Upon Further Review: What’s Next For Arkansas After Firing Sam Pittman, AP Top 25 reaction, more!

Summary

Cover 3 College Football Podcast

Episode Summary:

Upon Further Review: What’s Next For Arkansas After Firing Sam Pittman, AP Top 25 reaction, more!
Hosts: Chip Patterson, Tom Fornelli, Danny Kanell, Bud Elliott
Date: September 29, 2025

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Episode Overview

This episode dives deep into the ramifications of Arkansas firing head coach Sam Pittman, explores the AP Top 25 Poll and related controversies, and recaps pivotal storylines from the latest college football weekend. The crew discusses possible coaching candidates for Arkansas, debates the validity of the top-ranked teams, and gives their “upon further review” analysis of critical games like Oregon-Penn State and Alabama-Georgia.

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Main Topics & Discussion Points

1. Arkansas Fires Sam Pittman: What’s Next?

• (01:45–10:13)

  • Arkansas opted to fire Sam Pittman instead of waiting until after the season, forgoing $3 million in buyout savings.
  • Bobby Petrino named interim head coach, immediately fires much of the defensive staff.
  • The panel discusses the logic of the timing (“reverse of Keeping up with the Joneses”), implications for player retention, and Arkansas’s trajectory in the SEC.

  Key Quotes:

  • “It feels like a time to just rip the Band-Aid off and see how it goes.” – Tom Fornelli (04:01)

  • “Bobby Petrino is not a candidate for any Power 5 jobs…he has no leverage…You could offer him a discount and invest the savings in the roster.” – Bud Elliott (05:17)

  • “Petrino firing the defensive staff is day one: drain the swamp, I’m here for you.” – Danny Kanell (07:47)

  • Debate over whether Arkansas is capable of sustained success in the SEC; comments about scheduling philosophy compared to Ole Miss and Missouri.

  • Speculation on coaching candidates: Petrino, John Gruden (humorously), Rhett Lashley, and Golesh.

  • (11:52) Bud Elliott: “Rhett Lashley at SMU is probably the guy they really want...I just don’t know if he’ll take it.”

  Additional Points:

  • Arkansas’ non-conference scheduling makes success harder.
  • The school’s brand and support compared to SMU.
  • Whether Arkansas can be a consistently bowl-eligible program with the right coach.

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2. AP Top 25 Poll Reaction: Poll Assassin

• (18:09–29:51)

  • Ohio State remains #1 but loses some first-place votes; Oregon jumps to #2, Miami #3, Ole Miss up nine spots to #4.
  • Dispute over the AP voters’ logic, especially giving teams like Penn State and Texas the benefit of “good losses.”
  • Transparency and consistency in ranking teams based on resumes rather than reputation.

  Key Quotes:

  • “I’m so tired of the ‘good losses’ argument...why do we let voters get away with this?” – Tom Fornelli (20:03)

  • “If you think Oregon is the number two team in the nation, how far can you really drop the team that just played them double overtime?” – Bud Elliott (21:01)

  • Panel highlights voters who uphold head-to-head results, keeping Florida State above Alabama on their ballots.

  • (23:17) Tom Fornelli: “True ball mowers right there.”

  • Discussion of Virginia’s ranking and the poll’s treatment of teams not traditionally ‘big brands.’

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3. Key Game Analysis & “Upon Further Review”

• (37:01–56:06)

  • Oregon vs. Penn State:

    • (37:34) Tom Fornelli reviews the defensive performances: “The Jim Knowles hire works...Penn State’s defense is capable of slowing down one of the best offenses in the country.”
    • Bud Elliott argues that Drew Aller deserves more credit given the lack of support from Penn State’s receivers.

  • Ohio State vs. Oregon – Who’s Really #1?

    • Debate on which is actually the best team in the country.
    • Tom Fornelli: “Oregon’s the best team in the country right now.” (41:52)
    • Bud Elliott counters, preferring Ohio State but acknowledges Oregon’s QB edge.

  • Alabama vs. Georgia:

    • (48:58) Discussion on Georgia’s performance against Alabama and larger problems with their line play and pass rush.
    • Danny Kanell: “I would say they don’t have an Alabama problem, they have a line of scrimmage problem.” (50:13)
    • Debate on whether Alabama is now the team to beat in the SEC.

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4. SEC Title Race, Path Forward, and Projections

• (53:42–56:06)
  • Observing the wide-open nature of the SEC title race, with up to 6–7 teams realistically in contention due to unbalanced schedules.
  • Ole Miss’s favorable schedule is highlighted; odds from Connolly’s SP+ referenced.
  • Missouri is particularly well-positioned if they can take advantage.

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5. Notable Quick Hits & “Brilliantly Boring Wins of the Week”

• (33:55–35:20; 57:51–59:03)
  • Highlight win: San Diego State’s efficient, if unspectacular, victory at Northern Illinois.
  • Stat of the week: certain teams undefeated or winless against the spread—Memphis, Mississippi State, Utah State, Louisiana Tech, and James Madison (undefeated ATS); Georgia, Clemson, Penn State, SMU, Georgia State, and Sam Houston (winless ATS).
  • Chuckling about the troubles for teams like LSU, Clemson, and Penn State meeting or missing betting expectations.

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Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments (with Timestamps)

• On Arkansas firing Pittman:
  “Is this like the reverse of Keeping up with the Joneses?...are you trying to make sure you’re in line with the losers that have already fired their coach?”
  — Tom Fornelli (03:40)

• On SEC difficulty for Arkansas:
  “Arkansas actually seems to want to play big non-conference games, which prevents them from having nice records.”
  — Bud Elliott (08:57)

• On AP Poll frustration:
  “The AP voting process is a complete joke and yet we all still reference top 25 wins or top ten wins...it drives me batty.”
  — Tom Fornelli (20:03)

• On “good losses” in the poll:
  “If you think Oregon is the number two team in the nation, how far can you really drop the team that just played them double overtime?”
  — Bud Elliott (21:01)

• On Alabama-Georgia fallout:
  “They don’t have an Alabama problem. They have a line of scrimmage problem...they’re just not as good as they'd been two or three years ago.”
  — Danny Kanell (50:13)

• Who’s No. 1?
  “Oregon’s the best team in the country right now.”
  — Tom Fornelli (41:52)

• On the SEC title race:
  “Vandy is mathematically alive with a straight face...that hasn’t happened in our lifetimes.”
  — Bud Elliott (55:01)

• Engagement Grab:
  “Does Penn State win that game with Bo Pribula?”
  — (47:42–48:28), the crew hamming up and poking the fanbase.

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Timestamps of Key Segments

| Segment | Start | End | |--------------------------|------------|------------| | Arkansas/Pittman Firing | 01:45 | 16:10 | | AP Poll “Pole Assassin” | 18:09 | 29:51 | | Brilliantly Boring Wins | 33:55 | 35:20 | | Upon Further Review | 37:01 | 56:06 | | SEC Title Race | 53:42 | 56:06 | | ATS/Week 5 Notes | 57:51 | 59:03 |

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Final Thoughts / Episode Tone

The podcast features its characteristic mix of in-depth football analysis, good-natured banter, irreverence toward college football’s quirks, and an eye for the absurd—especially in polling and coaching carousel conversations. The hosts balance sharp criticism with inside jokes, such as repeated mention of the “COVID 3 tailgate,” Ball Mowers, and running gags around program culture.

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For New Listeners

If you missed the episode, you’ll come away knowing:

• Why Arkansas fired its head coach now, and what it means for their future.
• How the AP Top 25 poll often protects bluebloods and the loudest current controversies.
• Which teams are really the best in the country—and why the answer can change week to week.
• Deeper analysis of Oregon, Ohio State, Alabama, Georgia, and Penn State—beyond the boxscore.
• That the SEC is as wild and unpredictable as ever, and the championship race is wide open this year.

The hosts’ conversational, deeply informed, and occasionally irreverent style makes these sometimes-complicated CFB stories both engaging and accessible.

