Mailbag: Why There Might Not Be A “Next Indiana,” Re-Seeding in the CFP & More! | College Football

Summary

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Cover 3 College Football Podcast

Episode: Mailbag: Why There Might Not Be A “Next Indiana,” Re-Seeding in the CFP & More!

Date: January 29, 2026

Hosts: Chip Patterson, Tom Fornelli, Danny Kanell, Bud Elliott

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Overview

This episode of the Cover 3 College Football Podcast features a lively mailbag session where hosts Chip Patterson, Danny Kanell, and Bud Elliott tackle listeners' questions about the state of various college programs, the new realities of college football’s landscape, playoff logistics, and "sleeping giant" programs. The hosts engage in spirited debate, sprinkle in fun hypotheticals, and provide candid insights into hot topics like Florida State’s future, the myth of the “next Indiana," playoff seeding, and which faltering teams might bounce back.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Senior Bowl Report & QB Class Woes

Timestamp: 02:01–08:09

• The hosts open with updates from the Senior Bowl via colleagues Ryan Wilson and JP Acosta. General consensus is defenses are dominating, and quarterback play is underwhelming.
• Bud Elliott: "This quarterback class is a hot mess. It is garbage…possibly one of the worst years we've had."
• Standout prospects mentioned: Luke Altmyer (positive), disappointing showings from others like Cole Payton.
• Defensive names earning praise: Daryl Jackson Jr., Lee Hunter, Jacob Rodriguez, and Bud Clark.
• Danny Kanell notes the contrast: “We’ve been saying this since IMG. …There are so many [QBs] out there in college football, but this NFL class is bleak.”
• Hosts explain advantages for defenses in the all-star showcase format and the difficulty for QBs adjusting quickly to new playbooks.

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Mailbag: Florida State’s Path Forward

Timestamp: 11:30–18:09

• Listener (Laura, FSU alum) asks Bud for an optimistic future outlook for FSU post-controversy.
• Danny Kanell: “No, I think they're largely just playing out the string, waiting for that buyout number to come down...I think they'll be bad again.” [12:36]
• The crew runs through issues: donor fatigue, lack of administrative vision, and problems with the transfer portal class.
• Bud Elliott: "You're hoping to max out Mike Norvell's coaching potential...but it's a rough sell. It's a hard sell. ...Hope is not a great strategy.” [15:38]
• Discussion extends to macro-level hurdles: lack of a Phil Knight-style megadonor; questions of whether FSU's boosters trust current leadership.
• Core message: without significant behind-the-scenes change, improvement will be slow and uncertain.

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Mailbag: The “Next Indiana” Debate — Is There One?

Timestamp: 18:12–27:58

• Listener “Five Slice Rick” asks about another “sleeping giant” like Indiana surging to relevancy.
• Bud Elliott: Cites Vanderbilt’s 2025 surge as comparable: “They just had their first 10 win season...they were in the playoff discussion. ...This is a big justification year for Vanderbilt." [19:54]
• Danny Kanell: Notes the new “Rev Share era” increases volatility, spreading talent and giving more programs a chance: “You don't have to be as good as prior national championship teams to do it.”
• Chip Patterson: The key isn’t just resources: “When I'm looking for anything in that sleeping giant type category, I'm looking for somebody that can cast a little bit of a wider net.” [23:47]
• Other suggested candidates: Virginia, Texas Tech, Michigan State. All agree alignment—between university, donors, and athletic staff—is crucial.
• Quote, Bud Elliott: “I think Indiana kind of set an example that this is not impossible, ...but they did have the perfect pairing of finding the coach and a generational type quarterback.” [27:58]

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Hypothetical: Which NFL Alumni Would Improve Their Old Program the Most?

Timestamp: 29:53–41:49

• Listener “Nick” asks which current NFL player, returned to their alma mater, would most improve their former college team.
• The crew has fun with combos:
  • Patrick Mahomes to Texas Tech
  • Matthew Stafford to Georgia
  • Miles Garrett to Texas A&M: “He could be the type of player that could make them a national championship contender.” [31:32]
  • Trevor Lawrence to Clemson, Drake Maye to UNC, Saquon Barkley to Penn State
  • Discussion leads to conclusion that QBs or edge rushers would cause the biggest jump.
  • Danny Kanell: “Is there any team that would not take a quarterback who has an NFL starting quarterback?”
  • Defensive returnees also considered: Micah Parsons to Penn State, T.J. Watt to Wisconsin
  • Fun take: Joe Burrow back to LSU or Brock Purdy to Iowa State
  • Even “non-QB” upgrades like Derrick Henry to Alabama get brief mention.

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Should the College Football Playoff Be Re-Seeded?

Timestamp: 41:49–45:15

• Listener asks why play isn’t re-seeded each round.
• Bud Elliott: “For whatever reason, that is my least concern when it comes to the college football playoffs. It doesn’t bother me at all.” [42:25]
• Danny Kanell: Advocates for re-seeding if the bracket expands to sixteen teams, to maintain the importance of seeding and regular season value.
• Chip Patterson: Prefers bracket chaos and the existing system: “I like the chaos that we get without receding in college sports.”

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Where Does the New Pac-12 Fit in the Group-of-Six?

Timestamp: 45:45–50:23

• With conference realignment, listener Zach asks where the new Pac-12 (now with Boise, Fresno, etc.) fits among the G6.
• Danny Kanell: “I think it is slightly below the American, but I do think it’s better than the Mountain West.” [47:02]
• Panel discusses how cord-cutting has hurt the MAC’s visibility, and how Sun Belt programs are being “picked apart” for talent.
• Chip Patterson: “The [American’s] top tier, you would take over the Pac 12’s top tier, correct?” [50:04]

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Championship or Bust: Unrealistic Standard Now?

Timestamp: 50:23–56:52

• Listener asks if “championship or bust” is a fair expectation in the 12-team playoff era.
• Danny Kanell: On Oregon fans expecting a title: “No, it's ridiculous for this Oregon team…but I can't rule out it [being] a real expectation for maybe a certain team.”
• Bud Elliott: Nuanced: “Their goal should be to win the national championship…but if you make it to the College Football Playoff again and you get a win…but then you come up short… I don't think it’s a failure.” [51:44]
• Consensus: CFP expansion means the bar for a “successful season” should be at least making the semifinals (final four), not necessarily winning it all.
• Chip Patterson: “If you have national championship expectations and you make it to the semifinal, to me that feels like you’ve at least met the expectation of being in the mix for it at the very end.” [54:20]

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Bounceback Teams Candidates for 2026

Timestamp: 57:00–59:37

• Inspired by NFL “worst-to-first” talk, hosts quickly brainstorm programs that could rebound from a losing season to bowl eligibility or better:
  • Oklahoma State, Wisconsin, Florida, South Carolina, Stanford, West Virginia, Syracuse, Purdue
• Chip Patterson: "Wisconsin was 4 and 8 and their schedule’s about to get a lot more manageable." [58:11]
• Bud Elliott: “Florida count, four and eight to seven or eight wins. I think that's a pretty reasonable expectation.” [58:22]

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• Bud Elliott [04:14]: “This quarterback class is a hot mess. It is garbage…possibly one of the worst years we've had.”
• Danny Kanell [12:36]: “No, I think they're largely just playing out the string, waiting for that buyout number to come down...I think they'll be bad again.”
• Bud Elliott [15:38]: “It's a rough sell. I've talked to a lot of Florida State fans…Hope is not a great strategy.”
• Bud Elliott [19:54] (on Vanderbilt): “They just had their first 10 win season…they have never been relevant in college football.”
• Chip Patterson [23:47]: “When I'm looking for anything in that sleeping giant type category, I'm looking for somebody that can cast a little bit of a wider net.”
• Danny Kanell [47:02]: “I think it is slightly below the American, but I do think it's better than a Mountain West.”
• Bud Elliott [51:44]: “If you make it to the College Football Playoff again and you get a win…then you come up short…I don't think it's a failure.”

