Crime Salad – “Fighting Against Filicide: Alec, Lydia, and Rowan”

Hosts: Ashley & Ricky
Date Released: September 21, 2025

Episode Overview

This powerful and emotionally charged episode of Crime Salad centers on the devastating topic of filicide—the killing of a child by a parent or stepparent—and follows two families’ real stories that illuminate the systemic failures enabling such tragedies. Hosts Ashley and Ricky delve into the heartbreaking case of Hope Houdin, whose two children, Alec and Lydia, were murdered by their father, Brock Mater, amid a tumultuous custody battle and multiple red flags. They highlight Hope’s journey from grief to advocacy, introduce Brandy Maury Poles and her son Rowan’s story, and discuss legislative actions aiming to protect children at risk.
Listener discretion is strongly advised due to the sensitive nature of the discussion.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Meeting Hope Houdin and Episode Genesis

• (02:00–05:45) Ashley recalls meeting Hope at CrimeCon, deeply struck by Hope’s grief and resilience, which inspired them to tell her story on the podcast.

  “But right alongside it, I felt something else. Strength. A strength I can only describe as the kind that comes from living through the unimaginable.” — Ashley (04:15)

• Hope’s story sets the stage: Her two young children, Alec and Lydia, were murdered by their father, who then took his own life.

2. Hope’s Family and Early Warning Signs

• (06:50–10:58) Explores Hope’s background and family: her lifelong resilience, educational career, and the joy of raising Alec and Lydia in Arizona.
  • Alec: Age 7, energetic and joyful, loved sports and storytelling.
  • Lydia: Age 6, curious and sweet, adored her older brother.
• The narrative shifts as Hope faces the deaths of both parents, leading to Brock’s emergence as abusive and unstable.

3. Abuse, Escalation & Systemic Failures

• (10:58–20:37)
  • Hope experiences growing abuse from Brock—mental, physical, and psychological—especially following her parents’ deaths.
  • She methodically plans to leave, aware that leaving an abusive partner is statistically the most dangerous time.
  • Brock’s decline: threats of suicide in front of the children and psychotic behavior (delusions, paranoia).

  “You’re not only threatening yourself, you’re exposing the kids to... trauma that no child should ever face.” — Ricky (13:30)

• Red flags like psychotic episodes (demons, cults), threats, and access to firearms are highlighted as high-risk factors for filicide, yet the system seems blind to them.
  • Hope files a protection order and seeks court intervention. Despite evidence and immediate concerns, both parents retain full custody rights as the divorce proceeds.

4. Tragedy Strikes—A Failed System

• (20:37–32:00)
  • Brock’s mental health crisis leads to hospitalization, temporary loss of custody, and a diagnosis of bipolar disorder with psychosis.
  • Shockingly, after brief treatment and perceived improvement, the court grants him 50/50 custody once again.

  “Every warning sign was there... and yet, because he was medicated and appeared stable for a few weeks, the system defaulted back to shared custody.” — Ricky (24:44)

  • Hope’s concerns are dismissed. The court’s reliance on superficial stability over prolonged, documented safety is condemned.

5. The Catastrophe & Investigation

• (29:35–32:43)
  • On May 19, 2024, after being unable to contact the children, police find Brock, Alec, and Lydia dead from a murder–suicide.

    “A father who was supposed to protect them... had become the one to end their lives.” — Ricky (29:35)

  • The system’s failures are evident: multiple ignored red flags, lack of sustained oversight, and a focus on parental rights over children’s safety.

6. Turning Grief Into Advocacy – Hope and Brandy

• (32:43–39:34)
  • Hope launches Hope in the Pain on TikTok/social, advocating for change and connecting with other families affected by filicide.
  • Partners with Brandy Maury Poles, who lost her son Rowan under similar circumstances:
    • Rowan, 6, suffered neglect and was murdered by his father despite known risks and Brandy’s pleas to authorities and CPS.
    • Both stories expose a devastating pattern: red flags raised by protective parents are downplayed or ignored.

7. Statistics and Legislative Action

• (36:34–39:34)
  • Filicide claims nearly 500 children each year in the U.S.; 70% are under five. Custody battles multiply the risk by 4–6 times.
  • Ashley and Ricky explain why legislative reforms are critical, including:
    • Rowan’s Act (Michigan): Amber Alert criteria reform, elimination of judge signature requirement, prompt media coverage, and public education on filicide.
    • ALEC and Lydia Act (Arizona, pending federal): Limits use of “parental alienation,” mandates domestic violence hearings pre-custody, emphasizes children’s voices, and mandates judge training.

  “Parental rights should never outweigh a child’s right to be safe.” — Ashley (40:39)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Strength in Grief

  “It was as if her grief and strength both poured into me all at once.” — Ashley (04:05)

• On Systemic Blindness

  “On paper, it might have looked like things were stable, but in reality, the volatility was still there.” — Ricky (26:33)

• Court’s Responsibility

  “The Arizona family court system failed Alec and Lydia, but it also failed Brock. He didn’t need custody. He needed structured support, accountability and supervision.” — Hope’s Statement, read by Ashley (41:20)

• Accountability

  “Nothing I do will bring them back, but I will keep fighting in their honor. The Arizona family court system must change.” — Hope’s Statement, read by Ashley (42:35)

• Advocacy Call

  “These are real lives, precious children, and your decisions determine whether they are protected or put in danger.” — Hope’s Statement, read by Ashley (44:20)

Important Timestamps

• 02:00–05:45 – Ashley meets Hope Houdin at CrimeCon; emotional impact and the episode’s origin
• 06:50–10:58 – Background on Hope’s family, her children, and onset of trouble
• 10:58–14:52 – Escalation of abuse and Brock’s mental health crisis
• 17:06–20:37 – Hope’s efforts to protect her children; court’s inadequate response
• 24:44–29:35 – Systemic failures discussed; custody caveats and missed safeguards
• 29:35–32:43 – Discovery of the murder–suicide
• 32:43–33:33 – Hope builds community/advocacy through “Hope in the Pain”
• 33:33–36:34 – Brandy’s story and the loss of her son Rowan
• 37:54–40:22 – Legislative reform: Rowan’s Act and the ALEC and Lydia Act
• 40:39–47:28 – Hope’s statement to the Arizona Family Court; a direct plea for systemic change
• 47:46–end – How listeners can support advocacy and reform

Resources and Further Engagement

• Hope in the Pain: Advocacy, education, and community for families impacted by filicide ([TikTok handle: @hopeinthepain])
• Voices Against Filicide: Group working on reform and awareness ([website link])
• Rowan’s Act / ALEC and Lydia Act: Legislative reforms in process (see state advocacy sites for updates)
• Call to Action:
  • Follow, share, and support Hope’s and Brandy’s missions
  • Educate yourself and others about filicide, systemic child protection failings, and the urgent need for reform

Summary Tone: Compassionate, urgent, deeply empathetic—reflecting the seriousness and hope found in the stories told.

Key Message: The justice system’s emphasis on parental rights at the expense of child safety has deadly consequences. Hope and Brandy’s stories reveal that only through knowledgeable reform, sustained advocacy, and public awareness can future tragedies be prevented.