Transcript

[Chip Patterson]

This episode of the COVID 3 podcast is presented by Cash App. For a limited time only, new Cash App users can use our show's code when they sign up for a reward. Just download Cash App, use our code cover 3 and send $5 to a friend. Within 14 days, you'll get $10 right in your account. Terms apply. That's money. That's Cash App. I've never felt like this before. It's like you just get me. I feel like my true self. Does that sound crazy? And it doesn't hurt that you're gorgeous? Okay, that's it. I'm taking you home with me. I mean, you can't find shoes this good just anywhere. Find a shoe for every you from brands you love like Birkenstock, Nike, Adidas and more at your DSW store or.

[Bud Elliott]

Dsw.Com this episode is brought to you by State Farm. Checking off the boxes on your to do list is a great feeling.

[Danny Cannell]

And when it comes to checking off coverage, a State Farm agent can help.

[Bud Elliott]

You choose an option that's right for you.

[Chip Patterson]

Whether you prefer talking in person on.

[Bud Elliott]

The phone or using the award winning app, it's nice knowing you have help finding coverage that best fits your needs. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Welcome Back to the COVID 3 podcast with your hosts Chip Patterson, Tom Fernelli.

[Danny Cannell]

Danny Cannell and Bud Elliott. It's your call for the best college.

[Bud Elliott]

Football national signing day to the national championship and everything in between. CBS Sports presents the COVID 3 podcast.

[Chip Patterson]

And welcome back to the COVID 3 podcast here on CBS Sports. That's Tom Fenelli, that's Bud Elliott, that's Danny Cannell. I'm Chip Patterson coming to you [e-mail] cover3 and everywhere you get your podcast on demand. Thanks for hanging out. Smash that subscribe smash that like and come and join us in the chat aka the COVID 3 tailgate where they are trying to get Mike Bobo hired for the Arkansas job. Because the COVID 3 tailgate is committed to the bit lots to get to. Yes, we are going to do our normal Monday business that includes Pole Assassin. As we look at the AP Top 25 poll, react to some of the ballots, react to some of the changes in the rankings. We are going to go upon further review. One last chance to look back at the week that was. But first let's hop on that carousel. For those of you watching on YouTube.com cover three, you got to see our old friend Mel Tucker. You got to see that stack of money. And that stack of money is particularly significant because Arkansas could have waited until the end of the season and saved themselves about $3 million worth of buyout money. But no, they decided to act right away. And the actions have also included today, here on Monday, Bobby Petrino, the interim coach, is just bringing out the chopper. We. We are just getting the whole defensive staff. You are out, Danny. We. The idea that Sam Pittman is not the head coach for 2026 is not a surprise. Where are you with the Razorbacks in terms of the timing of the actions? What we've seen since and sort of what's next for that team in that program?

[Tom Fernelli]

Is this like the reverse of Keeping up with the Joneses? Like, where you. Like where you know, keeping up with the Jones? You're trying to spend more money to stay up with the elite. Are you trying to make sure you're in line with the losers that have already fired their coach? Like, to make sure you're getting those interviews there. That's the way I see it. Like, they don't want to get too far behind the interview process with some of these other coaches that are going to be having the same conversations.

[Chip Patterson]

Tanking. Race to the bottom, tanking. Is that kind of what we're going for here?

[Tom Fernelli]

Does that make something like that? $3 million is chump change. When you think about the bigger picture for all of these programs. And I, you know, hearing Brandon Marcelo talk about the scene there at halftime when they're scrambling and people are irate and they're looking around and half the stadium is emptied out, that is. That's a rough indictment. And all of these hot fires that we've made. I am usually, since you guys have listened to me on this show, I'm usually, patience, don't do anything rash. Maybe it can turn around. I think these have all been fairly obvious. Like, yup, it's probably time now. Feels like a time to just rip the band aid off and see how it goes. I was more surprised today that Bobby Petrino made some of the changes on the defensive side of the ball. Like, how many coaches are left? I guess you don't really need 45 coaches like a lot of these staffs have. But Travis Williams was one of those coaches who was, you know, a very hot name in the next head coaching cycle not that long ago and see the changes he made there was pretty interesting. But I think this is more about getting in line for the next head coach as soon as possible.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, I, I'm. I mean, I think Tom's point on the instant was really interesting. As far as, hey, do it now so that you can like remove all doubt that you should not hire Petrino because this thing's not going to really get turned around this season. Obviously I did have a thought yesterday while I was golfing and you know, if they, if they went with Petrino, like, Bobby Petrino is not a candidate for any Power 5 jobs, right? Like, this is like the only actual P5 job, P4 job. Rather like the only P4 job Bobby Trudeau could get is Arkansas. He, like, he has no leverage, like contract wise, money wise with them, like at all. I bet you could go to him, be like, hey, Bobby, we'll give you two and a half, okay? You're your own oc. We'll give you a little extra money to spend on defense. And we're going to take our cost savings compared to what we would do with a normal head coach. Your normal office coordinator staff cost savings are probably like 8 to 10 million, honestly. And we're going to put that into the roster like now. Granted, everywhere he leaves is an absolute dumpster fire. Like he leaves a disaster behind him culturally, roster wise, all that kind of stuff. But like, maybe in a GM era where he's not running things on that.

[Tom Fernelli]

Side of the ball.

[Bud Elliott]

I, I don't. There's. There's worse ideas, I guess, maybe. But yeah, I don't know. I think Arkansas's defensive staff knew they were going to absolutely suck out loud this year because they knew they didn't have any players because they didn't have any money in the portal to go get players. So that's what it comes down to. Like, you know, does Arkansas actually want to compete in the sec? Like, you join the sec? I don't think they really do, but I could be wrong. Hope I am.

[Chip Patterson]

Real quick, just, just to interject because this is from the tailgate. I want, I want to make sure we can ask. Did thinking about Arkansas while playing golf hurt your round negatively? Because I can't.

[Bud Elliott]

What did hurt my round is I really couldn't get to sleep at all. And I was 10 over through 5 and I shot 88. So like through adversity. Yeah. Turned it around, you know, pretty well. But yeah, that was, I think, like, I don't know, you guys, you have a hard time going to sleep after, after the night show?

[Chip Patterson]

Yes.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah. So it's like, yeah, we're done at like 1:30. But what time you actually like falling asleep? Like, yeah, I think I was like 2:45. I checked the.

[Danny Cannell]

I was upright until 2.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah. Which is 34 hours sleep.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

You know, when I was up at 7.

[Chip Patterson]

That's, that's why Tom agreed. He was like, I'll just, I'll just write to burn off all the energy. He's like, burn off the steam after, after the instant reaction show. So. Yeah, I'm, I feel you there, bud.

[Danny Cannell]

I will say Bobby's already, he's, he's, he's, he's doing what he can to get that job. I mean that's like, you know, day one showing up and firing the entire defensive staff. That is like I'm here. I'm draining the swamp. I am playing to the fans who hate this defense. I'm going to give them what they want right away. Bobby P. Is here for you. I'm gonna take over this program and get rid of everything that's wrong with it. Vote Bobby P.

[Chip Patterson]

Do you think, do you think he's got support?

[Danny Cannell]

I'm sure he has some.

[Bud Elliott]

I mean, I don't think you get the OC if you don't have some support. Yeah.

[Danny Cannell]

When was the last time Arkansas was good? Who was their head coach?

[Chip Patterson]

Right. I hear you.

[Danny Cannell]

He's got support. I just don't know if it's enough support to actually get the job.

[Bud Elliott]

Like Pittman did win nine games at one point.

[Danny Cannell]

You know.

[Tom Fernelli]

So many games are they gonna win? I mean, I don't think with the.

[Bud Elliott]

New nine game schedule, like it's, it's not a program I think you can win at. And a lot of people online have responded to me and they said why can't they be Ole Miss? Why can't they be Missouri? And honestly, like part of it's the non conference scheduling. Like Ole Miss in Missouri schedule themselves 40 every year.

[Chip Patterson]

Right.

[Bud Elliott]

Like you could talk to me about Kansas. I, I get that. But like for the most part, Kansas is an absolute dumpster fire. The program, they're much better now. I don't think they're gonna go back to what they were under less miles and, and before less. But like, you know, more often than not, like they're not a competitive program. Ole Miss schedules absolutely nobody on purpose. Like they, they go 40 the non con every year for a reason so that they keep their floor nice and high. Arkansas doesn't seem to do that. Like Arkansas actually seems to want to play big non conference games which prevents them from having nice records.

