Big Ten Show: Penn State Coaching Search | USC-Notre Dame | Washington-Michigan | Cover 3 College Football

Summary

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Cover 3 College Football Podcast

Episode: Big Ten Show: Penn State Coaching Search | USC-Notre Dame | Washington-Michigan

Date: October 14, 2025
Hosts: Chip Patterson, Tom Fornelli, Danny Kanell, Bud Elliott

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Overview

This week, the Cover 3 crew dives into a pivotal stretch for the Big Ten, hot on the heels of Penn State's headline-making coaching change. The episode features in-depth analysis of the Penn State search and coaching carousel implications, followed by previews and insights for major Week 8 matchups: USC at Notre Dame, Washington at Michigan, and Ohio State at Wisconsin. The group also spotlights key players to watch entering this critical phase of the college football season.

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Table of Contents

1. Penn State Coaching Search After James Franklin
2. USC vs. Notre Dame: Quarterback Duel and Matchups
3. Washington at Michigan: Reactions and X-Factors
4. Ohio State at Wisconsin: Buckeye Dominance and Mentality
5. Players to Watch in Big Ten Week 8

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<a name="penn-state"></a>

1. Penn State Coaching Search After Firing James Franklin

Discussion starts: [00:29]
Key Segment: [03:53]–[11:43]

Main Theme

• Penn State's decision to fire James Franklin after a 3-3 start and a decade-long era filled with highs and shortcomings prompts a deep-dive into the next head coach candidates and program trajectory.

Key Insights & Discussion Points

• Pat Kraft, Penn State AD Soundbite

  • "When you've made the decision, you have to make the decision with a whole heart and with conviction… I'm here to win national championship and I believe our fans deserve that." – Pat Kraft [03:53-04:27]

• Coaching Candidates: Each host pitches a name

  • Tom Fornelli: Matt Campbell (Iowa State)
    • "If you look at the footprint of the Big Ten and a coach with experience in the area who understands the area, I think Matt Campbell is a perfect fit." [05:14]
    • Lauded for development and culture building, especially at tough programs.
  • Bud Elliott: Eli Drinkwitz (Missouri)
    • “He scores a lot of points... He's been pretty progressive on the NIL front, embraces recruiting, and replaces coordinators well. I think there's some chance he could actually level up James Franklin, which is hard to do." [06:27]
  • Danny Kanell: Kirk Cignetti (Indiana)
    • “He's got somebody who’s won at every level. He’s a culture builder… brings swag in there... the obvious choice if Matt Rhule says no.” [07:09]
  • Chip Patterson: Matt Rhule (Nebraska)
    • “Those are emotions and an emotional hire right now—that’s gonna be Matt Rhule. So I will submit Matt Rhule as the name right here.” [08:46]
    • Notes Rhule's non-denial at his presser; emphasizes the Penn State connection and immediate fit.

• Potential “already done”?

  • Danny: “I think it’s so obvious that you might already have it in place… maybe the only two people that know—maybe not even agents—are Pat Kraft and Matt Rhule…” [10:13]
  • Speculates on a possible coach-QB combo if Dylan Raiola follows Rhule.

Notable Quote

"You're going to drop $50 million to send James Franklin packing without having a plan in place, at least some assurance? …That's the type of thing that I think you have to see unfolding here."
— Danny Kanell [10:13]

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2. USC vs. Notre Dame: QB Duel and Matchups

Discussion starts: [14:42]
Key Segment: [15:22]–[23:56]

Main Theme

• The storied rivalry gets renewed with major playoff implications and one of the season’s best quarterback matchups: Jaden Maiava (USC) vs. CJ Carr (Notre Dame).

Key Insights & Discussion Points

• Quarterback Comparison

  • Danny Kanell: “Both have over-exceeded expectations… I think CJ Carr has probably been one of the best surprises of the true first-year starting quarterbacks.” [15:22]
  • Bud Elliott: “Guys, he [CJ Carr] has looked elite… He's actually aggressively pushing the ball down the field.” [16:20]
  • Tom Fornelli: “If you’re asking me which one I take for the future, I’m taking CJ Carr. If you’re asking me which one I want right now, I’m taking Maiava.” [17:09]

• Defense Talk

  • Notre Dame’s D has allowed ZERO second-half points in three straight games, but opponents (Arkansas, Boise State, NC State) are a factor.
  • Bud Elliott: “They have plugged the leak. The boat is no longer sinking… They had the unfortunate luck of playing the two best offensive lines in the country in Miami and Texas A&M in Weeks 1 and 2.” [19:23]

• Key Matchups & Vegas Line

  • Notre Dame is a significant favorite at home.
  • Tom Fornelli: “USC on the road has been a very different team than USC at home… they're giving up over 34 points per game on the road.” [20:56]
  • Danny Kanell: “This is the best running back tandem in the country, potentially…Jeremiah Love and Jadarian Price." [22:11]
  • Bud Elliott: "Notre Dame's defense is better coached than Michigan's defense… if you’re USC, the key is getting Makai Lemon on the slot defender for the Irish. That has repeatedly been a pain point for Notre Dame this year. Makai Lemon is basically uncoverable.” [23:11]

Notable Quote

"C.J. Carr is playing better than almost all of these returning guys we thought maybe had a chance to level up and get high in the NFL Draft.”
— Bud Elliott [16:20]

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3. Washington at Michigan: Reactions and X-Factors

Discussion starts: [24:42]
Key Segment: [25:21]–[31:54]

Main Theme

• Michigan faces a bounce-back challenge after getting beat physically by USC. Washington looks to prove itself with its QB and offense against a traditionally dominant Wolverines line.

Key Insights & Discussion Points

• Michigan’s Struggles vs. USC

  • Tom Fornelli: “They got beat up on the lines of scrimmage by the old soft USC Trojans… Bryce Underwood just did not play well… they blitzed the hell out of Bryce Underwood and he did not look comfortable dealing with it." [25:21]
  • Bud Elliott: “Michigan just is getting whipped this year at times on the offensive line… I am surprised how much they've fallen off there.” [26:44]
  • Danny Kanell: “They gave up 200 yards rushing to USC. Like, that's something you cannot allow to happen against Washington.” [27:26]

• Can Washington Land a Punch?

