Stanford Fires Troy Taylor, Spring Game Scrimmages, More! | Cover 3 College Football Podcast

Summary

Cover 3 College Football Podcast

Episode: "Stanford Fires Troy Taylor, Spring Game Scrimmages, More!"

Date: March 26, 2025
Hosts: Chip Patterson, Tom Fornelli, Danny Kanell

Episode Overview

This episode dives deeply into Stanford’s abrupt firing of head football coach Troy Taylor, examining the details of his dismissal, the evolving power structure within college football programs, and the unique circumstances at Stanford. The hosts also discuss the feasibility and risks of spring game scrimmages between different programs, and later answer mailbag questions about College Football Playoff scheduling, sabotaging rivals with donor money, and Iowa football’s quarterback situation. The episode maintains Cover 3’s signature mix of direct analysis, banter, and insider observations.

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Major Segment 1: Stanford Fires Troy Taylor – What Does It Mean?

(Starts ~04:47)

Key Details of Firing:

• Troy Taylor fired following an investigation into allegations of bullying, belittling female athletic staffers, seeking to remove a compliance officer after she warned of rules violations, and making inappropriate comments about a woman's appearance.
• Stanford GM Andrew Luck (not the former QB), who was only hired in November, made the firing decision—a notable departure from traditional athletic director-led moves.

Notable Quotes:

• Chip Patterson [06:15]:

  "This firing, based on the statements, came from general manager Andrew Luck. Now, some of these general managers across college football do not have hiring, firing power."

• Danny Kanell [06:42]:

  "The fact that it is Andrew Luck... we're talking about a legend at the school...his title, which is general manager, of course, brings it into question. I think this is all kind of an evolution of college football, and there's going to be different power structures at different schools."

• Tom Fornelli [08:20]:

  "Stanford, I feel safe saying, is an athletic department that views its football program in a much different way than most athletic departments..."

Investigation Timeline & Process:

• Taylor was previously warned in Feb 2024 that further misconduct could lead to termination following a first investigation.
• A second investigation concluded July 2024, but action only followed later reporting and public scrutiny—echoed as “very Pat Fitzgerald” by Chip [10:36].

Key Points Discussed:

• The unusual power structure at Stanford, with a GM (Andrew Luck) making the call.
• The extent and nature of the violations: mostly about workplace hostility and compliance tensions.
• Timing questions: News broke publicly before administrative action despite earlier internal findings.

---

Stanford’s Culture and Football’s Place

• Stanford views football as "just one of our sports" rather than the driving force of the athletic department—a stark contrast to most Power 5 schools.
• They are slow or resistant to changes like NIL and the transfer portal, affecting competitiveness.

Quotes:

• Danny Kanell [14:49]:

  "They were one of the last to kind of...embrace NIL. They completely ignore the transfer portal. They do hold themselves to a totally different standard."

• Chip Patterson [15:10]:

  "They run themselves like a university and not a football team."

• Danny Kanell [15:13]:

  "It's admirable in a lot of ways, but ... it cost them competitively for sure."

---

The Challenge of the Stanford Job

• The early signing period, NIL, and strict admissions are particular hurdles.
• Open speculation about possible successors—interim coach expected, but the field is wide.

Candidates and Challenges:

• Andrew Luck not expected to coach, but deep ties to the school mentioned.
• Former Stanford figures like David Shaw and Jason Garrett (Ivy League background) referenced as logical fits.
• Dave Clawson, Jeff Monken, and Troy Calhoun floated—debate on whether anyone would take on such a challenge.
• Danny Kanell [17:36]:

  "Good luck seeing who you can find out there because it's not going to be easy. And how desirable is it because of all those challenges we talked about."

Stanford's Status in the ACC:

• Generally agreed as a "low-tier football job" within the ACC despite being a "top-tier school."

---

Major Segment 2: Spring Game Scrimmages—Will Coaches Embrace Them?

(Starts ~27:34)

Background:

• Deion Sanders and Fran Brown propose the idea of spring scrimmages between schools replacing standard intra-squad spring games.
• NCAA waiver required for this to take place—OSU’s Mike Gundy advocates for the fundraising potential with charity/NIL angles.

Key Discussion Points:

• Potential advantages: TV and ticket revenue, increased excitement for fans, better practice for teams.
• Host skepticism: Concerns about player injury risk, especially with high-value NIL athletes.
• Comparison to joint NFL training camps: Could be run as controlled practices to minimize injury; coaches emphasize "thud" (no full tackling) rather than live contact.

Notable Quotes:

• Danny Kanell [29:01]:

  "I wish it would. I think it's a great idea."

• Tom Fornelli [31:04]:

  "You'd be a little more fired up for a new team...more physical, more hitting."

• Tom Fornelli [32:48]:

  "I think if you compare injury data, you're far more likely to have a serious injury in a game than you are in practice."

• Danny Kanell [35:30]:

  "My thing is I don't think you'll ever see a preseason football game...but I do think what you could see is quarterbacks wearing red jerseys...even you might see that receiver wearing a red jersey...and both players have them."

Counterpoints:

• Tom Fornelli [34:36]:

  "The minute there's a serious injury in one of these games, they're not going to want to do them anymore."

• Danny Kanell [38:05]:

  "I was thinking that would concern me more...fights...That would be my biggest concern if I was a coach, especially with the rivalry aspect to it."

• Tom Fornelli [37:06]:

  "No. Do you watch preseason football?...It is not an interesting sport to watch at half speed."

Fan and Coach Impact:

• Concerns spring games currently showcase underclassmen and depth chart development for fans.
• Would fans tune into actual “thud” drills or half-speed preseason-type matchups? The group doubts it would be a huge draw unless star players are involved.

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Major Segment 3: Mailbag Q&A

(Starts ~42:04)

1. CFP Format and Non-Conference Scheduling

(Timestamp ~44:35)

Question:
With the College Football Playoff moving to a format where conference record is all that matters, what is the incentive for tough non-conference matchups?

• Hosts' Analysis:
  • Expect teams to reduce risky non-conference scheduling as there's no playoff incentive.
  • Suggests possibility of the Power 4 moving to 10-game conference schedules ("if you're at 18 or 16 teams, you can't be playing 8-game schedules").
  • Only remaining incentive may be for seeding.
• Danny Kanell [45:42]:

  "That's where you have to incentivize seeding...so that you are incentivized to not roll out your backups and have a game that's 'meaningless.'"

  • TV networks and conference commissioners most invested in keeping strong non-conference games.

2. Sabotaging Your Rival with Donor Money

(Timestamp ~53:24, question announced and teased for next episode)

Prompt:
Given $10 million, what’s the best way to spend it sabotaging your rival’s ideal season?