[Chip Patterson]

Interesting.

[Danny Cannell]

You guys like the thought I had about this, like with the timing of it. Because it was clear he was going to get fired.

[Chip Patterson]

Correct.

[Danny Cannell]

Do you think they waited till after the season was five games old, so players on the team couldn't just sit out the rest of the year. Yeah, okay, so I'm not alone there.

[Bud Elliott]

There's no reason not to fire him after Memphis if you're going to fire him after that. Like, I mean, you had the same players. You couldn't get a single stop against Ole Miss.

[Chip Patterson]

Like, you know, but you don't think anybody was lying to themselves about what? One score game against Ole Miss, one score game against Memphis. We're a couple plays away. I mean, that's the classic being able to lie to yourself about a football season. You know, we're, we're not that far away from being undefeated.

[Danny Cannell]

Possibly, but I also definitely think they were wanted to wait until they were at least five games into the season.

[Bud Elliott]

If you're a program and you're not doing that, you're really not being smart.

[Chip Patterson]

To Tom's point, Travis Williams, defensive coordinator, defensive line coach Deke Adams, and then defensive assistant Marcus Woodson. We are full. Analysts are now coaches, assistants are now coordinators. Skeleton staff scenario right there in Fayetteville. Sorry, bud. You got something?

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, I'm just looking at their schedule for next year. They play. They're playing at Utah. Arkansas is.

[Chip Patterson]

I mean, Texas Tech won there. How hard can be?

[Bud Elliott]

That's fair. Texas Tech probably has double the money Arkansas does.

[Danny Cannell]

Can you get John Gruden in there this week or is he gonna wait to see what happens at like Florida and Auburn?

[Chip Patterson]

No, he's gonna wait. Your John Gruden. AI generated photos are fantastic.

[Danny Cannell]

That wasn't AI that was real.

[Bud Elliott]

I think he could get Arkansas.

[Danny Cannell]

I do too.

[Bud Elliott]

I don't think he would get serious consideration in Auburn or, or Florida. Like those feel like serious football programs to me. Like, like Arkansas, whatever.

[Tom Fernelli]

I mean, I would not be surprised if Florida made a run at John Gruden at all. He did win a Super bowl right down the road with the Tampa Bay Bucks. I think that's one.

[Bud Elliott]

I hope that happens. Oh, my Lord.

[Tom Fernelli]

I hope it does happen too. I don't think it's that crazy. I think they will make a run at John Gruden.

[Chip Patterson]

Love that. All right, so let's, let's play this prompt. If it's not Petrino and I guess if it's not Gruden, what is it? What does an Arkansas wish list look like?

[Bud Elliott]

Lashley? I, I think is the top. Like Rhett Lashley at SMU is probably the guy that they really want to get. I just don't know if he'll take it.

[Chip Patterson]

What about Golish?

[Bud Elliott]

I mean, I think if you offer goal is a job, goal is has to take it. They're losing almost all their best players after this year and we've seen before these G5 guys. It like it can be you, but it can also be like having special players at a certain time. Like look at trailer at utsa, right? You missed the window. You missed the window.

[Chip Patterson]

Kendall Briles.

[Bud Elliott]

That didn't go well there.

[Chip Patterson]

I thought he was the OC for the nine win season. I might be. I don't have that.

[Bud Elliott]

He was also the OC for like a year. They didn't. I don't think he got really. I don't think he got along well with Pittman. I, I don't think Kendall Browse is, is gonna be a like at that level of head coaching candidate money being.

[Chip Patterson]

An issue could be a problem for Rhett Lashley. Don't forget SMU has agreed to fund all of the television revenue for nine years. So the idea that they would get into a bidding war with SMU could be a very dangerous, dangerous proposition.

[Tom Fernelli]

I think Brett's gonna laid out for Auburn too and see what happens there. Because I, I think smu, you could make a case that that's a much better job than Arkansas. I don't know if you could say the same for Auburn.

[Bud Elliott]

It kind of depends on what you care about though, right? Like if you just care about getting as rich as possible, I think Arkansas is a better job. But your roster is going to be worse than like more than a majority of the teams you play on an annual basis. Unless they, unless they all of a sudden start spending like crazy.

[Chip Patterson]

But when our. Golly.

[Bud Elliott]

It's just not a competitive program in the SEC. It should not have joined the SEC. It's a Big 12 program.

[Tom Fernelli]

Didn't their athletic director just say, say this out loud? Yeah, everybody was upset. They're trying to win in basketball and baseball too.

[Bud Elliott]

It's crazy.

[Chip Patterson]

I mean that's. That the only reason that's not going to get you dropped from the Super League is because the Super League needs teams to take losses.

[Bud Elliott]

Yes, but what I.

[Danny Cannell]

The Super League wants super brands. They're.

[Bud Elliott]

I don't. It's.

[Chip Patterson]

I think Arkansas is a bigger brand than smu. Yeah.

[Danny Cannell]

I don't think SMU is getting into the Super League.

[Chip Patterson]

But if it's all about. But that's what I'm saying, like at the. The money part of this. Right. If you're saying that SMU is a better job because the easier path to winning more games, you've got the financial backing. I think that they fall behind Arkansas in terms of fan support. I think they fall behind Arkansas in terms of brand and recognition. That's not as easy of a. That's not as easy of a call for me.

[Bud Elliott]

But can you win at Arkansas for a year?

[Danny Cannell]

You can have a really good season. I don't think you can sustain it unless something drastically changes in the sec.

[Bud Elliott]

You think you could make bowls more than half the time with a good coach?

[Danny Cannell]

For sure.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah, sure.

[Tom Fernelli]

That's going to be tough. I mean, I almost have to get him. He played there. That's going to be a rough look, but I think it's a really tough decision for Rhett because he could be one of those coaches that waits for the perfect job or the better job.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah.

[Tom Fernelli]

And he's got a really good thing going in Dallas.

[Bud Elliott]

I. I think you can get much better players relative to your competition at smu, and that allows you to win and level up to, like, a job that you actually really want to stay at. Yeah, but like, Rhett's from Springdale.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah. I don't know that Rhett Lashley wants the Arkansas job, but I'm not. I'm still thinking that you can get the bowl games pretty regularly at Arkansas if you get a good coach. Whether Rhett wants to be that coach, I don't know. But if Vandy's now at a point where they're getting to bowl games regularly, there's no reason Arkansas can't be. Andy got the right coaching staff in there.

[Bud Elliott]

Look, totally agree. But, hey, we are going to a 9 gamer. Right? And, you know, this is like the best quarterback Vandy's had in the history of the program. Maybe Cutler.

[Danny Cannell]

I was gonna say Jay Cutler was decent.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

You know it. Well, I think Pavia was much more effective in the SEC than Cutler was.

[Chip Patterson]

All right, any. Any other names that you would put on the quick watch list here?

[Bud Elliott]

I mean, I think they're clearly hoping that Auburn and Florida don't open. And you go after a summer. All right. Like somebody like that.

[Chip Patterson]

Maybe. I mean, I think that thinking that both Auburn and Florida are not going to open is wishful thinking.

[Bud Elliott]

Totally agree. Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

Okay.

[Bud Elliott]

Hell, maybe lsu. Although I bet you. I bet you LSU lets Kelly do the coordinator thing.

[Chip Patterson]

Oh, fire Joe Sloan.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

And then. Yeah. Yeah, I could see that. Even though I saw that as, like, a sentiment was. You know, you said it was the. You said it was a Matt House thing. You said it was a this thing. It's like, what if it's just the coach? Who knows, you know, that's possible. Worth considering. All right, coming up on the other side, we turn our attention back to the here and now. We turn our attention to teams that are ranked in the top 25 with a special look at those who are voting on it. It is Pole Assassin and more Nukes.

[Danny Cannell]

This episode is brought to you by Jack Daniels. Jack Daniels and music are made for each other. They share a rhythm in the craft of making something timeless while being a part of legendary nights. From backyard jams to sold out arenas, there's a song in every toast. Please drink responsibly. Responsibility.org, jack Daniels and Old no. 7 are registered trademarks. Tennessee whiskey, 40% alcohol by volume. Jack Daniel Distillery, Lynchburg, Tennessee.

