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- [00:01]
Commercial Narrator
This is the story of the 1.
- [00:03]
Ashley
As a custodial supervisor at a high school, he knows that during cold and.
- [00:07]
Commercial Narrator
Flu season, germs spread fast.
- [00:09]
Ashley
It's why he partners with Grainger to stay fully stocked on the products and supplies he needs, from tissues to disinfectants to floor scrubbers, all so that he can help students, staff and teachers stay healthy and focused. Call 1-800-GRAINGER Click grainger.com or just stop by Ranger for the ones who get it done.
- [00:30]
Ricky
This is the story of the 1.
- [00:32]
Ashley
As head of maintenance at a concert.
- [00:34]
Ricky
Hall, he knows the show must always go on.
- [00:37]
Commercial Narrator
That's why he works behind the scenes, ensuring every light is working, the H.
- [00:41]
Ricky
Vac is humming, and his facility shines.
- [00:45]
Commercial Narrator
With Grainger's supplies and solutions for every challenge he faces.
- [00:48]
Ricky
Plus 24. 7 customer support, his venue never misses a beat. Call quickgranger.com or just stop by Granger.
- [00:56]
Ashley
For the ones who get it done. Before we get started, we want to pause and give an important note that this episode is as heavy as the title suggests. We'll be discussing Filicide, the heartbreaking loss of children whose lives should never have been cut short, as well as mentions of suicide. These are difficult but necessary conversations, and with them comes the push for awareness and change. Please know that listener discretion is strongly advised. I'm Ashley. And I'm Ricky, and this is Crime salad. So at CrimeCon, Ricky and I had just finished getting ready for the day. We put on our Crime Salad shirts. We got our overpriced coffees prepared to meet hundreds of people, share stories, and invite new listeners to listen to our show. But then something happened that stopped me in my tracks. A woman approached our table holding a flyer, and on it were the faces of children. With her was a wonderful person named Rachel from momcast Productions, who introduced her and gently explained her story. The woman by her side was Hope Houdin. Her two children had been the victims of filicide, the unimaginable act where a parent, or sometimes even a step parent, takes the lives of a child and in this case, their father murdered her two children and then himself. As Hope stood there, I felt it instantly, the weight of her grief. It was deep and raw, the worst pain a mother could ever feel. But right alongside it, I felt something else. Strength. A strength I can only describe as the kind that comes from living through the unimaginable. It resonated off her like a beam of light. Hope was standing in her truth. She got ready on the same day, just like me, wearing A shirt that says Voices of Filicide. Here to tell her children's story, even if it meant reliving her pain of the words over and over again. That's when I knew that this woman has the kind of courage most of us can hardly fathom. I'll admit it. I couldn't hold back my tears. The mother in me just felt her pain. I. I just can't imagine losing my babies to something so horrible and preventable. And before I even thought about it, I asked her if I can give her a hug. And that hug is something I'll never forget. It was as if her grief and strength both poured into me all at once. That moment is what brings us to today's case. From the instant I met Hope, I knew that one day we would cover her story because it deserves to be told. For her, for her children, and for many others who may be living with the same fight. And today, we're doing just that. Hope Whodin has turned her pain into purpose, demanding change in the face of a system that failed her and so many children like hers. This is Hope Houdin's story. On a quiet Monday morning in Surprise, Arizona, a mother's worst fears began to take shape. Just days earlier, Hope had handed her two children over to their father, Brock Mater, for visitation, a court ordered exchange that, no matter how routine it had become, never stopped feeling heavy. Every goodbye hug carried this quiet ache, an anxiety tug of reluctance a mother might feel when the instinct to protect wants to pull them away in the other direction. But that Monday, the fragile sense of what was ordered to be normal shattered. A call came from her children's school. Both of them had been marked absent. No excuse, no explanation. In that moment, the rhythm of her family's routine, those carefully stitched together threads of custody orders and visitation schedules, began to unravel, replaced by a gnawing dread that something was terribly, terribly wrong. Hope tried calling the children's father, but the phone rang and rang and rang. No one picked up. With every unanswered ring, the fear inside her grew heavier. Unable to shake the feeling that something was wrong, she got in her car, drove straight to his apartment. His vehicle was still there, parked out front. But when she knocked on the door, there was only silence. No footsteps, no voices, Just silence. That's when the dread truly set in. Something was terribly off. In desperation, Hope called the police.