• Do you pay opponents, invest in a top rival, or go for creative sabotage?
• Discussion tabled for next episode—listeners invited to share ideas.

3. Iowa Quarterback Situation

(Timestamp ~51:37)

• Mark Gronowski as transfer QB: Can he solve Iowa’s long-standing QB problems?
• Tom Fornelli:

  "If you look at last season, Iowa scored 27.7 points per game. It's not like the offense was still terrible...but they just don't look like the same team [in terms of line play and development]."

• Danny Kanell:

  "But yeah. Again, I don't think their offense was a huge problem last year...for Iowa five years ago if they scored 28 points per game, they're 10–2 like without question."

4. John Shire’s Illinois Near-Miss

(Timestamp ~48:24)

• Listener asks about John Shire as a recruiting miss for Illinois basketball.
• Tom Fornelli describes it as a miss, but less painful than others, since Duke was always the favorite.

---

Memorable Moments & Humor

• "White Mike" Nickname for John Shire ([50:18])
  • Chip shares how Shire’s Duke players were surprised at his high-level playing pedigree:

    "They call him White Mike…the players are calling him White Mike and laughing about it."

• Lighthearted Critique of Preseason Football ([37:06])
  • Tom Fornelli on spring scrimmages:

    "Do you watch preseason football?...It is not an interesting sport to watch at half speed."

• Creative Coach Suggestions for Stanford Job ([16:06]):
  • Jokes about David Shaw, Jason Garrett, and even Condoleezza Rice making a return.
• Satirical Mailbag Prompt ([53:24]):
  • $10 million sabotage brainstorm, with hosts inviting outlandish listener input for the next episode.

---

Important Timestamps

• 04:47 — Stanford fires Troy Taylor, investigation timeline, Andrew Luck’s role
• 10:36 — Comparing to Pat Fitzgerald/Northwestern handling
• 15:10 — Stanford’s old-school approach, struggles to compete in modern landscape
• 16:17 — Who might replace Taylor? Coaching carousel speculation
• 22:50 — Is Stanford a low-tier ACC football job?
• 27:34 — Spring game scrimmages proposal and feasibility
• 34:36 — Transfer portal & NIL impact on player risk in spring
• 42:04 — Mailbag: CFP scheduling & non-conference incentives
• 53:24 — Mailbag preview: $10M to sabotage rival
• 51:37 — Mailbag: Can Iowa’s new QB fix their offense?
• 48:24 — Mailbag: John Shire and Illinois recruiting

---

Takeaways & Tone

• The episode has a candid, insider feel, with hosts blending tough analysis (on power structures, NCAA compliance, Stanford’s decline) with familiar, humorous asides (“White Mike,” preseason football jokes).
• The group is skeptical of surface-level reforms (like inter-team spring scrimmages), focusing on structural risk, program culture, and shifting incentives in the evolving world of big-time college football.
• Listener engagement is encouraged, especially with wild hypothetical questions and behind-the-scenes stories.

---

Summary prepared for those who want a smart, entertaining, and comprehensive grasp of the episode’s big stories and discussion threads.

Transcript

[A]

This episode is brought to you by PNC Bank. A lot of people think podcasts about in depth analysis on college football are boring sometimes, sure. But doing the research and understanding every game gives you the knowledge that you need to make small talk with any sports fan anywhere. It's like banking with PNC Bank. It might seem boring to save, plan and make calculated decisions with your bank, but keeping your money boring is. It's what helps you live a more happily fulfilled life. PNC Bank Brilliantly boring since 1865 Brilliantly boring since 1865 is a service mark of the PNC Financial Services Group, Inc. PNC Bank national association member FDIC I'm.

[B]

NFL linebacker TJ Watt and this is my personal best. YPB by Abercrombie is the activewear I'm always wearing. That's why I reached out to co design their latest drop. I worked with designers to create high performance activewear that holds up to my toughest workouts. Shop YPB by Abercrombie in store, online and in the app because your personal best is greater than anything.

[C]

Welcome Back to the COVID 3 podcast with your hosts Chip Patterson, Tom Fernelli, Danny Cannell and Bud Elliott. It's your call for the best coverage from national signing day to the national championship and everything in between. CBS Sports presents the COVID 3 podcast.

[A]

And welcome back to the COVID 3 podcast here on CBS Sports. That's Tom Fornelli. I'm Chip Patterson coming to you [e-mail] cover3 and everywhere you get your podcast on demand. Thanks for hanging out. Smash that subscribe, smash that like and come and join us in the chat. Aka the COVID 3 tailgate or where Garrett said. All right, Chip, my meeting just ended. You can start the stream now. Thanks for waiting on me.

[C]

Actually, he said start the steam.

[A]

He did say start the steam. Eyes giving him. Giving him a little credit. All right.

[C]

Still start the steam. That's how it goes.

[A]

Danny Cannell will be joining us here shortly as well. Bud Elliott out on assignment. Lots to get into today. We do have some breaking news out of college football from the acc. We'll be getting into that Stanford and sort of what the future of that looks like here in just a little bit. Looks like we got DK in the house. Let's go.

[D]

I'm in the house, baby. Let's go, let's go. Caught a little traffic. I was coming back so I'm glad I made it in time. Couple minutes late. Better late than never. Are you guys having serious. I know we have serious stuff to Talk about, but are you guys having serious basketball withdrawal? I found myself live betting the women's game the other night. Action like the five, the first like. And I saw Tom say it. It does hit you like a ton of bricks. Thursday and Friday are epic games all over everywhere. And then the early window Saturday and Sunday, it's kind of like, all right, where are the games? And then Monday night I'm sitting there live hammering Yukon live line, just lay the points with the favorites in the women's game. I'm having some withdrawal. I can't wait for tomorrow night.

[C]

So like as soon as juju went down, you were live betting the opponent?

[D]

No, I. So I actually had USC minus 18 and or minus 19 and a half. Was getting a little bit nervous. Did not do anything, did not hedge. Plus that game tipped at 10. I'm not gonna lie. I wasn't that crazy about watching it. So I went to bed and woke up a winner, which was always a good thing.

[A]

Hey, we love waking up to winners. No, the, the real challenge is if you were hammering the NIT quarterfinals last night. Like if you were, if you were fired up about the mocks being able to advance on into msg because like these games that you win in the nit, that gets you a ticket to the Big Apple right now. So congrats to Ben Kercheville. North Texas taking down Oklahoma State, that, that long rivalry between, between North Texas and the Cowboys and then Chattanooga both getting in there. If anyone's got any live bets for Loyola, Kent State or UAB UC Irvine, that's what you've got as your NIT Wednesday night play.

[C]

Loyola's still in it.

[A]

Loyola's still in it. They are four and a half point favorites against, against Kent State tonight.