[Bud Elliott]

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[Chip Patterson]

Back here on the COVID 3 podcast, every single Monday, we like to take a look at the new AP Top 25 poll and give it a give it a second look under the microscope. The changes, the ballots and more. We call it Pole Assassin.

[Bud Elliott]

Do it.

[Chip Patterson]

Well. We've got a new number two team in the country. Yes, as we discussed late night on Saturday night, Ohio State did hold on to its spot. They did lose as we discussed some of their 55 first place votes now, but I mean they're still at 46. Oregon picks up 16 first place votes. Miami in at number three with four first place votes. Big move up for Lane Kiffin's. Ole Miss Rebels take the over on the number of spots that they go up now at number four in the ranking, up nine spots from where they were previously. Some shuffling that was expected because of the losses. Penn State falls four spots down to number seven, Georgia falls seven spots to 12 and the LSU Tigers fall nine spots down to 13 after the Tigers lose to Ole Miss. Other shuffling includes Alabama moving up after beating Georgia. They now check in at 10. Florida State drops 10 spots down to number 18 following the loss to Virginia, which of course brings about, as we mentioned, the complicated issue of trying to respect head to head results where you've Got conflicting head to head results. Unless you are going to be pulling Alabama and Georgia all the way down or leaving Florida State up, you're going to have a little bit of conflict there. That's what we see as Florida State has the win over Alabama. Alabama has the win over Georgia. But I wanted to begin Danny Canel with a look at number seven pin. Yeah. Okay. So yeah. You were thinking what I'm thinking.

[Tom Fernelli]

Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

All right.

[Danny Cannell]

Who they beaten?

[Tom Fernelli]

What are we going to go with? I, I am so tired of the good losses argument. It's what kept Notre Dame in the top 25 before they beat Arkansas at some point. Why do we let teams get away with this? Why do we let the voters get away with this? I am. So Texas is another one on there. Who's still a top 10 team. Where's Texas's good win? Oh well, it was a good loss. It drives me insane that teams haven't even beaten a Power 4 opponent and we're looking at them and giving them credit for a top 10, you know, a top 10 ranking next to their name. I, this is. And the other thing that drives me nuts is, is I think this year specifically we've all kind of at least become to the realization that the AP voting process is a complete joke and yet we all still reference top 25 wins or top 10 wins or top 15 wins and we're just fueling the narrative that helps the biggest brands in the sport. It drives me batty.

[Bud Elliott]

So look, I get it. But also logically, if you think Oregon is the number two team in the nation, how far can you really drop the team that just played them double overtime?

[Tom Fernelli]

As far as you want. They didn't wait till next week. Why can't we wait and like why does it have to happen now? Why can't we wait and make sure that Penn State is as good as we think they are? Because for three and a half quarters of that game it sure didn't look like they were a top ten team.

[Chip Patterson]

I know.

[Tom Fernelli]

And take it to overtime like we're supposed to give them credit for. I don't understand why it has to happen now. Like I, I'm totally okay if Penn State goes out. Just give me one more game. Two more games. Let him blow out somebody, then let him move up.

[Danny Cannell]

I do think there is a very solid argument to be made that Penn State shouldn't be ranked ahead of Indiana. If you compare resumes, even if you look at, you know, Penn State playing Oregon tough because.

[Chip Patterson]

Or Alabama just went into Athens.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

I'M saying Alabama.

[Danny Cannell]

I think there's plenty, I think there's a very solid argument you can make that Penn State is still too high if you're actually looking at the resumes of the teams that they're being compared to right now, even with that close loss. Because Penn State, particularly that loss to Oregon was the best game they've played and they didn't play well until the fourth quarter, although the defense played great. But we'll get to that later. I don't know. I mean, this is the weird part. It's like for me, earlier in the season, it's very, it's very clear, like some of the voting kind of just malpractice that goes on. But this is when you start getting to the point of the year, whereas it's like, okay, well, yeah, you're going to have head to head results that don't match up with what happened last week and it's going to lead to stupid things. That said, Alabama being 10th and Florida State being 18th to me is absolutely ridiculous. If Florida State was 11 and Alabama was 10, I'd be like, all right, fine, whatever. That's just kind of funny. But like the fact that they put that huge of a gap between them to me is ridiculous. But we call out a lot of voters on here. I'm going to give some, some credit here. This is for you, Danny. Reese Davis, John Wilner, Stephen Johnson, David Briggs, Andy Amashida, the evil Ralph Russo, Sam McEwen and Stephen Means. Those are your AP voters who still had Florida State ahead of Alabama on their ballots this week.

[Chip Patterson]

Let's go.

[Tom Fernelli]

True ball mowers right there.

[Chip Patterson]

I mean even Reese Davis, Alabama grad. That's, I mean that's, that's somebody who's the closest to the fire and he feels the warmth. Let's go. Congrats.

[Tom Fernelli]

The only reason I'm not too willing to like and it like, whatever, I think they should like honor the head to head is because Florida State plays Miami this weekend. Like if they beat them, they should make a massive jump and then maybe at that point their resumes get a lot more similar because Florida State would have yet another win. Then you have that judgment call and it's a lot closer. So that's why I'm not too upset about Florida State and where they are because they should have an opportunity to if they have to win and then they could make a massive jump up.

[Danny Cannell]

You know who should be the most pissed off though? Virginia fans. Because think about it, the way that this poll works is More of an indictment about how the voters think of teams that aren't supposed to be good than it is Florida State because we have seen voters overreact and punish teams for losing games. But like Illinois lost by 50 last week and dropped from nine to 23. Florida State lost, you know, close to Virginia on the road, a 4 and 1 Virginia team and dropped 10 spots. So like if Illinois is dropping 14 for losing by 50, why is Florida State dropping by 10 for losing? Close. That to me doesn't make sense. The reason is because Virginia stinks, at least in the minds of the voters. Now they snuck into the poll at the very end. They got into 24th. But it's just to me if I, I'm angrier if I'm a Virginia fan than if I'm a worst state fan, honestly.

[Chip Patterson]

Do you know why Virginia fans are particular particularly angry? And not just because we went over the top calling them nerds for about 90 seconds at the end of the show at 1am because if they don't throw an interception against NC State, they're undefeated Florida State like they are legitimately. One or two players might be 20th.

[Danny Cannell]

Right now instead of 24.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah, so that was, that was a sentiment that I was definitely starting to see from the, the who's out there who are very much in the. Man, I think we're gonna regret that loss at NC State in Week 2. Now remember that was a non conference game. So Virginia undefeated in ACC play with the head to head win over Florida State. If Tony and a like decent conference draw, Tony Elliott can keep this thing on the tracks, they could, they could do something.

[Tom Fernelli]

It's the ACC they will not kill. But yeah, to your point, no Clemson, no Miami, no smu. They do have a tricky one this weekend at Louisville, but it is a very, very manageable schedule.

[Bud Elliott]

Underdog to Duke.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah, because Duke, Duke's. Duke's the only of. Of all the schools here in the triangle that have, have moved on to basketball season, Duke's the only one that still cares about football.

[Bud Elliott]

I mean we just killed Syracuse, which is remarkable.

[Chip Patterson]

That's, that's, that's where we're at right now. Maybe maybe a little bit more on both those things later. All right, where else in the, in the rankings do you want to turn our attention?

[Bud Elliott]

I mean LSU has no good games at this point. They should not be top 20.

[Chip Patterson]

Honestly like directional Louisiana, Louisiana Tech and a Clemson team which by the way in The CBS Sports 136 which updated this morning, Clemson is ranked 59th Florida is ranked 67th. So LSU, according to the CBS Sports 136, has zero top 50 wins.

[Danny Cannell]

LSU is still in the top 10. And 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 17 ballots still have LSU in the top 10. I'm not. I don't agree with you. They shouldn't be in the top 20. They should. I'm not going to agree with you. They shouldn't be in the top 20 opinion that Bud just shared.

[Chip Patterson]

That's.

[Danny Cannell]

I mean, name 20 better teams.

