Brief: The Man Who Lives With 16 Cats

Summary

Conspirituality Podcast — Brief: The Man Who Lives With 16 Cats

Hosts: Derek Beres & Julian Walker
Date: October 25, 2025

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Overview:

This Conspirituality Brief dissects the unique, controversial, and colorful character of Curtis Sliwa—recent Republican mayoral nominee in New York City, founder of the Guardian Angels, relentless self-promoter, and, yes… the man who lives with 16 rescued cats in a 320-square-foot apartment. Derek Beres and Julian Walker use Sliwa’s bombastic persona and the current NYC mayoral race (against Cuomo and Mamdani) to explore authenticity, populism, and the paradoxes of coalition-building in the current political and media landscape.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Who is Curtis Sliwa?

[06:31–09:18]

• Origin Story:

  • Sliwa began as a McDonald’s manager in the Bronx in the '70s, founded the "Magnificent 13," which evolved into the Guardian Angels—an anti-crime vigilante group.
  • Became a local folk hero (and sometimes a media hound), both controversial and celebrated.
  • Despite some fabrications about vigilante exploits, Sliwa has real street credibility—he was attacked with a bat and then shot in a cab by Gotti mobsters after exposing the family on his radio show.

• Comparison to Trump:

  • Both men are native New Yorkers, masters of media provocation, and larger-than-life personalities with a deeply ingrained tendency to "say the quiet part loud."
  • "Like Trump, Sliwa is a born and bred New Yorker and eight years younger than the current dictator in charge." — Derek, [05:27]

2. Sliwa’s Persona: The Good, The Bad, The Hilarious

[04:16–07:12]; [09:18-11:44]

• Problematic Track Record:

  • Known for racist, offensive, and contradictory remarks; deeply embedded in New York's tough, brash vernacular.
  • “Sliwa has said some racist shit... anti-Semitic shit... misogynistic shit... everyone from the tri-state area knows this already.” — Derek, [04:16–05:23]

• The Parade Example:

  • Sliwa has marched (and grand marshaled) in practically every NYC parade, demonstrating his appeal to a wide range of groups but also how such “showing up” can supersede ideological alignment in NY’s rough-and-tumble political context.
  • “This dude loves parades. It should actually be what his platform is. You see him at a trans parade… with a bunch of Asian women… he is there and in the mix.” — Derek, [15:53]

• Cat Daddy Persona:

  • Lives with his wife and 16 rescued cats in tiny quarters—turning animal advocacy into a quirky (and meme-able) part of his platform.
  • “He lives in a 320-square-foot apartment with his wife and 16 cats, all rescued from the streets of New York.” — Derek, [10:01]
  • New York Times confirmed: “It didn’t smell in there. And Sliwa’s like ‘Oh, we change the litter three times a day.’ Which is a Herculean task…” — Derek, [11:19]

3. Political Analysis: Authenticity vs. Orthodoxy

[11:46–17:28]; [23:47–33:30]

• Sliwa’s Unfiltered Style:

  • “At heart, Sliwa is an old-school New Yorker… it means he does not have a filter.” — Derek, [11:46]
  • His unscripted, brash style is described as “authentic” and seems to resonate more than the robotic, manicured affect of establishment politicians like Cuomo or Adams.
  • “You see Zohran laughing at questions, you see Sliwa shaking his head and jumping in… Cuomo trained to be very, very poker face… that’s not how people actually interact." — Derek, [25:11]

• Democratic Dilemmas:

  • The party’s fear of populism/socialism is contrasted with the appeal of authentic, coalition-building candidates like Mamdani and Platner.
  • “It blows my mind that the Democrats… all their messaging is about affordability. Then you have Mamdani: ‘Here’s some ways we can make it affordable.’ And they’re like, ‘Can’t touch you.’” — Derek, [27:33]
  • Julian: “The Democratic brand has become toxic in terms of that cautiousness… we need Democratic candidates who have that authenticity…” [29:22]

4. Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Sliwa on Bill Ackman (billionaire influence):

  • "[Ackman] lives in Chappa, the whitest suburb of America, where even the lawn jockeys are white. He may know Wall Street, he may know hedge funds. He has been wrong every step of the way with the billionaires." — Curtis Sliwa, [21:32]
  • Derek: "That is pure gold." [22:01]

• On Democracy and Party Loyalty:

  • “I have people running under me. Council people, judges. They put their heart and soul into it. I have more donations than Andrew Cuomo does… this is called voting. Since when do we not let people vote? Billionaires determine the next mayor?” — Curtis Sliwa, [32:14]

• Sliwa’s relationship with authenticity/populism:

  • “He would be very comfortable sitting in a lounge chair next to Archie Bunker… and then Meathead would come in and Sliwa would agree with him sometimes… that is how he would react.” — Derek, [17:50]

• On representation and parades:

  • “I would not boycott any parade… responsibility to be available to all racial, religious… no, I wouldn’t, unless they discriminated.” — Curtis Sliwa, [14:11]

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Timestamps: Important Segments

• [06:31–09:18] – Sliwa’s origin story; Guardian Angels and Gotti shooting
• [10:01–11:44] – Curtis Sliwa’s home life with 16 cats
• [13:52–15:18] – The “parade” debate excerpt; Sliwa’s platform of showing up
• [21:32–22:00] – Sliwa roasts Bill Ackman
• [23:47–27:03] – Sliwa vs. Cuomo; style, authenticity, and the New York affect
• [32:14–33:09] – Sliwa on democracy, party loyalty, and electoral assumptions

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Takeaways and Themes

The Paradox of Authenticity

Sliwa’s appeal comes not from policy depth, but from a gritty, unfiltered “authenticity” that matches the energies of both the Trump era and old New York. While Sliwa is deeply problematic, even fans and critics admit that "being real" often trumps message discipline in today’s political environment.

Social Media vs. Lived Reality

The hosts discuss how online “gotcha” moments fail to capture the complexity of real-world coalition-building—especially in diverse, working-class cities. “Tolerance and acceptance don’t always have to require understanding or companionship—and those qualities are still way better than outright hatred.” — Derek, [15:53–17:28]

Democratic Party at a Crossroads

The episode closes with reflections on how the left can reclaim authenticity and appeal to blue-collar and marginalized communities by moving beyond caution and embracing real, practical solutions—while grappling with the messy personalities who make up the broad tent of city politics.

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Notable Quotes

• Derek Beres: “When you're in a situation where if someone says the wrong word and then a mob comes after them online... it doesn't surprise me that it turns people away from causes. We talk about coalition building all the time...” [17:50]
• Julian Walker: “Populists come across as more authentic even when they're full of shit, even when they're spreading conspiracy theories and pseudoscience...” [29:22]
• Curtis Sliwa: "Billionaires determine the next mayor? If they don't like it, they can leave. Blue-collar, working-class people don't. Those are the people I'm representing." [32:14]

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Tone & Style

The tone is casual, brash, and unapologetically “New York,” with repeated emphasis by both hosts on the carnivalesque absurdity of Sliwa’s campaign—and the larger implications it has for American populism and politics.

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If you haven’t listened, this episode is a wild primer on why today’s urban politics are as much about performance as policy—featuring one of the city’s most peculiar and persistent performers. And, of course, his cats.

Transcript

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[Julian Walker]

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[Curtis Sliwa]

Everybody agrees curtis Lewa won that debate tonight.

[Derek Barris]

I actually agree with Curtis on that.

[Curtis Sliwa]

I agree, by the way, now it's time. Andrew Cuomo, you're one and done. You lost the primary. You lost the debate to me. Make room for Zoran Mondavi versus Curtis Lee with the next debate. Let the people pick the winner. And you know, after tonight it's gonna.

[Derek Barris]

Be no, no, Curtis, it is definitely not going to be you. But that video is pretty funny, which is kind of why I wanted to do this episode today. Overall, Sliwa is very problematic in a number of ways. So as a heads up, this is definitely no kind of endorsement and I believe he's playing a big role in wise. Ohani is going to win the New York City mayoral race in a couple of weeks. But it's Sleera's response as the Republican nominee in that race that piqued my interest in covering this because it goes against so much of what we've seen coming from the right in the Trump era. The clips you just heard came after the first debate between Sliwa Mamdani and Andrew Cuomo. And Sliwa has been on a media blitz ever since that night. Plus, like I said, he's fucking funny. But there's also some context for that which we're going to get into and think those clips are making people be like, who the fuck is this guy? So let's get into it. I'm Derek Barris.

[Julian Walker]

I'm Julian Walker.