[C]

I am, I'm in an NIT bracket pool.

[A]

Get out of here.

[C]

Shout out. NIT stew. And I've got, I've got Loyola winning it all. So that means I'm still alive, baby.

[A]

Oh, they go to Hinkle Field house now. Indianapolis. Thank you so much.

[C]

Cover MSG anymore. Wow. NIT down bad.

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

All right, let's get into it. So as, as Danny just mentioned, it is not the most. When we get caught off guard with some of these, you know, the, the scandal related firings, it is not exactly a hit. The sirens, you know, let's jump on right a minute and let's, let's, give you, let's give you 10 minutes of who's. How the tenure went down, who's going to be coming up next. I mean this is something that normally will take a little bit of time to be able to digest, but the fact of the matter is that right now, Troy Taylor, the head coach at Stanford, is out. He was fired by Stanford after an investigation into reports that he bullied and belittled female athletic staffers, sought to have an NCAA compliance officer removed after she warned him of rules violation, and. And repeatedly made, quote, inappropriate comments to another woman about her appearance. Now, there's levels to this among them that, like, there is, okay, well, what does this mean for Stanford football in 2025? What does this mean for Stanford football? Big picture. No, what is the Stanford job? But how about what this means in terms of the way a football program is organized? Because this firing, based on the statements, came from general manager Andrew Luck. Now, some of these general managers across college football do not have hiring, firing power.

[C]

This was my first question. Yes.

[A]

What.

[C]

Honestly, the first thing that came to mind was Ken Barton, fire Clark Lee.

[A]

Yeah, I was gonna say like this. This seems to be. I don't know if I could say precedent setting, precedent shattering. I mean, I did. I. Danny, the process, to me is probably more interesting than the violations.

[D]

When was the last time you saw a head coach fired? And then it said decision made by.

[A]

Like.

[D]

That was one of the more unique headlines and tweets. And just when the news. When it came across the news feed, it. That was the byline. It. You know, you would never. If Mike Norvell was fired, it wouldn't say fired by Michael Alford, the athletic. Like, it just doesn't happen. So I think there's two things to this. One, the fact that it is Andrew Luck, because we're talking about a legend at the school who just took the job in November. And then two, the fact of his title, which is general manager, of course, brings it into question. So I think every school, possibly, because. Because there's not like the NFL, they're pretty much all similar structures. I think different schools are going to have different power structures. Some athletic directors, traditional athletic directors, are going to hold that power. Some might delegate it to a guy like Andrew Luck. And I do remember, if you guys correct me if I'm wrong, when Andrew Luck was hired, it was kind of positioned as this is bigger than general manager, like, it was title. But they also said he's going to, you know, he's going to oversee the program. He's going to be in charge of all of it. You know, So I do think that's. And to your question about his. Barton going to be able to fire Clark Lee. I'm pretty sure Clark Lee hired Barton. So, like, that would be kind of crazy if that was flipped upside. And I'm sure there's a lot of scenarios like that where the head coach is hiring the general manager because they want to have the same vision for what the program wants. And then some programs are going to hire a general manager who might hire the head coach. But I think this is all kind of an evolution of college football, and there's going to be different. Different power structures at different schools.

[C]

Yeah. Particularly, like, if you look at this situation, Stanford, I feel safe saying, is an athletic department that views its football program in a much different way than most athletic departments view their football program. Whereas the truth of most athletic departments is the football team is the pro, the department, and then everybody else just kind of lives off of that. Stanford, I think, is one of those schools that actually just views football as one of our sports. It's like, it's one of the things we do. So that is interesting in this, but I think it's just the actual investigations and what went in. It's like you read the story very light on details. You just get the general sense that Troy Taylor is not the funnest person to work with, and he's kind of difficult. And I don't know, it is weird because the other story was that when the. It came out originally, like, last week, Luck was in a team meeting and doubling Troy Taylor, doubling down, saying, you know, we're gonna get. Blah, blah, blah, we're gonna get through this. And then out comes the thing where it's like, he's the one issuing the statement saying, you know, I've decided we need to make a change at, you know, in the football program. I don't. Andrew Luck's name might be on it. I. I don't know that Andrew Luck made this decision. Decision. There could be other people in charge.

[D]

At that school, he said. After consulting university leadership, I think Andrew Luck probably got pressure from university leadership saying, we're Stanford. This is unacceptable. Correct me if I'm wrong, but this was the second investigation, correct?

[A]

Correct.

[D]

There was one in 23, and then there was a new one. And the first one, I guess he signed something. Right.

[A]

That said, I've got that detail right here. In February 14th of 24, he signed a warning letter acknowledging he could be fired if conduct continued. Additional complaints were documented in a second investigation that ended in July of 2024. So they let him go through the 2024 season, the 24, 25 off season after having gone through a, what I'm going to call a disciplinary process. And it's not really until the reporting happens that we get action. This feels very Pat Fitzgerald.

[C]

It has to that. Yeah.

[A]

Not the same, you know, not the same issues leading to it, but at least in terms of we find out the story from a report, then the school takes action and then we find out that there has been investigations internally into this behavior for quite some time.

[C]

And none of it's good, but it's just, it's the timing of it all is kind of weird to me.

[D]

So I don't know Troy Taylor, Rick Newhousel, who comes on the show after me on Sirius. He does like just in between shows, but caught up with him, it's like, hey, can you believe this? And he was. And it wasn't. This was all fair. And so I'm not saying Rick was endorsing Troy Taylor or defending him, but. But he said it was surprising. He said this didn't seem like the character. They were on the same staff together at Colorado like 30 years ago, but I think they've stayed in touch and he sounded surprised by it. So I do think it's a word of caution to any coach. When you are struggling and you have massive buyouts, you better be careful with how you conduct yourself because teams, and I'm not saying he was innocent or guilty, he might have done it all and he signed a paper said if it continues. So clearly there was something. You wouldn't sign that if you didn't. But, you know, somebody put in the chat. I think it has to do, you know, more with nothing to do with harassing women. Maybe the contract. I don't know those details, but you better. I mean, with the amount of money that's at stake, you have to carry yourself to a certain standard or else they will find a reason to get rid of you.

[C]

Yeah. Another aspect to the story that just kind of raised my eyebrow. Not. No, that's the wrong way to put it. But yeah, it caused me to go down another kind of lane. Like apparently he was a real a hole to the compliance officer, a female. Now maybe he's just being an a hole to her because he's an a hole to women in general. But the, it's also possible he was being an a hole to her because he didn't like the fact that she kept telling him what he was doing he couldn't do.

[D]

Right.