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Episode Flow & Tone

The conversation is energetic, honest, and occasionally irreverent, with the hosts riffing off each other's takes and listener questions. The podcast blends serious evaluation with offseason speculation and football nerdery, making it accessible and entertaining for devoted fans and casuals alike.

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Senior Bowl Report / QB Discussion – 02:01–08:09
• Florida State's Future – 11:30–18:09
• "Next Indiana" / Sleeping Giants – 18:12–27:58
• NFL Alumni Hypotheticals – 29:53–41:49
• Re-Seeding in the CFP – 41:49–45:15
• New Pac-12 Ranking – 45:45–50:23
• Championship or Bust – 50:23–56:52
• Bounceback Teams – 57:00–59:37

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This episode is a must-listen for college football fans interested in in-depth off-season analysis, deep dives into program dynamics, and an entertaining spin on pressing questions and hypotheticals.

Transcript

[Chip Patterson]

NFL fans spend an average of 690 minutes a week thinking about football.

[Bud Elliott]

That's over 11 hours. You're checking matchups, tweaking your fantasy roster, reliving big plays, arguing calls.

[Danny Cannell]

Football lives rent free in your head all week long.

[Bud Elliott]

And when the game's on, every decision matters. A winning play or the right timeout. Just 60 seconds can flip the entire outcome. But here's the thing. Off the field, we forget to plan. We get so caught up in the pregame hype. The food, the drinks, the vibe. And forget the most important part of the day, how you're getting home.

[Chip Patterson]

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[Danny Cannell]

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[Danny Cannell]

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[Chip Patterson]

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[Danny Cannell]

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[Bud Elliott]

That's M A K E A P.

[Chip Patterson]

L A N 26.

[Bud Elliott]

Whether you're hosting, headed to a local bar, or going to the game, make it part of your ritual. Take a minute, make a plan. Never drive impaired this message brought to you by Diageo MAD and the NFL. Please drink responsibly.

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[Bud Elliott]

COVID 3 podcast with your hosts Chip Patterson, Tom Fernelli, Danny Cannell and Bud Elliott.

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It's your call for the best college.

[Danny Cannell]

Football coverage from national signing day to.

[Bud Elliott]

The national championship and everything in between. C presents the COVID 3 podcast and.

[Chip Patterson]

Welcome back to the COVID 3 podcast here on CBS Sports. That's Danny Canel, that's Bud Elliott. I'm Chip Patterson coming to you [e-mail] cover3 and everywhere. Get your podcast on demand. Thanks for hanging out. Smash that subscribe Smash that like and come and join us in the chat, aka the COVID 3 tailgate, where we got some mail bag questions piling up. Fired up to be getting interactive with you here on a Thursday. So Dirty Dog, Nick, Joel, Zach and More. We will be getting to your questions before we get out of here today. We also are going to be diving back into the big old bag of mail. That's right. If you go and you leave us a five star review and in that review you put a mailbag question, we will tackle it in a future mailbag episode. Spotify comments as well. We will be getting to you as we continue with these Thursday mailbags all throughout the off season. Before we jump into some of these mailbag questions, a little bit of current events. I was. We got, we got the Senior bowl coming up on Saturday. Okay. Senior. If you want to watch it, it's on NFL Network Saturday afternoon. But our friend Ryan Wilson. Our friends Ryan Wilson and JP Acosta are out in Mobile, Alabama. I was checking out some of their content. I recommend you do as well. You got, you guys want a little, you guys want a little Senior bowl report? Yeah. Okay. All right. You will be thrilled to hear Luke Altmire, day two Stand, stand out. Let's go. In general, we're not getting a lot of buzz from the quarterbacks. Danny. Yeah, the big, the big, you know, headline was obviously Diego Pavia at 5, 9 and 7 8. Garrett Nussmeier's health is a big consideration.

[Danny Cannell]

More like a subheader, actually.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah. All your Robertson. You know those. JP and Ryan were a little bit disappointed with some of his performances as well. North Dakota State quarterback Cole Payton standing out. But in general, I'm hearing that the, the defenses are really starting to, to win the day here. Does that line up with your view overall of the quarterback class, especially, especially the ones that are there.

[Bud Elliott]

This quarterback class is a hot mess. It is garbage. There is not a lot out there. You know, Trinidad Chambliss is somebody I'd be watching closely to see how his eligibility is because I think if he, and I think he's gonna get, be able to play at Ole Miss next year. Which makes me kind of wonder should he try to come out, you know, and just forego that. But he can make a lot of money. I think Ty Simpson is somebody who has a huge gap to fill between him and Fernando Mendoza, but I think he's number two. But the list is not great. When you see, I saw a couple lists that had Drew Aller as the fourth best quarterback in the class, they're like, yikes. And that is the old upside, you know. Well, look at, we could mold him into a quarterback. He's big, he's physical. It is just a complete mess. If you are a quarterback or if you are a team and you're in need of a quarterback, it is possibly one of the worst years. We've had. Some. It's interesting because we've had some great classes and we've had some horrible classes in recent years. This one definitely leans towards the horrible class.

[Danny Cannell]

You know what is not horrible though, is all the quarterbacks coming back in in the sport of college football. Like, that's awesome. I. I was, I was working on a short the other day. It looks pretty good, actually. Like, really good. There's. There are so many QBs out there who I would just gladly take for my team.

[Chip Patterson]

Who would you rather draft? This was a fun debate between Ryan and JP on with the first pick was would you rather take Katron Allen or Nick Singleton?

[Danny Cannell]

Ooh, I think I'd rather have Singleton. Just like the home run hitting ability he has I think is different.

[Chip Patterson]

What do you think, Danny?

[Bud Elliott]

I would probably lean towards Singleton.

[Chip Patterson]

So the.

[Bud Elliott]

What were they saying?

[Chip Patterson]

They said if it's a field day, it's Nick Singleton all day. And if Katron Allen was. I think JP's phrase was if he was like a tenth of a second faster, you know, then it would be there. And that if you gave Catron Allen's vision to Nick Singleton, oh, and you've built the perfect back. It's a little bit like. And Ryan said. I've. Ryan said, you know, I've been, I've been talking myself into thinking that I would take Allen over Singleton, even though the physical tools are not the same, just because it seems like some of the intangibles are a little bit better.

[Danny Cannell]

We've been saying this since img.

[Chip Patterson]

Really?

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah. It's like, man, I wish, I wish that he had an extra gear.

[Chip Patterson]

Your boy Daryl Jackson Jr. Has been showing out.

[Bud Elliott]

Did you see the streak was kept alive for 52 straight years, Florida State has had a player in the Senior bowl and he was not scheduled. He was a late AD Senior Bowl. So you kept the streak alive. It was dicey because he went to the Shrine bowl first.

[Chip Patterson]

There have been some players who've been doing Shrine, then senior and making the move over Daryl Jackson Jr. Being one of them.