  • Danny Kanell: "Demon Williams is a problem for a lot of teams… and you've got the weapons to work with like Jonah Coleman and Boston on the outside. Absolutely." [29:15]
  • Bud Elliott: “I think if Justice Haynes is banged up then certainly Washington is better at running back. So yeah, I'm absolutely buying [Washington].” [30:02]
  • Tom Fornelli (skeptical): “Watching Washington this year… I need to see them do it. I need to see them get off to a much better start in the first half than they have been.” [30:35]

• Michigan’s Mentality

  • The hosts joke about Michigan's “blue collar” imagery as a rallying cry, but Chip notes, “I think Sherron Moore probably feels some pressure… this is a big game for Moore.” [28:26]

Notable Quote

“All you gotta do is put on a jacket with your name on it, look like the gas station worker going back to work. But it is sort of alarming to see them not as physically dominant as they've been in years past.”
— Danny Kanell [28:11]

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4. Ohio State at Wisconsin: Buckeye Dominance and Mentality

Discussion starts: [33:47]
Key Segment: [35:26]–[42:39]

Main Theme

• The Buckeyes roll into Madison as 24.5-point favorites, looking every bit the best team in the country, but the main threat may be their own complacency.

Key Insights & Discussion Points

• Avoiding Letdowns and Complacency

  • Tom Fornelli: “Are we letdown proof? …Can you keep your eyes on the prize? Because if you start looking into the numbers, Ohio State won comfortably. But offensively, that was their worst performance of the season since that opener against Texas.” [35:26]
  • Bud Elliott: “Come out, beat them early... Get the young guys into the game early because your starters got in and took care of business on the road.” [36:59]
  • Danny Kanell: “I kind of want to see them get uncomfortable. Like, I want to see them tested. And I don't think you see it here.” [37:43]
  • Chip Patterson: “This is a mentality thing. …Now you're starting to get some flowers, now you're starting to look around… you are hoping to go in and...make the corrections from what happened during that game against Illinois.” [39:14-40:50]

• Biggest Weakness?

  • Tom Fornelli: “Boredom. Like, they're extremely bored… the next time this team will be truly tested is in the Big Ten championship game.” [40:50]
  • Danny Kanell: “You look at weaknesses, I don't know if they have them. I think that's why they're Tom's pick, why they're the odds makers pick.” [41:28]
  • Bud Elliott: “I think Ohio State has done a really good job of replacing what it had last year on the lines of scrimmage. But I don't think they're better along the lines of scrimmage this year than they were last year.” [42:00]
  • Chip Patterson: "If I am picking nits, where the whole spreadsheet is dark green... if they are forced to run the football in a situation, that would be the one spot where they can improve." [42:39]

Notable Quote

“Their biggest weakness is boredom.”
— Tom Fornelli [40:50]

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<a name="players-to-watch"></a>

5. Players to Watch in Big Ten Week 8

Discussion starts: [44:45]

• Tom Fornelli: Emmett Johnson (Nebraska RB)
  “He is currently second in the Big Ten in rushing yards with 650. He has seven rushing touchdowns and he's also proven to be a useful option out of the backfield in the passing game… not getting nearly enough attention.” [44:45]

• Bud Elliott: Makai Lemon (USC WR)
  “If USC is going to win this game, they probably need to score… Makai Lemon is just one of the best receivers in all of college football.” [45:29]

• Danny Kanell: King Miller (USC RB)
  "Waymond Jordan out. Eli Sanders out. For USC steps King Miller, freshman walk-on. Who went off for over 150 yards against Michigan... their run game has to be serviceable to at least keep them honest. So I'm all eyes on the freshman." [45:51]

• Chip Patterson: Ethan Gronkermeyer (Penn State QB)
  “[Gronkermeyer] was a four-star prospect coming out of high school…they were really hoping that he wasn't going to step in until 2026 and beyond.” [46:16]

  • Bud Elliott adds: “He can move around a little bit, he can get the ball around. He's certainly one of the higher rated guys in that class… It's hard to project. Some of them will hit, some of them will not.” [46:59]

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Memorable Moments & Quotes

• Danny Kanell on the coaching carousel:
  “The dominoes that could fall could be massive. And some more hot seat situations to monitor in the coming weeks mean that, yes, we are setting up for a wild coaching carousel.” [11:43]

• Tom Fornelli's future lean:
  “If you're asking me which one I take for the future, I'm taking CJ Carr. If you're asking me which one I want right now, I'm taking Maiava.” [17:09]

• Bud Elliott on Notre Dame's defense:
  "They have plugged the leak. The boat is no longer sinking. I don't know if it's ready to sail around the globe yet." [19:23]

• On Michigan's blue-collar messaging:
  “All you gotta do is put on a jacket with your name on it, look like the gas station worker going back to work. But it does…seeing them not as physically dominant as they’ve been in years past.”
  — Danny Kanell [28:11]

• On Ohio State:
  “This is a mentality thing… you are hoping to go in and you're trying to make the corrections from what happened during that game against Illinois.”
  — Chip Patterson [39:14]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Penn State Coaching Search: [03:53]–[11:43]
• USC vs. Notre Dame Preview (QBs & matchups): [15:22]–[23:56]
• Washington at Michigan: [25:21]–[31:54]
• Ohio State at Wisconsin: [35:26]–[42:39]
• Players to Watch: [44:45]–[47:22]

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Tone and Style

The episode balances wisecracking camaraderie with sharp, evidence-backed analysis. The hosts offer honest assessments, frequent debates, and a focus on both tactical X's-and-O's and the higher-level storylines & program direction that matter most to Big Ten and college football fans.

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For full, real-time analysis and ongoing updates, follow Cover 3's schedule on YouTube and the CBS Sports Network.

Transcript

[Chip Patterson]

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[Chip Patterson]

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[Bud Elliott]

When you've made the decision, you have.

[Tom Fornelli]

To make the decision with a whole.

[Bud Elliott]

Heart and with conviction.

[Danny Cannell]

And so, you know, I was going.

[Chip Patterson]

To sleep on it on Sunday and.

[Bud Elliott]

But I knew it was the right course of action for us as a.

[Tom Fornelli]

Program and more importantly for the team. This is not a three game thing.

[Bud Elliott]

This is really diving into where we were as a program.