[Bud Elliott]

Okay, well, actually, let's do this. I worked on this this morning.

[Danny Cannell]

Okay.

[Bud Elliott]

Everybody ahead of them, we think would be favorite over them, correct?

[Danny Cannell]

Right now?

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah.

[Danny Cannell]

Is Indiana favorite over lsu?

[Bud Elliott]

I think with. Yes. Non. Functional.

[Danny Cannell]

I don't know. I don't know if I'm gonna go.

[Tom Fernelli]

That far, but I'd have thought, well, who would you pick?

[Chip Patterson]

Indiana.

[Tom Fernelli]

Indiana. Like, forget that. Like, I, I hate.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah, I would pick. I would pick Indiana. But Indiana also just struggled on the road against Iowa.

[Tom Fernelli]

Agreed. That's why I think all of this stuff is so complicated this year, because of the parody. And that's what's frustrating, is because the perception and where you have that magical number in front of your name is really going to matter at the end of the season. And it shouldn't, but it's going to.

[Bud Elliott]

I would take Missouri over them. I would take Michigan over them. I would take Notre Dame over them. I would take FSU over them. I would take Tennessee over them.

[Danny Cannell]

Hold on, hold on, hold on. You're taking. You're not going to take LSU because their offense stinks, but you're going to take Michigan over them.

[Bud Elliott]

I think Michigan's offense looks better than LSU's offense. I think. I think the defense is like. I think the offensive gap in Michigan's favor is bigger than maybe the slight defensive gap in LSU's favorite. Yeah, I think LSU's offense looks broken. I mean, they. They had 21 carries for 60 yards. Nussmeier looks hurt. I'm just saying, like, like right now, they do not look like a top 20 football team to me. Honestly, they got very lucky that Ole Miss did not blow them out.

[Tom Fernelli]

Tom, I think you make a case for Illinois over LSU if you get the version of Illinois that you got against usc.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, I mean.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah, Michigan can run the ball. LSU cannot. Right.

[Danny Cannell]

But I mean, the thing is, like, I don't know, LSU's defense is pretty solid against the run, and I feel like if LSU is able to stop the run against Michigan, what the hell are they going to do against him? Nothing.

[Bud Elliott]

That's, that's fair. Do we think doing LSU would score?

[Danny Cannell]

No, but I think they could beat Michigan 13 to 10.

[Chip Patterson]

Well, if the officials from Happy Valley step in and just decide. We're not going to call holding because we don't want to have a three. Three tied into oblivion.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

Then who else? Any. Anybody else from. From the ranking stand out. It was again, jumbled lot lots to be able to sort out. It was a big weekend of results. So something that, you know, we, we knew that this part of the season was coming and that's definitely what's arrived here with some of the conflicts that you've got all throughout the ballot.

[Bud Elliott]

Georgia Tech.

[Chip Patterson]

They did not get punished for a.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, either. Like they, they got outplayed.

[Chip Patterson]

Yes. And then have you seen the, you've saw the offsides call. Yeah. Wake Forest is. Wake Forest has been on the, the wrong side of the officials for about two weeks in a row right now. And I mean, that's going to be the difference between maybe going bowling or not for Jake Dicker. So they put out a.

[Tom Fernelli]

Did the ACC put out an apology or whoops, we're bad. My bad.

[Chip Patterson]

And I haven't seen it yet. But that one was, I mean, it.

[Tom Fernelli]

Was, it was, it was a great, I mean, and it was like the Auburn stuff. Auburn, Oklahoma was interesting because there were calls they could have kneeled on it and the game was over. If they call that call right. And he was clearly offsides.

[Bud Elliott]

That should be reviewable, by the way. Think about it like a, a turnover with a clear and obvious offsides should be reviewable. Like it's not really a judgment call at that point. You, you have the down the line camera look on every snap. Like it's really not that hard to take a look at that. And it's something that could be quick, like you're going to a break anyway after a turnover. So I mean, if you have a pretty clear offsides, that's like palpable air. I think that should be a reviewable play. Targeting.

[Chip Patterson]

Targeting his judgment. You know, targeting his judgment. You know, your defensive pass interference holding his judgment. Like, there is not much judgment about whether or not you were on one side or the other of the line of scrimmage.

[Danny Cannell]

And if they did review it, we would be able to write a bunch of columns about how cool it is to hear them talk about it.

[Chip Patterson]

Wait, hold on. Are they writing columns? I, I see a lot of commentary on social media writing columns about it.

[Danny Cannell]

I'm sure they are. I've seen them. Yeah. I don't know if there's 100 of them. It does look cool.

[Chip Patterson]

I only read Tom, you know, you don't read me.

[Tom Fernelli]

It's the one win that Jim Phillips and the ACC have had. They've gotten, like, since, during his tenure. And the very next day, there's a horrific ACC official call that just kind of exactly from it. And I like how it kind of sounds like NASA. Just the microphones, the way they're like a little radio ish.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah.

[Danny Cannell]

Some sort of disturbance.

[Bud Elliott]

They should be a little more zoomed in so you can actually see the screens they're looking at. That's the only criticism. I think it's a great concept.

[Chip Patterson]

And Danny, you know the, you know, we always talk about the quarterback language in the play call. How about the referee language? Because they, they always, they're down distance, time and yardage and they like spit it out just like Spider2y banana, you know, like it's a whole new different terminology to it. So, yeah, again, lots more changes to come as we look ahead for the AP Top 25. And then coming up in about a month or so, we get another curveball with the College Football Playoff rankings. And the little numbers beside the names on your television screen have a whole new set of authority. Now it's time for the brilliantly boring Wins of the Week, brought to you by PNC bank, where we highlight the boring actions that, that make the biggest difference. Financial wins and football victories don't just happen. They're built on dedicated, consistent, often unseen work behind the scenes. It's the tactical moves and plays that create the foundation for the show, stopping moments in life and on the field. And going into week five, Tom Friedelli and I had a discussion. It was about familiarity, because when you find out that a team is traveling from San Diego to DeKalb, Illinois, you're thinking, you know what, that's a. That's going to be a foreign spot. But oh, no, no, no. Not when the head coach of that San Diego State team, he spent time in the Mac. He knows about these Mac streets. And even though Sean Lewis comes with a big offensive background, he knew what it would take to be able to go and get a tough road win against a Mac team. And that was just going to be the brilliantly boring defensive excellence as San Diego State held Northern Illinois to just 179 yards of total offense. They absolutely locked them down, allowed 57 yards of passing on just. On just 16 attempts, picked them off as well. And San Diego State wins 6 to 3 against Northern Illinois. And why is this particularly significant? Because now Sean Lewis's San Diego State team is 31 on the season. That loss to Washington State, I'm sure, feels very frustrating, and that matches the win total from last year. Tom what what kind of encouragement do you have about Sean Lewis and the way he was able to handle this tough road spot?

[Danny Cannell]

I mean, I do think that when you look at the situation, getting the big home win over Cal, winning 34 to nothing, an ACC win, and then you have to go on the road the next week to play Northern Illinois team, that maybe you get kind of caught overlooking the fact that they went in and no, it was not. It was not a brilliant performance from the San Diego State offense. They did only manage six points. Their defense did an incredible job. But I just think that it's a great job by Sean Lewis and that staff, making sure that their team were not celebrating too much last week's big win and going on the road knowing it wasn't going to be easy. You don't just walk into DeKalb thinking you're going to beat the Huskies. You got to know what highways to take from o' Hare to beat the traffic. So they got everything planned out. They went there, they had a plan, they executed it. Maybe not as well as they wanted, but they did it good enough and they got out of there with the win.

[Chip Patterson]

San Diego State, Northern Illinois 3 the Aztecs improved to 3 and 1 on the season. Those were the brilliantly boring Wins of the Week, brought to you by PNC Bank. Brilliantly boring since 1865 Brilliantly boring since 1865 is a service mark of the PNC Financial Services Group, Inc. PNC Bank National Association Member FDIC Coming up on the other side, we go under the hood for one last look at Week five. It's upon further review and more next.