[Derek Barris]

You're listening to a Conspirituality brief, the man who lives with 16 cats. And as always, you can find us on Instagram and threads at Conspirituality Pod individually on Blue Sky. And if you are able to do so to support us as independent media creators, you can find us on [e-mail] conspirituality where you will get access to all of our bonus episodes as well as listen to every episode ad free. Or you could subscribe to our Monday bonus episodes via Apple subscriptions. Okay, let's cut to the chase here. Curtis Lewa has says some racist shit in his life. He said some anti Semitic shit. He's said some misogynistic shit. He said some racist shit while seeming to prop up Orthodox Jews, then turned around and said some nasty shit about Orthodox Jews. A lot of people are unearthing old clips trying to create gotcha moments on Sliwa. But if you're from the tri State area, you know all this shit already.

[Julian Walker]

It's all gotcha moments. It's, it's. He only does gotcha moments.

[Derek Barris]

Exactly. It's kind of like Donald Trump. Most people from where I'm from always know who that guy is. And like Trump, Sliwa is a born and bred New Yorker and eight years younger than the current dictator in charge.

[Julian Walker]

Okay, Derek, hold up here. I'm just noticing something and I have to ask. Is it the Jersey boy in you that gets so foul mouthed when you think about this kind of New Yorker?

[Derek Barris]

It's absolutely unavoidable. I don't think people. I've worked in media for a long time and I really do try to present well. But when I'm talking to people who I grew up with, fuck is the word that is used every third word. It's just. It is what it is. When I see Sliwa, it's the only way I can talk because it's just the tri state code switching which just results in us have. If you've ever watched the Sopranos, that is where I come from.

[Julian Walker]

Yeah, okay. Yeah. That video is amazing. Like the way that he cuts together. I agree, I agree with Curtis. But then like his whole demeanor, like I haven't watched a lot of stuff from him in the past and he just comes across like a boxing promoter. It's amazing.

[Derek Barris]

That's. That's one of. That could be one of his jobs. It's not though. Actually I want to do a little bit of background because people probably aren't that familiar with where he comes from. So. Speaking of jobs, in the late 70s, he was working as a night manager of a McDonald's in the Bronx and he left there to found the magnificent 13, which is a group of predominantly black and Latino men plus a few white men like Curtis in the mix. Most people know them by their second name, the Guardian Angels. In the popular imagination I grew up with in the 80s, they were a bunch of tough guys who patrolled the street combating crime. They were very much like Batman. Figures.

[Julian Walker]

I was going to say. I even heard about them growing up in Johannesburg. Like I knew that there were these guys called the Guardian Angels in New York City who were like, you know, standing up to crime.

[Derek Barris]

Right. Because it was a much different New York City back then, and the media was also different. Remember, this is when there was only three networks and then local news, of course. But when stories about stuff like this got out, it would be spread everywhere because you didn't have bifurcated media. So the Guardian Angels were definitely in the Imaginarium. Two images I remember from my early visits to the city were those dudes in their red berets and a Hell's Angel Club that used to congregate by a police station in the East Village. And they were all guys you didn't around with, but you knew that if you weren't around, you'd be fine. So that's really where Sliwa gets his street cred, which is a real thing. In the early 80s, Ed Koch launched an investigation into them, and the report came back so positive that they basically became or ordained as part of the fabric of the city. Now, later on, Sliwa admitted to lying about some of their supposed heroics, but there were some real ones, too. And he said that he did those ones just to make people aware of the crime problem, which, again, was a real thing. Like, if you can remember the images of just subway cars covered in graffiti on the seats. Like, I rode those cars. I remember that time. That was absolutely real. Silhouette did piss a lot of people off, however, because he was. He was very much like Trump again in the media all the time. In 1992, he was first attacked with a baseball bat, and then two months later, he was shot in a cab by John Gotti's goons. Because Saliwa had talked about Gotti's dad on his radio program, a program that he had until he rage quit just this week because he was so pissed off how much his station was promoting Andrew Cuomo in the last few months. Now we'll see if it sticks because he rage quit while guesting on someone else's show.

[Julian Walker]

I was really hoping you were going to give him his flowers by mentioning him getting shot by the Gotti family. Because to me, he seems a bit like Giuliani and 911 the way he tries to work. I was shot by the Gotti family into every conversation. Right.