[Chip Patterson]

What is the trajectory of this program? And, and you all know, and I'm.

[Danny Cannell]

Not shy to admit it, I'm here.

[Bud Elliott]

To win national championship and I believe.

[Chip Patterson]

Our fans deserve that.

[Danny Cannell]

And I wake up every day trying.

[Bud Elliott]

To achieve that goal.

[Chip Patterson]

All right, Patrick. Well, I know that you're a big fan of the COVID 3 podcast, so you understand that we are available as a coaching search service. We will undercut everybody else around. We will provide equal work. And now we're giving it to you for free. So, Tom Fornelli, I'll let you go first. Let's provide for Pat Craft and Penn State. Who is the candidate that you would like to have their attention on?

[Tom Fornelli]

The top candidate on my board of available options that I think Penn State could actually lure away to take the job is Iowa State's Matt Campbell. I think if you look at what Matt Campbell has done at IOW.

[Chip Patterson]

Has.

[Tom Fornelli]

Been very difficult to win football games at, yet he's been winning a lot of games there in recent years. He's had some up and down years, but he's also had some of the best seasons in program history. And I think if you look at it from a culture perspective, from a program building perspective, and from particularly from a development Perspective. He checks a whole heck of a lot of boxes that Penn State should be looking for. And he's also, you know, an Ohio native. So if you look at the footprint of the Big Ten and a coach with experience in the area who understands the area, I think Matt Campbell is a perfect fit. And one of the areas I think that really shows out is last year, Iowa State had two NFL, you know, draft picks at the receiver position and Matt Campbell's position at Iowa State. The entire time he's had four wide receivers drafted, which is almost as many as Penn State has had in James Franklin's entire tenure. Except the difference is when Matt Campbell got him, they were three star players and he turned them into NFL players. Penn State's biggest problem has been getting talented players at those positions and developing them into NFL talent. Lately, I think that's something he would. I think that you would still continue to see Penn State churning NFL players out year after year all across the board.

[Danny Cannell]

So I think it's really.

[Bud Elliott]

I love that one. Good.

[Danny Cannell]

No, go ahead, go ahead.

[Bud Elliott]

No, Tom. I think it's a really great pick. I mean, like, I'm going to go with Eli Drinkwich, though, the head coach at Missouri. Seven straight bowl games here. If you look at it, what is one of James Franklin's main problems? He doesn't score points. Eli Drinkwood is a guy who. Who scores a lot of points. His teams compete at Missouri. He's going to win 30 games in three years at Missouri. That's really hard to do. He's been pretty progressive on the nil front. The guy embraces recruiting. Also, one of the hallmark of good coaches is that they have to replace coordinators. They do so repeatedly in good fashion. He lost his DC to lsu. He's lost his oc. He's made good hires there to replace both those guys. I think there's some chance he could actually level up James Franklin, which is really hard to do.

[Danny Cannell]

All right, so I think I might be taking crazy pills because how do we head to this point? We've had two guys off the board so far, and two of the most obvious names aren't there. And I know Tom put it out there that you can lure away. This is Penn State. You should be able to lure almost anybody away from any of those programs. So I'm going to go with one of the names that has been speculated. I think there's only two names that have to be the home run hires. I'm going to go Kirk Signetti, what he's done in Indiana and not only Indiana, going back to when he was an assistant coach at Alabama. And he said, you know what? I'm tired of being an assistant. I'm going to go take a Division 2 job. He goes and wins at that level. He goes and wins at Elon. He goes and wins at James Madison. And then he's made Indiana into a powerhouse program in college football in just two years. I think this is the obvious choice. If Matt Rule says no, I think it's got to be Kirk Signetti. He's got somebody who's won at every level. He's a culture builder. I think he can take the culture to the next level to make it a championship level. He brings an automatic amount of swag in there. He brings pedigree. Kirk Signetti would be my guy.

[Chip Patterson]

I don't think there's a culture problem at Penn State. I think this program is pretty healthy. I think that whoever walks in, they are inheriting a good program. Whoever walks in doesn't need to change a lot of stuff. They just need to be able to level up and maybe even just a change of voice. So what about a voice that's familiar? What about a voice that grew up there? What about a voice that loves and adores this university? You got it. Urban Meyer. No, I'm just kidding. It's not Urban Meyer.

[Tom Fornelli]

It's not Urban.

[Chip Patterson]

It is Matt Rule. Of course it's Matt Rule. And I tell you what, we saw Matt Rule address it on Monday at the press conference. Not a denial. We know that Matt Rule is someone who is well regarded across college football circles. Taking over at a place like Penn State, given where Penn State is right now, is not at all the same thing as trying to get Temple up to competitiveness. It's not at all the same thing as leading Baylor out of the darkness or even taking a Nebraska program that had slipped so far from anything close to what the program Standard was in its heyday. No, he's got a Penn State program that has been knocking on the door. If you're Matt Rule, this is an incredible opportunity. And if you're Penn State, you've already made an incredibly emotional decision, because logic and sense throw them out the window. Logic and sense don't say you move on. James Franklin. We heard from Pat Kraft right there, and he even said, yeah, I was gonna sleep on it, but I just decided to make the decision. Those are emotions and an emotional hire right now. That's gonna be Matt Rule. So I will submit Matt Rule as. As the name right here. Danny, you Mentioned Rule there off the top. And in addition to your Kurt Signetti, are you. Do you think that that is the sensible choice or do you think that it is one of those it just seems so obvious we might end up there situation?

