Upon Further Review: James Franklin-Penn State fallout, AP top 25 poll reaction, CFP Projections!

Summary

Cover 3 College Football Podcast — Episode Summary

Episode: Upon Further Review: James Franklin-Penn State fallout, AP top 25 poll reaction, CFP Projections!
Date: October 13, 2025
Hosts: Chip Patterson, Tom Fornelli, Danny Kanell, Bud Elliott

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Episode Overview

This episode of the Cover 3 Podcast focuses on the immediate fallout from James Franklin’s dismissal as Penn State’s head coach, delving into the coaching carousel ramifications, financial specifics of Franklin’s buyout, and speculation about the program’s next steps. The crew also reviews the latest AP Top 25 poll results, analyzes College Football Playoff (CFP) projections, and provides in-depth commentary on notable wins and under-the-radar teams, all while offering their signature candid, analytical banter.

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1. James Franklin Fired at Penn State: Fallout and Future ([00:50]–[21:31])

Key Discussion Points

• Rapid Downfall:

  • Danny is stunned by how quickly Franklin’s tenure unraveled:
    “The fall from just 15 days ago...unbelievable how you could be a program sitting on top of the college football world...and then see these back to back losses.” ([02:42])
  • The hosts agree that Penn State’s willingness to spend up to $50 million on a buyout underscores their commitment and volatility in the college football economy.
  • Bud jokes, “Money isn’t real, Danny. It’s all just something we agree to pretend exists.” ([04:04])

• Buyout Mechanics:

  • Discussion about Franklin’s contract offset language and that the headline buyout figure may not reflect the total actual payout due to offset provisions if Franklin takes another job.
    “If you’re Penn State, you can afford this.” – Chip ([04:59])

• Justification for the Move:

  • Analysis of whether Penn State’s expectations were misaligned with on-field results. Chip argues that Franklin never fully leveled the program up:
    “It used to be you won the games you’re supposed to win...but never leveled us up to that top level.” ([05:22])

• Risk and Replacement Names:

  • Bud cautions, “It’s a risky move...they’re hoping he’s Mark Richt, not Bo Pelini.” ([06:20])
  • Tom predicts James Franklin will be “my favorite hire of the 2025-2026 cycle, including whoever Penn State hires.” ([06:45])
  • Possible replacements discussed include Matt Rhule, Manny Diaz, Matt Campbell, and Kurt Signetti. None are seen as clear upgrades.

• Recruiting and Broader Program Impact:

  • Significant attention is paid to the importance of recruiting and coaching hires for Penn State’s ability to actually upgrade from Franklin, with skepticism that any candidate is an obvious step up.

Notable Quotes

• “You lose that game [to Oregon] and then to see these back to back losses...it just reminds you nothing should surprise us. There is no job that’s secure.” — Danny Kanell ([02:42])
• “If it’s just a line item, just paying out...over the next 15 years or so, it’s a little bit of a different math.” — Tom Fornelli ([04:37])
• “If you’re Penn State, you can afford this.” – Chip Patterson ([04:59])
• “It’s a risky move. They’re hoping he’s Mark Richt and not Bo Pelini.” — Bud Elliott ([06:20])
• “James Franklin will be my favorite hire of the 2025-2026 coaching cycle, and that includes whoever Penn State hires.” – Tom Fornelli ([06:45])

Other Highlights and Candidate Breakdown ([07:12]–[15:25])

• Matt Rhule:

  • Connections to Penn State AD Pat Kraft noted, but skepticism about Rhule's offensive track record and ability to be a better recruiter than Franklin.
  • Rhule's record vs. ranked teams scrutinized: “Last ranked win 2016, December 3rd against number 19 Navy.” ([12:39])

• Manny Diaz:

  • Questions about whether his in-game coaching would hold up under the Penn State spotlight.
  • “If you ask Miami fans, just some of the decisions he would make during the game were kind of confounding.” – Bud ([09:51])

• Kurt Signetti:

  • Concerns over recruiting ability at the high school level; currently seen as a portal-centric coach.

• Other Outlier Names:

  • Discussion of group-of-five upstarts (e.g., Golesh) and speculation about potential “package deals” including quarterbacks.

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2. AP Top 25 Poll Reactions (Poll Assassin Segment) ([30:03]–[38:10])

Key Insights and Discussion

• Indiana Earns Highest-Ever Ranking:

  • Indiana Hoosiers move to number 3 in the AP poll (highest since 1945, 1967). Only three first-place votes—Danny questions if “Indiana gets looked at with a different lens because of their logo...not getting enough credit for the job they do.” ([32:53])
  • Top of the poll: Ohio State (50 first place votes), Miami (13), Indiana (3).

• Ballot Oddities:

  • Co-hosts highlight Coki’s (a voter) “maverick” status for being the high/low voter on a large portion of teams.
  • USC’s ranking behind Missouri/Oklahoma discussed as questionable due to paper-thin resumes of those programs until recent wins.

• Competitive Balance & Rankings Fluidity:

  • Chip notes parity: “The gap between #1 and #17 is only a single score.” ([37:05])
  • Bud: “Ohio State’s typically a 3 to 3.5-point favorite against anybody. That gap is still there.” ([37:34])

Timestamps and Notable Quotes

• “[Indiana] are now number three. They got three first place votes.” — Chip ([31:47])
• “Indiana, in terms of voting points, is the same distance from Ohio State at 1 that it is from Texas A&M at 4.” — Tom ([33:44])
• “I was surprised Indiana didn’t get more first place votes...I just wonder if Indiana gets looked at with a different lens because of their logo.” – Danny ([32:53])
• “Coki was the high or low vote on seven of them by himself...he’s a maverick.” – Bud ([32:18])
• “The gap between number one and seventeen is only a single score.” – Chip ([37:05])

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3. College Football Playoff Projections ([39:07]–[44:05])

Key Talking Points

• Simulated Playoff Field:

  • Bud’s latest model has Ohio State, Texas Tech, and Miami as likeliest unbeatens.
  • Texas A&M projected as SEC runner-up at 5; Indiana at 6 after losing Big Ten title game—potential for playoff committee “resume wars.”

• Potential G5 Representative:

  • Tulane leads, but San Diego State and others are still contenders after notable wins.

• Parity’s Impact:

  • 25–30 teams still “live” for a playoff spot—a testament to the effectiveness and excitement generated by expanding to 12 teams:
    “I didn’t always love the idea of a playoff, but again, I do think 12 is way better than 4.” – Bud ([42:17])

• Big 12 Weakening:

  • The weekend’s results hurt the overall league strength and playoff positioning for its teams (examples: TCU loss to Kansas State, Iowa State loss to Colorado).

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4. Upon Further Review: Wins, Trends, and Under-the-Radar Notes ([45:50]–[53:39])

Key Segments

• Brilliantly Boring Win of the Week:

  • Texas A&M’s 34–17 win over Florida praised for its methodical, balanced approach.
    “Texas A&M defense that has been able to take some steps forward each and every week.” — Tom ([29:35])

• San Diego State’s Emergence:

  • Team is now 5–1; discussion centers on whether the Aztecs could grab the G5 playoff bid and how Jaden Denegal’s play has sparked their offense.
  • “Did we all forget to draft the team [San Diego State] that’s going to end up getting that spot?” — Bud ([48:58])

• Parity is Here:

  • Danny and Bud reflect on the increasing parity across college football, comparing SEC’s current margin of victory (10.7 points) to NFL levels (10.8).
    “It’s going to take a while for some programs to get used to seeing 9 and 3 as a really, really good season.” — Danny ([51:47])
  • Bud: “National average is 14.17. SEC is at 10.73.” ([53:28])

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5. Coaching Carousel & Other Job Market Ramifications ([21:31]–[26:40])

Key Discussion Points

• Will Franklin’s firing accelerate other schools’ coaching searches? Danny observes:
  “It does seem to be the trend...I do think it could lead to some more decisions being made here sooner rather than later.” ([21:31])
• Florida is the likeliest high-profile opening, followed by Auburn and possibly LSU/Oklahoma.
• Wisconsin discussion: Hang onto the coach or move on despite a tough new schedule (“could have a very Wisconsin type discussion”). ([25:29])

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6. Additional Notable Moments

• QB Standouts:
  • CJ Carr and MAA mentioned as potential best quarterbacks in the country based on recent play. ([60:19])
• USC’s Freshman DL Joaquim Stewart:
  • Recognition for his immediate impact and potential. ([60:40])
• Podcast Tone & Culture:
  • Lively, irreverent, deeply knowledgeable, with in-jokes about coaching friends, “winning the press conference,” and the quirks of college football’s revolving door.