[Derek Barris]

Oh, right. He was. But he really was. Yes, he. Absolutely. He will bring that up on in the two debates so far. We're mostly covering the first debate. The second debate was just as funny. He did his don't glazing me thing him, Donnie. But. But he will work it into any question possible to make sure people know. But at the same time, it's just like he doesn't get national press, like, in general. So of course he wants people to. To recognize where his. Where his credibility sort of comes from.

[Julian Walker]

Yeah.

[Derek Barris]

The dude also doesn't appear to be loaded. Which sort of brings us to the title of this episode. Sliwa is a longtime animal rights advocate. He lives in a 320 square foot apartment with his wife and. And 16 cats, all rescued from the streets of New York. In fact, he's turned that into part of his platform because he showed up outside of Eric Adams home with two cats that he said would help the mayor control the rat population.

[Julian Walker]

It's amazing. But hold on. Does this mean he's a childless cat daddy? Is he kind of the. The opposite version of Kamala Harris?

[Derek Barris]

No. He's got three kids.

[Julian Walker]

Okay.

[Derek Barris]

But they're older because he's been married three times.

[Julian Walker]

Okay.

[Derek Barris]

So they're out of the house. So right now, apparently the New Times covered them. I'll drop it in the show notes if you want to read about it. This is from the last time he ran in 2020 against Adams. Yeah, but he. Yeah, that's where he lives in this time. I can imagine sharing an apart 320 square feet with a person. Yeah. Much less 16 cats. And the New York Times reporter in that article noted that it didn't smell in there. And Slila's like, oh, we change the litter three times a day. Which is a Herculean task to actually do that. I couldn't even imagine.

[Julian Walker]

It still doesn't seem like enough with 16 cats.

[Derek Barris]

I know. I don't know how many, because you're supposed to have one litter box for every cat plus one. That's the rule.

[Julian Walker]

Right.

[Derek Barris]

So we have two cats. We have three litter boxes.

[Julian Walker]

Okay.

[Derek Barris]

Right. So you have. Each one has their own, and then you have a safe. So that would mean there would be 17 litter boxes if he was following that convention, which I don't think he is, because that's just too. You don't have enough room in 320 square feet.

[Julian Walker]

Too woke. That's too woke there.

[Derek Barris]

So Sliwa is a Republican in thought, but not in appearance, at least not in maga's America. He's no lover of Mamdani. Let's be clear. He thinks socialism will be the death of the city he loves, which is pretty thick, given how little of it Mamdani will Probably actually be able to accomplish. I mean, hopefully he gets some in. That's the whole point. Because unfettered capitalism has not been great for New York unless you're exceptionally wealthy. And at heart, Saliwa is an old school New Yorker. It means he does not have a filter. Which brings us to the debate. And again, we're talking about the first debate here. How did this dude even earn the Republican nomination for one of the most consequential cities on earth? Well, this time he ran uncontested. New York isn't immune to electing Republicans. Remember, Giuliani and Bloomberg was an independent. Bill de Blasio is the closest thing to an actual Democrat in charge of New York since David Dinkins in the early 90s. Because Eric Adams is certainly not a Democrat. And gasp, Dinkins was a member of the Democratic Socialists of America. The same affiliation as Mamdani. Which makes it funny that all these people are like, we've never had a socialist. It's like, no, you had Dinkins, who very much had similar messaging. Perhaps not as upfront. And again, it wasn't a national race in the 90s, but he was on. He was affiliated with the same party party. And still, despite all of this, no one in the Republican Party stepped up to run against Lewa and the state party endorsed him. So that's how we arrive at this moment. There's a lot of gems from the debate, but I just want to play this one. The question is pretty hilarious itself, yet it does speak to something important to some New Yorkers. You have all said that you want to be mayor for all New Yorkers. So will you march in all the parades that mayors have traditionally marched in, or are there any that you would boycott? Mr. Sliwa, I think a mayor has.

[Curtis Sliwa]

A responsibility, whenever possible, the march in parades to celebrate whatever that parade is performing. As I've been a grand marshal of the Pulaski Day parade, I was proud to celebrate though.

[Derek Barris]

I just need to move this along. Excuse me, would you boycott any of the city's parades?

[Curtis Sliwa]

No, I would not boycott any parade. It's responsibility to be available to all racial, religious. No, I wouldn't. Unless they discriminated.