- [05:47]
Ricky
Officers arrived at the home and started with the basics. In reality, police responded to these types of calls all the time. Welfare checks were a common part of police work. They knocked on the door. There was no answer. They called the father's cell phone multiple times, only to hear the phone ringing from inside. But they kept trying. They announced themselves, waiting, knocking, calling. There was just no response. With Brock Mater's car in the parking lot of the apartment complex, Hope's two children unaccounted for and no contact. The police needed to make their way inside. They had a maintenance guy unlock the door with the key. And what they discovered inside will haunt them forever. Two young children were deceased, along with their father. Hope was now standing in the middle of a tragedy that she always feared, that she always tried to prevent. Her two children, Alec and Lydia, were murdered.
- [06:51]
Ashley
Hope Joy Houdin was named by her parents in the face of fear. Born with an extremely low birth weight, her parents named her Hope as they hoped that she would survive and and her middle name, Joy, because of the joy they had. When Hope did survive her traumatic birth, Hope experienced visual complications as a result of her low birth weight and lack of oxygen as an infant. But she never let that stop her from pursuing her dreams. She was strong. From day one. She had built her life around education and Faith, going to college to pursue a career in special education. She wanted to help students in the same way that so many teachers helped her succeed throughout her life. It was there that during those years that she met Brock Mater. They were drawn together by their shared beliefs, similar values and a love of the same interests.
- [07:43]
Ricky
And the relationship grew quickly. After getting married, they moved to Arizona and began the next chapter of their lives. And for Hope, that chapter included ten wonderful years of working in public and private education. And her most cherished role, becoming a mother to two beautiful children who were so close in age. Alec and Lydia.
- [08:05]
Ashley
And after settling in Arizona, Brock and Hope's world revolved around their two children as they grew. By 2024, their son Alec was a vibrant seven year old boy full of light laughter and boundless energy. He loved Pokemon, basketball and swimming. And he spent as much time as possible playing outside with his little sister. Alec was also a proud member of Trail Life, an outdoor adventure program that focuses on developing character, leadership and outdoor skills for young boys. He was part of this program for two years, where he thrived in the sense of community and adventure. And he was expressive. He had a joyful spirit that showed up in everything he did. He loved singing, dancing and telling stories. Each night, he ended the day with bedtime prayers and stories, always eager to share what happened at school. Lydia, the younger of the two, who just turned six years Old five days before. She was unalived. Mirrored that same light and joy. She was full of curiosity and laughter, and she loved spending time doing arts and crafts, riding her scooter or or playing in the park. She even liked helping her mom fold the laundry, which speaks to her sweet, giving nature. She had bright blue eyes and a personality that was completely contagious. She went through a Peppa Pig phase and loved snorting like a pig to make everyone laugh. She loved unicorns, and her favorite colors were purple and pink. But above all else, Lydia adored her big brother. She followed Alec everywhere, and the two of them were just inseparable.
- [09:44]
Ricky
These two were really the heart of the family. They brought joy not just to their parents, but to everyone they knew. And it's because of how full of life they both were that the news of their deaths was so devastating. It felt impossible that such bright little souls could be gone. On the outside, it seemed like everything was smooth sailing. A good marriage, beautiful children, and promising careers. Well, up until 2022.
- [10:13]
Ashley
Yeah. So behind the happiness of Alec and Lydia's childhood, there was this growing darkness in the Mater household. It started in October of 2021, where Hope received a phone call from her sister stating that her mom was in a car accident and was in critical condition. After many weeks of battling against her injuries, Hope's mother sadly passed away in mid November. And at this time, Hope's father was also in a deteriorating condition as he was suffering from kidney failure. Hope and her sister took care of him for eight months until he also passed away due to his illness. So in a matter of months, Hope had lost both of her parents.
- [10:58]
Ricky
And it almost seemed like the passing of both her mother and father. By July of 2022 is when hope started to notice the gradual shift in Brock's behavior. What had once been a marriage rooted in shared values and faith began to change. Brock grew increasingly controlling, erratic, and physically and mentally abusive towards Hope. And it seemed to only escalate once her parents passed.
- [11:25]
Ashley
Right. Hope was being abused mentally and physically. And as a mother, not only was she battling the abuse, she had two children. Watching all of this and living through this environment, Hope knew she didn't want Alec and Lydia growing up in a home filled with instability and fear. And according to her, she knew God didn't want this life for her either. So she started to plan. Over the span of a year and a half, Hope had prayed and carefully contemplated how she could leave her husband safely. Escaping an abusive marriage is never simple. It takes time, preparation, and courage. So she weighed her options, thought through the risks, and leaned on her faith to guide her.