[Bud Elliott]

Carolina basketball isn't just a program, it's a legacy. I'm John Henson and we'll be the host of Tar Heel 247, a UNC basketball podcast for fans who bleed Carolina blue. Each week I'll be joined by players, coaches and insiders for real, unfiltered comments, conversations about the team, the tradition, maybe some funny stories and everything in between. No filters, no fluff.

[Chip Patterson]

Just hoop talk.

[Bud Elliott]

The Tar Heel way. Subscribe now to Tar Heel247@ UNC basketball podcast, or wherever you get your podcast at. We're gonna have a good time. Let's get ready to go I'm Christian McCaffrey, pro running back, and Abercrombie is.

[Danny Cannell]

An official fashion partner of the NFL. I'm not kidding when I when I.

[Bud Elliott]

Say NFL by Abercrombie broke the Internet.

[Danny Cannell]

Last year and I think this season's.

[Bud Elliott]

Lineup is even cooler and so does.

[Danny Cannell]

My wife, who keeps stealing all my hoodies.

[Bud Elliott]

Stay fit for the season and Abercrombie's newest arrivals. Shop NFL by Abercrombie in the app.

[Danny Cannell]

Online and in store.

[Chip Patterson]

Back here on the COVID 3 podcast. One of the most pivotal points of the week for the COVID 3 podcast is one last chance to empty the notebook before we look ahead. We call it Upon Further Review There were terrible calls. Do we want to go ahead and jump in after further review. After further review.

[Bud Elliott]

Further review.

[Chip Patterson]

Tom, a little bit earlier in the show, you said A little more on that later. You got something you want to turn our attention to to get us started for Upon Further Review?

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah, you know, I, I went back and I rewatched Oregon, Penn State, and obviously if you're a Penn State fan, it hurts. You lost the game again. You made the nice rally towards the end of the game. But I do think if there is a silver lining to suggest that maybe there's a chance you can win this game later or one of these games later, it's that the Jim Knowles hire works. I thought that Penn State's defense overall, and we talked about it on the reaction show, there was a lot of holding, which was negating a lot of the pass rush for both teams. But they did a great job of going out there and taking away what Oregon was best at. And that has been big plays all season long. An explosive offense that gets chunk yardage and just completely blows you out of the water and destroys you and strips you of your confidence. Oregon had a 7.7% explosive play rate in this game, which is their lowest of the season by four far. Their previous lowest was 15.6 against Montana State. So they pretty much halved it. So if you are Penn State, you know that you have a defense that is capable of slowing down one of the best offenses in the country. That's what you learned on Saturday night. That's what you need to know when you have Ohio State coming or when you get to the back of the Big Ten championship and whoever you're facing there, you get to the playoff and you're going to face another good offense. That defense. If I'm a Penn State fan, it's like I'm, I'm still upset I lost the game, I still wish I would have won it, but I feel like I'm confident that my defense can win me a game, even if my quarterback in that offense isn't that good, because you almost just saw it happen on Saturday night.

[Bud Elliott]

On that note, I bet you Drew Aller has a better career than any of these Penn State receivers. Like NFL wasp. I, I think they're slightly upgraded from where they were last year, but like, those guys don't look like difference makers to me. You know, maybe Pena was like a stack king last year at, at Syracuse, but like, when he faces real competition, doesn't look anything special to me. Doesn't look like a pro.

[Chip Patterson]

I thought Oregon's deal, I, I had, I was, you know, doing my best in the hotel room to have. There were actually like two TVs in the room. So I would like run around to one side, run around to the other to be able to like go back and forth and had the radio call for Oregon, Penn State beside the computer I was working on. But I thought Oregon's defensive plan to really confuse Penn State was good. You know, like, they like the fact that the wide receivers didn't stand out. Might have been some work that was done Monday through Friday, you know, where it's just the, the pivot points for Andy Kotelniki and for Drew Aller and for Penn State's offense, I mean, they just, they did not look comfortable. And I thought that Oregon's defensive plan, that's one thing we talk a lot about Will Stein and we talk a lot about Dante Moore looking like Dante Moore. Some huge throws in this game as we talked about, but man. Or the conversation about Oregon as one of the best teams in the country. I think the piece that I did not recognize as much coming into the season and I'm continuing to become more impressed with, is that defensively they do have one of the best defensive units as well. And when you are a national championship team, you got to be top 10 in both of those. And I don't think there are 10 defenses I would take ahead of Oregon's right now.

[Bud Elliott]

Bear Alexander was really good for Oregon in this game. Do you know who the second highest rated player on Penn State's offense was?

[Chip Patterson]

Lineman included?

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah.

[Chip Patterson]

Is it a lineman?

[Bud Elliott]

No. Oh, it's a quarterback.

[Chip Patterson]

Drew Allen. Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

Like, pff. Basically just thinks the rest of his Penn State offense sucks around him.

[Danny Cannell]

I.

[Bud Elliott]

Which I don't know that I totally agree with, but like special. And they're not getting pushed in the run game.

[Danny Cannell]

I I don't think Penn State's offense is anybody on that unit's really coating itself in glory. Like I. You take that outer might be better in the NFL than the receivers, maybe. But then I think of what Trey Wallace is doing at Ole Miss. It's like he looks suddenly very good in an offense that's getting him open and has quarterbacks who can get him the ball and who's actually. Who are actually willing to take shots when he's in man on man coverage. Whereas Drew Eller, I feel like his. One of his bigger problems is he is terrified of pulling the trigger in a lot of situations where sometimes you just kind of have to pull the trigger.

[Tom Fernelli]

Oregon's the best team in the country right now.

[Danny Cannell]

Oh, okay.

[Tom Fernelli]

You think that's controversial?

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, I think Ohio State over Oregon.

[Tom Fernelli]

So here's what. Here's my take on Ohio State. And now this is where I don't. Right now, if you had me take one team, I would take Oregon. Talk to me again in December or the Big Ten championship game or the playoffs if these two teams meet. I don't think Ohio State trusts Julian sand yet, but I don't think they have to. And I think it's kind of like when we talked to Ryan Day and he was talking about game management, load management, like we didn't really care. I think that's the approach he's taken with Julian saying, they're really not exposing too much in a game like that. They're not asking him to do too much because the defense is so good. That's why the first half's kind of slow. You can only do it. They just trust their defense and they have, you know, quick, quick hitting touchdown. The crossing routes of Jeremiah Smith to get things under control. Like, I don't think it matters, like, if. But that's where I think the development of Julian saying is something to keep an eye on. Like, does he start to get more comfortable? Do they trust him more in the system? Because I think right now they have a very, very tight leash on Julian saying, and what I saw from Dante Moore in Oregon is they're. They're throwing the ball in situations where you're like, oh, my gosh, they're still being aggressive here. Like, they're. They trust him. I trust Oregon more right now than I trust Ohio State.

[Chip Patterson]

Remember how he had the whoop data? Oh, so no free ads. Remember how we had, like the heartbeat data at the Ryder cup?

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah.

[Tom Fernelli]

For J.T.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah. Yeah. What do you think Dante Moore's is 45.

[Danny Cannell]

He gets skittish.

[Chip Patterson]

Okay.

[Tom Fernelli]

I don't know. He looked the way he operated in the pocket, operated within the system. I thought he looked in complete control. I know our Mike Renner and I like Fernando Mendoza, too, but I think I'm giving the edge to Dante Moore if I was looking at the next level.

[Chip Patterson]

Oh, we get to see them play, too, on Oct. 11 in Austin Stadium. That game is going to be good.

[Bud Elliott]

I, I think Ohio State has so many difference makers on defense and at receiver that I, I agree. Oregon has the quarterback advantage. I don't think it's so big that it overcomes the other edges that Ohio State has.

[Chip Patterson]

Julian saying, ain't Craig Krenzel. But Ohio State right now looks like one of those old national title contenders with a bus driver of a quarterback when just freaks everywhere else. And it's a fun debate. I think that is, I think that's one of the fun debates coming out of this week, is in Ohio State, Oregon, who you got? AP voters, obviously, you know, given the heavy edge to the Buckeyes, but. And we don't have a regular season game to be able to put them against each other. But I think that is a very fun debate for college football fans to be having this week. All right, Ohio State, Oregon, who you got tomorrow, who you got in December, if they play for the Big Ten title, who you got in January, if they meet up in the College Football Playoff semifinals. Like, I, I, I really like what I've seen from both of those teams.