[Derek Barris]

Okay. Mr. Mamdani, there are many parades that I would not be attending because I'd be focusing on the work of leading this city.

[Curtis Sliwa]

Which parades?

[Derek Barris]

I've already missed a number of those parades because I've been trying to tell us as possible. Okay, I don't have the list of all the parades I've missed.

[Curtis Sliwa]

Wow, that's a lot. May I should be going to all parades.

[Derek Barris]

Let me ask you this. Are there any parades that don't exist that you think should. Mr. Mamdani, I haven't thought much about parades, to be honest with you, Mr. Cuomo.

[Curtis Sliwa]

I have not thought. I don't even know what parade doesn't exist, frankly.

[Derek Barris]

Could be for anything.

[Curtis Sliwa]

Mr. Sliwa, every parade has the right to exist in New York City. I would ask you.

[Derek Barris]

Thank you.

[Curtis Sliwa]

Mr. Mondana, would you protect the Christopher Columbus statues that exist here in the city?

[Derek Barris]

I'm telling you, my focus is on affordability.

[Curtis Sliwa]

I'm not thinking about not answering the question.

[Derek Barris]

Thank you.

[Curtis Sliwa]

He gave the finger to the Columbus Day come up. That's what we call a disgrace.

[Derek Barris]

All parades matter. It's so amazing.

[Julian Walker]

Oh, my God. I mean, now they've got him. They've got him because he's refusing to. He's avoiding the question of which parades he would. He would boycott.

[Derek Barris]

And I think his.

[Julian Walker]

His instincts are really. Are really accurate. Just to like, dismiss. This is not a serious question. I'll be focused on more serious things when I'm mayor. But they're trying to posture, and it's so transparent and superf. I love the pandering toward the Italians. And then also Mamdani's best line in this. In this whole exchange is, I don't.

[Derek Barris]

Have a list of all the parades.

[Julian Walker]

I have not attended. It's perfect.

[Derek Barris]

Someone on Threads decided to dig into Sliwa's claim, hoping to out him. And they only discovered dozens of photos of him as Grand Marshall or a participant in every parade imaginable. This dude loves parades. It should be actually what his platform. You see him with like a bunch of Asian women. You see him at a trans parade. You see it doesn't matter. He is there and in the mix. And he's been doing this apparently for a long time. So the person on Threads is like, look at this. Here he is at every single one. And this actually brings up an interesting paradox that, see, you're not unique to New York City, but it is part of the mindset. The dude founded a vigilante group made up of predominantly black and Latino dudes while New York was experienced is experiencing one of its worst crime waves ever. While he still feels everyone deserves representation, he's literally marching alongside people of every ethnic background imaginable. It points to this very in real life reality that never plays well on social media, where you can always get outed for the slightest possible grievance. And I think sometimes People overlook the fact that that tolerance and acceptance don't always have to require understanding or companionship. And those qualities are still way better than hatred. Sliwa is certainly ignorant about a lot of shit. And I imagine the person that would be the first to say that is Curtis Sliwa.

[Julian Walker]

Yeah, he's. It's like he's a throwback, right? He's a throwback to a time when the patriotic American, like, meat and potatoes thing is to say everyone deserves representation. Everyone deserves to have a parade. I support all of it. Even though, like, I don't hang out with these people or those people necessarily or understand what their. What their platform is about, I'm still going to support it.

[Derek Barris]