- [12:10]
Ricky
And I know we've talked about it before, but leaving an abusive partner can actually be the most dangerous time for someone. Statistically, that's when violence is most likely to escalate. So Hope knew she had to be careful. And I'm sure after the passing of both her parents, the idea that your support system is starting to dwindle probably makes you contemplate the situation you're in more heavily now. She had two less people to turn to if Brock's mental state became worse.
- [12:40]
Ashley
Absolutely. And I can't imagine how scared and alone she must have felt. Finally, In October of 2023, she made her move. Hope left Brock with the goal of providing a safer, better life for herself and her children. She saw the possibility of peace and stability for Alec and Lydia. But what she couldn't have predicted was the downward spiral that Brock would take. After Hope left, she filed for divorce, hoping it would be the beginning of a new chapter, one where she and her children could live safely and happily. But the filing proved to be the catalyst of an even more unsettling shift in Brock's mental state. Because shortly after Hope had filed for divorce, Brock threatened to take his own life in front of Alec and Lydia.
- [13:30]
Ricky
That has to be terrifying because you're not only threatening yourself, you're exposing the kids to a level of trauma that no child should ever face. It just shows that Brock was so unstable that he was willing to use his own children as a way to maintain control after Hope tried to legally separate from him.
- [13:52]
Ashley
And these threats, they're major warning signs for filicide risk. Parents in mental crises like this are extremely dangerous to themselves and their children, to the point where they may think, if I lose them, nobody gets them. I'm not saying that this is what Brock was thinking, but it's a common theme in filicide cases.
- [14:13]
Ricky
Yeah, it is.
- [14:15]
Ashley
So in response to this, Hope did the only thing she could do at that moment. She immediately called 911. Her first priority was making sure Alec and Lydia were safe. But she also wanted Brock to get the mental health support that he so clearly needed.
- [14:31]
Ricky
And in interviews, Hope talked about the history of unpredictability and Brock's mental health issues. She described him as having episodes of psychosis where he couldn't determine the difference between what was real and what wasn't. He had extreme paranoia and delusions, which made it difficult to navigate their separation.
- [14:53]
Ashley
Which, if you're looking into this as closely as Possible. A history of psychotic episodes should have been a huge red flag to the people involved in Hope's case. In filicide research, parents kill their children under the grip of psychosis, where they have delusions of their children being possessed, in imagined danger or better off dead. And this also goes into spousal revenge filicide, which is also linked to custody disputes or divorce cases, especially when there's a history of domestic violence. So put these two things together and Brock is basically a walking billboard for filicide. But unfortunately, so many people aren't aware of that research or those risk factors. So for Brock Mater, these mental health symptoms became more and more apparent. That as a confirmation that Hope was making the right choice through her separation and custody decisions. Which is why on October 11th of 2023, Hope took another step to protect herself and her children. She filed a petition for an order of protection against Brock. In that document, she laid out in plain terms what she had been enduring. The abuse, the threats, and specifically Brock's alarming statement that he would kill himself in front of the children. She discussed that Brock had been speaking of demons and cults and had grown extremely agitated and fearful. Hope also wrote that Brock owned guns and she asked the court to prohibit him from possessing firearms. It was her way of saying that it wasn't just about her, it was about the safety of their children and Brapp as well.
- [16:38]
Ricky
And that just adds to what we just talked about with psychosis related filicide cases. The talk of demons and cults would be another red flag that this individual isn't in a safe mindset to care for children. Since many filicide cases involve delusions of possession or demonic themes. So this would just be another piece of evidence towards the fact that Brock should not have had custody of the children at this time.
- [17:06]
Ashley
And you know, millions of people live with mental health conditions with treatment and support and they're still able to be safe, loving parents. But when there's constant threats or ongoing abuse, even if some days seem better than others, the child's safety must remain the top priority. In those situations, mental health should be taken seriously. That can mean supervised visitation, mandatory and routine evaluations, and regular thorough check ins in custody and separation cases where stress is already high, the courts have to treat red flags with urgency. Shared custody cannot be automatic when there's clearly a documented history of dangerous ideation or violence. The standard must always be the child's safety first, because children are the most vulnerable. This was the reality for these children once the protective order in place to protect was placed not long after she filed. Another incident confirmed Hope's fears about Brock's instability. Without her knowledge or consent, Brock suddenly pulled Alec and Lydia out of school and took them to a hotel.
