President Trump, entertainer-in-chief

Summary

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Consider This from NPR

Episode: President Trump, entertainer-in-chief
Date: August 29, 2025
Host: Ailsa Chang
Guests: Domenico Montanaro (Senior Political Correspondent), Eric Deggans (Cultural Critic and Media Analyst)

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Episode Overview

This episode explores President Donald Trump’s unprecedented intervention in American cultural institutions during his second term. Using the Kennedy Center Honors as a focal point, NPR unpacks the consequences of Trump's expanded executive power, his impact on the arts and media, and the broader ramifications for American culture. Featuring insights from NPR’s Domenico Montanaro and Eric Deggans, the episode examines how Trump’s personal desires for recognition and loyalty are reshaping traditionally nonpartisan cultural spaces.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

The Kennedy Center's Legacy and Its Politicization

• Beginnings: The episode opens with the historical vision of the Kennedy Center—a bipartisan initiative for a national cultural hub, initially supported by President Eisenhower and carried forward by the Kennedys ([00:15]–[01:06]).
• Tradition vs. Politics: Traditionally, the Kennedy Center Honors remained a rare, apolitical celebration of the arts, attended by presidents but insulated from partisan conflict ([01:50]).
• Trump’s Takeover: Under Trump’s second term, the Kennedy Center and other institutions face politicization, with Trump leveraging executive power to reshape American cultural narratives ([01:54]–[02:45]).

Trump’s Direct Influence on Cultural Institutions

• Pre-Politics Persona: Trump’s background as an entertainer established a “brand” now affecting public institutions ([04:02]).
• Executive Overreach: Trump exerts White House scrutiny over Smithsonian exhibits, wins lawsuits against major broadcasters, and targets media funding in an effort to exert broader cultural influence ([04:29]).

Eric Deggans ([05:02]):
"The expertise of people who've run these institutions is being subverted and overturned and replaced by fealty to Trump and his ideological agenda."

• Desire for Recognition: Despite railing against the elite, Trump actively seeks validation by established institutions, as evidenced by his campaign to control the Kennedy Center Honors ([05:02]–[06:02]).
  • Trump himself, in a revealing moment:

  Donald Trump ([06:02]):
  "Since 1978, the Kennedy Center Honors have been among the most prestigious awards in the performing Arts. I wanted one. I was never able to get one this year. It's true, actually. I would have taken it if they would have called me. I waited and waited and waited, and I said, the hell with it, I'll become chairman."

Erosion of Artistic Criteria and Rise of Loyalty Tests

• Changing the Rules: Arts institutions are now rewarding loyalty over artistry—prompting fear and uncertainty in creative communities.
• Concerns in the Arts:

  Eric Deggans ([06:20]):
  "What really concerns people in the arts world is that all of a sudden the rubric isn't whether you're a great artist... It's, you know, how much have you paid fealty to Trump and how much do you align with his ideology?"

Historical Context and Presidential Precedent

• Unprecedented Overreach:

  • While previous presidents tried to shape cultural narratives, none have operationalized such direct control.

  Domenico Montanaro ([06:46]):
  "What Trump is doing here goes way beyond any traditional working of the refs ... He's trying to use the leverage of his office to operationalize control over the message."

  • Tactics include lawsuits against media giants and threats to public media funding ([06:46]–[07:21]).

• Raw Power Play:

  • Trump's actions target industries traditionally skeptical of authority, as a means of demonstrating power ([07:21]).
  • Example: CBS settled for millions over a routine journalistic edit—a clear example of strong-arm tactics ([07:31]).

Creative Pushback and Satire

• Comedy as Counterculture:

  • Despite executive pressure, creative resistance emerges.
  • South Park and other satirical programs have ramped up criticism, lampooning Trump's demand for flattery by visiting leaders and officials.

    John Legend as “World Leader” on South Park ([08:28]):
    "Mr. President, you have so many great ideas. Your leadership is truly beyond anything we have ever had in this country."