Sliwa would be very comfortable sitting in a lounge chair next to Archie Bunker. They would have a great conversation, and then Meathead would come in and Sliwa would agree with him sometimes because being from that part of New York, that is how he would react. And every time in all these debates, he's just like, when Cuomo would agree with him, he said, don't agree with me, you asshole. Like, you're a sexual predator. Like that, that attitude. And again, I just. I bring this up and it's really one of the points that I wanted to do this episode because, again, I'm not endorsing this dude. But when you're in a situation where you. If someone says the wrong word and then a mob comes after that person online and they know who they are in real life, it. It doesn't surprise me that it turns people away from causes. We talk about coalition building all of the time, and it is so reflective of people who don't actually live in places like New York or come from those places that are very diverse. And I am sure I am going to be on the record 100% sure that Sliwa has dropped the N word hundreds of times around the people in the group with him, and they rolled with it and they're like, there's that white dude again, like. And I'm not advocating or endorsing that, but I'm saying in real life, situations and circumstances do not reflect what we see on social media and the way that people think you're supposed to act in all situations. And Sliwa is that character. As hateful as he can be in certain regards, as ignorant as he can be, but also as real as he is. And I think that that sort attitude in the age of authenticity plays so much better than when you're hearing people trying to craft messages all the time. Also going back to that clip, I love both Cuomo and Sleeow revisiting a Sopranos episode with Christopher Columbus. Now, to be clear, that episode is based on something very real. In North Jersey in the Bronx. For some Italian Americans, Columbus is their dude. And this stems from a very real time. It's when Italians were treated as dirty immigrants during the waves of immigration in the 1880s through the 1910s. And since they were like, your country is literally named for one of us, show us some respect. Especially since those immigrants were responsible for a lot of the actual structural building of major cities here. This is all before postcolonial studies were a thing, and I personally think they need to let that go. But it's still pretty funny when it comes to up now after the debate, the rest of the cups I'm going to play come from after the debate, SLA was interviewed by a YouTube journalist named Nate Freeman, who, to be clear on a few things, he's not a fan of V. Donni. He uses his channel to expose hypocrisies on the left. I don't know a lot about his work. I've seen some stuff that I definitely don't agree with, so I'm not endorsing him. I'm only sharing one Response to the question of whether Sliwa is harming Cuomo's chances of beating Mamdani. I think it's a very interesting question. Question. I'm not sure what the two said about Bill Ackman before Friedman's question, but his reply is Sleewa's reply is pure gold. Now for context, Bill Ackman is one of the douchiest billionaires around. He's a supporter of Trump, he supports the Netanyahu government, and he uses his Twitter feed to dunk on anything slightly left of center.

[Curtis Sliwa]

Well, number one, Ackman is a jerk. Has he been right yet? Here's a guy who goes up to Newport, Rhode island and thinks he's a professional tennis player. Come on, Ackman, stay in your lane. Does he know anything about politics? No. Does he live in New York City? No. He lives in Chappa, the whitest suburb of America, where even the lawn jockeys are white. He may know Wall street, he may know hedge funds. He has been wrong every step of the way with the billionaires.

[Derek Barris]

Yeah.

[Julian Walker]

So Ackman is clearly a carpet bagger. And he's just whiter than white. It's. It's amazing how he gets these shots in.

[Derek Barris]

Yeah. And you know, that is actually comes from a Video. And when he. When he says come, like he's talking to Nate Friedman. And when he says, come on, Ackman, he turns to the camera and looks right at it, deadpan. It says that. And again, I just. There's something about someone, like, after the second debate, Sliwa came out and he said that the Republicans have offered him $10 million to drop out of the race.

[Julian Walker]

Wow.

[Derek Barris]

Now again. And now, you know, I don't know if that's true. That's only his claim. You're a dude who lives in a 320ft apartment with 16 cats and your wife, and you're offered that kind of money. I'm sure if that's not actually true, I'm sure there are some incentives that have been given to him to get out of the thing. He's like, all you guys. He even quit. His only source of income that I know of is his radio gig, and he quit that because they were going too hard for Cuomo this week.

[Julian Walker]

So for all of these reasons. For all of these reasons, we are officially endorsing Curtis Lewa for the mayor of New York City.

[Derek Barris]

I'm endorsing him to be on social media more. That's. That's about the only endorsement he's going to get. Because I couldn't even imagine. Well, you know, I couldn't imagine him having any sort of bureaucratic or administrative skills, like, even knowing. I mean, he did run an organization, but I don't know what that entailed.

[Julian Walker]

If he's taking care of 17 litter boxes three times a day, he's got some organizational accumulators of it.

[Derek Barris]

That's a good point. Maybe. Maybe we'll have to reverse our endorsement here. Well, okay, so I clipped one clip into three just for discussion. So here he moves on to Cuomo, which I'm splitting into two parts.

[Curtis Sliwa]

So let's say people come to the conclusion, if somehow I lose and we know Andrew Cuomo's lost, he's already tossed in the town. Oh, it's because of you, Curtis. Because it really. Because of the Democrats.

[Derek Barris]

Wait a second.