- [18:19]
Ricky
And because the divorce was still in the early stages, both parents technically retained full custody rights, regardless of Hope's protection order. That meant that law enforcement couldn't intervene, even though it was alarming and against Hope's wishes, especially with Brock's previous behavior.
- [18:39]
Ashley
Which I'm sure is exactly what Hope was thinking. She didn't know what could be happening. And it seems like each of these court proceedings or updates in the separation between Hope and Brock was like a stressor in custody or divorce related filicide cases. Researchers have noted that court proceedings, custody rulings, or even the fear of losing access to children can act as a major trigger. And that's exactly what we're seeing here. Each time Hope made a move to protect herself and her children, Brock's instability escalated. I would be terrified that this escalation would cause Brock to carry out exactly what he had threatened just weeks before. And because of this, Hope was desperate to know where her children were. So she tracked them down herself. And when she found them, thankfully, Alec and Lydia were safe. They were splashing in the hotel pool with their father. They appeared to be happy. The plan was made for Brock to return Alec and Lydia to school the following morning. But that didn't happen.
- [19:44]
Ricky
And that must be such a scary situation. And his prior history gave Hope every right to be terrified. And fear became even more clear when later that same night, around midnight, Hope's phone rang. And on the other end was the surprise. Police department officers told her that Brock had been taken into a mental health facility for evaluation and she needed to come to the hotel right away to pick up Alex and Lydia. So Hope's earlier fears were warranted. Police explained that Brock had actually been the one to call and ask for mental health help. He told them that he was having both suicidal and homicidal thoughts and that he feared not only for himself, but for his children. Alarmed, the police responded immediately, placing him under psychiatric hold at a hospital in Peoria.
- [20:37]
Ashley
And this is the kind of call that no parent is ever expecting. Being told that your kids are safe for now, but then the other parents spirals so far that they're aware that they need to be hospitalized. And by now, law enforcement and medical professionals had clear, documented proof of how unstable Brock had become. And Brock himself was also pretty aware he was openly voicing that he was a danger to himself and his kids, and at this point you would think that this incident would drastically change the situation of their custody and separation. And it did for a little bit, but it wasn't enough. Brock remained in psychiatric treatment for nine days following that hotel incident, and during that time Hope was granted temporary full custody of Alec and Lydia, giving her some measure of security. While Brock was hospitalized following the nine days at the psychiatric facility in Peoria, he was soon diagnosed with bipolar in psychosis. Regardless of the hospitalization and the warning signs that were glowing bright red just weeks later, the family was back in court in early November and the judge ruled that despite Brock's recent breakdown, he was fit to resume parenting. The reasoning was that Brock had been receiving treatment, taking his prescribed medication, and his condition was improving. On that condition, the court ordered 5050 custody, with both parents sharing equal parenting time and legal decision making. After everything the abuse, the threats, the psychiatric hold, Hope was once again legally forced to hand over her children for shared custody. Court records later showed that as the divorce process neared its end, Hope was asked for the order of protection against Brock to be dismissed in May of 2024, believing the final orders would soon provide stability Feeling stuck in your daily wellness routine? You're not alone. Our friends at Cornbread Hemp hear you. Their organic CBD gummies are made to help you feel better. Better. Whether it's stress, poor sleep or just needing a moment to unwind, CBD might be just what you need to level up your daily routine. Cornbread Hemp uses only the best part of the hemp plant, the flower for the purest and most potent cbd. No fillers, no junk, just full spectrum goodness. And right now they're offering 30% off your first order. Just go to cornbreadhemp.com/crime salad and use Code Crime Salad at checkout. That's cornbread hemp.com crime salad with code crime salad to get 30% off your first order ever wish your friends were as into true crime as you are. Stephanie and Olivia are here for you on the True Crime Society podcast. They cover everything from missing people in cold cases to breaking true crime news, including the intriguing story of Hannah Kobayashi who vanished in Los Angeles and later reappeared in Mexic. Listeners love that. It feels just like chatting with friends, but with well researched cases and just the right amount of conversation. New episodes come out every Thursday so you'll always have something fresh to dive into. Be sure to search for and subscribe to the True Crime Society podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or Wherever you get your podcasts, you won't see the engineer.
