Sen. Ron Johnson blames state and local leaders for Alex Pretti’s killing

Summary

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Consider This from NPR

Episode Title: Sen. Ron Johnson blames state and local leaders for Alex Pretti’s killing
Date: January 30, 2026
Host: Ailsa Chang
Featured Guest: Senator Ron Johnson (R-WI)

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Episode Overview

This episode centers on the political turmoil following the fatal shooting of Alex Pretti by federal immigration enforcement officers (ICE) in Minneapolis. The discussion unfolds amid an urgent congressional deadlock over government funding, with the prospect of a shutdown looming. At issue: Democratic calls to reform ICE and withhold Department of Homeland Security (DHS) funding, and Republican resistance led by Senator Ron Johnson, who places responsibility for the tragedy on state and local leaders in Minnesota.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Federal Government’s Funding Standoff

• At midnight January 30th, federal funding will expire unless Congress reaches a deal.
• “The threat of a government shutdown is looming right now. If a short term spending bill isn't approved.” – Ailsa Chang (00:01)
• While a Senate vote was expected to be a formality, the ICE shooting has thrust immigration enforcement into the center of budget negotiations.
• Senate Democrats, led by Chuck Schumer and Adam Schiff, demand reforms to ICE before approving further DHS funding.
  • "I'm not prepared to spend another dime on ICE unless there's just a massive set of reforms." – Senator Adam Schiff (quoted by Ailsa Chang, 01:27)

2. Senator Ron Johnson’s Position: Blame on Local Resistance

• Johnson rejects the idea of holding up DHS funding and opposes tying funding to ICE reforms.
• He frames the problem as one caused by open-border policies and local resistance in sanctuary cities like Minneapolis.
  • “What we're dealing with right now is the enormous mess created by President Biden and Democrats who opened up our border, allowed millions of people to flood in this country…” (03:35)
• Emphasizes that when local police cooperate with ICE, enforcement occurs without violence.
• Directly blames Minneapolis officials for not cooperating, asserting that Alex Pretti’s killing would have been avoided otherwise.
  • “Had there not been an organized effort to resist those law enforcement actions, those two individuals in Minneapolis would still be alive.” (04:40)

3. Law Enforcement, Responsibility, and Reform

• Johnson sidesteps calls for federal reform, redirecting focus to border security and local cooperation.
  • “When Democrats focus on that, they're focusing on the wrong problem. The root cause of this problem is the border.” (04:17)
• Stresses apprehension and deportation of “criminals” as the primary goal, expressing some understanding for ICE targeting “other people… working and contributing to society.”
  • “I want to target the criminals... there are a lot of criminals have been let in that need to be apprehended and jailed and deported.” (05:30)
• Argues that state and local officials should cooperate with federal agents, not resist, claiming resistance puts citizens at risk.
  • “Cooperate with them, don't resist. Don't send your citizens in harm's way to resist them and protest against them.” (06:10)
• When pressed about accountability for unlawful actions by federal agents, Johnson maintains his stance that local noncooperation led to the tragedy.
  • “Their open borders, their lack of cooperation created the circumstance for that tragedy.” (06:56)
• Expresses sympathy for ICE officers, citing the dangers and high tension of their work.
  • “I've got a great deal of sympathy for those ICE officers who are under constant threat. How would you like to be in law enforcement…and you've got people…showing up. You don't know whether they're armed…You're going to be on hair trigger alert.” (06:56)

4. Proposed DHS Funding Solutions

• Democrats propose separating (or “decoupling”) DHS/ICE funding from other federal funding to keep the government open.
• Johnson firmly rejects the idea, arguing it’s a path toward defunding police and DHS.
  • “They will never fund DHS. So…I can't support that effort.” (07:51)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer:
  “If Republicans refuse to work with us to rein in ICE and to end the violence, they're telling the American people they're choosing to protect ICE over choosing to protect people's safety.” (00:58)

• Sen. Adam Schiff (via Ailsa Chang):
  “I'm not prepared to spend another dime on ICE unless there's just a massive set of reforms.” (01:27)