  • The segment highlights how satire persists even amidst pressure ([08:28]–[08:56]).

• Cabinet Meetings as Performances:

  • Real-life Trump cabinet meetings mimic the satirical portrayals, with officials heaping praise upon the president.

    Donald Trump ([09:03]):
    "...it's an honor to do this under your leadership, have innovative jobs and get them back to work. So thank you for your leadership, Mr. President."

    Ailsa Chang ([09:13]):
    "Mr. President, I invite you to see your big, beautiful face on a banner in front of the Department of Labor."

• Life Imitates Art:

  • The lines between parody and reality blur as cultural and political spheres increasingly mirror each other ([09:19]–[09:28]).

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Memorable Quotes

• Eric Deggans ([05:02]):
  "The expertise of people who've run these institutions is being subverted and overturned and replaced by fealty to Trump and his ideological agenda."

• Donald Trump ([06:02]):
  "I was never able to get one ... I waited and waited and waited, and I said, the hell with it, I'll become chairman."

• Domenico Montanaro ([06:46]):
  "What Trump is doing here goes way beyond any traditional working of the refs ... He's trying to use the leverage of his office to operationalize control over the message."

• Eric Deggans ([06:20]):
  "All of a sudden the rubric isn't whether you're a great artist or whether you've achieved something. It's ... how much have you paid fealty to Trump and how much do you align with his ideology?"

• John Legend / South Park ([08:28]):
  "Mr. President, you have so many great ideas. Your leadership is truly beyond anything we have ever had in this country."

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Key Segment Timestamps

• [00:15–01:50]: History and ideals behind the Kennedy Center
• [01:54–02:45]: Overview of Trump’s takeover of cultural institutions
• [04:02–04:29]: Trump’s entertainment background and influence
• [05:02–06:02]: Discussion with Eric Deggans on impacts to the arts
• [06:02–06:20]: Trump’s public comments on the Kennedy Center Honors
• [06:46–07:51]: Domenico Montanaro on the escalation of presidential authority
• [07:51–08:28]: Creative satire and pushback via South Park
• [09:03–09:19]: Cabinet meetings as loyalty performances
• [09:28–09:34]: Closing thoughts and thanks

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Tone and Language

The conversation maintains NPR’s analytic, measured, and slightly wry tone, balancing serious political analysis with cultural insight and examples from popular media. The speakers use direct language, often referencing Trump’s own words to illustrate how spectacle and loyalty interplay at the heart of his cultural interventions.

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Recommended For

Anyone interested in how politics and culture intersect under powerful leadership, the future of American arts and media, and the societal role of satire and creative resistance.

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Transcript

[John F. Kennedy]

And I am certain that after the dust of centuries has passed over our cities, we too will be remembered not for victories or defeats in battle or in politics, but for our contribution to the human spirit.

[Ailsa Chang]

In 1962, President John F. Kennedy spoke at a fundraiser for the National Cultural Center. He spoke of art as a universal language and envisioned a national hub for art and artistic exchange in the United States.

[John F. Kennedy]

Moreover, as a great democratic society, we have a special responsibility to the arts, for art is the great Democrat calling forth creative genius from every sector of society.

[Ailsa Chang]

The center was created by a bipartisan bill signed by President Dwight D. Eisenhower in 1958, who hoped it would become a, quote, artistic mecca. It was then the Kennedy administration, with the strong influence of First Lady Jacqueline Kennedy, that made strides towards its construction. The night seems to be at long.

[Mariel Segarra]

Last, the beginning of what for so.

[Ailsa Chang]

Long has really been just a hope or a dream. The night featured a lineup of some of the most iconic artists of the era, including comedian Danny Kaye, dancer Maria tallchief, and a 7 year old yo yo mom. After JFK was assassinated the following year, the center of the was renamed the John F. Kennedy center for the Performing Arts. And for decades, the Kennedy Center Honors have highlighted performing artists for their contributions to American culture. Recipients have included Ella Fitzgerald, Dream A Little Dream of Me, Tom Hanks.