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Summary Table of Major Segments & Timestamps

| Segment | Topic/Theme | Timestamp (start) | |-----------------------------------|------------------------------------------|------------------| | Opening & Coaching Carousel Debut | Franklin buyout, Penn State firing | 00:50 | | Fallout & Analysis | Why Franklin was fired, replacement talk | 02:42–06:45 | | Replacement Candidates | Rule, Diaz, Signetti, etc. | 07:12–15:25 | | Broader Coaching Carousel | National impacts, job rankings | 21:31–26:40 | | Poll Assassin | AP Top 25 Poll reaction | 31:47–38:10 | | CFP Projections | Playoff modeling, parity, Big 12 | 39:07–44:05 | | Wins of the Week & Deep Dives | Texas A&M, San Diego State, parity stats | 29:35, 48:22+ | | Further Review & Listener Qs | Parity, margins, coaching evaluations | 51:47–59:00 | | Closing Notes | Player standouts, upcoming coverage | 60:19-end |

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Memorable Quotes

• “Money isn’t real... It’s all just something we agree to pretend exists.” – Bud Elliott ([04:04])
• “There is no job that’s secure. It is crazy.” – Danny Kanell ([02:42])
• “If you’re Penn State, you can afford this.” – Chip Patterson ([04:59])
• “If Drew Aller scores a touchdown against UCLA, maybe James Franklin has a job.” – Tom Fornelli ([24:55])
• “The gap between #1 and #17 is only a single score.” – Chip Patterson ([37:05])
• “It’s going to take a while for some programs to get used to seeing 9-3 as a really, really good season.” – Danny Kanell ([51:47])

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Tone & Style

The dialogue is energetic, candid, analytical, and at times irreverent. The hosts blend sharp insights with inside jokes, back-and-forth ribbing, and a “let’s pull back the curtain” approach that appeals to die-hard fans and casual listeners alike.

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Recommended for:
Fans seeking real-time, inside analysis of major college football moves, AP poll dynamics, and playoff projections, plus anyone interested in the intersection of sport, money, and the high-coded drama of the college football industry.

Transcript

[Chip Patterson]

This episode is brought to you by Jack Daniels.

[Bud Elliott]

Jack Daniels and music are made for each other.

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They share a rhythm in the craft of making something timeless while being a part of legendary nights.

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From backyard jams to sold out arenas.

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There'S a song in every toast. Please drink responsibly. Responsibility.org, jack Daniels and Old no.

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7 are registered trademarks.

[Chip Patterson]

Tennessee whiskey, 40% alcohol by volume.

[Bud Elliott]

Jack Daniel Distillery, Lynchburg, Tennessee.

[Chip Patterson]

Welcome back to the COVID 3 podcast with your host, Chip Patterson, Tom Fernelli, Danny Cannell and Bud Elliott. It's your call for the best college football coverage from national signing day to.

[Danny Cannell]

The national championship and everything in between.

[Chip Patterson]

CBS Sports presents the COVID 3 podcast.

[Tom Fenelli]

And welcome back to the COVID 3 podcast here on CBS Sports. That's Tom Fenelli, that's Bud Elliott, that's Danny Cannell. I'm Chip Patterson coming to you [e-mail] cover3 and everywhere. Get your podcast on demand. Thanks for hanging out. Smash that, subscribe, smash that like and come and join us in the chat. Aka the COVID 3 tailgate where I saw them asking in full auto tune voice as much as you can in the tailgate. How many coaches gonna get fired this fall? Boy, listen, we need to not waste any more time. Mel Tucker, come on down. Let's jump on the carous. When we had that graphic made, we said it was very important that we have a big, large stack of money and that is exactly what. Penn State has pulled together upwards of 45, $50 million to buy out James Franklin. No. No rumors, no long drawn out. This was a swift news. University release acts down. We are moving ahead as a college football program. After a lengthy run. 104 wins from James Franklin, a Big Ten championship, a College Football Playoff appearances, handful of top 10 finishes. He is out. Penn State is moving on. Thank you to everybody who tuned in either live or check this out on demand for the instant Reaction show. Now we've got the full group together and yeah, we will continue the coaching carousel conversation in terms of the next steps. But Danny Cannell in instant. Your instant reaction. Your, your thoughts here on, on James Franklin out at Penn State.

[Danny Cannell]

Wow, like the fall from just 15 days ago. I mean, it was not. I mean, how does this happen this fast? You know, it's, it's unbelievable how you could be a program that looked like they were sitting on top of the college football world, a preseason favorite to be the, you know, national championship pick. Who I picked, you know, I was one of those who bought in to all the pieces. They're Bringing back like veterans quarterback, you go out and you get all this and you're in overtime. Like, it's not like you got embarrassed against Oregon, but you're like, oh, here we go again. And you lose that game. And then to see these back to back losses, it's just astounding to see how fast it could happen. Like, I wonder where James Franklin is right now. I'd imagine he's probably, you know, probably getting his family, getting to a beach somewhere and just be like, let's just escape from all the hysteria. Yeah, I saw this Matt Fortuna tweet. Unbelievable. To see how fast it can happen. I, I do wonder how in the college football economy, like where does all this money just come from so easily? Because I think we make a lot of assumptions. Well, that's a lot of money. There's no way we're going to be able to come up with that. And then magically it just appears out of nowhere and you can make this type of change. It's remarkable. It just reminds you nothing should surprise us. There is no job that's secure. It is crazy.

[Bud Elliott]

Money isn't real, Danny. It's all just something we agree to pretend exists.

[Tom Fenelli]

Deep thoughts on a Monday. Let's go.

[Chip Patterson]

If it's in the 40s and there's an offset in, in Franklin's deal, apparently Franklin is a good, is a good enough coach to where he can get another real job if he wants to. He might just decide to chill on the beach for a little bit or do some tv, I don't know. And you can, you know, you could pay it off over a couple years. I really don't think it's, you know, quite as huge as a number as it sounds like Mark Stoops number at Kentucky.

[Tom Fenelli]

Stoops is the one where the number's big. But you go into the language of the contract, some of these contracts are due in full in 30 days or 60 days or 90 days. You got to have tens of millions ready to go. But if it's just a line item of just paying out just a, you know, like another assistant over the course of the next 15 years or so, it's, it's a little bit of a different math. I am not privy to the contract details of, of this buyout in particular.

[Chip Patterson]

I, I heard on, on the Insiders or on HQ that Talty said there is some offset. I believe, I think it was Talty. So that, that certainly, you know, helps the number a little bit. Right? Yeah. You know, if you're offsetting that BY maybe, what, 20 over the next five years or something like that? Maybe. I don't know what percentage is subject to the offset, but it. You know, if you're Penn State, you can afford this. No, I.

[Tom Fenelli]

Was it a good. Was it the. Do you endorse the move from Penn State?

[Chip Patterson]

Look, Penn State should be in the best position to make Penn State decisions. It doesn't mean that, like, you have to just stamp every decision that a program makes. A lot of them make bad decisions, but, you know, if they feel like, hey, Franklin misevaluated this roster as to what he had, he was openly saying, this was the best roster we've ever had. It's the best coaching staff that we've ever had. And you don't beat Oregon, which, you know, in hindsight looks worse now that they've lost at home by double digits to Indiana. And then you proceed to lose to UCLA and Northwestern, who are arguably the two worst teams in the Big Ten. Maybe not solidly there, but, like, hey, man, it used to be that you won the games you're supposed to win, and you never, like, leveled us up, you know, to. To that top level. And we are committed to playing at that very top level. So, you know, you see what USC is doing right now. They have the number one recruiting class in the country. Looks like they have some momentum.

[Bud Elliott]

They're.

[Chip Patterson]

They're spending. You know, maybe Riley's getting some things turned around there. I think he did a hell of a job there. Right. And some of the names being thrown out, I'm like, I don't think that's an upgrade over James Franklin, but sometimes, like a fresh start, and sometimes your time has just run its course, so perhaps. Right. I don't. It's a. It's a risky move. They're hoping he's Mark Richt and not Bo Pelini.

[Tom Fenelli]

I like that line. Hey, can I pitch something at y'? All? I think James Franklin will be my favorite hire of the 2025, 2026 coaching cycle, and that includes whoever Penn State hires.

[Chip Patterson]

Oh.

