Conspirituality, Episode 276: "Inventing Saint Charlie Kirk"
Release Date: September 25, 2025
Hosts: Derek Beres, Matthew Remski, Julian Walker
Episode Overview
This episode deconstructs the assassination of Charlie Kirk, founder of Turning Point USA, and scrutinizes the spiraling creation of his martyrdom amongst the American right. The hosts analyze how Kirk’s death became a flashpoint for reactionary myth-making, grift among wellness influencers, and the co-mingling of Christian nationalism with conspiratorial politics. They discuss the fraught and toxic environment created by these dynamics, the hyper-monetization of tragedy, and the role of both left and right-wing media in shaping the national narrative. The episode also debates liberal responses to Kirk’s death, evangelical “sainthood,” and coalition-building on the left in a time of growing extremism.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
1. The Assassination of Charlie Kirk: Narrative Chaos
[03:27–09:28]
- Julian recounts Kirk’s assassination during a campus speech at Utah Valley University, and the rapid mobilization of right-wing voices declaring Kirk a martyr akin to Martin Luther King Jr.
- Shell casings left at the site led to wild speculation: initial reports said they were anti-fascist messages, then nihilistic memes, then possible far-right Groypers references.
- Motive remains unclear; speculation swirls over the shooter’s background—including possible ties to the far-right, meme culture, or a transgender partner.
- An undercurrent of paranoia and hair-trigger rhetoric permeates the evangelical community's response; a vigil in Neptune Beach, Florida, typified by “an incendiary cocktail of politics and religion.”
Quote:
“Charlie Kirk died because of his stand. It is good and evil. It's evil that they want to kill babies... It's evil that about 70% of the transgender people are... teenagers. What does that tell you about indoctrination?”
— Unidentified Evangelical Speaker at vigil, [08:04]
2. The Making of a Martyr and Christian Nationalist Hagiography
[09:29–15:07]
- Turning Point USA is now not just a conservative campus group, but “a vehicle for Christian nationalism,” supporting Seven Mountain Mandate ideology—Christians presiding over “business, government, media, arts, education, family, and religion.”
- The movement aligns with charismatic leaders, Christian nationalist politicians (e.g., Marjorie Taylor Greene), and New Apostolic Reformation figures, creating a "spiritual warfare" frame for political opponents.
Quote:
“This is an ultra conservative, deeply reactionary, cult like movement that believes it can revive the gifts of the Holy Spirit... They see the world itself as a spiritual battlefield.”
— Julian Walker, [14:11]
3. Meme Culture, Nihilism, and Extremism within the Right
[17:16–21:36]
- The hosts unpack the emergence of meme-driven nihilistic violence, in which both left and right symbols are scrambled for shock or chaos, making motives elusive.
- Meme violence is often rooted in “black pill” hatred, resisting not just liberals but institutional MAGA efforts to “build” — viewing compromise as betrayal.
- Post-millennialist Christian nationalism wants not apocalypse, but total Christian dominion as a precondition to the Second Coming.
Quote:
“For them, Turning Point USA and every attempt at MAGA integration dulls the blade of pure rebellion. Ergo, Kirk was a sellout because he wanted to build electoral power.”
— Matthew Rimsky, [19:04]
4. The Backlash: Targeting Journalists, Doxxing, Stochastic Terrorism
[21:46–26:33]
- Coverage by independent journalists like @heyitstwig (“Hey, it’s Twig”) is met with harassment and threats.
- The right uses “retroactive justification”—accusing opponents of methods they themselves are engaged in, e.g., hate speech, doxxing, stochastic terrorism.
- The language of “hate speech” is being redefined and weaponized by the right.
Quote:
“The whole doxing website that Charlie supporters have come up with... You're not gonna shut me up. You tried to intimidate me, you tried to silence me and all you did was give me a megaphone.”
— Hey, it’s Twig, [22:19]
5. Power over Principle: The Hypocrisy Discourse
[26:07–27:36]
- The right is unfazed by accusations of hypocrisy; for many supporters, managing contradiction is part of the appeal.
- Cited analysis from podcasts like "Know Your Enemy": hypocrisy is not a meaningful charge for Trump supporters due to ongoing internal conflicts and the function of "owning the libs."
- The regime of “power over principle” exposes the futility of expecting hypocrisy charges to prompt self-reflection or change.
Quote:
“For a Trump supporter, hypocrisy is just baked into the way in which the person is living... These are symptoms of internal conflicts... and Trump gives them permission to solve that tension.”
— Matthew Rimsky, [26:33]
6. The Grift: Wellness Influencers Monetize Tragedy
[32:40–44:54]
- Prominent wellness conspiracy figures (Dr. Jess Petros, Mickey Willis, JP Sears, Leland Stillman) exploit Kirk’s death to push anti-vax, anti-government, and toxin-cleansing products.
- Unsubstantiated connections are made between COVID vaccines and violence, with pseudo-medical justifications and fear-mongering.
- Kirk’s own “medical freedom” stance and anti-vax content made him a natural fit for these influencer grift networks.
Quote:
“100% of the people who are excited and happy about a young father and husband’s death have gotten the COVID vaccine... this shot can rip the humanity right out of people.”