[Domenico Montanaro]

Hello, my name's Forrest. Forrest Gumption.

[Ailsa Chang]

And the Grateful Dead. The Kennedy Center Honors, even though they're attended by the president and politicians, have always been a night away from politics and partisan division. But since President Trump took office a second time, he has thrust the Kennedy center and several other American cultural institutions into the midst of the country's political divide. And he has initiated a takeover of the Kennedy Center. Consider this. Throughout Trump's second term, he has dramatically expanded the authority of the executive branch. Now he is using his power to reshape American culture. From npr, I'm Ailsa Chang.

[Mariel Segarra]

If you're a robot, this might not be the show for you. But if you're a human with hopes, dreams and bills to pay, the Life Kit Podcast might be just what you need. Three times a week, Life Kit brings you a fresh set of solutions to help you tackle topics big and small, from how to save money on groceries to how to bring the house down at karaoke. You know, human stuff. Listen to the Life Kit Podcast from npr. Presentado por Mariel Segarra.

[Scott Carter]

Life is a mystery. For those of faith or no faith. Ye Gods with Scott Carter is the podcast that makes sense of how we make sense of life. Each week we talk to celebrities, scholars and mere mortals to unearth what on earth we believe and what we don't. Listen to. Ye Gods. With Scott Carter, part of the NPR Network. Wherever you get your podcasts here at.

[Mariel Segarra]

Life Kit, we encourage you throughout life's big moments. But what about support for those smaller problems? Sometimes you just need a tiny pep talk, like for when your clothes don't.

[Eric Deggans]

Fit or for when you want to order delivery but should cook.

[Mariel Segarra]

That's this week from NPR's Life Kit. Listen in the NPR app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Ailsa Chang]

It'S consider this from npr before he entered politics, most Americans knew Donald Trump as an entertainer. As the host of the hit show the Apprentice, he was catapulted to a new level of fame.

[Donald Trump]

I've mastered the art of the deal and have turned the name Trump into.

[Eric Deggans]

The highest quality brand.

[Donald Trump]

And as the master, I want to pass along my knowledge to somebody else.

[Eric Deggans]

I'm looking for the Apprentice in this term.

[Ailsa Chang]

Unlike his first president, Trump has taken aim at cultural institutions. He has declared that Smithsonian exhibits must submit to White House scrutiny. He has successfully sued and won settlements from multiple broadcasting giants. And so to understand how Trump is influencing culture in the U.S. we spoke with NPR senior political correspondent Domenico Montanaro and NPR cultural critic and media analyst Eric Dagins. I wanted to start our conversation by asking Eric how Trump's direct interjection into culture has impacted the arts.

[Eric Deggans]

So I think what we've seen happen here is a lot of chaos, and we've also seen a lot of uncertainty and a lot of fear. People are not sure what's expected of them, but what seems to be happening is that the expertise of people who've run these institutions is being subverted and overturned and replaced by fealty to Trump and his ideological agenda. On top of that, what's really interesting is that even though Trump has in many ways been somebody who's overturned institutions, he's also somebody who wants to be recognized by them. You know, he's somebody who has called the press fake news, but he also seems to want to be featured in, you know, the New York Times or featured favorably in cnn. He's someone who has criticized the Kennedy Center Honors, but he's also someone who seems to want to receive one. And in fact, we saw that when he was talking about the Kennedy Cent Honors and picking who would get them as he began to assert more control over the organization. And we have a clip.

[Donald Trump]

Since 1978, the Kennedy Center Honors have been among the most prestigious awards in the performing Arts. I wanted one. I was never able to get one this year. It's true, actually. I would have taken it if they would have called me. I waited and waited and waited, and I said, the hell with it, I'll become chairman.

[Eric Deggans]

And so I think what really concerns people in the arts world is that all of a sudden the rubric isn't whether you're a great artist or whether you've achieved something. It's, you know, how much have you paid fealty to Trump and how much do you, do you align with his ideology?