[Tom Fenelli]

So that he will get another job. And I will be more enthusiastic about James Franklin at whatever job that is than I will be about who Penn State hires. I don't know. It's just a thing. It's just a gut feel here.

[Bud Elliott]

I get it.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah. I mean, you guys discussed Matt Rule an awful lot, and I obviously had him on my list because the connections. He's very. Buddy. Buddy with the ad Pat Kraft there.

[Tom Fenelli]

At Temple with him. We always do the Temple thing as Like a big foundational part of the Matt Rule story. So yeah, he was my craft was there.

[Chip Patterson]

Like, I don't know that that solves a lot of your complaints. What were your complaints about? Franklin doesn't find a way to score points. Matt Rule is definitely not a guy whose team score points. Not traditionally, not historically. He finally got rid of his buddy at OC and brought in a guy who has a history of scoring points. They are scoring some more points this year. So you. Maybe that's a step in the right direction. I don't think he's. I don't think he's a better recruiter than James is. Right. I don't think he's got a better history of hiring assistants than James does. So this better not be, hey, the AD wants to hire his buddy for a decision of this kind of money. But the thing is his body has a good track record. Like Rule could. Rule could work out there great. Sure. We don't know if it will or if it won't, but you know, I mean, they're like, what, two very close games away from having three losses right now. Cincinnati game. If. If Cincinnati's quarterback doesn't throw that YOLO ball there at the end since he was moving it on him consistently. And you know, they almost lost a Maryland, so. But they did. They won the games.

[Bud Elliott]

You know who else? Temple, though for the years was the ad.

[Chip Patterson]

He was on that for.

[Bud Elliott]

Fran Brown.

[Chip Patterson]

Oh, one shoot one. Tyler Donahue of Appliance247 brought up, which I think would be really interesting. A guy who does have a good track record of making hires. A guy who I think can recruit. You have to look at his tenure at Miami quite differently. When you see the massive resource difference that Miami gave to Mario, which granted, Mario brought with him because some of these mega boosters are Mario's buddies. And I don't think Manny was going to get that there from Miami, but he's done a really nice job at Duke. He's a defensive guy who likes to score points and allows an offensive coordinator to actually operate. I. I wouldn't hate that. He also coached at Penn State. Yeah. And I thought your Matt Campbell one was really good. I didn't have Matt Campbell on my list because he doesn't. He's not a guy I think of as like an offensive dude who wants to score points. Like hasn't shown that he's a top flight recruiter. You know, like that. That would make a lot of sense. He's a very competent guy. I think Matt Rule's competent. You know, I just don't know if any of these guys are no doubt like big upgrades over what Franklin does.

[Bud Elliott]

I talked about it on the show yesterday, like with Manny Diaz, a lot of the in game coaching decisions, I, I think that he gets away with them because he's at Duke and nobody's watching. Like, if you ask Miami fans, just some of the decisions he would make during the game were kind of confounding. And then I just watching, I feel like if he was at Penn State, he was in the spotlight more. I just feel like that would get him in trouble pretty quick.

[Chip Patterson]

I think the sports shifting to what he does though, in terms of like the, like finding your optimal amount of aggressiveness. But yeah, I mean, back then it was really controversial and certainly bigger program. You're going to get blasted when some of that stuff doesn't work out.

[Tom Fenelli]

Manny Diaz is a sensible, very Dan Lanning ish. Though Manny Diaz is a more sensible. Hired. For me, looking at Penn State, if they didn't just pay $50 million to buy out James Franklin. Yeah, you pay $50 million to buy out James Franklin and hire Manny Diaz. And it's like, okay, all right, Manny, this. I mean, you want to talk about being set up with an intense amount of pressure. I mean, that's. That would be, that'd be. I think Manny Diaz is very capable. I think he has been on quite the walkabout. I mean, you go all the way back to his early time as an assistant. I mean, Manny Diaz has been around and been in a lot of places. He's got some scars, he has seen some wars. And I think that, you know, he might be interested in that or he might be interested in continuing to build at Duke, where I think particular, particularly in this season. He's done a good job of steadying that team after those two losses to Illinois and Tulane in the, in the non conference portion.

[Danny Cannell]

Do you think Penn State gets their first choice?

[Bud Elliott]

No.

[Tom Fenelli]

Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

Well, who do we think their first choice is? Well, that's all.

[Bud Elliott]

Well, the fan base's first choice I think right now like a realistic options is Signetti. But I went over yesterday why I don't think that's likely. And also I will point out, you know where Pat Kraft got his degree from.

[Tom Fenelli]

Indiana.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah. Is he going to want to go to his alma mater and steal their football coach from him? I don't know. Yeah, but just.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah, I, I don't know.

[Bud Elliott]

I just don't think that, like if you're Signetti. Penn State's a better situation than the one you currently have.

[Chip Patterson]

We also have no idea and we're, we're going to talk about this also in an hour on the Recruiting Hour with Andrew Ivins. But we have no idea if Signetti can recruit high school doesn't mean he can't. We just don't know it because Indiana is almost entirely transfers and he's done an amazing job with the portal. But like we don't know now he's worked for Saban, he's worked for some operations that do recruit well. So that if you want to believe that he can do it, I'm not going to doubt the guy that he can. But there's not evidence that he actually can do it.

[Tom Fenelli]

So. Kurt Signetti has two ranked wins in the 2025 college football season. Can anyone tell me when Matt rules last ranked win was.

[Chip Patterson]

Oh, it was a long probably a Temple.

[Bud Elliott]

It was at Temple.

[Tom Fenelli]

It was in 2016 against number 19 Navy.

[Chip Patterson]

I was joking. Really. He hasn't been team at Nebraska, he zero ranked teams.

[Tom Fenelli]

At Baylor he beat zero ranked teams. I believe it is 17 consecutive losses to top 25 opponents. That's not top 10. That is not an issue against top 10 opponents. That is an issue against top 25 opponents. Correct me please.

[Bud Elliott]

I think if you. But if he was, if he was coaching Penn State, he would have an easier time beating ranked opponents.

[Tom Fenelli]

Agree.

[Bud Elliott]

Than he would at Nebraska and Baylor.

[Tom Fenelli]

That's fine. I just again, Last ranked win 2016, December 3rd against number 19 Navy.

[Chip Patterson]

Wow.

[Tom Fenelli]

So, you know, you trade.

[Bud Elliott]

Remember that 2016 Navy team? It was a juggernaut. Hey. And he knocked it down.

[Tom Fenelli]

That was a. I think that's a conference championship game, right?

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah.

[Tom Fenelli]

American Athletic conference championship game December 3rd.

[Bud Elliott]

Was Navy in the American back in 2016?

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

Have they been in there that long?

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah. Wow.

[Tom Fenelli]

Keenan Reynolds.

[Chip Patterson]

You're right.

[Tom Fenelli]

All right, so if you say if they're not going to get their first choice, where does the search. What are the other. What are the other names that stick out? Tom played this game. Tom and I played this game a little bit yesterday. But just because it is an amazing college football job, you know, steeped in history, steeped in passion. The other side of oh my gosh. They'll pull together 45, 50 million to get you out. Says like they care a lot. So you should have resources and some more flowers for the recently fired coach. That program is in a way better position because of the work that James Franklin did while he was in Happy Valley. He left that program Better than he found it. And so it is a better job now than when he took it as a head coach more than a decade ago.

[Chip Patterson]

You are going to have to portal like a lot of an offense to Happy Valley. They lose a bunch of this offense defensively, I think they're probably okay. You know, do you look at somebody who brings their quarterback with them? Like, I don't think they're gonna hire. I just look at some of these names in the chat. I. I don't think Shiano is a serious candidate for Penn.

[Bud Elliott]

I don't think anybody was. Yeah. Mentioned in the whole Sandusky stuff.

[Chip Patterson]

Has a chance also. He doesn't, like, typically doesn't score points. That's the most consistent knock on James Franklin other than the big game. James stuff doesn't score points. Offense doesn't come through like, no. And I don't think you'll get Dan Mullen after how he met. I think Dan Mullen's a great underdog program coach. I don't think, like, the way he managed the operation at Florida would give you warm fuzzies if you are Penn State.

[Danny Cannell]

I think Dan Mullen would do better at Power 4 job than he did at Florida because of the new rev share and stuff like that, but I don't think it's the right hire for Penn State.

[Tom Fenelli]

Anybody else?

[Danny Cannell]

Rule and Raiola, package deal.

