The Trump administration says left-wing terrorism in the US is on the rise. Is it?

Summary

Podcast Summary: "The Trump administration says left-wing terrorism in the US is on the rise. Is it?"

Podcast: Consider This from NPR
Host: Ailsa Chang
Air Date: October 22, 2025

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Overview

This episode examines claims by the Trump administration that left-wing terrorism is rising in the United States, particularly in the wake of the assassination of right-wing activist Charlie Kirk. NPR explores the evidence behind these claims, highlights the complexities of categorizing political violence, and features experts who discuss whether there is a real shift in the threat landscape. The episode digs into recent data, the challenges in drawing firm conclusions, and the ways in which political violence is evolving in the U.S.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Presidential Rhetoric Following Charlie Kirk's Assassination

[00:00–01:16]

• President Trump, reacting to Charlie Kirk's assassination, condemns what he labels as "radical left" violence.
• Trump attributes an ongoing pattern of political violence—including attacks against ICE, a healthcare executive's killing, and the shooting of Steve Scalise—to left-wing extremism:
  • “Those on the radical left have compared wonderful Americans like Charlie to Nazis and the world's worst mass murderers… This kind of rhetoric is directly responsible for the terrorism that we’re seeing...” — Donald Trump [00:27]
• He moves to designate Antifa as a domestic terrorist organization for the first time in US history.

2. Is Left-Wing Political Violence Really Increasing?

[01:40–03:26]

• Reporter Odette Youssef points out the increasing complexity and chaos of motivations for violence, making it difficult to categorize events purely by ideology:
  • “Ideologies are becoming so chaotic, so complex, and because motivation towards violence appears to be a more important factor these days... than actually ideology.” — Odette Youssef [01:40]
• She notes historical context: Over prior years, right-wing terrorism was both more frequent and deadlier than left-wing terrorism.

3. Recent Data: Are Trends Shifting?

[03:26–06:06]

• Data from Daniel Byman (CSIS) suggests an uptick in left-wing terrorist activity in the first half of 2025, overtaking right-wing activity for the first time in 30 years.
  • However, only five far-left incidents were identified.
• Amy Kuder (Institute for Countering Digital Extremism) cautions that this is a very small dataset:
  • “Five is a really low case number to try to make any kinds of inference from and try to say we’re having an increase in any kind of problem.” — Amy Kuder [06:06]
• Any rise looks dramatic when the baseline is so low.

4. Disputes Over Defining and Counting Incidents

[06:46–08:00]

• Determining whether an incident "counts" as left-wing terrorism is subjective:
  • Were Tesla arson attacks terrorism or sabotage? Should pre-empted attacks or acts with ambiguous motives be included?
• Example of methodological issues: Some attacks (e.g., firebombings at Tesla infrastructure) might not be counted, while others (e.g., arson of NYPD squad cars) are, depending on the study.
  • “There are a host of subjective calls when it comes to analyzing domestic terrorism. How destructive was the crime? Did people die? Was that by intent? … What was the perpetrator’s politics or ideology? Did that motivate the violence?” — Narrator/Reporter [07:01]

5. The Blurring Lines: Political Violence Beyond Left and Right

[08:00–09:56]

• Motives for violence are frequently unclear; many incidents lie outside traditional ideological frames.
• Jacob Ware (Council on Foreign Relations) argues that terrorism is becoming more personal and targeted:
  • “Terrorism is getting more personal...” — Jacob Ware [09:14]
• Recent incidents, such as killings of a healthcare CEO and a Minnesota lawmaker, defy classic "mass casualty" forms of terrorism and often lack clear political statements or manifestos.

6. Limitation of Current Data and Policy Implications

[09:56–10:42]

• Many incidents do not have publicly available perpetrator motivations or ideological statements, making classification as "terrorism" difficult.
  • “We really need to get statements or justifications, motivations from perpetrators, and I don’t think we have that in the Charlie Kirk assassination or the Minnesota assassination... they're clearly assassins, but I just don't think we have the information yet that would allow us to code them as terrorists.” — Odette Youssef [09:56]
• Experts warn that in the current political climate, data may have limited effect on policy directions as partisanship drives rhetoric and action.