[Danny Cannell]

I think it's so obvious that you might already have it in place. Like you're, like this was. I mean, if you're Pat Kraft, you're really going to drop 50 million to send James Franklin packing without having a plan in place, at least having some assurance. And this is maybe the only two people that know, maybe not even agents, are Pat Craft and Matt Rule. It is a simple phone call because maybe you don't even leave a trail. Hey, man, we got an issue. Would you come here? Yeah, we'll figure it out later. Done. See you later. That's the type of thing that I think you have to see unfolding here. Not to mention if on that phone call you could say, do you think your quarterback could come with you? And I know there's some split decisions even on this, split opinions on Dylan Raiola as far as just how good he could be. But I think that would infuse a fan base as well. To be able to get a coach and quarterback combo like Matt Rule and Dylan Raiola, then all of a sudden you would see this team be probably a preseason top five pick again with a lot of excitement without losing any momentum of what they brought with James Franklin. That's been completely lost this year. So, yeah, I think Matt Rule is the most obvious choice. Chip, you mentioned as presser, I love Penn State. I love the time there. Don't want to say anything bad about Nebraska. And I don't even know if Nebraska fans would be that upset. I mean, I guess they'd be upset, but they'd be like, we get it. It's your school. You played there. And then Nebraska would be the next team we're talking about. But I do think Matt Rule is probably the most obvious right in front of our face choice.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah, right there. You saw on the screen the list of jobs that are already open. The dominoes that could fall could be massive. And some more hot seat situations to monitor in the coming weeks mean that, yes, we are setting up for a wild coaching carousel. Well, coming up on the other side, we turn our attention to the field, specifically to the USC Trojans, who are back in the top 25 and back in the mix for the College Football Playoff. They've got just one loss, but they've got a huge game at Notre Dame. We'll take you inside the matchup of the Trojans and the Fighting Irish and more.

[Bud Elliott]

Next.

[Chip Patterson]

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[Danny Cannell]

Carolina basketball isn't just a program, it's a legacy. I'm John Henson and we'll be the.

[Bud Elliott]

Host of Tar Heel 247, a UNC basketball podcast for fans who bleed Carolina blue. Each week I'll be joined by players, coaches and insiders for real unfiltered conversations.

[Danny Cannell]

About the team, the tradition, maybe some.

[Bud Elliott]

Funny stories and everything in between.

[Chip Patterson]

No filters, no fluff, just hoop talk.

[Bud Elliott]

The Tar Heel way.

[Chip Patterson]

Subscribe now to Tar Heel 247 at.

[Bud Elliott]

UNC Basketball Podcast or wherever you get your podcast at.

[Danny Cannell]

We will have a good time.

[Chip Patterson]

Let's get ready to go back here on the COVID 3 podcast live on CBS Sports Network, turning our attention for Inside the Matchup Big game breakdown for USC and Notre Dame. Now it is a rivalry with a murky future, but we're going to put all that to the side because we're concerned about the Jimmy's, the Joes, the X's, the O's, the way this game is going to be played out. Now, I want to start with a really, really fun quarterback matchup. So let's start with our quarterback. Let's go, Danny. Bud. Tom, how do you look at these two quarterbacks? What you've seen so far, both Jaden Maa for USC and CJ Carr for.

[Danny Cannell]

Notre Dame, I think both have over exceeded expectations at least with Jaden Mav, we thought, you know, hey, he's going to take that next step. It's Lincoln Riley. He had spoken highly of him. We saw a glimpse of him last year, but I think even he has played better than I think you could have hoped for for a USC team. And then with CJ Carr, I mean there was a tight competition in camp. How is he going to look? He comes out against Miami and they played a little bit tight to the vest. Remember the first couple series, they're throwing a lot of bubble screens, keeping him, you know, pretty tight, tight reins on him, but he's playing as good as anybody out there, so. And it helps to have a run game like they do, but he's managing the system, he's seeing the field well, he's getting good protection, he's showing good mobility. I think CJ Carr has probably been one of the best surprises of the true first year starting quarterbacks. He's playing as good as anybody. He's playing as good as a lot of veteran quarterbacks too. It's a fun matchup.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, Danny, I was going to say, I mean C.J. carr is playing better than almost all of these returning guys. We thought maybe had a chance to level up and get to the, you know, get high in the NFL draft after that kind of shaky Week 1 against Miami, which in hindsight turns out it was, you know, his first, you know, career start. And two, Miami's defense is really, really good. Guys, he has looked elite. I mean he as a recruit was never afraid to make big time throws and like he has continued to do that. Like he's actually aggressively put, you know, pushing the ball down the field. He's dropping in a bucket like, man, I don't know who else you think in the country is actually playing better right now than C.J. carr. Maybe it's my EVA for USC, maybe it's Simpson for Alabama, but maybe it's Mendoza for Indiana. But the list is quite short and he certainly belongs on it.

[Tom Fornelli]

I think if you're asking me which one I take for the future, I'm taking CJ Carr. If you're asking me which one I want right now, I'm taking my Ava. Because you know, C.J. carr has been playing great the last few weeks after a slow start against Texas A and M in Miami. But the fact of the matter is C.J. carr had a slow start against Texas A and M in Miami. Miami, the two best teams that Notre Dame has faced this year, even in USC's one loss this season at Illinois, certainly wasn't on Jade Maeva. He played very well in that game. It's their defense that could knock it off the field. And he played well again last week against Michigan when they were able to play much better and get probably their biggest win of the Big Ten era. So I don't think Mayava is as talented as C.J. carr. Like, I don't think they have the same NFL futures, but I also think he has a lot better players around him, particularly in the passing game. I think if you stack up USC's receivers with Notre Dames, I think I know which way the three of you would all lean as to who has the edge in that department. So I think that has helped him. I think he looks really good in that offense and I think for this one matchup I give my the edge doesn't mean he's going to play play better than Carr because Carr may outplay him this week. But I just think overall I lean myava right now.

[Chip Patterson]

Is it the best just like snap call nods? Best quarterback matchup on the board for week eight?

[Bud Elliott]

Yes, yes, I think so.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah, but it's one of the best of the year. Yeah, we'll say hopefully it lives up to it. Look, there's a, there's an interesting storyline, but I want to hear from you first on this because you, you often do a good job of helping us put in context some of the raw numbers. So let me give you some raw numbers. After a really hideous start to the season, here is what Notre Dame's defense has done the last three times out. Just 13 points allowed in the first half, zero in the second. Then game number two, seven points allowed in the first half, 0 in the second game. Number three seven points allowed in the first half,. 0 in the second. That is zero second half points allowed the last three games and just 27 total points allowed over the last three games. So Bud Elliott, I ask you, is Notre Dame's defense fixed? Has it gotten better or is that just the aspect of playing against opponents that you are more more favorable matchup against Arkansas, Boise State and NC State.