[Tom Fenelli]

Oh.

[Danny Cannell]

I mean, that's Tom's favorite qb.

[Bud Elliott]

It's an upgrade over Aller.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah, he probably could get it to happen.

[Tom Fenelli]

All right, here's what we need. We need Photoshops of Dylan Raiola doing this one right here with. With the Penn State. The Penn State blue and the white helmet. He's got one year of eligibility left, you know. Yeah, man. You want to talk about winning the press conference and just like putting some real hype into it. I mean, the. The one of the best podcast hosts among all college football coaches. Bring in his podcast and his quarterback.

[Chip Patterson]

Matt Rule is really good at the media stuff for sure.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah, he's great at it.

[Chip Patterson]

If you're Penn State, you're like, wait, he hasn't beat a single ranked team at Nebraska. It doesn't give you, like, a lot of confidence he's gonna be better than James.

[Danny Cannell]

Are there any chance they'll go for like a goal Ish. Or somebody at the group of five who's crushing it?

[Bud Elliott]

Maybe. I don't know if that. I mean, Golish has experience in the Big Ten. He was on Illinois staff for a while. I think if you want to bring in an offense that's going to score a ton of points. Golesh is a great hire, I think if you want to compete for national titles. I don't know if that offense is the one you want to bring in because to this point that offense hasn't really proven to be that.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah.

[Tom Fenelli]

And yet Dylan. Dylan Raiola has. He has two years of eligibility left. I was working the clock the other way in terms of.

[Danny Cannell]

Right.

[Tom Fenelli]

He thinks how many more he has to spend in college before he's NFL eligible.

[Bud Elliott]

A name.

[Chip Patterson]

Sorry, go ahead.

[Bud Elliott]

I was gonna say Eli Drinkwitz is a name that I think has to be on their list.

[Chip Patterson]

That's the one I brought up in hq.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, I think, I think you're doing a disservice to yourself if you don't at least check to see how interested he would be in this gig.

[Chip Patterson]

I mean, like, you think about it, it's. He recruits really well. He's been very progressive in terms of like, like embracing some of the nil stuff. He also, I think has done a tremendous job of like he's had to replace coordinators. His bigger programs, hire them away. And one of the hallmarks of good coach is that they do hire better. Like they continue to hire good coordinators to figure it out.

[Danny Cannell]

You know, he could bring his quarterback with him too.

[Bud Elliott]

His quarterback with him too.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah.

[Tom Fenelli]

And in the world of. And look, we are given a lot of flowers and spotlight. Depends. State as a job. But you are still also playing that role in the world. The Ohio State, Michigan power dynamic. Drink is an MFer. And I say that endearingly, you know, like if you need somebody to, you know, push, poke the bear and sort of rile things up. If you want someone who's going to be able to, you know, get. Get a little chesty against the old guard. Drink is an MFER who I think could. Could at least occupy that space of where Penn State sits just kind of vibes wise. In the Big Ten.

[Danny Cannell]

We had a lot of people pushing back, saying it's a better situation. Missouri, that's crazy talk, right?

[Bud Elliott]

It's not crazy talk, but.

[Tom Fenelli]

It's not crazy talk. But it's not my opinion. My opinion is that Penn State's a better job, but I don't think it's insane to favor Missouri.

[Chip Patterson]

There is a bit of like how much of Missouri success under drink is sustainable because they had first mover advantage in some of the nil stuff. They were early to adopt it. They were early to embrace the nil. They were early to embrace the portal now that other teams are catching it up a little bit more. You know, like that, that's, that's interesting.

[Tom Fenelli]

They, Missouri was one of the first ones to get the state legislature involved.

[Bud Elliott]

You know, like they were the first.

[Tom Fenelli]

Ones to pass laws that said you can get nil money in high school if you're committed to an. In state university. I mean, that's when they talk about first mover advantage. Oh, they, they saw the light. They're like, here's, here's how we get this going.

[Chip Patterson]

So I do think Matt Campbell would leave Iowa State.

[Danny Cannell]

Yes.

[Chip Patterson]

Like Florida State thought he was coming before they hired Norvell. Like when they set that little press conference up, it wasn't for, for James Franklin. They thought Matt Campbell was coming that day. But do you think he's going to wait it out another year for Michigan? Because like in the industry, the people I talked to are like, hey, like Michigan is the one that has his heart. I mean, maybe, but would you turn down Penn State to wait on Michigan?

[Bud Elliott]

That's what I'm saying. That's a risk.

[Chip Patterson]

I don't know. That's ballsy.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah. Because like if, if you do that, like, is Rocco Beck back next year? Is he done? Like, you might, you might be 7 and 6 next year. You might not be very attractive.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

I mean, that kind of downturn.

[Chip Patterson]

So what are you gonna finish this year? Six and six?

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah. I feel like if you're Matt Campbell and you want, you're only considering moving, leaving Iowa State for one of these big time jobs, it'd be hard to pass up on the big time job coming right now.

[Tom Fenelli]

Yeah, I mean you, you never know what the cycles are going to be like and Matt Campbell probably needs to test himself at any place that's got that kind of resources and those kinds of recruiting expectations. So yeah, I think that I would not pass on Penn State to wait on Michigan. All right, with. This is obviously going to be an ongoing story. Any other threads that, that you want to, that you want to pull on here? Oregon, Oregon State, UAB decided that they wanted to get in on the James Franklin sweepstakes. Oh, here's a thought. Danny, do you think that this leads other schools to take action? We had. That was another point we talked about yesterday. James Franklin's on the market if you're Florida, if you're Auburn, if you are, you know, one of these schools that we think will be open eventually. Do you think that this speeds up the decision making process?

[Danny Cannell]

I never thought we'd be sitting here October 13th with seven coaching hires available. So I'm not going to say that this doesn't spur some more action sooner rather than later. Like, it does seem to be the trend that people are like, yeah, I'm going to get to the front of the line. So, yeah, I do think it could lead to some more decisions being made here sooner.

[Chip Patterson]

Who is front of the line over Penn State.

[Bud Elliott]

Right now? Of the likely possible openings, I would say Florida is the biggest candidate to be ahead of the line.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah, I would say Florida. All right. So, like the three in the SEC that I think everybody would be monitoring. Right. Auburn, lsu, Oklahoma.

[Tom Fenelli]

And LSU is the funny one because they're still five and one football team.

[Chip Patterson]

And again, I don't think all of, all of those are going to open.

[Tom Fenelli]

But Florida and Auburn seem far more likely based on the result. Like, even with Florida getting the win against Texas, you just, you kind of see what's happening right here. What about Oklahoma? Is Oklahoma all good?

[Chip Patterson]

I mean, I, I don't think they're going to fire Brent Venables, and I think they're going to get Matier back for another year.

[Tom Fenelli]

The start was good.

[Bud Elliott]

Back half of that season could be pretty rough, though. Like, that 5, 0 start might be a distant memory in about a month.

[Tom Fenelli]

So if they finish 8 and 4 or 7 and 5, Oklahoma, the work was done essentially when you won the swing games against Michigan and Auburn. If Brent Venables has returned returns, then that tells me that he did enough work with the overall product, the way that it looked and the way that they won in the first five weeks of the season, six weeks of the season, to secure 2026.

[Chip Patterson]

Doesn't OU also have an ad opening right now?

[Tom Fenelli]

Yes.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah, I don't, I don't think that opens. But, yeah, I could be wrong. Yep. And. And I don't hate Arkansas, but, like, where I had them on this list, pretty low. If you're, if you're just listening at home and not watching us on YouTube, which you should definitely subscribe, even if you're an audio listener. You should definitely subscribe to the channel.

[Tom Fenelli]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Chip Patterson]

If Arkansas is gonna spend. Yeah, like, certainly possible. Right. You know, they have a very interesting, like, front office, you know, ideas going on there right now. We'll see if those prove to be like, crazy like a fox or just crazy. Well, you know, we'll have to see Arkansas just like, look, if they, if they actually spend, then they're much higher on this list. The way I wrote this was assuming current spending Level like Arkansas right now does not spend. They're definitely bottom two or three SEC.

[Tom Fenelli]

Payroll for, for the roster and for those one. A little bit of context, but I believe that you were given this list. You.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah, somebody gave me this list, said rank all these jobs. I did not create this list of just. Yeah, yeah.

[Tom Fenelli]

Not that you're. You're grabbing. You're grabbing some jobs that aren't open yet. You're grabbing some jobs.