[Bud Elliott]

So yesterday, my playoff, I had Ohio State, Miami, Oregon, Texas Tech. Right. Which I think reflects what we're seeing at the top of the sport with, like, the best Big Ten team that I think clearly look better than what the SEC has. I think it's pretty clearly deeper overall. So I had five SEC teams in, none of them getting a buy. And then I had, you know, two Big Ten buys. Because, I mean, like, if Oregon runs it and Ohio State runs it, there's no way they're dropping Oregon to fifth or Ohio State to fifth if one of them loses the Big Ten championship game.

[Chip Patterson]

I mean, even outside of the, you know, the way the bracket plays out, you could say that SEC has 10 of the top 20 teams in the country and none of the top three.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah. Yeah. So the top four teams in SP plus this week are all Big Ten, and the SEC's average rating is still four and a half points higher, but.

[Danny Cannell]

I blame UCLA for that. That's all ucla.

[Chip Patterson]

That's all ucla. Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

The bottom two are really Bad.

[Chip Patterson]

And Northwestern, who played each other and just drug each other down even further and even further.

[Danny Cannell]

Going back to Danny's point about saying, I. I don't think that Ohio State was putting everything on his plate in this game, but I think they trust him. I just don't. I mean, he went on the road. It's his first road start. It's in one of the tougher environments you're ever going to play in. And he was 22, 28, two touchdowns, no mistakes, didn't make a ton of big plays, but he didn't make any of the bad plays that you would expect a freshman to make.

[Tom Fernelli]

How many times he throw the ball downfield? Not that many.

[Danny Cannell]

Did you watch Washington's coverage? There's a whole lot of quarters.

[Tom Fernelli]

Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah.

[Tom Fernelli]

They probably didn't want to give up.

[Chip Patterson]

The big play, which they're probably going to. Ohio State's probably going to see a lot of that.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah.

[Danny Cannell]

They didn't have Taco Davis. They were. They didn't have their best pass rusher. They were dropping back a lot just to try to keep everything in front of him. And I think that he did the thing that a lot of freshmen don't. He took what was there. He trusted his teammates. A lot of freshmen are like, oh, God, I got to make something happen here. I'm the guy. I'm the man. I've been since I was 12.

[Chip Patterson]

DK. Oh, sorry. Anything else on Oregon, Penn State before we. I mean, obviously we'll be talking about those teams a lot. Probably even on Tuesdays, Big Ten show on CBS Sports Network, noon Eastern time.

[Tom Fernelli]

So I. I Penn State fan recently, like, hey, what do I do? Like, oh, here we go again. I don't. I would not throw them out just yet. They'll be fine. Like, I do think it's going to be a question every time they face a good team. They were close to getting it done. And if Drew Aller doesn't lock in on his guy and just, you know, make a boneheaded throw in that situation, who knows? Maybe they come out with the win and we're talking about it completely different. But they did claw their way back. Maybe that's something. Maybe that's what they needed to see was, hey, we can score fast, we can get two touchdowns on the board, we can sustain drives. Maybe that's the sort of loss that kind of wakes them up the way that Bama did for them, you know, losing to Florida State.

[Danny Cannell]

Do you guys want to go for some engagement? Yes.

[Bud Elliott]

Sure.

[Chip Patterson]

All right.

[Danny Cannell]

So all Right. I mean, give me two seconds of silence here. Let's set it up. Does Penn State win that game with Bo Pribula?

[Tom Fernelli]

Oh, man.

[Bud Elliott]

I don't think he makes some of those throws Aller made. He might make the run game a little bit better. Yeah, like, they couldn't run the ball.

[Tom Fernelli]

Guys, which opens things up.

[Danny Cannell]

We're going for engagement here, guys. All right, let's start out.

[Chip Patterson]

Reset, reset, reset.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah.

[Danny Cannell]

Does Penn State win that game with Bill Pribula by three touchdowns out of the water? I agree. I just think that they made a huge mistake letting Beau Pribula walk out of that door during the middle of the playoffs, by the way. I think that was a huge mistake on Penn State's part. If James Franklin was doing a good job, he would have kept Pribbulin kicked Aller out and they'd be undefeated right now.

[Tom Fernelli]

To your point, though, to your point. With his athleticism, with the way he runs football, the world runs the ball. It does change the way they have to defend you, which opens up easier throws in the past game. So maybe you don't have to have him make many great throws. He's making a lot more easy ones.

[Chip Patterson]

How many national championships does Eli Drinkwitz win at Penn State with Beau Pribila?

[Danny Cannell]

Well, he only gets them for four seasons, so I'm going to go with four.

[Bud Elliott]

Okay.

[Chip Patterson]

Anything else from. From Alabama, Georgia coming out of the weekend? Because, you know, we went live very shortly after the game was done. Man, Kirby. Kirby Smart's doing the thing. Right? You know, what's everybody else's record against Alabama? Do you have that? No, I don't. I don't have that. It's just what's going to happen, guys? I can't think about.

[Bud Elliott]

Hold on.

[Chip Patterson]

Do you have that? I can't think about that. Okay. It's college football, man. It's just gonna happen. It's just gonna happen. We look around, games all over the country, it's just gonna be like that. Georgia fans aren't happy, right? Does. Does the Georgia fan. Obviously all fans have the right to feel however they want to feel, but does Kirby Smart have a point? Or should Georgia fans feel validated in their frustration with a we have an Alabama problem type scenario?

[Bud Elliott]

I mean, like, Georgia has a pass rush problem. Yeah, right. Like that. That showed up against Tennessee. They could have easily lost to Tennessee because they can't get after the passer. Right. Like, Bama's a better team than Tennessee is, not by some huge margin, but, like, Georgia has no pass rush this year. Like, they all their pass rush comes from these backers. Like it's all manufactured.

[Danny Cannell]

I, I would take that a small step further. I would say they don't have an Alabama problem. They have a line of scrimmage problem. Like, I still think they're good. So just for context, they're good. They're better than most teams on the offensive and defensive line. They're just not on either side of the ball as good as they had been two or three years ago. And I think that. Yeah. And that is causing them to be in a lot more of these games than they probably would have been before. And I think that is where they now that they don't have a. You know, it's easier to win with a game manager quarterback when you can just beat the hell out of teams in the line of scrimmage than when you can't.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, like Ty Steps have played really well. Ty Steps is going to be a pro. I don't, I don't think Gunner Stockton's a pro player. At least not, not like a high pick type guy. He's more that college game manager. You know, kind of fine to Tom's point if, if what you have around you is really good. But you know, I think the receivers are really good. They think they got the offensive line combo figured out and I don't necessarily disagree. It's probably the best we've seen Georgia's offensive line look so far this year. They actually kicked Gaston out to right tackle the freshman guard and he's, he's a freak and actually played, you know, just fine out there. Like I will note Bama D line this year has not been up to standard and like they were not very good against fsu. Bamboo D line was not really anything special in this game against uga. You know, Russo got hurt as well. I, maybe Georgia's offensive line stuff is solved, maybe it's not. I think it's the best it has looked. But it's just weird watching Bama, Georgia and not seeing like wildly good line of scrimmage play compared to what we normally see in this league. Although I thought Bama's O line was pretty good.

[Chip Patterson]

You know. You know that Kaylin DeBoer also has a good record against Dan Lanning and also has a good record against Steve Sarkeesian.

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah, I brought that up last week.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah, I mean it's, it's. I, I think Alabama has a good football coach. I know they wanted to spend their lottery money to get him out of there, but he's, he's Showing up in these big games.

[Bud Elliott]

Georgia against Kalyn's like that boxer just cannot find a way to get to the corner, you know, to halftime.

[Danny Cannell]

What if Alabama's like bizarro Auburn now under Gus, whereas it's like they're able to beat Alabama with Gus, but they were losing all those other games. What if Alabama's not a position with Kaylin where it's like we're gonna beat Georgia every single time we play him, but we might lose to Vandy once in a while and maybe a Mississippi State here or there because we're gonna be playing them every year. What if, like a Freaky Friday situation going on in Tuscaloosa?