[Bud Elliott]

So Chip, I think they have plugged the leak. The boat is no longer sinking. I don't know if it's ready to sail around the globe yet. Really, if you look at it, Notre Dame had the unfortunate luck of playing what in my opinion are probably the two best offensive lines in the country in Miami and Texas A and M in weeks one and two. And honestly, Arkansas has a pretty nice offensive line this year as well. You know, Purdue does not. Boise certainly does not. You see, you saw usf. You really kind of punk them on national TV early in the season and I don't think NC State's offensive line is particularly great this year. So Notre Dame like finding a way to get home with its defensive line and not having to ask its younger secondary this year to cover for quite as long has been the most important part of this turnaround. I think for the Irish, USC is probably it's definitely not quite as good up front as Miami and Texas A and M, but they still have a lot of firepower on the outsides and their offensive line is is decent enough. They clearly blocked Michigan last week.

[Chip Patterson]

All right, so if we're going to think that the Notre Dame offense, Notre Dame defense has taken a step forward. Tom, how do you think that Notre Dame fares in this setup, which is again like we talk about the importance for USC, Notre Dame's College Football Playoff hopes after starting 02 really ride on being able to take care of business. We'll do best bets on Thursday. Obviously in our LOCKS episode, Notre Dame's a heavy favorite here at home, or at least by more than one score. Do you agree with the assessment that they are the the team that should be out there as more than a touchdown favorite?

[Tom Fornelli]

Well, first of all, I will say with a bold proclamation that Notre Dame's defense will allow a point in the second half this week because the USC offense is much better than any of the ones they faced in their last four games. So I have a hard time seeing a shot on the second half. As for the spread, I think that if you just look at the two teams as pure neutral site, no, Notre Dame should not be nearly this large of a favorite over usc. The problem is, USC on the road has been a very different team than USC at home under Lincoln Riley. This is a team that is barely over.500 when they have left the column or the confines of the Coliseum. In Lincoln Riley's tenure, they're giving up over 34 points per game when they are on the road. So it's hard to imagine that they are, you know, going to be able to really get the stops that they need. But the good news is, based on what I saw last week against Michigan, the USC defense, especially up front, looked fantastic in that game. Now maybe that says more about Michigan's offensive line in the long run than it does about usc. We'll find out this week. But if that defense that showed up last week is the same one they take on the plane with them to South Bend, I do think the Trojans will be able to make this a very good game because we have to see if Notre Dame will be able to run the ball so effectively against this USC defense as it has against other people that aren't named Miami and Texas A and M. Yeah, I mean.

[Danny Cannell]

This is the best running back tandem in the country, potentially. Jeremiah I love and Jadarian Price that they're going to have to defend. So that obviously comes into play and that's going to help C.J.

[Bud Elliott]

Carr.

[Danny Cannell]

And then on the other side of the ball, you have to consider with, with the injuries that USC has been dealing with along the offensive line and now all of a sudden their running back depth has been decimated as well. Unfortunately, USC is going to be playing a little bit shorthanded, so that's something that I think is coming to play in this line too. And we'll find out just about how, how deep USC goes. But I do worry. Defense has been really good. I think this is the best offense they will have faced and it's going to like. Seeing them get pushed around by Illinois was one thing because I think Illinois did on both sides of the ball handle them physically. Maybe it does say more about Michigan, which might be a little bit more concerning, but they were a little bit one dimensional with Bryce Underwood still like him long term, I still think that's easier to fend to defend than it is going to be against that running game and C.J. carr. That's going to be a big, big challenge for USC's defense.

[Bud Elliott]

I, I also think Notre Dame's defense is better coached than Michigan's defense. And I think if you're Notre Dame, you like having to see USC sort of empty the cliff, if you will, against Michigan. Like that was a had to have it game at home for Lincoln Riley. They busted out their best stuff. Not that Lincoln Riley and Officer Genius won't have more stuff going forward for this Irish game, but certainly Notre Dame has defended them, you know, pretty well under Marcus Freeman. In years past. I think if you're usc, the key is getting Makai Lemon on the slot defender for the Irish. That has repeatedly been a pain point for Notre Dame this year. Makai Lemon is basically uncoverable as Tom's a lot and I saw in that game and I don't know that Notre Dame can stick with him one on one. So how creative can Lick and Riley be to get him matched up against that sort of undermanned slot position for the Irish defense?

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah, big, big game. And you mentioned those injury issues. I mean it's we're dressing guys at halftime. I mean we are doing anything that we can to be able to get warm bodies out of the sands. You're selling popcorn. Congratulations, you're on pump block. That's just kind of where we're at for USD. So we'll be sure to keep an eye on all the latest and again we'll do our best bets with more injury updates as we know them later in the week on the COVID 3 podcast. YouTube.com cover3 to watch the locks live. Well, coming up on the other side, let's do take a second assessment about the Michigan Wolverines because now they are in a little bit of a gotta have it game welcoming Washington to the big house. We'll take you inside the matchup X factors and more next back here on the COVID 3 podcast live on CBS Sports Network. Taking a look inside some of the biggest matchups in the Big Ten for week eight. And we've got a bounce back spot for the Michigan Wolverines. They're playing at home. They've got Washington coming into town. We got our west coast team playing in the early slate on Saturday. But forget your time zones. I need to go inside what happened last week. So let's start with the Michigan side of this. Let's go Tom. Bud, Danny, what went wrong for the Michigan Wolverines in a double digit loss to usc?

[Tom Fornelli]