[C]

It just did make me wonder. It's like, is Stanford more of a stickler for these rules than other schools or maybe is Sacramento State just like, yeah, whatever, do whatever we want. Because I mean, I think those are all based on the story. I think they were related to like practice time. Like he was having players there more than he's supposed to. And I wonder if, I don't know, it's. It's just an interesting peek behind what goes on behind the doors and some of these programs.

[D]

But again, I do think you get away with a lot more if you win. I mean, Jim Harbaugh was cordial to the compliance people for the ncaa. No, like, do you think Nick Saban was cordial to every invest like anybody? And it's not saying it's right or wrong.

[A]

Right.

[D]

But some people may just be irritated and irritable and it's a high stress job and they just want to get back to practice and they might treat you rudely that some places might take a little bit more offense to.

[C]

Yeah, there, there are plenty of examples of college coaches in basketball and football who are gigantic a holes, but they win. So you just say, hey, they're just being honest. That's just who they are. I love it. I appreciate the honesty. No, they're just a dick.

[A]

I spoke with a college staffer who was explaining about coming right out of college. They were hoping to get into, you know, like sports media and communications. And they got a, they got a job at Auburn, but the only job that was available was in compliance. Oh no, the year's 2010, which means they spent the entire season digging through Cecil Newton's phone records, like, number of things. The, the compliance office is the mo. One of the most interesting places. And to your point, Tom, that compliance officer could have been male. That compliance officer could have been female. That compliance officer could have been an alien. And Troy Taylor might have, could not, might have been like, I cannot stand this person because I am trying to field a winning football program and you are hammering me on the tiniest of details. And maybe because you are Stanford, the Directors cup champions, like you do, like want to follow every single one of those NCAA rules and bylaws and details.

[D]

I mean, they didn't really. I was doing some research this morning. I mean, they were one of the last to kind of, I don't even want to say embrace nil. They were like, well, man, we really have to do something. And they didn't do it for a couple years. They completely ignore the transfer portal. Like, they are different. They do hold themselves to a totally different standard.

[C]

They run themselves like a university and not A football team.

[D]

Exactly. I was just gonna say it's, it's admirable in a lot of ways, but in a while the ways it cost them competitively for sure.

[A]

I know Bud has brought this up. I think even Barton did too when he was still here. The, the early signing period wrecked Stanford because of Stanford's admissions calendar. Like they just could not promise recruits that you're in based on when students are admitted. And so the like capable players were going to Notre Dame or they were going to Wake Forest or they were going to Northwestern because they didn't have that confirmation that they had been accepted by the university at the time in December when you're supposed to sign for the early signing period. I mean there's been a lot in terms of the way that things have changed that have impacted Stanford in a way that's made it more difficult. So what now?

[C]

Andrew Luck for coach?

[A]

I mean we're obviously, we've got to go interim coach here. There's no way that. Right.

[D]

Well, there is a similar available. What'd you say?

[C]

I, I could think of somebody who's probably available.

[D]

Are you saying Andrew Locke?

[C]

No. Oh, he's, he's currently the passing game coordinator for the Detroit Lions.

[A]

Oh, David Shaw.

[C]

Yep. Or get Condoleezza Rice. Remember when she was in Schefter tweeted that she was running to be like the coach of the Browns. Oh, the Browns, clearly, like Condi can run the football team.

[D]

So Chip, you said you have to go interim. There is a similar situation that unfolded. Kansas was a disaster and it was after spring football that Lance Leipold, you know, Les Miles was let go and that looked like the worst job in the country and they found nobody better. There was not a better candidate than Lance Leipold. Like, and that's what I think Stanford needs to try to find. Good luck because there aren't a lot of Lance Leipolds out there. But I don't think they have to go in term. But I do think you don't want to just hire anybody. So I think all options are on the table for a 35 year old, first time on the job, general manager. Like, good luck seeing who you can find out there because it's not going to be easy. And how desirable, how desirable is it because of all those challenges we talked about.

[A]

What are you thinking?

[C]

Who did Andrew Luck play for with the Colts?

[D]

Oh, there's a bunch. Chuck Pagano. Like I saw a lot of them. I saw Chuck Pagano, Pep Hamilton. Like there's a lot of Andrew luck ties that make a ton of sense.

[C]

Jason Garrett was in the running for the job before they hired Taylor.

[D]

Oh, is that why his name was brought about? Yeah, see I think he might. So I was confused because I, But I do think he played at Princeton, I think. Right. Jason Garrett, like he's an Ivy Leaguer.

[C]

Yes.

[D]

So like he gets the high academic institution. So I, I think it'd be, I think that'd be somebody I would call for sure.

[C]

Mike Bobo.

[A]

Listen, the Tailgate's been trying to sell Mike Bobo on stanford since about 8:56am so here's, here's what's really disappointing. I thought Troy Taylor was starting to flip things in terms of talent. The guy who's one of the players who's in the running for quarterback this year, Elijah Brown's a four star prospect who had other like power conference offers out there on the West Coast. A modern day kid, you know, like at the, the high school powerhouse out there in California. You were expecting him to take over and now I guess he still is. But how are you going to try to maintain that momentum? There have been a couple places where you kind of looked at the talent. All right, maybe this is going to be the year that this is going to turn and you break the streak of three and nine results. I think this roster is better than the roster Troy Taylor inherited, which is what makes me think that just sort of punting on the season would be a huge loss. And you've got to find somebody to get everyone locked in before the spring portal opens because you got to think everyone's going to come try to feast on some of those players, those four stars that are on the roster, those higher rated three stars that are on the roster. Like this is going to be something where whoever you bring in, they've got to do a job of being able to get everybody on the same page, being able to get them committed because I, I saw a step forward for Stanford on the field in 2025 and now that's obviously going to be something that's going to take some, some more evaluation moving forward.

[C]

Yeah, I don't know if I saw a huge improvement in the talent on that roster. I think that, I mean I, I thought that they played better last year. I don't know if that could say they were more talented. I think they were just kind of in the second year and you had Ashton Hollands as a second year starter yet Imnor at receiver and I just, I don't know. I get what you're Saying, I don't know if I totally agree with it.

[A]

What about Jim? There's no waste. Dave Clawson goes to Stanford after resigning from Wake. Right. And then would Tyson Helton be a decent hire?

[D]

I saw Clawson's name come up. I thought it makes sense. He won with less at Wake Academic School, you know, similar challenges as far as resources go. But I do think that's why he threw in the towel. Like, why would you go from one place that looks like it's really hard to win to another place that might be harder to win? And you've got to throw in the travel nightmare that's going from the west coast to east coast so many times.

[C]

Yeah, I, I don't, I don't think that makes any sense for Dave Claussen. You're going to a similar situation, like Danny just said, but you've got to travel more. And I would say you could probably. There's probably more money to spend at Stanford than there is at Wake.

[D]

If they tap into it.