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Notable Quotes and Moments

• On presidential framing:
  “This is not a right wing problem. This is a left [wing problem].” — Donald Trump, referencing earlier debates [04:10]

• On interpretation of limited data:
  “Compared to historical data, almost any increase in left wing violence is going to look like a big jump.” — Amy Kuder [06:39]

• On the challenge of attribution:
  “There are a host of subjective calls when it comes to analyzing domestic terrorism… How much fear did the act create? To what extent did mental health issues factor into the attack?” — Narrator/Reporter [07:01]

• On evolving forms of violence:
  “Historically, domestic terrorists in the US have sought a large body count… in recent cases, perpetrators or suspects haven’t done that even in situations where they could have killed more people.” — Jacob Ware [09:17]

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Important Timestamps

• [00:00–01:16]: Trump administration's immediate reaction to Charlie Kirk's assassination, blaming the left and designating Antifa as a terrorist organization.
• [03:26–04:02]: Context setting — Republicans using recent attacks to amplify concerns about left-wing violence.
• [05:03–06:14]: Daniel Byman and Amy Kuder on the difficulties and limits of current terrorism data.
• [06:46–08:00]: Disputes over inclusion/exclusion of incidents as terrorism in studies.
• [09:14–09:56]: Jacob Ware: Contemporary political violence is more personal, increasingly difficult to classify.
• [09:56–10:42]: Lack of clear perpetrator motivation complicates labeling incidents as terrorism; politics may override data in shaping policy.

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Summary Conclusion

The episode underscores the complexity in assessing claims of rising left-wing terrorism in the US. While recent data suggest a relative uptick in left-wing incidents, the absolute numbers remain very small, and the interpretation is fraught with methodological challenges. Experts caution against drawing strong conclusions from limited, ambiguous data and emphasize the changing nature of political violence—motivations are harder to pin down, and traditional ideological binaries are often inadequate. As the Trump administration focuses on left-wing violence, the politicization of such trends appears likely to continue, regardless of what the evolving data actually show.

Transcript

[Ailsa Chang]

Hours after conservative activist Charlie Kirk was killed, President Trump gave a somber video address from the Oval Office to my great fellow Americans.

[Donald Trump]

I am filled with grief and anger at the heinous assassination of Charlie Kirk on a college campus in Utah.

[Ailsa Chang]

And while law enforcement launched an investigation to find the person responsible for the attack on Kirk in September, President Trump had already placed blame.

[Donald Trump]

Those on the radical left have compared wonderful Americans like Charlie to Nazis and the world's worst mass murderers and criminals. This kind of rhetoric is directly responsible for the terrorism that we're seeing in our country today, and it must stop right now.

[Ailsa Chang]

The president claimed that all of this was part of a larger pattern.

[Donald Trump]

From the attack on my life in Butler, Pennsylvania last year, which killed a husband and father, to the attacks on ICE agents, to the vicious murder of a health care executive in the streets of New York, to the shooting of House Majority Leader Steve Scalise and three others. Radical left political violence has hurt too many innocent people and taken too many lives.

[Ailsa Chang]

Then President Trump did something the US has never done before. He designated a domestic terrorist organization, namely Antifa, which which is more of a left wing movement. And while it's unclear what that executive order actually accomplished, the Trump administration's words and actions raise the question, is left wing political violence increasing in the United States?

[Odette Youssef]

Well, the answer is complicated, I would say, because ideologies are becoming so chaotic, so complex, and because motivation towards violence appears to be a more important factor these days in a lot of cases than actually ideology.

[Ailsa Chang]

Consider for years in this country, right wing terrorism has been deadlier and more frequent than terrorism from the political left. One new study says that is changing, which is drawing concerns from npr. I'm Ailsa Cheng.

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[Ailsa Chang]

It's consider this from npr. For many years, the far right has been the most lethal and persistent source of domestic terrorism in the US but the assassination of right wing influencer Charlie Kirk last month and attacks against immigration enforcement efforts have fueled a talking point for Republicans about concerns over left wing political violence. The political motivations behind these attacks are still unclear, but one study says violence from the left has been the greater threat. So far this year, NPR domestic extremism correspondent Odette Youssef looked into whether this claim was correct.

[Narrator/Reporter]

President Trump's insistence that the far left has been the primary culprit for domestic terrorism goes back years at this point.

[Donald Trump]

Because this is not a right wing problem. This is a left FBI director. This is a left wing white support.

[Narrator/Reporter]

That was a 2020 presidential debate when Trump was asked if he would condemn far right extremist groups. It was also just days after his acting head at the Department of Homeland Security told congressmen that white supremacist extremists were responsible for the most lethal extremist violence. Still, five years later, there is a sense that something is shifting, that the nation has seen the killing of Charlie Kirk, the apparent attempted assassinations of Trump, the gunning down of a health insurance executive in New York, and more. These events are not clearly coded as right wing, and so has the violence in fact pivoted to the left.

[Odette Youssef]

My hope was to bring some data to the discussion.