I would say primarily the fact that they got beat up on the lines of scrimmage by the old soft USC Trojans or at least you know, the narrative that has hung around USC for years. The, the Trojans really beat them up there. But I think the other spot you have to look at is Bryce Underwood just did not play well. And we were talking on the show last week about how much better Bryce Underwood is starting to look, how much more comfortable he is starting to get in that Michigan offense and how he was starting to find a rhythm and a flow and that all kind of disappeared against USC last week. And I think the Reason for it was, if we go back to Michigan's first loss of the year on the road against Oklahoma, what did Brent Venables do? He did the thing he always does. He blitzed the hell out of the quarterback and especially a young one in his first road start. It was very effective. What did USC do last week? They blitzed the hell out of Bryce Underwood and he did not look comfortable dealing with it. And it was the most that Michigan had dealt with the blitz since that Oklahoma game. And it was Bryce Underwood's worst performance since that game. So I think that's the one thing that they'll probably need to address in practice this week, getting ready for this one, because we also saw Washington last week. They blitzed on over 50% of Rutgers's drop backs on offense. I think you're going to see a very similar plan from a Washington defense that's been a little banged up on that side of the ball and has had to find ways to generate pressure through the blitz. Will they bring that same kind of pressure on the road with them to Michigan? I suspect they will until Bryce Underwood proves he's capable of beating it.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah. You know, Tom, when I look at this, I, I'm a little bit higher on Underwood in that game, but I agree it wasn't his best game. I, I look at what they did on the interior offensive line. Michigan just is getting whipped this year at times on the offensive line like they do. They are not. Which is surprising. Right. With Sharon Moore being the former offensive line guy, I'm surprised how much they've fallen off there. They're starting guard had a PFF grade of 45, their starting center a PFF grade of 53. Like USC just out physical them. And that, that's, that's got to be pretty concerning if you're Michigan because I don't know if that gets fixed in a given week. But Washington, you know, not quite as physical on the defensive line of scrimmage as USC was. So maybe there is some hope there.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah, I mean, it feels weird to say this, but I totally agree with you guys. They got out physical by usc. Like this is a team that typically imposes its will on most teams, including Ohio State. Like that's why they've had this run of four years straight and now all of a sudden they're not. You had, you gave up 200 yards rushing to USC. Like that's something you cannot allow to happen against Washington. So I think clearly they need to step up. It's the reason Charon Moore is talking about. He's wearing the blue collar. We're going back to our mentality where we got to dominate up front. All you got to do is put on a jacket with your name on it, look like the gas station worker going back to work. But it does. I mean, it is sort of alarming to see them not as physically dominant as they've been in years past.

[Chip Patterson]

Thank you for bringing that up, Danny, because I had a similar reaction to our 1962 go grab a soda pop from the gas station and crank it off the edge while you get your car filled up. America, right?

[Bud Elliott]

What?

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah. You know what that tells me? Honestly, I think Sherron Moore probably feels some pressure. I mean, the two games that he was gone, two good wins for the Michigan Wolverines. So this is a big game for more. But what about the other side, Danny? Does Washington, I want to say, do they have the horses, but I should say, do they have the dogs for the Huskies? But does Washington have the players to do it? Do they have the team to go into the big house early kickoff and be able to land a punch, a haymaker? That would a, I think, be a huge piece of sort of Washington continuing to have an impact here on the Big Ten in the early years of its membership, but then also, of course, create a lot of talking points for the Wolverines moving forward. Do you see Washington being able to get the early win they got?

[Danny Cannell]

I mean, Demon Williams is a problem for a lot of teams, and granted he was held in check by Ohio State, but we're talking about Ohio State maybe being the best defense in the entire country. And I don't care who the opponent is. You have over 500 yards of total offense just by yourself, with over 400 passing and 100 yards rushing. And you've got the weapons to work with like Jonah Coleman and Boston on the outside. Absolutely. Because when you have a quarterback who's so dynamic, it can put your defense in a bind, you can't just go out physical them because you might win some matchups up front, but he can devastate you up front if you have him. Stop. So, yes, to answer your question, I do think they have some of the horsepower in order to make this a really uncomfortable spot for the Michigan Wolverines.

[Chip Patterson]

Buddy, you buying?

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, I'm by. I don't see a big difference between these teams. I think that Michigan, if fully healthy, has a few more difference makers, probably just especially on the defensive side of the ball. But if you look at Washington's firepower, I think Bryce is a much better prospect long term than Damond Williams is. But right now I don't think that one is way better than the other. I think Washington is better at receiver. I think if Justice Haynes is banged up then certainly Washington is better at running back. So yeah, I'm absolutely buying. And I also give the coaching.

[Tom Fornelli]

I'm not nearly as confident as the rest of you guys apparently because watching Washington this year, like yeah, they've got the names Demand Williams, Jonah Coleman, Denzel, Boston, like an excellent trio and the offense looked fantastic in their non conference games. But you mentioned Ohio State completely shut them down. And I know Michigan's not Ohio State, no defense truly is but they didn't do anything. Like they were able to move the ball a bit but then as soon as Ohio State put the clamps on them, boom, done nothing. And then you look at the last time they went on the road against Maryland. They didn't do anything against Maryland for the first three quarters of that game before they finally got things going late to come back and win that one. So we saw even last week they got off to a slow start in the first half against Rutgers and yeah, they put up great numbers and they finished with a whole lot of points. But like Rutgers stinks. Like I if if your offense doesn't score at least 21 points against this Rutgers defense, you should probably fire offensive coordinator. They've been giving up points to every single team that they've played, so I don't put a whole lot of faith in that. So you're going on the road against Michigan. I need to see them do it. I need to see them get off to a much better start the first half than they have been and I need to see them prove that they can play well in both areas of the ball and offense at the same time. I think Michigan's defense is still good. I don't really hold anything against it for giving up points to an excellent USC offense. So that's going to be the one thing I really need to see from this unit going on the road.

[Chip Patterson]

Washington's secondary has dealt with injuries sort of throughout the season, so the whole stat profile is not necessarily overwhelming or representative of what they could be. Still a name that you brought up on the Instant Reaction show, Tom maybe a big Jake Marsh game. You know, the law offices of Marsha McCully as as w as Michigan continues to try to put together a passing attack for Bryce Underwood, all things to keep an eye on. Again, that is a noon eastern time kickoff as Washington heads into the big house to take on Michigan. Well, coming up on the other side, we turn our attention to the Ohio State Buckeyes, the number one team in the land. They will be on CBS in the big time game for Week 8. We'll get into the matchup and more next Your fantasy season doesn't end after your draft.