• Sen. Ron Johnson:
  “Had there not been an organized effort to resist those law enforcement actions, those two individuals in Minneapolis would still be alive.” (04:40)
  “Cooperate when you arrest an illegal, hold them for detention.” (06:10)
  “I've got a great deal of sympathy for those ICE officers who are under constant threat.” (06:56)
  “They will never fund DHS...I can't support that effort.” (07:51)

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Important Segment Timestamps

• 00:01 – 01:59: Government shutdown context; impact of ICE shooting on funding talks; Democrats demand ICE reform.
• 03:09 – 04:40: Senator Ron Johnson’s interview begins; his perspective on ICE, border security, and blame assignment.
• 04:40 – 06:32: Johnson details what he expects from state and local officials, explicitly blaming non-cooperation.
• 06:32 – 07:26: Discussion of responsibility for unlawful actions and the high-stress context of law enforcement.
• 07:26 – 08:06: Final questions on separating DHS funding from the rest of the spending package and Johnson’s firm opposition.

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Summary Flow & Tone

The episode maintains a tone of urgency and confrontation, reflective of the high-stakes budget standoff and the tragic events in Minneapolis. Senator Johnson’s language is assertive, defensive of federal law enforcement, and sharply critical of state and local leaders who oppose current ICE operations. The host, Ailsa Chang, persistently pushes Johnson to clarify his stance on reforms and accountability, providing a balanced and probing interview.

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Listeners are left with a sense of gridlock—both in Congress and on the ground in Minneapolis—where competing interpretations of responsibility and public safety continue to fuel national debate.

Transcript

[Ilsa Chang]

Midnight January 30th. That is when funding for the federal government runs out. We've all been here before, many, many times, everyone waiting and watching for Congress to come to an agreement on a continuing resolution to keep money flowing into the government. Remember last year saying that Congress, with the help of the White House right now is not doing its job since they are now barreling toward a shutdown. If they can't agree on a spending deal by midnight tonight or Remember back in 2021, well, the clock is ticking. The threat of a government shutdown is looming right now. If a short term spending bill isn't approved. And let's go even further back 2018.

[Senator Ron Johnson]

In just an hour, the federal government will partially shut down the House.

[Ilsa Chang]

But this time feels different because there was a deal. The vote in the Senate this week was supposed to be just a formality. That was until immigration enforcement officers shot and killed Alex Preddy on the streets of Minneapolis.

[Senator Ron Johnson]

If Republicans refuse to work with us to rein in ICE and to end the violence, they're telling the American people they're choosing to protect ICE over choosing to protect people's safety.

[Ilsa Chang]

Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer stood on the floor Thursday challenging the funding that has been set aside for the Department of Homeland Security, even though his Senate Democrats do support the rest of the spending package. Democratic Senator Adam Schiff of California told NPR Stevenski how ICE operations must change.

[Senator Ron Johnson]

I'm not prepared to spend another dime on ICE unless there's just a massive set of reforms.

[Ilsa Chang]

Consider this Democratic resistance to the immigration enforcement operation in Minnesota could result in a partial government shutdown. With hours left, can lawmakers even reach a deal? And will Democrats even get the reforms they want? From npr, I'm ailsa chang.

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[Ilsa Chang]

It's Consider this from npr. Unlike his Democratic colleagues in the Senate, Wisconsin Republican Ron Johnson doesn't think that DHS funding should even be pulled into the battle over the immigration enforcement operation in Minnesota. Johnson says he does want an investigation into the shooting of Alex Preddy, but not at the expense of government funding. I asked Senator Johnson if he thinks ICE even needs reforms.

[Senator Ron Johnson]

Well, what I agree is that we needed to secure a border. What I believe is that what we're dealing with right now is the enormous mess created by President Biden and Democrats who opened up our border, allowed millions of people to flood in this country where ICE is doing enforcement actions just like they've always done under the Obama administration, the Biden administration, where they're doing these enforcement actions and local police are cooperating, there's no violence, there's no problem. We're just enforcing the law. The problem in Minneapolis is we have a governor and a mayor who are resisting.