[Narrator/Reporter]

Daniel Byman is director of the Warfare, Irregular Threats and Terrorism Program at the center for Strategic and International Studies, or csis. Data on domestic terrorism is surprisingly hard to come by. There is no public official, unified and comprehensive database, so researchers like Byman are assembling databases on their own. He looked at incidents between 1994 and July 4th of 2025.

[Odette Youssef]

We're seeing, you know, from a low baseline, an increase in left wing attacks. And we're seeing a decrease in right wing attacks from much higher numbers.

[Narrator/Reporter]

Biman and his co author found something remarkable. Their tally showed that in the first half of 2025, far left terrorist activity had overtaken that from the far right. It's a departure from the pattern of the last 30 years. News outlets ran with that headline. But among many professionals in Biman's field, the surprise has been for a different reason.

[Amy Kuder]

Five is a really low case number. To try to make any kinds of inference from and try to say that we're having a increase in any kind of problem.

[Narrator/Reporter]

Amy Kuder is deputy director at the Institute for Countering Digital Extremism. Five is the number of far left terrorist plots and incidents that Biman's study tallied during the first half of 2025. It's a small number, but it's bigger than previous time periods. And Cooter says that is exactly what can distort conclusions.

[Amy Kuder]

Compared to historical data, almost any increase in left wing violence is going to look like a big jump.

[Narrator/Reporter]

Bimon acknowledges this. Still, he says the trends are what matter. But Jacob Ware, a research fellow at the Council on Foreign Relations, says there are more questions.

[Odette Youssef]

There have been methodological concerns that have been aired with that product.

[Narrator/Reporter]

This is where the real mess starts. There are a host of subjective calls when it comes to analyzing domestic terrorism. How destructive was the crime? Did people die? Was that by intent? If not, could people have gotten hurt? What was the perpetrator's politics or ideology? Did that motivate the violence? How much fear did the act create? And to what extent did mental health issues factor into the attack? And so some incidents that the CSIS study included and left out have been disputed again.

[Odette Youssef]

Jacob Ware early this year, for example, there were a number of firebombings at Tesla stores or other Tesla infrastructure. To me, that might qualify as an act of terrorism if somebody is using incendiary devices against civilian targets for political purposes. Those don't seem to be counted.

[Narrator/Reporter]

But the study does count the burning of 11 NYPD squad cars among its five left wing terrorist incidents of 2020. Ware says that one wouldn't make his cut. Another instance that raises questions involved an individual arrested by U.S. capitol Police earlier this year for allegedly plotting to kill Trump cabinet members. The individual reportedly turned herself into law enforcement before following through. Should that count? Some might say no, but this study included it. What about the killings of two Israeli embassy staffers in May? Those are left off this list. Biman says he understands if others arrive at different conclusions on these, as he calls them, edge cases. But two or three out of five can change whether there is in fact a trend. Taking a step back, researchers in this field largely agree that something is shifting. Political violence has increased. There is concern that more may be coming from the left, though many told NPR it's just too early still to know. For Jacob Ware, the left right framework isn't the best way to understand the change.

[Odette Youssef]

Terrorism is getting more personal, whether it's.

[Narrator/Reporter]

The killings of a health care CEO, a Minnesota state lawmaker, Charlie Kirk, Israeli embassy staffers, the arson at the Pennsylvania governor's mansion, attempted assassinations of Trump. Ware says this is different from the past. Historically, domestic terrorists in the US have sought a large body count. But in recent cases, Ware says perpetrators or suspects haven't done that even in situations where they could have killed more people. And he says the question of whether their violence stemmed from far left or far right tendencies is more often than not unclear.

[Odette Youssef]

We really need to get statements or justifications, motivations from perpetrators, and I don't think we have that in the Charlie Kirk assassination or the Minnesota assassination. So I would argue there's a world in which neither of those people should be coded as terrorists. I mean, they're clearly assassins, but I just don't think we have the information yet that would allow us to code them as terrorists.

[Narrator/Reporter]

Ideally, a data based understanding of who is committing domestic terrorism, how and against whom, would help law enforcement allocate resources toward the greatest threats. But as the Trump administration continues to ramp up its efforts against its political opposition, Ware and Bimon both say any data are unlikely to shift that agenda.

[Ailsa Chang]

That was Odette Youssef, who covers domestic extremism for npr. This episode was produced by Janaki Mehta and Alejandra Marquez Hanse. It was edited by Andrew Sussman and Sami Yenigun, who is also our executive producer. It's Consider this from npr. I'm Ailsa Chang.

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