[Chip Patterson]

Like we definitely think Florida's open, right? Like behind the scenes, Florida's open. Yes.

[Tom Fenelli]

I think Auburn might be careening towards that level.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

If I had to bet on it, I would bet that Auburn does open.

[Tom Fenelli]

I would bet Wisconsin though.

[Chip Patterson]

I might just what they spent on this roster. What could happen if you have a coaching change in terms of talent flight? I liked everything I saw from this roster except quarterback. You know, I might give them one more chance to just throw some big money out of QB and get it right.

[Tom Fenelli]

You know, we were talking about the sliding doors and the small margins. If Drew Aller scores a touchdown against ucla, maybe James Franklin has a job. And if they decide that Jackson Arnold did cross the goal line, man.

[Bud Elliott]

Right.

[Tom Fenelli]

I mean, is Auburn and we're making.

[Danny Cannell]

And they're making 50 million dollar decisions off those one or two plays, it's nuts.

[Chip Patterson]

Are y' all surprised Wisconsin is not open or do you think they're just going to let. You're gonna let Ohio State and Oregon just. Just run them out of town?

[Bud Elliott]

There's part of me that wonders if it's not just the coach going.

[Chip Patterson]

So that makes sense.

[Tom Fenelli]

Interim everything. Barry Alvarez.

[Chip Patterson]

Yes.

[Bud Elliott]

He might be running stuff again here in a few weeks for a while.

[Chip Patterson]

Because from a PR perspective that's a pretty big game. You're gonna have to trot Lou Fickle out there for interviews if you haven't fired him yet. It would make more sense to have the AD if the AD is not getting fired too, to come out there and say, look, man, our process in hiring this guy was sound. He's the first coach to take a G5 team to the playoff. He sent multiple guys to the pros from Cincinnati. I don't think there was anything wrong with our process. It just didn't work. We're still very committed to playing top level football here at Wisconsin. We know the challenge is harder than it's ever been because the Big Ten west is gone and now we have a much harder schedule. And also for some reason, I guess I might be the part of the reason we're playing like non conference games against the Irish and the Crimson Tide. But we still want to play. I don't know. I would try to put that message out there. Hey, we still believe in this program, but Tom may just have it nailed here. Yeah, okay.

[Tom Fenelli]

All right. Well, we of course will keep you up to date with all the latest on the carousel as it continues to spin. But we do have business at hand here on Monday. So coming up on the other side, Poll Assassin looks at the new AP Top 25 poll. We've got a latest update to the College Football Playoff projections and upon further review and more next when did making plans get this complicated? It's time to streamline with WhatsApp, the secure messaging app that brings the whole group together. Use polls to settle dinner plans, send event invites and pin messages so no one forgets mom's 60th and never miss a meme or milestone. All protected with end to end encryption. It's time for WhatsApp message privately with everyone. Learn [e-mail] this episode is brought to.

[Chip Patterson]

You by State Farm. Listening to this podcast Smart Move Being financially savvy Smart Move Another smart move Having State Farm help you create a competitive price when you choose to bundle home and auto bundling. Just another way to save with a personal price plan. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Prices are based on rating plans that vary by state. Coverage options are selected by the customer. Availability, amount of discounts and savings and.

[Tom Fenelli]

Eligibility vary by state. And now it's time for the brilliantly boring Wins of the Week, brought to you by PNC bank, where we highlight the boring actions that make the biggest difference. Slow and steady isn't just a saying. It's a proven strategy. Consistent, deliberate financial decisions help build a strong financial foundation and lead to the most meaningful wins. There's no need to chase risky ventures or fall for quick fixes at PNC Bank. They help you keep your money simple and stable so that you can live with the confidence that your future is on solid ground. And I wanted to highlight Texas A and m for that 34 to 17 win against Florida because I don't know how everyone else's Saturday night was, but it was a game that I felt like I was just kind of monitoring because Texas A and M was doing all the right things in terms of creating enough of an edge. Then in the fourth quarter they were able to hit the gas and go. So glad that we were able to celebrate that. Texas A and M pass rush. A Texas A and M defense that has been able to take some steps forward each and every week. But it is also the balance that they have. Marcel Reed, 234 yards passing and a touchdown. The offense as a whole rolls up 183 rushing yards, three rushing scores. It's not always just breakneck pace and flying down the field, but it is sometimes just just tiny little bits and then boom, an explosive play. Danny, when you think about Texas A and M in this season, they are just continuing to climb up the rankings 6. And oh, what stands out about the way that Mike Elkos got this team.

[Danny Cannell]

Playing, I mean fundamentally sound on the defensive side of the ball. It was a little bit sloppy. They plagued by penalties. They're slowly getting better there, I think. Connor, excuse me, Colin Klein, the offensive coordinator starting to get a better feel and they're starting to utilize a lot what a lot of weapons that they have. Marcel Reed is just continues to improve and the Conception Craver combination on the outside, I mean they are absolutely one of the best teams in the country.

[Chip Patterson]

Yep.

[Tom Fenelli]

And those were the brilliantly boring wins of the week brought to you by PNC Bank. Brilliantly boring since 1865. Brilliantly boring since 1865. As a service marker, the PNC Financial Services Group Inc. PNC Bank national association member FDIC Those were the brilliantly boring wins of the week brought to you by PNC Bank. Brilliantly boring since 1865. Brilliantly boring since 1865 is a service mark of the PNC Financial Services Group Inc. PNC bank national association member FDIC back here on the COVID 3 podcast on Mondays. We do like to take just a moment to look at the changes in the AP Top 25 poll. It is poll assassin. The Indiana Hoosiers as projected on Saturday night made program history. Number three, the highest ever ranking for the Hoosiers. They had hit number four in 1945. They had hit number four in 1967, but they are now number three. They got three first place votes. Miami still at number two, holding steady with 13 first place votes. Ohio State in first place with 50 first place votes. Now the Ducks predictably slid down to number eight. Oklahoma takes a tumble as well. We get to see a return to the top 25 for the Texas Longhorns. USC after that big win against Michigan. And as we talked about on Saturday night, lots of swapping in and out for those teams near the cut line. Tom, when you looked at the rankings or the ballots, what stood out this week?

[Bud Elliott]

The first thing that stood out to me was congratulations. To chip your propaganda to get Illinois UNRANKED worked. Good for you. I'm very proud. But the bigger thing was our favorite, our boy, Cokie Cokey. There are 33 teams that received a spot on a ballot this week. Okay.

[Tom Fenelli]

Yeah. Not a lot of other receiving votes. A lot of groups like this is the small. A 33 is smaller. And our friends from San Diego State. More on them later. They were at the. The lower end of the count.

[Bud Elliott]

Yes. But of those 33, Coki was the high or low vote on seven of them by himself. If you consider being tied with other voters, he was 10. So nearly a third of the teams that were actually ranked. Koki was the high or low vote on that man is. He's. He's a maverick.

[Tom Fenelli]

He's a big brain. He's thinking outside the box.

[Bud Elliott]

He is not. He is not a sheep. He is the. He is the lion. What?

[Tom Fenelli]

Dk anything stand out?

[Danny Cannell]

I was surprised Indiana didn't get more first place votes. And I think that has something. And again, it's not like Ohio State fans. I'm sure they're very upset. They don't like being held anything. I think Ohio State could be the best team in college football. There's no doubt about that. I just wonder still if Indiana gets looked at with a different lens because of their logo and because of who they are and they're not getting enough credit for the job that they do. Because I think now they have two really impressive wins and they do have a common opponent in Illinois who. We saw what Indiana did and we saw what Ohio State did against the same team. Granted, one was home, one was away, and again, this is not a knock on Ohio State. I was just surprised Indiana didn't get a little bit more first place. Love. That was a pretty dominant win on the road. So the best win of the season so far.

[Tom Fenelli]

Yes.

[Bud Elliott]

Right.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah.

[Tom Fenelli]

I to. To go under the hood a little bit, Danny. Indiana, in terms of voting points is the same distance from Ohio State at one that it is from Texas A&M at four. So, you know, surprise Indiana didn't get more first place votes. Sure, I can definitely understand that. But Indiana showed up at a lot of twos. You know, that to be able to. To have that gap where the top three separated by the same number of votes as number three is to number four, Texas A and M. And then also say about 100 voting points, 1433-1331 to get down into Ole Miss before things bunch up again. Right. Until about, I'd say 12. Georgia Tech. Yeah, Georgia Tech. That 60 record. Kind of standing out right there, bud. Any anything, Anything for you on your hit list?