[Curtis Sliwa]

Who created Zohan Mondami? Who embraced him, who nourished him, who supported him? And how dare you, people who know nothing about politics suggest that everybody who's going to vote for me is suddenly going to be reborn. We love Andrew Cuomo. He killed all these elderly. He's a sexual harassment. He told conservatives and Republicans. And 2014, if you're a conservative and you believe in right to life and the second Amendment, you have no place in New York. You need to leave. This is the result of the Democrat self destruction.

[Derek Barris]

Wow.

[Julian Walker]

You need to clear this up for me, Derek, because when I hear this whole way, the storytelling, the mocking impersonations, this, this whole kind of extroverted, you know, just say whatever comes to your mind attitude, I'm like, oh, he's. He's kind of like Trump. Is he imitating Trump? And then I'm like, wait, if they're. Are there. Are they just like part cut from the same cloth and it doesn't matter what the political orientation is. They're. This is how that personality type from that particular region of the world does this sort of dance.

[Derek Barris]

Oh, absolutely. And, and you can really see it on the debate stage. And again, returning to my comment on authenticity, you see Zohran laughing at questions. You see Sliwa shaking his head and jumping in be like, what the are you talking about? What you see in Cuomo is someone who grew up in the same environment. He's a New Yorker, but someone who's been trained to be a politician. He grew, I mean, obviously with Mario, his father, he grew up in politics, so he's trained to be very, very poker face, very, you know, and not lash out and, and in certain environments, that has worked before, but in the environment we're in right now, when you see that, you're like, there's no emotion. Like, he was on Cuomo was on Morning Joe and Anan G. Hardis Haradis was interviewing him and went hard with some really good questions.

[Julian Walker]

So good, really good.

[Derek Barris]

Like, not like Sliwa not poking him, but going there in. In a sort of, of, in a roundabout way and just bringing all these accusations without actually saying the thing. And. Same thing. Cuomo just sits there without any emotion whatsoever. And that's not how people actually interact. And sla. So coming from the same environment as Trump and Cuomo, the same, relatively the same age demographic, there's an attitude where you're just like, like, you look at the guy and it's like what he said with Amman. It's like, come on, you know who you are. Quit trying to, quit trying to pretend you're not that person. And Cuomo will not give in. He will not cave. And so he seems very stiff and robotic. Eric Adams also seems very stiff and robotic in those situations. And, and so, and so it creates this real, real difficult thing because you just see these people and you're like, you can tell they're not authentic.

[Julian Walker]

Yeah. And it seems like that's a. That's A big piece of the enthusiasm about Mamdani is that he represent. Presents from the Democrat side something completely different than Democrats are actually getting, you know, really lambasted for over the course of the last year or so, which is that you're, you're, you seem manicured. You seem very cautious in your responses. You don't seem able to like, express anything authentic. We don't know what you really believe or what you're really going to do because you're trying so carefully to make sure you don't offend anybody. Right?

[Derek Barris]

Yeah. And Sliwa, you know, he says this is democratic self destruction. I think he means it in one way, I think it's true in another way. And I think they do intersect. But the way that I think it's true is that you, you have a party that refuses to. I, I mean, Hakeem Jeffries just came out today and is now endorsing Mamdani. But the fact that it took them so long and the fact that the Democratic Party hasn't wanted to touch anything close to socialism, which we're really just talking about, about social services here. Right? Yeah, we're talking about things that'll make like, like it's. It blows my mind that the Democrats go and the whole shutting down the government of health care, which I agree with, and all their messaging is about affordability. And then you have Mundani who's like, oh, here. Here's some ways we can make it more affordable. And like, we can't touch you. And it really shows the hypocrisies that exist within the Democratic Party. And that's where I think, think, like there might be some intersection with Sleewa is saying, like sue was basically saying you guys can't figure your out. And now you have two of you that are running against each other. So you, you. Why are you gonna come at me? I, I actually got the endorsement of my party and I'm represented by them. And you're gonna tell me that I shouldn't be here. That's which he's completely correct on. But I also think that the Democratic Party, you know, and we saw it with Graham Platner. Now obviously that's a whole different story with the past week in the tattoo. But you also see a populist coming out and the Democratic Party refusing to endorse that person. And you can't keep going with the conflicting message. You can't keep saying, we're going to make life more affordable for you. And then when you have people who actually put forward really strong messaging for it. You can't turn from them. Yeah.