[C]

If they tap into it. So if you feel like you'd be able to convince them of that, maybe. But I just, I think that's where.

[D]

Andrew Luck comes in, in this whole position. I think that's his main job is to try to access, what is it, $35 billion endowment that they've got, you know, and they, they pour a lot in the Olympic sports. They just don't pour it into football, which I think that may be what he's trying to do is campaign. I thought of two guys and somebody already kind of suggested, but a different tilt. I think Jeff Monkin or Troy Calhoun at the academies, like either one of those two guys that embrace a challenge. You know, they talk about some hard places to win with the lack of resources and academic requirements and just everything you have to deal with. But would Andrew Luck embrace the option offense? And they both kind of morph where they're not old school triple option, but they still don't like to throw the ball a ton.

[C]

Yeah, I don't think either one has to run the option. I mean, when you look at what Kansas does, they're running the option. It's just the modern version of it where there's actually passes involved. Like, I, I don't think if Jeff Monkin or Troy Calhoun took a job outside of a service academy, their offense would look that different. I just, I, I think they'd be able to do it as effectively. It's the situation of being able to find the guys that you're limited to recruiting and being able to make it work. But I think that they would have access to better players at Stanford than they do at Air Force and Army. So I, I think it would make sense. I also think it would just be fun if they did hire them and they did just run the option. Because I've long argued for years just run the option. More teams need to do it, especially those at a talent disadvantage. And I don't think that's changing anytime soon.

[A]

Andrew Luck demands that if you run the option, you at least have to run Spider2y banana three times a game. Okay. You just gotta at least have that roll out with the tight end leak.

[C]

Think about Andrew Luck though is. I bet Andrew Luck wouldn't minded running an option offense himself. I bet he would have had fun.

[A]

I bet he would have been great.

[C]

I bet he would have loved it.

[A]

It's a mobile big boy. Yeah. You know, that was one of the things everybody loved about him as like the perfect, the perfect prospect. Great point from Patrick in the tailgate. He, Ken Nematolo didn't run the option at San Jose. You know, he's just a good coach who end up an opportunity might be there for either one of those. And then is Stanford a mid tier or low tier job in the Atlantic Coast Conference?

[C]

Low tier.

[A]

Low tier. Yeah. Gosh. I mean there's 17. Being in the low tier means there's like 12 jobs better than you.

[C]

Top tier school, low tier football. Yep.

[A]

I mean it's, we might look back on the Harbaugh Shaw era as just like a, a comet golden era.

[D]

Although, I mean they, they have had some history. I mean they did have some of the greatest coaches and quarterbacks that we've seen, you know, come through the game, coached and played there.

[A]

But they were in Rose Bowls.

[C]

Yeah, but I, I think that, I mean this is just a, like a byproduct of the changes to the sport. You're seeing schools like Stamp, like smaller private schools or schools like Stanford's, like schools that look at themselves still as schools and not just, hey, we can make money playing football like programs. They're, it's. They're. Unless they adapt and odds are they won't because they don't really want to, it's going to be really hard for them to keep up, period. Like, we've seen it at Wake already. We're seeing it at Northwestern, we're seeing it at Stanford, like for every SMU in which it is a small private school. But we've got a ton of people involved who really, really really love football. Most of these schools are not the same way.

[A]

And then one final note on this. If it, if it has not already been understood, but for those of you at, you at home, when schools are making revenue sharing decisions, Stanford is a school that is going to value the revenue sharing opportunities for all of these other sports. And like, there might be external pressures here like, I don't know, the United States Olympic Committee and like making sure that this university that has led to gold medals for the United States on the world's biggest sports stage for decades, that they're not all of a sudden going to start falling behind. So I, I think that when they're, when they're having to decide how much of this, however many million dollars is going to go from one sport to another, more money is going to be put in some of those other buckets than it will be at some of these other sports. And that means less for football, something to keep an eye on. For sure.

[C]

We will keep, gets a lot of money.

[A]

Swim team. I mean that is like so much pride for the Atlantic Coast Conference when Katie Ledecky won those gold medals. You know, I mean, right. It means so much to the league. Got, got, got a chance to, to see, to see Jim Phillips over the weekend and we talked about some things and I'm disappointed we didn't get to talk about Katie Ledecky and those gold medals for the acc. So coming up on the other side, what started with a little bit of a friendly back and forth between Deion Sanders and Fran Brown is, has now all of a sudden led to more conversations about creative ways that we can look at the spring game as something a little bit different. All that and more.

[E]

This episode is brought to you by State Farm. Checking off the boxes on your to do list is a great feeling. And when it comes to checking off coverage, a State Farm agent can help you choose an option that's right for you. Whether you prefer talking in person on the phone or using using the award winning app, it's nice knowing you have help finding coverage that best fits your needs. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there.

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[A]

Patrick Talking about watching The SEC commercial that has Vince's run into the end zone in it. Listen, listen, if you, if, if you can, yeah, you can inherit everything, all the good and all the bad. That's what you get. All right, so we, we made an offhanded reference last week to the Deion Sanders suggesting that you do a scrimmage against another, you know, power conference team as a spring game. Fran Brown says, you know, hey, we're, we're ready to go. Then we find out that some of the paperwork is being filed because some NCAA bylaws would need a little bit of a waiver to be able to have this go down. And then Mike Gundy says, hey, this might be a great way for us to bring Bedlam back, you know, that great rivalry that is starting to be lost with Oklahoma's move to the Southeastern Conference. Part of Gundy's suggestion also included a charitable angle to this, where you're selling tickets and then being able to have some positivity for that. Maybe even you've got an nil angle as well. So my, my question was going to be, all right, so let's, let's rattle off the, the spring game scrimmages we want to see, but I don't think we'd really dug into the, the feasibility of this. Danny, do you think, do you think this can happen?

[D]

I wish it would. I think it's a great idea.

[A]

That sounds like.

[D]

No, but. So we're getting to a point, though, where we're almost ignoring the ncaa, any rules that are currently in place, and we're going to have this new, you know, CEO and, and new structure where there's going to be a new kind of policing agency. I know certain conferences have had rules. I think the Mac tried to do this before, and it was shut down because, you know, they weren't allowed to do it. I don't think it's that outside the box, especially when you consider what he said about what they could do with the gate, because he said, we can charge 25 bucks a person and all the money can go to your nil. And when you think of that, when you think of the money that's potentially there, it'd be a great money maker. You think of the TV networks that could get involved because I guarantee you they would want to air it.

[A]

100.

[D]

So, like, with spring, like, have you guys noticed we used to get multiple spring games on ESPN, ESPN2, like Alabama, Ohio State. Recently, it's kind of died off. Georgia. And I know they've never been plastered all Over. But there were more this year. Like, good luck trying to find them because they aren't really doing them.