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah, a couple things here. I don't really know why, like why USC behind teams like Missouri, you know Oklahoma, they obviously they, that resume was.

[Tom Fenelli]

Paper thin until they beat Michigan. Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

And they also lost to an unranked Illinois.

[Chip Patterson]

Illinois is a decent team.

[Bud Elliott]

Right.

[Tom Fenelli]

But it's like if you're trying to wrestle the head to head of it all and Illinois came in at 26, the 113 voting points, they were very much a presence on a lot of ballots where USC was also there. So I, I think that you can't just fly USC all the way up when both of their conference wins are against teams that are combined 0 and 6 and Big 10 play.

[Chip Patterson]

That's fair.

[Tom Fenelli]

It's a good team though. I'm with you like if we want.

[Chip Patterson]

To winning conference like so. And, and Michigan is unranked, but Texas is ranked. Do you like Texas resume over Michigan? Because Texas got walked by not very good Florida team.

[Tom Fenelli]

Tom, I should have corrected my language. The previous two wins, Michigan State and Purdue combined 0 and 6 and Big Ten play.

[Bud Elliott]

So now they're 2 and 7.

[Tom Fenelli]

It was a paper thin resume before. I think they've got a very good, very, very good resume now thanks to the Wisconsin win.

[Bud Elliott]

I mean USC games are road games against Notre Dame and Nebraska, so that'll settle itself one way or the other.

[Tom Fenelli]

Yeah, I mean this is the season for usc. I'm excited.

[Danny Cannell]

And Notre Dame. Yes. For both of them.

[Tom Fenelli]

Oh, baby. College football playoff elimination game. Maybe, maybe, just maybe that makes an appearance on Tuesday's Big Ten show on CBS Sports Network with a little big game breakdown for the Trojans and the Fighting Irish. Reminder, noon eastern time on CBS Sports Network. Other than that, I didn't, I didn't have any huge, you know, throw your hands up. You know, this looks absolutely ridiculous. Felt pretty predictable and mostly fell in line with expectations.

[Chip Patterson]

I think it's harder to do than it ever has been, honestly. If you look at the power ratings in 2019, the gap between the number one team and the number 17 team was three scores or three touchdowns.

[Tom Fenelli]

Yeah, 21 points.

[Chip Patterson]

No, like 17 points.

[Tom Fenelli]

Okay.

[Chip Patterson]

Right now it's one score. I was talking to Bill Connolly this morning about, he put out a great graph on it as well. It's like teams 9 through 20 have basically stolen a good bit of talent off teams one through eight. Like there are so many more teams now that have a chance and that means you're going to have a Lot more losses, you know, every year because just there's so many more teams that are capable of beating you. Yep.

[Bud Elliott]

We'll say though, the one thing that hasn't changed is the gap between 1 and 2, because Ohio State's typically a 3 to 3 point favorite on the neutral against everybody, whoever you have at number two on your ratings. That's what I've seen across the board.

[Danny Cannell]

What did, what did Washington do? They haven't beaten anybody, but still they didn't. They dropped out of the top 25. Were they not in it last week?

[Tom Fenelli]

They were not in it last week.

[Chip Patterson]

You know, they were not in it.

[Tom Fenelli]

Striking distance right now. They, but they need, they, they need signature wing. Yeah. They need to start stacking quality wins.

[Chip Patterson]

They only got a Mississippi State get.

[Bud Elliott]

Votes because they're in the sec. But like, Jesus, you wanted the answer. But like, yeah, Washington only getting six points at home in the one game where it actually had a chance to impress somebody is what's keeping them from being ranked because you look at who they beat and It's Colorado State, UC, Davis Wazoo, MD and Rutgers.

[Tom Fenelli]

Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

And they, they struggled against both Maryland and Rutgers before finally getting their act together.

[Tom Fenelli]

Yeah. When I'm filling out my top 50 for the CBS Sports 136, Washington is like, you know, continuing to climb with each win but not putting them on a. Not having them well represented, though they are C26. They're 28th right now in voting points, but still kind of a big gap away from, from getting into the top 25. All right, buddy, take us through the latest college Football playoff projection. You've, you've taken all the Week 7 data, then you've run it through and what is it going to give us?

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah, let's, let's throw it up here on screen. I'll walk you guys through it. So still have Ohio State as the number one team. I don't think that they're going to lose here. In the latest modeling, I do have Miami and Texas Tech is pretty likely to go undefeated. I will note, I think there's some, some chance that Utah would have a chance in a rematch if. Damn. Pierre is actually healthy. We know that Utah was kind of playing some games with his, like reporting on his health there into that Texas Tech game. He did not look right and Texas Tech was clearly the better team in that game and they dominated them. I don't know if he's fully healthy, if they dominate them in the same way, if that's the rematch. But I do have Ohio State, Tech and Miami going undefeated and claiming the top three spots. This model run had Bama beating out an undefeated A and M in the SEC championship games. A&M gets the five spot. New Indiana fans are not happy. I had Indiana 6 there at Indiana losing to Ohio State in the conference championship game. I think if the committee takes it, compares resumes, you know, A and M@12.1 Conference Championship Game loser is probably going to get the nod over 12. One conference championship game loser, Indiana, just based on the depth of schedule. Although the Oregon win will certainly count for, you know, for quite a bit there. I do still have Oregon getting home, fielded in the playoff here, you know, as the eight seed. Still have Georgia getting in. They just keep winning. Look, Kirby Smart's good coach.

[Tom Fenelli]

That's a good team.

[Chip Patterson]

They're not a great team.

[Tom Fenelli]

Everybody clap your hands.

[Chip Patterson]

Exactly. Tulane is the G5, but really there's probably six or seven teams that are still alive there for the G5 race. Obviously old Dom losing to Marshall kind of kills that. And you know, this, this time Georgia Tech actually got in. So that was, that was interesting. I, I do. We think an 11 and 2 ACC or 12 championship game loser is potentially gonna get beat by a 9 and 3 non championship game participant from one of the, for the like the major two conferences. That's setting up a big argument. I'm just telling you. Like, like this is going to come up a lot. Utah or Georgia Tech.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, it depends who the 9 and 3 team is. Like if it's Oklahoma at 9 and 3, I think Oklahoma gets the spot.

[Danny Cannell]

It might be Georgia.

[Chip Patterson]

If it's Georgia and it might be.

[Danny Cannell]

One of those games, is Georgia Tech like how does it look?

[Tom Fenelli]

Yes.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah.

[Danny Cannell]

You know, like if it's Georgia and it's Georgia Tech and they had head to head a week before then, unfortunately, it's probably tough. You know, you're going to have to win the ACC titles. Your only way to get in or beat Georgia, right?

[Tom Fenelli]

Georgia Tech can beat Georgia.

[Danny Cannell]

Absolutely. I mean, shoot, they did it last year, almost did it. And I know overtimes it took. So yeah, definitely they could.

[Chip Patterson]

And look, Tech is not a reliable favorite under Brent Key. They're really good in an underdog role, but like they routinely kind of screw around when they're favored. So there's not any kind of guarantee that they run the table in their non Georgia and they're non UGA opponent games.

[Danny Cannell]

They're underdog this weekend, right? Against Duke? Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

I mean, huge game. So looking at this, I mean, we still have probably 25 or 30 teams whose fan bases are like, hey, we really still have a shot to make the playoff. I didn't always love the idea, like, of going to a playoff, but again, I do think 12 is way better than 4. Like just at 4. ESPN would be running these who's in commercials. And their message is basically, hey, everybody, but about nine teams, your season is over. And that's just like a shitty place to be as a fan because you're being beaten down, you know. So I, this is why I think 12 is better than 4. If you want to go back to BCS, that had flaws as well. But like, to me, this kind of keeps reinforcing. Four was, was not a great number. Maybe eight's better than 12, but like, four was bad. So this keeps a lot of fans.

[Tom Fenelli]

Engaged throughout the sport with, with obviously Texas Tech in here as, as your Big 12 champion, and we're talking about Georgia Tech or, you know, what would happen in terms of the Big 12. Rough weekend for the Big 12 in terms of the overall strength of that conference. The idea that this is not, you know, a, a Texas Tech and the 15 dwarves was really hurt by TCU getting dog walked by Kansas State. What was a. There was a couple other kind of Iowa State laws to Colorado, Iowa State, Colorado. When I was, when I was doing my, my movers in the 136, I was noticing a trend of a lot of Big 12 teams that had been in that sort of 20 to 35 range were all starting to slip down. And that's, that's not going to be the great, the best thing in terms of trying to get two teams into the College Football Playoff.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, they kind of really need both BYU and Texas Tech to be undefeated in the Big 12 championship. Do they play each other in the regular season?