[Danny Cannell]

He is like John Henderson big. He's gonna get like, yeah, he's gonna go higher. People think.

[Bud Elliott]

I suspect when we were in Tallahassee for the Bama game, we'd had him on after the game and I was like, oh, and he's really well spoken. Like he's got a great personality and he bald out in that game. He could absolutely be somebody who. Somebody could find themselves a steal, somebody play a long time.

[Chip Patterson]

That was another note that one of the things for the quarterback is that the defensive lines like the Lee Hunter, I mean, no surprise, but like Texas Tech defensive lineman Lee hunter, Daryl Jackson Jr. Stood out. Also the defensive backs and the sort of playmaking linebackers, hey, this might be surprising. Jacob Rodriguez has been picking off quarterbacks in some of these senior roles.

[Bud Elliott]

I saw he forced a fumble too. Shocker.

[Chip Patterson]

Big shocker there.

[Bud Elliott]

You know, you said the defenses are dominating. I think even if there is good quarterback play and there were quality quarterbacks, it is much easier for the defense to just pick up and play than it is for the quarterbacks. It I remember I had the Chicago Bears staff, so it was Dave Wanstadt and Ron Turner was our offensive coordinator. And I remember you're cramming things in and they give you a condensed playbook, but it was completely different terminology, way more complex than what we were doing at Florida State. And it was like just fed through a fire hose and you're trying to like, whoa, what, what am I doing? So you're thinking a lot. So really the time for the QBs to shine is you either seven on seven or one on one drills. You know, when you can kind of just see their arm because if you're thinking that much, it can affect your ability to execute the offense. So I, I would more look at just arm talent. You know, how are these guys throwing as opposed to how are they executing the offense? It is a lot to ask, but it is an IQ test too that they test how much can you consume and execute in a short period of time.

[Chip Patterson]

TCU safety Bud Clark has been getting a lot of high praise. Pit linebacker Kyle Lewis, you know, another guy who's just been like a stud for a long time. Those are some of the ones. And they still have. Yesterday was day two, day three. They've got great coverage there again. Ryan Wilson, JP Acosta there, producer striker on the scene. Looks a little cold out there. They're grinding in Mobile with the first pick. Go and check out all of their coverage. The game Saturday, I believe it's around 2:30pm Eastern time or so. You can watch it on NFL Network. All right. It is Thursday. It is the off season. That means that we need to take the elevator on down into the mailroom. All right. This one is just a good old classic, big old bag of mail and we had a fan jump in, leave a five star review and then put a question in there. Excuse me Subject, no username, no fan. For better or worse, no question for Bud. Hello Cover 3 team. I want to start by complimenting you all on your podcast. I work in a non sports related industry, but I found the revenue strategy discussion around college football genuinely fascinating. You all consistently do a great job providing context and objective analysis and it really shows. I also wanted to share a question specifically for Bud. I completely understand why you pressed Pause on the Nolcast, and I appreciate the thoughtfulness behind the decision. Given the decisions that have now been made, whether we can agree with or not, how do you see Florida State moving forward from here? Do you see any signs that the staff and administration are learning from past mistakes and what risks or pitfalls still stand out to you as the program tries to stabilize and rebuild momentum? For context, I'm a female listener and an FSU alum and I really value the way that these conversations are handled both on Cover 3 and the Noel cast. Thanks again for the great work and for consistently raising the level of discussion around college football.

[Danny Cannell]

Best Laura I. I don't personally, I. I think like, the great struggle they had in getting the GM candidates who we know they wanted to get indicates like, how kind of just not organized they are behind the scenes. You can't like go undo the decisions Mike Alford made over the past two years. So. No, I think they're largely just playing out the string, waiting for that buyout number to come down and, you know, I have to see like some of the big donors. Are you comfortable giving to the people who are currently running it right now, both from a coach and administrative level? So, no, I don't, I don't like the portal class was pretty crappy and that's not unexpected with the actions they took to, you know, generate cash over the last 18 months. Two years, roughly. So no, I think they'll be bad again. I actually love that they have all these Friday and Monday games because you're gonna get your Saturdays back and like, you won't just be like depressed all Saturday, right?

[Bud Elliott]

Like, well, if they get smoked on Friday night, it kind of ruins the weekend.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah, but like, at some point, like, like you're kind of saved by bedtime, right? Like, you wake up, like, maybe you're pissed over your coffee, but like, you know, then it's.

[Chip Patterson]

It's. Oh no, but Danny's. But then Danny's got to deal with it on college football pregame, right? Yeah, we don't love that. You know. Danny, what about the. This was the other piece. I. I'm Sorry, I didn't want to like, you know, just throw Florida State on the bus because I think there's a follow up question to this that's like, okay, I hear the understanding about current leadership, you know, within the athletic department and the football program. But like what about the university? What about the power players? What about the, the is. Is there. Do you feel like there is a vision for the, the future somewhere within that decision making body? Right. Like is there somebody who is saying.

[Danny Cannell]

Like okay, not, not currently. No, I don't.

[Bud Elliott]

Can I ask a question that doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me because nor you said they'll wait till the buyout gets cheaper. It's still 51 million after this year, right?

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

That is a lot of money. Like what's the difference in. I mean I know it's 10 million bucks or whatever the number is, but in the bigger scope of things, is it really that much sign, is it significantly different?

[Danny Cannell]

I also, I'll say I, I don't think the people who made the call to keep Mark Norvell quite forecasted just how out everybody would be on this team. You know, like you talk to fans.

[Bud Elliott]

And contributors and or from inside it's.

[Danny Cannell]

Easy to say hey, we're going to support the guy. Like you know, they obviously like they, they played slightly better than their record as far as like from power rating standpoint and like there's. You hope to run it back. Well, I think this roster is worse than last year's maybe meaningfully so I think there's probably.

[Bud Elliott]

I'm going to give the optimistic view. I'm more of an optimist. The ACC is pretty wide open after Miami. Now granted you're getting teams like Virginia Tech are spending probably more. SMU is spending, Georgia Tech's probably spending.

[Danny Cannell]

More than you are.

[Chip Patterson]

Right.

[Bud Elliott]

So you're hoping to max out Mike Norvell's coaching potential which is one of the biggest problems that we've seen. I'm just hoping they over exceed expectations. But, but we did the schedule conversation. It's one of the tougher converse tougher schedules in the conference. Like it is the, it is not a year to be on a hot seat if you're Mike Norvell. Unless you look at it from the perspective of hey, we could surprise and you know, maybe win some games we weren't supposed to. But I mean clearly the hope is you salvage things, you get a little bit better, you know, get to seven or eight wins. But is that going to be enthusiastically received by the Fan base which is used to, you know, competing for ACC titles. I don't know, but I think not.

[Danny Cannell]

If the losses are Florida, Miami, Louisville on the road. And like, like, so you beat nobody. No, I. I don't think you're getting people to start buying season tickets over that again.

[Bud Elliott]

Right. But like, it's a rough sell. It's a hard sell. I've talked to a lot of Florida State fans and I just kind of say, hey, let's hope for the best. You know. But that's all you're doing is really. It's a. Hope is not a great strategy.

[Danny Cannell]

I'm not joking. Like. Like a lot of fans I know are like, cool get our Saturdays back.

[Chip Patterson]

Like, what about. All right, but that's what I'm talking about, the vision. Like, is there a chicken farmer?

