Consider This from NPR

Episode Title: Sen. Ron Johnson blames state and local leaders for Alex Pretti’s killing
Date: January 30, 2026
Host: Ailsa Chang
Featured Guest: Senator Ron Johnson (R-WI)

Episode Overview

This episode centers on the political turmoil following the fatal shooting of Alex Pretti by federal immigration enforcement officers (ICE) in Minneapolis. The discussion unfolds amid an urgent congressional deadlock over government funding, with the prospect of a shutdown looming. At issue: Democratic calls to reform ICE and withhold Department of Homeland Security (DHS) funding, and Republican resistance led by Senator Ron Johnson, who places responsibility for the tragedy on state and local leaders in Minnesota.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Federal Government’s Funding Standoff

• At midnight January 30th, federal funding will expire unless Congress reaches a deal.
• “The threat of a government shutdown is looming right now. If a short term spending bill isn't approved.” – Ailsa Chang (00:01)
• While a Senate vote was expected to be a formality, the ICE shooting has thrust immigration enforcement into the center of budget negotiations.
• Senate Democrats, led by Chuck Schumer and Adam Schiff, demand reforms to ICE before approving further DHS funding.
  • "I'm not prepared to spend another dime on ICE unless there's just a massive set of reforms." – Senator Adam Schiff (quoted by Ailsa Chang, 01:27)

2. Senator Ron Johnson’s Position: Blame on Local Resistance

• Johnson rejects the idea of holding up DHS funding and opposes tying funding to ICE reforms.
• He frames the problem as one caused by open-border policies and local resistance in sanctuary cities like Minneapolis.
  • “What we're dealing with right now is the enormous mess created by President Biden and Democrats who opened up our border, allowed millions of people to flood in this country…” (03:35)
• Emphasizes that when local police cooperate with ICE, enforcement occurs without violence.
• Directly blames Minneapolis officials for not cooperating, asserting that Alex Pretti’s killing would have been avoided otherwise.
  • “Had there not been an organized effort to resist those law enforcement actions, those two individuals in Minneapolis would still be alive.” (04:40)

3. Law Enforcement, Responsibility, and Reform

• Johnson sidesteps calls for federal reform, redirecting focus to border security and local cooperation.
  • “When Democrats focus on that, they're focusing on the wrong problem. The root cause of this problem is the border.” (04:17)
• Stresses apprehension and deportation of “criminals” as the primary goal, expressing some understanding for ICE targeting “other people… working and contributing to society.”
  • “I want to target the criminals... there are a lot of criminals have been let in that need to be apprehended and jailed and deported.” (05:30)
• Argues that state and local officials should cooperate with federal agents, not resist, claiming resistance puts citizens at risk.
  • “Cooperate with them, don't resist. Don't send your citizens in harm's way to resist them and protest against them.” (06:10)
• When pressed about accountability for unlawful actions by federal agents, Johnson maintains his stance that local noncooperation led to the tragedy.
  • “Their open borders, their lack of cooperation created the circumstance for that tragedy.” (06:56)
• Expresses sympathy for ICE officers, citing the dangers and high tension of their work.
  • “I've got a great deal of sympathy for those ICE officers who are under constant threat. How would you like to be in law enforcement…and you've got people…showing up. You don't know whether they're armed…You're going to be on hair trigger alert.” (06:56)

4. Proposed DHS Funding Solutions

• Democrats propose separating (or “decoupling”) DHS/ICE funding from other federal funding to keep the government open.
• Johnson firmly rejects the idea, arguing it’s a path toward defunding police and DHS.
  • “They will never fund DHS. So…I can't support that effort.” (07:51)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer:
  “If Republicans refuse to work with us to rein in ICE and to end the violence, they're telling the American people they're choosing to protect ICE over choosing to protect people's safety.” (00:58)

• Sen. Adam Schiff (via Ailsa Chang):
  “I'm not prepared to spend another dime on ICE unless there's just a massive set of reforms.” (01:27)

• Sen. Ron Johnson:
  “Had there not been an organized effort to resist those law enforcement actions, those two individuals in Minneapolis would still be alive.” (04:40)
  “Cooperate when you arrest an illegal, hold them for detention.” (06:10)
  “I've got a great deal of sympathy for those ICE officers who are under constant threat.” (06:56)
  “They will never fund DHS...I can't support that effort.” (07:51)

Important Segment Timestamps

• 00:01 – 01:59: Government shutdown context; impact of ICE shooting on funding talks; Democrats demand ICE reform.
• 03:09 – 04:40: Senator Ron Johnson’s interview begins; his perspective on ICE, border security, and blame assignment.
• 04:40 – 06:32: Johnson details what he expects from state and local officials, explicitly blaming non-cooperation.
• 06:32 – 07:26: Discussion of responsibility for unlawful actions and the high-stress context of law enforcement.
• 07:26 – 08:06: Final questions on separating DHS funding from the rest of the spending package and Johnson’s firm opposition.

Summary Flow & Tone

The episode maintains a tone of urgency and confrontation, reflective of the high-stakes budget standoff and the tragic events in Minneapolis. Senator Johnson’s language is assertive, defensive of federal law enforcement, and sharply critical of state and local leaders who oppose current ICE operations. The host, Ailsa Chang, persistently pushes Johnson to clarify his stance on reforms and accountability, providing a balanced and probing interview.

Listeners are left with a sense of gridlock—both in Congress and on the ground in Minneapolis—where competing interpretations of responsibility and public safety continue to fuel national debate.