[Chip Patterson]

Byu and yes, they do.

[Bud Elliott]

I believe BYU goes to Tech. There's just no way that's happening then.

[Tom Fenelli]

Boys, we got holy war this week. I can't. I can't talk about BYU or Utah, what their record's going to be till I see Saturday night out in Provo. One of many, one of many games that are very exciting about this coming weekend. All right, well, coming up on the other side, one last look at week seven. We go under the hood. It's called upon further review and more next. If you love the NFL and NFL draft, you'll love with the first pick a part of CBS Sports podcast network. CBS Sports draft analyst Ryan Wilson and former Titans GM Ran Carthon come to you twice a week to give the front office perspective on the biggest NFL storylines of the day. We also follow the NFL Draft Closer Than Anyone, the weekly updates on our favorite college players, names to know based on your favorite NFL team's needs, and all the mock drafts and big boards you could want. If you love football, you're exactly where you're supposed to be. Download with the first pick and follow on Apple Podcasts, Spotify and anywhere podcasts are found.

[Danny Cannell]

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[Chip Patterson]

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[Danny Cannell]

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[Tom Fenelli]

Imagine fast hydration combined with balanced energy. Perfectly flavored with zero artificial sweeteners. Introducing Liquid Ivy's new energy Multiplier, Sugar free. Unlike other energy drinks, you know the ones that make you feel like you're glitching. It's made with natural caffeine and electrolytes so you get the boost without the burnout. Liquid IV's new energy multiplier, Sugar Free Hydrating energy. Tap the banner to learn more back here on the COVID 3 podcast. On Mondays, we get one last chance to be able to look back before we turn our attention ahead. We go under the hood. It's upon further review there were terrible calls. Do we want to go ahead and jump in after further review. After further review.

[Chip Patterson]

Further review.

[Tom Fenelli]

All right bud, do you have the did you put in this cash's Howell Texas A&M note?

[Chip Patterson]

I did. Yeah.

[Tom Fenelli]

Yeah. Let's talk about one of the best defenders in the SEC right now.

[Chip Patterson]

This is not about his little celebration dance after the game. But like A&M's pass rush is so much better than we thought it was going to be after they lost all those guys. And man, like he is a big reason why this guy is an absolute beast getting after the quarterback. We know A and M's offensive line is probably top two in the country. I would say maybe top three. Like kind of them. Miami, Iowa are all probably strongly in that group. Maybe Cole, Kublick or Aaron have have other other teams they would mention as they work on the Joe Moore Award committee. But Cash Sal is a freak and this guy is good. His band off the Edge is special and like he looks like one of these kind of classic pass rushers that a national title Team breaks out there and you just can't, can't find a way to block them. Austin Barber, and I know it's PFF College, which is not as good as PFF Pro, but he had a pass blocking grade of zero. So that doesn't mean he's, he's supposed.

[Tom Fenelli]

To get drafted, right? I mean, yeah, that does.

[Chip Patterson]

Correct. He's a solid player. It doesn't, that doesn't mean that he, that he didn't have a single successful snap. By the way, like penalties do actually like give you negatives from how I understand the grading works. But a zero ain't good, guys. So you're looking, if you're a team like that, probably more, you know, high 60s, mid 70s. If you're a really good player, you're in the 80s or like the rare players are kind of in the low 90s. 0 is not, not getting it done. And a big reason for that was cash as hell.

[Tom Fenelli]

The helmet is one and oh, but the San Diego State Aztecs are five and one. Shawn Lewis's crew just absolutely laying it down on Saturday night. This Aztecs team continues to be a very interesting squad to watch out there in the Mountain West. When they beat Cal, we put a lot of that on a Cal no show performance and a letdown spot. I mean, Tom, I kind of think that this is a, this is a little bit of a reevaluation of where this Aztecs team is at this point in the season.

[Bud Elliott]

I mean, I think that the four of us need to sit down, have a tough talk with ourselves about did we in our draft of G5 playoff potential, did we all screw up? Did we all forget to draft the team that's going to end up getting that spot? Because what if what we saw on Friday night in Denton kind of becomes the norm in the American and those guys just eat each other alive. And next thing you know they've got two losses. And then there at the end of the year is a San Diego State team that emerges from the Mountain west with only one loss and a win over Boise. I don't know.

[Tom Fenelli]

I think.

[Bud Elliott]

And a win over an ACC team.

[Tom Fenelli]

They, I think they enter. So they don't play UNLV in conference play.

[Chip Patterson]

Correct.

[Bud Elliott]

So it's possible in the championship game. So they end up 111 with wins over Cal, Boise and UNLV. Is the American team gonna have that?

[Chip Patterson]

They're gonna have that resume.

[Bud Elliott]

You're gonna be all like wild. Tulane beat Northwestern. I don't know.

[Tom Fenelli]

I don't know. Navy might have something to say about that.

[Danny Cannell]

You know, I do think it's going to be interesting because the debate about the nine and three SEC teams, the group of five record versus wins. Who do you think? Yeah. Is going to be really intriguing where you start looking deep into those are going to matter just as much.

[Chip Patterson]

I think as long as everyone has at least one loss in the group of five, the committee is going to have carte blanche to just pick who they think is the best team. Right. I think they still show great deference to an undefeated G5, but I feel like if it's one loss for two loss, they're just going to pick who they want.

[Danny Cannell]

Like which don't you think the Americans the deepest conference group of five?

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

I mean the American has a better non conference record against P4 schools in the ACC does this year. The American 6 and 11. The ACC is 5 and 13. Now the ACC still has a few more games left where they can make up that ground.

[Chip Patterson]

But or.

[Tom Fenelli]

For those who haven't checked it out, it is. It's not just a San Diego State team that's had a couple defensive performance, but Jaden Denigal has really kind of opened up. The former Michigan quarterback kind of settled into his own as that offense the last two weeks has kicked it into high gear. Following they were a previous brilliantly boring wins of the week team. After 6 to 3 at Northern Illinois, 45 points against Colorado State, 44 points against the Wolf Pack. Two words that offense is humming now with Denegal at the helm. Dk anything upon further review, anything from the notebook that you. You want to. Oh no, you go ahead. I've got something. I forgot to put it in the dot.

[Danny Cannell]

I was just gonna say I am not making any emphatic statements. Last week I thought like hey, the top tier had started to separate. It was Oregon, Miami and Ohio State. And then we saw Indiana even with that three, the new three that are kind of elevating this season. I know Bud put out some stuff. Well, it was based on the SP plus rankings that are out there. There is just. And we've talked about a lot. It's become more of a common theme. But I think you're really seeing it as we get deeper in the season. We see these, you know, conference plays start to go. There's just the parody that's out there is unbelievable. And I do think it's going to take a while for some programs to get used to seeing 9 and 3 as a really, really good season because there's a lot in shoot, Penn State might be one of them. And it's like you're starting to realize, holy crap, maybe that was really good to be able to, you know, achieve that. I mean, it looks bad. I know it's horrible. Losing those back to back games is 21 point favorites or more. I just feel like the parody's here and it's not going anywhere anytime soon. I think it's for here for good.

[Tom Fenelli]

When, when we were in Fort Lauderdale, you asked Jake Fettner from Sportsline about the spreads.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah.

[Tom Fenelli]

And he was saying that they are starting to get even closer to NFL type spreads. And he backed up your notion. I saw this from ESPN, Stan Wetzel yesterday. SEC margin of victory, 10.7 points per game. NFL margin for a victory, 10.8 points per game.

[Bud Elliott]

Oh, you're just going to do that to your very own podcast co host, huh?

[Tom Fenelli]

Did you put that out?

[Bud Elliott]

I put it out for every freaking conference, man.

[Danny Cannell]

So what's that?

[Chip Patterson]

If you take, if you take Kentucky out, it's, it's, it's even tighter, probably real tight.

[Tom Fenelli]

Do you want to read it? Sure.

[Bud Elliott]

It was the. Out of this is just average margin of victory by conference and through week seven. SEC is at 10.73. Next is the Mountain west at 13.79, the ACC at 13.83, the Sun Belt at 13.93, the Big Ten at 14.18, Mack at 14.4, CUSA at 14.54, the Big 12 at 14.56, and the American at 18.05. That's in conference play.

