Conspirituality Podcast Episode Summary Episode: Brief: How To Talk To Your Son About Fascism (Pt 1) Release Date: April 26, 2025 Hosts: Derek Beres, Matthew Remski, Julian Walker Guest: Dr. Craig Johnson

Introduction and Context

In this episode of the Conspirituality Podcast, hosts Derek Beres and Julian Walker delve into the critical topic of fascism and its intersection with youth, particularly young men. They are joined by Dr. Craig Johnson, a historian with a Ph.D. from Berkeley, and the author of the newly released book, How to Talk to Your Son About Fascism. This conversation marks the first part of a two-part series aimed at exploring the pathways to fascist ideologies among young individuals and strategies for intervention.

Overview of Craig Johnson's Work

Derek introduces Dr. Johnson's book as a significant contribution to understanding and combating the rise of fascist sentiments among young men. He notes the serendipitous timing of their publications, both addressing similar urgencies in contemporary society. Dr. Johnson's approach is both scholarly and pragmatic, offering parents and educators actionable insights to prevent the allure of extremism.

Notable Quote:

Derek [11:01]: "Craig’s book is an essential service, providing a framework for how fascism appeals to young men and offering practical advice for intervention."

Defining Fascism: Misogyny and Sexism

Dr. Johnson begins his book by defining fascism not just as a political ideology but as one deeply rooted in misogyny and sexism. He emphasizes that fascists view certain societal spheres—like government and business—as inherently male domains, relegating women to roles centered around family and childcare. This obsession with sexual hierarchies is central to fascist ideology.

Notable Quote:

Johnson [Timestamp not provided]: "Fascism is sexist. Fascists believe that men naturally belong in positions of power while women should remain in domestic spheres."

Attraction of Fascism to Young Men

The discussion shifts to why fascism particularly appeals to young men. Dr. Johnson identifies qualities such as speed, violence, recklessness, and self-assertion—traits often glorified in fascist rhetoric—that resonate with the typical young male experience. Fascist leaders exploit these desires, offering a sense of purpose and belonging.

Notable Quote:

Johnson [Timestamp not provided]: "Speed, violence, recklessness, and self-assertion are qualities that fascists recruit and mobilize, presenting violence as the highest form of political dignity."

Online Recruitment Pipelines

A significant portion of the conversation focuses on the role of the internet in facilitating the spread of fascist ideologies. Dr. Johnson examines the "pipeline" from platforms like YouTube to the manosphere, highlighting how influencers such as PewDiePie have historically cloaked racism and misogyny under the guise of humor or entertainment. This slippery slope—from seemingly harmless jokes to genuine extremist recruitment—is a critical concern.

Notable Quote:

Johnson [15:28]: "There is a pipeline from the joke to dehumanization. What starts as humor can evolve into a tool for fascist recruitment."

Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion as Countermeasures

Dr. Johnson advocates for Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) initiatives as effective tools against the rise of fascism. He argues that exposure to diverse communities fosters understanding and reduces the likelihood of individuals gravitating towards extremist ideologies that thrive on division and exclusion.

Notable Quote:

Johnson [14:08]: "DEI is more than a corporate policy; it's a societal imperative that expands human equality and opportunity, making fascism less appealing."

Gender Essentialism and Social Construction

The hosts engage in a nuanced discussion about gender essentialism—the idea that certain traits are inherently tied to one's gender—and the social construction of masculinity. Dr. Johnson emphasizes that while traits like aggression are socially emphasized in young men, they are not biologically essential. Recognizing masculinity as a social construct allows for the creation of healthier, more inclusive identities that do not rely on violence or dominance.

Notable Quote:

Johnson [29:10]: "Masculinity is a social construct. The traits associated with it, such as aggression and dominance, are not biologically inherent but culturally reinforced."

Agency in Fascist Beliefs

A pivotal point in the episode is the debate over agency—the capacity of individuals to act independently and make their own choices. Dr. Johnson asserts that fascism is a political choice rather than a result of deception or psychological manipulation. He challenges the notion that individuals are merely pawns in extremist movements, emphasizing the importance of recognizing their agency to effectively counteract fascist recruitment.

Notable Quote:

Johnson [37:16]: "Fascism is a political choice. Recognizing that individuals believe in these ideologies deliberately helps us form clearer strategies to combat them."

Limitations of Cult Theory Application

The conversation takes a critical turn as Derek introduces perspectives from cult studies, questioning the applicability of cult theories to large-scale movements like MAGA. Dr. Johnson acknowledges the complexity, noting that while certain fascist organizations may exhibit cult-like behaviors, the scale and integration into societal structures differentiate them from traditional cults.

Notable Quote:

Johnson [44:05]: "Calling large-scale fascist movements a cult shields us from understanding their broader societal impact and the true nature of their ideologies."

Silver Linings and Future Considerations

Despite the grim nature of rising fascism, Dr. Johnson remains cautiously optimistic. He suggests that generational shifts and changing cultural norms could render fascist ideologies "cringe" to future young people, much like past extremist movements have lost their appeal over time. However, he warns that proactive and sustained efforts are necessary to ensure this decline.

Notable Quote:

Johnson [24:04]: "While it's possible that future generations will find fascism cringeworthy, this outcome requires deliberate and ongoing countermeasures."

Conclusion

The episode wraps up with Derek and Julian reflecting on the insights shared by Dr. Johnson. They emphasize the importance of understanding fascism's appeal to young men and the need for effective intervention strategies. The conversation sets the stage for the forthcoming second part, which will delve deeper into intervention and repair strategies, including the role of DEI in inoculating communities against fascist ideologies.

Closing Thoughts:

Julian [45:30]: "These are spectacular questions. I really had a lovely time talking to you about these things. Really, really some good things to chew on."

Derek [46:17]: [Advertisements and sign-offs]

Key Takeaways:

• Fascism's Core: Beyond political ideology, fascism is deeply intertwined with misogyny and sexism, reinforcing rigid gender roles.
• Youth Vulnerability: Young men are particularly susceptible to fascist recruitment due to societal pressures and the glorification of aggressive traits.
• Digital Influence: The internet serves as a powerful tool for spreading extremist ideologies, often under the veil of humor or entertainment.
• Preventive Strategies: Implementing DEI initiatives and fostering inclusive communities are essential in countering the allure of fascism.
• Understanding Agency: Recognizing individuals' capacity to choose and believe in extremist ideologies is crucial for effective intervention.
• Avoiding Essentialism: It's vital to approach gender and behavior as socially constructed to prevent reinforcing harmful stereotypes.

This episode provides a comprehensive examination of the mechanisms through which fascism appeals to young men and offers valuable strategies for parents, educators, and society to combat this growing threat.