- [24:13]
Commercial Narrator
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- [24:44]
Ricky
It's hard not to look back at the timeline and feel angry. Every warning sign was there. The threats, the erratic behavior, even his own admission of having suicidal and homicidal thoughts. And yet, because he was medicated and appeared stable for a few weeks, the system defaulted back to shared custody. We now know the decision had catastrophic consequences, but you have to wonder, did the courts treat this like just another custody case? On paper, he looked fixed, but we're talking about two children's lives. Medication alone doesn't erase threats or dangerous urges. And in this case, the court's decision put the children directly in danger.
- [25:30]
Ashley
Right. And Hope felt the same. She was upset that brock was awarded 50% custody, even though he had an established history of violent and dangerous thoughts and behaviors. But there was literally nothing that she could do, the courts had decided. But still, she tried to persevere. Hope had bought a house, built a divorce case, and tried to make the best of the situation she was in, hoping that Brock would continue on his path of treatment. In March of 2024, the court reviewed a psychological evaluation of Brock. This was the moment that Hope had been praying for, that Alec and Lydia would finally be protected. But instead, the opposite happened. Despite everything that had already occurred, the judge found no grounds to limit custody, and Brock retained shared custody of the children. To the court, it seemed that as long as he was following his treatment and taking his medication, he posed no risk to Alec and Lydia.
- [26:33]
Ricky
And that's really where the gap in the system shows. On paper, it might have looked like things were stable, but in reality, the volatility was still there. And that meant that Alex and Lydia were at risk every single time they were in Brock's care. It hadn't been nearly enough time to know if Brock's mental state was truly stable enough for 50% custody. Now, remember, his psychiatric hold was only four months earlier. To really protect children in situations like this, there has to be a long standing history of improvement, not just a few weeks of treatment, not a short stretch of seeming stability. Because despite all of that, Brock regained 50% custody almost immediately after his release.
- [27:22]
Ashley
It was such a hopeless situation, one the courts themselves had enabled. The right safeguards weren't in place, and it's clear that the children weren't treated as the number one priority. Judges are tasked with balancing parental rights, making sure both parents have access. But sometimes that focus comes at the expense of the children. One of the big buzzwords in family court is parental alienation. It's been around since the 1980s, when a child psychiatrist tried to label it as a syndrome. But that's never been backed by solid research. It's not even recognized by the American Psychiatric association, the American Psychological association, or even listed in the dsm. Still, courts use it all the time. And the danger is that it can overshadow real issues like abuse or instability, even when there's clear proof. Like in Brock's case, the children, they weren't safe. And instead of looking at the actual evidence, judges are trained to filter parental behavior through that lens. The problem is, training on domestic violence or serious mental health issues just doesn't happen. And that's exactly what Hope was up against. She wasn't just trying to completely erase Brock from Alec and Liddy's lives. She was trying to keep them safe. But the narrative, it got twisted. Instead of focusing on a father with documented suicidal and homicidal thoughts, the system focused on protecting his custody rights. And as Hope expected, with time, Brock's mental health began to spiral again within the next few months. From the outside, though, it wasn't obvious. Hope and Brock had limited contact, mostly by phone. And those conversations seemed normal enough to Hope. There were no clear warning signs, Nothing to suggest that he was about to unravel again. Maybe the treatment was working. Maybe the crisis had passed. Hope didn't feel like anything was wrong. But underneath, Brock was slipping back into paranoia. And that brings us back to the beginning of our story. Just a few weeks before the divorce was set to be finalized.
- [29:36]
Ricky
And it was on May 19th of 2024. Surprise. Police had devastatingly found Brock, Alec and Lydia all deceased inside Brock's apartment. And investigators determined that Brock had taken his own life after shooting both of his children in the head. A father who was supposed to protect them, who was granted 50% custody, had become the one to end their lives, Making Hope's worst nightmare a devastating reality, One that she was trying to prevent. Detectives canvassed the neighborhood, trying to Piece together a timeline. Neighbors reported hearing loud noises that night before on Sunday night. At first they thought it might have been fireworks. Some even stepped outside to check. But they didn't see anything unusual and went back inside. It wasn't until the next morning when police made that grim discovery, that the sounds being heard between 9:30 and 10 on May 19th were the actual gunshots that ended the lives of three people.