[Chip Patterson]

Would you. Danny, what'd you make of Alabama, Georgia fallout game, game and more.

[Tom Fernelli]

I think Alabama's the best team in the sec. I think Ty Simpson is the best quarterback in the sec, maybe in the entire country. He has been lights out. He's been close to perfect since losing to Florida State. And he had all day to throw. Operating in the system, he knew exactly where to go with the football. I thought getting Tim Keenan and Jam Miller back was big for them. I still think Alabama's. I think they're going to win the sec. So, like, I, I, like. I just thought the Florida State game was one where it was sort of the perfect storm of Florida State. Play their tail off. Bama might have been caught off balance a little bit. They lose, I think they're going to be right back where we expected to be in the preseason.

[Chip Patterson]

I can rock with that.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah. I mean, there's so many teams I think could win the sec, like, legitimately could win it. What are there, six, seven.

[Chip Patterson]

Okay, so here's what. Before we wander into this, I haven't done the. Simulate the rest of the schedule to see who's got the advantage in terms of the draw. So I'm. I'm probably thinking about this more in a power rating standpoint. If I remember from last year, since the SEC schedules are the same, Ole Miss might have more of an advantage than I would give Ole Miss just because of who they've got play who they are playing the rest of the way.

[Bud Elliott]

Yeah, Ole Miss has the same schedule they had last year. It's a cakewalk within the league, and they. They are potentially in a position to cash it in this year.

[Danny Cannell]

I. I sent this to you guys yesterday. I'll read it off on the show now from. From Connolly. His. His SP/SEC title odds per SP + Ole Miss 16.3%. Mizzou 12.9. Oklahoma 11.1. Alabama 11.1. Vandy 9.7. Texas 8 1/2. Tennessee 7 2. Texas A M 62, Georgia 5 2. LSU 5 2. So basically, Vanderbilt's almost twice as likely to win the SEC as Georgia and LSU are at this point. Whoa.

[Chip Patterson]

Whoa.

[Bud Elliott]

I mean, I do think there's a bit of, like, you actually have to get there and win that game to it, obviously.

[Chip Patterson]

Sure.

[Bud Elliott]

But like, Vandy is mathematically alive with a straight face. And we're basically in October. That hasn't happened in our lifetimes.

[Chip Patterson]

No.

[Danny Cannell]

Over by October.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah, we told you.

[Bud Elliott]

If you look at the betting odds, I think they're probably a little more realistic here. It's basically six teams or seven teams. Missouri, Oklahoma, A M, Ole Miss, Georgia, Texas, Alabama.

[Chip Patterson]

What an opportunity for Missouri. Good gravy. I mean, when they got to the SEC championship game two years in a row and won the SEC east, there was a lot of. Yeah, but that accompanied that. Even though they were like, super high win totals, the teams are really good. Had NFL players on both sides of the ball. The. Yeah, but being that your traditional powers on that side of the conference were like, definitely down. If Missouri gets to the SEC championship game in this sec, I. I don't know if there's any yes or buts. I think that would just be a super impressive showing from Eli Drinkwitz in this team.

[Bud Elliott]

That makes sense. Okay.

[Chip Patterson]

Bud, you got anything on the notebook you want. You want to get out before we start to look ahead?

[Bud Elliott]

Not really. I, I think we covered a lot. I mean, I'm concerned about Auburn. Clearly, like, like, to me, that, that's. That's something we got. We got to watch out for, man. USD is a very tough stretch coming up, and they. They're like, really banged up Their. Their injury. Timing here is. Is not good. What else out there?

[Danny Cannell]

Yeah, Illinois just beat him up physically. What are you gonna do?

[Chip Patterson]

Did y' all see. Speaking of post game press conferences, did you see that Mike Elko gave a nice little like to Brian Kelly? He would chastise in the media for the. The tenor and the tone of some of their questions. And he goes, I don't want to sound like somebody else, you know, but like, but to his point, I wanted to offer, you know, and I don't want to. I don't want to step on trap draws corners here, but a little Mayakopa of my own, you know, just like I, I was. I was not giving Texas A and M's defense a chance. There's plenty of, like, Data both in terms of film and statistics to back up the idea that that group was going to be in trouble. But at going back and re watching Auburn, Texas A and M A game that was going on as I was kind of switching locations the early down defense by Texas A M to stop the run and force Jackson Arnold into the losing position that is third and long over and over and over and over again. I just thought Texas A M's defense did a good job. And as you mentioned Tom, Auburn's defense is still really good. You just got to wonder whether they're going to let go of the rope at some point because of some of the offensive struggles. So for Texas A and M I think that I on re watch came away more impressed with the performance than maybe I felt on Saturday night coming out of that 16 to 10 result.

[Bud Elliott]

How did you separate like Auburn's just completed confidence from A M Because I I was impressed with A M but like man that was a like the flatline Auburn kind of no showed that offensively.

[Chip Patterson]

I think some of that was the opponent okay outside of penalties, you know procedural stuff, it was a little messy, a little sloppy for sure.

[Bud Elliott]

That's fair.

[Chip Patterson]

Anything else? Anything else from week five?

[Danny Cannell]

Not a not a real upon further review but just an interesting factoids for the listeners. Still undefeated against the spread Memphis, Mississippi State, Utah State, Louisiana Tech and James Madison. Still winless against the spread Georgia, Clemson, Penn State, smu, Georgia State and Sam Houston.

[Chip Patterson]

Let's see. I mean do you think Clemson's going to cover against North Carolina?

[Tom Fernelli]

What's the number the pattern they did.

[Bud Elliott]

Last year they would beat the bad teams and they seem and beat them pretty badly.

[Chip Patterson]

Yeah.

[Bud Elliott]

Syracuse.

[Chip Patterson]

We'll see. All right, here's the schedule for the week. Noon eastern time on Tuesday. You can find us on CBS Sports Network. We will be diving in with a special spotlight on the Big Ten tackling some of the biggest questions as we go. Look ahead to week six. Then on Wednesday it'll be big game breakdown where there's just a little small game of incredible significance that so big we're going to be going to Tallahassee because. That's right. We want everybody Friday, October 3rd to be at Madison Social in downtown Tallahassee, Florida. 3:00pm Eastern Time is when the show would get started. But look, we're going to be hanging out all afternoon and into the evening and we want you to be there. We're going to have giveaways, we're going to have games, we're going to have trivia. Some Swag lots more. And of course, if you can't make it, we'll be sure to give you the opportunity to participate. Submitting some questions, a little Ask Me Anything as well. It is the COVID 3 pregame tailgate live in advance of Florida State and Miami. Downtown Tallahassee at Madison social this Friday, October 3rd, 3:00pm Eastern Time. Now Florida State, Miami, big game breakdowns. Obviously going to be the headliner. We'll have other games as well packed into Wednesday show here 11am Eastern Time. Then Thursday, 11am Eastern Time, we'll go with our locks. And then Friday we'll all be together right there at Madison Social.

[Danny Cannell]

Yes, Tom, I just want to check with Danny and Bud. Is there any snow in the forecast?

[Tom Fernelli]

I think we're safe.

[Danny Cannell]

Thank God.

[Bud Elliott]

All right.

[Chip Patterson]

Okay. That's. I mean, and isn't. Never mind. I'm not even. We're not. I can't even this. There's too many weather patterns out there. Tomorrow we need everybody. We need. We need things to be looking as clear as possible and then we'll be okay. But yes, now we are very fired up to get back together. We are very fired up to spend that time with you. Downtown Tallahassee in advance of Florida State, Miami. Come and hang out and watch us live. That'll be on Friday. Then of course, the big game on Saturday and Saturday night, Instant Reaction show. And you can follow him on Twitter at Time for Noah. You can follow him@Blood Elliott3. You can follow him at Danny Cannell. Follow me at Chip Patterson. Gentlemen, thank you very much.

[Danny Cannell]

Thank you.

[Bud Elliott]

See y'.

[Danny Cannell]

All.

[Tom Fernelli]

See ya.

[Danny Cannell]

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[Bud Elliott]

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[Chip Patterson]

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[Tom Fernelli]

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