— Dr. Jess Petros, [32:40]
Quote:
“They do have this fantastical vision of a post liberal, post secular America that looks like illustrations from Sunday school books or Star Trek or a mixture of the both. But for the most part... they’re nihilists...”
— Matthew Rimsky, [19:59]
7. The Kirk Memorial: Evangelical Sainthood and Political Opportunism
[52:12–62:02]
- The Kirk memorial is described as a mega-church meets MAGA political rally, infused with “triumphalism of the evangelical Jesus,” opportunistic glorification by politicians, and even awkward religious performances by non-believers like Trump.
- The creation of a martyr narrative is compared to historic fascist mythmaking (e.g., Horst Wessel under the Nazis).
- Kirk’s composure, discipline, lack of scandal, and cross-demographic appeal made him an ideal unifying figure—contrasted to more divisive right-wing voices.
Quote:
“He was saintly... he knows how to not mimic the social justice warrior stereotypes that are thrown up by the MAGA side of the culture war.”
— Matthew Remski, [55:09]
8. Liberal Responses and the Dangers of “Both-Sides” Bootlicking
[62:02–67:12]
- Some liberals (Ezra Klein, others cited by Ta-Nehisi Coates) attempted to eulogize Kirk as a “colleague” or fellow political participant, drawing sharp criticism for whitewashing his record.
- The hosts discuss the risks and psychology behind such responses—whether driven by class interest, social position, or a naïve hope of appeasing fascists.
- There is a robust rejection of such whitewashing by other left/progressive commentators and politicians.
Quote:
“I think the problem is it won’t work. Like, you can’t emotionally appease fascists because that’s more blood in the water.”
— Matthew Rimsky, [62:02]
9. Left Organizing, Coalition Building, and Democratic Weakness
[67:12–71:43]
- The episode concludes with a self-reflexive exploration of coalition building on the left, the challenge of building power against right-wing unity, and the limits of both centrist and Marxist critiques.
- Democrats' penchant for “punching left,” neoliberal compromises, and inability to match the strategic clarity of the right are discussed as ongoing obstacles.
- Personal stories and analogies about coalition-building, empathy, and moving beyond internet discourse to “real-life” conversations are offered.
Quote:
“Most regular people aren’t plotting out how to cling to their power in spite of everyone else... but it casts blame upwards.”
— Matthew Rimsky, [71:43]
Notable Quotes & Moments
-
On Martyrdom & Memes:
“He was everything MAGAs desperately project onto Trump: eloquent, ideologically consistent, principled... you would never have to be secretly ashamed of Charlie Kirk.”
— Julian Walker, [59:51–60:09] -
On Hypocrisy:
“It’s not just that they don’t care about it, but... hypocrisy is just baked into the way in which the person is living.”
— Matthew Rimsky, [26:33] -
On Wellness Grift:
“The herpes reference is interesting... It’s almost like she’s recognizing, oh, this is a market for me... and then sell them my product.”
— Julian Walker, [35:28] -
On Liberal Appeasement:
“You can’t emotionally appease fascists because that’s more blood in the water.”
— Matthew Rimsky, [62:02] -
On Coalition-Building:
“Everyone wants systemic change and no one really wants power over anyone else. The right is better at organizing... because their overall goal is simpler.”
— Matthew Rimsky, [67:12] -
On Meme Nihilism:
“Each slogan or meme can have agonist or antagonist effects. Like chemistry doesn’t have any intention. And likewise it’s impossible to sort out the intentionality of the black pilled world.”
— Matthew Rimsky, [48:16]
Memorable Timestamps
- [08:04] Evangelical speaker at memorial and the rhetoric of spiritual war
- [22:19] “Hey, it’s Twig” describes becoming a target for documenting right-wing reactions
- [32:40] Dr. Jess Petros begins the grift: COVID vaccines and “ripping humanity out of people”
- [37:08] Mickey Willis’ conspiratorial, “the Great Purge” segment
- [41:26 – 42:13] JP Sears pivots from Kirk’s eulogy to selling magnesium sleep supplements
- [55:09] Analysis of Kirk’s “saintly” composure and emotional palette at memorial
- [62:02] On futile attempts to appease authoritarians
Tone and Style
The hosts maintain an analytical, skeptical, occasionally sardonic tone—cutting through both right-wing propaganda and liberal wishful thinking with incisive commentary, while also making space for empathy and self-awareness about the limits of online political discourse.
Summary for Non-Listeners
This episode demonstrates how the death of Charlie Kirk became a Rorschach test for American political polarization, instantly weaponized by right-wing forces to manufacture a martyr, promote conspiracy-laden grifts, and advance authoritarian, Christian nationalist narratives. The hosts track the opportunism and myth-making across both evangelical and wellness influencer spheres, highlighting the deepening entanglement of meme culture, religious authoritarianism, and reactionary politics. They critique not only the right, but also the tendency of centrist liberals to “whitewash” Kirk’s legacy in a misguided attempt at civility or self-preservation. The episode closes with a candid discussion about leftist coalition-building, the unique challenges facing democratic organizing, and the essential need for honest, upward-focused critique in the current political landscape.