- [30:41]
Ashley
And later, Hope said that she had been trying to contact her children for days. She hadn't heard from them since the Friday that she had dropped them off. And by Monday, Alec and Lydia had already been deceased for the entire night while their mother was still trying to reach them, unaware of what had already happened. And I don't think any words can really describe how Hope must have felt. Police Sgt. Rick Hernandez gave a statement stating that those who discovered Brock and his children were devastated and had taken personal days to process it. He pleaded with the public, those who knew and loved Hope, to show her support during the tragedy she was going through. He assured that the police department would be providing Hope with every resource they had available to help her through her grief. And Hope was enduring tragedy. I mean, in the span of two years, she had lost both of her parents, saw her husband spiral into someone she no longer knew. Anne lost both of her children. Anyone would find that to be too much and unbearable, especially when the system had failed her children and had failed to properly help Brock in his fragile mental state. In the days and weeks after the deaths, the shock was overwhelming for Hope. The weight of her grief was impossible to measure. But even in the middle of that devastation, she says that she knew one thing. She couldn't bring her children back, but she could fight to make sure their deaths weren't in vain. And to this day, that belief still stands true. She began speaking openly about the failures in the system that left Alec and Lydia vulnerable. Despite every warning she had given, there needed to be safeguards in place to put children's safety first. Hope has been clear about her mission. She doesn't want any other family to suffer the way hers has. She. She wants legislation changed so that the rights of parents don't overshadow the protection of children. Because in Alec and Lydia's case, the courts prioritized shared custody, and the result was catastrophic.
- [32:44]
Ricky
And amazingly, Hope is turning her pain into purpose. Hope launched a social media platform called Hope in the Pain, where she shares her story and advocates for change. It's a space not just for her children's memory, but but for other families. Navigating similar battles, giving them a voice, a community, and a reminder that they're not alone. Her strength is something that is so inspiring.
- [33:10]
Ashley
Yeah. It has opened opportunity to connect with other parents who had lost children to filicide. Families who, like her, had done everything in their power to raise red flags, only to be ignored by the very systems designed to protect them. And out of those connections, she partnered with Brandy Maury Poles to create a new movement, Voices Against Filicide.
- [33:33]
Ricky
And Brandi's story is another heartbreaking example of how devastating these failures can be. Her six year old son, Rowan, was also the heart of their large blended family. He was a mama's boy through and through, because Brandi was his safe place.
- [33:50]
Ashley
Yeah, Rowan was incredibly funny and full of personality. Brandy remembers a time that he got into a little fight with his big brother, Bailey, because Bailey had called Brandy mom. And Rowan shouted, nuh, that's my mommy. He once announced that he was heading to the glorious bathroom just to make everyone laugh. And when he played golf for the PJA Junior League with older kids, his longest drive was 110 yards. And he yelled, mom, I smoked that thing. But just like Alec and Lydia, Rowan's safety was undermined by a system that prioritized a parent's rights over the child's well being. In early 2024, Rowan came home underweight and emotionally distressed. He told his mom about neglect at his father Mike's home, that he was eating only toast, and that his father spent the days sleeping. Brandi called cps, but the investigator downplayed her concerns. Even worse, they gave advance notice before visits to Mike's house, giving him time to prepare for their arrival.
- [34:57]
Ricky
And this was despite the fact that Mike was a felon and in possession of firearms, with a clear pattern of neglect. Yet the family court continued to grant him unsupervised parenting time.
- [35:10]
Ashley
Brandi also fought tirelessly in court, sometimes enduring hours of testimony just to make sure that Rowan could consistently attend school. But on August 12, 2024, her worst fears came true. Mike failed to return Rowan after a custody visit, and Brandi knew something was wrong. She called police, filed emergency motions, and drove across counties, begging law enforcement to act. But instead of treating it like a crisis, they dismissed her, calling it a civil matter. For more than 52 hours, Rowan was missing, and when police finally acted, they found him murdered by his father in a hidden camper behind the home. Despite multiple wellness checks, police had never searched the entire property. To make things worse, Rowan's family learned much of what happened through news outlets rather than directly from investigators. And to this day, there's not even an official confirmed time of death. His family believes that earlier intervention could.
- [36:14]
Ricky
Have saved him, and it mirrors the same sentiment as Hope's story. It's the same pattern. This could have all been prevented if the safety of the child was the number one priority. But instead, the rights of dangerous parents were prioritized over the lives of children, even when real concerns were raised.
