacy, signaling a potential retreat from U.S. commitments abroad.

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Analysis of Rubio's Political Adaptation

Survival and Ideological Flexibility

Daniel Dresner provides a comprehensive analysis of Rubio's political maneuvers:

Daniel Dresner (06:03): "Rubio did articulate a more democracy, promoting human rights, promoting foreign policy vision when he ran for president in 2016, and he lost... he has managed to get into the good graces of Trump over the last 10 years."

Rubio's shift is viewed as a strategic adaptation to maintain political relevance and align with the prevailing Republican leadership under Trump. This ideological flexibility has positioned him favorably within the administration but at the cost of his earlier foreign policy principles.

Limited Influence as Secretary of State

The episode underscores the challenges Rubio faces in exerting influence within the Trump administration's foreign policy framework:

Daniel Dresner (08:47): "Secretaries of state... is in part a function of the relationship and trust they have with the president."

Rubio’s inability to significantly shape foreign policy beyond endorsing Trump’s directives limits his impact, reinforcing the perception that foreign policy decisions are predominantly driven by the White House.

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Conclusion: Implications for U.S. Foreign Policy

Marco Rubio’s pivot to America First diplomacy marks a significant departure from his earlier stance on global leadership. This transformation reflects broader shifts within the Republican Party and the Trump administration's influence over U.S. foreign policy. As Secretary of State, Rubio's alignment with Trump’s policies has led to decreased support for international allies like Ukraine, raising concerns about the future reliability of the United States on the global stage.

Professor Daniel Dresner's analysis highlights the precarious position Rubio holds—balancing his political survival with diminishing authority to effect change in foreign policy. The episode concludes with a nuanced perspective on the potential long-term effects of this pivot, emphasizing the turbulence it introduces into international relations and the established global order.

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Notable Quotes:

• Marco Rubio (02:07): "This is not a game."
• Daniel Dresner (05:42): "He has demonstrated tremendous ideological flexibility."
• Daniel Dresner (07:17): "He has the world's worst poker face."

This episode of Consider This offers a compelling examination of the evolving dynamics within the U.S. political landscape and their implications for international diplomacy. For listeners seeking to understand the intricacies of Marco Rubio’s policy shift and its broader impact, this discussion provides valuable insights and expert analysis.

Transcript

[Scott Detrow]

It's no secret that much, if not most, of the Republican Party is in lockstep with President Trump.

[Daniel Dresner]

The golden age of America has only just begun. It will be like nothing that has ever been seen before. Thank you, God bless you and God bless America.

[Scott Detrow]

We have seen members of the President's party fall in line over and over on a wide range of issues since Trump returned to office some six weeks ago. Sometimes that has meant compromising on issues and beliefs that had defined them for years. Hi, Mr. Cassidy.

[Marco Rubio]

Mr. Cassidy. Aye.

[Scott Detrow]

Mr. Lankford. That was Louisiana Senator Bill Cassidy, a doctor who had expressed concerns about vaccine resistance, voting for Trump's pick to head the Department of Health and Human Services. Robert F. Kennedy Jr. Kennedy has a long history of opposition to vaccines and chaired an anti vaccine nonprofit called Children's Health Defense. Here's Iowa Senator and military veteran Joni Ernst, who has spent years advocating for women in the military and trying to raise awareness about sexual assault in the military. I think for a number of our.

[Daniel Dresner]

Senators, they want to make sure that any allegations have been cleared, and that's why we have to have a very thorough vetting process.

[Scott Detrow]

Ernst was talking about Trump's pick for Defense Secretary, Pete Hegseth. Hegseth has been accused of sexual assault. His lawyer has called the claims false, and police never filed charges. And before he was nominated, Hegseth had argued against women in combat. He talked about it in a podcast hosted by Sean Ryan in November.

[Daniel Dresner]

Because I'm straight up just saying we should not have women in combat roles. It hasn't made us more effective, hasn't made us more lethal, has made fighting more complicated.