[Danny Cannell]

No, I don't think so.

[Chip Patterson]

Like, hey, here's what we're gonna have fresh out and then we're gonna be able to go get so and so and then we're gonna of cash. Like at some point, somebody, for example, at Virginia Tech, somebody at Virginia Tech behind the scenes was like, okay, here's the deal. This is how we're going to. We are going to change the way that we spend. We are going to go and get our guy. And they went out and they did it. And is that gonna. Virginia Tech and Florida State don't have the same goals. I think that's very fair. You know, Florida State I think is. They got national championship trophies. Virginia Tech no stray here, but you've still got the empty trophy case. Like Florida State still should have that motivation somewhere within the community, right?

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah. But if you're go look at Michael Alford's quotes, right? Like it bad business decisions have consequences. And if you're a donor, you're like, how in the world am I comfortable giving money to that guy? You know, we're going to double down on facilities like spending that contrast that what Keith Carter said at Ole Miss. You know, one is. One is very clearly right once one's wrong. Like Ole Miss paused alter stadium upgrades to realize they had to put money into the roster. Like winning fills the stadium.

[Bud Elliott]

There was a lot of excitement because Sarah Blakely and her family were at Florida State in November. She is the owner of Spanx and she's one of Florida State's billionaire alumni. But I don't know her appetite for wanting to support the football program. She might have just been on a reunion, like seeing some of her girlfriends from school, but I know there was a lot of hope that we need a savior. We need somebody. We need a Mark Cuban. You know, we need a Phil Knight. And those guys have way more money than Sarah Blakely. I mean, she's got a ton of money, but we need a Cody Campbell. And Florida State just doesn't have that person that's going to come in and save everything from a nil perspective.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah, I. I don't know.

[Chip Patterson]

Come on, Danny. Pony Hub.

[Danny Cannell]

I, I think, I think there's a got it and there's a willing to give it to the people who, who manage it.

[Chip Patterson]

Interesting. All right, well, speaking of Mark Cuban, let's keep it rolling.

[Bud Elliott]

Gotta talk to my buddy with the house in Utah.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah. Five Slice. Yeah, Username five Slice. Rick jumped in. Five star review said. Hey guys. Longtime listener since the COVID Tom Allen days. I'll never forget Bud reminding us all off season that last year's team was a fluke. I really wanted him to be wrong and he wasn't. My question is what about talking about the COVID year being a fluke? My question is about the big buzzword from the off season. Who is the next sleeping giant like Indiana? I actually think Indiana is a totally unique case, almost a college football anomaly. It's clearly the top public school in the state, a founding member of a flagship conference like the Big Ten, in a solid recruiting region like the Midwest, with a large and financially successful alumni base that genuinely cares about sports. And yet over 130 plus years, Indiana has never even looked into a short stretch of real football relevance. Service academies, Ivies and Minnesota all had Pre World War II success. Cal won a national title. Mississippi State even had a successful season. So what is the difference? Oh wait, Cal won a national time. Mississippi State had relevant seasons. Indiana had none of that ever until now. So I don't really think there is another clear sleeping giant like Indiana. I think they're more of a historical anomaly. But I'm curious what you guys think. Thanks and Go Hoosiers. Five Slice. Rick.

[Bud Elliott]

I got one. Vanderbilt. I think this year is huge for Vanderbilt. They just had their first 10 win season in history. They were in the playoff discussion. They have never been relevant in college football. And I do think, I mean they just landed Jared Curtis. So clearly there's a desire and there's an opportunity for them to fill in from where Diego Pavia left off. He is an uber talented young player. They've created an atmosphere that they've never had in the history of Vanderbilt football by putting some money into the stadium, creating a home field Advantage. Clark Lee is a coach you could believe in that I think is an outstanding coach. Our Buddy Barton is doing a phenomenal job of finding some of that talent, similar to what Signetti's done at Indiana. But I think this is a huge, and I'm not saying they're going to win the national championship or even get back to the playoff, but I do think this is a huge like justification year. We do a, when we play our Skins Game in golf, sometimes if you get a skin, you think you have a birdie, you have to justify it by parring the next hole. I think this is a big like justification year for Vanderbilt to show that the last year in two years really weren't an anomaly, that those are going to be the new norm at Vanderbilt. But I do think they would be a program that probably does have a lot of money behind it that maybe never was there and never realized. But all of a sudden there's enthusiasm, they're getting some support. I think they could be somebody now. It's, it's tough. It's not easy when you're trying to go against the likes of LSU and Ole Miss and Bama and Georgia and everybody else. But we said the same thing about Indiana going against Ohio State, Michigan, Oregon. So I think Vanderbilt would be one of those potential. And Nashville is a phenomenal city to recruit to just to get players to come to.

[Danny Cannell]

So I like with, with the Rev Share era, right? Like I kind of look at it as like, you know, full nil plus portal 23 and 24. Rev share era started in 25. Obviously with the talent being spread out as much as it is. I think it's much more possible because you don't have to be as good as prior national championship teams to do it. I think like that really increases the variance a lot. Especially like in a single season, you know, scenario if you got a bunch of veterans to come play together who all knew each other, you added some special pieces around. Like, especially like Indiana had the number one pick at quarterback, you know, that that's a huge differentiator for them. So in looking at that, I don't know if I can pinpoint like one specific team. I think Vandy by, you know, Danny there is a really good call. What about the Hokies, right? Like could, could they do it in year two? Probably not. But like, I guess it's, it's possible. I, I think so many more teams do have a shot. Especially like before there were so many inherent advantages for, for your traditional good teams, right? Like you could be pretty incompetent and still put a good product on the field like administratively. And now that's not the case. Like now if you're incompetent administratively, you get punished.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah.

[Danny Cannell]

And like other people go ahead and elevate off that. I still think Indiana this year was a very special blend of things coming together at the right time. You know, coaching staff, continuity. Like they didn't lose anybody off last year's staff. They didn't lose anybody of this year's staff really either. But you know, getting the quarterback piece, I think the old thing is overplayed as far as like that's their main advantage, but it certainly allows them to run a pretty great variety of scheme. You know, they don't play a lot of young guys on that team, so it's probably hard to replicate their formula, especially just like with all the factors came together. But I think it's doable and maybe.

[Bud Elliott]

In a different way.

[Danny Cannell]

But I think we will, we will probably have more teams that rise up that have never won a national title before. I think it's actually pretty cool.

[Chip Patterson]

Vanderbilt and Indiana, the common thread there for me is coaching, just getting the coach right.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

Truly special coaching individuals, obviously on very different ends of their careers between Clark Lee and Kurt Signetti. But I think everyone recognizes that it's something special. I do think that if you're trying to look at the way that five slice Rick explained the Indiana phenomenon, Vanderbilt is a smaller school. Vanderbilt is a private school. Vanderbilt's a harder school to get into. It's a harder school to get players into. You know, I think that when I'm looking for anything that's in that sleeping giant type category, I'm looking for somebody that can cast a little bit of a wider net. I mean, could Pat Fitzgerald do it at Michigan State?

[Bud Elliott]

So I was going more from Vanderbilt's perspective that a sleeping giant is somebody who's never been good. Like Michigan State had that run with Dantonio and they're going to Rose Bowls. Same thing with Virginia Tech. They were playing for a national championship 25 years ago.

[Chip Patterson]

What about Virginia?