- [36:35]
Ashley
Which is why, together, through Voices Against Filicide, they're fighting for change and bringing awareness towards the horrors of filicide to prevent more lives from being lost. Filicide, the murder of a child by a parent or a stepparent, occurs nearly 500 times every year in the United States. It's more common than most people realize, and the numbers are staggering. 70% of children killed in filicide cases are under the age of five, and fathers are statistically more likely to commit fatal violence. But mothers account for about 40% of cases. And when you add in the stress of a custody battle, the risk skyrockets. In high conflict custody situations, filicide is four to six times more likely to occur.
- [37:26]
Ricky
And that's exactly why Hope and Brandi are pushing so much. Their children's names are now part of those statistics, but they don't want Alec, Lydia, or Rowan to be remembered as just a number. They, they want to break this dangerous pattern and to shift the courts away from prioritizing equal custody at all costs and focus on protecting kids first through training and knowledge so a crisis so devastating can be prevented.
- [37:55]
Ashley
Which is why, out of her unimaginable loss, Brandi created and pushed for new legislation in Michigan. Rowan's act. This bill is aimed at preventing child deaths in high conflict custody situations and particularly cases of parental abduction. The first part of Rowan's act focuses on reforming Amber Alert criteria. So right now, Amber Alerts, they're often not issued in custody related abductions, which delays the response. And Rowan's act would remove the requirement for a judge's signature, giving state police the authority to issue alerts directly. It would also ensure that custody related abductions qualify for alerts and require immediate dissemination through social media and news outlets. And the second part of the bill is about media accuracy and speed. Too often, coverage of a missing child is delayed or filled with errors. Rowan's act would require verified, timely reporting of missing child cases with increased coordination between law enforcement and media to make sure the facts are accurate.
- [39:04]
Ricky
And the third piece is just as important, public education on filicide, because a Lot of people don't even know what the word means. They see headlines that say murder, suicide, which frames it as an adult tragedy, not a child's murder. Rowan's act calls for education campaigns to raise awareness, to teach people to spot warning signs, things like suicidal threats involving children, emotional abuse, or sudden erratic behavior.
- [39:35]
Ashley
And as for Hope, she's a powerhouse in her own state. Her goal is to protect other children like Alec and Lydia, the way that they should have been protected. She's writing a memoir, There's Still Hope, scheduled to release in 2026. She's also working alongside Representatives Rachel Keshel and Lisa Fink to draft new legislation, the ALEC and Lydia Act. This bill aims to bring sweeping reform to Arizona's family court system. And this goal is extremely important to Hope and so many other families. The ALEC and Lydia act in Arizona will help protect children moving forward. And once this gets introduced and gets a green check mark, Hope's goal is to make the ALEC and Lydia Act a federal law as well.
- [40:22]
Ricky
And it makes you wonder why this isn't already a law. Under the ALEC and Lydia act, judges would no longer be allowed to use the concept of parental alienation to undermine protective parents concerns. The safety of the child comes first, and that's how it should be.
- [40:40]
Ashley
The bill also requires domestic violence hearings before custody is ever decided. So the court has to look at the abuse first, not after the fact. It protects children's voices, making sure that their experiences and fears are heard. And it ensures that judges receive training in both domestic violence and trauma. Most importantly, the ALEC and Lydia act holds the courts accountable. If a child is harmed because safety wasn't prioritized, the system will answer for it. And Hope's message is parents rights should never outweigh a child's right to be safe. And the ongoing pain she feels every day from losing her two children has been turned into a fight for change to protect innocent children first. With that being said, I would like to read out Hope's statement, which is directed to the Arizona Family Court ad hoc committee. And I wanted to read this as it comes from Hope herself and shows the pain and fight firsthand. As a mother whose children, Alec and Lydia Mater, were tragically failed by the Arizona family court system. This same system also failed their father, Brock, and it led to the irreversible loss of three lives between October 2023 and May 2024. The court had multiple opportunities to intervene, to listen, to protect, to act, and it failed. I warned the court repeatedly. Brock had a long standing history of instability and abuse. I had a protection order in place due to both emotional and physical abuse he inflicted on me. In October of 2023 during a severe mental health crisis, Alec and Lydia were placed in a dangerous situation while in his care. After that incident, Brock was voluntarily taken to an inpatient psychiatric facility for nine days of treatment, where he was diagnosed with bipolar disorder with psychosis. Despite these red flags, Brock was granted 