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Back here on the COVID 3 podcast live on CBS Sports Network. Getting you set for week eight in the Big Ten and among the offerings it'll be 3:30pm Eastern time from Camp Randall in Madison, Wisconsin. College football pregame with Danny Cannell and more will be in Madison. Be sure to check them out. Y' all going live at 10:00am Eastern time, right? 10:00am Yep, 10:00am eastern time should be a lot of fun getting you set for the full day of college football, among which is this big time showdown between Ohio State and Wisconsin. Now look, we are a podcast of transparency, a podcast of accountability. Also, we want to make sure that we are putting you in the position to know what you need to watch. The Buckeyes are 24 and a half point favorites, but the Buckeyes are also the best team in the dagum country. I don't care whether you're talking about the polls. I don't care whether you talk about the power ratings. In a year where we don't necessarily have monsters, Buckeyes are starting to look a little scary. A little monster. Ish. And so as we get started looking at this matchup, I want you to go from the perspective of someone who thinks Ohio State can accomplish all of these things. And I want to start with the person who already said it on the COVID 3 podcast because Tom Fornelli said, I think Ohio State is going to go back to back. I think they're going to win the national championship again. If you were rooting for your prediction, Tom, what do you want to see from Ohio State that would indicate continued development, more steps down that path towards claiming another national title?

[Tom Fornelli]

If I was rooting for my prediction, of course I'm rooting for my prediction. I want to look smart at the end of the year. I think that one thing I'm looking for here, if I'm Ohio State, honestly, like, are we letdown proof? Because we saw what just happened to Penn State after they lost to Oregon. They went on the road to ucla, let it beat them twice, and then that quickly derailed into. James Franklin is now unemployed. Your Ohio State, last week you were on the road playing Illinois. You didn't play an excellent game. You didn't have a great game, but you won anyway. And now you're going on the road to play a Wisconsin team that frankly is dead in the water. You're probably going to be in an empty stadium because I'm not sure how many Wisconsin fans are going to be turning out for this one. It'll probably be filled with Ohio State fans. And you've got Penn State looming next week on the schedule. So even if it' you know, Penn State without James Franklin, you still look at it as a far more difficult matchup than what you're going to deal with this week. So can you keep your eyes on the prize? Can you stay focused and can you overcome what was something of a lackluster offensive performance? Because if you start looking into the numbers, Ohio State won comfortably. But offensively, that was their worst performance of the season since that opener against Texas. Whether you're looking at yards per play, success rate, whatever kind of stat you want to look at, they were not really very good in that game. They were just handed a lot of short fields thanks to their defense, causing turnovers in Illinois, making mistakes. So I want to see that offense kind of take things to another level against a Wisconsin defense that I think they should be able to manhandle. So even if it's just to feel good about myself, I'd like to see Ohio State stunting a little bit in this game, put up at least 40 points.

[Bud Elliott]

Yes, I want to see Ohio State come out and throw the knockout punch in this game early. You know, Bama beat this Wisconsin team by three scores, Maryland by three scores, Michigan by two, Iowa by six scores. So, like, if Wisconsin's a dead team walking, you know, kick them while they're down, come out, beat them early. And I want to see a lot of these four and five star guys that Ohio State signs and like the younger guys who are on the bench, I want to see those guys get a lot of playing time. One of the best things this Ohio State team did last year was load management. They were pretty fresh as they got to the playoff, you know, didn't have to play their starters a ton. It bit them a little bit. You know, potentially some of those games they lost, but they still won the whole thing. So who am I to really doubt their approach there? Get the young guys into the game early because your starters got in and took care of business on the road.

[Danny Cannell]

Oh, I would love for this game to be a game in the fourth quarter so we could do the jump around and actually have it like be exciting, but I don't think we see that. I do think when you look at Ohio State, this is the one question I have for him. And I remember historically saying this about Bama or Georgia when they were so dominant and they were going to be heavy favorites in most of their games. I kind of want to see him get uncomfortable. Like I want to see them tested. And I don't think you see it here. Maybe it's against Penn State, but even a quarterback who's playing great and they've done a phenomenal job of kind of working him along and he's playing as good as anybody in the country. And Julian saying, I don't know if they're going to get truly tested until the Big Ten championship game. I mean, at Penn State comes up with an all world performance and their defense is playing lights out. Somehow a backup quarterback comes in and makes them a tougher out. Maybe you get that, but that's still at home. That's the one question mark I'll have. And maybe it's Michigan, you know, maybe it's ucla, the most resurgent team in the country, but I just wonder if they ever truly get tested where it's the fourth quarter and you need sort of some of those battle scars to show up and be like, all right, we've been in this position before and it is a great spot to be in. Trust me. A lot of coaches would love to have this problem and maybe it's not an issue. Maybe they're that much better and they just waltz right into a championship game. Or maybe they're ready for that test when it comes the first time, which may be in the playoffs. I just. That's the only uncertainty that I have about Ohio State. Everything else looks awesome, but we don't know truly how they're going to be against the very best probably until the postseason.

[Chip Patterson]

This is a mentality thing, Danny. You mentioned those Alabama teams, you mentioned those Georgia things. Do they have it right? I mean, this is a team that we have given a lot of credit to for their ability to reload. We did a whole Anatomy of a Reload segment here on CBS Sports Network a couple weeks ago. And so that hunger, in my opinion, has driven some of this early season performance. But now you're starting to get some flowers, now you're starting to look around. Now you're starting to realize, like you mentioned, the rest of the schedule, you can easily paint a picture where until you walk into the big house in Ann Arbor, you're really not going to get pushed in any major way. When you're breaking down tape of this second half of the season, all those meetings, man, you got to make sure that you are working on yourself and not concerned about the other team. Because if you're only thinking about the other team and you're Ohio State, you're just going to walk into this like, yeah, we got this. And yeah, I, I think you make a great point, Tom. Ohio State, was it. Did we really get beat this bad? I think Illinois won the success rate battle. Right. Our friend Parker Fleming. Yeah, this is, this is a spot where I think as you're breaking down the film, you are hoping to go in and you're trying to make this, the corrections from what happened during that game against Illinois and then you're trying to spin it forward. Excuse me, against Wisconsin. All right, final word, Tom. The Ohio State Buckeyes, if they have one weakness, it is blank. What is it?

[Tom Fornelli]

Boredom. Like, they're extremely bored because we just saw the schedule. Like, now that they're past Illinois, there's nothing left on that schedule that's really going to present much of a challenge for them until that Michigan game. And honestly, I don't know if Michigan on paper presents much of a challenge, but we know how that usually goes when those two teams get together. So I think you kind of have to fight apathy and I think you just have to make sure that you're healthy getting through the rest of the season. Because I think, honestly, the next time, Danny, you were talking about it, I think Ryan Day would love for his team to be tested. So they have to be in that situation. But I think honestly, the next time this team will be truly tested is in the Big Ten championship game against either Indiana or maybe Oregon.