[A]

They are choosing UFL over spring games.

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

So disappointing for me.

[D]

That's hugely disappointing. I would much rather watch a game. So I think money is always the driver. Even though I think this could be really good for the players and the teams and like, preparation and I think it'd be great for the fans. I do think the money that's potentially at stake could make this feasible. Like Dion throwing it out in the. Fran Brown will come out for three days. I don't think anything's happening this year, but the more coaches seem open to it, the more likely I think it could potentially happen.

[C]

Question for you, Danny. Describe to me if there's any difference in intensity. Like when you're in training camp and you're practicing against your teammates every day, is there a difference in intensity in those practices than the first time you do a scrimmage against a new team?

[D]

Now you'd be a little bit more fired up for a new team.

[C]

A little more physical.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

A little more hitting.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

So what happens the very first time your new 5 million dollar wide receiver transfer tears his ACL in one of these spring scrimmages? How long are these games going to last?

[D]

So, but here's what, here's why I would push back. Because Gundy was pretty clear and he said it was great clip, you should go. I mean, everybody should go listen to it. But he was like, this isn't your typical spring game. Because he said, nobody's doing spring games. And this is where, I mean, NFL teams did this.

[A]

Where.

[D]

I remember when I was with the Broncos, we went to the Texans, we went to Houston, and we were going to practice with them for three days and then was going to culminate in a true preseason game. And both coaches, but you know, Mike Shannon was talking to us, he said, now look, this team practices a little different than we do. We do things one way. We're gonna try to be on the same page, but they might push the envelope. We're gonna try. It's gonna be a work in progress, but let's just work with each other. Let's make sure. Let's make sure nobody gets hurt. Like that was the priority. And Gundy did say, he's like, we're not gonna have a spring game. But we, Pratt, we're gonna practice against one way. Why? And nobody does a spring game, so why can't we just practice with them? And you can do seven on Seven together where fans would like to watch that. You can do one on one routes together, passing routes. You can do pass blocking drills, offensive line versus D line. And yeah, they'll go fast, but I don't think there would be any more significant risk than there would be in a practice. And I get the intensity level thing. I think that's something that you would have to work out, but I do think it's manageable. And I do think that's just something that's going to be. You know, you can get hurt anytime you're on the field, even if there's no contact.

[C]

You can. But how many times do you remember teammates suffering serious injuries in practice compared to how many times did you see him doing it in games?

[D]

I mean, we had. I forget the running back's name, but we had a guy lost on the first day of training camp. We didn't have pads on.

[C]

You know, I'm saying it happens in practice, but I think if you compare injury data, you're far more likely to have a serious injury in a game than you are in practice.

[D]

But this isn't a game, naturally. But this will be a game.

[C]

You're putting new. You're putting a different team on the field. It's not your teammates anymore. There's still football players. You're still playing football. You can't play half speed.

[D]

No, but you can practice.

[A]

You. You.

[D]

But it's not full go. I mean, he even said they would do thud, which you know is just up top. You just kind of rap and then you let them go. You don't bring them to the ground.

[A]

And then refs whistle at dead right.

[D]

Yeah. So I think it's controlled. It's not your true spring game, which I think is something important to note that that's the way it could potentially work. And that's why you never see starters playing the preseason. That's why I was out there playing for the Broncos. Exactly.

[C]

In these games. But you can get hurt. But you see starters in practice every single day.

[A]

Okay, all right, so real quickly on that. That's the same thing that happens in spring games. Back when we had spring games, Anybody who, like a lot of the top shelf guys and anybody who was coming off of injury like they were all sidelined. And I thought fans enjoyed the aspect of getting to see these players who they were hoping would emerge, maybe not even that year, but maybe the year after. Like, from a fan perspective, the spring game draw is just getting to see your roster in action so you can start to build out the depth chart in your mind because you're not in the practices, you're not in the scrimmages. It just gives you, just gives you a little piece that makes you feel like you know the team more.

[C]

What is at the very heart of these coaches wanting to change their spring practice habits? What was the cause? What happened to the sport getting poached?

[A]

The transfer portal stuff?

[C]

Transfer portal nil. You're paying players. Spring practices happened before they were paying players. Chip, like I said, now that you're paying these kids, you do not want to bring extra risk to getting them hurt because you have a certain salary that you're allowed to spend. You can't have your 5 million dollar player getting hurt and then replace them with your 500 grand player. It's just not going to work for you. The minute, the minute there's a serious injury in one of these games, they're not going to want to do them anymore.

[D]

But God forbid, I don't even want to say a name, but let's just say one of the best receivers in the country who's coming off an incredible freshman season, he could get hurt in running one versus there but he's more.

[C]

Likely to get hurt running against a corner.

[D]

But his own corner too though he could get hurt as against his own corner. My thing is I don't think you'll ever see a preseason football game. I don't think you'll see that like. And I don't think, but I do think what you could see is quarterbacks wearing red jerseys. They're off on, they can't touch them. You could see, you know, even you might even see that receiver wearing a red jersey where everyone else is thudding. But we don't touch that guy. And both players have them. And you can use injuries like they actually had different colors. Quarterbacks were kind of, they were green at Florida State, they were red in the NFL. But then there were kind of another blue. Maybe if your colors didn't match and that player was off limits, you might. And you could do half your team if you wanted to. You know where you're just off limits to contact. You don't touch that guy.

[C]

Are your offensive lineman and defensive lineman just gonna hug or are they going to actually play football?

[D]

No, but they have the, they have some of the least risk in some of those where you're just doing.

[C]

Look at the quarterback talking about how offensive lineman and defensive linemen have the least risk. That must be why the offensive linemen are wearing those braces on their legs. Because they're not at any risk to get hurt.

[D]

But you could do one on one pass blocking drills. I mean, they do it at the Senior bowl and those players have a ton of risk.

[C]

That's.

[D]

I.

[C]

If you want to do like practices like that where you're just doing drills, okay, that works. But the idea of them playing games, to me, yeah, I don't think they're gonna like.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Are you gonna tune in to watch Colorado and Syracuse do drills?

[A]

No.

[D]

Some people, seven on seven, they would watch.

[A]

All right. Okay. So you're Tom, you're talking about the feasibility now. Just put that aside. Shut down that part of your brain. Don't you want to see it?

[C]

No. Do you watch preseason football?

[D]

No.

[C]

Yeah, like every year, like, I get excited. All right. The Bears are playing their first preseason game. I turned it on, four plays in. I'm like, this sucks. And I changed the channel. It's point.

[D]

Who are these guys?

[C]

Yeah, it's nobody. You can't play football at half speed. It is not an interesting sport to watch at half speed. That's why nobody watches the Pro Bowl. And they've spent like the last 10 years trying to figure out a format to get people to tune in to watch. It's not a good product when you're not playing 100%.