[Tom Fenelli]

Yeah, that's because when there's a huge.

[Bud Elliott]

Gap between the top and the bottom of that league.

[Tom Fenelli]

Well, and it's also because when things go sideways in one of those American games, they go real sideways. Where even competitive games like we saw on Friday night with like a twin. Was he 63, 36. That's what, 27 point margin? Yeah, that. That backs up essentially what my eyes have told me.

[Bud Elliott]

By the way, the national average is 14.17.

[Tom Fenelli]

All right, Danny, I'm not going to declare it a full. Knowles to go. Knowles to go. But can we get, can we get. Can we get a public service announcement? Man, like, what's.

[Danny Cannell]

It could not have been a worse Saturday for me. I had to bail on the studio crew because I was feeling like crap. Went home was like.

[Bud Elliott]

There are some that were saying that you bailed because you were watching Florida State and.

[Danny Cannell]

No, it was before. It was before the Florida State came. It kicked off.

[Chip Patterson]

It was early.

[Tom Fenelli]

Somebody in that studio was like, oh, we've got Bud here, we've got BMAC.

[Danny Cannell]

Here, and we've got all the Florida State guys.

[Tom Fenelli]

Let's get them all.

[Bud Elliott]

See you later.

[Tom Fenelli]

Let's get them all on. Get them all on set, let's go.

[Danny Cannell]

It is, I mean, it's different, but it's not that different to think where you could go from beating Alabama in week one to losing three straight games, the Miami loss, I mean, coming into the season, you're like, yeah, you probably thought you would have lost to Miami, you would have taken a one possession loss all day long. But thank goodness they beat Alabama because if they didn't, if they were sitting here with only, you know, with zero wins against Power four teams, it's probably a different conversation. There are a lot of articles that are being written. I'm sure Bud has seen them about, hey, this is. The writing is on the wall. It does feel inexcusable, like it is unacceptable by Florida State standard. I don't know how you. The offense is actually delivered. I think on exactly what you wanted to see, Gus Malzon with his style of quarterback, they've actually been playing really well. And going into the pit game, you would have said, man, we're down. Squirrel, right? A starting tackle like, boy, I hope our offense can deliver, but if you put up 31 points in the board, you should be able to win. And I'd say the defense specifically has been the biggest surprise, biggest disappointment that we've seen out of Florida State. You know, it's just, it's hard to explain. I don't, I don't, I will say, and I don't think it's time to fire anybody. The win total was seven and a half based on the roster that was out there. Let's see how it goes. Let's see how you stack up against Clemson, who's getting better. Let's see how you stack up against Florida. But my goodness, you have to win an ACC game before you even start talking about those. And unfortunately, if they lost on the road to Stanford, we might be doing an emergency podcast. I don't know where the money would come from, but it just might get so uncomfortable. It's just, I don't know what you would do.

[Chip Patterson]

I mean, his, his buyout is very line item as well. Like you can just pay it out through 2031. You know, I think the question there is like, if you did do it, who's making the hire? Like, they, they may have a very Wisconsin type discussion. Intelligency, you Know where? I don't know if the AD is going to get to make another hire there. If that happened this year, I. It's probably more of a win, not if question, but like the win might be 26. We don't know.

[Tom Fenelli]

Okay.

[Chip Patterson]

I think they're very out on this experience. Like you can't be just losing conference games like that. Not in the Big Ten. Like, you're facing a lot of teams that don't have rev share money. You spend a whole lot on football. Yeah, that's just not acceptable. I think it's. I think it's over. Just questions when.

[Tom Fenelli]

What's the. Was Florida State included on the list of jobs that you were asked to rank?

[Chip Patterson]

No.

[Tom Fenelli]

How does that, how does that look?

[Chip Patterson]

Well, I mean they're. Yeah. Like you're. You're getting. You're gonna get double digit bonus money for sure this year in millions from the extra revenue coming off the ACC thing. Which also makes it a lot easier to make a move here if you need to. Where's my list here? Shoot.

[Tom Fenelli]

Listen, why a the. The money that we get from Pit beating us on Biggie ESPN and the noon slate is gonna pay Mike Norvell's buyout. What a world.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah. If you're, if you're spending like 30 or 40 more on your roster, I think it's pretty reasonable to expect to beat those teams that you're outspending by that margin. You know, if, like, if the Dodgers were constantly losing to the Rockies, you'd have some people fired. And FSU is not the Dodgers. But like relative to what they're spending against a lot of these teams that they play in in the acc, they are. So I don't think that's like crazy Florida State fan expecting to beat, you know, bottom two Thursday teams. Yeah, exactly.

[Danny Cannell]

At home.

[Chip Patterson]

But like Norvell has consistently had this team unprepared to play the non name teams on their schedule.

[Tom Fenelli]

Yeah. One in 10 in ACC play since the start.

[Chip Patterson]

Correct season. Yeah.

[Danny Cannell]

And last year does skew it. Obviously.

[Chip Patterson]

It would not surprise me at all if they make the move this year. Like at all. I'm not saying that will happen. Just like that would not be a surprise.

[Tom Fenelli]

It'd be a bit. Because that's another one.

[Chip Patterson]

You should have done it last year. But like, I mean, it's just such a weird sport right now. You go 2 and 10. That's unacceptable.

[Tom Fenelli]

Is Florida State a better job than Wisconsin?

[Bud Elliott]

Yes.

[Danny Cannell]

Oh, Eastman.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

Yes.

[Danny Cannell]

Come on, don't be insulting. Chip was the one to ask that.

[Bud Elliott]

On this show, that's something I would typically ask.

[Chip Patterson]

Like, like generate discussion. Yeah.

[Tom Fenelli]

Yeah, that was.

[Chip Patterson]

I will say the 26 schedule is actually really difficult. So you may want Norvell to wear those losses in 26 and then start fresh.

[Bud Elliott]

Danny. Florida State or Iowa State, whereas Penn.

[Chip Patterson]

State has, like, a nice schedule.

[Danny Cannell]

Stop it. Stop. Tom rubbing salt in the wood.

[Chip Patterson]

I'm still sick, by the way.

[Danny Cannell]

You're still making me feel worse.

[Chip Patterson]

You.

[Tom Fenelli]

You're sick too.

[Chip Patterson]

Tough.

[Danny Cannell]

My goodness.

[Tom Fenelli]

I think. I think. I think. I think we had a super spreader last week in Tallahassee.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah, definitely.

[Bud Elliott]

I'm fine.

[Tom Fenelli]

Well, you know, you got out right before the virus crept out. All right, anything else we want to get on the record before we start to turn our attention forward to week eight.

[Chip Patterson]

CJ Carr should be in the discussion for the best quarterback in the country.

[Danny Cannell]

He's playing really good.

[Chip Patterson]

He's really. Yeah, yeah. Like, he and Simpson both had bad week one jitters and have since played extremely well.

[Bud Elliott]

CJ versus MAA will be a fun game.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah, ma's in that conversation, too.

[Tom Fenelli]

Yeah. How about. How about Joaquim Stewart, the true freshman defensive lineman for USC who's out there letting it be known that he is good man. He's a. He's a good player. Yeah. That usc, Notre Dame game should be a lot of fun. It will be among the games that have our attention when we are on CBS Sports Network noon eastern time with a look at week eight in the Big Ten. So come and watch this live. But if you miss it, that's okay. It'll be on demand on YouTube and wherever you get your podcast. We will be back live [e-mail] cover three. Wednesday 11am for a little big game breakdown, then locks on Thursday. We rocking and rolling into week eight. And you can follow him on Twitter Tom Fenelli. You can follow him@bud Elliott3. You can follow him at Danny Cannell. Follow me at Chip Patterson. Gentlemen, thank you very much.

[Bud Elliott]

Thank you.

[Danny Cannell]

See ya.

[Tom Fenelli]

Tulsa is my home now.

[Bud Elliott]

Academy Award nominee Sylvester Stallone stars in.

[Tom Fenelli]

The Paramount plus original series Tulsa King.

[Bud Elliott]

His distillery is a very interesting business.

[Chip Patterson]

And we got to know the enemy from Taylor Sheridan, co creator of Landman.

[Tom Fenelli]

What are you saying? If you think you're going to take.

[Chip Patterson]

Me out, it's going to be really difficult.

[Bud Elliott]

Tulsa King new season now streaming exclusively on Paramount Plus.