[Ailsa Chang]

Well, Domenico, this assertion of authority we're seeing from President Trump this term, it's more than we saw in the first term. Right. Like, how unusual is this level of involvement in the cultural space for a president?

[Domenico Montanaro]

Well, we've always had presidents try to look to shape the narrative, you know, all the way back to Nixon. His vice president, Spiro Agnew, spoke out against the advent of television news, for example, which he as shallow and focused on the wrong things. But what Trump is doing here goes way beyond any traditional working of the refs. You know, he's, he's trying to use the leverage of his office to operationalize control over the message. He's trying, for example, to force media outlets, hands and more specifically their corporate owners, often with lawsuits or in the case of public media, cutting funding. You know, Trump doesn't want criticism. He wants fealty. And he's willing to use whatever he can to get it.

[Ailsa Chang]

Fealty. Okay, so if this is all about loyalty, something that we know he values, why take on an industry that often challenges authority just to show he can do it?

[Domenico Montanaro]

That's exactly why, you know, to try and break it, to get that control over them. And, you know, to do this in some ways with outlets settling for millions of dollars for things that are routine journalistic practice, as CBS did as a result of 60 minutes editing of an interview with Kamala Harris during the 2024 campaign. It was a real strong arm tactic.

[Eric Deggans]

And it's been interesting to see how the pushback has come within the same company that owns CBS. In 60 minutes, Paramount, South park seems to be the animated show seems to be where there's a lot of criticism of the president, even as there was a deal to a deal between south park and Paramount and a deal between Paramount and Skydance to merge. They have stepped forward, they've had new episodes that have criticized the president. And we've got a clip of them making fun of how the president tends to bring in world leaders or Bring in local politicians and have them flatter him. Let's check it out.

[John Legend]

Mr. President, you have so many great ideas. Your leadership is truly beyond anything we have ever had in this country.

[Eric Deggans]

And we had to stop there because the joke that unfolds is something we can't hear on the radio. But it's worked for south park because they're coming from a place where they haven't necessarily always been a consistent critic of the president, but they're stepping up now and it's really making an impact.

[Domenico Montanaro]

Yeah. And if you think that's outlandish, I mean, listen to just a little bit of Trump's recent three and a half hour cabinet meeting under the last administration.

[Donald Trump]

And it's an honor to do this under your leadership, have innovative jobs and get them back to work. So thank you for your leadership, Mr. President.

[Eric Deggans]

Thank you.

[Donald Trump]

Great job.

[Ailsa Chang]

Mr. President, I invite you to to see your big, beautiful face on a banner in front of the Department of Labor.

[Domenico Montanaro]

So is that life imitating art or vice versa? Either way, this is what Trump wants. And certainly with an industry like comedy or the arts that are traditionally counterculture.

[Ailsa Chang]

And counter power, that is NPR's Domenico Montanaro and Eric Deggans. Thanks to both of you.

[Domenico Montanaro]

You're welcome.

[Eric Deggans]

Thank you.

[Ailsa Chang]

This episode was Produced by Kai McNamee with Audio Engineering by Tiffany Vera Castro. It was edited by Courtney Dorning and Justine Kennan. Our executive producer is Sami Yeniken. And before we go, a quick thanks to our Consider this Plus listeners who support the work of NPR journalists and help keep public radio strong. Supporters also hear every episode without messages from sponsors. Learn [e-mail] It's Consider this from NPR. I'm Ailsa Chang.

[Mariel Segarra]

Stars.

[John Legend]

They're just like us. John Legend goes to CVS. Well, that's because he has his own skincare line.

[Eric Deggans]

It was so exciting to actually go into one of those stores. We had the end caps.

[John Legend]

Were you like, I don't want this locked up? John Legend is one of many stars riding the celebrity branding wave. He tells us about it on the indicator from Planet Money. Listen in the NPR app or wherever.

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[Ailsa Chang]

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