[A]

Mikey brings up a great comment. If we do renew rivalries with these, there ain't no way that they're going half speed.

[D]

We'll see, but it's not about half speed. It's about full tackle. You know, like, it's about tackling. I would be far more worried. You know what I'd be far more worried about than injuries. And I know kids are friendly today, but like the rival, like, fights, we see that.

[A]

I was.

[D]

I was thinking that would concern me more than. And getting hurt in a fight than in a game or a practice. Seven on seven. It'd be. I mean, who was it? The Panthers and commanders who were fighting like, every day? And that. That would. That would be my biggest concern if I was a coach, you know, especially with the rivalry aspect to it.

[A]

Like, if I had had this idea.

[D]

Like 10 years ago and every coach about that. I asked about it, liked it, because I wanted to get rid of the FCS games in the regular season. Well, what do you do with the money that they lose? It's like, play them in the spring. Have the FCS player, you know, practice your spring game against an FCS opponent. Let them take the gate. You give them their money that helps them fund their program, and it gives them exposure. It's a different opponent, all those sorts of things. And coaches were pretty open to it. They like the idea, because I do think you learn a lot more about your players going against different schemes. You have to be on your toes a little bit more. You don't know their calls because it does get old. That was something Gundy referenced as well. I mean, it gets old going against your own players. They literally start calling out your checks, and, you know, you. You use some code word and they're like, here comes the. You know, the quick slant, and they're jumping all over it. Like, it gets a little bit monotonous. So there's an aspect of that where I do think it helps you prepare for the season.

[C]

Well, another. And this is. Obviously, it's different coaches with different feelings about all this, but one of the more humorous aspects of this to me is if you go back to Matt Rule saying one of the reasons they want to get rid of spring practice is because it's like a tryout for the transfer portal for coaches to see. So what's the response? Let's schedule games against other teams and put them on television because they won't see them now. I mean, it's just. Yeah, the TV networks would love it, though, because they could find something to put on a Saturday afternoon in April that's not gonna. That's gonna get better ratings than what they would automatically put there.

[A]

If Penn State reached out to Temple and they decided that they're gonna go to the Link and play a scrimmage to Thud. You think that would.

[D]

I do. I'd way more want to watch it than Penn State versus Penn State and some, you know, dunk contest and hot dog eating contest, half time, you know, like, where nobody's doing anything.

[C]

First of all, they're not doing it at. They're not doing it at the Link. There's no way in hell. The Eagles are like, sure, yeah, play a spring game on our field. No, but you know what you do? Penn State plays Temple, and they play at Franklin Field, home of Penn. The Penn Quakers. Just a tiny little stadium.

[D]

That'd be cool. I do think there would be some. Hey, Penn State might come play Florida A M in Orlando. Remember Harbaugh was trying to remember the satellite camps. I mean, they might do it as a way to get, you know, access to recruits, which is why I think those are some of the rules that you can't do them right.

[A]

Because of the.

[D]

There are. I mean, there are. They're. They are not allowed to do this. Didn't the Mac look into doing this? They wanted to scrimmage against other schools in the spring and the conference I think shut it down. There were rules prohibiting this because I think it's been discussed before that I.

[A]

That is why Syracuse and Colorado have at least started to go through the paperwork process of seeing if if they can go through and and actually get it done. They, they are testing the feasibility of this. All the willingness for it seems to be there for Fran Brown and Deion Sanders coach Tom Fornelli and the rest of his American Tom Fornelli Coaching Association. They have, they have unanimously, unanimously voted against this idea. It sounds like any team that you would want, Tom, anything that you would want to see. Okay, no big UFL got to Tom.

[C]

I don't watch the UFL either. I don't need football all year long. I love it. I can watch it in the fall. There are other sports to occupy my time.

[A]

But we do like talking about it all year long on the COVID 3 podcast. And one of the great ways to continue that conversation is the big old bag of mail. We got a couple leftover mailbag questions and a mailbag episode tomorrow. So let's dive in. Coming up on the other side, hey, if the College Football Playoff proposed format for 14 teams, the 442211 hike. If that goes through, what does that mean for non conference scheduling? All that and more nukes.

[G]

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[C]

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[A]

Back here on the COVID 3 podcast we had Bill Connolly drop in last week. We've had a lot going on here on the show and so we will look forward especially tomorrow to diving in with your questions. A couple of ways that you can get to us. We love the tailgate. You show up early when the link goes live on YouTube. So subscribe hit the notifications. You can find out when that is. You drop your question in the chat. We'll grab a couple early on in the show. We also have some questions that you might have reached out to us on social media. You might have sent us an email or you've gone to give us a five star review. And in that review you put your mailbag question that's where we're going for this next one in the big old bag of mail. All right, this question came from username utah23. If the CFP format goes through and the only thing that matters is conference record, what is the incentive for teams to schedule any remotely difficult out of conference games? Why would Texas risk injury or be showing scheme to play Michigan when it could work its backups A full half of work against Rice there is none.

[C]

We talked about this I think a week or two ago. I mean this is part of my argument for why if they do go to this format ten game conference schedules through the SEC going to nine just go straight to ten.

[A]

Like if the SEC and the Big Ten and the ACC and the Big 12 already know exactly how many teams they can get into the playoff. Let's, let's just get rid of the, the non conference data points because they, they're not going to matter anymore for playoff selection.

[C]

Yes. Schedule 2 non conference games against smaller schools that can effectively maybe serve as the scrimmages like you're talking about doing in the spring or just as kind of bye weeks where it's a game we're going to win. So maybe we can get some guys some rest, get some of our younger guys some reps. That will basically be the purpose of the non conference now. They won't be able to schedule them in the first two weeks of the year is kind of like a preseason because the TV network's going to want actual games every single weekend. But I do think that would be. I think that makes a lot of sense if you go to this format. Just play more conference games, give fans what they want and then we'll determine the best conference in the country in the College Football Playoff.

[D]

The so that's where you have to incentivize seating. Yeah. So that those games aren't meaningless because how do you differentiate yourself? You want to be the number one seed if whether it's a buy favorable matchup. That's where you've got to make sure that they get the seating part of it. Right. So that you are incentivized to not roll out your backups and have a game that's quote, meaningless.

[A]

Do you think that, do you think that that's taken into consider who's of all the parties that are invested in, in this, who wants to keep non good, non conference games a part of the college football schedule?

[D]

Oh, I think, I think the commissioners do, the TV networks clearly do. But I do think in a main, Sankey always talked about creating value. You know, he wanted to create value. That's why he added Oklahoma, Texas. I think it helps the Big Ten in the SEC that Texas is playing Ohio State. We, that helps both of them, helps both parties, you know. So I think there's, there's. But the coaches probably don't.