[Scott Detrow]

Hecseth softened his stance a bit during his confirmation hearing, and Ernst ultimately voted to confirm Hegseth. Then there's Marco Rubio and Ukraine.

[Marco Rubio]

I fear that if we do not send a strong and decisive message that I think this will be spun against us.

[Scott Detrow]

That's Senator Marco Rubio in 2014, speaking on the Senate floor shortly after Russia invaded and annexed Ukraine's Crimean Peninsula.

[Marco Rubio]

I think this will be used as evidence to our allies and other countries around the world why America is no longer reliable, either economically or militarily. And the consequences of that could extend far beyond Europe into other regions of the world like Asia. This is not a game.

[Scott Detrow]

In February 2022, Russia launched a full scale invasion of Ukraine. Days after the Russian tanks rolled across Ukraine's border. Senator Rubio defended the country on msnbc.

[Marco Rubio]

Look, Putin can't win. There always has to be a real, legitimate Ukrainian state that we have a relationship with, and I don't know why we can't begin to openly say we will support them as long as they are willing to fight, even if it's an insurgency.

[Scott Detrow]

Fast forward three years. Rubio is now secretary of state in the second Trump administration. And that steadfast support that Rubio had as a senator has taken a backseat to the administration's hardline approach to Ukraine.

[Marco Rubio]

It's been very clear from the beginning that President Trump views this as a protracted stalemated conflict and it needs to come to an end. And no one has any idea or any plan to bring it to an end. The plan of the Ukrainians up to now and their allies, Capitol Hill and the people you talk to in other countries is let's just keep giving them as much as they need for as long as it takes. That's not a strategy.

[Scott Detrow]

Consider this. As Senator Marco Rubio supported America's role as a global leader. Now as secretary of state, he has embraced Donald Trump's America first policies, policies that are having dire consequences for Ukraine and creating turbulence in the rest of the world. From npr, Scott I'm Scott Detrow. This message comes from NPR sponsor SADVA founder and CEO Ron Rudson shares the story of how he got started Creating.

[Daniel Dresner]

Saatva in 2007, 2008 I went out and I bought the most popular luxury mattresses. I tore them apart and I realized based on the raw materials, cost and the analysis that I had done, that I was able to sell that level mattress, but with a very affordable price.

[Scott Detrow]

To learn more, go to saatva.com NPR this message comes from Carvana. Sell your car the convenient way, enter your license plate or vin, answer a few questions and get a real offer in seconds. Go to Carvana.com today it's Consider this from NPR. It has been a little more than a week since Ukrainian President Vladimir Volodymyr Zelensky met with President Donald Trump in the Oval office. Vice President J.D. vance was in the meeting, too, and so was Secretary of State Marco Rubio. The nation's top diplomat was sitting on an Oval Office couch, mostly silent, as Trump and Vance berated the Ukrainian leader and in the process made it clear just how much of the established global order they are ready to upend, an order that for most of his career, Rubio has defended and worked to help hold up. So what changed and what do those changes mean? To answer these questions, we're going to talk to professor of international politics at Tuff University's Fletcher School, Daniel Dresner welcome to the show.

[Daniel Dresner]

Thank you.

[Scott Detrow]

Let's start by rewinding just a little bit. You wrote an opinion piece in the New York Times about Rubio's political evolution back in December before he took office. And you asked which Marco Rubio is going to show up for the job? The democracy promoting optimistic or a more inward looking anti global pessimist? A month in, do you feel like you have a verdict?

[Daniel Dresner]

Oh, yeah. It seems pretty obvious. The Rubio that's shown up is the one that will defer to Trump's America first image, the one that will close embassies and consulates, the one that, according to widespread reports, has yet to really push back on any of Trump's foreign policy instincts.

[Scott Detrow]

Does that surprise you?