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, Virginia could be. Yeah. And they had a breakout season. I think it's a big year for Tony Elliott for Virginia to show that that wasn't a all in year with, you know, with the Portal. And they did go all in and they had a lot of veteran experience on that team. But yeah, I think Virginia would be a good one.

[Chip Patterson]

That's like another they, they had to get their alignment right. You know, they had to make sure that they were. Everybody understood which way we were moving. I mean, the, the pla. The idea of leveraging these large alumni bases in a very strategic way is. It's not, it's not world breaking, but it's also very carefully orchestrated right now. I mean like the, the thinking that has gone into making sure that you are connecting the dots with your corporate sponsorships. I mean, you need, you need people that are going to be able to actually make all that happen. A lot of fans sit around like, oh yeah, we've got money. But you need someone who actually understands the mechanics and the levers to pull and how to be able to get from point A to point B, make all those connections happen. I think that's where a lot of stuff for programs falls between the cracks. You know, just everybody stretched so thin, everybody's so distracted. You're always like chasing whatever you think is the next new thing. It takes a lot of focus. And that's why I think the word alignment is a, Is a big one for the idea of the next Indiana. Because everybody, everybody around Indiana points to the alignment part as the reason why Indiana was able to really get things moving. Once they got the hire of Signetti. They, they were told which way we're going to move. We're all going to pull on the rope in the same direction. And they've been able to make it happen. So super, super impressive on their part. All right. Do you think that, do you think it's fair to say there won't be like to search for the next Indiana is, is a little bit like Indiana is an anomaly.

[Bud Elliott]

I mean, they're definitely. We're in this new era, though. It's so young and we've only been in the portal nil era for five years and it happened pretty quick, which gives me hope that somebody else could do it. I mean, and Texas Tech is one that somebody brought up in here and I think that paid a lot of dividends early. You know, and they're a program that had some success. Success. But you know, they got, they have the support, they've got the back and they've got the desire. You know, I think what they were missing was the quarterback. And guess what they did. They went out and got the quarterback. So I think if you see Texas Tech have another good year and they're back in the Big 12, I think they would fit this bill. But I think that's what's kind of exciting. I, you know, seeing Michigan State invest and them what is. It was a 400 million dollar gift they got, you know, so I think there is an appetite and I think Indiana kind of set an example that this is not impossible that you could do it. But I do think that they did have the perfect pairing of finding the coach and a, you know, generational type quarterback.

[Danny Cannell]

Yep.

[Chip Patterson]

Coming up on the other side, in the name of the recent college basketball news, someone wants to know if a college football team could bring back a current pro, what would be the team that would benefit the most from adding one player? Who would be the team? Who would be the player and more Next.

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[Chip Patterson]

Back here on the COVID 3 podcast 8:50am Eastern Time, our guy Nick, he pulled up to the tailgate, he got his spot and he said mailbag Question if each college team could add back one former player who is currently in the NFL for next season, which program improves the most and who is the player?

[Danny Cannell]

Oh wait, hold on. Let's take this from the perspective of any NFL player. Right. Or does that to be from their former team?

[Bud Elliott]

I think it has to be from their program. Right.

[Danny Cannell]

Oh, okay.

[Chip Patterson]

All right.

[Danny Cannell]

Because I. I think the obvious answer is Josh Allen, Georgia. If it was not from there, like, give Georgia, like, a real NFL quarterback.

[Bud Elliott]

But I was gonna. Matthew Stafford is going to be the mvp. That was my first thought. Now he's older, so it's hard to envision, but if you just put Matthew Stafford on Georgia, they're probably national champion. Yeah.

[Danny Cannell]

Nobody's beating them.

[Bud Elliott]

Right.

[Chip Patterson]

Patrick Mahomes to Texas Tech.

[Danny Cannell]

Oh, right, Exactly.

[Chip Patterson]

That's a good one. The one thing that Texas Tech was missing from being able to, like, really make a run at the national championship, if Patrick Mahomes was the quarterback instead of Baron Morton, that's a.

[Bud Elliott]

That's currently in the NFL. Some people said Cam Newton to Auburn.

[Chip Patterson]

There are some players. Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

Current NFL player last week, like, he.

[Danny Cannell]

He's. He could still throw.

[Bud Elliott]

I was trying to think of defense. Miles Garrett back at A M with Mike Elko could make a massive difference. I mean, he could be the type of player that could make them a national championship contender. I mean, they're already close. They were in the playoffs. If you would have added him to that mix, I would imagine him just ragdolling opposing offensive tackles. He does it in the NFL. Like, I think he could wreak havoc on that side. What about Saquon Barkley back at Penn State?

[Chip Patterson]

I don't think that. I don't think that dramatically changes the entire team like this. Because that's the other thing is we got to think about the Delta. Right? We got to think about who's. Who really takes them to the next level. Because Texas Tech, as I mentioned, already had a pretty high floor. You know, Patrick Mahomes takes them over the top. I don't think dropping Saquon on Penn State's team this year dramatically changes the entire special. I know.

[Bud Elliott]

I mean, he did kind of carry the Eagles to it. Now they had a complete team. But he did elevate Jalen Hurts. I think Rocco Beck could be that much better if he was handed off to Saquon Barkley.

[Chip Patterson]

What if it was Micah Parsons?

[Bud Elliott]

Oh, similar to Miles Garrett.

[Chip Patterson]

Are we. Are we basically locked into edge rushers and quarterbacks? That's another interesting. Like, yeah, talk about one player who could dramatically improve a team. That. That one player would have to either be a quarterback or an edge rusher.

[Danny Cannell]

I think the other two quarterback situations here. Daniel Jones back to Duke, given what just happened.

[Bud Elliott]

Right now. Absolutely.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah.

[Danny Cannell]

And then Trevor back to Clemson.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

Oh, my goodness.

[Danny Cannell]

Massively different team with Trevor Lawrence than Chris Fazina. Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah. Because again, that's the other piece of this 20, 26. So I guess it would be Brendan Sorsby to Patrick Mahomes, but still Brendan.

[Bud Elliott]

No offense to Sourceby.

[Chip Patterson]

No offense to Brendan Sourceby. What about teams? What about the team?

[Bud Elliott]

What about Carolina? Drake, May.

[Chip Patterson]

Drake, May.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

I don't know. Belichick probably wouldn't want him. The Tide of the Patriots a little dicey right now. He'd probably say, no, we're good. Things are a little bit contentious there.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah. Who. Who else. Who else is on that, like, lower end of team might be like. But then you had one player who's currently in the NFL.

[Bud Elliott]

Well, like, if you put Josh. Josh Allen back in Wyoming.

[Chip Patterson]

How. How much could Josh Allen do at Wyoming?

[Danny Cannell]

Probably a lot.

[Bud Elliott]

You could probably get him into the championship. He'd get him the College Football Playoff. I would hope. Although he did throw a lot of picks. Maybe he would take too many risks, but he could run over some dudes. He would get them to the playoff.

[Danny Cannell]

If you put Baker back at Oklahoma, like, they're probably national title favorite, right?

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

You know, it's a good one. Amos back to Florida State.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah. Yep. That would be big. That'd be big.

[Chip Patterson]

Somebody said Josh Allen threw three picks against Nebraska. Nebraska and blew the COVID Like, if.

[Danny Cannell]

Brock Purdy went back to Iowa State, they'd probably take that right now.

[Chip Patterson]

Oh, yeah.