[C]

But I, I think some of that's canceled out. If you go to 10 games, you are increasing the likelihood of Ohio State and Oregon, you are increasing the likelihood of Alabama, Georgia. So you still get those marquee matchups and you'll get more of them and you'll also be able to sell like the idea that this is a matchup for fourth place. Like there's a playoff berth on the line here. So I, I think that a lot of those concerns about non conference matchups for TV would be solved just by simply having those more of those conference matchups. So instead of going fewer and further between these teams in the same league, seeing each other because like you've got 18 and 16 team leagues, you can't be playing an eight game schedule, you have to be playing 10. So that way you can at least see these teams more and more often because it gets back to what the heart of the sport still is, at least in that you, it's regional like it's a national product now, but the heart of the sport is still regional.

[A]

But to Danny's point, if they don't change the conference schedules, then the only motivation is to be able to seating, to be able to give you a chance. So at that point don't do it like you know that SEC 3 is going to be playing against ACC 2 in one matchup. You know, you can't like predetermine the seeds in almost like a World cup kind of way where group B finish number two is going to be slotted here against group D winner. It's got to be something where the seating is actually going to matter along the way. All right, this next question came from Tim. Hey Tom.

[C]

Hi.

[A]

You mentioned Eric Gordon and Cliff Alexander as the near misses for Illinois basketball. What about John Shire, his senior year of high school basketball? His senior year of high school basketball. His senior year of high school basketball is the year Illinois was number one for most of the season and made it all the way to the title.

[C]

His high school coach was.

[A]

His high school was Bruce Weber's brother. Yeah, it seemed destined for him to go to Champagne, but it didn't happen. If Shire goes to Illinois, perhaps Bruce is still the Alliani coach today. That one hurts me more than Eric Gordon or Cliff Alexander. Thanks for your time, Tim Anderson.

[C]

Tim, that's fair. But I feel like Cliff and Eric Gordon, like Gordon had actually committed Illinois and then flipped Cliff the vi, like doing the hat thing he did. And the vibes going into that were all, he's going, you know, very pro Illinois. And it's like he was purposely floating that out there so he could have the, like, switcheroo at his commitment ceremony. I, I felt like John Shire was always going to Duke just when Duke gets involved. I know Illinois was good at the time and we were coming off that season, but it was Duke. I just never felt like a kid from the northern suburbs of Chicago was going to choose Illinois over Duke.

[A]

Now, you have heard Pat Bev in his comments recently about John Shire, right?

[D]

Yes, Yes, I was blown away by that. Did you guys know that, like what a dog he was and. Oh, yeah, like, I had no idea.

[C]

Oh, he was a huge deal in high school. He here. The Tribune and Sun Times were covering John Shire.

[A]

Yeah, he would go anywhere in the city that there was a game, go and play. The. The players have been laughing from these stories. They call him White Mike. Like the players are calling him White Mike.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

And laughing about it. And he got a question. He said, you know, Tyrese, you know, you're the first Duke player with five plus three pointers in back to back NCAA tournament games since your coach, John Shire. And he's like, will you repeat that again? They don't believe I was good team. Just it's blowing their mind that their head coach was not just like a college basketball player, but a really, really good college basketball player who was performing at a high level. One of the top prospects coming out of one of the top metro areas in the country. Yeah. John Shire's playing career has become a little bit of a storyline inside that Duke locker room. And it's been a been pretty funny story to. To hear them start to roll out along the way. All right, let's see one more before we get on out of here. All right. We talked a little bit about the quarterback battles to watch. We mentioned Mark Gronowski and Brendan Sullivan. So go ahead and just address this head on. Tom. Mr. Iowa 5 and 7 in 2025. The question is can Mark Gronowski solve Iowa's quarterback issues? He.

[C]

I mean define solve like can he?

[D]

And they get a Jag plus. Like at the very least I, I think they could.

[C]

But like if you look at last season I was scored 27.7 points per game. It's not like the offense was still terrible. They took a significant leap forward last year but the results on the field weren't there. And part of the reason I had them going 5 and 7 in my win total story this week is I feel like while the quarterback situation has gotten a lot of attention the offense and deservedly so because for a few years there it was just bad mut. Terrible production. There was a time where every NFL draft would come around and there'd be numerous Iowa offensive linemen and defensive linemen going early or in the draft. Overall you don't see that happening nearly as much. I feel like the development has kind of started to either flatten out or start know going the wrong way. And when I watch Iowa, they, they aren't as impressive along the lines of scrimmage to me as they have been in recent years. They just don't look like the same team. I think that's the bigger problem. I think Gronowski could be good. I think Granowski could just be another like you said Danny, a Jag plus which would be an upgrade for them. But I felt like they were kind of Jag plusy last year so I.

[D]

Think they were below Jag plus. They got really corporate especially for having.

[C]

Caleb Johnson covered a lot of ground for him. But yeah, but yeah. Again I don't think their offense was a huge problem. Last year they scored nearly 28 points per game which for Iowa five years ago if they scored 28 points per game, they're 10 and 2 like without question.

[A]

All right, so did this a couple weeks ago. I think I like it. Some of these mailbag questions that require some, some deeper thought. I want to give it as some homework and I want to bring in the the listeners for this one too. So I'll do the full question read tomorrow as part of the mailbag episode. But one of the ones we're going to include is a proposal or a scenario. Okay. A group of donors are willing to donate the proceeds of their next tax cut, let's say $10 million to their favorite athletic department. Unfortunately that football team is in a multi year rebuild so they decide to spend their money trying to sabotage their rival who has the best shot to win a championship in decades. The question what would be the best way to spend $10 million trying to sabotage your rival's chance at a national championship? Do you sprinkle million dollar player million dollar payments on 10 opponents? Do you focus on spending to improve a top team? Do, do you pay the refs? How do you spend $10 million trying to sabotage your rival's best season in years? Okay, so just, I just want to plant that in your brain. I want your imagination to run wild. I'm already seeing it in the tailgate. We're starting to get the suggestions. We will open this to a full discussion yet. Tom, I want you to think about this when this to rattle around in your skull rent free. I want to hear the best ways to spend $10 million sabotaging your rival's dream season. We'll get into that and much, much more in tomorrow's edition of the Mailbag. Come and hang out live and you can follow him on Twitter at time. For now you can follow him at Danny Canel. You can follow me at Chip Patterson. Gentlemen, thank you very much.

[C]

Thank you.

[D]

See ya.

[H]

Popsicles, sprinklers, a cool breeze. Talk about refreshing. You know what else is refreshing this summer? A brand new phone with Verizon.

[A]

Yep.

[H]

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