[Ilsa Chang]

You don't think that ICE needs any reforms, then there should be no changes on the federal government side when it comes to immigration agents.

[Senator Ron Johnson]

When you ask that question, when Democrats focus on that, they're focusing on the wrong problem. The root cause of this problem is, is the border. They opened up the millions of people, including criminals, that they've allowed to flood in this country, and now law enforcement has to take care of that problem.

[Ilsa Chang]

So what changes do you think need to be seen for law enforcement to better take care of this problem that you have identified, that you have characterized?

[Senator Ron Johnson]

The first change was we secured the border. It has to remain secure. The second change is there are people that need to be apprehended because they're criminals, murders, rapists, sex, human and drug traffickers that need to be apprehended and either jailed or deported. And that right now is what the sanctuary cities and people like Mayor Fry and Governor Walts are resisting and that have led to the tragedy. Had there not been an organized effort to resist those law enforcement actions, those two individuals in Minneapolis would still be alive.

[Ilsa Chang]

President Trump has tried to shake up the leadership for the federal immigration crackdown in Minneapolis. He's replaced the Border Patrol official, Greg Bilvino with border czar Tom Homan. Homan said today that he is going to, quote, fix the situation there. Do you believe it is possible to fix the situation in Minneapolis with this change of leadership?

[Senator Ron Johnson]

If Governor Walls and Mayor Fry would cooperate with ICE rather than resist them, rather than send people into harm's way to create these types of martyrs. Yeah, I think it can be fixed. Again. I personally, I want to target the criminals. You know I don't, I don't, I don't want, I understand ICE targeting other people who are peer working and contributing society but there are a lot of criminals, there are a lot of criminal have been let in that need to be apprehended and jailed and deported.

[Ilsa Chang]

Okay, you keep shifting blame to the mayor in Minneapolis and the governor in Minnesota. Can you tell me specifically what you need to see from that? Well, what do you need to see from them that's specifically to fix the situation in Minneapolis.

[Senator Ron Johnson]

Do what other governors and mayors have done. Cooperate with ice, cooperate with federal law enforcement when they're carrying out completely legal enforcement actions. Cooperate with them, don't resist. Don't send to your citizens in harm way, harm's way to, to resist them and protest against them. Cooperate when you, when you arrest an illegal im hold them for detention.

[Ilsa Chang]

So that I, state and local officials supposed to do federal. What are state and local officials supposed to do if they see federal immigration agents doing unlawful actions such as fatally shooting people when it's not in self defense, when there is no imminent danger in that situation, there's no weapon being wielded right in the face of the federal agent.

[Senator Ron Johnson]

They're open borders. Their lack of cooperation created the circumstance for that tragedy. So they should have cooperated on the front end. Right now there will be a thorough investigation in terms exactly what happened. And I'm just saying I've got a great deal of sympathy for those ICE officers who are under constant threat. How would you like to be in law enforcement and everybody all of a sudden you've got people who are opposed to what you're trying to do showing up. You don't know whether they're armed, whether just vanishing cameras. You don't, you're going to be on hair trigger alert. And that's what caused us tragedy.

[Ilsa Chang]

There are still legal requirements for when any law enforcement officer can use lethal force. It's not just if they don't know if the person is armed or not. Last question. Going back to the federal spending package, Democrats at least, at the very least they just want to split DHS funding from the rest of the spending package to keep the government open. Do you agree with that idea?

[Senator Ron Johnson]

Then they will never fund dhs. So supply, I mean they'll do it. They'll convince people like you that oh they're just being very reasonable. This is a way that they can defund dhs, just like they want to defund the police to disastrous consequences. So no, I can't support that effort.

[Ilsa Chang]

Republican Senator Ron Johnson of Wisconsin, thank you very much for joining us.

[Senator Ron Johnson]

Have a good day. Take care.

[Ilsa Chang]

That was Ron Johnson, Republican Senator of Wisconsin. This episode was produced by Briana Scott. It was edited by Christopher Intagliata and Kelsey Snell. Our executive producer is Sami Yenigun. It's Consider this from npr. I'm Ilsa Chang.

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