[Danny Cannell]

Heavily.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

Which Alabama quarterback would you want hurt? Surprise.

[Danny Cannell]

Oh.

[Bud Elliott]

Two. Two. I would not want to. His confidence is shot and his health issues.

[Chip Patterson]

Derrick Henry. Forget the quarterback.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

There you go.

[Bud Elliott]

Still going strong.

[Chip Patterson]

We've solved Alabama's running issues. Yes. Yeah.

[Danny Cannell]

Back to Colorado. He's a Pro Bowler now, guys.

[Bud Elliott]

That's right.

[Chip Patterson]

You are factually correct. Bud Elliott. He is. That is a hundred percent.

[Bud Elliott]

But that was Dion's best two years war with Shador, I think. I mean, it would absolutely. They would take him back in a heartbeat.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah. Who. Any others come to mind right here.

[Bud Elliott]

Burrowed lsu.

[Chip Patterson]

Burrow to LSU next year. So you're going from Sam Levitt to Joe Burrow. Joe Burrow in Lane Kiffin's offense.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah. That's pretty. Pretty good.

[Danny Cannell]

Is there any team that would not take a quarterback who has an NFL starting quarterback?

[Bud Elliott]

Well, that's.

[Chip Patterson]

Oh, Texas.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah. They would not take viewers back.

[Chip Patterson]

Who's. Who is the current viewers.

[Danny Cannell]

Is an NFL starter?

[Chip Patterson]

No, no. But I'm Just saying, like this player in the NFL, like who's who.

[Bud Elliott]

I don't think. I don't think Notre Dame would take.

[Chip Patterson]

Back riley Leonard for C.J. carr.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah. I think that what they've seen in C.J. carr, they're feeling pretty good and he's more.

[Danny Cannell]

They clearly upgraded there. I mean, like among teams that have a guy who's actually like a starting NFL qb.

[Chip Patterson]

Okay. But I think the idea is just anybody. Anybody.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah. Can you get somebody back to help you out?

[Chip Patterson]

I do not think that there is a Texas. A former Texas quarterback in the NFL right now who. Steve Sarkeesian would take over Arch.

[Bud Elliott]

Do you think Ohio State would take back C.J. stroud or Justin Fields? I don't know.

[Chip Patterson]

I would. I would take CJ Stroud over Julian saying.

[Bud Elliott]

I mean, the dude was pretty. I mean, I know he kind of cratered down the end when things got rougher, but I don't know.

[Chip Patterson]

I mean, I would talk about Shroud or saying. Because they both did.

[Bud Elliott]

But is it the difference? Is it improves the most? Like, that's the question. Which program improves the most? I don't know if you improve that much more.

[Danny Cannell]

He's got to be like what, 26, 25 years old now.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

Shroud.

[Danny Cannell]

That's a big difference.

[Bud Elliott]

It is.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah. The experience. I think C.J. stroud would absolutely carve up a college game right now.

[Bud Elliott]

But Julian saying just carved up everybody until the end.

[Chip Patterson]

Michael Pinnicks back to Indiana.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

I would take him over Josh Hoover. Right. You know, would you take Cam Ward over Darian Mensah?

[Danny Cannell]

Yes.

[Bud Elliott]

I think you'd have to.

[Chip Patterson]

Okay. Who else would be on the. No former Nicks? Would you take back Bo Nix over Dante Moore?

[Danny Cannell]

I'm gonna take like 27 year old Bo Nicks or over 20 year old Dante Moore.

[Bud Elliott]

Like, even with all the ankle surgeries that there's. He's denying. And Sean Payton just brought out to light. Do you see that story?

[Danny Cannell]

No, I didn't.

[Bud Elliott]

Bo Nicks held a press conference. Call out Sean Payton said he shouldn't be talking about my surgeries.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

Got a little bit uncomfortable. Yeah.

[Danny Cannell]

Wow.

[Chip Patterson]

I love it.

[Bud Elliott]

This is what we do on mailbags, Joey.

[Danny Cannell]

This is.

[Bud Elliott]

This is a real conversation. Will Levis.

[Chip Patterson]

Over. I guess Will Levis would be over Kenny Minchi.

[Danny Cannell]

Yep.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah.

[Danny Cannell]

I'm gonna take Will Evans over Kenny Mitch.

[Bud Elliott]

Yep.

[Chip Patterson]

Oh, boy. Now. Now we're really starting to. Maybe I would take it, but what about.

[Bud Elliott]

See Jackson dart the whole mess? I don't. Trinidad Chambliss Played really well this year. Something accused of being a Jackson Dart hater. So I don't want to. I don't want to ruffle any feathers.

[Danny Cannell]

But, like, no, I don't know if.

[Bud Elliott]

There'S that much of a significant improvement. Trinidad Chambliss was outstanding.

[Danny Cannell]

Like, non. Non QB edition.

[Bud Elliott]

Oh, Dak Prescott to Mississippi State. Yeah, that would be a great upgrade.

[Danny Cannell]

That's a great call.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah.

[Danny Cannell]

Like George Pickens back to Georgia.

[Bud Elliott]

Does Ohio State take any wide receiver back over Jeremiah?

[Chip Patterson]

No.

[Danny Cannell]

Well, they lost Tate, though. I mean, right, Right. Yeah. If all of a sudden Jeremiah is your two, that's js.

[Chip Patterson]

So, like, you bring back jsn, right? Yeah. Yeah. Fun, fun thought.

[Bud Elliott]

Cousins of Michigan State all day long, David.

[Danny Cannell]

Absolutely.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

Good call.

[Chip Patterson]

T.J. watt to Wisconsin.

[Bud Elliott]

Would you refusc. Would you rather have Sam Darnold or Caleb Williams?

[Chip Patterson]

Caleb.

[Danny Cannell]

Caleb.

[Bud Elliott]

I don't know. I thought we were talking about all that veteran experience, you know, but through a lot more playing in the super.

[Chip Patterson]

Bowl, we're talking about 2026. If Lincoln Riley's the head coach, I want to have Caleb Williams rather than.

[Bud Elliott]

Run his system fair.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Danny Cannell]

Like, if Caleb had the Seattle's defense and Darnold had Chicago's defense, does Seattle make the playoffs? Because, like, you can't assume the Bears defense can get as lucky as it did this year.

[Bud Elliott]

Right.

[Danny Cannell]

It was like, you know, turnover, like, crazy stuff.

[Bud Elliott]

Wisconsin or NC State with Russell Wilson, Both of them would take them, right?

[Chip Patterson]

No, hold on, hold on. Right now. Yes, I would rather have C.J. bailey. Oh. If we're talking about for the 2026 season, I would rather have C.J. bailey than Russell Wilson.

[Danny Cannell]

How old? Russell?

[Chip Patterson]

Mr. Unlimited.

[Bud Elliott]

He's getting up there.

[Chip Patterson]

He's getting close to me. He's not that much younger.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah, he's got to be like late 30s, right.

[Bud Elliott]

What if you're in Michigan, would you rather have J.J. mcCarthy or Underwood with what we know now, which is J.J. mcCarthy has not been all that he was cracked up to be. I think they might stick with Underwood.

[Chip Patterson]

That's. It's kind of like the text situation with architecture, right?

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, but arch is way better than Underwood.

[Danny Cannell]

I think coaches might prefer the floor of McCarthy.

[Bud Elliott]

And again, this is the college.

[Danny Cannell]

What's been on the ceiling of Underwood?

