Consider This from NPR: Vaccine Expert Worries Child Measles Deaths Are Being 'Normalized'

Episode Title: Vaccine expert worries child measles deaths are being 'normalized'
Host: Mary Louise Kelly
Release Date: April 14, 2025

Introduction

In this episode of NPR's "Consider This," host Mary Louise Kelly delves into the alarming surge of measles cases in the United States, now numbering over 700 with three reported deaths this year. The discussion centers on the role of the new Secretary of Health and Human Services (HHS), Robert F. Kennedy Jr., and his contentious stance on vaccines amidst the outbreak. A pivotal conversation with Dr. Peter Marks, the former top vaccine regulator at the Food and Drug Administration (FDA), sheds light on the administrative and public health challenges facing the nation's vaccination efforts.

Background: Robert F. Kennedy Jr.'s Position and Controversies

Robert F. Kennedy Jr., appointed as the HHS Secretary, has been a polarizing figure in the public health arena. Despite publicly supporting vaccines, his actions and statements have raised concerns among public health experts. During his confirmation hearing, Kennedy faced scrutiny from Senator Ron Wyden over his previous claims that parents have been "misled" about the dangers of measles and the safety of vaccines (00:00).

Kennedy's recent interview with CBS News echoed a seemingly supportive stance on vaccines when he stated, "People should get the measles vaccine" (01:30). However, contradictory remarks have emerged, such as questioning the safety tests of vaccines and promoting unproven treatments for measles (01:38).

Current Measles Outbreak Situation

The United States is currently grappling with significant measles outbreaks, primarily concentrated in Texas but affecting multiple jurisdictions. Measles, known for its high contagion rate, is preventable through a highly effective vaccine. Historically, vaccination has kept outbreaks rare and deaths even scarcer. Public health experts emphasize that vaccination remains the cornerstone of controlling the current epidemic.

Interview with Dr. Peter Marks: A Critique of the Federal Response

Mary Louise Kelly interviews Dr. Peter Marks, who served as the top vaccine regulator at the FDA until his recent departure. Dr. Marks provides a critical perspective on the federal response to the measles outbreak and the internal conflicts within the HHS under Kennedy's leadership.

Departure from the FDA

Dr. Marks explains that his exit was not voluntary but was precipitated by a series of events undermining vaccination efforts:
"It was one that became clear that it was going to happen based on an accelerating number of events that seem to be conspiring against vaccines in this country." (04:43)

He criticizes the HHS's official statement regarding his departure as "Orwellian speak," emphasizing his commitment to science and the Hippocratic oath over political directives:
"Anybody who knows me knows that that is Orwellian speak because they know that I am somebody that is guided by the science and that will follow the science in support of doing what is right." (06:01)

Assessment of the Federal Response

Dr. Marks describes the federal response to the measles outbreak as "tepid at best," lacking the necessary forcefulness to curb the spread effectively:
"I believe that the federal response has been tepid at best. It is not the type of forceful response that's necessary now." (06:48)

He advocates for a proactive approach, collaborating with states to tailor vaccination messages and dispel myths surrounding vaccine safety:
"A forceful response involves going into the various states, working with the states to find the best way to get across the message for vaccination in that particular state." (07:28)

Clarifying Vaccine Misconceptions

Dr. Marks addresses misinformation propagated by Secretary Kennedy, particularly regarding the efficacy and longevity of the MMR vaccine:
"Two doses of this vaccine provides essentially lifelong immunity. That kind of statement... are just ways to discourage vaccination." (08:49)

He vehemently rejects claims that the MMR vaccine's protection wanes rapidly or that it fails to provide adequate maternal antibody transfer:
"Those are just ways to discourage vaccination. And so that subtle way of, I encourage vaccination, but maybe it's not such a great idea." (08:49)

The Cost of Vaccine Hesitancy

Highlighting the stark choice between vaccination and natural infection, Dr. Marks underscores the preventable nature of measles deaths:
"If we decide that we want everyone to get the measles so they have lifelong protection, it means that one child out of every thousand will die." (09:44)

He expresses profound concern over the normalization of measles deaths, emphasizing that such fatalities are unnecessary in the United States:
"This is something I truly worry about, and it actually keeps me up nights because there is no reason in the United States for us to have a single child die of measles." (11:08)

Outlook on the Outbreak's Resolution

Dr. Marks anticipates that only after additional tragic deaths will there be sufficient impetus to mount a robust public health response:
"I think what's probably going to happen is at some point after a few more children die, someone will really get activated and we will have the kind of robust public health response that we need." (10:39)

Conclusion

The episode paints a concerning picture of the current public health landscape in the United States, where leadership conflicts and misinformation threaten to undermine vaccination efforts. Dr. Peter Marks' insights highlight the urgent need for evidence-based policies and proactive measures to contain the measles outbreak and prevent further loss of life. As the nation faces this preventable crisis, the clash between scientific integrity and political maneuvering becomes a critical focal point in the fight against infectious diseases.

Notable Quotes:

• Robert F. Kennedy Jr.:
  "People should get the measles vaccine." (01:30)

• Dr. Peter Marks:
  "Anybody who knows me knows that that is Orwellian speak because they know that I am somebody that is guided by the science and that will follow the science in support of doing what is right." (06:01)

• Dr. Peter Marks on Vaccine Safety:
  "The vaccine doesn't kill children, the vaccine doesn't cause encephalitis, and the vaccine doesn't cause autism." (07:28)

• Dr. Peter Marks on Measles Mortality:
  "One child out of every thousand will die." (09:44)

• Dr. Peter Marks on Normalization of Deaths:
  "There is no reason in the United States for us to have a single child die of measles." (11:08)

Produced by: Connor Donovan
Edited by: Courtney Dorning
Executive Producer: Sammy Yinigun

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