5050 custody of her children. That decision was made just weeks after his inpatient treatment and only a short time after beginning psychiatric medication. The court moved forward as if danger had passed, but it had not. Brock was later court ordered to complete a psychological evaluation. That evaluation raised serious red flags, yet they were never meaningfully addressed. The psychologist even noted that Brock appeared very calculated in his responses and that he might not be as stable as he seemed. That statement alone should have triggered caution, further supervision, or a suspension of parenting time until a full team of medical professionals could regularly evaluate him and until verified documentation was submitted to the court. However, none of that happened. The Arizona Family Court took no further action. When I raised concerns, our judge Michael Valenzuela, told my attorney and wrote in court orders, if you want to know if he is taking his medication, Hope can ask him. I was the abused spouse in a high conflict divorce. Yet the court placed the burden of monitoring Brock's psychiatric compliance on me. There were no protocols, no medication verification, no documentation from providers, no safety checks. There were no safeguards at all. And the result? On a weekend visitation, Brock shot and killed Alec and Lydia and then took his own life. Judge Michael Valenzuela ignored numerous red flags and completely neglected the urgency and severity of my entire case. The day after Alec, Lydia and Brock were found dead, he held a hearing without my presence, dismissed the family Court case, and sealed all of the records. I was told at the time that this was done for my protection. But now, 15 months later, I know that this is not true. The sealing of those records was not to protect me, but to hide the court's failures and prevent the public from seeing the extent of of the negligence that occurred. My children should have been protected. Alec was seven years old, bright, thoughtful and full of energy. He loved Pokemon Trail, life, swimming, soccer, and making people laugh. And Lydia was six years old, Joyful, creative and kind. She loved unicorns, music, sparkles, and cuddling with her stuffed animals. They were radiant children. They were deeply loved. And they were taken because a system meant to protect them ignored every single warning sign. Brock asked for help. He received some, but the court failed to follow through. He was not held accountable for continuing treatment. There was no requirement for medical documentation, no review of progress, no supervised parenting plan. The Arizona family court system failed Alec and Lydia, but it also failed Brock. He didn't need custody. He needed structured support, accountability and supervision. Instead, the court handed him unsupervised time with our children and three lives were lost. Now I am left without my children. Nothing I do will bring them back, but I will keep fighting in their honor. The Arizona family court system must change. High conflict custody cases involving abuse and mental illness must be taken seriously. Judges need training. Protocols must be put in place to verify treatment, assess stability, and protect the vulnerable. There must be real accountability, not assumptions or shortcuts. Judge Michael Valenzuela failed to do his due diligence to protect the lives of two innocent children. Yet he remains fully protected behind the shield of judicial immunity. Please, I beg you, do not let Alec and Lydia's deaths be in vain. When you read court documents, when you see a parent waving red flags, don't treat it like routine paperwork. These are real lives, precious children, and your decisions determine whether they are protected or put in danger. Thank you for honoring Alec and Lydia by choosing to do better.
- [47:29]
Ricky
Hope and Brandy are just two people in a sea of individuals who have suffered from preventative filicide cases. With stronger laws, better safeguards, in a system that prioritizes children first, many lives could be saved.
- [47:46]
Ashley
Yeah. So if you're asking yourself, how can you help? The first step is to follow Hope in the Pain on all social media platforms. On her TikTok, hope in the Pain, Hope shares updates on her journey from advocacy efforts around the Alec and Lydia act to small glimpses of healing. One of those bright spots is her adorable pup, Joy Angel. Alec actually named her before his life was taken. And now Joy angel truly lives up to her name, bringing hope, comfort and light in her hardest moments. We also encourage you to learn more about Filicide by visiting the Voices Against Filicide website, share their message and their podcast to help push for legislative change not only in Arizona, but Michigan and across the entire country eventually. And thank you all so much for listening, for caring and and for being a part of this conversation.
- [48:44]
Ricky
Also make sure to check out crimesaladpodcast.com we have some new merch on there. Black cat influenced. And also if you hate ads as much as we do, check out our patreon@patreon.com crime salad podcast. You can get ad free listening for as little as $1.
- [49:04]
Ashley
One doll hair, one doll hair. Thank you all so much for listening. We will see you next time.
- [49:10]
Ricky
Crime Salad is a black cat Media production. For more information, check out Blackcat FM.
- [49:28]
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