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, right. I mean, we're kind of flipping it because Signetti did uncover a new thought process going. Production over potential. The NFL wants the potential upside. But in college, you want to know what you're getting? It's a good question.

[Chip Patterson]

I like it very fun conversation. Thank you Nick for jumping in back to the big old bag of mail. This one is a little bit of a conversation that we touched on in the thick of the college football playoffs. So now that we've got a little bit more room to let it breathe, D Ham jumped in five star review and said why are we not receding after every round? Shouldn't the top see seed get the best draw throughout? I remember we sort of like discussed it a little bit. But do you thoughts on receding in the College Football Playoff?

[Bud Elliott]

For whatever reason, that is my least concern when it comes to the college football playoffs. It doesn't bother me at all. In fact, I actually prefer it because from the bracket standpoint when I was doing NFL brackets and you had to, you know which one gets which and you had to figure it out who gets home field and manipulating those. I mean, I guess the, the question does make sense. Shouldn't you favor the one seed? Maybe it adds a little more intrigue to the regular season and prioritizing how good of a regular season you had it just I don't give it much thought. It doesn't bother me at all. Like look at Miami's path was probably the hardest. Maybe I'm arguing with Tom about that, you know, and they were the 10 seed clout. Could it have gotten harder? You know, from.

[Danny Cannell]

I do think we need to recede if we go to 16 for the reason of anything you can do to impart more advantage to the team that earns that top seed helps to keep the regular season more meaningful.

[Bud Elliott]

And if you get two home games potentially right, if you do them on site, then that second round becomes. Then you do want to prioritize that like the NFL does.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah, I think in college sports bracket luck is great. You know, I mean it's. This is chaos like we talk about, especially where the margins are thinner than ever. If the difference between the 10 seed and the 2 seed is getting smaller and smaller and smaller, then don't overweight finishing in that two spot. When a selection committee is going to be the one that determines who gets the two and who's lined up all along the way, throw like make the decision and then that's the end of it and we just roll it out there and see what happens. I, I like the chaos that we get without receding in college sports. I understand why they do it in the NFL. I don't love it but because like you said Danny, it's kind of confusing. I like a bracket, I like to fill out a bracket and sort of predict what the matchups are going to be like. But I think that in college sports I I like the no receding that we've got. I think I would prefer that moving forward. Coming up on the other side, more of your questions and our answers, including who can go from worse to first and more next. In a world full of noise, long term thinking stands out. On the Capital Ideas podcast, Capital Group leaders explore the decisions that matter most in investing, leadership and life. It's a rare look inside a firm that's been helping people pursue their financial.

[Bud Elliott]

Goals for more than 90 years.

[Chip Patterson]

Listen to the Capital Ideas podcast from Capital Group, published by Capital Client Group.

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[Chip Patterson]

For 20% [e-mail] back here on the COVID 3 podcast. This question before we got started comes from Zach. Yes, welcome Back to the PAC12 mailbag. Question, where do you slot the PAC12 in the group of six? Is it stronger than the American or does it just take the Mountain West's place as the number two? Yes, for those of you who might not be sort of resettled and recalibrated and we'll do a special conference realignment reset episode when we get closer to the actual transition date. The PAC12 will be welcoming in a host of teams from the Mountain west to be able to reconstitute the PAC 12. Washington state and Oregon State now being able to have a full league that will be deemed a conference. They'll play a conference championship. And a lot of those are going to be on our networks. We're excited to be able to bring those to you on CBS and CBS Sports Network. So to Zach's question, as you sort of look at the hierarchy of the group of six, where do you think the Pac 12 will slot in?

[Danny Cannell]

So I think it is slightly below the American, but I do think it's better than a Mountain West.

[Bud Elliott]

Better than the Sun Belt?

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah. What I think is Sunbelt's pretty bad, to be honest.

[Chip Patterson]

Is that because of the way that like the Food chain has kind of gobbled up the Sun Belt.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

It'S tough.

[Bud Elliott]

What a rough run it's been for the Mac too.

[Chip Patterson]

Oh God.

[Bud Elliott]

Had a run when it was like when they had P.J. fleck at Western Michigan. When you had Northern Illinois was good. There were some years when they were the teams from, you know, the group of five and they just have been completely diminished.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah. The Sunbelt has not like lost any team. You know, they haven't been picked apart the way that the Mountain west was. But so they at least still have, they still have those passionate fan bases. Right. You know, they're still leaning into all their traditions and fans of those programs are still able to grab ahold things. But what they can't grab a hold of is their star players because the all Sunbelt team feels like it gets picked apart basically every season. For those listening at home who might not have a computer nearby. So Oregon State, Washington State, obviously they are going to be welcoming in Boise State, Colorado State, Fresno State, San Diego State, Utah State and Texas State. So Texas Tech excuse. So Sunbelt does lose one Texas State leaving the Sun Belt to go join the new Pack 12. I mean when you're getting San Diego State with Sean Lewis, when you're getting Utah State with Bronco, I mean the. I thought that we had a pretty decent Matt in season at Fresno State. Colorado State just went and hired Jim Mora Jr. Boise State's always going to be Boise. Kind of feels like they lopped off a lot of the programs that you can be excited about in terms of investment and sort of pushing this thing into the.

[Danny Cannell]

On the Mac piece. I, I do think cord cutting has hurt them.

[Chip Patterson]

Huh.

[Danny Cannell]

Like their best run was kind of been like oh, three to 14 time. And cord cutting really started to hit at the very tail end of that, you know. And I think they were largely benefiting from. We had fewer channels. Right. Everybody had cable. Like, like they, they were something you would just kind of channel surf. It's like, oh cool, it's a high scoring game. There's football on. I'll watch it now. Like how often do you guys channel surf? Right. You have to actually seek something out to watch it. So that's kind of my suspicion there.

[Chip Patterson]

It's an interesting theory. I like that. So American still holding that spot. American also. And I'm, I'm not, I don't, I don't want to nitpick here, but the American has a gulf from the top of the conference to the bottom of the conference.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

So if not that all these. I, I think that in the PAC 12, the way that I see it, there may be a little bit more condensed, you know, from the top to the bottom. But the Americans top tier. You would take over the PAC 12's top tier, correct?

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah, yeah, I would. Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

Okay. And yeah. And of course, yes. Gonzaga joining the conference for basketball. If they ever feel the football team. Sure you'll have the option. This question 8:38am Eastern Time. Mailbag question bl1632 do you guys still believe in, quote, championship or bust? Some fans are saying that for Oregon and I think it's ridiculous. 12 team playoff makes it too hard to expect a championship. Is championship or bust a an unrealistic expectation for teams in 20, 26 and beyond?

[Danny Cannell]

No, it's ridiculous for this Oregon team, but I can't rule out it like being something that is a real expectation for maybe a certain team that like spent a ton of money to bring back a bunch of veterans, keep them out of the NFL, added some pieces like clearly like a shove the chips in the middle of the table type situation. I don't look at this Oregon team as like so much better on paper than everybody else, that if they fail to win the whole thing that it's a failure.

[Bud Elliott]

I guess that's the championship or bust is the one that you kind of have problems. I do think their goal should be to win the national championship and I think anything less of that is not reaching your goal. But if you make it to the College Football Playoff again and you get a win, but then you come up short in whatever round, I don't think it's a failure. But I do think that Oregon fans should have an expectation of we could win it all. I guess the championship bust is where it's like, that's where the terminology is a little harsh.