[Daniel Dresner]

Not really. You know, Marco Rubio did articulate a more democracy, promoting human rights, promoting foreign policy vision when he ran for president in 2016, and he lost. And he not only lost, but Donald Trump humiliated him in a lot of ways on the campaign stage. Rubio is a lot of things, but one thing is a political survivor. And he survived Trump's first term and has managed to get into the good graces of Trump over the last 10 years. And the way he survived is by altering his worldview. He has demonstrated tremendous ideological flexibility, and by doing so, was, you know, considered for vice president and eventually was given the Secretary of State position. And I'm sure Rubio thought of this as potentially a stepping stone to run for president again, or certainly, you know, an action that would give him the prestige of traditional Secretaries of state.

[Scott Detrow]

You know, Marco Rubio is not the only Republican by far, to change big positions and align them with what President Trump is promoting. But I think this particular issue of Ukraine, and you have that visual that rocketed around the Internet of Rubio kind of slumped into the couch, almost high, like absorbing into the couch, like the Homer Simpson meme, you know?

[Daniel Dresner]

Yes, yes.

[Scott Detrow]

Like this particular issue of Ukraine. Rubio and so many other Republicans were so out there in terms of defending this country, standing up for this country, making sure the United States was continuing, continuing to fund this country. Then you see how he tweets about what happened in the Oval Office afterwards, saying President Trump was standing up for the United States. That particular issue, I feel like, is a hard one to square. How do you feel about it?

[Daniel Dresner]

I think there are two things about Rubio that make it particularly noticeable for him. The first is that as that Oval Office meeting demonstrated, he has the world's worst poker face. It was obvious that this was not something he wanted to see happen. Anyone looking at the body language could tell why that is. And because Rubio smiled smart enough to know what the implications were of Trump berating Zelenskyy in the Oval Office. To be fair, Rubio did vote against Ukraine aid back in 2024 because of claims that you wanted to prioritize focus on the southern border.

[Scott Detrow]

There's this long line of various high profile Cabinet secretaries who more traditional Republicans hope can be a moderating influence. I think the first secretary of state under Trump, Rex Tillerson, is a good example of that. And he ended up being humiliated when he was fired and then mocked by President Trump and others in the administration. How much influence can you have over foreign policy when you're a secretary of state who is not seemingly one of the key decision makers in the presidency?

[Daniel Dresner]

Not much. It doesn't end well. Secretaries of state, in some ways, whether they are considered influential or not, is in part a function of the relationship and trust they have with the president. This is how James Baker was considered an outstanding secretary of state under George H.W. bush, for example, or George Shultz to some extent under Ronald Reagan. On the other hand, secretaries of state who have been considered on the outside looking in, like let's say, Colin Powell during George W. Bush's first term, generally are not given high marks by historians. And so the problem that Rubio has is not just that he has little influence, it's that if he tried to exercise any influence, Trump would probably tweet just a long list of scorn headed towards Rubio or fire him.

[Scott Detrow]

So what does that mean for policy?

[Daniel Dresner]

What it means for policy is that don't look to Marco Rubio as an indicator for what foreign policy is going to look like. Marco Rubio will be the endorser. He will try to perhaps offer a patina of rationality for why Trump is doing what he's doing. But the truth is, is that in this administration, foreign policy is being run from the White House and in particular the Oval Office.

[Scott Detrow]

That's Daniel Dresner, professor of International Politics at Tufts University. Thank you so much.

[Daniel Dresner]

Thank you.

[Scott Detrow]

This episode was produced by Erica Ryan and Briana Scott with audio engineering by Ted Mebane. It was edited by Courtney Dorning. Our executive producer is Sammy Yenig. It's Consider this from npr. I'm Scott Detrow. Want to hear this podcast without sponsor breaks? Amazon prime members can listen to Consider this sponsor free through Amazon Music. Or you can also support NPR's vital journalism and get consider this [e-mail] that's plus.NPR.org.