[Julian Walker]

I mean, it's. It's this whole dilemma around populism and the media environment that we're in now and the reality that populists come across as more authentic even when they're full of shit, even when they're spreading conspiracy theories and pseudoscience. Right. They're just to. To a huge swath of Americans. They're just more believable and they've become absolutely allergic. Like, the Democratic brand has become toxic in terms of that cautiousness, which we can then say is sort of adjacent to how public health officials try to talk about things like Covid and vacc. So it's just in this real predicament. But I do think that we need Democratic candidates who have that authenticity and who are leaning into that populist appeal while maintaining integrity and, you know, being connected to facts.

[Derek Barris]

Right. And it's interesting watching both Mamdani and Platner, because Platner comes from, you know, the military and working for Blackwater and. But also, apparently historically, seeming also left on issues. And now he's forced to play politics in a way that I don't think he expected he would have to. And you're seeing Mamdani do the same thing, like, you know, having to go to synagogues. He was on Flagrant this week, which I'm sure part of the leftist base hated, but he was very comfortable in that environment because he can move through circles very easy because he comes from New York City again, which is somewhere where you have to move through numerous circles.

[Julian Walker]

Yeah. And he's not going on a podcast like Flagrant thinking, well, I have to give XYZ kind of performance, and I better not say abc. He's just, just like, I'm going to go on and talk about what I think and what I believe and where I'm coming from. He's very, very good at that.

[Derek Barris]

Yeah, he's excellent. And so, I mean, that is one thing the Democratic Party really needs to learn from. Because, I mean, he's moving, I don't want to say moving to the center, but he is moving toward becoming a more establishment type politician. Because how are you going to run a city where you have to have relationships with the fire department and the police department, where you have to have relationships with Wall street, where you have to have. Have relationships with the Jewish population and having a past like that, like you have to build some bridges at some point. And so watching him, you know, he does seem to be a Little bit more careful with his language and his messaging now, which I know pisses some people off, but that is actually what we've talked about for a long time in coalition building. And what do you sacrifice and what do you keep? And that's, that's a question that, I mean the Democratic Party as a whole has to answer right now. But you have to be willing to engage with people that you think are coming from the populist side, especially because their messages resonate with most of us, at least non maga. Most of us. Okay, so let's wrap it up. Let's play the second part of that exchange.

[Curtis Sliwa]

So I'm supposed to help them. How come they don't help themselves? Andrew Cuomo failed everybody in that primary. He even admitted it. Now he's basically saying, I can't win without slew of votes. Where are your votes? Why don't you spend your money? And they got millions from the billionaires. Millions go out, get your own votes, convert slew of voters. But for me to drop out, I represent a major party line. I have people running under me. Council people, judges. They put their heart and soul into it. They support me. I have more donations than Andrew Cuomo does matching funds. So you, you know something, this is called voting. Since when do we not let people vote? Billionaires determine the next mayor. If they don't like it, they can leave. They have options. Blue collar, working class people don't. Those are the people I'm representing, not Andrew Cuoman.

[Julian Walker]

Yeah, it's so interesting. It's like his, his messaging is almost straddling into Mamdani's lane. Even though we know that blue collar people didn't. Really. Aren't really the ones responsible for Mamdani winning that primary. Right. I'm also, I'm not so sure that all the people down ticket would really give a shit if Curtis Levi dropped out. But you know, what do I know that's true.

[Derek Barris]

But what he's saying is if you're voting party line, like I am the party. But I mean, yeah, he's, he's self aggrandized. Aggrandizing a little bit there. But, but that was honestly like. What I love about that moment is it's one of the clearest explanations of what democracy is supposed to be. And it's just, he's just like, like you just think people are going to rush to you if they, if I drop out, that's not, they won't, they won't come out. They, you know, they're, they're not, they're not going to either going to stay at home or they're going to write in me or something else like don't just assume that. And, and I just love that one line where he's, he's like, then convert them. Take them from me. Go for it. Let's see what you can do. Here we have the Limu Emu in its natural habitat, helping people customize their car insurance and save hundreds of with Liberty Mutual.

[Curtis Sliwa]

Fascinating. It's accompanied by his natural ally, Doug.

[Julian Walker]

Uh, Limu is that guy with the binoculars watching us?

[Derek Barris]

Cut the camera.

[Curtis Sliwa]

They see us.

[Derek Barris]

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[Matthew Remsky]

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[Derek Barris]

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