[Chip Patterson]

What about the mentality in a vacuum championship? It seems like the question is I.

[Bud Elliott]

Think there's like 10 to 15 programs, maybe 10, you know, closer to 10 than there is to 15 should feel like, like LSU. You're telling me they don't think national championship or bust even in the first year of Lane Kiffin. Ohio State thinks that every year. I guarantee you ask Ohio State fans or Ryan Day. They feel like this year was a bust. Yeah, I know.

[Danny Cannell]

I think they, they have like return on investment expectations at LSU and quick ones. I don't think they have like massive, you know, VC exit expectations in year one.

[Chip Patterson]

The question from the tailgate, define or bust that the season is a disappointment that it's like you're just like, man, that was the nothing that we can take away from that.

[Danny Cannell]

Like if lsu, which has not gone to the playoff yet since what the, the borough year, if they make like the, the, like the, the eight or the four, they're disappointed in that outcome. I don't think so.

[Bud Elliott]

I mean, and Gazarian Gozar brought up a good point. Like Phil Knight's not getting any younger. I, that is one reason I think for Oregon fans and for Phil Knight, he's thinking championship or bust. Like his window is closing. He's not getting any younger. I think he's absolutely with that mindset. Like I think like last year, I think Texas Tech was college football playoff or bust.

[Chip Patterson]

Yes.

[Bud Elliott]

And they made it. If they would have fallen short of the College Football Playoff, they would have felt like what to Bud's point about the money, like that was money that was just wasted. But I think they felt pretty good. You know, we got there, we showed up, we got an opportunity, now we know what we got. I still don't know if it's national championship or bust for Texas Tech, but they still did invest more money. They went out and got one of the highest paid quarterbacks. I think it's the same expectation, but I don't know if it's championship or bus still for Texas Tech. But I think Oregon's been knocking on the door for a while. Like this is several years where they've been close. I think they want to see that they haven't hit a plateau in the.

[Chip Patterson]

I think in the spirit of the question, from sort of looking at the, the fan angle of what would mark a successful season, I might, I mean I'm leaning a little bit on college basketball here, but small sample size. But given what we've seen from the two years of the 12 team playoff, I think, I think making the four means that you've, you're in it for the national title. And here's what I mean by that. The margins of all of our College Football playoff semifinals in the 12 team bracket have been wildly small. Ohio State beat Texas by a double digit margin, but that's because of a fumble. Scoop and score the other way. Texas was driving to tie the game. The Penn State, Notre Dame game came down to a field goal. Well, I guess not all of them. Excuse me, I forgot about Indiana, Oregon, that was not a close game. But then Ole Miss, Miami, right. That one was an absolute classic. With the Carson Beck game winning touchdown in college basketball in the NCAA tournament, you accept the chaos and the randomness. But if you make it to the Final Four, you feel like it was a successful season where you had a shot at the national title. I think for these teams that feel championship or bust, if you make it to that semifinal, you feel like you've got a chip in a chair, you're sitting at the table, and then whatever happens, happens. It's football. It's weird. It's one game you might. Might not play well, or there might be a call or an interception or something that goes. Doesn't go your way. But as a fan, when you are determining whether or not it's been a season that has met your expectations or not, if you have national championship expectations and you make it to the semifinal, to me that feels like you've at least met the expectation of being in the mix for it at the very, very end of the season.

[Danny Cannell]

I think that's fair. One of the other aspects is, you know, you can. You can make the eight without winning a game.

[Chip Patterson]

Right.

[Danny Cannell]

You can't make the four.

[Chip Patterson]

Correct.

[Danny Cannell]

Which means, I think that's fair.

[Chip Patterson]

You need to win one or two playoff games to be able to feel like you've got.

[Danny Cannell]

Or you will have beating a real team.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah.

[Danny Cannell]

You can make the. Like, you can make the eight without beating a team that a lot of our fan base is going to say doesn't even belong in the playoff. Right.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

Like Oklahoma.

[Danny Cannell]

No, I'm just kidding. Yeah, exactly.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah. Appreciate the question. Appreciate you jumping in and getting the conversation early. Let's go one last.

[Danny Cannell]

We got a shorty.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, we got.

[Chip Patterson]

We got one last. One common NFL topic is who can go from worst to first. And a little bit later on, we'll do a bigger episode called Turnaround Teams, where we try to identify teams that are going to have the biggest jump. But let's just sort of scatterbrain this right now. Who do you think can go from disaster season to bowl game or better in 2026?

[Danny Cannell]

So how are we defining disaster? Like 4, Nate, or worse than the P5?

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah, I think it's. You are a power conference team. You thought you were going to be in the bowl game, bowl season, and then you ultimately spent holidays at home.

[Danny Cannell]

Oh, okay. How about Stanford?

[Chip Patterson]

How about Oklahoma State?

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah, yeah, clearly that. That's a better one in Stanford.

[Chip Patterson]

Do you think that. Do you think Purdue has a year two bump under Barry Odom?

[Danny Cannell]

I think it's possible. They lost Nitro Tiger. Right. So he's pretty good. Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

Wisconsin was 4 and 8 and their schedule's about to get a lot more manageable.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah, that's a good one.

[Chip Patterson]

That's one that stood out.

[Bud Elliott]

Florida count four and eight to.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah, yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

Seven or eight wins. I think that's a pretty reasonable expectation.

[Danny Cannell]

West Virginia, I think.

[Chip Patterson]

I don't know. Tough to take that temperature right now.

[Danny Cannell]

I just think you got some of the teams in front of them kind of maybe falling off a little bit.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah, sure. A little bit more real estate.

[Danny Cannell]

Second year under Rich Rod. I think he's. I think he's still good at doing what he does.

[Chip Patterson]

Who else? Syracuse.

[Danny Cannell]

I mean, look, I guess you can't rule it out.

[Chip Patterson]

Steven Jelly, like, you know, Steve Angelli comes back. Steve Angeli's healthy. That totally changes the offense which was down to a fourth string lacrosse player by the middle of the season. So there's no.

[Bud Elliott]

Without Toosie. I don't know.

[Chip Patterson]

He was putting Fran Brown on blast. He was.

[Bud Elliott]

Could have been the missing piece.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah, I think in the sec probably Florida is the best, the best chance I could see South Carolina rebounding to make a bowl.

[Chip Patterson]

From 4 and 8.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, we said Virginia Tech, right?

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah, for sure. Yep. Well, again, a little bit later on in the off season we'll have one of our. One of our staples is turnaround teams where we will do a deeper dive into some of the candidates to be able to have big bounce back seasons, the reasons why and so much more. We look forward to that and we thank you everybody for jumping in on this mailbag episode. Remember, you can come and join us live. You can reach out to us individually and you can go leave us a five star review. And in that review you put a mailbag question. We'll tackle it in a future mail bag episode and you can follow him on Twitter at Danny Canal. You can follow him@bud elliot3. You can follow me at Chip Underscore Patterson. Gentlemen, thank you very much.

[Danny Cannell]

See y'. All.

[Bud Elliott]

See ya.

[Chip Patterson]

I'm back. I'm really back.

[Danny Cannell]

School Spirits returns.

[Chip Patterson]

Why am I here? Not dead, right? This place is an absolute death trap. We need to get out of here now.

[Danny Cannell]

School Spirits new season now streaming only on Paramount plus.