[Danny Cannell]

Danny, I'm with you. I mean, that's sort of my big question mark. I mean, you look at weaknesses, I don't know if they have them. I think that's why they're Tom's pick, why they're the odds makers pick complacency that you mentioned to Chip. Like a lot of things we've talked about are potential hiccups for this team. So far, they've answered every test with flying colors. You know, does the parody of college football catch up to them? I don't think so, but this team looks pretty complete all over the place.

[Bud Elliott]

You know, I, I think every team out there nowadays has weaknesses. Like the top teams are so much worse than they were even a half decade ago. I mean, on the power ratings, like more than a touc down worse in some cases. If you compare number one to number one, I think Ohio State has done a really good job of replacing what it had last year on the lines of scrimmage. But I don't think they're better along the lines of scrimmage this year than they were last year. So that's not really a weakness compared to most of the teams on their schedule or really most of the teams in the country. But I don't think that they're like, you know, special on the lines of scrimmage compared to like a Miami or Texas A and M. Okay, again, your.

[Chip Patterson]

Standard is your standard. And I asked for relative, right? So I know I am picking nits. Last year you had Quin, Sean Judkins and Travion Henderson, like running the football or throwing it, checking down to your backs. I mean, the, the what you had in that running back room was truly special. We talk a lot about the versatility. It's like, oh, they've got Bo Jackson, they've got Peoples, they've got Donaldson, they've got and. And by the end of that the season they will have settled into a place. But if I am picking nits where the whole spreadsheet is like dark, dark, dark green, the only spot, I'm like, okay, if this team does happen to run into a team in the college football playoff that can man up on, and I don't know if anybody can, but just saying they can man up on these wide receivers, okay, that team does not exist if we are picking it. I do wonder Ohio State, if they are forced to run the football in a situation that would be the one spot where they can improve. And that maybe goes with Bud. Looking at what they've got up front. But again, 3:30pm Eastern time, a kickoff from Madison. It's the number one team in the country, the Ohio State Buckeyes against the Wisconsin Badgers. Be sure to check it out. You can watch it on CBS. You can stream it on Paramount plus, again, college football pregame live from Madison starting 10:00am Eastern Time. Watch that on CBS Sports HQ or Paramount Plus. Well, coming up on the other side, we of course like to leave you every single week with one player to watch in the Big Ten. We'll tell you who it is and why next back here on the COVID 3 podcast live on CBS Sports Network. Always like to leave you with a couple players to watch. So for week eight in the Big Ten, Tom Fornelli, you're going to get us started with a little Friday night tilt and a big game for the head coach who's found his name in the headlines. Who are you looking at as a player to watch in week eight?

[Tom Fornelli]

Yeah, Nebraska fans are hearing people talk about their team a lot this week, but it is not for any reason that they want to hear their team talking about because they are 5 and 1. They are ranked for the first time since last year and only the third week in the last last seven years. And one of the reasons why is running back Emmett Johnson. I know Dylan Rayola gets a lot of attention for his play in that program, but he's very, very happy to have Emmett Johnson alongside him in that backfield. He is currently second in the Big Ten in rushing yards with 650. He has seven rushing touchdowns and he's also proven to be a useful option out of the backfield in the passing game with 24 receptions for another 230 yards and a score. I think he's a very versatile back, somebody who is not getting nearly enough attention for the production he's giving the Corn Huskers this year.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, Tom, I'm going to go ahead and go with with Makai Lemon of usc. I think if USC is going to win this game, they probably need to score, you know, 30, 35 points to do so. Makai Lemon is just one of the best receivers in all of college football. That's been a weakness for Notre Dame covering, especially when USC gets him in the slot. I think Makai Lemon for USC has got to be that guy this week for the Trojans.

[Danny Cannell]

Boy, I'm going to stick with the Trojan theme. Waymond Jordan out. Eli Sanders out for USC steps King Miller, freshman walk on. Who went off for over 150 yards against Michigan. I don't think he has to replicate that performance. But their run game has to be serviceable to at least keep them honest. So I'm all eyes on the freshman at USC to see how he stacks up against Notre Dame.

[Chip Patterson]

And I'm going to turn our attention to, I mean, guys, I Penn State still has to play the rest of the season. I mean, I know it seems crazy, but like they still have games and I know and drew Allers out for the year. But yet somebody's got to go out there and somebody's got to play quarterback for this team. So who is that? That is going to be Ethan Gronker Meyer. Now, Ethan Groenke Meyer was a four star prospect coming out of high school. Now he is someone who on the staff, they were excited about what his potential could be, but they were really hoping that he wasn't going to step in until 2026 and beyond. So, Bud Elliott, from the recruiting standpoint, can you give me 30 seconds? What is Ethan Gronkermeyer in terms of a player and what should Penn State fans be looking for?

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, Chip, so he's a guy with a nice frame. He can move around a little bit, he can get the ball around. He's certainly one of the higher rated guys in that class. And you know, quarterback recruiting is really kind of a crap. You just have to keep taking guys who have tools. It's hard to project. Some of them will hit, some of them will not. But Gronkmeyer is a guy that. Look, I don't know that Penn State has to go to the transfer portal to get a quarterback. We'll probably find out over the second half of the season if they do.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah. Grunkemeyer, congratulations. You're stepping into the starting role. Here are your first three assignments. At Iowa at night, Ohio State and Indiana. Three top 10 defenses. That's what you're going after for Ethan Grundkemeyer. But again, that's the player who Penn State fans are going to be rallying behind as he takes over the Penn State Nittany Lions. That's why he's my player to watch again. Penn State at Iowa. That will be Saturday night out in Kinnick Stadium. Well, we hope you loved our time here together because we are back all the time. Yes, you can catch us [e-mail] cover3 for more big game breakdowns. Thursday, 11am Eastern time for our locks. Saturday night, 11:30pm Eastern time for our instant reaction. And of course, course back here on CBS Sports Network. Just scan that QR code to watch and listen to the COVID 3 podcast. Wherever you get your podcast. Tulsa is my home now.

[Tom Fornelli]

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[Chip Patterson]

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Out, it's gonna be really difficult. Tulsa King new season now streaming exclusively on Paramount Plus.